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#208 OTB or not OTB
390 Plays8 days ago
Slightly new name, slightly new look, same podcasters, and absolutely the same vaguely coherent waffle.
The On The Ball podcast is now the OTB podcast and Norwich City have helpfully kicked off the 'OTB' era with a win (they must have known), triumphing in one of their finest performances of the season at The Den with a 2-1 victory over Millwall.
Ryan Livermore, Dan Brigham, Zoë Morgan and Steve Sanders dish out more praise to the lads as Toure comes over all supersub, Field plays the field, and one of the panel has to eat some humble pie over Pelle Mattsson's finishing.
Plus, big derby anticipation, canaries landing on Nunez, the pointlessness of tiny shinpads, and why letting political party leaders into your dressing room probably isn't a great idea.
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Transcript
Podcast Name Change
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everyone, Steve here. I've got some admin to kick off this podcast before the music kicks in. Always a fun way to start off a podcast. We're changing names. ah We obviously were previously called On The Ball and after some extensive marketing sessions, we've gone out to agencies, we've spent a lot of money on this, we are changing our name from On The Ball to otb So you will now need to find the podcast again and resubscribe. The official name for the podcast is OTB colon a Norwich City podcast. So we will no longer be on the usual stream. We are moving over. Zoe will explain this in a lot more detail at the end of the podcast. But I just thought if you did want to keep listening, and hopefully you do, that it would be worth telling you this straight off the bat. This will be the last podcast on the old feed, the first one on the new feed, and everything after that will be on the new feed.
00:00:52
Speaker
Hope that makes sense. Otherwise, it's the same old nonsense. Enjoy the podcast. Cue the music.
Episode Introduction
00:01:12
Speaker
Hello and welcome to OTB, a Norwich City podcast, the new name and place for the same old Winsicle Norwich City chatter. We may have undergone a facelift and house move, but inside we're still the same show.
00:01:27
Speaker
I'm Ryan Livermore and tonight we look at a not so good Friday, ah resurrection on Easter Monday and the small matter of the big one on Saturday. Plus, it wouldn't be us without a feature thrown in too.
00:01:45
Speaker
Now the pod may be in a new flat, but it's the same roommates once again. The first back this week is, of course, the wonderful Zoe Morgan. Hello, Zoe. Happy Easter to you.
00:01:56
Speaker
Happy Easter, Ryan. Absolutely thrilled to be recording this just after a game as well. I think this is the first time we've done this. So obviously the adrenaline's all pumping around all our bodies still. So I'm looking forward to it. I'm not going to lie, about three quarters of my questions are solely about the Millwall game in Portsmouth. It's basically just, uh, whatever. Who cares? Who cares? Who cares?
00:02:19
Speaker
And joining her is the delightful Dan Brigham. Hey, Ryan. It's lovely what you've done to this new flat. Norah City wallpapers everywhere. green and yellow furniture. Yeah. And the, the giant mural of Carrow road from the South stand that they were selling at one point that's in here as well. And the bathroom is adorned with all the player photos that they put up in the away dressing rooms now. So I thought, you know, i thought I'd properly deck it out in celebration of a brand new podcast, which is not the same'm not sure about all the cushions being those inflatable Ashley Barnes faces though. but
00:02:52
Speaker
Well, it was either that or Josh Sargent. And we know how we feel about him at the moment. So, you know, swings and roundabouts, swings and roundabouts. And of course, we have the notorious NCFC numbers, a.k.a. Steve Sanders. Hello there, Steve. if You've legally changed your name to Otba now. Isn't that right? Yes. Yeah, I was thinking NCFC numbers, Steve Sanders, and also Otba. I have three names. and
Norwich City Game Analysis
00:03:18
Speaker
is It feels like it's a very tedious admin point for me to start talking about on our new podcast. bus But suppose I might as well stay in keeping. I've changed my name. because the podcast has changed name and I couldn't work out how to get my own name off of Spotify. i don't I don't want to be publicly associated with this. I'll just you know just talk about it in the background. That's fine. I'm looking forward to seeing how long it takes ah the listeners to realise that although this is a revamp, it is just going to be exactly the same as the last one. So hopefully... people will agree that that's not a bad thing. we've we've just right It's worked for Spider-Man and Batman movies for decades. So why can't it work for us? Yeah, I mean, we're comparable to those massive franchises as well. We are the we are the Star Wars of Norwich City podcast as well. So, you know, we're we're timeless until the new one comes out, which point everyone starts to resent us. Yay! Amazing. Right, you are going to start climbing up walls Spider-Man style as Captain Canary as well, aren't you, Ryan? I think that's part of your plan for the end of the season.
00:04:19
Speaker
Mate, they won't let me drop from the Regency stand. It has to be the military people in the suit who do it. So they're not going to let me climb up the back of the South stand. In a parachute, right? You're not just going to like...
00:04:32
Speaker
Which would be more apt if I was splat the cat doing that and they go, oh, that's why he's called that. Nice. Because he was always just the cat, wasn't it he? He was, yeah. Until we scraped him off the pavement. Well, if you could land on Nunez on Saturday when you're doing it, that would be most helpful. Yeah, just as I'm falling, just hear lovely jubbly bang.
00:04:55
Speaker
Like that famous when ashley Ashley Young looked up to the heavens with his mouth open. A bird dropping, arrowed straight into the back of his throat. feel But instead, i just go into Nunez's mouth like he's a boa constrictor all the way, stuck in his neck for the full game like a sandwich in Scooby-Doo. Captain Canary's head just in his neck. Incredible. I'd rather have Captain Canary land on me than have some bird, a bird turd go in my mouth. Yeah, well, I mean, the bird turd probably won't kill you if it falls from a height, but but I will, which sounds like a threat, actually, now I've put it like that. Also, maybe a little bit too confident, I'd say. Yeah. Someone's been working out.
00:05:46
Speaker
Someone's really bad from heights, apparently, as well. Well, shall we kick off the new podcast, brackets the same, with this week's Hot Topic?
00:06:03
Speaker
Hot Topic.
00:06:07
Speaker
No points for originality either from the EFL fixture computer as Norwich City had a repeat of their Easter fixtures from last season. Portsmouth at home on Good Friday, followed by Millwall away on Easter Monday. But the outcomes, however, were a far cry from a year ago.
00:06:25
Speaker
a rather flat 1-1 draw against Portsmouth was the supplementary cost for a 2-1 win at second place Millwall this afternoon. Happy Easter, everyone. Dan I'll come to you first please four points from those two fixtures that include a game away to second place in the league happy with that yeah I think you have to be right especially when we are essentially on the beach now to sort of put in such a committed performance today on the on the two two days after um like everyone else sort of play it playing on Friday then yeah i think you got a
00:07:01
Speaker
Especially with you know the players coming back from international break the number of injuries we've had as well. um And I think it sort of eroded a bit of the disappointment about ah conceding late against Portsmouth as well, which probably did finally end our playoff chances, unfortunately. Although as tantalising it is as it is to look at the table now, we've obviously played a game or two more than some of the teams above us now. I thought today we were magnificent. Clemens called it our best performance of the season, he thinks. And ah it's hard to think. I mean, we've had other other exceptional performances, but it probably is right up there against a team in second position.
00:07:43
Speaker
a really physical team as well, who can also you know mix it and play some decent stuff here and there. um to have absolutely bossed that mid first half um creating three excellent chances should have been sort of miles out of sight and but the most impressive thing i thought was then um going behind and sort of still having the confidence and the wherewithal to play ourselves back into it as well i I'm almost more pleased about that than the way we carved them open in the first half so often as well. And really pleasing that, again, Clement's magic touch when it comes to substitutions, which seem to be losing it touch slightly on Friday against Portsmouth, came back today with the introduction of And Shwartau and Toure, and Toure in particular, I think, sort of turned the game as well. The luckless Chris Gorin in the first half had that really good chance. And as hard as he works, he just doesn't have that sort of running power to stretch defences in the way that Toure and Makama can as well. It's quite frightening, actually, because Torre is so raw and it's quite rare for a player as raw as he is to still pose such a significant threat against one of the best defences, if not the best defence in the Championship as well. The way he kept stretching the play in the second half was fantastic.
00:09:10
Speaker
And yeah, just ah just a really, really great win. um Just quickly on port Portsmouth before we get to that. it was just sort of my one takeaway from that is Portsmouth probably missed out an opportunity for three points fighting for their lives against a team that had to field players who had played sort of on Wednesday morning. Team players coming back from injury, Schwartel being thrown straight in. And I sort of worked out afterwards that Of our outfield players, only four were playing in their best positions. Kenny, Mattson, Darling at right centre-back and Chris Gorham. You could argue Shortell on the left maybe, but really as we saw today, he's probably going to be a more central player. And even Chris Gorham maybe isn't an out-and-out striker either. So to have come away...
00:09:54
Speaker
With a point from that one, I think we can look back on it now after today's win has sort of put a lot of effort in, looked tired, but did okay on Friday and then did brilliantly today. you not counting Medic in his best position? Well, because he's striker. Oh, I see. Just quickly, the international break thing really peeved me a bit because I looked at the team news on ah before the game on Friday and then went, oh, so how many minutes did Ahmed and Slomani actually play on Wednesday? And Ahmed was 15. I was like, oh, OK, sure. But then Slomani, I think, played the full 90 minutes of that game, which for a friendly was just...
00:10:35
Speaker
ridiculous like ridiculous, given the the quick turnaround. But um speaking of turnaround, good segue, Zoe, Norwich after the opener, I thought were fantastic. And the decisions they made on the ball in the final third were very assured. And the way the substitutes changed the dynamics of the entire game, particularly for Norwich going forward, was I thought, yeah like Philippe Clement said, the best we've probably seen this season. In terms of the consistent positive reactions to these tactical tweaks and substitutions, where do you rank this management team in terms of, I guess, certainly recent history of ah Norris City leaderships? Because it seems like everything they touch turns to gold at the moment.
00:11:19
Speaker
It is really incredible. And yeah, they do seem to just be sort of blessed at the moment in terms of of everything that goes on. It just happens to go right. um And it's it's wonderful. And I am personally not a fan of the five substitutions thing. I
Player Performance and Management
00:11:37
Speaker
think it's really sort of impacted Championship football especially, I think that it's so rare for a second half to to really show much flow. There's ah so much stop and start. Often so many players are brought on that it is actually it's it's too many for the team to actually you know necessarily get any better because there's too much adjustment to be going on. And I think for...
00:12:01
Speaker
four like it is consistent that Clément will make changes and it will change the side for the put side's performance for the better. um Yeah, it is in be really, really impressive. um And yeah, it's quite scary how well it's going. um I think...
00:12:22
Speaker
I've completely forgotten what I was going to say there. So I'll stop talking. I had another point to make, but I've completely forgotten what it was. When I said this podcast was going to be exactly the same as the previous ones, maybe maybe not. Maybe Zoe's lost all her memory. I've just completely lost it.
00:12:40
Speaker
Oh, that's what remember. That's what I was going to say. It's not going to be good. It's not that interesting. But having seen quite a lot of Millwall's game against Middlesbrough on Friday in the pub in Norwich before our game, the first half seemed to take a very similar approach sort of um run as our game today with Middlesbrough absolutely dominating Millwall and said in the pub, Middlesbrough regret not taking these chances, get into the second half. And Millwall absolutely did a number on them, a really impressive second half.
00:13:16
Speaker
It would have been easy for that to have happened today. And, you know, I guess maybe not in 2026, but over the course of the season, Middlesbrough are a better team than us. So for to be you would have been forgiven to think, well, when Millwall took the lead, the same sort of thing was going to to transpire. um And I think that's, you know, that's the really impressive thing that we, you know, the crowd were up.
00:13:42
Speaker
They were one nil up. They remembered what had happened on Friday. I think for us to have turned that round away from home, I think it is just all credit to all of them. I just think it was so impressive.
00:13:54
Speaker
And this this is the thing, Steve. I thought Norwich were excellent in the first half, and I'd argue that they could have been three ne up ah going into going into the break. And then the second half starts, Millwall tweak things a little bit, and they they go in front. And at this point, kind of like Zoe alluded to, you're kind of going... in okay, this is the chance for them. you know, they've got a good result on Friday, despite not playing their best and they can really turn the screw. But what changes did you notice that really arguably turned the game in Norwich's favour as soon as they conceded that first goal?
00:14:27
Speaker
um I think Dan's touched on it too, Ray. And to be honest, ah you know, Millwall did come out as strong at the start of that second half. i think going to two up top and having two men, big strikers in the box to cross the ball into helped them in that regard with the goal.
00:14:44
Speaker
But other than that, it was kind of a continuation of of where we were at in the first half. We certainly looked more um in to hit it long into the channels to Touré than we were doing under when Chris Gorham was on the pitch for obvious reasons.
00:14:56
Speaker
I think the difference really was just we were clinical and... but The other thing to add to what was brilliant about Toure today was, you know, we've seen him, we've seen his strength, we've seen how quick he is, but his composure for both of the goals, both of them I thought he'd completely messed Actually, I thought he'd held on to it for too long, but he picked out the pass in a way that you think, why don't more players do than that? And obviously he's then helped by a brilliant finish for that. But his pass for the second goal is fantastic. Again, I thought he'd held on to it for too long. But he has the composure to pick out Schwartau in a way that actually Kenny didn't repay the favour, although Kenny was good, but you know what I mean, later on in the game.
00:15:37
Speaker
But I think they they took the chances and Mattson's finished for that first goal. like At the moment, he just cannot... But I think it felt like it's been coming, that that goal, that first goal, and as soon as he scored against Charlton, it's like the floodgates have opened. And um that's something that I think we've missed a little bit for a while now, maybe since we've had, well, I suppose Sarah and he must not be named to have have left. We haven't had those kind of goals coming from midfield. but If Mattson can add that to his game, then he really is a looking like he might be the complete midfielder for us. But back to Toria, three starts, four off the bench, five goals and three assists. You do still need to pinch yourself a little bit with how ridiculous it is. his start has been even though he hasn't scored for a while um so yeah i i don't think there was masses that changed but the second half would be so impressive you know like last time we were on the podcast i was saying how good could this team be when big phil can use subs tactically rather than just because they're the only lads who can come on and we need to give other people a break I think we saw a little bit of that today.
00:16:44
Speaker
Kept Magoma, Forsen right in the paddock. and But the subs were so effective with, you know, I think most people would have brought on Magoma for Slimani before Shvartal. That worked incredibly well. So, yeah, really going back to what Zoe said, nothing Big Phil at the moment does can can go wrong. And, he you know, even though you look at these things and think, not sure I would have, you just know that he's going to get it right because 90, 95% the time he does I imagine the the cynics among our listeners might think that maybe we've had to move home for this podcast because one of our number is so embarrassed that they once said that Matson had such a weak shot. um He looked like he was never going to score from any distance.
00:17:26
Speaker
who Who was that again? Sorry. Do you want to? Does anyone want to own up? Oh, no. Yeah, that yeah that that what might' have been um might have been me saying that he he shot, he's shooting, remind me of Wes's shooting and that it always looked like he was using his weaker foot, what whichever foot.
00:17:42
Speaker
but my My next question is this, Dan. Are you stupid? Are you stupid? I can answer that one. I remember getting an awful lot of pushback at the time, mind you. Dan, I'll come to you next, please. the The individual improvement is something which has been so well documented, and not just in terms of results, but the kind of the the in microscopic moments throughout the game. like The Torre examples today, I think, are the best of that.
00:18:12
Speaker
Because it was so easy for the first goal for him to run down the channel and sort of swing his left foot ah and flash the ball across the face of goal. And with the second one as well, in my head, I'm thinking he's winding up to shoot. He's absolutely going to draw this across the face of goal. But that moment of composure is something which even even for someone who's come...
00:18:32
Speaker
over from Australia and is learning the English game. And there was always going to be that adaption period. It feels like he's kind of gone one step further with that, in the with with the way he's being coached.
00:18:43
Speaker
And there's always going to be a this chat about recruitment going into the summer. But are we in a position now where we do kind of think... If they can get these players fully fit, not that they won't need to sign anymore, but we do have enough variety in the squad that we can, A, make like-for-like changes if someone does kind of fatigue and the game plan's going well, but B, there are enough profiles of players there that they can change the the whole course of a game if they if they come on. Do we finally have a squad that looks balanced and, dare I say, it has that variety? Yeah.
00:19:15
Speaker
yeah i'm not Yeah, it's interesting. I'm not entirely sure that Clement's after variety in in his number nine, in particular we're talking about Toure, he wants a big guy who can run in behind, but is also good with ball to feet as well, which is you know asking quite a lot because that not many of them exist. ah But we do seem to certainly have one with Makama, still very early days with him, and it increasingly looks like we have one with Toure as well. So it's interesting that he seems very keen to want to buy another number nine in the in the summer as well. But I do think behind the number nine or either side of them, we do have an increasing amount of variety. um And obviously some of them are still not fit. If you think of Shor Tao and Sienat, people, you know, two young players who like to, or who can sort of cover a lot of ground when attacking in that sort of Kevin De Bruyne kind of way, not comparing them to Kevin De Bruyne, but in that sort of style of play. You've got Slamani, who's a bit more of a sort of technician um around there. You've got Diallo and Ahmed with a bit more pace.
00:20:23
Speaker
um And obviously Jacob Wright's been playing there as well and sort of brings that sort of um vision, sort of central midfield vision as well. And there's Eurosek as well, but we're still not the wiser, really. And Magoma as well, who sort of brings that mix of Shortel, that sort of ability to cover ground, but also the technical vision of Slimani as well. So yeah, a huge amount of variety. And I was just, there's so much, ah such a high ceiling in a lot of these players that we were not seeing at the start of the season, obviously. Sienat's very, ah as we've all said, very interesting to see what Clement can do with him. But Fisher, Makama,
00:21:05
Speaker
um Torre and Schwarzau, how high are their ceilings? i They've come already come in on leaps and bounds under Clement as well.
00:21:19
Speaker
They're but all very young still, at a good age. Seem to be sort of coachable as well, which is is the key to growing as well. So I think we can be quite excited about the make-up of our attack at the moment going into to next season. And we'll probably be looking sort of elsewhere around where to tweak around the edges as well.
00:21:41
Speaker
Zoe, I'm going to come to you as the most positive person on this podcast with a glass half empty question. Does this kind of speak more about the quality of Norwich, this result, or perhaps the lack of quality in the division as a whole, if Norwich are able to go to the side in second place and put on a display like this? Or arguably, is it a bit of both? And is it kind of indicative of what this time of the season can do to a team who have a lot to play for at this time?
00:22:09
Speaker
Yeah, it was it's an interesting one. I mean, I think i think it's probably pretty much universally is accepted that this year's championship hasn't been the highest quality it ever has been.
00:22:22
Speaker
um However... as I said, saw quite a lot of Millwall-Millsborough the other day. You know, that was proper championship football at its best, like nearing the end of the season, pulsating game, super exciting.
00:22:36
Speaker
um And you can only really deal with what's in front of you. And I think... um so it's you know it's very hard to tell on the quality other than saying we must have quite a lot of it if we have managed to go through this calendar year so far and got so many points you know there's it's not like teams aren't picking up points you know there are you know a lot of teams that are doing pretty well and we are we are beating quite you know we've beat Coventry now we've beat Millwall hopefully we're going to beat It's Switch next week like those things keep happening um so I think it's a sign of how far we've come very difficult to measure overall other than i imagine when all three promoted clubs get immediately relegated from the Premier League next season and that will be a sign of it
00:23:29
Speaker
i Just to step in briefly, I had two slight pangs of regret with this game today. Number one, obviously, being that we've handed a big advantage to Farage FC, which is a shame. um And number two, that it really could have been us with a better start this season. like um It is now, there is only now one club with a better record than us since Philippe Clement took over and we happen to be playing them next Saturday. Coventry might
Norwich City's Transformation
00:23:59
Speaker
change that if they win tonight, which they probably will. But as we speak, we are currently the second best team in the Championship since the 21st of November. And we were second worst team before Clement came in. It's absolutely mad. But it does it's made me think like, I don't know. Well, as as we all have, I guess, you know, a like I could keep saying, when he when ah Big Phil took over, I was thinking, have they left enough time?
00:24:23
Speaker
for us to stay up. Whereas now it's actually, God, we could have been a force this season. We really, really could. And and and going away to second in the league and deservedly winning that game um does make me think, yeah, this could have been our year.
00:24:34
Speaker
But what I was going to follow up actually to you, Steve, is are Norwich allowed to be this good because they don't have that pressure of having something to fight for? Like, is the next gauge of seeing how good they are, putting putting them in a real pressure situation, like fighting for promotion with four games left and seeing how they cope with being under the cosh at home for a bit, having ground out a result before? is is the Is the character the next test of how good they actually are? Well, not really, because weirdly, this is the first...
00:25:04
Speaker
Before this game and then when we won went 1-0 down was the first time i've thought I thought, well, maybe like maybe there is an element where we're not going nick games because we haven't got something to play for. The Portsmouth game was the first one where i thought,
00:25:16
Speaker
like, OK, we are safe now. We've had a bit of a break. They haven't been training with you know there every day. So maybe we are just going to see out the season, Hipswich game aside, and just kind of coast to the end because we don't need to.
00:25:28
Speaker
I would say up until that point, we have been playing for survival, right? I think, you know, probably we've all thought for a while now, well, we will be safe playing like this. But I don't suppose there would have been any complacency within the dressing room. So i i don't i don't think so. like it's a ah Staying up is a different challenge to a promotion race where you really do have to go into every game.
00:25:52
Speaker
like you know Losing a game really sets you back, whereas when you're playing for survival, you can lose a game and kind of get away with it. um But i i I sort of think i i think we have seen this team perform under pressure. I think we have had big games. Well, Filipe Clement has been... in place So I wouldn't see that as a problem for next season, but could be completely wrong in 12 months' time.
00:26:15
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, beating Coventry when we were ah maybe still in the bottom three or in the bottom four or five are at that stage, beating all the teams around us in big relegation battles, Oxford, Leicester, and West Brom. ah Yeah, I saw an Ipswich fan saying, oh, you're only playing well because the pressure's off. And it's like, we were second from bottom. like We have now deserved to have the pressure off because of the incredible turnaround we've had over the last three, four months. We we have, that's just reminder, we've now beaten both the top two to, well, Ipswich are now in second, having won today, but we've won it from behind under Philippe Clement against Coventry and Millwall. That's seriously impressive stuff. Live scenes, Borough are now second because they they've gone 1-0 up.
00:26:59
Speaker
yeah nice Nice. Well, in that case, Steve, you're wrong. It's not for the time. Ipswich are now second because Swansea have equalised against Borough. Oh,
00:27:10
Speaker
tonight i guess I'm right. I don't think Adam Eder just flipped me the bird. My goodness. um ah Let's touch on Portsmouth. Dan, respectfully, the vibe of the whole game was a bit of nothing, right? And I looked at it and was kind of thinking, yeah, this, as soon as the whistle went, I was like, this is draw written all over it. Right. And it kind of panned out to be this kind of vanilla flat atmosphere and and tempo on the pitch too.
00:27:40
Speaker
Yeah, ah first half an hour i thought actually we were pretty decent, sort of in control. um And then second half, Portsmouth, I was going say played well enough, but Did just about enough, I think, to deserve a draw from that. I don't think either team deserved to get a win from it. What I would say is, though, that Portsmouth should have been down to 10 men very ah very early in that game, as they were today against Oxford, and should have been down to nine men in the second half when Caballero should have been sent off as well for it, the second yellow. So they kind of got a one away with one there, but 11 v 11, it looked such a tired performance from us, understandably. I know we had quite a few players come in who hadn't been at the international break, but not first team starters, players who maybe hadn't sort of played together before. and gelled together. Kenny looked tired and had a very rare poor game this season, I thought. And when he has a poor game and looks tired, you know that the team is probably off their game as well. um
00:28:45
Speaker
It was not nice to see Medici back. I thought he was pretty bad on the ball, but did his defensive duties really well against a team that were, you know, in the second half were throwing balls into the box a lot. And he seemed to win most of those headers and most of his duels as well. So it's sort of nice to see him get a run out. Shame he still hasn't scored though, so he can reveal what he's got written on his T-shirt, under his shirt.
00:29:11
Speaker
But of all the games under Clemente, It's one we'll probably forget the quickest and unsurprisingly, i what was it, our first draw in 20 games, 21 games it was as well?
00:29:23
Speaker
Because we are the entertainers. Yeah. did Didn't Portsmouth score as well as Medich came off at a set piece? So he was literally the note perfect and they took him off and then Mattson was like, I don't know what to do! Just sort of smashed it in like an overly...
00:29:38
Speaker
I thought you weren't supposed to make substitutions when you were defending a set piece. like isn't that on reading Yeah, I know. We did it twice. i thought that was like an unwritten rule that you never did that. And we proved why. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. He can do what he wants. Yeah, it's true. It is true.
00:29:55
Speaker
Zoe, let's have a chat about Pedder Mattson quickly because at the moment that boy can do no wrong and he's currently got four goals in three games, winky face. um I mean, for someone who, um say this tongue-in-cheek now we've had the revelation or reminder of what Dan said earlier in the season, he he's adding now goals to his game and and his movement in the final third mick makes him an attacking threat as well. And he he does have a pretty high ceiling now, doesn't he?
00:30:23
Speaker
Yeah, he is he is wonderful. um It's just so easy to like him um as a footballer. He works so hard. He's tenacious. He doesn't stop. um He just looks like he could run and run forever um and never get tired and never get bored of it, crucially. He just seems to want to keep going.
00:30:43
Speaker
And he smiles as well. There was a good bit in, I can't remember what had happened, but during the game when he was smiling away at Kellan Fisher and was thinking... you're not going to get much back from Fisher. I don't think he's an in-game smiler, is he? But he just seems to really enjoy playing football, which is magnificent. um And yeah, he he is getting, you know, we when he got injured, we all knew he would be a big loss for us. um You know, Sam Field had come in and done a really decent job, but I think...
00:31:13
Speaker
Matson coming back really shows the extra bit of quality that he's got. He keeps stepping up. um And I think he's just such a crucial player alongside Kenny in our midfield. um And he, yeah, he's a joy to watch. um And he's got that great mixture of like,
00:31:33
Speaker
I think he is actually harder than he looks like. I think he is quite tough, but he also looks really nice and smiley. So he's not a scary person, but he also will stand up for himself, which I think is is what you need.
00:31:45
Speaker
Now he has has added goals to his game, Steve. Is there a slight argument and that Norwich should be a bit worried in the summer? Because I think, i am'm in my in my head, I think Kellen Fisher is the next one off the conveyor belt. But looking at Pella Mattson, he's kind of come from nowhere and is now adding other things to his game that they've clearly coached him on because Clement said he's been practicing that kind of shot the last few weeks. So is there a cause for concern, maybe?
00:32:14
Speaker
ah The thought did cross my mind now that he's scored three goals in three games. That's the kind of thing that does put you in the limelight as a centre midfielder. But um I mean, that the the position we're in at the moment with the Sargent money, with the fact that we have owners who are...
00:32:30
Speaker
a little bit more, ah have a little bit more cash behind them than we have previously had. I think it would take a big offer. And if it it takes a big offer and he has to go, then I think we say goodbye and good luck.
00:32:42
Speaker
ah To me, it still feels a little bit early into his kind of Norwich City timeline for him to be um kind of upping sticks and going somewhere else. And he seems like he's enjoying it at the moment. Really, we've only seen, i guess, like this...
00:32:58
Speaker
Phil Clement um period of of him really ex excelling and part of that he's been injured. So we're really, really talking about 20 games, i agree he looks exceptional, but that seems like not an awful lot of time for ah a team to take a big opportunity on, or at least not the the kind of money that we'd be looking for. So I...
00:33:15
Speaker
Again, I could be completely wrong. and We could be sitting here um kind of bemoaning another centre midfielder leaving us next summer. But I think I feel like he'll give us another year. and I hope so anyway. um
'Right or Long' Game
00:33:27
Speaker
Just to say, just because it hasn't been mentioned yet while we're talking about the centre midfield, I didn't expect to see Kenny McLean playing on right wing. i don't think he was a nominally a right winger. um But it worked so well. i thought Field was so good today. And again, just another example of of Phil getting absolutely spot on. I think he probably brought Field in to help nullify the set-piece threat that Millwall had because he's in an extra, ah I suppose, tall body in there.
00:33:56
Speaker
um But I would not have separated that Kenny and Mattson axis. And yet again, it worked perfectly. I think Kenny playing there sort of helped quell the Sturge threat from left back from for Millwall. And we were still a threat on the counter as well. So just props to him again.
00:34:15
Speaker
I was going to mention that as well, actually, because Big Phil is sort of quite a blueprinty coach. He has his way of playing and he sticks to it. And this is probably the first time we've shown we've seen a bit of innovation from him, which is quite exciting um as well. like to have.
00:34:35
Speaker
Kenny sort of normally playing on the right, to which helped with the press as well, I think. And they could not cope with Stacey taking up positions, high right as well. um So as much as like the players are developing under Clement, it's interesting to see Clement having the confidence now. Maybe you know we are safe, having a bit more confidence or or the opportunity to... tweak a few things or try out a few different things as well. And maybe we'll see a bit more of that over the next were five games left.
00:35:05
Speaker
but But also, just quickly, that there's there's no I think the players deserve some credit as well because there's no way that they can have trained and trained and trained with Kenny McLean playing on right wing. This will have been something that will have probably come up, I guess, maybe Phil had it in his mind, but probably come up since Friday as a way to to deal with the threat of Millwall. And they they just...
00:35:24
Speaker
the thing that The players are carrying out his every instruction at the moment and that's what makes this team such a joy to watch because that they are they just seem to be kind of in simpatico the whole time, which is exactly the opposite of what we've experienced with other managers recently. Today was the first day as well where I thought of Sam Field as more than just a stopgap. There was a small part of me which was like, maybe it does make sense to to get him in regardless of where Norwich will be in a couple years' time. But hey, never fall in love with a lone player, as they say.
00:35:54
Speaker
As we said before, new pod, same whimsy, which means the same features. This week, it's the return of Right or Long.
00:36:17
Speaker
Take it away, Zoe. Yeah, I'm excited to be in charge of this feature for the first time. So for those of you, including the people on the panel who don't remember what Right or Long is, um I will present to our contestant today, who is going to be NCFC Numbers, a.k.a. Steve Sanders, who going a thing about football it could be anything it could be norwich city related it might not be uh and steve is challenged with discussing that and saying whether he believes that thing is right jacob right or long george long maybe ah an fa cup winner later this season um
00:36:58
Speaker
And what we will do is we will also see what Ryan and Daniel also think about that thing. And Steve will get points if he has said the same thing as both Ryan and Dan. Forgot all your names there. um It's going well. All this adrenaline is obviously not good for me remembering things to say. um So we've got a few of these. Steve, if you're ready. I am ready. Looking forward to you breathing new life into this tired format. The first one is tiny shin pads.
00:37:35
Speaker
The first one is... Okay, no leading. Just got a snap decision on tiny shin pads. um I feel... I don't object to them per se, but you might as well wear no shin pads, right? i don't has Has there been some scientific research into the area of the shin that is most likely to break? And so therefore players are wearing smaller shin pads than normal because they are protecting the area that's most likely to be targeted. I'm saying they haven't done that much research. So either don't wear them at all or wear them properly.
00:38:09
Speaker
So I'm saying long pads. Interesting. Ryan's got something to say. I do. I have something to show as well, which is no good to our listeners, but I ordered some football socks, some grippy, grippy ones, and they came with aforementioned mini shin pads. Now for context, that is the size of them.
00:38:30
Speaker
what They are as about the size of my microphone. they ah compared to the Compared to the palm of my hand, they just about fit into the palm of my hand. Now, for any people who know goalkeeper attire, I'm a size nine and a half in gloves, which is just below, i think, maybe about average.
00:38:50
Speaker
So the average 31-year-old male's palm is the size of these mini shin pads. It's like phone case. Yeah. yeah I would say a sausage dog could wear that as a hat, but a Labrador couldn't. That helps to give any context. I think a Labrador could wear these as full shin pads, arguably. So I'm going to say long because they freak me the F out. Because if someone comes in with metal studs on you, these are going to do nothing whatsoever.
00:39:21
Speaker
So I'm going to say long. I think they're a bit too dangerous, but then I'm a precious little boy. So maybe that's that's why. But long for me, please. Thank you, Ryan. Daniel? I'm going to say long as well because I'm also a precious little boy who ah always gets ribbed when I used to play five-a-side for wearing full shin pads, even at five-a-side. And no one wears five-a-side shin pads. But I want to protect those little shins down there.
00:39:47
Speaker
But not so little that you'd wear tiny shin pads. Yeah. I mean, I would wear cricket pads if possible. Can't really run in those effectively. I've played football with you. Sometimes it is like you're wearing crickets. cricket Right. Well, i'm I'm quite surprised. We're all in agreement. So that is two points to Steve. Get in. Congratulations. um The second thing I'd like you to judge right or long.
00:40:16
Speaker
Welcome to Wrexham.
00:40:19
Speaker
Okay, well, I should probably declare straight off the bat, I have never seen this programme. um What's it about? No, I do know what it's about. So this is, I guess, let's so let's maybe, am I allowed to extend it to and Rob? I think it's the concept of what's going on at Wrexham, really, is what I'm asking about.
00:40:39
Speaker
It's a very good one, because I feel, ah feel like there's a part of me that... and now it's back. Oh, no!
00:40:50
Speaker
My goodness, Disney cut off his internet. i I'm having such an existential crisis about this that I have to leave the chat and come back. i think I think on balance, I'm going to go right because I think it's probably here like envy that makes me...
00:41:10
Speaker
that that makes me slightly turn off it. And also the fact that it's it's the the media and the way that the media cover it that I think I object to more because I feel like Wrexham get more coverage than probably most Premier League teams do. like It annoys me when I'll scroll through, i don't know, BBC Sport or something and Wrexham drawing with Hull is above Premier League results. But fundamentally, that's just the way the world works. And I think they're probably too...
00:41:38
Speaker
reasonably okay blokes who have just ploughed load money into a football club and it's going really well. So I'm going to say, right, um i don't I don't mind it that much. Okie dokie. Daniel, we'll come to you.
00:41:51
Speaker
They're torn because I do think they've been good for the community, which is what you want football owners to be. You want them to pull money not only into a football club, ah but also into the sort of local community as well. And I don't think it's just because of their rise through the leagues that they are loved in Wrexham.
00:42:11
Speaker
But equally, on the other hand, it has made more Americans watch football. And I don't think that can be a ah good thing on any level. So we don't need more pete more Josh Sargeants.
00:42:25
Speaker
We don't need more, ah other than our own owners, more American owners um taking us down the path of no relegation or no promotion. and So on that basis, I'm going to say a long But i do love It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia, so he can have a right for that. Brian.
00:42:46
Speaker
I'm going to say right purely on the basis that, A, I think the initial story is very good about a club who are kind of in the mire and someone you know picks them up out of the dirt. And as Dan said, what they do for the community is is wonderful. And the only thing I think is the issue is the repetitive nature of the story when you kind of get to League Two, League One. And I think it will now start to get a bit more interesting now they're in...
00:43:13
Speaker
there's more of the chance of failure in terms of getting to the Premier League. And then the ambition of getting to the Premier League in itself is always ah a watchable thing from a global standpoint. But I think fundamentally, they they are two guys who are in it for the right reasons. Yes, they're able to get stuff out of it and doing this documentary, of course. But I think they are two guys who get it, which compared to a lot of owners coming in is a breath of of fresh air. And it doesn't feel... performative yes there might have been an element of that at the start but it feels like now they are invested in the in the club in the town and what they have done for Wrexham as as a kind of borrower as well is is is wonderful so I'm gonna say right and can I just say if we do have um any American listeners tuning in we appreciate you and thank you for your support ah
00:44:08
Speaker
But Dan doesn't remember that.
00:44:13
Speaker
Zoe, Ryan and Steve appreciate you. Oh, I didn't agree. Ryan and Steve, appreciate Steve appreciates you. Right? Where did that come I'm literally half American.
00:44:26
Speaker
but Yeah, your mum's fine, though. to you know She wants to take her ownership of a football club. I'm sure she'd do a great job. Yeah, she's the only person from Arkansas to have a Norfolk accent, and and that is what's what makes her wonderful.
00:44:41
Speaker
We would be highly compromised if Ryan's mum took over Norwich, though, wouldn't we? I think we'd have to have some. I'm not sure we'd be allowed to continue. Right, so that's one point to Steve in that round. ah Next one, a bit more of a Norwich City theme, potentially.
00:44:58
Speaker
Head coaches being on social media? I'm going to say right, ah partly because because Phil is doing it. And I've already said that everything he does is correct. so I can't get back on my word now, can I? um I mean, it makes it makes things more interesting when they are.
00:45:16
Speaker
Nothing good can come of it from their perspective, but it's it's fun for the rest of us in case they drop a massive bollock or say something they really shouldn't have done. There are certain head coaches who, I mean, I can't really think of that many who are, but it it feels like we're in Nathan Jones and Brendan Rodgers' territory. Sorry, Dan has just made some balloons go off his school. What?
00:45:40
Speaker
What? My hands were away from my keyboard. Why have balloons suddenly appeared on the screen? To be fair, when you were looking at Steve, you did look miserable. So maybe it was your MacBook trying to cheer you up.
00:45:54
Speaker
And why has that only ever happened to me? It is my birthday this month, though, so maybe it's getting some preppy. Maybe it knows. Well, I think we should take that as Dan agreeing with me and saying, right, that's you' we don't we can just skip past him. i'm I'm saying right, but thank you for agreeing with me, Dan.
00:46:13
Speaker
Do you think Philip Clements ever actually looked at his own social media channels? No, absolutely not. I can't imagine he has. i can't imagine he has. Which is why which is why i'm good I'm going to say long.
00:46:26
Speaker
I think when you have kind of... social media companies churning out this kind of generic, oh, fans were superb, three points, brilliant stuff, whatever it would be. I think it's really bland and just a bit of nothing.
00:46:38
Speaker
If they actually had some personality on on offer, like, you know, we saw what Philippe Clermont gets up to on his days off or something like that, then sure. But for me, kind of archetypal generic sports people posts are a big, fat long.
00:46:54
Speaker
Thank you, Ryan. Daniel? Long. I mean, what's what's the point? It can only end in disaster or ah abuse, which is, you know, not their fault. it's the It's the people abusing them fault. um But we don't need to see Philippe Clément or his number two...
00:47:17
Speaker
cutting out or cropping images from you know official ones that still have credits in and still have the captions in and then putting them on their instagram which although quite sweet does seem a bit of a waste of time and by the way if it's not them doing it and i very much know it normally isn't then maybe they need to find someone else to do it for them because they are very dull and felipe clement is not a dull man ah It's true. Where are the pictures of him down the Belgian monk? Yeah, I'd love to see some behind, like at home with Big Phil kind of content. That well that would be great. How else are you going to see that unless he he is on social media as the head coach? you But he's not doing that though. But what's the question is, do you object to being on there in the first place?
00:48:01
Speaker
Yeah, I've never seen a manager use it correctly. I had to google Google because I'm sure Lee Johnson used to be on Twitter and it used to be... Oh, okay. Can i change my... And it used to be a very high-performance, Jake Humphrey adjacent, but I just Googled it and I couldn't find him on there. So I may have just assumed he was the kind of manager who would have been on there.
00:48:19
Speaker
Well, that was a waste of you releasing these balloons. and We didn't say happy birthday, they Steve, so I was going to agree with you. Right, zero points for Steve on that one. um Okay, the next one.
00:48:33
Speaker
ah Three-week international breaks. These are good. You should have been doing this all season. Why have I been wasting my time racking my brain? Is that three-week or three-week as in not strong international? Three-week.
00:48:52
Speaker
Great. Thank you for clarifying. ah Is this, and but further question, is this at the expense of another international break? Yes, so that's what will be happening next season, isn't it? We're having fewer international breaks, but they will be longer.
00:49:09
Speaker
I'm going to say right. I think it's probably for the better. i don't actually know when this bonus international, this three-week international break is going to be. But I think fewer international breaks to apart from anything else, break up Norwich City's flow as they head towards a title charge next year. um But also, I always think that the idea of an international break is always worse than reality. I always quite enjoy them when they come round.
00:49:37
Speaker
The break is quite nice. So then, hold on, am I arguing against my point here? Probably. I think i think a three-week one could could probably work in that you get into the international, a little bit like you get into the flavour in international ah football when there's a World Cup or Eurozone.
00:49:52
Speaker
You could have a little bit of that within the season, but it not break up the club football. So I'm i'm writing that one all the way home. Lovely. Daniel. Daniel. I think longer is writer. um I agree with Steve. sure As long as it's not this stage of the season next season, because having two weekends without championship football when it's got to the really sort of interesting business end of the season, I think that would be a shame.
00:50:24
Speaker
ah But i agree. yeah And also it's a nice it's nice opportunity for all of us football fans to just go and do something on a Saturday instead of... working it all the way around a football match, you know, just go and eat some nice food, go for a walk somewhere. Whatever whatever you enjoy gives you more of an opportunity to do that. um So I am in favour.
00:50:45
Speaker
Ryan. Full house, I'm going to say right as well. I think that it's going to benefit international teams as well because they get more time together. But ah it just means less breaks during the domestic season, which means, you know, especially this time of year, as the guys have alluded to, less kind of stalling the run-ins. And I don't have anything else to add.
00:51:07
Speaker
So, yeah, right. that's too Well done, FIFA. Always loved them. yeah Always making good decisions. Right, this is the the last real one, and then we've got a little bonus one after this. ah It is calling commentators by their nicknames vis-a-vis Fletch.
00:51:25
Speaker
I mean, this one's very easy, isn't it? Long. And Brian and Dan can feel free to disagree with me on this, but I will think less of them if they do. ah I mean, no apart from anything else, I can't think of an example other than Fletch. Morty.
00:51:41
Speaker
Oh, yeah, Motti. um Yeah, but that was a kind of affectionate, nerdy, you know, you sometimes call me NCFC numbers kind of way, not a Fletcher's. I cannot bear the whole laddish commentary thing that they're up to at the moment on TNT. I think I listened to West Ham and Leeds for about five minutes yesterday and they got him and Ali managed to get on my nerves in that time because it they just won't shut up. And I think part of that, probably a good 90% of that is because they call him Fletch. So it's a lot.
00:52:15
Speaker
They are commentating on everything at the moment, those two. They never stop. um Ryan, you're up. Do you agree? Oh, no, I agree. Long, long. it It reminds me of that clip of The Office where David Brent's like, is the man Finchie? And it just gives me it gives me the ick so much. like i i I can't stand it. like i I get that they're they're friends and they want to try to make it a bit lighter and whatnot, but it it for whatever reason, it's just cringey to me. So I'm going to say long.
00:52:49
Speaker
Excellent. Daniel? ah Is Fletch any different to Ali? It's just shortening her nose? Well, yes. That's his like give, like people, everyone calls him. It's like saying, well, we should call Kenny Ken. But does everyone call Fletch Fletch though? I can't even think of his name. Is it Darren? I'm pretty sure that McCoy used to say Darren more than he does. Which is obviously better. Any opportunity for a Scotsman or woman to roll their R's shouldn't be missed. No, yes, it's a long for me. It's too,
00:53:28
Speaker
chummy um familiar it's too sort of puts a barrier up to the audience i think as well that these two pals are just and i really like ali mcquist uh but these two pals are just sort of sitting at the football um as fans rather than as people there to sort of do their job on behalf of the uh audience so yeah it's too too chummy for me so i'm going long because I think that is, you've you've hit the nail on the head of why i dislike it so much. If you listen to their commentary, it's literally like there could be no one else listening and they're just having a chat with each other. like, that's not what you're there to do. But no this is a Norwich City podcast. station
00:54:03
Speaker
We never do in-jokes on this podcast. And we've never been accused of it either. People don't like it. I thought your beliefs would come up again. But also... Also, we're not paid. So if anyone is listening and wants to sponsor us, then we'll change our team. Not yet. People are choosing to listen to us, whereas often you don't have you do not have a choice of commentators. um
Ipswich Town PR Issues
00:54:27
Speaker
like if if If you could choose who commentated on England games, no one would be going for ah Dixon and Matterface, would they?
00:54:36
Speaker
Okay. I think I'd turn commentary off if I had a choice. No no disrespect to the commentators. I just prefer the the kind of sound of the the stadium compared to some of the options you do get given. But I'll leave that there.
00:54:49
Speaker
which ah Which is a reminder that the sound of the man that could be heard, the Millwall fan that could be heard on the commentary today. Absolutely. I would have just loved to have just him on the on commentary because that was excellent. Sorry to interject. Didn't a commentator today say, oh, a lack of experience there from Kenny MacLean? Yes.
00:55:11
Speaker
It's Luke Chambers who said that. I hate to be fair to him, but he you could tell he definitely meant for a man of Kenny's experience, he shouldn't be doing that. And it came out wrong.
00:55:23
Speaker
Right. Well, you're doing very well, Steve, but there's one more um and we are bringing it back to being a Norwich City podcast and with the Derby ah approaching. Here we go. Your last question. Allowing one of the most divisive and potentially harmful politicians of modern times free run of your football club for a PR opportunity. Is that right or long? We've moved the Farage section up the podcast, have we? good to know. just need a simple I just need a simple right or along from you.
00:55:52
Speaker
I wouldn't be doing it. And you're in the biz. I'm in the biz, yeah. um Yeah, I feel like... I don't know. think they might have dropped the ball a bit on that one. Don't want it to be too controversial. Yeah, i have I'd be fascinated to know what all happened behind the scenes and what was said behind the scenes before that all came about. But, um I mean, i don't know what I'd like to think about Ipswich Town, but you'd like to think that they wouldn't have wanted it to go like that. no um kind of comms team or anyone in the background of football club would want it wants it to have gone like that. Putting all politics aside...
00:56:30
Speaker
It's not the right, it's not a good look for any football team, but I think particularly someone as divisive as that and then for them to come out with a statement about inclusivity um after they've done that kind of sticks in the craw. um I mean, you know, we're the good guys. We've always said it, we're the good guys. So I'm going to say that one's long, Zoe.
00:56:48
Speaker
All righty, well, we'll see if you'll get two more points. ah Daniel, right or long? ah Yeah, I mean, it's ah one of the few times I've felt sorry for right-minded Ipswich fans throughout all of that. I did enjoy, though, lots of neutral fans saying they've always preferred Norwich City and isn't on-the-ball city a banger, etc., etc. um But obviously long, and that's not just because of the... um Many, many, many tweets I received ah calling a me terrible names um in under my response to Faraj turning up at Trichetown.
00:57:28
Speaker
I mean, big, fat, long, big, fat, long. i can't add anything else. Everyone, everyone has said what needs to be said on it. It's kind of, i say kind of it's vol it's vulgar. And the whole dealing of the situation has,
00:57:47
Speaker
been a PR nightmare as well. So big fat, big fat long. And if anyone from that party comes anywhere near our football club, I would hope that we would get the same treatment that Ipswich have done as well in terms of backlash, because that is, it's spitting in the face of so many wonderful people in their respective communities who do a lot for the the wider, you know, the wider kind of demographic of East Anglia. So big
East Anglian Derby Preview
00:58:13
Speaker
fat long.
00:58:15
Speaker
That's what I was hoping for. So that's a relief. Well, congratulations, Steve. You have finished right or long with a total of nine out of a possible 12 points. Wow. Congratulations. Thank you. I feel like you gave me a real freebie at the end there. but Yeah. I mean, yeah.
00:58:34
Speaker
And here endeth the future.
00:58:38
Speaker
speaking Speaking about Ipswich Town, if you thought this weekend would spell the end of Norwich City's season, you'd be decidedly wrong. For the fans, at least, there is still a job to do, and that is to hinder Ipswich Town's promotion hopes. This Saturday is the return of the East Anglian derby, with Norwich looking for revenge after their 16-year unbeaten run over Ipswich was unceremoniously ended back in October.
00:59:04
Speaker
ah Zoe, derbies are obviously a little bit juicier when the stakes are bigger than just the bragging rights, but just how big is this from a Norwich perspective? Because, yes, they can swap Ipswich, but i' I'm going to bring it up again. Pending results tomorrow night, by 2.30 on Saturday, Norwich could actually be four points off the playoffs with four games left.
00:59:28
Speaker
It's not over. It's not over. um It's, I mean, it's obviously a bigger game for them than it is for us, but it's felt like that for quite a long time because they've been so desperate to beat us for for quite a long time. Yeah.
00:59:43
Speaker
It feels like the pressure is all on them. um Once again, yes, they won at Portman Road. um But there's obviously like a million asterisks next to that result, because we were going through such an absolute torrid time um under the former regime. so I think it's a massive game for us because i think that big Phil, and I've said this before, will be absolutely determined that they are not going to win. I think he will see this as a big marker that he's putting down as a manager in Norwich city's history.
01:00:20
Speaker
I think he understands what it means to the club. I don't think we're going to have to have Neil Adams explaining it to the players, uh, like he did before the first derby of the season. Um,
01:00:33
Speaker
ah just I just, you know, everything, it feels like ah so much has been leading towards this game. It feels really juicy. It feels exciting. um And, you know, i think i think think that the players will be up for it. I think the manager will be up for it. And even if things have not gone particularly well by half time, I think he will have a massive part to play as well. So, Yeah, I'm quite in a weird way, even though I hate these games, I'm sort of looking forward to it because it feels like there's promise and opportunity there because it will be hilarious if they don't win, which is just the way you want it to be, right?
01:01:16
Speaker
Does it feel like a must win game for Ipswich Steve? Because they've got little room for error with their games in hand and with the topsy turvy nature of the run-in, if they do lose on Saturday, those games in the hand become more and more redundant if teams around them do pick up points ah in the coming weeks as well. So is is it must win? And is that then something that can play into Norwich's hands?
01:01:38
Speaker
Well, update, it's now Swansea 2, Middlesbrough 1. So I would say ah more and more it' it's not looking must win for Ipswich ah because they probably could afford to slip up and might still go up just as they did two years ago. and That doesn't mean any less for us, I don't think. And ah in terms of it, which is round, I believe five of their last seven fixtures are away from home. So they don't have... have an easy run and they have been a lot weaker away from home than they have at home this season. So they they could still finish badly. They've not sort of hammered teams this year. They've tended to win games narrowly.
01:02:15
Speaker
So I wouldn't say it is must win for them. Almost on the flip side, I would think if having beaten Millwall today and if we then allow Ipswich to beat us on Saturday, they will probably be ah saying thank you from ah from the other side of the waveney.
01:02:31
Speaker
But like Zoe, I don't think we will lose on Saturday. i i i The atmosphere is going to be brilliant. It's probably... probably If people can remember what it was like two years ago before the game, it's going to be like that and then add another 10, 20% onto that because the the vibes are already good right now. um We can go in into it with nothing to lose, whereas they will know that there's something riding on it for them. So i I feel very optimistic that we will get at least something out of it. And even if we don't, we'll give them a bloody good game. I worry that Kellen Fisher limped off today. i You know, there's there's not many players who are not replaceable in this team, but I think particularly in a derby game.
01:03:16
Speaker
playing it right back against whoever it is, whether it's Clark or Filagene that they play off the left, would it would have been handy to have had him. So I hope that he's fit. But, you know, yet again, if if it's Stacey and Kraseni who start, then i I would still say we'll be OK.
01:03:32
Speaker
um Dan, it's going to be Philippe Clermont's first East Anglian derby. And as Zoe kind of ah alluded to, i don't feel particularly nervous or anxious going into this game, such as it feels like the preparation will be for Norwich as well. I can't imagine Philippe Clermont allowing the players to feel anxious, not in like an abrasive way, but it it does give the impression, doesn't it, that Norwich are going to be so well prepared to deal with everything on Saturday.
01:04:00
Speaker
Yeah, ah where he's obviously he's a very diligent manager and coaching team. um i don't I feel less anxious now that our run, 14-year run or whatever it was, has been broken somehow. like Holding on to that run made me deeply anxious every time we played Ipswich. Now it feels like, well, it's been reset a bit now.
01:04:21
Speaker
They're obviously in the driving seat and that should be favourites for this game. Yeah.
01:04:28
Speaker
But I don't think necessarily Ipswich fans will see themselves as favourites because it's not no longer a secret that we know each other as the most informed side in 2026 in the Championship, who I think have got the most points. um So I think Ipswich fans, there'll be more pressure on Ipswich than there will be on Norwich. It's interesting interesting, actually, yesterday I was looking at um the tabe championship table when you when teams call first and can see versus concede first. And up till to- today, annoyingly,
01:05:03
Speaker
um ipswich had gone by every game Ipswich had gone behind in first. 14 games, they hadn't won one until today, which is a bit irritating. But they do nearly always win when they score first. So first goal on Saturday could be incredibly important. and So if we start as well as we did today against Ipswich then and nick that first goal, then I'll be very confident. to Well, I say I'll be very confident about holding on to the lead, but obviously I'll be bricking myself about holding on the lead And would probably prefer to go behind as well because you feel less nervous then. ah But I'm looking forward to it just also because I think it will just probably be a really good game in a way that derbies often aren't.
01:05:47
Speaker
um But two teams, as Steve said, since Clement came in, are the two best teams in the championship points-wise. So should be a bit of a humdinger.
01:05:57
Speaker
We need to do a podcast at 11am and ask Dan if he feels nervous then. At 11am on Saturday morning, get very different answer. The idea of obviously them, their fans celebrating at Carrow Road if they do win, obviously makes me um sick. But there it it does feel like a pressure has been lifted because of the the run has ended. i I don't like to talk about this particularly, but anyone know the last season that Ipswich did the double over us?
01:06:24
Speaker
Oh, yeah.
01:06:27
Speaker
No. ah i think I'm right in saying this. the year that we finished third. And they went down, didn't they?
01:06:38
Speaker
I don't think they did that because they went down the same year as... I don't think did that season. Check the ah the Premier League highlights that have been put up for every single game in the Premier League. Yeah.
01:06:51
Speaker
watch their entire season back. um did Does anyone know what the situation is with Nunez? Was he involved today? He started today. Okay. He won't be finishing on Saturday, that's for sure. Yeah.
01:07:06
Speaker
I was going to say, what are the chances on him being out with quote-unquote mysterious injury or something on Saturday? Because i this is actually my next question, Zoe. What kind of treatment do you hope he gets? Hostile.
01:07:20
Speaker
Yeah. Bad landing on him. Yeah, don't look up to the sky and open your mouth. um no i Yeah, I think he deserves a hostile reception. ah like Obviously, you know nothing more than that, but like you know...
01:07:36
Speaker
he he did you know He did the dirty on us and I think that we're absolutely entitled to you know to make that clear, um especially with the way that he celebrated at the end of of the game at Portman Road. I don't think that will have made people very happy. um And I think we've had a seat you know we've had a couple of seasons where where players have you know sort of turned their back on us a little bit. And obviously we've been through it with Sargent this year, so as well as Nunes. So I think some of that all will all come out in in the feeling towards Nunes as well, because obviously we're not going to see... Josh Sargent come to Carrow Road anytime soon. So I think that will be taken out on him.
01:08:15
Speaker
um I mean, come on, like he plays for Chile, so he's played for Chile. So I
Podcast Branding and Future Plans
01:08:20
Speaker
think he will have experienced hostile atmospheres when i don't think it will be too much for him, but it will be interesting because often, you know, when you do give, you know, every goalkeeper we've ever booed, for example, has had the game of their life. So there is always that risk that, you know,
01:08:37
Speaker
The more attention he gets, the better he might play. Are you saying we should clap him, Zoe? Is that what you're saying? No, I'm i prepared to deal with whatever comes because he does not need to be clapped.
01:08:50
Speaker
Well, Steve did clap Todd Cantwell when he came over to take a corner. So an eye on Steve. Can't wait for... Can't wait. Can't wait. so do eat what what's the overriding noise going to be? Is it going to be booing, swearing, or like snake noises, hissing?
01:09:12
Speaker
probably shouldn't say that, actually. Yeah, I think it will be it'll be that constantly. It will be that, yeah, that word constantly. it's It's crazy, isn't it? Because however but many months ago it was now, there's the whole Liam Manning coming out with Van Napa and saying, well, actually, it's the best deal for the football club. And then you have Philippe Clement, who you would imagine if he was in charge then, would go absolutely effing not. like no Like, no chance whatsoever. So... how times change. But we did get Mattson.
01:09:43
Speaker
yeah Yes. Yeah. Who they laughed at as being the replacement. And now we're laughing at them. He says, as they have games in hand to go up. so great. um Steve, i'm going to offer you a ridiculous hypothetical scenario.
01:09:57
Speaker
Imagine tomorrow is a draw draw between Southampton and Wrexham. Norwich win on Saturday, but then in a few weeks' time, Ipswich win at Southampton to secure automatic promotion, but the win at Southampton means Norwich finish in the top six. Do you take it?
01:10:14
Speaker
oh ah Yes. didt Hold on, do they beat us? No, we beat them on Saturday and we finish top six, but them beating Southampton in a few weeks wins them promotion, but it means Norwich finish top six. Oh, yes, definitely. I mean, I'm not i'm not that some that bothered about us finishing about time. I don't care about anything at this point.
01:10:36
Speaker
I think I would take that. I ah my i thought you were going to ask me a different hypothetical, which is we win on Saturday, but Ipswich still go up versus we lose on Saturday, Ipswich stay down. And I don't know which of those think. Because I think at this point, actually, I'm not that fussed about us going up. I don't even mind that much about Ipswich going up. But if you could give me one scenario that happens, I want to beat them on Saturday. That's that I think is what it comes down to. anything after that that happens, it's happened before. We've beaten them. They've gone up.
01:11:05
Speaker
I was fine with that. If that happens again, I really don't mind. um I can't remember what your question was. I would probably take us finishing in the playoffs and then going up, yeah, fine. But I didn't really mind what happens after that either. So, um yeah, that's a terrible answer to what is a very legitimate question.
01:11:22
Speaker
I'll start with you, Dan. ah What are you thinking for Saturday? um Get up. Feel nervous. um Have a shower. Probably have a second shower a little bit late, within and half an hour because of the sweating. ah Big breakfast.
01:11:39
Speaker
um Watch us take a one ni lead. ah Watch Mattson bang in a second. Ipswich pull one back, makes us knowr make us nervous. and Go for a third shower in the changing room, come back out. Fischer, who has started the game with us two one up with five minutes to go,
01:11:58
Speaker
does the right thing and um snaps Nunes gets sent off but fine and Ipswich pouring forward with an equaliser Vlad smashes the ball from his own goal line over the Ipswich keeper to make it 3-1 God that would be good and I've just put that into Skybet and that is 10-1 so I might put some really don't get the odds you used to do you Zoe what do you think I mean, all of that would be good. um
01:12:33
Speaker
It would be good. Yeah, I don't know. Like just winning. just like They're always horrible. Just winning however possible. But the the Fisher Nunes bit, I'll keep that bit in.
01:12:44
Speaker
Steve. And the win? Yeah, well, I said winning first. um Get up. Have a shot. No, I'm not going to do all that. yeah will also say, yes, 2-1. Norwich City.
01:12:58
Speaker
Nice. Nice. I am tempted to say draw. No one crucify me. that But you know what? Heart overhead. I'll go to one as well.
01:13:09
Speaker
I'll go to one. We weren't even going to crucify you to be fair. Just three really awful stares over Zencast and then Dan's balloons came up and I felt right again. And that leads us on to Kenny, other business. But once again, i will hand over this podcast to Zoe Morgan, who will talk us through some pretty big changes. And this is admin time, everybody. So you've got to listen carefully and follow my instructions. So as we have been discussing already today, there are a few changes afoot for our little podcast. um The ultras among you know that this podcast started life as the Michael Bailey podcast ah for The Athletic. um However, over the last couple of years, as Michael's become an Australian coach, and no longer follows Norwich City for his job, um us four have taken the reins somewhat. um So it's about time we severed ties and completely forgot about Michael Bailey um and that he had ever existed um and went out on our own.
01:14:06
Speaker
um I am, of course, joking about most of that. um But we are moving to a new feed, which means that we don't have to rely on someone in a completely different time zone to upload the podcast anymore.
01:14:20
Speaker
It will be exactly the same as you have heard today. um Be exactly ah exactly the same nonsense, um but it's just got a very startlingly similar, but yet different name, which is OTB, a Norwich City podcast. um And you need to resubscribe. So if you subscribe to us on the, on the ball podcast feed, you need to go away and do some searching and find the new feed. So you'll be able to hear the the sort of latest episodes.
01:14:51
Speaker
So this will be the last full episode on the previous feed, but we will also be putting it on the new feed. So bonus points for anyone that listens to it on the new feed instead of the old one. Um,
01:15:03
Speaker
And all future episodes will be found there. So all you need to do is search on your podcast player of choice for OTB, a Norwich City podcast.
01:15:13
Speaker
um You'll find us. You'll be able to subscribe. We will put all the new links on our Instagram feed, which has also had a slight makeover and a new change.
01:15:25
Speaker
You'll find us there at OTB underscore pod underscore NCFC um or just search OTB Norwich City podcast on Instagram. You'll find it. and So there's a bit of faff, but just a little bit to carry on having the same wonderful experiences you have already. um And it does help us realize our dreams of being sponsored by farming simulator one day. So we're just one to get closer. And one last thing, do like or rate the pod if and when you do subscribe because it will help the searching part of all of this happen more easily.
01:16:04
Speaker
That is all my admin. Have I missed anything? No, great job. Other than thank you to Lottie for the rebrand. Thank you very much. We love the facelift. We look better and younger than we've ever done.
01:16:17
Speaker
Oh, thank you, Lottie. Thank you very, very much. um Any more Kenny other business guys? I've just got one which is the football department shaker, but the football club. We knew that Lee Dunn was going to be promoted to assistant sporting director, but and there will be a new head of scouting appointed shortly. But the big one for me is Dr. Paul Ford, MBE is the new performance director, whatever that means. And he worked for the British Olympic Association for 15 years. And it's basically, long story short, his job to make sure nobody gets injured.
01:16:51
Speaker
everything Ever again. again. luck with that. which could potentially be the biggest signing Norwich City make for the next few months. So touch wood, everything goes well. Anything else, guys?
01:17:03
Speaker
Just one little thing. The number of Millwall fans on Twitter saying how weird Norwich fans are for singing Ipswich Town, they're coming for you. rather than Ipswich Town, we're coming for you, is absolutely gobsmacking. Literally sort of 20, 30 Millwall fans thought we were celebrating the fact Ipswich might overtake Millwall rather than the fact we're just playing them on Saturday and we're coming for them.
01:17:31
Speaker
I mean, that takes a staggering lack of just knowledge of anything, doesn't it? Top marks. You don't want to stereotype me, all fans, but good Lord. They've had a hard day, so I've got to feel them a bit. Can i also just add, and sorry to take it on a serious note, but best wishes to Liam Manning as well. I know we've... yes we've said some We've said some quite ah less than complimentary things about him on this podcast. we We may continue to say some less than complimentary things about the job that he's done, but I think it's important. As we often stress, it is just a game and I hope for his sake and his family's that he's...
01:18:13
Speaker
peace better and back managing again soon. Yeah, 100%. 100%. There are so many things that are bigger than football. ah But that's all for this week's OTBA Norwich City podcast. A huge thank you to Zoe Morgan.
01:18:28
Speaker
Thank you, Ryan. Dan Brigham. Thanks, Ryan. And Otpa. true Thanks, Ryan. God, as Otpa, I feel like I've reached new heights. And this podcast has gone. We're so much better than when were under the athletic. feel free from the shackles of tyranny now. I've just got an email from The Athletic. It says we're interested in collaboration. for God's sake. I'll edit it out. If you've enjoyed this episode, please leave a rating on your podcast player of choice for the new feed and follow us on Instagram. As Zoe said, we're on there now as at otb underscore pod underscore NCFC. Until the next one, never mind the danger.
01:19:32
Speaker
Did it not? No! Move your head for the start. Zoe just went... Just silence. ah ja have you Have you seen that clip of the... je