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Episode 8: Changing the Perception w/ Jacob Samland
46 Plays1 year ago
Welcome to Episode 8! This was a great conversation with Jacob Samland, whose official title at HFW is expeditor and shipping manager. In reality, Jacob is much more than that.
One of our newer guys in the shop, this was a terrific conversation in which we discuss how Jacob found his way into manufacturing, why the work we do is fulfilling and all the opportunity that a business like HFW can provide someone early in their career (or older too!).
This was a fantastic conversation, and we are lucky to have great people like Jacob on our team.
As always, thank you for listening! If you have any questions or feedback, email Jack at jdwatson@hfwindustries.com.
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Transcript
Introduction to Podcasting at HFW
00:00:00
Speaker
So the thing I found with podcasting at HFW is that for most people, it's, this is their first time. I mean, when we did our first podcast, that was my first podcast. And so you have to get people used to the idea of talking into a mic. It's really just a conversation. I think the best podcasts are it's a conversation and you just happen to have microphones there to recording. Yeah. So I think that's a lot of the.
Joe Rogan's Influence and Genuine Conversations
00:00:28
Speaker
That's interesting that Rogan just eases into it. I think people feel self-conscious. I don't know many people who like hearing themselves speak. No. It's almost like stage fright where you get nervous and you get clammy and you're worried about what are people going to think. I think that's a good way to go about it. That's the way I've been trying to think about this.
00:00:52
Speaker
Yeah. Where I'm not, like, I really don't want to put on a performance. I just want to be myself, be normal and just talk the way I normally do. Yeah. Like, you know, the way we talk every day, just normal conversation, right? I think you and I have some great conversations and I guess I'll give a little bit of just a brief intro. Sorry for everyone listening because I kind of just cut into the middle of the conversation.
00:01:13
Speaker
trying something new, I guess. So we got episode eight with Jacob Samland for the formal introduction, I guess.
Sharing Life Stories and Learning from Veterans
00:01:20
Speaker
And yeah, I think we're just having a conversation and that's really been the goal of the podcast is to get
00:01:30
Speaker
get people on a little bit longer format. A lot of people tell their stories. It's awesome. The best days for me are talking to people you don't talk to every day around here and you just hear something or they tell you a part of their story, their life story that you had never known before. You're like, wow, I never knew that. I don't know. There's a lot of those guys here and gals who are like,
00:01:59
Speaker
They have so much wisdom and experience. I think Fred Nedermeier is probably a good example, you know, where you're talking to him and he just knows things that he's just picked up over the years and I'm sitting there and I'm like, how the heck do you know all this stuff? And it's really, I mean, the honor is getting to sit here with those guys and talk to them and trying to pick up as much as you can, right?
00:02:22
Speaker
That's what I talk about all the time or I think about all the time is just trying to, I mean, you and I are both early on our careers. We've been here less than a year and just trying to learn from these veterans that they don't have much longer at HFW necessarily, but they've been
Colorful Tales from Veteran Employees
00:02:40
Speaker
around. They've seen everything inside and outside of work, you know, whether it's
00:02:44
Speaker
working on a part here on a machine or just, you know, fixing stuff at home or in life with relationships and stuff. You know, I know you, you and I were listening to Kevin's stories the other day. And, you know, Kevin's got some more colorful stories than a lot of people, I think. But growing up in the falls, that happens from time to time. But yeah, I don't know if I would always take his relationship advice, but I at least appreciate that he's giving me advice. He's got, he's got experience.
00:03:14
Speaker
The growth by hard knocks I guess yeah, you've got a lot of wisdom maybe not relational wisdom that I would use but general life with I Definitely actually taking a lot of the stuff. He said hard. Yeah, and I mean we have a lot of those guys here You mentioned Fred Fred it'd be funny to see if you can find something that that Fred couldn't find a way to fix And we had a lot of that. I mean when I was a kid we had a we had this toy wheelbarrow and
00:03:40
Speaker
It was, I don't think it was very expensive. Um, but the frame broke off of the actual like wheelbarrow. And so my dad brought it in and he had Vinnie who used to, it was a welder here for many years. Vinnie is like your classic Italian guy. You can hardly understand him because his accent is so thick. And, uh, he started, I heard a story or he might even told me, he started welding at like 12 years old in Italy. Um,
00:04:05
Speaker
And I've heard varying rumors of why he came to the United States, and we'll leave that there. So anyway, my dad would always bring in our broken toys and our broken kitchen utensils, and Vinnie would fix it for him. And it was always a source of pride for Vinnie and my dad. When things were bigger, my dad's like, I'll take it to work, Vinnie will fix it. And we have so many of those guys here. Yeah, they're everywhere. And like I said, it's kind of a
00:04:32
Speaker
It's an honor to be able to learn from them, especially someone like myself who doesn't have a ton of mechanical experience.
Blending Generations and Experiences
00:04:40
Speaker
I'm kind of in awe of, Ben Niedemeyer is another great example. Yeah, I wonder where he gets it from. Yeah, I know. Just the experience they have and being able to look at something and take all the prior knowledge and apply it to one problem that I'm stuck over. They just have an answer right away.
00:04:59
Speaker
You have to appreciate that and not take that for granted either because that didn't exist at HFW or in manufacturing in general. We'd really be in trouble. People always talk about the tribal knowledge and that's why I think it's so important.
00:05:18
Speaker
pushing hard and recruiting and to get people in the door like you like me and even devine in marketing you know he's really the first person in marketing but just to get to spend time around guys that have spent their whole careers in this he gets to learn the business and you and i are learning the business and then you know the younger we have so many younger guys and i think it's.
00:05:39
Speaker
It's important to stock up on them now while we still have some of these veteran guys on board. I was thinking about this last night. It's interesting that I had Rich on last time and you on this time, it's kind of like a juxtaposition. You're on opposite sides of the spectrum. It'll be interesting to see your perspective versus his perspective.
00:06:07
Speaker
I think the difference or the—it's helpful when you blend those two together. I think you get a really cool thing and I know you've spent a lot of time with Rich in a couple months here. Yeah, I really like Rich and I would never tell that—say that to his face. But he actually is an awesome guy and an excellent machinist. Not that I'm a really good judge of that but if other machinists say he's an excellent machinist then I'll believe them.
00:06:33
Speaker
But yeah, he's got a lot of wisdom and a lot of experience. Um, and also just a good guy to talk to, you know, uh, I really enjoy chatting with him and obviously we ran the Turkey trot, uh, last year, which was a lot of fun and.
00:06:47
Speaker
I think it is a cool juxtaposition. And I think if you're a young person and you're not trying to get to know the veterans and the seasoned guys that you have kind of in your spheres, then I think you're really missing out.
Blue-collar Work and Personal Growth
00:07:05
Speaker
And so, you know, I don't want to take the opportunity to have that for granted, you know? But yeah, Rich is a great dude.
00:07:15
Speaker
Yeah, I think there's just so many, I was telling someone this the other day, maybe it was Kevin, I don't know, can't remember, but it just, I just feel like in a blue collar industry like manufacturing, you just get just an amazing group of people because
00:07:37
Speaker
Obviously the working with your hands know how to fix anything, but just the down to earth attitude and people, you know, it's a no BS zone, I guess. And, and I dunno, it's just, it's just refreshing, especially with all the craziness on social media and in the world. Um, it's just the old school, um,
00:08:00
Speaker
world of, of, of manufacturing, you just get some really, really good people. And HFW is a great example, I think, and not just downstairs, upstairs too. You know, a lot of our engineers here, um, you know, I think when you picture an engineer, you picture this person and, uh, you know, a button down shirt and in a stuffy office and all of our engineers, I'm pretty sure have started in the shop or have a significant shop experience. And, um,
00:08:27
Speaker
and are in the shop every day. And I just think that that I don't know, it keeps you grounded. And it's, it's what our country relies on. So there's, there's a great book, and maybe you've read of it. I read it and then we were talking about books earlier called shop class as soul craft. And it's all about kind of the blue collar work ethic and what it does to you mentally and how it builds you and grows you and
00:08:57
Speaker
I think the author used to be working for this think tank, I think in Washington, and he quit to start his own motorcycle repair shop. I haven't read it. I'm going to read it now. I've heard of this though. So good. Yeah. And he opens up this motorcycle repair shop and he kind of writes a book about his experience and his disillusionment with think tanks and these kind of, you know,
00:09:22
Speaker
I'll say cognitive jobs, let's say, where you don't see anything tangible produced from your work. Yes. And I know we've talked about this before and maybe we're beating a dead horse but it's worth beating because it's true that there's something so good for your soul to see something tangible produced by your hands and something that you actually created.
Respect and Education in Trade Careers
00:09:43
Speaker
And there's this amazing feedback you get from that. And it also really grounds you because you're interacting with the physical world in a way that someone who is doing, you know, pushing ones and zeros on a computer screen all day or pushing paper around doesn't experience. And maybe it's, I think it's just not talked about that there is something so powerful about that. And it really does ground you.
00:10:09
Speaker
You're focused on the physical world in front of you in a way that's very tangible. And anyway, it's a great book. You should check it out.
00:10:16
Speaker
I absolutely will. I think you nailed it. I think it's, well, one, it's changing the perception of the trades and showing that it's, I don't know where the idea, and Rich and I were talking about this, the idea that if you go into the trades, you're an idiot came up or where, I don't, it was probably started by colleges or something to convince people that you need to go to school
00:10:42
Speaker
And nothing against school. You and I have both gone to school, and we support education. And obviously, that's one of the benefits here is the tuition assistance. But just this narrative that if you don't go, if you go into trades, it's kind of like a last resort. That's not true. And so I'm glad. I think things are starting to change now, especially when you look at things like the college debt problem. And to your point, the lack of fulfillment in a lot of these office jobs
00:11:12
Speaker
I just read this book, pardon my French, called Bullshit Jobs, and the exact premise was what you were just talking about, that there are so many jobs, well there are so many unnecessary jobs in the world, where you're literally doing nothing, you're literally
00:11:30
Speaker
Pushing paper around and if that job didn't exist, no one would be worse for the wear. The example was, I mean there were a couple examples of this in the book, throughout the book, of people who just didn't do anything in their job for six months. There was one case a guy didn't show up to his job for six years before anyone noticed.
00:11:50
Speaker
I mean, that's crazy. In the way, not only in manufacturing, but for a small business like us, that's impossible. Every single person has an enormous presence and importance in this business. We have one guy that goes out sick, right? One guy's out sick, can't come into work. His absence is felt. And so I think that
00:12:17
Speaker
Hopefully that gives people meaning and like what you do really matters and not just to the business, but to the world. So I know there's some people who maybe think that these jobs, um, where you don't do anything or like the dream, right? Like this is what you want to get someday where a job where you get paid to do nothing. Um, I really don't think that's true. I think there's like significant, um,
00:12:46
Speaker
benefit to actually producing something meaningful with your work and your time. And I think people were made to work. I really don't think we're not at our best when we're lounging on a beach our entire lives. Humans are made to be idle. Right.
00:13:01
Speaker
Two points to that I guess when I was talking to Pete Keebler yesterday and and he was on lost time He's like I hate when I don't have anything done bored and I've had the same exact experience and the book actually talks about this too where it said in the I think one of the chapters was titled this where the the author goes isn't that the dream if you're literally getting paid to do nothing and he's like why is it that people are
00:13:28
Speaker
gets so distraught by that, and he just brings up the emotional
The Role of Productivity and Uselessness
00:13:31
Speaker
distress. You feel useless. You feel like you're not contributing to society, and that's just a terrible feeling. Yeah, it's a horrible burden, right? The feeling of being useless.
00:13:41
Speaker
And you're spending all your time doing something you don't want to do. And it just becomes an endless cycle, you know? Yeah. I don't think we were made for endless leisure. No, no. I'm sure vacation is nice. It is. But I don't want vacation for the rest of my life. Well, they talk about that. Like I know like people that retire. That's maybe that's why my grandfather has resisted retirement. I think it is actually because he's talked to people who
00:14:10
Speaker
They don't know what to do. After the first month, it's like, okay, and what next? You have to find ways to keep yourself busy because it's boring. You can only play so many rounds of golf and collect so many seashells on the seashore before you start wondering what you're doing with your life. Golf's an expensive habit too. I'm learning that. I don't really like that part of it.
00:14:30
Speaker
Yeah, someone said that, um, it's kind of like the key to business deals though, are all on the golf course. I've heard that. I don't know if it's true or not, but I think there's, there's an, there's an element of that. That's true. Uh, there's I've heard of people.
00:14:44
Speaker
In business school, I heard
Golf and Business Networking
00:14:45
Speaker
of people who, um, basically get paid to negotiate deals on the golf course. Actually, I think I met someone one time that did that. I texted my grandfather. I was like, Hey, I'm signing up for this job. And he's like, go for it. But that's his job. Yeah. Well, these people, they, I'm assuming you're good at golf too. You negotiate on the course. So there is some of that, but I think that's kind of.
00:15:10
Speaker
Oh, that's changing too, you know, with, uh, cause there's also an element of that. That's like the old boys club, but yeah, yeah. Cultural changes are probably healthy in that department. You know, I like golf. Um,
00:15:23
Speaker
But usually, my friends and I aren't exactly negotiating business deals when we're on the golf course. I'll tell you that. Yeah, and maybe just for fun. That seems like a good thing to do, right? Yeah. I think we have a great conversation so far, but let's talk about some of the stuff that we've got here. We don't have to talk about all of it.
00:15:43
Speaker
So we've touched on it a little bit, but you've got a little bit different of a background than a lot of people here.
Journey from Psychology to Manufacturing
00:15:51
Speaker
Um, a lot of people have either grown up in the business or have grown up around manufacturing or went to trade school and got into, you got into this world. Um, you didn't do any of that really. Right. You, you went to, you, you're still, you're finishing up your degree in psychology. That's correct. Yeah.
00:16:09
Speaker
So I mean, can you explain, I'd be interested to hear your journey and what made you think about manufacturing or be intrigued by the idea of manufacturing and what, how'd you walk in here? Yeah, it's a good question.
00:16:25
Speaker
Yeah, the first job I ever had was I worked at a greenhouse, this plant market. And I think I started when I was 16 and it was all manual labor. You're driving a forklift around, you're unloading and unloading dirt. And so it was in a greenhouse. So it was 120 degrees in the summer and you'd work 60 plus hour weeks. And I did that for,
00:16:56
Speaker
probably around three years at least, and I loved it. And so I did get some hands-on labor work, but it was certainly no skilled trade experience there at all. And so I kind of floated around jobs when I was in school. I mean, you'd be for psychology right now.
00:17:18
Speaker
I did an internship at M&T Bank doing some data work for them. They had a financial crimes internship. That was a really cool opportunity and I learned a lot. I got really good at Excel that summer. Most recently, I was working a retail job here in Buffalo.
00:17:42
Speaker
I worked there for about a year and I kind of realized that this is not for me.
00:17:49
Speaker
Wait, I know where you were at, actually. Yeah. Oh, yeah. And I just, yeah, it's a funny story. Yeah, I could, I know one of the guys I worked there. I heard some stories as well. Yeah, it kind of became just an unhealthy place to work. And there's a lot of drama going on. And I realized it doesn't make any sense for it to be here. Like, this isn't my career someday. So I don't have to deal with this. Yeah, it's not worth it.
00:18:14
Speaker
And so, I started looking around and kind of the key in all of this is Mike Okea because he's a really good family friend and him and my dad get coffee together all the time and we used to go to church together actually, Mike and I.
00:18:31
Speaker
And so, I was telling my dad about my woes at this retail job and how I didn't want to be there. And he said, you know, you should talk to Mike. Talk to Mike. Mike, he might have something for you. And my younger brother actually toured here. Mike showed him around probably years ago and he didn't like it. He didn't want to do it. And so I had that.
00:18:57
Speaker
There's my contacts and I was like maybe and I put it off for a while and then I was complaining to my dad again and he said maybe she talked to Mike and so I sent Mike a text and.
00:19:07
Speaker
He set up a time to come here, and he showed me around a little bit. And I had no idea what I was gonna do here, because I was considering, well, maybe I have zero experience in any of this. I'm not a machinist, I'm not a welder, I can't do any of it. So I said, well, maybe I would just start from scratch. I'm open to learning how to do basically anything. And so I kind of told that to Mike when I was here.
00:19:37
Speaker
I don't really know where I fit in, but I'm more than interested to see where I could fit in. And so we talked some more, and then you called me shortly thereafter. I remember that. Which was really funny. Kind of a cold call. Yeah. You'd never met me, didn't know who I was, but Mike said, just call this guy. Is that how that went? Did he just say, hey, just call this kid? That's literally exactly how it went. And I mean, yeah, like you said, Mike deserves
00:20:06
Speaker
pretty much all of the credit here because he saw it right away and you and whereas I think I was actually visiting a school or something that day and he left me a message or an email or something and he's like hey give this give this kid a call I think it'll be worth your time and that's where that's where it started from our end so yeah so you gave me a call and then you gave me a tour around the place and we talked and
00:20:32
Speaker
And I was thinking about this prior to actually having the podcast. I think to your credit and to HFW's credit, you know, a lot of jobs and job postings, like there wasn't an official job posting for some guy who doesn't know what he wants to do, right? So I came in kind of a really a wild card.
00:20:54
Speaker
And you could have said, well, you don't really fit into a machinist welder. Sorry, we don't have anything for you, right? That's fairly standard. But instead, you said, well, we're going to create this position that we think would be a good fit that could be really helpful to the company.
Cultural Fit and Training at HFW
00:21:10
Speaker
So expediting, right? And I didn't really know what that meant practically speaking.
00:21:15
Speaker
But I'm still open to try it. I think HFW and you and Mike and Pete deserve a lot of credit for trying to fit me into a role that would make sense, that would be a good fit even if that role didn't exist prior.
00:21:31
Speaker
Am I correct that I'm the first person you technically hired or were in the process of hiring or then created a position for because that would have been kind of you're taking a pretty big risk in that case because you didn't know who I was. I mean this position was new you basically just had Mike's word and you know the tour in my interview to go off of that's kind of a big risk there.
00:21:56
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I hired you and Jawaani on the same day, but Jawaani's was more informal because I mean, and a credit to him, he's, you know, one of the hardest working dudes you'll find. Yeah. I mean, he literally walked in the door here and fill out an application, was looking for anything. And, um, uh,
00:22:15
Speaker
I remember making the calls on the same day and actually he's similar too because his background was working for FedEx and he's a young guy too. What we looked at with both of those and other hires too and hires we're trying to make is what I was always coached in was hiring for culture, training for skill. If you can find the right people,
00:22:40
Speaker
They may not have the skill you need right now, but if they're the right person culturally, you can get them there. And I think that's what HFW has done all along. I think right now we've got a really great group of, like a core group of people here that are good cultural fits because HFW doesn't work for everyone. You know, like it's, some people don't like the shop environment or, um, like you said, your brother, like manufacturing just there, or at least our type of manufacturing wasn't for him. And that's okay. We're not trying to be everything for everyone.
00:23:10
Speaker
But talking with Mike, we had just, him and I, I think, just saw in you just have a really great person. I think you're just a born leader, honestly. And you've proven us right, so thank you. But I think that we felt comfortable taking that risk. And we want to take that risk more with other people, too. Like, we have Jawani and a bunch of others.
00:23:39
Speaker
go down the list of people we've done that with. Those have turned out to be, like I'm thinking to the older guys that we've taken that risk on, they've turned out to be some of our best people. I think sometimes you take that little bit of risk and it's not like it's a huge risk from our side. You come in and
00:24:00
Speaker
And I just, I, and I've really been knocking on the table and trying to really push that. I don't think knocking on the table is the right saying, but whatever. Um, we'll go with it. I'm bad about those, but, uh, pounding on the table. I don't know. Anyway, you get the point. Um, we just, I really feel that like.
00:24:21
Speaker
If you can get the right people in here, we'll find a way and we'll get people to a level where they'll need to be, especially as we've got, you know, we've had a little bit of, uh, of, we've seen this, this talent shift as we, a bunch of our people have retired. Uh, we just had Lynn last week after 28 years, we had Joe Federio after 43 years. And that's whatever 28 plus 43 is can't do that in my head right now, but you know, 60, 70 some years.
00:24:50
Speaker
experience right there just walks out the door and within a couple months of each other and obviously different positions different skills and whatever but
00:24:59
Speaker
So it takes time to build that.
Storytelling and Legacy in Manufacturing
00:25:01
Speaker
And I think if you can get good people in here, um, that you, in, in, like you said, you've been exposed to rich and Fred and all these guys. And now in Lynn, and, uh, now you can, you've got the right mindset where you take the good stuff and you take the stuff that they do really well and you learn from it. And then you say, well, okay, how can I adapt that to what I've learned in my experience? And.
00:25:26
Speaker
I think that's the type of stuff we looked for, so I think you've been a good fit so far on that. Well, thank you for your kind words there.
00:25:38
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's kind of where I've gotten lucky is because of people with experience here who have been able to help teach me and explain what it is we do here. And to be perfectly honest, I didn't even really think of the world of manufacturing prior to starting here.
00:25:59
Speaker
That wasn't something that was on my radar of either careers or even really industries. Most people don't think about manufacturing because they don't need to. Maybe that's just the consumer world we live in.
00:26:19
Speaker
You know, I don't look at things and well, I do now, but I didn't used to look at things and think about how it was made, right? It's just there and that's all I ever really need to know. But I think HFW has given me a cool perspective, a new perspective of just realizing that there's craftsmanship and everything and starting to appreciate that a little bit more, you know.
00:26:43
Speaker
Well, I think also manufacturing is hidden too. You go to the store and you buy food or you buy a toy or a car or whatever. I can't tell you the number of people that have lived in this neighborhood. We're in the Riverside neighborhood in Buffalo.
00:27:00
Speaker
They have lived in this neighborhood and they're like, I had no idea you guys were there. And they live right around here. They've grown up around here. So it's kind of like this hidden world. And so that's why we, you know, we brought Devon in and we're trying to get the word out and be more, um, in the community, uh, because we have to tell our story because the story, it wasn't that someone else was telling the story for us. There was no storytelling.
00:27:25
Speaker
And it's not just us, it's manufacturing and I think the trades and heavy industry as a whole. That story wasn't getting told because previously I think there was a lot of concern about liability and
00:27:41
Speaker
saying too much, which we still have to be very careful about. It's tough to market stuff when we have trade agreements and proprietary information. We have to really limit what we share, which is tough because we do some really cool stuff. But we can still tell the story and do it in a way that conveys how cool it is, the stuff we do.
00:28:06
Speaker
I think our generation is a little bit better at that than the previous generation was, and it's because we have to be. If people don't know about this company, if our generation doesn't know about this company, we're not going to survive because we need to replace so many people who are retiring, who have earned their retirement, and now their spots need to be filled.
Modernizing the Manufacturing Narrative
00:28:32
Speaker
I think someone like you is such a great person for us because, well, great testimony in the first place. But also, whereas a lot of, right now, I think a lot of our veteran machinists, they probably know a lot of machinists, which is great, and we've always used that. But now,
00:28:53
Speaker
Our generation there aren't as many people in the trades It's you know, you don't have that that network as much and so we need to build it again And I think you know, so someone who's new to it and can hopefully spread the good word about it That's what we need more of yeah, and I think it's um It was a shock to me how much I think money you could make in manufacturing but also I
00:29:18
Speaker
that manufacturing has this reputation of being like a really dirty business. People get injured all the time. It's unsafe. You get paid peanuts.
00:29:35
Speaker
It's kind of your last resort, right? It's like people say this about the military too. They say things like, well, you know, I couldn't hack it at college, so I went into the military. And like, maybe that's true for some people, but not for the people who are really good at their jobs in the military, right? It's like anything. Yeah, exactly. There's always going to be people in a career or a field where
00:30:01
Speaker
They're kind of the bottom 10%. That always exists. And so you shouldn't use that to generalize to the entire population. But I just didn't know that about manufacturing, that you could have a really solid career, you could make really good money, and you could be fulfilled producing something tangible. Again, to go back to our previous conversation, I didn't realize that was such a viable option. It just never crossed my mind.
00:30:30
Speaker
Yeah. So much of people's preconceived notion, I think, goes back to the fact that as an industry, manufacturing hasn't effectively told its story. Everyone assumes it's the same thing in construction and mining. When you think of a miner, because mining companies haven't told their story in so many years, when you say mining, people think of an underground coal mine in the early 1900s,
00:30:54
Speaker
It is what i thought of you covered in soot i mean it's very similar to machining and what we do if you imagine a dark dingy factory and fire everywhere and yeah hands and arms falling off and i know that's true anymore but the fact is the story hasn't been retold because people,
00:31:14
Speaker
People saw that so the manufacturers and and heavy industry i feel like kind of kind of retreated and they're like we don't want anyone else to know you can't take any pictures cuz you can't see well now it's all changed it's brightly lit injuries are very rare severe injuries are almost non existent.
00:31:32
Speaker
Um, and, uh, you know, it's, but that story hasn't gotten told. And so, um, I, it's an exciting opportunity for someone in our positions where we're younger in our careers, because you said that, you know, that there's so many different opportunities. You can make good money, but now it's, it's telling the story so that there's other people can see what's there. I mean, yeah, that you touched on the money thing.
00:31:57
Speaker
I mean, this is the American dream in a lot of ways and not just our company, although we worked very hard at it, but you can come here.
Manufacturing and the American Dream
00:32:06
Speaker
We had people that would come here with little more than a high school degree, sometimes not even a high school degree, or they had gotten their GED or something, and they'd go on and make really good money. People are making upper five figures, six figures even, with little more than high school education.
00:32:26
Speaker
That kind of trajectory, there's the narrative that that kind of trajectory is dead in America, that progression in the American dream. In a lot of cases it is, but in manufacturing industries like ours, it's still very much a very feasible thing that you can easily do with hard work and time.
00:32:47
Speaker
I think maybe another underrated aspect of manufacturing is the stability and security yeah right and you're talking about opportunities. You know a lot of people wanna work for really sexy companies doing tech jobs and.
00:33:04
Speaker
I mean you're looking right now at all these layoffs and. You're not gonna see huge machinist layoffs because they're so high in demand we can't possibly get enough of them yeah and. May not you know on the surface seem as sexy as.
00:33:23
Speaker
doing a nothing job for Google, right? But actually, it's incredibly rewarding, not that I'm a machinist. But working in manufacturing, there's so much opportunity here for someone who's hungry and humble and willing to go through the training process if they don't have any experience in manufacturing. And they're willing to learn. And I think there's the world is your oyster at that point. Absolutely. I think that's
00:33:52
Speaker
such a huge part of it and that's why we're trying some of these new things like the podcast, like the marketing, just getting that story out. I told Devon, our marketing guy from the very first day, part of your job is marketing customers, traditional marketing, but part of your job is marketing to potential employees as well because we need to tell that story.
00:34:20
Speaker
I just think that that is such a critical part to growing the business and we're very committed to doing that. I mean, the first thing I did when I heard about HFW was go to your website, right? And maybe that's a generational thing and for better or my grandfather does that too. So yeah. And maybe it's the world we live in, which is very like media heavy. Yeah. But I went to check out the website, you know, and this was prior to, I think you working on it and Devon working on it and getting it kind of
Digital Presence in Manufacturing
00:34:50
Speaker
revamped.
00:34:50
Speaker
We have a new site coming soon. Yes. Yes. Which is a good thing. Yeah. And, you know, that's what that's the world we live in, where your online presence, and this is why Devon's work is actually so important. Your online presence is huge. Yeah. And it may not seem like anything to a lot of the old school veterans who are, you know, doing the work, but
00:35:17
Speaker
when you're looking at the future you're looking at getting new employees and getting younger guys in the shop to train. How you present yourself to the rest of the world digitally really doesn't matter you know absolutely yeah and i think so small business like ours we don't have the name brand of the tech companies are even the bigger manufacturers but,
00:35:43
Speaker
This is a sweeping generalization, but those big companies, like you just said, they had 10,000 people laid off, 20,000 people laid off. That just reduces people in numbers. That sucks. That's the exact opposite of what we do here. Again, we work very hard to do that, but I don't think we're necessarily special. I think there's a lot of great companies like that. That's why I'm just a big advocate of
00:36:10
Speaker
of small business and giving the company you've never heard of before an opportunity because there's so many companies like that in America and they'll blow you away with what they have to offer. All right. So we've gone through a lot of this stuff more or less. I think it's kind of taken a winding path. I don't mind it though. I think it's good. Yeah, no, this has been great. I'm curious though, what is something that most people at HFW wouldn't know about you?
Homeschooling and Self-directed Learning
00:36:37
Speaker
So I was, full disclosure, I was given prompts for these questions prior to the podcast. Hopefully there's no trade secrets there. But I think one thing that people might not know is that I was actually homeschooled until college. So from birth until high school graduation, I was homeschooled. Wow, that's crazy. I think you did tell me that. Possibly.
00:37:05
Speaker
Yeah, so my dad's a high school science teacher. Um, he teaches at Wilson schools. And, uh, I think my mom has her early childhood education degree. I think that's what it is. I can't remember which one. And, uh, so, uh, I have four siblings and there's five kids total, all of whom have been homeschooled or are currently being homeschooled. Oh my gosh.
00:37:29
Speaker
And so, yeah, I think it's always a fun little fact that they're out there. The response I get is a lot is, well, you're not, I wouldn't have guessed that you were homeschooled, but I always think it's a hilarious response. You're normal. Wow, you can talk to people. That's crazy. Yeah, so that's kind of funny.
00:37:51
Speaker
That's interesting that your dad's a high school teacher and chose to homeschool you. It is. I'm not sure I 100% fully understand his thought process behind that. I think part of it was he thought him and my mom could do a better job or at least. They've got the background, I guess.
00:38:14
Speaker
Yeah, and I think there's a lot of freedom. I know homeschooling got super popular during COVID. Well, you had to. You had to homeschool your kids. Yeah, that's a little bit different. I mean, my parents are homeschooling 20 years before COVID. Before it was sexy. Yeah, exactly. So I just think they thought they could do a better job than the public school system.
00:38:36
Speaker
I personally loved it I know homeschooling is not for everyone and it really matters who your parents are too but I had so much freedom growing up that other kids did not in school so. You're given a lot of autonomy sort of you're given a lot of structure which I think is important it depends again how you do homeschooling.
00:38:57
Speaker
My my parents were very structured. It wasn't you could sleep until 10 and then do school in your pajamas all day You know, it was you're starting school at 7 a.m You're gonna be fully dressed at the kitchen table doing your math homework. Like that's that's that was kind of the structure I had which I think helped a lot
00:39:13
Speaker
But also, I love to read growing up. So if I could crank out all my work for the day by one o'clock or by noon if I was really diligent, I'd have the rest of the day to go outside and hang out with my friends or read books. And I loved that.
00:39:30
Speaker
I have friends who are still stuck in school till four o'clock and then have two hours of homework and that just sucked. I don't think homeschooling is for everyone but I loved it and so I was given a lot of freedom to explore hobbies, interests I had, do so much reading. I loved the freedom of that and I think my parents did a really good job with that.
00:39:57
Speaker
That's really cool. So I guess follow up question then, what was it like for you going to college? Was that like, I feel like college is somewhat similar to homeschooling in a way that it's a lot more, um, it's a lot more unstructured. Like you go to class, but then you do whatever you want with your time. Like, how was that experience?
00:40:16
Speaker
So I think you would assume it'd be a huge like culture shock, but it wasn't at all. In fact, it was really easy. And I think the reason is because.
00:40:29
Speaker
As I got when I was, I don't know, 16, 17, there were there were several subjects that I was more or less teaching myself. So certain math levels or science levels would my mom would be like, all right, I'm going to just delegate this to dad to teach you, you know, bio or chemistry or something like that. Yeah. And so I'd have, you know, a textbook and I'd have like the
00:40:55
Speaker
problem sets or whatever and I'd work through it on my own and then dad would come home from work and we'd go over kind of what I did. And so it was very self-directed.
00:41:03
Speaker
That's what college is. There's no one over your shoulder forcing you to do assignments to go to class, which is why so many kids out of public school go to college. And then they end up either really struggling because there's no parent or teacher telling them what to do. It's not self directed at all in high school. And so I already had that experience of having to teach myself things and, um,
00:41:31
Speaker
the transition was actually really easy and I'm very thankful for my parents giving me the training to learn how to take information.
00:41:43
Speaker
You know, into my brain myself and the freedom to mess up and figure all that out. Um, it really made it painless, which was kind of counterintuitive, you know? Well, I think that they always talk about, you know, being a helicopter parent kind of backfires when your kid goes to college, because then they're, it's like their mind explodes because there's so much autonomy. They don't even know what to do with themselves.
00:42:07
Speaker
And I feel like your parents kind of primed you pretty well for not just college, but I guess the real world. Um, you, you always kind of had a little bit of that autonomy and figuring out how to get stuff done in a way that was productive and that, um, gave you time to do what you wanted, but also you weren't slacking off. So I feel like it's kind of, it was a good balance. Yeah. And I think the other big thing people talk about is, you know, socialization, you know, people are like, what about prom or what about friends? And, um,
00:42:35
Speaker
My parents did a fantastic job with that. I played on sports, I played baseball most of my life. I went to summer camp, I worked at summer camp, I had jobs. It wasn't like I was in a bunker in the backyard my whole life, just me and the cows.
00:42:53
Speaker
But again, everyone does it differently to varying degrees of success, but I will say I was super blessed by how my parents did that and it worked out really well. Yeah. Well, it seems like it, so. All right. Well, I guess last question.
00:43:09
Speaker
gone a little bit longer, but I think this is great. It's been a great conversation. Um, and this actually, I thought of this one yesterday. I'm pretty, pretty proud of this one. Let me tell you. Uh, but can you give a shout out to someone at HFW that you think is doing great work and deserves recognition?
00:43:27
Speaker
This is a really good question, and I was talking to my wife yesterday about this question, and I was just rattling off all the people I thought deserved recognition, right? And at some point I hit like 10 people, and my wife goes, you can't say 10 people, because then you're just diluting the water, right? If you say everyone's great, then you start to wonder who are you not saying, right? And who's not doing a good job?
00:43:56
Speaker
If I had to pick one person, I think Zelko, deserves recognition. He does a freaking fantastic job. That guy is a worker, right? I come in relatively early in the morning. I'm here 10, 15 minutes early. He's always here before me. Every single time, I have never beaten Zelko to work in the morning.
00:44:21
Speaker
Also, we play chess every day for lunch, so I have a soft spot for that. But he's got a good attitude. You can hear his laugh from across the shop because it's so distinct. See, I think that guy is awesome. And he's another one of those guys that has so much experience and just a cool backstory, too. I don't know if you'll ever be able to have him on the podcast. That'd be really interesting to try. But man, like.
00:44:47
Speaker
Every time I hear more about his background, it's mind-blowing that he's even here. So I think he deserves a lot of credit.
00:44:55
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, he's a great pick. Just a very hard worker. Actually, you were there for this. One of the coolest things that I've experienced, and it actually involves ZELCO, was when Jacob and I went to a job fair, trying to find more people to add to the team. And some guy walks up,
00:45:19
Speaker
It turns out it's ZELCO son. He's like, I'm ZELCO son or my dad works for you. I'm ZELCO son. Surgeon, I think the name was. Yeah. Yeah. And, uh, it was just, it was, it was such a cool thing to happen. And, um, you just to see, I mean, not just the next generation, but also, um, we could just express how much ZELCO means to the company and, uh, how much his work is valued and, um,
00:45:46
Speaker
He's just one of those old school machinists and, uh, does great work. Like you mentioned, hard worker, um, and doesn't, you know, you barely hear a peep from, well, except when he's talking, everyone always thinks he's mad. He's just talking, but because he's, he has a very loud, his voice carries. It's a very distinct voice too. So I'm sure that adds to it. Yeah. And he's just, you know, one of those, those guys that.
00:46:12
Speaker
That generation of people, I hope that we can replicate it, but I don't know. Lord knows how long he's been running a machine and just the knowledge and the skill that he has. And I always think it's cool. You mentioned you played chess with him. I always think it's cool just seeing how multifaceted our guys are. And Zalko's a good example.
00:46:34
Speaker
Joe Fadario who had retired right before you started, he was big into cooking and he'd always show me pictures of pizzas. I think everyone has a story about Joe's pizzas. Classic Italian move right there. I like it. Guys have car collections and they fix up things and I just love seeing people's
00:46:58
Speaker
you know, when you come to work, you see everyone in the in their role, like as a machinist or an engineer or an accountant. And so seeing people's passions and what they do outside of work and the things that they're really, they're really excited about is really cool. I agree. There's so many guys at HFW who love to cook.
00:47:19
Speaker
And I'm realizing that there's so many, they're like just make amazing food. And they'll bring it in most days, which is awesome because you get to try this awesome food. But yeah, I think it does a disservice to manufacturing to think of it as anything less than this like rewarding career with people who are smart and talented and multifaceted and cultured in so many ways you wouldn't realize, right?
00:47:48
Speaker
uh i used to think you know like manufacturing welder or something um you have this picture in your head like the coal miners right yeah you know no one thinks of a coal miner and thinks they can cook or play chess but like but the can the can a lot of them do and so it's just this this weird dynamic here breaking down these
00:48:13
Speaker
Misconceptions changing the perception. Yeah, it was so we keep talking about I feel like we keep coming back to it Yeah, that might be the theme right that is podcast. Yeah, that's right. All right there. There you go I haven't if I haven't titled another one after I go back make sure I haven't title but I yeah, I totally agree I think you're
00:48:29
Speaker
Hit the nail on the head with that one. That's good. Well, Jacob, this has been an awesome conversation. Hopefully people are still awake at this point in the podcast if they listen through this far. We appreciate that. Anything else you'd like to add before we close it up today? No, just that this has been a lot of fun and I appreciate you having me on. I think it's funny you had me after Rich Hender. I think that's awesome. But this has been good and I really appreciate it.
00:48:55
Speaker
Well, we appreciate you having on. It's funny because I feel like all the podcasts are starting to go together now because Mike Okea is next. And the reason he's next is because he actually said he'd be excited to come on, which is not the reaction I normally get. So I'm very appreciative to him. So he's next. That's awesome. That'll be great. Yeah. So this is a great episode. We got another great episode coming up. But in the meantime, thanks for listening and we will see you on the next one. Thanks.