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Nos Audietis, Episode 285: All good things
63 Plays7 years ago
The Seattle Sounders made a nice bit of history, but that didn’t stop this week from feeling a bit like a bummer. The loss to the Philadelphia Union took us by surprise, and not just because of how it went down.
In the end, though, the Sounders are coming off a 10-game stretch in which they’ve claimed 27 of 30 possible points and a 13-game run in which they amassed 32 of 39 potential points. Consider that they started this run 11 points out of a playoff spot and tied for the second fewest points in the league. That first-round bye looks a little less likely today than it did before, but a home playoff game is still very much within reach.
This week's music: Stadtler & Waldorf, "RVIVR - "Ocean Song", Perry Como - "Seattle", RVIVR - “The Tide”, Woody Guthrie - "Roll On Columbia"
Thanks to James Woollard, Sounders Public Address Announcer, for doing our sponsor reads. You can follow him on Twitter at @BritVoxUS - if you're looking for a British Voice to advertise your business or non-profit, please reach out to him.
Want to hear the music from the show in their glorious, full versions? Check out the Nos Audietis playlist on Spotify!
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Transcript
Introduction and '36 Bottles of Wine' Release
00:00:00
Speaker
This episode of No Sadietes is sponsored by Fullpool Wines, a Seattle-based wine seller who recently released their first book, 36 Bottles of Wine. To eat those of the book, a highly curated look at wine categories that provide exceptional value right now should be familiar to Fullpool readers. But there's loads of fresh content, and since it's not trying to sell any wine through the book, there's a bit more of a sass factor.
00:00:20
Speaker
And there's food! Lots of it! Fullpool's unique writing styles apply to recipes like Leftover Thanksgiving, Turkey, Smaltz of All Soup, and pregnancy nachos. This book can be purchased through Sasquatch Books.
00:00:38
Speaker
That was wonderful! Bravo! I loved it! Oh, it was great! Well, it was pretty good. Well, it wasn't bad. Well, there were parts of it that weren't very good though. It could have been a lot better. I didn't really like it. It was pretty terrible. It was bad! It was awful! I was terrible! Get him away! Hey, boo! Boo!
00:01:03
Speaker
The bluest skies you've ever seen are in Seattle And the hills the greenest green in Seattle
00:01:16
Speaker
like a beautiful child growing up.
Podcast Introduction and Team Lineup
00:01:20
Speaker
Welcome back to another edition of Noce Adietta, sponsored by Fullpool Wines, Queen Anne Acupuncture, and our broadcast partner Bootstrapper Studios. This is episode 285 and recorded on Thursday, September 20th, 2018. I'm your host, Jeremiah O'Shan, and I'm joined as always by my co-host today and our engineer, Lickett. Aaron was not able to join us this week.
Sounders' Recent Matches Recap
00:01:43
Speaker
Anyway, the Sounders made history over the weekend, but unfortunately couldn't follow it up with making it a nice and round number 10 on Wednesday. As much as the 1-0 loss to the Fiddle of a Union stung, it should be said that the win over the Vancouver White Cops was arguably the more important one. Not only did it secure the Cascadia Cup for the first time since 2015, it also gave the Sounders some much needed breathing room in the playoff chase as even after Wednesday's loss,
00:02:09
Speaker
They still have a four point cushion and are still within three points of fourth with a game in hand. That said, the loss of the Union definitely hurts and not just because it came on a 93rd minute gap that led to the game's only goal. The Sounders were downright dominant for large portions of this match, playing some of their best soccer of the year in the first 15 to 20 minutes and then pouring on the pressure over the final 15 to 20 minutes.
00:02:30
Speaker
In fact, the only shot the Union took from the 59th minute onward was Fafa Pico's goal, as they seemed very content with the tie. Still, the Sounders have only themselves a blame. They hit the post twice and weren't nearly as effective as they needed to be around the goal and missed several good scoring chances. If the Sounders are leading, Stephen Fry doesn't even attempt to make that pass he did, as he could have simply booted the ball out of bounds.
Sounders' Playoff Position and Upcoming Games
00:02:55
Speaker
In the end, though, the Sounders are coming off a 10-game stretch in which they've claimed 27 of 30 possible points in the 13-game run in which they amassed 32 of 39 potential points. Consider that they started this run 11 points out of a playoff spot and tied for the fewest points in the league. That's a pretty impressive turnaround.
00:03:15
Speaker
That first round buy looks a little less likely today than it did before, but a home playoff game is still very much within reach. With all that said, Lickit, what would you say the mood is right
Fan Reactions and Playoff Odds
00:03:27
Speaker
now? I feel like there was an emotional letdown for sure. But I don't know, what's your sense of the mood out there among Sounders fans?
00:03:39
Speaker
I'm guessing the most people would be saying, you know, I don't think this wind streak, this unbeaten streak would have gone on forever. And at some point it would have come to an end. It's just, I don't think anyone pictured it coming to quite the same kind of end. Yeah. Because I heard in the stands as we were leaving, someone just said like, that was gross on so many levels. Yeah, it was. I have to say I came into this game feeling pretty confident, but I think probably a lot of people
00:04:09
Speaker
Uh, I don't know. There's a lot of, on a lot of levels, this was very unexpected. I don't know for certain that this stat holds up in the way that it went down, but back in, uh, in July, when the streak was just getting started, uh, the Fox showed a graphic that showed that the sounders had, uh, or no, that only two of 37 teams that had traveled coast to coast on short rest.
00:04:39
Speaker
They actually, at the time, they said it played a weekend after a midweek game. But I assume that it was for any kind of short rest. Only two of 37 had managed to win their game. And the fact that two teams won in that situation last night is pretty crazy, especially when you consider that the Union were one of those teams who, granted, they were the last playoff team the centers were going to face before the playoffs potentially.
00:05:05
Speaker
Uh, but they, I don't think a lot of people saw them coming into this game, especially with the focus being everywhere else that it probably is. I don't think a lot of people saw this one coming.
Philadelphia Union Match Analysis
00:05:16
Speaker
And then of course there was the game in San Jose where Atlanta came back from essentially four one down to win four to three. Uh, that was a pretty wild game as well.
00:05:26
Speaker
But man, it just felt like early on, the first 15 minutes, the Sounders put on so much pressure. They hit the boast twice in that first 15 minutes. They had a few other chances to score. I started to get kind of a bad feeling, like maybe this isn't the day, because those were the kind of situations that had been going the Sounders way during this whole break, this whole streak.
00:05:48
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, we came out looking good. And then I was I was watching it. And I just was like, I don't what is this? What is it? What is Philadelphia playing? Like, they're kind of pressuring, but they're not. They're
00:06:02
Speaker
kind of just content to sit in these rows, you know, really compact, but let us get behind. And it's just, it was a really weird style. I'm like, this is not, something's not right. Something didn't feel right about this. Yes, I totally agree. Like in those first 15 minutes, I thought also the same thing, that this was a very strange defense that they were playing because they were playing in three banks of, you know, three banks, essentially, which is not so weird, but they were so compressed right around the midfield area.
00:06:29
Speaker
that it was allowing the sounders all this space in behind, especially on the wings. And the sounders just kept, I mean, Gustav Svensson just kept picking out passes over the top. And then I think what really turned the game around was that injury to
Injury Impact Discussion
00:06:45
Speaker
Chad Marshall. And it wasn't so much the injury to Chad Marshall that caused the problem. And then shortly thereafter, Raul Rui Diaz. But the sounders had to play about 10 minutes essentially down a man because the two injuries kind of came
00:06:57
Speaker
right back after another. They were both off the field for a little while before they were subbed out. I guess Marshall actually finished the half, but
00:07:07
Speaker
It just felt like all the air got taken out of the game during those 10 minutes. And then the Sounders really struggled to recover. Now, I think they kind of found themselves in the second half. They were, like I said, the much better team for the second part of the second half. But it did feel like the momentum just got sucked right out of that thing, right out of the game after Chad Marshall got hit in the head by Cory Burke.
00:07:29
Speaker
Yeah, and then just there was so many stoppages around there. Even watching the game, it was just kind of lost focus, kind of wandered and drifted for a while. And yeah, the end of the half was just weird. And then halftime was like,
00:07:45
Speaker
This doesn't feel right. Something's not right here. Yeah. I don't know exactly what it was, but it did. It did feel like kind of a strange night. There was a strange kind of energy, I felt like, in the air. Not to get too, not to get too weird on you, but it did. I don't know. Something seemed off yesterday. All that said,
Playoff Chances and Expectations
00:08:06
Speaker
All the statistical models still seem to really like the Sounders chances, certainly of getting into the playoffs. I think 538 and club sports stats both have them well over 95% in terms of their likelihood of making the playoffs. The Sounders would really have to just crap the bed over their final five games in order not to get in.
00:08:29
Speaker
That said, they're down to about a 55-ish percent chance of finishing the top four, which would give them a home playoff game. Their chances of finishing in the top two definitely took a hit, which is frustrating because, conceivably, they could have moved to within one point of the Western Conference lead if they had been able to win both these games this week. Now, I don't know how realistic of a, you know, it's tough to
00:08:59
Speaker
you know, keep stacking wins like that, but I don't know, finishing third, fourth, I still feel like that would be a very acceptable place for them to finish out. Yeah, I agree. I mean, just from where they were and where they are now, it just, if they got any higher than that would feel, you feel pretty blessed, I think. Yes, yes. I think that's a good way of looking at it. That said, what do you, I mean, for you,
00:09:28
Speaker
Is making the playoffs feel like enough at this point, or is it you got to do something in the playoffs for this to feel like all what we just went through is really meaningful? That's kind of a tough question, but I think if the win streak had gone on into the playoffs, I think you would have felt like you have to win out. This has to end in something special. Right. Now it's, can we get to the playoffs? And what can we do in the playoffs, I think,
00:09:56
Speaker
more realistic, I guess, of a place to be in for me. Well, you know, an interesting thing, I've been listening to a lot more of the national kind of conversation lately. It's a lot more fun to listen to the national conversation when the senators are playing well, as you probably agree. Right.
00:10:15
Speaker
It's been it's interesting because in the last week or two, I feel like there has been this kind of growing consensus that the sounders are if not the team to beat in the West, they are certainly one of the top teams and that they are being perceived as a team that is
Sounders as Top Contenders in the West
00:10:35
Speaker
You know, maybe not the favorite to go back to MLS cup, but right there, like no one's going to be surprised. And I feel like at least from a Sounders fan perspective, the loss yesterday took a lot of that out. And I don't know if it's.
00:10:50
Speaker
The way they lost, that they lost at home in a shutout, which felt very eerily similar to what, you know, it's like, I think there's a PTSD thing going on here a little bit where it felt like the early part of the season. Now granted, I don't remember the, I think the only game that you could really compare this to was probably the LAFC game. That said,
00:11:10
Speaker
I don't know if it's that. I don't know if it's these injuries that Raul Rui Diaz and Chad Marshall both suffered. We don't know how serious those are. Or I don't know if it's something else, something less easily defined that is making people feel like, cause I just don't get the sense anymore that, like at least among Sounders fans that like two days ago I would have said, I actually think the Sounders are going to go back to MLS cup. And today,
00:11:38
Speaker
I don't know. And I feel like one loss shouldn't change that much, especially in a loss they play well. I just think it's, you know, the unbeaten streak was something pretty special and people still weren't kind of buying into it. And they just, you know, they were kind of waiting for a shoot a drop kind of thing moment. And I think this may have been the one where people are like, whoa, you know, like come back down to earth kind of a little bit.
00:12:04
Speaker
Well that the LA game you know the Christian rolled on in the post game yesterday said something along the line of like there's a lot more pressure on us now in this LA game. And at the start of the week I would have said the LA game you could almost throw away. Like if you win this game against the Union.
00:12:22
Speaker
whatever happens in LA, it doesn't matter. You could lose three zero, you could lose five zero. No, I think emotionally you'd probably feel differently. But I certainly looked at that game as not at all a must win. And now I don't know that it's a must win, but they need to like, I think they need a result to start to like, just get back to get their groove back a little bit.
00:12:45
Speaker
Yeah, I think they need to get a result. It's just, you hope that yesterday was, or, you know, last night's Phillies game, I should say, in case you're not listening to this from the next day. Hopefully that's a kind of a wake up call. Cause I mean, they, they look tired. They looked, I don't know what it is, but maybe this just is a wake up call they needed from being, from being unbeaten for so long that they just needed to remember that they need the points.
00:13:12
Speaker
Yeah, I mean mathematically the one point would have definitely been helpful at the very least it would have kept them in fifth place with a game at hand still on RSL it keeps them, you know, again, I think.
00:13:25
Speaker
Portland, they would have had a game in hand on as well, I think. But in any case, they would have been two points back of Portland, they would have been two points back of LAFC. It definitely changes the equation a little bit if they get that one point. But there is a part of me that hopes
00:13:43
Speaker
that, well, there's not a part of me, I definitely at this point hope that losing may have actually been better than a scoreless tie. Because a scoreless tie, I feel like a lot of times you get lulled into believing that you're still playing well when you're eking out, when you're eking out ties, but that loss is a real jarring effect of saying like, nope,
00:14:04
Speaker
This is the difference between winning and losing in this league and it's this really fine margin. It's one bad pass. It's not finishing your chances. It's all these little things that remind you that there's no there's no guarantees. There's no guaranteed points in this league.
00:14:22
Speaker
you know, the union were not a bad team, but I think if you look at the schedule, whether you looked at it at the beginning of the season, or you looked at it two weeks ago, or you looked at it on Tuesday, you would have said, this is a game the Sounders have to win, just because this is a very winnable game at home, all the circumstances around it. And so maybe losing that game is maybe psychologically a good thing for this team. Am I trying too hard?
00:14:50
Speaker
No, I think you're right. You're not reaching there. You want it to be motivation that I'm sure
Victor Rodriguez's Performance Highlights
00:14:56
Speaker
the team will be using as motivation just to get back on track.
00:15:01
Speaker
I think they were already living on, you know, a borrowed time there when they got that VAR call, we got that goal reversed. Yes, I agree with you there. So I think that's why the 1-0 loss probably stings more because man, you feel, you feel a little like you got lucky and you should make it pay off and then it doesn't. And then it goes the opposite way. And then a 1-0-0 tie too would have been probably like you're saying, it probably would have felt worse.
00:15:29
Speaker
So if there was one positive to take from this game, I think it may have been the play of Victor Rodriguez and not so much because he was so spectacular all the way through. But I think we were reminded that this is a player that possesses the kind of game breaking ability that
00:15:47
Speaker
they don't really have outside of Rui Diaz and maybe Ledero. He had that shot, that beautiful, beautiful shot from about 20 yards out that hit the upper V. But he just in general was causing all kinds of trouble. He was almost playing as a false nine at points. He was getting in behind a lot. I was reminded yesterday that he's much, much quicker than sometimes I remember him being.
00:16:13
Speaker
But the positive was that this was his first start since July 21st, which happened to be the first game in this win streak. And I thought he looked better. He looked sharp. He looked good. I really think that he could potentially be the guy along with Rui Diaz. If they can get him healthy, get Rui Diaz healthy, get Lidero going,
00:16:37
Speaker
All of a sudden, there's a lot of pieces here that I think should get you excited about the postseason and what they can do. Yeah, I think he's he's starting to look to that. He's getting to that point where I think when he first got here and he showed it a little bit and then he got injured and all stuff, that's he's getting to the point where he like, this is what I wanted to see from this player. And I think we kind of kind of got to see a little bit on a Wednesday.
00:17:04
Speaker
Yeah, and it was too bad that Harry ship was the guy who had to sit. But I thought ship actually did a very good job off the bench. I noted that he played about 15 minutes 1520 minutes came in 76 minutes something like that. And the Sounders while he was on the field outshot the Union seven to one with the one shot of course being
00:17:25
Speaker
being the goal but ship look good I mean he that it would have been just glorious if he had been able to convert that volley that he had from again about 20 yards out he hit it well unfortunately he did kind of right at at Andre Blake but I thought he looked good I thought it was encouraging that he could still be effective off the bench like that
00:17:45
Speaker
Yeah. On a side note of that save, guarantee that's going to be in the goal of the week voting just because it's Andre Blake. But yeah, no, uh, he saved the week. Yeah. Save the week. Sorry.
00:17:57
Speaker
Yeah, it's great that while Victor was getting back, Harry basically played himself into the starting role. And it's unfortunate that he's getting removed, so to speak, from that role. But yeah, he did look good, I thought. I think also it helped. I think Brad Smith behind him looks more comfortable playing behind him. Yeah, I would agree with that. He's a better, that ship and Smith are a better pairing than Rodriguez and Smith. Yeah, so that's something they need to work out.
00:18:27
Speaker
Yeah, I do wonder, I wouldn't mind seeing a attacking band of four, of Rodriguez, Ledero, and Ship, and obviously Ruy Diaz up top, that would maybe require benching Ozzie Alonso, which would be tough, but I don't think that's a crazy notion. I think
00:18:50
Speaker
You know, I said that this is the line. I thought that the Sounders should put out what they thought was their best lineup on Wednesday and then kind of let the cards fall as they may on Sunday. I don't know if that was ultimately the right choice. I think that the way that the players looked, maybe there were some guys that could have used a rest. I think Ozzie Alonzo was probably one of the guys that just did not look
00:19:15
Speaker
his usual self. He did not look as spry as he had been in the previous eight games or so. He only had one defensive action. I can't remember the last time that's happened. I don't know that it's ever happened. Yeah, he had like one, I think it was at a clearance.
00:19:31
Speaker
which is not even like a particularly valuable defensive action. But he just didn't seem to be involved. His passing total was down in terms of volume. And maybe that was because Gustav Svensson was taking the more active role. He had six tackles in the game. And he was also seemingly doing a lot of the long ball distribution. But I don't know. Alonzo looked to me like he could have probably used the day off.
00:20:01
Speaker
He at least didn't, he didn't seem on, I guess. He didn't look like the couple, last couple of games were just like, wow, he looks lights out. Like it almost, I said to my, uh, seatmate, I was like, he must've been reading his own press this week. Yeah. Because usually what's happens is.
00:20:18
Speaker
Yes, that did not look great. Well, I feel like at this point we have ignored maybe the elephant in the room. We should end this segment talking about what was ultimately the play that decided this game.
Stephen Fry's Critical Error
00:20:31
Speaker
That was Stephen Fry's pass to Gustave Stenson that gets picked off. And then Pico just as if to add insult to Andrea goes five hole on Fry to score the winner. Now, I think
00:20:46
Speaker
I'm guessing you would agree that that's mostly on Fry, maybe completely on Fry. He doesn't hit that ball well. He hits it too far inside. But where I came down, Fry after the game was saying, maybe that's a ball that I just kick out of bounds and we take the shutout and we kind of lick our wounds and we go home. But I actually disagree. I would think that at home,
00:21:15
Speaker
against the team, you feel like you should win, a game you should win. You do kind of want those, you really do want those points. I want the Sounders to be pushing forward on that. And I don't think it was the wrong choice. You know, he was under a little bit of pressure, but it wasn't like he had no time to make the pass. And if all he does is just hit it farther to the outside where there's also more room for error, if it goes out of bounds, it goes out of bounds, everything's fine.
00:21:44
Speaker
I don't know, where do you come down on that? Do you want to see the sounders trying to play out of the back in that situation? And I guess you add this to it, they were down a man and they were pressing with at least two guys and there was a third guy coming up. If Svensson is able to get up and turn, all of a sudden they might have numbers going the other way.
00:22:03
Speaker
Yeah, no, I mean, their, their plan was fine. It's also, you get on that field and it's an extra time and you don't know how much time's left. You're just playing every second feels like it's you're going to end. So if you're playing to, for possession to get a good chance down the field, you just keep doing that. You can't just, if you just whack it down the field, you're just going to lose it and you just feel like you're not going to get the ball back. So I think it was fine. It's just, I think there was just a bunch of, you know, errors stacked up. There's like, uh,
00:22:31
Speaker
I think that they had one guy a little deep in there. The pass came in at a weird kind of an angle at Fry and then Fry. I don't think Goose, I don't think Gustav was ready, quite ready for that. And then it kind of went past him a little bit and he stumbled. And it just, it was just a comedy of errors, like altogether. Yeah, I don't think that Kim Ki-hee handled the pass probably as well as he could have. I don't know that even because Ki-hee knew that there was pressure coming.
00:23:01
Speaker
I think he put Fry in a little bit of an awkward situation. I think I would rather see Kiki control that ball and potentially, you know, and then deal with whatever he has to deal with at that point. Hitting it back to Fry I feel like was maybe
00:23:17
Speaker
just created a little bit of the danger. Now I think it's still Fry, maybe 70, 80%, but I don't think it was quite as completely on Fry as Fry himself was suggesting or most fans I think have suggested. But what's really killing me is how many people, I was shocked at how many people, like first of all, there was this weird narrative that was developing where it was like, yeah, he does one or two of those a game.
00:23:44
Speaker
What are you talking a game that was where it started and then it was like where do you die it's like okay well maybe one a season, one or two a season. Okay, and but they were still holding but like my point still stands that he makes errors that oftentimes cost us games.
00:24:01
Speaker
It's because the errors that he, the one error that he makes, you know, a season is like, it stands out because it's just like the one he had in Vancouver a couple of years ago, you know, where he kicks it and it goes 2014, by the way, that was 2014. And just, they're just big ones where it's like, they stick out in people's minds for some reason. And then, you know,
00:24:21
Speaker
No one ever talks about when, you know, they talk about he makes a great save, but they never like, you know, it's not like, oh, you know, he made like six great saves. He kept us in the game. But, you know, I made one mistake and that's that's all people want to know. You know, it's like it costs them points. You know, it's just it's the life of a goalie kind of thing where, you know, they never get too much recognition for doing the little things correctly all game and then they make one mistake and then that's all the fancy. Yeah, I was
00:24:49
Speaker
Like one of the comments that drove me nuts, there was a guy on Sounder at Heart that was saying that this loss was totally on fry. And I'm like, what are you talking about? And he's like, well, you know, in the 93rd minute, it's his mistake that cost him the game. It's all on fry. It was like, the only reason they were tied going into the 93rd minute was because he had made an amazing save on Burke in the first half at point blank range.
00:25:16
Speaker
Yeah. He also made two back-to-back saves. Right. Then he had that double save in the second half, early in the second half, that, again, easily could have been a goal. And then that also seems to just give a total pass to the cylinders' attackers, who had plenty of chances to score in this game.
00:25:38
Speaker
And like I said, any one of those goes in, and the fry situation, even if it plays out exactly as it did, can go totally differently. Because he just, at that point, if they're up 1-0, he does boot that out of bounds.
00:25:51
Speaker
Uh, it just boggles my mind that anyone would look at this and think like, yeah, that's Stefan Fry's fault. And I know he's a really good goalkeeper, but you got to admit he does make one or two mistakes that cost us hunters a game every year. And it's like, I mean, I, I, I mean, I guess, but doesn't every goalkeeper in the world have a mistake or two that costs his team a game?
00:26:13
Speaker
Well you know to put it bluntly like every loss is you know basically a goalie's fault because the goalie's job is to not let them score so I mean distilled down yeah I mean it is his fault but there was a lot more to that game than just his that one play I mean I get it I get it from that perspective it's like you
00:26:33
Speaker
He makes a bad pass and he gets scored on. And it's totally unnecessary. I get it. And you can blame him. That's fine. But you have to realize that there's much more going on than just that play. And I don't think this is the majority of fans by any stretch. But I do think that there is a vocal minority that just they want to focus on the negative with that situation so much. And it just drives me absolutely bonkers.
00:26:59
Speaker
But anyway, that's probably a good place to call this a segment. We're going to come back, take your questions. You're listening to no audio.
00:27:11
Speaker
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Q&A Segment Introduction
00:28:35
Speaker
Welcome back to NOS Ariete. So, Lickit and I are just going to do a two man Q&A. So I'll just go ahead and let Lickit take it away.
00:28:42
Speaker
Yeah, and I'm going to wing it this time. It's going to read the Twitter. So this should be interesting. Alright, 86 206 S would you say that the with the Vancouver game a win that probably should have been a tie and yesterday's loss a loss that should have been a tie. We came out overall with one extra point hashtag glass half full. I mean, that's a good way of looking at it. I think that you could look at a lot of the games during this win streak and reasonably say that they should have been ties or
00:29:11
Speaker
I suppose you could maybe make a case that some of them should have been losses. But yeah, I mean, I think that's a fine way of looking at it, the Vancouver game being the game that immediately preceded it. I think if you had told me the Sounders would either take two ties in that game or win one of them, I would absolutely take the one win, especially if I got to choose which game it was because I would want it to be the Vancouver game for many reasons, not the least of which is they get to have the Cascadia Cup, which is great.
00:29:42
Speaker
Let's see. MuffinTopModel asks, what's more impressive, climbing out of a huge hole, winning nine straight, 12 unbeaten, or two, digging such a huge hole to climb out of? I mean, I don't think impressive is the right word that it has the double meaning there. I mean, I would say that it's much more impressive to win nine
00:30:04
Speaker
than it is like the whatever the opposite of impressive is to be in the hole that they're in. I think that the nine straight wins is made more oppressive by this was somehow the same team that was in that hole.
00:30:19
Speaker
But yeah, I mean, it's nine, there's a lot of, you could drive yourself crazy talking about just kind of running the numbers a little bit to see how much they could, the centers could have still been pretty bad early in the season, but if they had been a little less bad, they would be in much better position right now. And it's kind of a shame that after nine straight wins, they are still basically fighting for a playoff spot, certainly fighting for, you know, that are still on the outside looking in for a home playoff game, which is kind of crazy and frustrating.
00:30:50
Speaker
Yeah, our cell didn't lose a couple games where there were supposed to be those chirks. Yeah, what's up with that? Jojo nuts asks, why was there a structure on the field every single time one of the Philadelphia players went down? So I noticed that too, and Ishmael Elphath early on in the game was immediately making the that's the referee, he was immediately making the the bring out the stretcher sign. And I don't know if that was because he
00:31:18
Speaker
just wanted to get the game moving and he was already sensing that there was a lot of stoppages in play or what, but it was definitely Elphath who was kind of dictating that the stretcher come on the field. It was funny that I don't think anyone actually used the stretcher. Yeah. That was very frustrating. Mr.Dod18 asks, is it time to panic?
00:31:44
Speaker
I don't think it's time to panic, but I do understand how, like it's amazing, like the emotional switch from being on the high of a nine game winning streak where you feel like, hey, we might win out to, you lose one game when you play well and you're like, God, are we gonna win another game? I mean, it's a big, it's quite the 180 and I get it. But I still think the sounders are,
00:32:12
Speaker
Like if you're asking me where I think they're going to finish, I think the money I would put on is probably fourth. Yeah. And, uh, to, I thought Philadelphia game would have been icing on the cake, so to speak, or on the cake. Yeah. And then I was already ready to not win ring home points from LA. So it was high. So if they win in LA, then it's a wash, right? It's pretty much pretty much a wash. Yeah.
00:32:38
Speaker
And also Mr. Dodd, the correct way to phrase that would have been, is it just me or is it time to panic? Um, Irish sounder asks, I was under the impression that the ref only had to stop play for head injury. Is this correct? Yeah. I mean the rep only has to stop play himself for.
00:33:02
Speaker
a head injury. I feel like there was a moment late in the game where he ordered the play dead when there was no head injury. I don't remember the exact point of that, but I do feel like that happened. I don't know that there's really much to be done about it. I will say that one of the funny things that happened was
00:33:26
Speaker
The free kick that led to, that ultimately led to the union's counter-attack goal was apparently kind of controversial because the union had just put a ball out because of an injury and the Sounders basically retained possession. Although I feel like they had already kind of earned possession and it was kind of a weird situation, but, um,
00:33:52
Speaker
Yeah, that was that was kind of funny that it worked out that way because they were arguing over whether or not the sounder should have retained possession there. Well, the problem, the problem to me looked like Blake was playing it fast. He wanted to play it fast out of the bats. And then he threw it all the way to half field out of like basically almost out of bounds. Right. And then they lost the you know, we
00:34:12
Speaker
I can't remember they we threw it in or they threw it in or we want it back and like I don't understand they got mad at that it's like well right right you're you guys try to play you guys try to play it out like that's not
00:34:24
Speaker
That's pretty, that's kind of weird that we've kind of been part of two of those like sportsmanship, you know, quote unquote, sportsmanship plays. Right. Well, you know, it's funny before the, like, as it was going into stoppage time, there was all this, like, it was, it felt like it was very much like the FC Dallas game where there was these like long delays and it was just kind of going on and on. And I was like, Oh, this is going to be an eventful stoppage time. And sure enough. Yep.
00:34:53
Speaker
Nick Denny asked, do you wish the Campiones Cup had been introduced a year ago so the Sounders could have played for it?
00:34:59
Speaker
So I like the idea of the Campionis Cup. I think it's cool. I think playing the MLS Cup champion against the Liga Emequis champion is a great shtick.
Campiones Cup Timing and Impact
00:35:12
Speaker
I agree that it is kind of a money grab, but I don't think it's any more of a money grab than like the UEFA Cup or any of the millions of comparable little one-off games that played throughout the world that aren't really
00:35:26
Speaker
cup games, but they call them cup games. My issue with the Campiones Cup is all about the timing. Can you imagine if the season had been going exactly the way it had been going except that the Sounders had won MLS Cup last year?
00:35:44
Speaker
and we're playing in the Campionas Cup on a Wednesday as a midweek game where they're expected to field the starting lineup while they're still fighting for the playoff spot. I mean, Toronto, I actually kind of felt bad for Toronto FC there. That was the timing of it could not have been worse. I think if you're going to play that game, you got to do it in summer. You got to do it during kind of friendly season, and you got to find a date that makes a lot more sense than a random Wednesday in September.
00:36:13
Speaker
Well, doesn't this favor already favor the Mexican league, the state this late in the season? Cause isn't, I don't know what they're like, they're like nine games into their season right now. So second season or second season. Yeah. Uh, so yeah, I mean, I guess it kind of favors them, uh, already. So if they had to play this in early in their season, I wouldn't have, I mean, I would think that's fine. I.
00:36:43
Speaker
Yeah, I don't understand how MLS agreed to play the game when they did. Yeah, it's weird. I mean, this kind of plays out as a friendly at this point.
00:36:52
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. But there's a lot of money on the line. I mean, there's like real prize money on the line here. So I kind of understand the motivations to, to compete in it. But, um, the timing is stupid. It's dumb. Yeah. At least do it near the, when Toronto was like, there, are they, are they out? Are they methodically? They're not actually, no, no, not at all. They're like, because the Eastern though, the six seed in the Eastern conferences, uh, pretty bad. So they, they are, I think seven points out, which.
00:37:22
Speaker
They're probably not going to get in, but they're not totally out yet. Let's see. If you voted to retain Garth and SSFC fail to qualify for playoffs, does that change your mind?
Voting on General Manager Retention
00:37:40
Speaker
I would hope not. I mean, it's my like.
00:37:44
Speaker
I've been saying, I don't think like if you, if, if a run of bad results is going to influence the way that you want to vote, you should wait to vote as long as you can. Like that's, that was, that's the advice I would give you if you voted yesterday and then after one game felt like you want to bring back your vote. Like I don't, I don't have much to offer you. Uh, yeah. And I, and I, and I, like if the centers get 48 points and they miss the playoffs.
00:38:13
Speaker
I mean, for me, I think I'd still vote to retain, but yeah, I mean, I would think that if you were easily enough swayed based solely on their playoff positioning and not in what you perceive as a direction, I suggest waiting as long as you can.
00:38:34
Speaker
I mean, if, if not making the playoffs at this point changes your mind, then you, like you said, I think you're voting for the wrong reason. Right. I mean, you certainly can vote that way, but it's just, you should have, I don't know. I don't know how to say it without, I mean, this is what I'll say is that if, if
00:38:57
Speaker
Like, first of all, I wouldn't suggest that simply making the playoffs or not making the playoffs should be the thing that you are deciding on. I think if you, as of right now, if you're not satisfied with the direction of the team, you should vote not to retain. If you're satisfied with the direction of the team right now, you should vote to retain and, or you should vote confidence or, you know, like you should base it on the broader picture than like whether or not they make the playoffs this year.
00:39:26
Speaker
Right. I think what I was trying to say is if you are basing your vote on missing the playoffs, and that was the one thing that's missed, you need to actually walk it back and think about what was on the field that led up to that.
00:39:41
Speaker
You know, we, the whole nine games win streak, 12 unbeaten. Those are players that were brought in and put together by the general manager over the course of the season or two. You know, it's like, you have to put those into perspective. And then did that, did that squad that made that run also fail on the field or was it Garth's fault that they missed the playoffs? You know, they missed the, they lost the last five games or something like that, you know.
00:40:06
Speaker
Well, I mean, and I'll say this, I was kind of thinking about this a little bit, too, is that because on one hand, I'm I'm sympathetic to the idea that the Sounders have created a razor thin and it's not razor thin, but they created a very thin margin for error because of their horrible start. But the reality is that they don't need to play great during their last five games to make the playoffs. If they go to one and two, they're almost certainly going to be in the playoffs.
00:40:35
Speaker
that would get them to 50.
00:40:38
Speaker
52 points. I would be shocked if they don't make the playoffs at 52 points. And so I guess my point is that they don't need to like, if they fail to make the playoffs, it's because they played bad down the stretch. It's not just because of what happened early in the season. They're now in a position where I feel like they it's kind of a wash, and they've made up for their bad start. It's now like how they finished is a separate issue.
00:41:07
Speaker
Yes. And to be fair, if you're only changing your mind because they miss the playoffs, I mean, like on a five game window. Yeah, in the five game window. That's that's not that's not enough to quote. I mean, personally, I don't think that's enough to.
00:41:22
Speaker
I'll just say that if you aren't convinced that you should retain him now, you shouldn't vote to retain him. Yeah, I mean we talk a lot about the people that have certain feelings about how Garth runs the club.
00:41:38
Speaker
They're, you know, they're, those are valid reasons that those people feel are valid and that's great. But the difference is those people have actual reasons to vote yes or no. And it's just beyond just the losing. I think is, I think. I would agree with that. I would agree with that. Oh, let's see. Bill Jones, STRPTS, why didn't we see much rotation last night? Our boys looked like they could have used it. Should we expect any in the future?
00:42:08
Speaker
I mean, I think the reason we didn't see rotation is because they looked at the schedule and they said, this is the game that we want to emphasize. And I suspect that we're going to see a little more rotation on the weekend. So maybe in hindsight, that wasn't the right choice. Maybe the guys really could have used the rest on Wednesday and that was more what it was about. But yeah, I mean, I think that was the reason is that they felt like the game on Wednesday was the more important one.
00:42:38
Speaker
Yeah, and it's also at home and you want to win at home. Yeah. In theory. Let's see. Third string star asked, did you think we'd get to the point this season where losing a game didn't put us on the brink?
00:42:57
Speaker
Yeah, you know, that's an interesting question. And I feel like this has been a very similar ride to the last two years where it felt like it was going to come right down to the wire, although I guess two years it did. They needed to get points in their season finale to get into the playoffs. But yeah, I have to admit that I'm a little surprised that we're sitting here after a loss at home and they still have a four point cushion.
Emotional Impact of Unbeaten Streak Ending
00:43:24
Speaker
That's pretty remarkable in a sense.
00:43:28
Speaker
It's kind of crazy. Let's end it on this. The real James FBS, now that winning the winning streak is over, will we ever win again? Yeah, I know. It's funny. It's like I kind of touched on this earlier. It's like kind of an amazing emotional roller coaster that I felt like I personally went on because I feel the same. You know, it's like you can see how you know, once you lose hold of that, that streak, like it's just going to all vanish and
00:43:58
Speaker
You know, I, I did a fair amount of research that one of these days I need to publish about teams, how they perform immediately after streaks. And there it's pretty common actually for, uh, for long winning streaks to be followed by short losing streaks. And by short losing streaks, I mean like a couple of games.
00:44:19
Speaker
And I think that there is like some real emotional letdown that happens after you go on this long winning streak that it's a little tough to get back into gear.
00:44:30
Speaker
And so the Sounders are going to have to be kind of fighting history in a way to they actually had obviously they had to fight history to do what they did. So they'll have to be kind of kicking trends. Again, it's it's it's actually exceptionally rare for long streaks like this to end with just one loss. And they oftentimes are a couple losses or a few winless games.
00:44:52
Speaker
So let's hope that it doesn't and that we don't have to talk about this anymore. A win on Sunday would not literally secure a playoff spot, but it could potentially put them in position to kind of cruise down the stretch.
Sounders' Playoff Outlook and Season Finish
00:45:08
Speaker
Vancouver has a home game against FC Dallas. If they lose that game and the Sounders win the Galaxy game, they would be seven points up on Vancouver. LA would basically be out of the playoffs at that point.
00:45:21
Speaker
And all of a sudden, the Red Sea is kind of opened up for them. And all of a sudden, I think they can get momentum going again. I'd love to see them finish strong. Obviously, these home games are still really the most important ones. They've got nine points left potentially at home.
00:45:41
Speaker
those teams are Houston, Colorado, and San Jose. You gotta think they can get full points in those three games. And if they can't, they might be in a little bit of trouble if they can't do that. But you still gotta like this team's chances. LA is actually by far the most daunting opponent they have left. They still have road games against Houston and Orlando. The Orlando one is on short rest though, but man, they are bad.
00:46:10
Speaker
Anyway, so that's that. Thanks to our sponsors, Fullpool Wines, Queen Anne Acupuncture, and our broadcast partner Bootstrapper Studios. I am Jeremiah O'Shan, signing off on behalf of Lick It. This is No Study Yetis. Remember, you'll never get alone.
00:46:31
Speaker
Green Douglas fir where the water's cut through. Down to wild mountains and canyons you flew. Canadian Northwest to the ocean so blue. It's Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Roll On, Columbia Roll On. Your power is turning our darkness to dawn. Roll On, Columbia Roll On.
00:47:11
Speaker
We love you. Let's win another one!