Transcript
Speaker: Hello everyone, and welcome to the Able Voices Podcast. I'm Dr. Rhoda Bernard, founding managing director of the Berklee Institute for Accessible Arts Education and the assistant chair of the Music Education Department at Berklee College of Music.
Speaker: And I am proud to present this podcast featuring disabled artists and arts educators. We are inviting artists with disabilities to be guest hosts with the Able Voices Podcast.
Speaker: Today, you'll meet our next guest host, Jillian Raquet. Jillian Raquet is a New York City-based nonprofit arts administrator, educator, and vocalist with more than a decade of experience in the nonprofit arts and cultural sector.
Speaker: And as an artist with low vision, Jillian is deeply committed to creating more inclusive pathways in the arts. Her work is closely closely connected to the Filamino M. D'Agostino-Greenberg Music School, a community music school for the blind and visually impaired, where she began as a student in 2012 while studying musical theater at Marymount Manhattan College.
Speaker: Through her work there, Jillian collaborates with fellow artists with vision loss and is dedicated to expanding meaningful opportunities for artists of all ages and abilities.
Speaker: Jillian's professional background includes positions at leading arts organizations such as Ta-Da Youth Theater, Theater Development Fund, Philadelphia Theater Company, and A Class Act New York, where she developed expertise in arts education, outreach, and program development.
Speaker: Hi, everyone. Welcome to the Able Voices Podcast. My name is Jillian Riquet, and I've had such a wonderful time being your guest host. If you haven't listened to my previous episodes, I'm a New York-based singer with low vision who works with the Philemon M. D'Agostino Greenberg Music School, a community music school for the blind and visually impaired.
Speaker: I'd love to introduce you to my next guest, Jenna Bainbridge. Jenna Bainbridge is an actor, singer, and disability rights advocate currently appearing on Broadway as Nessa Rose in Wicked.
Speaker: In 2024, she became the first wheelchair user to perform in a new musical on Broadway when she made her debut in SUFFS, which won the 2024 Tony Awards for Best Book and Best Music. In addition to performing, Jenna is also the co-founder of ConsultAbility, a nonprofit consulting company whose mission is to work with theatrical institutions and educational programs to create more accessible spaces and inclusive programming for disabled artists. Bridging the Gap Between What's Desired and What's Required When Working with Disabled Artists in the Theatrical World.
Speaker: Welcome, Jenna. I'm so excited to have you on the podcast today. Thank you so much for having me, Jillian. I'm so excited to chat today. So I wanted to start off with your story as an artist. How did you get your start and how did you get to where you are today?
Speaker: Oh, there's so many, so many stops along, along the way and the journey of, of coming to to Wicked and to Broadway. What's interesting is that I, so I've been performing since I was a kid.
Speaker: And I started working at a theater company in Denver when I was 12 years old called Family Theater Company. And they are an incredible organization. They hire entirely actors with disabilities, all disabilities, all ages, all ah you know all experience levels with theater too. there's There's professional equity actors and people who are doing their first show.
Speaker: So it's it's a really, really cool organization. Started working there when i was 12 years old and learned a lot about, disability in theater and disabled storytelling and how to incorporate my disability into my artistry, but also how to accommodate for myself and how to advocate for myself. um So it was a ah really important part of my career and my my education.
Speaker: Started working there when I was 12 and just got the bug and decided that when I went to college, I knew I needed a scholarship to to go to college. And so I was like, well, I've been acting all these years. I've been taking voice lessons. I'm i'm going to audition for theater programs and music programs just kind of because it was something I had a ah a skill set for and a love for.
Speaker: i never thought I would be a professional actor though. Like never in my, it was always a thing that I loved to do. And I was like, well, the opportunity is still there. So I'll keep doing it. And around the time I graduated college was when I finally went like, no, this is, this is what I want to do.
Speaker: So I started auditioning for a lot of local regional theaters and that is one of my favorite places to work is just regional theaters. I think that regional theater is such an exciting place to be But every opportunity I had just opened another door and I started then doing shows in other states and eventually i ended up I was looking on like the the equity website for auditions during the COVID shutdown.
Speaker: and was like, you know what? going audition for every single pipe dream out there because everything is a remote audition right now. You don't have to be in New York to be auditioning for Broadway. And so I started just submitting myself on like YouTube videos just to see what would happen. And um I ended up booking my first show in New York for one of those. I did Sufts at the Public.
Speaker: And then that ended up leading to Wicked. So every single show I did was like a stepping stone that led to another door. um But I never, it was funny. I never like thought, oh, going to be on Broadway one day. It was just like, oh, here's another opportunity. Sure, I'll go through this door. And they just kept kept opening.
Speaker: That's incredible. And I love hearing that you started in such a supportive environment, because i think that's so important. And it's something that not everyone is so lucky to to have in um our situation.
Speaker: I feel the same way about the students at our music school, um who, you know, never knew what it was like to have a piano teacher who didn't know how to get you sheet music that you could read or, you know, work help you get on stage or or things like that. So it's That's awesome. So going along with that, can you tell me a little bit more about your experience as an artist, but also just a person with a disability? Yeah, so I have a, um well, the the assumed diagnosis is a spinal cord injury. We don't know exactly what caused it, if it was a
Speaker: Like if it's neurological or if it's physical, there's not really a lot of um evidence remaining because I was 16 months old when I suddenly became paralyzed. So I'm partially paralyzed from the waist down now.
Speaker: I am an ambulatory wheelchair user. So i'm I'm able to walk. I have a very pronounced limp and it I tire very quickly when I'm walking. I'm also a trip hazard. So I primarily use a wheelchair for um distances and speed and ease.
Speaker: And, you know, my my working with family just gave me a whole different perspective on what accessibility and what inclusion was. And it was always then baffling to me when I would go to audition for something at my school or at a regional theater and or a community theater even and and be told,
Speaker: that it it it couldn't be done, that they couldn't get a wheelchair on stage. i remember going to see um The Little Mermaid. It was doing its out-of-town tryout in Denver when I was a kid. And I was doing a show in the same complex at that time because Denver Center has a bunch of different theaters that all share a like plaza.
Speaker: So they invited us to come watch a a rehearsal one day because we were rehearsing in the same space. So everyone from Family Theater Company was like inside the Ellie Calkins Opera House watching them do a rehearsal. And I remember one of our founders, a woman named Kathleen Traylor, was talking to one of the directors for a Little Mermaid or a producer. i can't remember exactly who it was she was speaking to.
Speaker: And she was like, you have so much diversity on this stage. I see people of all different body types and ethnicities and cultural backgrounds and ages.
Speaker: But what I don't see is a single person with a disability. I've seen shows where you get a live elephant on stage. You have brought actual helicopters on stage before, but you can't figure out how to get a wheelchair on stage.
Speaker: And I just remember her like kind of raving this guy apart for like, you did such a good job with diversity and you forgot an entire group of humans. You know, one of the...
Speaker: We are the largest minority. 25% of the population has a disability. Why is not a single person on this stage, the Little Mermaid, disabled? And, you know, maybe they had invisible disabilities they weren't disclosing, but, like, there was no visible disabilities on stage.
Speaker: And it it it just, like, I was 12 at the time, something like that. And I remember just, like, it, like, blew my brain. I was like, she's right. Why am I not seeing disabled representation on every single stage?
Speaker: And it it just lit this fire in me where every time I'd go to an audition, then after that, I was like, And they would tell me, oh, well, we can't include your disability for X, Y, Z reason. And I'd be like, tell me why.
Speaker: Like, give me the reason why. And I will give you six reasons why you're wrong. And that just became my whole mantra. And every single time I'd go into audition for shows after that, I made sure that I was including my disability in my storytelling. So if I was auditioning for Cinderella and she's singing, you know, in my own little corner, in my own little chair, that chair was my wheelchair. And I would draw attention to it as part of my audition and hopefully just get them to rethink, like, wait, why haven't we thought of this? Why haven't we thought of disability inclusion?
Speaker: um because it was always so obvious to me. And it was just something that that nobody else had, it hadn't been done before. And so these theater companies were were just stuck in the way of, well, this is how we've always done it. um And that's just become my my whole mindset in theaters. But why not?
Speaker: No, absolutely. i I love that. And it's it's so true because um we've seen a huge shift over the past few years on Broadway with, um you know, as far as race and body type goes, you know, there's been a lot more creative casting. There's been a lot more, you know, not your golden age musicals don't have to be done by just, you know, white, thin people.
Speaker: um And I also feel the same way that, you know, I'm waiting for that to to trickle to the the disabled community because one of my favorite shows that I've seen in the past few years on Broadway was um the Deaf West Spring Awakening and how the accessibility was just so ingrained into it. um So i I agree with your sentiment. we need We need more of it and there's no reason to not have it.
Speaker: and then So I know you talked a little bit about your arts education with family theater and through college, but can you tell us a little bit more about your study of the arts and um how you continue learning today?
Speaker: Yeah, i honestly, if I could, I would always be in school. I love learning. i think that you can never, like the greatest experts on the planet are still seeking out new knowledge because there You can never stop learning. There's always something to glean. There's always something to hone in your craft and your experiences.
Speaker: So I am always in classes. I take voice lessons regularly. i take acting classes regularly. i take dance classes regularly. In addition to, you know, just the world is is such a great place to learn within,
Speaker: Uh, so I, am such a huge supporter of like always be in classes, always be learning, always be seeking out new knowledge. My education was interesting because once again, people didn't expect me to show up.
Speaker: And so i i can't count the amount of schools I auditioned for, especially when i was looking for colleges, that I was just flat out rejected from. And when I would go and talk to them and say, like, I'd love some feedback because I want to be able to do better in my next audition.
Speaker: And the feedback would consistently be, oh, you did a great job. We just didn't think you could complete the dance portion of our degree. when they had never seen me dance. They just saw my wheelchair and said, oh, she can't dance.
Speaker: And that was something that I faced again and again and again. i had one school that flat out rejected me from their performing arts degree. But they called me and they were like, we loved your audition so much. We think that you are so talented. We want to offer you a scholarship to our school, just not as a performance major, because we don't feel like you'd be able to work upon graduation.
Speaker: And a huge part of our degree is we sell ourselves on like X amount of our students are actively employed as performers. And we just, we think you'd bring our average down was like literally what they told me. They said, so instead we want to offer you a ah scholarship to become an arts administration major.
Speaker: And I was like, all I want to do is perform. And and this is this is what I'm auditioning for. i need a scholarship to go to college. But like, why are you telling me I can't be a performance major?
Speaker: This is absurd. So, you know, joke's on them now. I'm on Broadway and they don't get to say that. They don't get to say alumni of our school on Broadway. um So I ended up choosing ah the Lamont School of Music in Denver as a music major because, and this is, you know, once again, every musical theater program auditioned said like, oh, we don't we don't think you can...
Speaker: complete the dance portion or some version of that story. And Lamont said, we think we think you could be an incredible musician. Please come to our school. And they they really did work with me to make a ah very accessible program.
Speaker: And i'm I'm eternally grateful for my music degree. I always kind of thought I would have a musical theater degree Maybe not always. Like I said, I didn't really think about going to Broadway or any of that. But like when I was looking at schools, I was looking at musical theater degrees and ended up getting an opera degree because that was the opportunity that was available to me. And that's where the scholarship was.
Speaker: That's, ah I mean, that's... angers me. to my for But, um you know, I, it echoes a lot of what I dealt with, um even with a, you know, semi invisible disability in college as well. ah I remember someone saying to me, you know, well, if you're going to lose your eyesight, like, why are you pursuing performance?
Speaker: And I was like, um I don't see how those two things are related, These are completely different categories. It also always baffled me because I was like, but you're literally teaching people how to have my disability as part of your training program.
Speaker: Like you're literally telling people like today we're going to practice walking the different gates. And like, why are you teaching people to walk like me when you can just hire me? Stop telling people to have a limp to play Laura in Glass Menagerie. Just hire a disabled person. This is so obvious to me. yeah They'd be like, well, you can't be in our program if you're low vision. And you're like, well, there's a lot of low vision characters out there. And also there's a lot of characters that could be low vision and it doesn't matter.
Speaker: and they're like, no, no, no, we can't do that. 100%. And it means so much to the people in our community who aren't. pursuing this to actually see themselves represented on screen. Like it's something that you just can't describe unless you're in that position where you're not seeing yourself represented. But every time there's like a genuinely blind person or low vision person playing a actual, you know, blind or low vision person, it means so much to me as an audience member.
Speaker: It means so much. And on the reverse, whenever I see someone faking a disability, i get so icked out that I can't enjoy any element of the show anymore. Nope. The movie, of you know, whatever it is I'm watching. Yeah, there was a... done out There was a show on The CW a couple of years ago with a blind character and for all the promotion, they kept putting the CW logo in Braille, but like it was flat and like visual. and I was like, what is that?
Speaker: You can't feel it. this is Someone who actually is blind can't benefit from it. What is this doing? This is performative. you know she The actress is not blind. what yeah What are we accomplishing?
Speaker: So we're about to listen to a clip of a recent performance of yours. Can you tell us a little bit about it? Yeah, so this was at 54 Below a few months ago. we did a tribute to Olivia Rodrigo and sang a bunch of covers of ah her whole discography. so this is Vampire.
Speaker: One look fine, I should've known it was strange You only come out at night I used to think I was smart But you made me look so naive The way you sold me for part You sunk your teeth into me I'm that sucker Faint fucker Bleeding me dry Like goddamn bamfuck
Speaker: Every girl I ever talked to Told me you were bad bad news You called them crazy God I hate the way I called them crazy too You're so convincing How do you lie without flinching?
Speaker: What a mesmerizing, paralyzing, fucked up little thrill. Can't figure out just how you do it. And God knows I never will. It's meant for me and not her. Girls your age know better.
Speaker: I've made some real big mistakes. So obviously ah we know you're in Wicked on Broadway. but I know you have a lot of other things going on.
Speaker: you tell us a little bit about your current work? Oh, boy. um I mean, Wicked is I've now been doing eight-show week for about three years. And it is... oh my gosh. It's exhausting. The amount of time that you spend in the theater and and it's such a physical physically demanding job.
Speaker: And yet... Everyone I know, we're all we're all doing multiple gigs, multiple things. So in addition to Wicked, I've been doing a lot of workshops for other shows.
Speaker: I love doing workshops. I love... There's something so rewarding about, you know, new work and new pieces, It's just exciting to see the journey that a show goes on, you know especially when you revisit time and time again. i was so lucky to work on Sufts for a couple of years before it went to Broadway ah in workshops and just seeing how it changed every single time. there's There's versions of it that are still in my head that, you know, those songs were cut five years ago and I still know every single lyric and every single note.
Speaker: So that's just so... It's fun to see how things change and how things shift. But it's also really exciting to like feel like maybe you had an impact on it. you know there's There's lines and stuff where I like remember that day in rehearsal of somebody said something and suddenly it was in the script. right like there's There's those moments. um But it's also just so rewarding because you do something different. you know When you are doing the same thing every night, eight shows a week...
Speaker: there is an instinct to get a little complacent because it does feel a little like you're, you know, stuck in a hamster wheel doing the same thing, but you're not, right? It's always different. Every single night is different. There's different audience members, of course, that are giving us different energy, but you know, there's also different people on stage and everyone's had a different day that's impacting their, their life and their choices on stage. And when you can stay fresh in the moment,
Speaker: It's always exciting. It's always lively. It always feels completely unique and one of a kind. And I think that doing other shows, you know, during the day and working on workshops or even just, I like to read other plays or listen to other shows. It reminds you of that love, of that excitement.
Speaker: So I've done a ah couple of of new works this year. One of my favorites is there's a musical called 504 that is all about the 504 movement um and the sit-ins that happened across the country in the 1970s.
Speaker: It is a great musical. They just had their world premiere in Denver, um which, know, unfortunately I was in New York, couldn't go, couldn't be a part of it. But um I did a couple of their workshops and I just think it's An absolutely incredible show. And, um you know, it's it's an interesting part of disability history that I don't think that most of, you know, mainstream society even knows happens. and it was It was the largest and longest sit-in in U.S. history.
Speaker: And um it's a hugely important part of how we got not only Section 504, but also the ADA eventually passed. So it's a ah ah great musical. And I highly recommend people go...
Speaker: check it out. Oh, they've got some clips on YouTube and on their Instagram page. Amazing. So what advice would you give to a young artist with a disability?
Speaker: Tenacity is your friend. um I can't count the amount of times where I have been told no simply because of my disability. And the thing that I found as a pattern in in my life auditioning experience was the first time I auditioned someplace, I was almost never cast.
Speaker: People, i mean, i think that people were so surprised that a disabled person was entering the room sometimes that they didn't even watch my audition. um You know, i I can't count the amount of times where I would do an entire audition, an entire audition, and they never looked at me.
Speaker: I'd walk or roll into the room and they would immediately like look down at my resume and then just not watch my audition. And then the second time I'd audition, You know, they'd they'd start thinking a little bit of like, well, could we make this accessible?
Speaker: And then it was around my third audition that I would generally get cast. So, you know, that tenacity of being willing to go back in again and again and again served me well. And just the stubbornness of saying, no, I want to be seen for this thing.
Speaker: Regardless of if I had an agent or a manager or, you know, any of those ah kind of gatekeeping mechanisms, like I would submit myself. i would I would take myself to the audition. I would send a video myself.
Speaker: And and it it took a lot of ah additional steps sometimes. But... you know, eventually it led to where I am now. So tenacity is your friend and relationships will get you everywhere.
Speaker: You know, it's not just about what you know, but sometimes it's who you know. Sometimes it is having that person on the other side of the table, someone in casting, someone who's directing, you know, even just a ah friend who's a friend of the director, right? Like friends of friends are sometimes how you get into the room. and how you stay in the room, right? Kindness really does take you so many places.
Speaker: So be tenacious, keep showing up, but lead with kindness because... Who knows, that relationship of someone you met waiting in the audition room years later, they might be on the other side of the casting table and and remember you and think of you fondly or be able to recommend you to somebody who is auditioning and is looking to include your voice. So it's important to just be in the room, network, and keep showing up even when it feels like all the doors are shut.
Speaker: That's great advice and ah so important, you know, just even for the everyday for us, um you know, being able to advocate for yourself is, you know, very, very, very important.
Speaker: And trust who else can advocate for you because it's exhausting to constantly having to be advocate for ourselves and it shouldn't be our job. No. Like at the end of the day, we shouldn't have to do that. It is extra work. It is extra labor. Mm-hmm.
Speaker: So having other people in the room that you can trust to advocate for you, you know even if it's as simple as telling a friend, like, I'm so tired of fighting for XYZ thing, or this thing is fixed and i don't even is is wrong and I don't even have the energy in me to tell them it's wrong.
Speaker: Right? And having someone else in the room that you trust to be able to speak up for you on your behalf... or on their own behalf, right? Because access benefits everybody. Absolutely. So let let people, trust people, let them in, let them yeah assist. And that's also why my husband and i founded Consultability was to be an additional voice for people so that they can reach out to us and say, I need someone to step in. I need someone to call this out or to call someone in. Like,
Speaker: We do all of that. We make sure that we are advocating for the artist so that they can focus on just being an artist. That's amazing. And I love that you're creating a space for that because it it's much needed.
Speaker: So um I know after listening, our audience will want to follow you ah to kind of keep up with your work and ah any upcoming projects.
Speaker: ah Where can they find you online? I am at Bainbridge Jenna on Instagram and TikTok. Those are my only real social, I guess my my Instagram's linked to Facebook too. So you can find me there too, I guess, if you're on Facebook, but it's literally just my Instagram feed. ah So yeah, I do a lot of um i do a lot of content on those two platforms.
Speaker: I have a whole series about fashion and looking at ah how fashion works for wheelchair users and ambulatory wheelchair users. I do a whole series on roles that are better disabled where I'll analyze theater and um try and give some inspiration for theater companies on on how to include disability in their storytelling.
Speaker: And I answer questions regularly. So if you have any questions, um I try to answer those as often as I can. But yeah, I'm very active and always always trying to to respond to people.
Speaker: Yes, i I love your content, especially we were talking earlier about, you know, kind of making some disability knowledge a little more mainstream. I think you do a great job at making it accessible to to people who haven't thought that way before about thank you accessibility. Yeah, I always try to like bring new people into the conversation. I try to make access and disability you know, not scary and not, you know, there's, there's, there's nothing uncomfortable about it. I try to bring people into that conversation and feel like there are no bad questions. Um, and that way they're asking me and not someone who doesn't want to answer those questions, right? Like I try to be that, that place, that, that safe space so that people can feel safe exploring something maybe that they have never thought about before.
Speaker: Absolutely. Well, thank you so much for joining me on the podcast today. yeah thank you so much for having me. This has been a blast. Before we wrap up my final episode of the podcast, I just wanted to take a moment to say some thanks. A huge thank you to Dr. Bernard, Daniel, and everyone at the Berkeley Institute for Accessible Arts Education for this amazing opportunity.
Speaker: I'd also like to thank everyone who has listened to my episodes, and I hope that you'll keep in touch. I can be found online on LinkedIn at my name, Jillian Request, that's J-I-L-L-I-A-N-R-A-Q-U-E-T, or or on Instagram at Gemini Jill, spelled G-3-M-I-N-I-J-I-L-L.
Speaker: You can also learn more about the Philemon M. D'Agostino Greenberg Music School at fmdgmusicschool.org or at fmdgmusic on all socials.
Speaker: There's some really exciting stuff coming up this fall, and I can't wait to share it with you. Until next time!
Speaker: Able Voices is a production of the Berklee Institute for Accessible Arts Education, led by me, Dr. Rhoda Bernard, the founding managing director. It is produced by Daniel Martinez del Campo.
Speaker: The intro music is by Kai Levin, and our closing song is by Sebastian Batista. Kai and Sebastian are students in the arts education programs at the Berklee Institute for Accessible Arts Education.
Speaker: If you would like to learn more about our work, find us online at berklee.edu. slash B-I-A-A-E or email us at B-I-A-A-E at Berkeley, that's L-E-E dot E-D-U.
