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Navigating Debt and Balance: Life After Dental School
24 Plays11 days ago
About the Hosts:
Dr. Savanah Craig and Dr. Ronnetta Sartor are the engaging hosts of "Beyond Graduation." Both are experienced dentists with valuable insights into the intersection of professional growth and personal finance in the dental industry. Dr. Savanah Craig continually explores the nuances of balancing student debt with career advancement, while Dr. Ronnetta Sartor brings her expertise as a practice owner and her perspective on financial management and wellness. Together, they foster discussions that resonate with early-career dentists navigating post-graduation challenges.
Episode Summary:
In this episode of "Beyond Graduation," Drs. Savanah Craig and Ronnetta Sartor delve into the often-taboo topic of finance, focusing on understanding and managing student loans, debt, and balancing financial obligations while pursuing a fulfilling career in dentistry. Their candid conversation touches upon the personal experiences of handling student loans, the emotional burden of debt, and the strategic financial decisions that come with owning a dental practice.
Dr. Sartor likens student loans to "the ex that you want to forget about," highlighting the ongoing challenge of coming to terms with financial commitments made in the past. The discussion emphasizes the importance of reevaluating financial priorities, understanding the difference between good and bad debt, and the necessity of having a robust financial plan. The hosts discuss influential financial philosophies, mentioning Ramit Sethi's approach of living a "rich life" and the concept of "dying with zero," advocating for a balanced life that doesn't sacrifice personal happiness for financial gain. They highlight the critical role of professional financial advisors in guiding new dentists through the complexities of managing debt while building a practice.
Key Takeaways:
- Understanding student loans as a persistent yet manageable financial element in a dentist's journey.
- The significance of distinguishing between good debt and bad debt while building a practice.
- Ramit Sethi's financial philosophy: spend extravagantly on what you love, and cut costs mercilessly on what you don't.
- Balancing professional ambitions, like owning a practice, with personal wellbeing and lifestyle goals.
- The importance of having professional financial guidance to prevent lifestyle creep and achieve long-term financial stability.
Connect with Us:
- Savanah Craig, DDS: @savanahcraigdds
- Ronnetta Sartor, DMD: @dr_sartor
- FutureDentists Beyond Graduation: @futuredentistsbeyondgraduation
- FutureDentists: @futuredentists
- IgniteDDS: @ignitedds and @ignitedds_coaching
- A-dec: @adecdental and https://www.a-dec.com/find-a-dealer
Tune into the full episode to explore the unique financial journeys of Dr. Craig and Dr. Sartor as they offer advice and insights for new dentists facing similar challenges. Stay connected for more enlightening discussions ahead in the "Beyond Graduation" series.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Smart Start Program
00:00:00
Speaker
ADEC's Smart Start program offers first-time practice owners their deepest discounts on equipment and furniture for two years, plus other savings and complimentary services. Ask your ADEC rep for details and start smart with ADEC.
00:00:13
Speaker
Join Drs. Savannah Craig and Renetta Sartor as we navigate life beyond graduation. Real conversations about forging our own paths in our early years in our careers.
00:00:24
Speaker
There's a reason it's called practicing dentistry. Welcome back to another episode of Beyond Graduation. i am Savannah Craig and with me as always, I'm Renetta Sartor.
Financial Themes: Balancing Work, Play, and Debt
00:00:34
Speaker
So this week's episode, i feel like it's potentially a taboo kind of topic, talking finances.
00:00:43
Speaker
um But we reached out to the Ignite team and asked them for some topics they would like to have us discuss. So today we're going to talk ah about like about money and how do you balance work and play with your with you know all the the fun debt we're in with money.
00:01:03
Speaker
student loans and houses and practices. And I don't know, I got a car payment, but we're putting it all out there. Renetta, I guess, let's start with what, what's your relationship to your student loan debt?
00:01:18
Speaker
That's a super easy question to just come out with. And how has that changed? Because I bet it's changed. Oh, boy. You said, what's my relationship? Yeah. It's like the eggs that you don't want.
00:01:30
Speaker
It's like. Okay, we're going there. Yeah, it's like the eggs that you want to forget about, but it's all they're always looming in the background, you know?
00:01:41
Speaker
It's like you want to forget it, but you know you can't. and ah And a different person made that decision. I don't know who I was when I had decided to take those loans out.
00:01:53
Speaker
I'm completely different than who I was. Completely, completely. don't know who she was. My frontal lobe was not fully formed. it It wasn't. It
Exploring Good vs. Bad Debt
00:02:03
Speaker
wasn't. You know, I might need to go get checked out if that means...
00:02:08
Speaker
They'll be forgiven. I don't think it's going to work out that way. We're stuck with them. Yeah, we're stuck with them. So maybe not in that way with the eggs, but you know, I just thought that was a little bit funny. No, that's very funny. To joke about it. But yeah, how about you? What's what's your relationship with yours?
00:02:25
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, they're looming. I feel like at one, it ebbs and flows between like, what am I going to do They're just there. You know, well, the money goes out every month.
00:02:38
Speaker
And then also like, the idea of like good debt versus bad debt. But then there's also like the way I was raised was like, debt is bad. And like, you know, you, should I should have paid off all of those student loans before I like bought a house and before you buy a practice and like all of those things.
00:02:59
Speaker
And then you like find out that that doesn't make any sense. Um, so like having to reconfigure your brain of like, it's just going to be this monthly payment as long as it's going to be. And I mean, I wish they would go away, but haven't figured out how to do that yet.
00:03:16
Speaker
No. If any of our listeners know, but let us know. Yeah. Yeah. If you figured out dump it. If you
Journey from Debt to Positive Net Worth
00:03:24
Speaker
got a magic pill, just s let us know how to get rid of them.
00:03:27
Speaker
But no, I completely like agree with you. Like, you know, it's, it's, it's so funny because we just were joking about it before we got on, but we talked about our net worth and how in order for me to kind of climb out of debt, I almost had to like not almost had to, I had to go more in debt. You truly had to go more. Like getting, getting to practice in ah the real estate and all that sort of stuff. And like now, even though it doesn't feel great, you know, i can look at my net worth and see, the okay, I'm starting to see positive when for so many years it was negative.
00:04:09
Speaker
And so just seeing how like that can change and, You know, I've kind of crossed over into that point. And then you kind of laugh since you're on the path to owning a practice. um
Financial Philosophies and Guilt-Free Spending
00:04:22
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What's been your your your feelings about it?
00:04:26
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I think at this point, I'm just like, just more debt. Just bring it on. Whatever. But I think at at one point, like Adam and I laugh because when I was in dental school,
00:04:39
Speaker
We were like, okay, we're going to graduate, you know, we're going to go to residency. I'll graduate. And then we will live on your salary and we will just put all of mine towards my debt. And we'll just live in this one bedroom apartment. And like, you know, we'll just suffer.
00:04:58
Speaker
and then you do the math and you're like, okay, we're going to have to suffer for a long time. And you've already eaten ramen for how many years now, right? Yes, yes. Someone is going to come on here some, you know, boomer financial advisor and be like... They're going tear us apart. Yes.
00:05:17
Speaker
Yeah. Dentistry is a lovely career. We make good money. we also work our booties off to make that money. And like, we actually make that money with our hands, right? Like my body makes that money. So I'm trying to, you and I have talked about this, like, get over that guilt of like, my income is higher than like, all of my family growing up combined. You know what i mean? And like,
00:05:44
Speaker
That's what they wanted for us, right? You always want better for your kids, but like processing that and then also being like, I make good money. i am also six figures in student loan debt, housing debt. All the things.
00:05:59
Speaker
All the things. And you just, the bills, the bills come every month and it's fine. So how do you navigate... Supposedly fine. Work, play, and debt.
00:06:10
Speaker
Yeah. Supposedly okay. so Things are supposedly fine. We've had some talks with like different financial advisors and things who have like let us know that we are on the right path and like setting like budgets.
00:06:25
Speaker
One of my favorite like finance people is Ramit Sethi. Are you familiar? No, but I will definitely look. Okay. So Ramit's whole philosophy is.
00:06:36
Speaker
Oh, yes. I do know. Yes. I will teach you to be rich, like living a rich life. I love that. I've read some books, actually. You should listen his podcast. but Shout out to Ramit. Ramit,
Balancing Financial Goals with Lifestyle
00:06:47
Speaker
sponsor us or something.
00:06:49
Speaker
I think we would be a very interesting guest on his podcast. So anyway, we're going to tag him in this episode. but I'm sure he's going like, what are you guys doing? Yeah, listen, his I'm sure he has much better things to do than answer my Instagram DMs. But anyway, Ramit's philosophy is like...
00:07:06
Speaker
you should not live a smaller life than you have to. And like, there's no valor in like suffering to suffer. And so his podcast, he'll bring on these like multi-millionaire couples who fight every day about like the cost of but like bananas.
00:07:25
Speaker
And so he's like, your money psychology like doesn't just change one day when you've become wealthy. And so I think you've got to sort of like micro dose living your life.
00:07:36
Speaker
while also like living living within your means too. So I think that's what we've tried to do is just like we have, we know how much we have to pay in these bills every month and then how much we need to save for retirement and savings. And then Ramit's big thing is guilt-free spending and like each of you should have your own guilt-free spending and then joint guilt-free spending. And All of the rest of your money is accounted for. So do what you want with that and don't feel bad about it. And so I think we've just navigated like Adam and I both come from like save everything you can backgrounds and learning like you can't take it with you. i think the other philosophy I've been really into is Die with Zero. That's another really good book.
00:08:19
Speaker
Yeah. So I think you've got to know you can't just be totally blind to how much your bills are. um But like get it all on auto pay. savings and certain as savings to Right, right.
00:08:31
Speaker
And then from there, like, you can work and play and save up for big things. And, you know, Amazon, too many cat toys to you. I think while you were talking, the image in my brain was, and know, we've all seen the couple in Paris on like older and sleeping. Yes.
00:08:51
Speaker
And so that image is like burned into my brain. Because like you said, we we all have like, been conditioned to, okay, save, save, save, work hard right now, delay gratification, delay it, delay it, delay it until you're older and retired. And the truth of the matter is how do we know that when we get to retirement age or for that matter, 10 years from now, we'll be in good enough health
00:09:22
Speaker
to have these experiences. So I think it's
Lifestyle Choices: Spending and Saving
00:09:25
Speaker
finding the balance. But one of the things that you said that I thought was amazing is making sure that early on, before you start to get that lifestyle creep.
00:09:35
Speaker
Yeah. You have the right people in your corner in terms of advisors from a financial perspective that can say, okay, you know, here are your goals and this is where you want to go, but this is how you get there. So absolutely this is what you need to save and this is what you need to be doing.
00:09:55
Speaker
The other thing we were just talking about at work was like, and and for me, I'm a big fan, but they talk about like, his thing is like spend extravagantly on the things you love and cut costs mercilessly on the things you don't.
00:10:10
Speaker
And we were talking at work up, like, you know, we'll splurge on whatever, whatever. we travel a lot, but like, we don't fly first class or like, whatever, you know what i mean? Like, you got to find those balance of or like, I'm gonna go to Costco and buy my paper towels in bulk.
00:10:27
Speaker
But we'll go out for a nice cocktail. And you know what I mean? You just find those things. Right. Or I'm not going to eat out all the time. I'll cook at home and save that money. And I'm not gonna go on a whole lot of vacations. But
Income Differences and Financial Responsibilities
00:10:45
Speaker
when I do go on vacation,
00:10:47
Speaker
I'm going to have the experience that I want on vacation and not be i feel guilty about it. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I think it's it's all about finding that balance.
00:10:59
Speaker
How I don't know, and this might be very personal, but like, I'm sure you have friends that are like not in dentistry and have... different career paths and things. And like, for me, a lot of my friends started working four years out of college. And so like, we've delayed things, but then you get this lifestyle creep all of a sudden. So like, how have you navigated that with yourself and like with the people around you of, we do make good money as dentists, even though it took us a long time to get here and we do have the debt to go with it. So yeah. Have you had, have you had to navigate those things or how do you navigate those things?
00:11:36
Speaker
I think that's a really good question. i think in in some regards, it's kind of having that vulnerable conversation with some people. That's like, yeah, you kind of see the outside, but have no clue what's happening like internally or yeah just in general. Like, and we kind of talked about this earlier, but yes, we are dentists. It's a great profession.
00:12:01
Speaker
We are paid well. but with comes more responsibilities, kind of like the old adage, more money, more problems. Like yeah you have to pay for disability insurance and this insurance and that insurance. and you, you know, so it's like, yes, it's glamorous, but you know, the same way that you have costs to live in in your household, I do too, but I might have more going out than what you have because yeah
00:12:31
Speaker
the title of doctor and all of the things I need to have to protect myself, you know? Absolutely.
Balancing Ambition with Personal Principles
00:12:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's, it can be interesting. I think the other thing we were talking about earlier was like this idea of enough and like you and I are both very...
00:12:53
Speaker
goal oriented people and we like a challenge and we like to set a goal and setting like a production goal and all of these things but also you were talking about having these goals for your office but like what that might what that sacrifice might look like in other areas of your life and like my boss and I were talking the other day because he was like well if you so I work four days a week and he was joking and he was like if you work five days a week then you can retire 20 faster I'm like only if my production on those days is the same as the other days where most dentists I've talked to are like when they cut days their production actually increases because you're just getting rid of like fluff stuff but so how has this conversation of like
00:13:39
Speaker
Having these financial goals, and I think sometimes it's not even a financial goal necessarily, is like, just like my my practice is now at this level. And I want to get to the next. Yeah. Like, is it, is it, obviously it's a money thing too, but what was that conversation or what does that look like for you with trying to navigate that balance? It's always balance.
00:13:59
Speaker
I think a lot of it goes back to my why. Yeah. but in every aspect of my life. Like, you know, what's my why as it pertains to the business and my patients and my team? Yeah. What's my why at home for my family and i And the things that I'm not willing to bend on in terms of values.
00:14:25
Speaker
And so kind of to your point, yes, the business could probably get to a certain level, if I bend my values and things that I believe on believe in in in certain areas, but it's a hard no for me to do those things. So if it means it takes me a little bit longer to get to that goal, but I'm able to do it on my terms and the terms that, you know, I'm going to be able to look back and be proud yeah of how I got there.
00:14:59
Speaker
yeah for me,
Work-Life Balance: Happiness and Health
00:15:00
Speaker
that's what kind of keeps me grounded. And kind of the same thing with like at home, like like you said, oh yeah, I probably could get to that goal for sure if I work five to six days a week, but i just know that on a personal level that won't make me happy.
00:15:17
Speaker
And it's not all about being happy because we always have to do some things that we don't want to do, yeah you know, but in life at some point, having peace and happiness can be the goal.
00:15:33
Speaker
That's huge. Yeah. For some people that I think that's where I'm at. I'm at right now. youre Like, Yes, it is okay to have all of these goals, but if at the end of the day i don't have peace and I'm not happy, then is it really worth it?
00:15:49
Speaker
Yeah. And you have to know that for yourself of like, what, what are your non-negotiables? What is most important? And it might change. what's What's your take on it? No, I think that was spot on of like, I keep thinking David did a ah podcast recently where he was talking about like dentists these days are now like working to live instead of live to work.
00:16:12
Speaker
And yeah, the, the reason I go to work, I mean, I love what I do and I love having
00:16:21
Speaker
i'm I'm blessed to have the skills that I have and to be able to help people. But I also go to make money to fund the life I want to live to, you know? It's just true. this Yeah.
00:16:32
Speaker
Yeah. So I think you gotta, just like you said, you gotta know what's worth it and not worth it. And yeah, what at the end of the day or at the end of the next 10 years is a little bit more money sitting in a bank account worth it to like see your family struggle or to not have that peace at the end of the day. I don't...
00:16:51
Speaker
Or to not have your health. Because if you're just working all the time and you don't have time for yourself for self-care, something's got to give. And a lot of times it's going to be something with you, whether it's mental or physical. four what ah That hit really heavy. What a what a huge... I think we forget.
00:17:12
Speaker
we forget. che We're not robots. We can't just hit the the off button and then... Yeah, I think isn't that the irony of like, doctors make the worst patients, where the first thing we talked about was our own health.
00:17:29
Speaker
Yeah, the the whole thing of like, put on your own oxygen mask first. Like if I am unwell, my family is unwell, I can't take care of anybody. Wow. Yeah, prioritize your health. Why is that always the
Inviting Listener Experiences and Expert Advice
00:17:41
Speaker
last thing we think about?
00:17:44
Speaker
Maybe because we're we're young and it's like, oh yeah, we're healthy. So out of sight, out of mind, right? Yeah, but- Kind of like student student loans, right? Truly. But no, and I mean, if you're but if you're not taking care taking care of yourself now, you won't have that health in the future.
00:18:02
Speaker
So true. Man, we this one was full of some bombs. I'm i'm interested what people have to see. You know, I think financial planners are going to come here. Older dentists who are like, you should just grind seven days a week and pay off your loans.
00:18:17
Speaker
Yeah, come at us in the comments. I'm interested to Be nice, though. We're... we're we're patient on the on the On the opposite end of that spectrum, I'm very curious to hear from, you know, any of our listeners that feel what we're saying on a deeper level and just talk about what your journey has been like. um So let us know where we want to hear the good, the bad, the ugly. Yes.
00:18:42
Speaker
Also, Ramit, invite us to your podcast. Thanks. but Yes, we'll be there. You just, we'll make it work. We'll see you guys
Conclusion and Sponsor Messages
00:18:49
Speaker
next time. Thank you for joining us for this episode of Beyond Graduation. If you enjoyed this week's episode, be sure to share it with a friend.
00:18:57
Speaker
Connect with us on social media at Savannah Craig DBS and at Dr. Sartor. And remember, you are not alone on this journey. ADEC certified pre-owned equipment is a sustainable, affordable choice that makes genuine ADEC equipment available to every doctor.
00:19:14
Speaker
Each package is sold on a first-come, first-served basis. So if you see one you like, contact your dealer. For more information, go to www.adec.com backslash findadealer. Thank you for listening to Beyond Graduation brought to you by Ignite DDS and Future Dentists. This episode was sponsored by Ignite DDS Coaching. We build self-determined futures. For more information, please reach out to the Ignite DDS team.