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E189: Michael “Papaw” Chambers
5.3k Plays2 years ago
Michael Chambers-- there are many words to describe him: firefighter, hero, deacon, Papaw, dad, and… victim. He was so present in the lives of all who knew him and then he just disappeared. Was the scene in his garage a clue as to what happened or was it a red herring?
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Transcript
Introduction and Podcast Recommendation
00:00:00
Speaker
We have an excellent podcast suggestion for you this week that comes from our friend Kelly Jennings. With her background in law enforcement, she brings a needed perspective to true crime cases. Her show is called Unspeakable and is one you can find on your favorite podcasting app with a new episode every Wednesday. Here's a little about the show from Kelly herself.
00:00:29
Speaker
Welcome to Unspeakable, a true crime podcast where I tell stories of real crimes with real victims, whose cases are so shocking that many are left wondering how is this even real? I use my experiences in law enforcement, corrections, and combined with my years as a criminal justice educator, dig deep into complex cases of evil acts. Some so evil, many feel they are unspeakable.
00:01:00
Speaker
Unspeakable, a true crime podcast by Kelly Jennings can be found wherever you listen to your podcasts. But I have to warn you, if you're easily offended, then I'm not your girl. Listening discretion is
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Speaker
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Speaker
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Speaker
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Challenges Faced by First Responder Spouses
00:02:37
Speaker
The life of a first responder spouse comes with snares that most don't realize. It comes with a fear every time your spouse leaves for work that they will face dangers that you can't even begin to fathom. You pray for their safety.
00:02:55
Speaker
It comes with being alone or the sole parent for 24 hours at a time that never fails to fall on the days you need them the most with power outages, flat tires, birthday parties, and anniversaries. It comes with them continually worrying about the worst case scenario, even when tiny accidents happen because, well, they've seen the worst more than once.
00:03:22
Speaker
It comes with aches and pains from years of weight from the physical tools of the trade and heavy hearts paired with vivid memories of what they've seen. The invisible yet ever present mental toll that also comes as part of the job. I know because I've seen and felt it firsthand as a wife of a firefighter and I know I'm not alone.
The Mysterious Disappearance of Michael Chambers
00:03:49
Speaker
Despite all of the tolls we know,
00:03:52
Speaker
In our case this week, it wasn't the dangers of the firefighter job that led to disaster. In fact, the man at the center of our case had been retired for several years from the Dallas Fire Department. The dangers this man faced are still unknown, but his friends and family are nonetheless dedicated to finding out the answers to exactly that question. This is the case.
00:04:19
Speaker
of Michael Papaw Chambers.
00:04:58
Speaker
Welcome to Coffee and Cases where we like our coffee hot and our cases cold. My name is Allison Williams. And my name is Maggie Dameron. We will be telling stories each week in the hopes that someone out there with any information concerning the cases will take those tips to law enforcement. So justice and closure can be brought to these families.
00:05:17
Speaker
With each case, we encourage you to continue in the conversation on our Facebook page, Coffee and Cases podcast, because as we all know, conversation helps to keep the missing person in the public consciousness, helping keep their memories alive. So sit back, sip your coffee, and listen to what's brewing this week. Allison, I bet this case fit really close to home for you. It did. There were so many details that I was
00:05:45
Speaker
I could connect with. So, I mean, he's retired firefighter, so is my husband. You know, and I'm looking at pictures and I saw one picture and he's still wearing this navy blue t-shirt with the firefighter logo from their department on the chest and the blue pants and the baseball cap. And that's like Rodney's standard outfit most days still too. So yeah, I mean, there were just so many, even tiny details that
00:06:15
Speaker
I connected. Plus, in our case this week, I had to throw in that Michael Chambers nickname is Papaw because, you know, Rodney and I just a couple of years ago became grandparents and it's there's nothing like it. And I just thought it was so heartwarming and sweet that that was his nickname was Papaw. So I had to had to put it in there. What do your babies call Rodney?
00:06:45
Speaker
They call him Papa. Oh, so close. Yeah. And then, of course, I'm Nanu, which was supposed to be. I know it was supposed to be Nani. That's what we said we were going to be. But the first granddaughter, she said Nanu and so it stuck. So so, yeah, I'm Nanu.
00:07:07
Speaker
So by the time our case takes place on March 10th, 2017, 70 year old Michael Chambers had nine grandkids and six great grandkids.
00:07:23
Speaker
who all called him Papaw. And in fact, obviously there were so many who called him Papaw that even the adults who knew him had taken to calling him the same thing. And I mean, that makes sense because anytime the grandkids are around, I call Rodney Papaw and he calls me Nanu, you know? So he'll say, oh, what's Nanu doing over there in the kitchen? So, yeah. So he became Papaw to pretty much everyone.
00:07:52
Speaker
but I'm getting a little bit ahead of myself in talking about him. So I want to kind of step back and give you some background information. Michael Glenn Chambers had grown up in a small town in Texas with a population of less than 2,000 called Italy. Now don't be fooled because it looks like it's Italy, Texas. And I verified that it is pronounced Italy.
00:08:22
Speaker
Well, that's like us saying Versailles. Yeah, Versailles. He was born on November 27, 1946, and Michael Chambers graduated from Italy High School in 1965. And Maggie, even when he was younger, he was extremely active and involved in high school. He was in the FFA, and he played both football and basketball.
00:08:52
Speaker
So a very busy young man. Yes, he's busy all year long. Mike had married his high school sweetheart and they had two daughters, Sherry and Susie.
00:09:05
Speaker
So Sherry and Susie had big families of their own then, if he has nine grandkids. Well, we're going to get two more kids here in a few years. But yeah, with his first wife, he had two daughters, Sherry and Susie. And it was during this time that he was beginning his career as a firefighter in Dallas. It was a job he began in 1972.
00:09:30
Speaker
So just a few years after graduating from high school, he was known on the job for not backing down no matter the situation, so not showing fear, for always being present, for his kindness to everyone he interacted with, and for his cooking skills at the station, Maggie. Particularly his chicken enchiladas, which apparently everybody went nuts over.
00:09:57
Speaker
I love a good chicken enchilada and at my job there is a lady that I work with. She lives in
00:10:07
Speaker
El Paso, I'm pretty sure. And I'm pretty positive she is a first generation born American. I think she told me that, but I could be wrong. But her family is from Mexico and she gave me their chicken enchilada recipe with the green sauce. I've not tried it yet because everything that spicy gives me heartburn, but like thinking about it makes my mouth water.
00:10:30
Speaker
I can't wait. You're gonna have to invite us over when you make this. So yeah, he everybody loved him and his cooking and he was just he seemed like the kind of guy who everybody was just drawn to because he had a quick smile and just an easy nature to him.
00:10:52
Speaker
In nearly every interview with someone who knew Michael Chambers, they said something about how giving he was and that he would help anyone and everyone at any time who needed it. I mean, he kind of does sound like Rodney. Maybe that's just like quality of a firefighter because I feel like Rodney is so giving and would help people anytime they needed it. Yeah, yeah.
00:11:17
Speaker
And Michael was just a kind soul. Unfortunately, that easiness, I'm guessing, didn't carry over necessarily into his home life. I didn't read any reason why his first marriage didn't work, but it didn't last. But Mike was able to find love again when he was 33 with his second wife.
00:11:44
Speaker
She was about 10 years younger than him. So a little bit of a difference but not bad. But her name was Rebecca Erickson and of course soon became Rebecca Chambers. But she went by Becca for short. And obviously he's coming into the marriage with two daughters of his own. But Mike and Becca went on to adopt two sons
00:12:10
Speaker
of their own, John, and then four years later, Justin. Okay. So that's a big family. I love it. Yeah. By accounts from all who knew the couple, they were happy. And most people also noted that Mike would dote on Becca.
00:12:30
Speaker
like making her breakfast, making her dinner, opening the garage door when she was on her way home from work so he could be there waiting to help carry in her work things. She was a home health nurse or carrying groceries or whatever he needed to do to help out.
00:12:50
Speaker
Now, I didn't read if those actions were ones that he did throughout the entirety of the marriage or if those just kind of happened after he retired from the fire department in 2008. But even if it was after retirement, that's still a good nine years where that had been their routine.
Investigation and Theories on Chambers' Case
00:13:09
Speaker
It's sweet.
00:13:12
Speaker
Even more than his love and devotion in the role of husband, that same level of love and joy poured out of him in his other roles as father, grandfather, and then later great grandfather. So even though his knees were bad from so many years on the job,
00:13:33
Speaker
he was the first to still get down on the ground with the grandkids and great grandkids and to let them climb on his back to pretend like he's a horse just to be their personal jungle gym. Oh, it sounds like a great grandpa. I know. Yeah, I can just picture him now that I know what he looks like, you know, down on the ground and just letting them crawl all over him. Mm hmm.
00:13:58
Speaker
In his spare time when Mike wasn't pampering his family, he was splitting firewood on his property, performing in his gospel band called the joint heirs quartet at nursing homes and other area locations, working alongside his son-in-law, performing some of his Deacon duties at church, or doing something related to his love for classic cars.
00:14:25
Speaker
So still super busy. Yes. Yes. Very much so. So from what I read, Mike would find a car that needed to be fixed up. He would work on it. He would rebuild it. He would show it. He would win trophies because he had rebuilt it so well. And then he would just trade for a new one to start working on.
00:14:46
Speaker
And he had even joined a local car club, the Texas Most Wanted Car Club. So he had a lot of interests and he made friends easily wherever he went. So he had a wide circle of people who loved him. In the days and weeks leading up to March 10th, 2017, everything seemed normal to those who knew the couple. Yeah, I'm like sitting here trying to figure out what could be wrong. Yeah.
00:15:16
Speaker
I know and who would do something. On the Vanished podcast, host Marissa Jones interviewed one of Mike's granddaughters who said that just a couple of weeks before her grandfather went missing, he and Becca had come to visit her.
00:15:34
Speaker
And it had been just before nap time, so she was reading her son, so Mike's great grandson, a story. And she remembers Mike and Becca sitting there just cackling at the silly voices that she was making while she was reading. I'm one of those voice people too. That's why the grandkids love when I read a book.
00:15:56
Speaker
But she said there didn't seem to be anything amiss. Even in the days leading up to his disappearance, Mike was working on a car. He had been looking forward to attending a grandson soccer game on the 11th. However, by the evening of March 10th, a missing persons report had been filed for Michael Chambers and no one seemed to have any clue as to where he might be. Hmm.
00:16:27
Speaker
According to Becca, the morning of the 10th, she had spoken with her husband Mike before heading into work. She reports that he had mentioned something about working on a car and perhaps splitting some firewood on the property. Those were kind of, I guess, his plans for the day. These are the things he wants to give them. Yeah, very normal Mike things. Mike and Becca actually lived on a tract of land in Quinlan, Texas.
00:16:55
Speaker
of around 10 acres. That's quite a bit of land. And even though Quinlan is about an hour drive from Dallas, it's still considered to be within the Dallas-Fort Worth metropolitan area. Wow. I know.
00:17:11
Speaker
That's a large metropolitan area. Though, of course, Quinlan is rural and it's actually located near Lake Tawakani, which covers around 37,000 acres of land. So it was kind of a place Quinlan was close enough to a larger city where there could be things to do, but still rural, quiet, and quaint.
00:17:38
Speaker
It sounds like a pretty fun outdoors area. Mm hmm. It was. Yeah, there's lots of fishing and water sports and things like that that happened on the lake. After leaving for work, Becca had called Mike around 8 a.m. to ask that he run to Walmart. So there was a Walmart in Quinlan to pick her up some mascara. According to an investigation discovery report, Becca then next tried to text and call my
00:18:09
Speaker
around 5.50 PM to say that she was heading home from work. And I got the impression that that was kind of the routine that she would call on her way home. That's how he knew to have the garage door open and kind of be waiting to help carry things in or whatever. However, she said that call went straight to voicemail.
00:18:34
Speaker
When she arrived home at around 6.15, the garage door wasn't opened for her as it normally was. Okay, so immediately she's like, something's different. Exactly, yeah. She's used to seeing Mike's smiling face greeting her and helping her carry things inside. And instead, she gets home to a closed, locked, and dark home. And Mike's truck was parked in the driveway.
00:19:02
Speaker
Okay, that was going to be my question. Was his vehicle gone? But no. No, it's right there. So like you said, immediately she knew something was wrong. She said that she walked through the house calling for Mike, but he didn't respond. And she spotted the new mascara in the home. So that told her that he had gone out and been home at least
00:19:25
Speaker
once if he did go out again. And so she's thinking, well, maybe he stepped out with somebody or somebody had called and they needed help because remember, he's a helper, right? So if somebody said, hey, I need your help, he would have gone. So next, Becca said she called several people who might know where Mike would be.
00:19:48
Speaker
According to the sources that I read, Mike was a creature of habit and routine. So he was most often with just a handful of people. Because if he were somewhere else or with someone different, he would have let Becca know or would have left a note about where he would be. And she didn't report any notes that had been left behind.
00:20:15
Speaker
So, yeah, she started making phone calls. She made a call to John. Remember, that's one of their sons. Because he and Mike would frequently have lunch together, but he hadn't seen or heard from his dad all day. Next, she called daughter Susie.
00:20:40
Speaker
because Mike sometimes helped Susie's husband David with floor restoration work. But Susie hadn't seen her dad either. Becca then called someone from the car club. Still no luck locating Mike.
00:20:58
Speaker
It was then, accounts say, that Becca went to a neighbor's house. The neighbor was actually retired law enforcement to ask if she could borrow their four-wheeler. Why? Because she recalled that Mike mentioned something about firewood. And so she wanted to ride around their property just in case he'd had an accident. Because remember, they live on 10 acres. Right. Because I'm picturing we have one of those
00:21:28
Speaker
pear trees or whatever. The invasive ones that somebody planted in our house and it split last year, like in half. And then with the wind and rain we had a few days ago, another portion of it split off.
00:21:42
Speaker
And so like when he's cutting firewood, I'm like picturing Anthony just, you know, in my backyard and I can see it from the window cutting up firewood, but I forget they're on a huge piece of property. They are, yes. And heavily wooded. So yeah, she asks if she can borrow this four wheeler to kind of ride around and see if she can locate Mike. After searching much of the property with the help from the neighbors,
00:22:07
Speaker
They actually came back home because they didn't see Mike or a sign of him anywhere. And now is when
00:22:15
Speaker
Becca decided to check the workshop, like the garage where Mike would work on his classic cars. So she said the door was locked, so she unlocked the door, and that's when she saw something. Oh, God. She saw Mike's wallet, his keys, and the blue baseball cap that he always wore lying in the place where he always laid them when he was working on the cars.
00:22:46
Speaker
So he had clearly been there. He just wasn't there now. She also saw something on the ground that she pointed out to the others, to the neighbors who were over there with her, as potentially being blood or transmission fluid, which is also red in color. So she says something like, is that blood or is that transmission fluid? Was it a lot? Well,
00:23:15
Speaker
The amount of fluid that was there, it was more than there would be if it was blood from like a neck or a small cut, but it wasn't egregious or anything that looked like a fatal amount. So it's like somewhere in between.
00:23:40
Speaker
They did soon determine that it was actually blood.
00:23:48
Speaker
There was also in this garage workshop, a wooden dowel rod with blood on it, including a bloody hand. Okay. We need to be calling 911 now. And they did. Yeah. It was around 6.55 PM that law enforcement, the Hunt County Sheriff's Office was called to the scene. And when was the last time she had spoke with him when she was leaving work? Yeah.
00:24:17
Speaker
So she, I know, so anytime really in between there, we know that she tried to call him sometime around five something and he didn't answer. It went straight to voicemail. And so I guess they've been looking for close to an hour before law enforcement gets called.
00:24:40
Speaker
Okay. Hearing about Becca's description of the day, law enforcement decided to request video footage from Walmart's security cameras. Good. Right. Because we know she said I need something from there and it's in the home. And sure enough, there was Mike making the purchase and exiting the Quinlan Walmart around 11 15 a.m.
00:25:07
Speaker
And the video showed no one was following him. No one looked suspicious in the store. Other cameras at Walmart showed him getting into his vehicle and leaving the parking lot again. Nobody followed him? Nope. Nobody's following him. Nobody seems suspicious.
00:25:27
Speaker
We obviously, like I said, know that he made it home from that trip because of the mascara and the other purchased items that were found in the couple's home. They also found the receipt in the trash can. So we know he at least made it home from that. In questioning neighbors, law enforcement were also able to determine that a close neighbor had arrived home from work on the 10th around 3pm
00:25:54
Speaker
and had proceeded to do yard work outside for some time afterward without seeing or hearing anything suspicious. And so that led police to believe that whatever had happened to Michael Chambers had happened sometime between noon and 3 p.m.
00:26:15
Speaker
Okay, and I have a question. So this car workshop place that he has, that's on their property? Like he can walk there? Yes. Okay. Interesting. So, I mean, I guess that explains why he didn't pick up when she called because if we're following their timeline, something had already happened to him. Right. Sometime between noon and three is what they're saying.
00:26:39
Speaker
But law enforcement soon discovered some very odd things about the crime scene.
00:26:47
Speaker
When Mike worked in this multi-car workshop, he almost always left one of the doors up. And I know Rodney does this, I don't know if Anthony does if he's in the garage, either to let fumes out or whatever he's doing, or at least to get some airflow in the garage. So you want to know one thing that happened to me? Okay, this is totally like
00:27:12
Speaker
tell me you grew up poor without actually saying you were poor. So we did not have a garage at my house. Like I had to walk downhill like behind my grandparents house to where we parked cars. Like we can't even pull a cart to my house until we did like some landsc- like excavating when I was in high school. So when we moved to Frankfurt we had a garage there and that's the first time I ever had a garage that
00:27:40
Speaker
you know I parked a car in and I was like it was in winter and I was like I'm gonna go ahead and start my car because it's cold and that way when I leave for work it'll be warm when I get in there. I did not realize I needed to like crack the garage door open. Oh no Maggie. When I went in there I was like
00:28:03
Speaker
Because there's so much carbon monoxide. I was like, not me trying to like poison myself. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. Lesson learned. So, you know, he normally leaves the door open. But when Becca arrives home, the garage doors were all closed. Mm hmm.
00:28:27
Speaker
But there were other details about the workshop that didn't add up for investigators.
00:28:34
Speaker
While there was the blood and the bloodied wooden dowel, there were no other signs of struggle either in the house nor in the workshop. Nothing was out of place. Which is weird because you would think if he's someone's obviously hit him presumably in the head with this wooden rod, so you would think there would have been
00:28:59
Speaker
some kind of struggle unless he was surprised or it was somebody he knew maybe. Right. Even then. So initially law enforcement considered maybe Mike was the victim of a robbery. Yeah as well it's there. Well so I didn't read
00:29:21
Speaker
Most of the sources I read said there was not cash in Mike's wallet, but one source said that there was. But even that, if there was no cash, I'm sure he had expensive tools in his workshop. He did, yeah. So they ended up discovering that, well, right inside the console of his truck, which is parked right outside in the driveway, there was $1,000 in the console that was still there.
00:29:46
Speaker
And like you said, all of these expensive tools, classic cars in this workshop, none of which were touched. And I mean, surely if somebody wanted to rob Mike, they could have profited much more from those items than any small amount that he had in his wallet if he, you know, had any in his wallet. So robbery doesn't seem to be the motivation in whatever happened to Michael Chambers.
00:30:15
Speaker
As some detectives were going over the scene, others were going into town to check out surveillance footage from other area stores to see if, you know, maybe Mike made more stops after Walmart. Can we narrow down this window even more? However, Mike wasn't seen on any other store footage.
00:30:39
Speaker
So those detectives who were at the house made even more bizarre discoveries in the meantime. Along with Mike himself, his cell phone was missing. Which we know went straight to voicemail. Potentially a tarp from the garage. We'll talk more about that later. As was his driver's license
00:31:07
Speaker
taken from his wallet. That's random. Yeah, I don't know about you Maggie, but I almost never take my license out of my wallet. In fact, other than being places where I have to show my license to prove my identity, like if I go to a new doctor or something like that, I don't know if I ever take my driver's license out. Yeah, same.
00:31:34
Speaker
Police were also dumbfounded by that detail, but not as much as the details surrounding the blood found in the workshop.
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Speaker
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Ready to combat dehydration track here today and feel the difference for yourself. Use code coffee and cases for 20% off your order. So the blood that was found Maggie didn't look like
00:33:59
Speaker
normal blood that you would happen upon at a crime scene. OK, interesting. Nor did it even look like blood you'd find if you accidentally cut yourself or something like that. So there are several reasons why. So first let me explain them to you. And then I'm going to show you an image. In Sleuth Hounds we will post this on social media. So first is that the blood was bright red.
00:34:30
Speaker
And I didn't know this until I started doing some research, but bright red blood is arterial or oxygenated blood, while venous blood is darker red. So like what they draw when they draw your blood is darker.
00:34:50
Speaker
versus arterial blood, which is oxygenated. Arterial bleeds are caused most commonly by penetrating injuries though, which are like wounds with which the blood comes out in spurts because it's coming out as your heart is beating and pulsing.
00:35:11
Speaker
Right, so keep in mind what that would look like. If you get a wound where it's spurting when my heart beats spurt, spurt, spurt. Look at the image from the workshop blood. No, this looks like drips.
00:35:28
Speaker
Yeah. So for it to be arterial, generally speaking, those come in those skirts. Like a mist. Mm-hmm. And that's not what you see. Yeah, the blood in this picture definitely doesn't look like blood that was spurting out. But it is bright red. Yeah. So in my mind, the only thing that could be bright red but not spurting would be something like a nose bleed.
00:35:59
Speaker
Okay, and I am prone to nosebleeds. Oh, are you good? I mean, not good. Not good, Maggie, but you can't auto-use this because, you know, I was thinking it could be from a nosebleed.
00:36:15
Speaker
I've only ever had one nosebleed in my life. And I noticed or felt something on my lip and kind of wiped it away to see blood before it got on my clothes. I feel like when you get nosebleeds, you would probably, I don't know, notice it before it would become a big pool.
00:36:37
Speaker
on the ground. So Slootown's in this picture that you'll see there's like one area where blood is kind of pooled, though it's not very large. I would be interested to know. And then the rest isn't true. Yeah, like the size of that. Like is that? With a ruler. What is that?
00:36:56
Speaker
Yeah, like six inches, four inches. Because I have had nosebleeds like, I mean, mine are so bad that even when I was small, I have to put cold Vaseline inside of my nostrils because that keeps my nose moisturized. But apparently I guess like the vessels or whatever are close to the surface of my nose. And they were like that with my brothers too. So we're just really prone to nosebleeds.
00:37:22
Speaker
But I'm wondering if a couple things. One, because like if I blow my nose and it's dry, it will come out like that big spurt. Oh, so it does kind of glows. Yeah. And then I'll drip like I'm holding it to get to the bathroom and it'll drip like those drops. Or I wonder if they even maybe
00:37:47
Speaker
They're dripping and then where that bigger spot is, that's like they coughed up a blood clot or blew out a blood clot. Interesting. Well, let me tell you some other unexplainable details about the blood. So if you look closely, then you will see exactly kind of what you were already noticing that there's no
00:38:13
Speaker
splatter with the droplets. There's no spray, like you were mentioning. If a six foot two inch mic is standing and his nose is bleeding, then I feel like those drops aren't going to land in perfect circles. Like gravity is going to hit with force. Maybe. Yeah, because otherwise I feel like it would hit with force and spread.
00:38:45
Speaker
Right. This is almost kind of like whatever they hit him in the head with. They're holding it and it's close to the ground and it's dripping off just a couple inches from the ground. Maybe it's dripping from if he's hit whatever he's hit with. Yeah. Well blood spatter experts were later brought in.
00:39:08
Speaker
And they would say that the blood appeared as though, because it's in these, it's bright red and it's in these perfectly round droplets, it would appear as though the blood had some sort of anticoagulant in it, like a blood thinner. But Mike had blood thinner? Nope, he had no prescription for blood thinners. Additionally, the blood was found in this area of the workshop leading toward the door.
00:39:38
Speaker
but it abruptly stopped just a couple feet before reaching the door and it wasn't found outside. So maybe then he was wrapped up into something or picked up? We will talk about that. We will talk about that. First, let's say that this were a nosebleed or like something as innocent as that. If that were true,
00:40:09
Speaker
Why, you know, because I'm thinking, OK, why might it have stopped? Well, maybe you got something in it or you tilted your head back or you've done something that's keeping it away from the ground. But if it is something like a nosebleed, why wouldn't Mike have grabbed some of the shop rags for his nose? Yeah, because I'm sure they would have been close by or even like his t-shirt. And even if he tilted his head back and that's why it abruptly stops,
00:40:38
Speaker
Why would he have walked outside of the garage instead of over to the shop sink to clean up? Oh, good point. I mean, why not go into the house? Yeah, and then I feel like if he did have a nosebleed and he went to the house to clean up, they could find traces of his blood in the sink. And they didn't. I mean, why wander off with your cell phone and just your driver's license from your wallet?
00:41:05
Speaker
And then what about that bloody dowel rod? Yeah, that is really peculiar, all of that. So Hunt County Sheriff Meeks stated, as reported in an investigation discovery article by Catherine Townsend, quote, my thoughts were that someone had hit him on the head with the dowel rod and had taken him, end quote. So that's what he's thinking initially.
00:41:31
Speaker
Instead of leading to answers, though, Maggie, tests would later come back to show that the blood on the ground, as well as the blood on the dowel rod, including the bloody handprint, belonged to Mike himself. OK, hold on. So the handprint is found on the wooden rod. Correct. And the wooden rod
00:42:02
Speaker
That's Mike's bloody handprint on this wooden rod. Yes, which is just like leaning somewhere in the garage. Was there any other blood, like any other person's blood on there? Maybe he hit somebody with it after he was it. Okay. Only his. So then I'm thinking why grab the rod? Right. Obviously you're bleeding from something ahead of time.
00:42:30
Speaker
So that doesn't make much sense to me. Luckily, unlike some of the cases we cover, law enforcement were out in full force trying to find out what may have happened to the beloved papaw. They brought in helicopters to search the rest of the property, but they found no further clues. They brought in bloodhounds.
00:42:53
Speaker
to search for Mike's scent. The hounds did trace his scent to a corner of the property that was near a culvert, but the trail ended there. So despite the oddity with the blood, some people are still wondering, could Mike have been abducted? Had he been brought to that corner of the property and then maybe placed in a car? And that's why the dog stopped.
00:43:23
Speaker
Yeah, but I mean, his scent will probably be all over that property. I mean, I would think so. Could he have accidentally injured himself in the workshop and then been, you know, confused and wandered off on his own? Maybe, but I just feel like with the weird things that are missing, I don't know if that really makes sense either.
00:43:56
Speaker
And with little else to go on, since nobody else's blood was found there, his blood isn't found elsewhere. There are no strange tire marks. He has no known enemies. There's nothing that's out of place. Law enforcement's next attempt at answers was to look at cell phone data since his phone was missing.
00:44:19
Speaker
So they're thinking maybe the last ping will show where he may be, or maybe he did make some phone calls. They found that the last ping to Mike's phone was around 5.55 PM, which was around the time when Becca said that she called and texted Mike to let him know that she was on the way home from work. So even if, let's say my phone is dead,
00:44:49
Speaker
and you called my phone, it would still pick up a ping? I think, I don't think so. So somebody hit the F you button and send her to voicemail. Potentially or couldn't answer or something. And then it's obviously turned off. Because when I hear it goes straight to voicemail, which is what she said, right?
00:45:18
Speaker
That that to me is it does not even ring like your phone is dead or it's turned off. Right. And it doesn't even ring. Right. Because if I call my mom and she doesn't answer and she'll be like, well, why didn't you call me? I'm like, I did. But it went to your voicemail. That's different than going straight to voicemail versus going to voicemail. Yeah. So I don't know. I also don't know if she texted first.
00:45:43
Speaker
And then she tried to call. And so maybe the text pings. The sheriff had actually later tried to call the phone and obviously it again had gone straight to voicemail. And even those details were confusing the family because they've stated that Mike always had his cell phone charged and on his person.
00:46:11
Speaker
And you know, we're talking, I mean, if he charged it overnight, as we would assume he would, and something happens to him between noon and three, I wish things just happened. So why was the battery dead or it turned off? The last ping on his phone placed him near a bridge spanning the lake near his house.
00:46:41
Speaker
And it was a place that they'd already searched in their investigation, because again, it's near his house. However, investigators searched the area again, only to come up empty handed. Are they like searching? So does this bridge go over the lake? Mm hmm. It's called Two Mile Bridge. I don't know if that means it's two miles long. So I wonder if they like looked in the water for his phone.
00:47:10
Speaker
I know that would be finding a needle in a haystack. Right. I'm pretty sure they did send divers, but I don't know how extensively or what portion of it was searched. Obviously, rumors began swirling, as they often do when there are cases like this one with no clear or obvious answers. And some of those rumors pointed a little close to home.
00:47:37
Speaker
So this seems like a perfect time to start talking about theories. Oh, are we going to name? Oh, I'll just wait. Oh, wait. OK. I know some of them are already ones going to be that he committed suicide. I already know that's going to be a theory. Yeah, it is. So we'll start with that one. So theory number one is that Michael Chambers committed suicide. OK.
00:48:01
Speaker
While some of Mike's family and friends have been the biggest and loudest opponents to this theory, law enforcement believe in the validity of this theory. Well, I mean, I'm not trying to say anything bad about law enforcement, but yes, because then you can just cases closed.
00:48:21
Speaker
He committed suicide. Right. Law enforcement have even proposed that Mike had taken his driver's license so that his body could easily be identified after committing suicide. I read in several sources that Sheriff Meeks has stated that police discovered something in their investigation
00:48:47
Speaker
that could be a motive for Mike to commit suicide. Okay. But if we're supporting the suicide theory and not a homicide theory, then why can't we share what we have found? They said because it's still an open investigation. So they have never disclosed what that something is. So I can't tell you because I don't know. We don't know.
00:49:10
Speaker
Law enforcement have also intimated that Mike had severe depression, though I have not heard this claim being corroborated by family nor by a medical professional. And I feel like his wife would at least know if he's taking... I feel like there would be record. Their theory is that Mike rode a bike
00:49:36
Speaker
and I'll tell you why here in a bit, rode a bike to the bridge where his cell phone pinged that he then threw the bike in and then jumped over the bridge off of the bridge himself. Okay, I think a bicycle would be easier to find in this lake than a cell phone and his body. I would think so too. Yeah. Also, is it common
00:50:03
Speaker
to drown oneself. Because I mean, that's essentially what's going to happen, right? I mean, this bridge isn't up high enough that the impact would kill him. That would not be the choice I would make. So I wouldn't think that it's as common. I don't want to be completely dismissive of the theory. There is a detail that does seem to support it.
00:50:31
Speaker
So when investigators were able to triangulate data from Mike's phone, they were able to see that Mike had traveled to this location almost eight miles from his home, moving around two to four miles per hour. Obviously, they argued that is much too slow for a car to travel if it were an abduction.
00:50:58
Speaker
Oh, so hence the bicycle theory. Hence they think, yes, that he had taken a bike and ridden it from his house to this bridge. But that would mean it would have taken almost three hours to get from his house to this bridge at that rate. And one, do they have a bicycle that's missing from their property?
00:51:24
Speaker
did not get a clear answer on that. Some sources said yes, others said no. Also, I don't know, but I think when you make the decision to commit suicide, we've talked about this in some of the other theories where the person was like on the train tracks to remember that one. Why, I don't think you would
00:51:51
Speaker
take the long way of doing it. I think it would be like you've decided and you're doing it. So why take three hours to get to the destination that you have chosen. That does seem odd. I also have some other problems with this theory. First is that I read that the bridge is less than 10 feet above the water. Yeah. So this is not a height at which a fall would kill you if you jumped. Second,
00:52:21
Speaker
is that in this entire two to three hours that it had taken him to travel from his home to the bridge, whether on bike or on foot, not a single person recalls passing him nor seeing him. Well, that's true too, hadn't thought of that. Third, Mike had bad knees from his firefighting days. I really don't see him cycling nor walking that long of a distance. I mean, it is plausible, but eight miles,
00:52:51
Speaker
Yeah, and you would have to be in fairly good shape to bike that distance. I would think so. And then fourth, and most importantly, if law enforcement's whole theory was that Mike took his license so he could be easily identified by committing suicide, why would he then have thrown his bike in the water, making it harder to find him?
00:53:17
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Why would you not have just left it on the bridge? And then they would have been like, oh, that's right. Here we go. Exactly. Those two details don't go together in my mind. I know you're going to talk about it, but also the blood, which I'm sure we'll get there. But right. Why that? We're kind of get to that in theory, too. A private investigator, Phillip Klein, who was later hired by Mike's daughter, Susie,
00:53:46
Speaker
also does not believe in the suicide theory, stating instead that maybe Mike's things had been thrown over the bridge there, and that's why the pings stop. Like if a phone is then introduced to water and it kind of fritzes out. That's interesting. Also, if this is a suicide, like you said, why all of the blood at home?
00:54:17
Speaker
And speaking of the blood, unfortunately, detectives in the case did send it off to get verification that it belonged to Michael Chambers, but they did not have coagulation testing done on it to see if there were, I don't know.
00:54:35
Speaker
So, by the time, even though Sheriff Meeks originally thought, you know, maybe he got hit over the head, after that testing comes back and it's all proven to be Mike's blood, per the Catherine Townsend article for Investigation Discovery, Sheriff Meeks stated, quote, this was not an abduction and it's not going to be a homicide. He left on his own, end quote. Hmm.
00:55:04
Speaker
And there are some in Mike's family who do say that the theory of suicide is possible, but daughter Susie disagrees completely, feeling that foul play is the only feasible theory to her. I mean, I do think suicide is a possibility. I don't know how we tie the blood at home into that, unless like he attempted to do that at home and then that wasn't successful. And this is like his backup plan.
00:55:33
Speaker
I just feel like, I feel like it would take an awful lot to get to that point with when your whole life kind of revolves around your grandkids. Yeah. I just, and my thing is, if we're so sure he left on his own, then why is this still an open investigation? Exactly. You obviously are not so too sure.
00:55:59
Speaker
Theory two is that Michael Chambers staged his own death so he could leave and start a new life. Okay.
00:56:09
Speaker
This theory is primarily based on three things. The first is a memory from Mike's son-in-law, who recalls that one time when they were watching an investigation discovery show, he was watching it with Mike, that somebody was committing pseudocide, which is faking one's own death, and that Mike had made a comment that it would be easy to disappear and make it look like an accident.
00:56:37
Speaker
Well, I'm glad he thinks it would be because I am not smart enough to do that. I'd leave a hair trail because I love so much hair. But to me, though, I mean, given the context, that comment doesn't seem off putting. I feel like it would seem more bizarre if it were made, you know, just when you're watching Gilmore Girls. Right.
00:56:57
Speaker
Right. Not when you're watching Investigation Discovery. Because I remember one time I was watching Unsolved Mysteries with my, it was like on the TV at my aunt and uncle's house when we were all out there. And my uncle who's like, like, like a papal, like papal, said, well, if I was going to kill somebody, I'd just dig an empty grave a couple feet deeper and hide a body in there. And like, it was like, if he had said that when we're watching, you know,
00:57:24
Speaker
a sitcom, then I'd be like, okay, weird. But when you see it, when you're watching Unsolved Mysteries, you're like, oh, okay. Exactly. The second detail that leads some people to think he staged his own death was the blood. So some experts have argued that the only way for the droplets to have been as perfect as they were would be that
00:57:51
Speaker
if the blood had been in some sort of vial and then strategically and carefully placed, like, dropped there. Okay, my thing with this, though, firefighters respond to a lot... They do. ...of accidents. They respond to suicides and all kinds of stuff, yeah. So I would think he would know how to make it look believable. I agree. And he would know that detail is not believable. I would agree with that, too.
00:58:21
Speaker
The third detail, though, is that his quote unquote bike ride to the bridge isn't the first time that he had been to the bridge that day. Cell phone analysis showed that he had gone to the two mile bridge earlier that morning, that he had stopped just past the bridge and that he had stayed there for about 10 or 15 minutes.
00:58:48
Speaker
before continuing on and then coming back to that same spot that afternoon because his cell phone last pinged there. So there you have to go over this bridge to go to Walmart or anything like that. I don't believe so. I don't believe because I'm just thinking like my dad.
00:59:12
Speaker
When he, if there's no one coming and he goes over like a bridge, he'll stop and see, you know, like lean out of his little window in his vehicle to see if he, what fish he sees swimming. So could it have just been something like that? I wonder. Maybe. It could have been something like that. But of course, those who believe this theory, they're saying, Oh, you know, was he thinking about or planning something?
00:59:40
Speaker
And that's why he went there first and then he's coming back to actually carry it out. Right. And to argue this point, his family have said that, you know, even if there were
00:59:54
Speaker
elements to his life that he wasn't happy with, that he cared so deeply about his children, his grandkids, and his great grandkids that he would have never done such a thing to just leave and start a new life. It's also their argument about the suicide. I mean, he had a grandson's soccer game the very next day. And they're saying, OK, well, let's say he was going to run off and start a new life or whatever.
01:00:23
Speaker
If he's going to stage something and turn his phone off anyway, why not just leave it behind? Yeah. Yeah. Why take it with you? Why take your driver's license? Just leave it all behind. Yeah. So that part doesn't really- I even think the staged blood doesn't even really fit the staging his own death. Like why even do that? Like you could have just left. Right. Just disappear.
01:00:49
Speaker
So now we're gonna get into the theories related to foul play. And there are three that I'm gonna talk about. Theory three is an abduction. This theory is supported by the private investigator who was hired by the family. So in the Klein Files podcast, private investigator Philip Klein notes that he spoke with the blood spatter experts and that they identified the pattern in the blood
01:01:18
Speaker
has something that they call a dog walk pattern, because it's going kind of back and forth. And they proposed, he said, that the larger spot of blood could have been a blow, like you mentioned early on in the episode, to the head, and that Mike had then been picked up by two perpetrators. So think of him like kind of hanging upside down.
01:01:44
Speaker
Right. So it's closer to the ground. You mentioned crawling earlier. So if one perpetrator were holding him by the feet and the other by the arms and that the swinging kind of pattern is the body being carried out.
01:02:01
Speaker
that may have produced that pattern. And it definitely would have taken two people to manhandle, again, six foot, two inch, 225 pound Michael Chambers. To explain the abrupt stop of the blood a couple of feet before the workshop door, Klein states that before he even had a chance to tell the blood spatter experts, they asked if a tarp or anything of the sort had been missing.
01:02:31
Speaker
And when Klein said that he confirmed that there was, so he was the source of that piece of information that I mentioned earlier. I didn't corroborate, I couldn't corroborate it in my other sources, but the private investigator hired by the family is the source who said that there was also a tarp missing. Yes. So he said that there was, and then he said that these blood spatter experts indicated that
01:02:58
Speaker
it stopped likely because Mike had been placed on the tarp and then carried out of the workshop that way. Okay. Cause at first I was like, how are they, wouldn't there be like another larger spot if they laid them down and maybe you rolled them onto it, but they placed him directly on the tarp then picked up. But this is the middle of the day. Like does he have neighbors? He does. But I guess most of them were at work because the one closest one doesn't get there until three. Yeah.
01:03:26
Speaker
And then, because I'm thinking, you know, if Mike had hurt himself in the workshop versus foul play, why wouldn't he have, like, why would he have taken a bike, which is so much slower than his truck, to get help if this, if the blood is the result of an accident? Maybe he was, maybe he was just really, really confused. I guess he could have been. Whatever happened.
01:03:55
Speaker
I don't know. But then if that's the case, why does the blood stop? That's true. But why is there no struggle? I'm sure that's what you're about to say. It was, yeah.
01:04:09
Speaker
It doesn't answer, if this is an abduction, why there wasn't the sign of struggle. It doesn't answer why- And did they like, you're going the same way I'm going, or the same place? Because if they come in, he's hurt somehow.
01:04:27
Speaker
there would have had to have been more blood. Like he's hitting the head, let's say, and he touches the back of his head and that's how he gets his own blood on his hand and picks up this rod to try to hit these men. He's going to probably be a little bit disoriented because he's been hitting the head. So you would think things would be knocked over. There would be more blood out there. That just doesn't explain that. Right.
01:04:51
Speaker
And it also doesn't explain why Mike's phone data was triangulated to show travel to the bridge between two and four miles per hour. Because I would think if a vehicle is traveling that slow, it would definitely draw attention. Yeah, I mean, like, you wouldn't even have to touch your gas. And if anything got behind that vehicle, he'd be going insane. Yeah. So yeah, people would remember. Right. And there's no recollection of it.
01:05:20
Speaker
Theory number four is Mike's son, Justin. Law enforcement heard rumors that there had recently been a falling out between Mike and the then 31 year old, Justin, over money.
01:05:38
Speaker
allegations say that Justin was always asking Mike for money and kind of guilt tripping him into giving it to him. And in the past, Mike had always given in. However, not long before Mike went missing, he apparently had had enough.
01:05:57
Speaker
Townsend reported that son-in-law David said, quote, Mike had totally quit. He said, I'm done with this. It's time for him to take care of himself. From what I understand, he would call and get belligerent with Mike and make threats, end quote. And he's 31? Mm-hmm. So some people wondered whether those threats had been translated into physical violence.
01:06:27
Speaker
Because you mentioned, you know. Do you know how young they were when they were adopted? I think they were around four. So still pretty young.
01:06:42
Speaker
And you had mentioned earlier, you know, if he had been taken by surprise or somebody he knew or something like that. And of course, that's what people who believe this theory think as well. But law enforcement looked into these allegations. And in an interview with Justin by law enforcement, he said that he would never hurt his father. You know, we say a lot of things in anger that we don't really mean.
01:07:10
Speaker
And he also gave the alibi of being at work on the day that his father disappeared. And that was something that law enforcement were able to verify. So when we're talking about this, and you may think I'm crazy, until the money thing came up, like I hadn't thought of
01:07:30
Speaker
any of Mike's kids, but I did think of his wife. So I'm wondering if she's going to be a theory. So yes, she is going to be the final theory. The final thing I'll say about Justin though, is that he, I know we talk all the time about how they're not admissible in court, but Justin was given and passed
01:07:56
Speaker
two separate polygraph exams in May of 2017. So police have kind of ruled him out. And the final theory that we're going to talk about is Mike's wife, Becca. I'm interested in this one. I will warn you that this is the longest theory because I do have a long list of reasons why she is the person suspected by
01:08:27
Speaker
a lot of people in this case. Okay. So my first thing I'm going to guess is that because she is a nurse, we are able to explain these droplets of blood. Yes. So there are some people who think, okay, well, if it looks like it came from a vial, who might have access to a vial of blood? And of course it was Mike's blood, but I mean, that could have been for a number of reasons.
01:08:56
Speaker
But the biggest reason related to her being a nurse, though, is that they argue that comment concerning whether the drops on the floor were blood or transmission fluid is bogus because as a nurse, I would think she would know the difference. Well, yeah, like if it was, you know, me or you and we were like, what is that? Right. Actually, I would not even know.
01:09:22
Speaker
I wouldn't even know what transmission fluid would look like. Well, I wouldn't be able to make that comparison nor would my brain even really register the words transmission fluid. The second reason why some suspicion lands on Becca is that she has never publicly made a plea for Mike's safe return.
01:09:48
Speaker
I'd be like, give me every newspaper, give me every new station. I'm going to talk to everybody, you know, about helping people. They do. Instead, per statements made by a car club friend of Mike's named Penny, who was interviewed on the True Crime Broads podcast.
01:10:13
Speaker
She said she has made many statements about things that Becca has said. Now, again, this is hearsay. I don't have verification other than Penny said it happened. But she has stated on that podcast, if you want to listen to the interview, that Becca had insisted that Mike was never coming back and all of that from the first day that he was missing.
01:10:43
Speaker
But is it like, how is she saying it? Like is she sobbing and she's saying like, he's never coming home. You know, I think that could change. It could tone does matter. Yes. Yeah. Penny has also stated though, that when she was called to see if she knew where Mike was on that March day, that Becca had asked her to come over to the house
01:11:13
Speaker
because she, quote, needed someone on her side. End quote. But wouldn't all of his family be on her side? I know. That comment is weird to me. Yeah, that comment's weird to me. Probably the reason why individuals question her the most, Maggie, though, is because it came to light as a result of the investigation.
01:11:41
Speaker
that she had carried on many affairs over the years. I'm sorry you're cheating on the man that opens the garage door for you and helps carries your work stuff inside? And makes your breakfast and dinner. And Bhaji Mascara? Yes. These were affairs that she initially denied but later admitted to. Well she admitted to one. The
01:12:07
Speaker
The rest, I guess, are just allegations. And she admitted to that one when given a polygraph exam. During the polygraph exam, she said that she believed that Michael knew about the affair, but just had never brought it up to her. And she said that it ended five months before Mike went missing.
01:12:31
Speaker
That's what she said. Further, she didn't want to discuss Mike's case with the private investigator, which to me seems suspicious because I know what you said is true, that everybody grieves and reacts differently. But to know that she didn't make a public plea,
01:12:55
Speaker
that she allegedly told Penny that Mike was never coming home before even days spent looking for him. And then to not want to work with anyone and everyone who might be able to bring him back like the private investigator, that to me, it at least looks really bad. Right, because even if maybe I'm just too emotionally distraught to make any type of public plea,
01:13:24
Speaker
I would still be like, here's my debit card. Here's access to my savings account. Here's all of my credit cards. Max them out to do whatever you need to find my husband. Well, we're about to get into some financials. Oh, God. Because just when you might think that things couldn't look any worse for Becca, they do. Just 10 days after Mike disappeared,
01:13:52
Speaker
Becca removed son Justin from the family phone plan and suspended Mike's phone service. OK, so even if, look, let's say Mike is abducted or, you know, like we said, he's he had said he's disoriented and he's lost and then he figures out where he's at and he can charge his phone. He wouldn't be able to have no use for it because he don't know. See,
01:14:21
Speaker
I would be paying for Anthony's phone until the day I died. I would too. I would too. Yeah. Because by suspending it, it means that any future turning on the phone, pinging a tower cannot be tracked. So she stated that financial hardship was the reason that she made that move.
01:14:45
Speaker
Nope. And if my dad went missing and my mom couldn't afford to pay for it, if he had a cell phone and my mom couldn't afford to pay for it, I would pay for it. I mean, at least, at least reduce it. Yeah. Yeah. Any of them. Reduce it down to a basic extra line. What is it? $10 a month? Yeah. Hmm. And I don't know what it was in 2017, but I mean, don't keep the data on it. Like just reduce it down, but keep it active. Mm hmm.
01:15:16
Speaker
That was also the reason, financial hardship, that she gave for her next move, which was to file for a death certificate for Mike on April 20th. And he went missing when? On March 10th. Yeah, no, absolutely not. Nope. Yeah. She told the kids that the death certificate was only temporary
01:15:45
Speaker
because she, well, she said it was temporary because she said that she would have to at least file this temporary death certificate in order to sell or get rid of Mike's truck because she didn't want to continue to make the loan payments on it. So they, they had like a monthly payment on the truck. Now I get that could be a financial burden.
01:16:14
Speaker
I don't know how much truck payments are. My mom and dad though, literally did not have two pennies to rub together after my brother died and made the last like however many of his truck payments just to be able to keep his truck because he loved it that much. So no, again, no. Yeah.
01:16:39
Speaker
So she says she's filing this temporary death certificate so she can sell or get rid of his truck. So she doesn't have to continue making the payments. I mean, were they in that much financial hardship? I don't know. I didn't read anything that stated that they were. But I guess she's kind of saying here, if he's just missing,
01:17:04
Speaker
And I do know that several states are trying to pass legislation that will allow for some, I guess, financial aid in some of these cases, because you've gone from like a two-income household to a single-income household, right? Because he's missing, so you're not going to be getting his retirement.
01:17:27
Speaker
but you still have your house payment, your vehicle payments. Okay, so maybe I jumped on Becca's case a little too soon, because I hadn't thought about that his retirement would have probably stopped. So she probably did need
01:17:39
Speaker
the extra income. But the death certificate would also allow her to sell Mike's classic cars, including the one that he had gifted to her to get money. And she did sell off all of those possessions and put their home up for sale as well. Now, again, it could be financial hardship. It could be too emotional. It could be too emotional.
01:18:10
Speaker
The problem is that you were onto something earlier. The certificate was not temporary. And Mike was declared legally dead, permanently, officially, on May 26, 2017. A detail his children only found out about after the fact
01:18:37
Speaker
And it allowed Becca to now receive payments from Mike's pension. I mean, we have cases that we have covered that span decades and the people are still not declared dead. Right. This is like three months. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Because this happens March 10th.
01:19:03
Speaker
and where two and a half months later. Yeah. Then there's Becca's cell phone activity. Per details outlined by the private investigator, Phillip Klein, on the morning of Mike's disappearance, Becca made five work-related calls. Then she called her alleged lover
01:19:32
Speaker
Remember the one that she said it had been over for five months? At 2.20 PM. He called her back at 2.53 PM and again at 3.08 PM. Remember, keep in mind that we think something happened to Mike between noon and three. Then for no obvious reason, Becca's phone was turned off
01:20:03
Speaker
between 315 and 451. So there are no pings. Were we able to say like she was at work? No, there are no pings to verify her location. And she was like a home nurse? She was a home health nurse, yep. And that information came from the private investigator. So he has released those details. So she's talking to an alleged lover and then her phone turns off
01:20:32
Speaker
for an extended period of time. And then her cell phone isn't used again until that text and then attempted phone call telling Mike that she is on her way home from work. And that was well after five. The man
01:20:51
Speaker
who she was calling, was brought in for additional questioning. And he too initially denied any affair or that any phone calls had taken place with Becca. He's basically like, I don't know what you're talking about. I haven't talked to her until he was presented with the evidence to the contrary of the phone records showing that the calls took place. It was then that he finally admitted to a relationship, though he maintained that he had nothing to do
01:21:22
Speaker
with Michael's disappearance and he did have an alibi for that day that they were able to verify. Like an all day alibi or is it one of those things that was like, how was that Allison's house? And then I drove home. That I don't know. You know, there's that gap. Right. Also, I would be a horrible criminal. Yeah. Horrible.
01:21:45
Speaker
Because as soon as they were like, OK, well, we're going to give you a lot of detector tests, I'd be like, well, this is what I did. This is what happened. I'm so sorry. Go ahead and take me in. And then finally, on July 13, 2017, Becca called law enforcement to file a restraining order against her son, Justin. Interesting. She said that the argument was about the phone bill.
01:22:15
Speaker
Because remember, she had dropped him from the plan. But that had occurred months prior. I mean, that happened in April. And he's just now figuring out that he's been dropped in July. She said that's what the argument was about. He said instead that the argument was because he was accusing her of involvement in his dad's death because of the rumors that he had heard that she and another man were involved.
01:22:45
Speaker
So many people outside of the situation, they felt like, you know, a restraining order was kind of an extreme reaction of the fight was really over a cell phone bill. Yeah. So what was it really about then? Exactly. To play devil's advocate, Becca has not been named a suspect in the case. There are some of those moves she could have made out of grief, out of true financial hardship.
01:23:16
Speaker
She definitely could not have carried out anything against Mike alone, because in my mind, given the size difference of the two, there's no way she could. And further, law enforcement were adamant that Becca passed the other part of the polygraph exam, other than the questions about the extramarital affairs, which is why they have ruled her out as a suspect.
Discovery of Chambers' Remains
01:23:41
Speaker
You know, I don't understand how
01:23:42
Speaker
Passing a polygraph rules you out as a suspect, but failing one does not make you a suspect. I know. It is bizarre. Now, before I ask for your opinion, I will say that at least one of our theories, the staging of death to start a new life, can now be ruled out since Michael Chambers' remains were discovered just recently on November 30th, 2022.
01:24:14
Speaker
So only about, what, seven months ago? They were discovered, yes, six years after his disappearance. They were discovered by a man hiking in a rural area of Raines County, which is near East Tawakini, just off of US Highway 276. And recovered from the scene were skeletal remains and a bicycle
01:24:44
Speaker
that were identified by the University of North Texas Center for Human Remains in Fort Worth as Michael Chambers. The location of the remains was not far from where law enforcement had tracked the final ping of Mike's cell phone. Were we able to tell how he died? No. So Maggie, what are your thoughts?
01:25:17
Speaker
I mean the body at the discovery at the end just kind of throws a little bit of a wrench in things because I really want to know. I mean I feel like if he'd been hitting the head we would see that on a skull. If he shot himself or something he would see that. Obviously he didn't drown himself. Right. I don't know.
01:25:43
Speaker
what my final thoughts are, but I need somebody to tell me what happened to Michael Chambers because I'm invested. I know. As the wife of a firefighter, I have faced many fears, but none of the fears I've faced can come close to that experience by the family and loved ones of the missing and the murdered.
01:26:07
Speaker
There's the fear of never finding the missing coupled with the fear of finding them only to feel a different kind of loss with their passing. There's the fear of never having answers paired with the fear of not knowing whether answers will even dull the pain. My heart aches with their anguish at each and every turn. It's the invisible burden we should all bear
01:26:37
Speaker
when we hear these cases, ones that prompt us to action, to advocacy, to easing their loneliness at least ever so slightly by knowing someone else cares. Hunt County Sheriff Terry Jones told a staff reporter from NBC Dallas Fort Worth, quote, I ask for the continued prayers for the Chambers family. Mr. Chambers family have waited for answers for a long time.
01:27:06
Speaker
And I hope this brings some closure to the Chambers family. This remains an open investigation and my office will continue to diligently investigate this case." End quote. Now it's up to us, Sleuthhounds, to do our due diligence in sharing the case as well. Anyone with credible information on Chambers' disappearance
01:27:32
Speaker
is asked to call the Hunt County Sheriff's Office at 903-453-6838 or text to submit online an anonymous tip to Hunt County Crime Stoppers at 903-453-6838.
01:27:56
Speaker
Again, please like and join our Facebook page, Coffee and Cases podcast to continue the conversation and see images related to this episode. As always, follow us on Twitter, at casescoffee, on Instagram, at coffee cases podcast, or you can always email us suggestions to coffeeandcasespodcastatgmail.com. Please tell your friends about our podcast so more people can be reached to possibly help bring some closure to these families. Don't forget to rate our show and leave us a comment as well. We hope to hear from you soon.
01:28:26
Speaker
Stay together. Stay safe. We'll see you next week. It's love notes with Maggie and Allison. We have lots of love going out.
01:28:56
Speaker
to both Crime With My Coffee and to Teachers Talk Crime, both amazing podcasts. Yes, they are. Who gave us a shout out on social media this week, and we adore both of those pods. Yes, we do. So if you haven't checked them out, you should. Yes, you should. Because they're pretty great. They are awesome. And we also want to send some love out to our Patreon swag box recipients, those who joined at the 12, 15, or $20 a month levels.
01:29:24
Speaker
We have loved seeing you in your new shirt. Yes. That you got this last round of swag and you look amazing. And if you want to be in the next round of swag, because you just found out they're getting, they got shirts and you're very sad that you missed out. Maybe you just want some bonus content. Maybe you just want to support the show. You can do all of those things. If you head over to patreon.com slash coffee and cases, there's a link in the show notes.
01:29:52
Speaker
And you can join today. Yes. And to close, we have a favor to ask. We are again nominated for the podcast awards and would be thrilled if you would take just a minute out of your day to go to the link in our show notes.
01:30:11
Speaker
or the ones that we post on our social media to vote for us, because a lot of the big name podcasters, they obviously get a lot of votes. They've got a lot of listeners, but we want to show everybody that heart and compassion concern and advocacy mean more than money. So we would love for you to vote for us and our show just to kind of show those bigger shows that a small indie podcasts, we can make a difference.
01:30:41
Speaker
We'll love you all even more. If you didn't vote for us, that would be amazing. It would be amazing. I would die. And with that, all of our love is going out to each and every one of you. Until next week, Sleuth Hounds.
01:31:00
Speaker
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Speaker
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Speaker
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Speaker
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