Transcript
Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to Loser Kid Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: This is episode 67.
Speaker: I am Josh Roop.
Speaker: With me, my co-captain as always.
Speaker: Scott Larson.
Speaker: And Scott, we just recorded a couple days ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, you know, it seems like they waited for us just to record.
Speaker: It was like, oh, Loser Kids are done.
Speaker: Episode's out.
Speaker: Let's hurry and push out some information about Deep Root.
Speaker: Because apparently, people think that you and Deep Root
Speaker: are associated just like, I don't know, flipping out and really good deals with pinball machines.
Speaker: Yeah, we are super.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Nice way to slide that in there.
Speaker: Hey, if you want a good deal on a pinball machine, except for Raza, go ahead and contact Zach and Nicole Mini.
Speaker: Bye, bye, bye.
Speaker: Flipping out a pinball.
Speaker: Bye, bye, bye.
Speaker: Get a topper.
Speaker: Get a topper.
Speaker: And so with this deep root information.
Speaker: Wait, wait, wait.
Speaker: You are.
Speaker: You're also bearing the lead.
Speaker: Who do we have on board with us today, Josh?
Speaker: Well, I was getting to that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So what was it?
Speaker: Saturday morning.
Speaker: Like I woke up and six o'clock.
Speaker: I got texted.
Speaker: My wife's like, what is going on?
Speaker: We're camping.
Speaker: I'm like, I don't know.
Speaker: And everyone wants to talk to, well, mainly you.
Speaker: And Colin McAlpine hits us up because, you know, he was one of the deep six.
Speaker: The deep six.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And we're like, you know what would be best?
Speaker: We should just record with you.
Speaker: And so who do we have with this guy?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We have Colin McAlpine.
Speaker: The deep six.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: By the way, one of the GCs is gone that Colin put on my machine.
Speaker: So I'm very proud of that.
Speaker: I even kept the glass on.
Speaker: Nice.
Speaker: Took the tilt ball out and just kind of wiggled the machine around.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It may have been a few death saves, but it's okay.
Speaker: It's my machine, right?
Speaker: But back to deeper.
Speaker: So Scott, have you gotten a lot of people reaching out to you and saying, hey, I'm sorry, Scott, for criticizing you for being over the top on your last episode?
Speaker: No, but I did get a message from a good friend who he thought was like, yeah, the last one was a little over the top.
Speaker: But however, he's like, so when are you recording this?
Speaker: Because a lot of people were just like, man, you're like, I've had a, I don't know, I've had a laser pointer on this guy since last year.
Speaker: And it's just an excuse after excuse.
Speaker: However, we kind of found out why everything's going on.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: Okay, hold on.
Speaker: I've got some Scott, like the one that really shocked me that messaged you.
Speaker: And I know we'll probably get into this.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Was Joe Cam and cow.
Speaker: Everyone knows Joe.
Speaker: He didn't message me.
Speaker: I shared it on Facebook and he actually responded on there.
Speaker: So it was your personal Facebook page, dude.
Speaker: It wasn't like loser kid pinball.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: So, but can I read this comment?
Speaker: Cause it's kind of,
Speaker: It's intense.
Speaker: You know, I think it's out there.
Speaker: It's fair game, right?
Speaker: It's in the interweb.
Speaker: It's in the public.
Speaker: Can't wait for this to be an episode of American Greed.
Speaker: And now he can kiss Gary Stern's butt and bow down before him and all the other little pinball jerks that threw their money away and show great disrespect for Gary's accomplishments in keeping pinball alive.
Speaker: He was rude and disrespectful and the minions piled on.
Speaker: Hope you all remove her.
Speaker: hope you remember to probably.
Speaker: Ah, okay.
Speaker: Hope you all remember to send Robert Mueller birthday cards in prison while you're asking for your deposits back.
Speaker: That's a shot, right?
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: Fire.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Why are we talking about Robert Mueller in prison?
Speaker: We probably need to educate people.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: We kind of jumped.
Speaker: So there was... Okay, let's rewind.
Speaker: Let's back up the train a little bit.
Speaker: So the last episode, we talked about a little teeny announcement that they had where they were delaying, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That was actually two episodes ago.
Speaker: That was 65.
Speaker: We just did 66.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: But don't forget Tim.
Speaker: Tim was great.
Speaker: Tim was great.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: So let me, yeah, thanks Tim.
Speaker: Pinball loft.
Speaker: Go check it out.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm just going to read this again.
Speaker: Cause I love it so much.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Dear Raza customer, we are sorry for the length of time without an update.
Speaker: We have been contacted by a few of you within the last few weeks.
Speaker: The main topics were how many people took the refund offer at three.
Speaker: Is the refund offer still available?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: And what's the status of the Raza builds are?
Speaker: No, I'm, this is not me interjecting.
Speaker: That's his own parentheses.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: A legal matter affecting Raza arose around a month ago that we did not expect.
Speaker: We were advised by council to not send out any substantive communication while they work to resolve it amicably.
Speaker: We have taken that advice while patiently waiting for it to be resolved.
Speaker: The back and forth has taken much, much longer than we expected.
Speaker: So we are providing this brief update so you understand what the delay is about.
Speaker: I would add that you still don't understand it.
Speaker: We cannot discuss the parties of what the complaint is about.
Speaker: We cannot provide a timeline.
Speaker: What we can say is that we are working hard to resolve slash settle it, and we hope it will be resolved very soon.
Speaker: We will be able to give you a meaningful update at that time.
Speaker: Until then, dot, dot, dot, Robert J. Mueller, principal deep root pinball.
Speaker: I do like that he said principal, as in like the principal of a...
Speaker: of a high school where he's your pal, P-A-L.
Speaker: Should we start calling him Edward Rooney?
Speaker: Oh my gosh.
Speaker: I think Rooney is more competent than this guy.
Speaker: Skinner?
Speaker: After he sends this out, what dropped on Friday evening, Josh?
Speaker: What was this little legal matter that they totally didn't expect to come about?
Speaker: What was it?
Speaker: Let me just read the title here so I don't get this wrong.
Speaker: The SEC charges San Antonio investment advisor with operating a fraudulent scheme and misappropriating investors' assets.
Speaker: The federal government is after security and – oh, sorry, the Securities and Exchange Missions versus Robert J. Mueller.
Speaker: It's not anyone else.
Speaker: It's just him.
Speaker: That's the – OK.
Speaker: So now I will say all of this –
Speaker: The white hot focus of the sun is on Robert Mueller.
Speaker: I am actually allowing the people who are working at Deep Root and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker: This is not a shot at them because we're going to talk about them too.
Speaker: But this is definitely orchestrated by the principal investment guy who is using his funds as his own personal piggy bank.
Speaker: And let me just point this out to according to the SEC order, Mueller and Deep Root persuaded investors, many of whom were retirees to cash out annuity and individual retirement accounts that they held with other investment companies and invest in two pooled investment funds they advise.
Speaker: Mueller and DeepRoot told investors the funds, the DeepRoot 575 Fund LLC and the DeepRoot Growth Fund's Deep Fund LLC would invest in life insurance policies and DeepRoot-related businesses to provide relatively safe returns to investors.
Speaker: He created the fund in 2014.
Speaker: So he has a whopping how many investors?
Speaker: 300. 300.
Speaker: who invested roughly 56 million.
Speaker: Um, okay.
Speaker: I, I round up.
Speaker: I thought it was 59.
Speaker: Oh, that's true.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: 58 million.
Speaker: Excuse me.
Speaker: I misspoke.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: Sorry, Bobby.
Speaker: Um, 58 million, which just misplaced a couple million dollars.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: Which, by the way, I'm just going to break it to you.
Speaker: If you're in financing and you're only managing 300 people with $58 million, that's actually not that much.
Speaker: I'm just kind of breaking it to you.
Speaker: But the regulator says Mueller paid himself roughly $1.6 million.
Speaker: From 2016 through 2020 using investors' funds.
Speaker: Now, actually, okay, so that's divide that by five.
Speaker: So, you know, he's well-paid, but not extravagantly paid.
Speaker: Quarter million a year.
Speaker: Yeah, okay.
Speaker: No, sorry, 200,000 a year.
Speaker: All right, all right.
Speaker: However, Robert also used more than 1.5 million of the fund's assets to pay hundreds of personal expenses, including his daughter's private school tuition, vacations with his family, his second wedding, his second divorce, his third wedding, Julie for both his second and third wives, including engagement rings and wedding bands for both wives,
Speaker: other lifestyle spending for and by his family and to buy a condominium in Kauai, Hawaii, said the SEC in its statement.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: Wait, wait, wait.
Speaker: Wait while we wait while we work to resolve this amicably.
Speaker: Seriously.
Speaker: Oh my gosh.
Speaker: Like I, okay.
Speaker: Again, I'm going to, I'm going to borrow a line from Jeff Foxworthy.
Speaker: It's, this is Bobby.
Speaker: It's like calling Bobby Godzilla and itty bitty lizard.
Speaker: Like this is the sec.
Speaker: The sec does not come knocking on your door because you like bought takeout at McDonald's.
Speaker: They don't care.
Speaker: But if you are stealing funds from all these people, then they're going to care.
Speaker: And I'm kind of wondering how much of this money is left.
Speaker: Legitimately.
Speaker: What's the old saying?
Speaker: You never want to owe money to the government or to the mafia.
Speaker: Something like that.
Speaker: I thought it was a fool and his money is soon parted.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay, so Colin, what we want to know in the NDA, did you have to like not talk about the big money room?
Speaker: Like was there like a Scrooge McDuck room?
Speaker: Scrooge.
Speaker: He got my first dime.
Speaker: So no, there was not a giant room that had a bunch of gold coins in it with a encased first dime.
Speaker: There was an empty room that had zero manufacturing in it that was very, very evident that something was incredibly wrong.
Speaker: with this company as it pertained to manufacturing a pinball machine.
Speaker: And yeah, and so this is just, I mean, all along, ever since that visit, out of respect for my friend Stephen Bowden, I've
Speaker: I kept my mouth shut.
Speaker: I didn't want to do anything to disparage.
Speaker: And I was genuinely hopeful.
Speaker: I really, really, really wanted another company here, very local to me.
Speaker: It's only about an hour and a half down the road from me.
Speaker: And so I thought, hey, this is really cool.
Speaker: have a company right here in Texas.
Speaker: They're going to, you know, in addition to multimorphic, but this is going to be bigger and they're going to be manufacturing stuff.
Speaker: And I'm excited about this.
Speaker: And then I went down there and discovered that they had a lot of Whitewoods and ideas and supposed licenses, a lot of very good people that they had hired.
Speaker: But not much in the way of product and not much in the way of capability of making things.
Speaker: I mean, so I work in a manufacturing company.
Speaker: Until recently, I joined the marketing team.
Speaker: But prior to that, I worked for over a decade in my company managing the company supply chain.
Speaker: I worked for prior companies in managing their supply chain and procurement.
Speaker: So I know a little bit.
Speaker: about manufacturing and supply chain.
Speaker: Not necessarily pinball machines, but just in general.
Speaker: There are some things that are universal from a manufacturing standpoint.
Speaker: In your aspect too, how big is your company that you work for that you manage marketing for?
Speaker: I would assume bigger than what DeepRoot was trying to obtain, right?
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Now, the company, we're not a huge company.
Speaker: So it's not like we're a private, especially chemical company.
Speaker: But between them and other companies I've worked for, other companies I've worked for were in the couple billion dollar valuation prior to that.
Speaker: And then prior to that was like maybe more like a 10 to $50 billion valuation company.
Speaker: So a lot bigger than the 300 investors.
Speaker: But the point being is just this – even that, even after going there and commiserating with the other deep six and sitting in this hotel lobby after we'd been there going, what is going on?
Speaker: what are they doing?
Speaker: They just tried to show us this brand new product that was sadly falling all over its face.
Speaker: They showed us this room with a bunch of Harbor Freight workbenches with no parts and no wiring and no electrical and nothing going.
Speaker: And I was like, okay, this is a sham.
Speaker: I mean, there are lots of different theories at that point as far as, okay, maybe he's trying to
Speaker: develop a company and then sell it off or parlay the IP in some way, because obviously this is not a manufacturing company.
Speaker: But in my wildest dreams, I could not have imagined this.
Speaker: I mean, I was never all that impressed in terms of Mr. Mueller when I met him.
Speaker: He's very impressive in terms of his ability to talk and his ability to sell an idea.
Speaker: He's a salesman, in my opinion, at heart, even though he's a lawyer, apparently, at least for now.
Speaker: I doubt he's going to be retaining his bar status, but that's... Former?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I just... This is...
Speaker: I'm, I'm so disappointed for those people that work at Deeproot Pinball.
Speaker: My friend, Steven Bowden, other people that I met when I was down there, you know, there, obviously there's some very famous pinball designers that work there.
Speaker: And so I, I, I first and foremost, I feel bad for them, but let's just add onto that.
Speaker: This is,
Speaker: it's not surprising that this is coming to a Titanic level, you know, ending because the, the nature of what they were doing and how they were doing it was just, it was a debacle and this just, man, this is debacle squared reading the stuff from the sec.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, crap is hit when the hat, the crap is hit the fan when the sec gets involved.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, the funny thing is when asked, so all those things I talked about, including the, I love the, the second marriage, the second divorce, the third marriage.
Speaker: I would love to be the copywriter who was writing that.
Speaker: When asked by the SEC counsel during the investigative testimony about his use of the funds asset to play for these personal and family expenses, Mueller asserted his fifth amendment right against self-incrimination.
Speaker: Okay, more from the article.
Speaker: Indeed, Mueller, the order states, funneled more than 30 million of the fund's assets to the relief defendants in non-arms length transactions whenever he determined the relief defendant businesses had expenses that need to be paid.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And he did so without any analysis as to whether such transfers constituted suitable investments for his client funds.
Speaker: So he basically was using this as like a piggy bank to do whatever he wanted.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so just to clarify, this is in the official SEC filing.
Speaker: The defense are listed as Robert J. Mueller, Deep Root Funds,
Speaker: and policy services.
Speaker: And then those are collectively the defendants.
Speaker: And then DeepRoot Tech, DeepRoot Pinball, DeepRoot Studios, DeepRoot Sports and Entertainment, DeepRoot RE 12621 Silicon Drive, and each and then some other people, a family member and somebody else.
Speaker: Those are all the relief defendants.
Speaker: So DeepRoot Pinball is certainly wrapped up in this.
Speaker: This is not just...
Speaker: Of course, this stems from Mr. Mueller.
Speaker: Don't get us wrong.
Speaker: But the – yeah, unfortunately, Deep Root Pinball is certainly tied up in this.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay, so Colin, what are your feelings over this?
Speaker: Well, other than what I've already stated, I'm just – I'm first and foremost disappointed for the people that have poured their sweat equity –
Speaker: into working on pinball machines and ideas and new designs, rules, what have you, that are working for DeepRoot.
Speaker: I don't envy what they're going to be going through over the next week or whatever, and beyond that.
Speaker: So that's first and foremost.
Speaker: The second thing, this feeling on this is,
Speaker: When are we as a pinball community going to wake up and quit giving money sight unseen to people that just go and ferret it away onto their first marriage, second marriage, third marriage, photography, other house.
Speaker: I mean, I'm referencing Skip B now.
Speaker: When are we finally going to wake up?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, this is almost verbatim.
Speaker: We keep saying this stuff, but I just honestly think of Zidware because I came into the pinball hobby as Zidware was crashing and burning, maybe a little bit before.
Speaker: But it's almost like the exact same thing that happened to John Papaduke.
Speaker: I even remember similar claims.
Speaker: I'm glad John's not involved in this.
Speaker: It really history repeats itself.
Speaker: And it blows my mind.
Speaker: that this is what it's come down to again.
Speaker: And don't get me wrong.
Speaker: Like I'm all for new pumball companies.
Speaker: And I think Spooky, you've either got to do one of two ways.
Speaker: Like Spooky did, eating macaroni and cheese and building it from the ground up if you don't have the money to do it and starting small and slowly snowballing, right?
Speaker: Or you've got to have a ton of money
Speaker: And you've got to do it right and either A, invest into an existing pinball company or build your own.
Speaker: And I guess that's what Robert was trying to pull off.
Speaker: No, sorry.
Speaker: In the beginning, the first two years of talk, that's originally what it was.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: We're not going to take pre-orders.
Speaker: We're not going to do this.
Speaker: You don't remember this one?
Speaker: Oh, no, no, no.
Speaker: I'm waiting for my response.
Speaker: Go ahead.
Speaker: I get you.
Speaker: But like, that's...
Speaker: Granted, like it was too good to be true.
Speaker: And then when the pre-order thing happened with them, it just smelled funny.
Speaker: But honestly, I don't think there's any other way, which really sucks because pinball, in my opinion, is very niche.
Speaker: I think we've all agreed that it's a very small industry slash community.
Speaker: And so you're going to have to find someone that's a diehard fan of pinball to either do like what Charlie Emery and his family did or...
Speaker: uh, I can't remember his name now, the dude that ended up coming in and buying like the lion's share of, of, of JJP.
Speaker: And it's, it's doing that with Jack Winnery now, you know?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Now you're also overlooking American pinball, which I would argue is,
Speaker: is a startup company that does have some money behind it, but they are doing it right in that they're starting small and they're slowly growing too.
Speaker: So I would argue that American Pinball is actually doing something that if Deep Root were ever a legitimate option, that's what they had done.
Speaker: But you do realize that American Pinball originally hired John Papaduke.
Speaker: They did.
Speaker: And once they realized what a snake in the grass that guy was, they jettisoned him from the company and they started over.
Speaker: But American Pinball is tied into another company as well.
Speaker: It's just not American Pinball.
Speaker: It's like a subsidiary.
Speaker: Apparently Deep Root's tied into another company too, just not legitimately.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So like CGC, like look at CGC was already making cabinets.
Speaker: They were already doing the stuff for Stern.
Speaker: CGC broke away.
Speaker: CGC is completely different.
Speaker: CGC is, they are a, they are an entertainment machine building thing.
Speaker: And they also have, they have licensed the ability to do these remakes.
Speaker: So that that's totally different, but okay.
Speaker: For anybody who believes this guy was legitimate from day one, this is your wake-up call.
Speaker: This guy was never legitimate.
Speaker: This is straight out of the con artist's handbook where you come in and you overpromise and you keep delaying any sort of production because you know eventually the wheel is going to stop.
Speaker: And you will get caught eventually.
Speaker: If you are managing this much money, eventually something's going to happen.
Speaker: And so Robert Mueller is a con artist.
Speaker: He's a dirt bag.
Speaker: And I'm angry at him for targeting vulnerable people.
Speaker: I'm angry at him for hiring people who legitimately are good people who have...
Speaker: um who have goodwill associated with them and have been using them as human shields which is why a hundred percent why he hired steve bowden because steve is a great ambassador and so he is using steve as a human shield and to hide behind that and say oh no no we're a good company look we have steve bowden and he
Speaker: He followed in the footsteps of Skip B, of Zidware, of all these things, because this guy is a con artist and he knows what an easy mark is.
Speaker: And so if you have a history in a small niche hobby, which pinball is, of people throwing money at something on hope that they will get something that's magical, that reminds them of that 90s Bally Williams feeling,
Speaker: then they will do it.
Speaker: Even though I would argue that better machines are being produced now, people still look at that and say, Ooh, look at the shiny thing that J-pop did long time ago.
Speaker: And so we're going to do that again.
Speaker: And so I have a shock and anger against Robert Mueller.
Speaker: I have a deep seated compassion for the people he has hired because these are people who it's a small hobby.
Speaker: They want to be involved in pinball.
Speaker: They could be doing other things in other industries, but this is their passion.
Speaker: And so he preyed on that vulnerability by hiring them down there and bringing them down.
Speaker: And he also has preyed on the vulnerability of these retirees who this guy is a salesman and a con artist.
Speaker: And so he's convinced them to give them his life saving, give him their life savings.
Speaker: And at the end, he's going to go to jail.
Speaker: He is a narcissistic egomaniac who is a sociopath who has no conscience whatsoever and doesn't care what kind of carnage he's left in his wreck because he lived the high life for eight years.
Speaker: And Deep Root was never, ever, ever a legitimate company, period, end of story.
Speaker: And the other thing, just to reemphasize also in terms of the controlling, I mean, it was obvious to, I think it's been obvious to many of us as we listened to Mueller's talks and everything else about how controlling he is.
Speaker: And it was evident in the visit that we paid down to San Antonio last September and how controlling and how he wants to have his hands in everything.
Speaker: To me, once again, this is all on Robert Mueller.
Speaker: This is not on the other people that he hired.
Speaker: And even in the SEC filing, it says, Mr. Mueller is in section 39.
Speaker: Mr. Mueller is responsible for Deep Root's product design, marketing, and strategic planning areas, as well as operation and management of multiple entities.
Speaker: Robert is the architect and implementer of all products, services, or designs, Policy Services, Inc., that's the parent company, or the Deep Root family of companies have marketed or sold.
Speaker: He has also personally managed all aspects of the administrative functions of the enterprises, supervised all investor or client care, handled most of the clerical and processing of investor or client paperwork, designed the IT systems and client portal, and is chiefly responsible for the growth and success.
Speaker: Ha ha ha!
Speaker: Of all the enterprises, Robert has also has backgrounds in accounting, valuation, information technology, graphic design, marketing, programming, and other technical areas.
Speaker: Robert J. Mueller is the only executive of the company.
Speaker: Yeah, that's not a good sign.
Speaker: When you are not diversified and there's one guy doing all that stuff, you need to be really suspicious.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It brings up two things.
Speaker: I know we talked a little bit about this before the podcast, but I just on a moral ground, it really, it really bothers me.
Speaker: Um, for reasons I'm going to leave on said, but I just, I, I, like Scott was saying, I must be a good guy.
Speaker: Cause this, this really bothers me that people would take advantage, not only of, of goodwill and old people and stuff like that.
Speaker: It's just, it's, it's terrible.
Speaker: Like,
Speaker: I just don't get it.
Speaker: I don't get.
Speaker: Well, I get that there's money.
Speaker: I get that you do you want to go play in Hawaii on other people's dimes.
Speaker: But it just it's so messed up.
Speaker: Like, Robert, if you're listening, he's not listening.
Speaker: He doesn't care.
Speaker: Are you kidding me?
Speaker: He gets he he literally gets a high off of hearing his name on these podcasts.
Speaker: I bet he's just gobbling this up right now.
Speaker: Maybe not.
Speaker: Maybe he's finally realized that like, I told you, he probably was literally like, if we talked to him, he probably was like, I told you guys, like, it was a ball gag in the butthole.
Speaker: That's what the logo is.
Speaker: And I told you from the very beginning, that's what I was going to do to you guys.
Speaker: And so, like, I know we're family-friendly podcasts.
Speaker: I apologize.
Speaker: But
Speaker: Like seriously, like head to head warned us years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's right.
Speaker: Ryan C. War.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like Ryan C. Thank you for warning us all.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Two and a half years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Prepare to get deep rooted.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Is it sad?
Speaker: Is it maybe we shouldn't feel bad?
Speaker: Like I just don't like it just on a moral level.
Speaker: It is so messed up.
Speaker: And like, I do believe in like forgiveness and all that jazz, but like,
Speaker: Dude, I hope someone throws you a really special time in prison.
Speaker: That's all I got to say.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: He's going to a white collar prison.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Whatever.
Speaker: I don't need to know.
Speaker: I do not need to know.
Speaker: Not at all.
Speaker: But yeah, no, it's just, it's no, this is what bothers me.
Speaker: This is another thing that bothers me.
Speaker: There's so much of the community that's been divided on this personal subject of deeper.
Speaker: And it's because like you've said, they've taken people that are good in the community that they've, that have built this community for years.
Speaker: They've helped this industry grow because we care about it.
Speaker: It's a product that,
Speaker: I mean, maybe I'm getting too mushy on this, but I'm like, I feel like you can't look at one person in the pinball community and be like, that's what defines this community.
Speaker: It's such a hodgepodge of, of,
Speaker: every aspect of the high school spectrum, right?
Speaker: Like you've got the jocks, you've got the, the nerds, the goths, like there's just so many people.
Speaker: And it, it, they were all brought together because of this wonderful thing called pinball.
Speaker: And, and when we're playing pinball at tournaments or with friends or just at the local scene,
Speaker: all that just drops.
Speaker: It doesn't matter if you're Mormon or if you're pagan or black, white, gay, straight.
Speaker: It doesn't matter because we're all there to play pinball and enjoy it.
Speaker: And it just, it bothers me so much that you took people of this community because you knew they were good.
Speaker: You knew they'd help your image and you use them to take people's money.
Speaker: And even like, I don't know, like listening even to recent episodes to people that I really respect and still defending people
Speaker: this company, it bothers me because not, not them in general, but because they're still got the goodwill.
Speaker: They've got the good faith of this company and they are, they are protecting their friends and the people that they love because they know that they are good people.
Speaker: And Robert Mueller has taken advantage of that.
Speaker: And it, it just is bothered me so bad.
Speaker: Like, I don't know what else to go with it.
Speaker: Like, please someone else talk.
Speaker: Well, so let's, let's, let's pivot.
Speaker: So, I mean, I think we, it's, we've,
Speaker: we've beaten this dead horse and Mueller is a dead horse now.
Speaker: So let's talk about like, so where does it go from here?
Speaker: What lessons have we learned?
Speaker: Well, yeah, well, not less lessons, but first and foremost, unfortunately, the people who had money
Speaker: that are, you know, they prepaid to Deep Root.
Speaker: I hate to break it to you, unless you had like some third party that you can try to make a claim against that they'll cover you and then they'll take the hit.
Speaker: Your money's gone.
Speaker: Money's gone.
Speaker: It's toast.
Speaker: It's done.
Speaker: I am, it's interesting.
Speaker: I wonder, just throwing out for you guys, do you think that there's any pinball company that is going to be interested in purchasing a,
Speaker: the IP associated with the pin bar?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: No chance.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: That is the problem.
Speaker: I can see viability for it in the pinball industry so long as it's not fiscally drowning.
Speaker: I think they would find other ways of doing similar things.
Speaker: I mean, look at look at if they want to do it, but they won't pay the money for it.
Speaker: They'll figure out like an end around to say, OK, well, the whole point was having the information that you're looking down on.
Speaker: Are there ways of having some sort of way to convey the information?
Speaker: But it's forever tainted with this association.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Like I said, I think it is an innovation.
Speaker: I don't know where it goes from.
Speaker: It's basically an iPad that's connected to – what is so innovative about that?
Speaker: I think it opens up a realm of things.
Speaker: It's a touchscreen down on a machine.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But it's cool.
Speaker: Sure, but it's still –
Speaker: You could trap up and upgrade.
Speaker: Say you're playing Game of Thrones and you trap up and you wanted to upgrade one of your houses because there's now an RPG element.
Speaker: And I don't know.
Speaker: I get that pinball is mostly on the play field, but I feel like there's still some stuff about the pinball.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: But I agree.
Speaker: It's forever tainted.
Speaker: Nice.
Speaker: You can look at P3.
Speaker: They've got their screen on the play field, so you don't have to look up.
Speaker: And then you've got Haggis, who's now putting screens in the card apron.
Speaker: So I think we're already heading that way.
Speaker: But I don't think there's anything specifically tied to that you would have to pay them for their licensing.
Speaker: I think it's an interesting gimmick, but I really don't think it's groundbreaking in that it's not like the iPhone.
Speaker: where it was so different than anything else that's been going on.
Speaker: It's really not.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And also there, there, there's definitely still, I think the, a lot of things that we were, you know, everybody was questioning about the pin bar in terms of its viability in a location.
Speaker: specifically home environments a little bit different but in a location that you know how well would the pin bar hold up and i think those questions still remain unanswered obviously because the money got spent somewhere else looking at because i know the whole one of the biggest selling points of the pin bar is then that way you could connect like
Speaker: You could link it Bluetooth-wise, and you could have your account there and yada, yada, yada.
Speaker: But really thinking about that, so long as the pinball machine has Bluetooth and you could link up to it with your phone, you could have your account on your phone.
Speaker: It's not like you necessarily need the pin bar to do that stuff.
Speaker: You don't need that.
Speaker: And everything else associated with them, those whitewoods, there's no chance they'll ever get made.
Speaker: I mean, it's forever tainted and I don't want to I don't really want to bring it up because it's kind of icky.
Speaker: But there's a reason why when John Trudeau went to jail or at least was arrested, Stern distanced themselves from anything associated with his version of Deadpool.
Speaker: Yeah, it got scrapped.
Speaker: Yeah, they're just like, no, sorry.
Speaker: We're keeping the license because the license isn't tainted, but anything that that person touched is forever going to be associated with his ickiness.
Speaker: Dude, he's been...
Speaker: He's been blacklisted.
Speaker: Like, seriously, when was the last time you've heard his name on a podcast?
Speaker: Like, I'm surprised we're even bringing him up, but like, well, okay.
Speaker: We just don't talk about him.
Speaker: We don't, which is for the better, in my opinion.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Because forever, it's kind of a, I still have one of his games.
Speaker: I have black Rose and I still enjoy it because it doesn't create that association with me because I had it way before I knew who John Trudeau was.
Speaker: But it's just forever, the association with it will forever taint any of those things.
Speaker: And I doubt that any of those whitewoods really are that groundbreaking.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I really doubt that.
Speaker: I think it was just more of a, hey, really, Colin, you and I and Josh, we could all get together and make a whitewood in a week.
Speaker: It may not be a great whitewood, but it would be a whitewood.
Speaker: Well, and I think the thing that we've talked about more and more lately is design is wonderful and everything, but...
Speaker: the game of pinball has evolved so much over these years that almost design is kind of one of the smaller aspects compared to everything else between code and like, don't get me wrong.
Speaker: Like I would say that it's part of the pillar, but you can't have a code that completely resurrects an unfun layout, but okay.
Speaker: Walking dead.
Speaker: It's not an unfun layout.
Speaker: It's a hard layout.
Speaker: But if your average person designs a bad layout that just has brick shots, it doesn't really matter how good the code's going to be because eventually people will just be like, yeah, I'm not going to, I don't like it.
Speaker: And there's a few that I've played recently that I'm not a huge fan of.
Speaker: So the code's okay, but I think the layout's a miss.
Speaker: So I guess my biggest question is, I know that there's obviously gonna be updates from here on out for Deep Root, but is this kind of like, can we just please be, is this like the last episode we can talk about them?
Speaker: Like, I'm so tired of talking about them.
Speaker: It's done.
Speaker: There's no chance that the next episode is going to be Robert pleads guilty and goes to jail or Robert goes to trial and goes to jail.
Speaker: But we all know where the end is going to be.
Speaker: But what about the pin?
Speaker: What about the pin pod guys?
Speaker: Oh, the pin pod.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: What about that floating, uh, that, that, that weird home version of the super deluxe, whatever that they were doing.
Speaker: And we're just like floating back box.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You're like, that looks like a Walmart display.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Where it's stuck up on the two poles.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It was certainly different.
Speaker: Difference.
Speaker: Not necessarily good.
Speaker: So no,
Speaker: But I really, Colin, there were...
Speaker: I think there were enough, there were enough red flags that if people, people were holding out hope because they are fans of what John Papadouk has done in the past, they were hoping that it would eventually come to fruition.
Speaker: But sure.
Speaker: At the, everything that came up in the meantime, just had to have been one more log to the fire of saying, there's something else going on here, guys.
Speaker: This is, this does not feel legitimate.
Speaker: And they had to.
Speaker: Well, and he certainly he was throwing a lot of money at it.
Speaker: But it turns out that money.
Speaker: It wasn't his money.
Speaker: It wasn't his money.
Speaker: It was Laverne and Shurls from, you know, the 80 year olds who now are are destitute because they don't have any money left, because I guarantee when they finally tally up how much he spent versus how much is left, there's going to be very little left.
Speaker: Anyway, I really hope people who are working at Deep Root are able to find better landing spots than where you've been.
Speaker: And I hope you don't feel that any of this criticism is aimed at you because I think that you guys were doing your best in a challenging situation.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Any final thoughts on Deep Root?
Speaker: Time to wipe and flush.
Speaker: Crapper get off the pot.
Speaker: I think we already did.
Speaker: So meanwhile, okay, let's talk about something fun now.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Something else fun did happen and it was announced on Friday or at least it was confirmed that we've all heard.
Speaker: But what all was confirmed?
Speaker: Because I've heard, well, I have heard quite, I don't know what's rumor and what's true.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: They confirmed that the next game is Cactus Canyon, a remake of Cactus Canyon.
Speaker: From CGC, right?
Speaker: From CGC, yeah.
Speaker: Surprise!
Speaker: Yeah, woo!
Speaker: Are any of us shocked?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Okay, I... It's taken a long time to get to this point, so I appreciate that they are not the type that are banging a drum and putting out banners over-promising and under-delivering.
Speaker: If anything, CGC has under-announced and over-delivered on all three of their remakes.
Speaker: So are you guys excited about this one?
Speaker: I'm not.
Speaker: I think Cactus Canyon is a fun, gimmicky pin.
Speaker: I do enjoy much more so the Cactus Canyon Continued, which I don't know.
Speaker: I didn't go into the detail of their announcement if that's something that they're going to be offering.
Speaker: If they've worked with, I think it's with Eric.
Speaker: Was it Eric Pripke who did the Captus Canyon Continued?
Speaker: So I'm not sure if they're working with him because, I mean, in all honesty, guys, I mean, it's... Okay, first off, layout-wise, it's just... It's your basic, you know, fan layout.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it is very, very, very similar to, you know, the Medieval Madness or AFM.
Speaker: Monster Bash, yeah.
Speaker: Monster Bash.
Speaker: I mean, so it's... There's nothing revolutionary about it.
Speaker: It has some cute...
Speaker: you know, quotes or whatever that are kind of funny and make me laugh when I play it.
Speaker: Lock is lit and so am I. Yes, yes.
Speaker: But not nearly the extent of like a medieval madness or an AFM or now the modern ones that make me laugh like, like Deadpool.
Speaker: Yeah, Deadpool is hilarious.
Speaker: And so I just, man, it's a struggle for me because, I mean, I wish the best for Chicago and I wish the best for them in success in their remakes.
Speaker: And I have no doubt there are going to be a fair amount of people that buy this thing.
Speaker: And based on the Chicago game that's passed, they're probably going to be pleased with their product that they're going to receive.
Speaker: And so that's great.
Speaker: And I love that for the pinball world.
Speaker: I mean, we've seen that now also with, you know, more recently as well with Haggis doing a remake of Fathom and announcing they're going to do other remakes of Bally, other Bally, you know, hopefully, you know, famous, really good titles.
Speaker: So I'm excited for all those people that who place a high value on
Speaker: on Cactus Canyon and want that product for their home or location or what have you.
Speaker: And I'm very confident based on now multiple pins that CGC is going to execute and they're going to deliver and that they will be fun to play and it'll be more of that title that's out there.
Speaker: Me personally, I'm not a big fan of it, but I'm happy that there is a reputable company that we know can manufacture product
Speaker: is going to make something that people want and sell it.
Speaker: And there are going to be more people in the pinball community that are happy with another pinball machine that they can add to their collections.
Speaker: so i gotta ask you before you wrap it up colin um i've heard this rumor i have you know it's been confirmed it's been denied it's yada yada yada what if because we have heard that lyman sheets has left stern pinball and it's been a while ago they did it what happened if he left to go to cgc to finish cactus canyon would that then make you feel more appealed especially where lyman was part of attack for mars and
Speaker: and Monster Bash and Medieval Madness, would it draw you more into Cactus Cannon?
Speaker: Or is it, it is what it is, and you don't think code could fix it?
Speaker: No, 100%.
Speaker: If Lyman is on board with revitalizing Cactus Canyon, oh yeah, then it's going to be good.
Speaker: I mean, you just talked about it.
Speaker: I mean, The Walking Dead, I mean, actually, I don't mind the layout of The Walking Dead.
Speaker: I think it's kind of a cool layout.
Speaker: But it was the initial rules, because they were in their infancy, were pretty bland.
Speaker: They were rough, yeah.
Speaker: They were rough.
Speaker: and not not fun to play and then now it's arguably in my opinion also personally uh one of the best and so yes if lyman if that's something that actually were to come true and the lyman were working on uh revitalizing cactus canyon code and the rule set uh to make it more enjoyable and you know that oh yeah game changer for sure you're like then all of a sudden i might actually be interested in buying one
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: I have two friends that want LEs already.
Speaker: And so at least they're within two miles of me.
Speaker: So I'm not planning on buying one right now just because I'm trying not to overlap everything.
Speaker: But I'm excited to play it because I don't have enough time on it on the original.
Speaker: And so I guess I'm holding out hope to see what it's going to be.
Speaker: I'm sure they're going to do something big on the code.
Speaker: I sure hope so.
Speaker: And with just like Colin said, with their history, they have done an amazing job of sprucing up a classic design while keeping that classic design classic.
Speaker: And it's not like they put a whole bunch of gaudy stuff on there.
Speaker: The attack from Mars is it's mind-blowing how good that integration is.
Speaker: Oh, man.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And what my medieval madness, I I dare say that if I sold every game except for one, I would still hold on to medieval madness because that's the one that that everybody up to Colin level of play like that game.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, Colin could he could definitely rule the kingdom every time just because it does have that slightly easier layout than Attack from Mars and an elite player can boss it around.
Speaker: But everybody else goes down.
Speaker: And when that castle explodes the first time, there's like, I want to do that again.
Speaker: I agree with you guys.
Speaker: I'm excited to see if there is new code.
Speaker: Well, we know that there definitely is new code.
Speaker: If Alignment Sheets is on it, I want to see it now.
Speaker: It went from a game that I was just like, meh, to okay, this could be good.
Speaker: Let's see what this is now.
Speaker: And we keep hearing rumors of they've revamped things on it, and it's looking more and more good.
Speaker: And that honestly could be people just trying to get you hyped.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, however, they've done such a good job about not overplaying their hand.
Speaker: In many ways, they could probably tease it a little more than they are, but I think it'll be a hit.
Speaker: However, the next remake that I would consider buying would probably be Whitewater.
Speaker: I don't know about Theater Magic.
Speaker: I don't know about, and these are all games that have been talked about for years, but Theater Magic or Tales of the Arabian Nights or those other ones, I think the one that would push me over the edge would be Whitewater.
Speaker: Yeah, you can't buy them all, even though I'd like to and my wife thinks I do.
Speaker: But you can't buy them all.
Speaker: So with their announcement this weekend at Southern Fried Gaming Expo, do you think we see – I mean, we're two months away from Pinball Expo.
Speaker: Do you think we actually see Cactus Canyon at Pinball Expo?
Speaker: I think that's their target.
Speaker: That's probably the next big – that's the next big one.
Speaker: And so I'm looking forward to trying it at Expo.
Speaker: Yeah, if I were them, I would definitely have that as the target, to have that ready to go and playable, at least in the small number amount, to be able to take it to that show that's right in their backyard.
Speaker: Yeah, because the next one really is kind of Texas Pinball Festival, and I think they'd want to at least develop more of a buzz.
Speaker: I mean, that's almost, what, eight months away?
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, and historically, honestly, companies that aren't Stern usually reveal at Pinball Expo.
Speaker: I mean, look at JJP with Pirates.
Speaker: They also did it with Wonka.
Speaker: CGC did it with Monster Bash.
Speaker: I mean, it's not uncommon for a pinball machine to be ready to play at Expo.
Speaker: I wouldn't be surprised, though, if they pull an online reveal video.
Speaker: I mean, really, Guns N' Roses was that way.
Speaker: Hey, check this out.
Speaker: It's an online reveal.
Speaker: And...
Speaker: They can control it and edit it quite easily that way.
Speaker: That may be the way to go.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And your reach of an online reveal is pretty good now.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Especially with all those Western magazines they'll tie into.
Speaker: What was the last actual good hit Western movie you can think of?
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: Unforgiven?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They don't do a lot of Westerns because they're kind of expensive to produce.
Speaker: And yeah, they typically don't be big hits.
Speaker: Maybe Unforgiven?
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: The two Westerns that I think are awesome and I just love watching, I think Silverado is a great one.
Speaker: And that's what in the eighties, uh, I think Maverick with Mel Gibson and Jodie Foster is really funny.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: You can't forget the good, the bad, and the ugly.
Speaker: That won so many awards.
Speaker: That's from, what, the 60s?
Speaker: Well, 60s, 70s, somewhere around there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But that's the problem, though.
Speaker: Did you know one of the longest-running TV shows of all time was Gunsmoke?
Speaker: It has the most episodes of any TV show.
Speaker: I do know that because my grandpa would watch it.
Speaker: My grandpa still does watch it.
Speaker: My wife's grandpa.
Speaker: It's always on when we go over to his house.
Speaker: I'm like, did this show ever end?
Speaker: They just keep filming it in black and white and just putting other people in as the character.
Speaker: Okay, it was a Bonanza or Gunsmoke or something like that, but they...
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So there was true grit.
Speaker: That was okay.
Speaker: I'm looking at the top 100 from Rotten Tomatoes.
Speaker: I didn't watch this, but Django Unchained, wasn't that also kind of a Western...
Speaker: Jamie Foxx yeah I didn't watch that yeah it was okay it wasn't great yeah the Ballard of Buster Scruggs yeah wow that was that was unique yeah well that was 310 to human oh sorry yeah yeah 310 to human it was okay just yeah they just don't make them like the bone tomahawk wow that's just sounds odd uh
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, it's a theme, though, that people – so without going to a direct movie license, it is a theme that resonates with a lot of people.
Speaker: And it also resonates, in my opinion, with a lot of people probably overseas as far as the stereotype or whatever of Old West America.
Speaker: And so I think that helps their cause.
Speaker: And, you know, the other aspect of it is there are, you know, as we talked about, there are a lot of really funny call outs in Cactus Canyon.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It ties into some of those scenarios.
Speaker: Even some of the, you know, they're like voice actors, obviously, but like some of those that try to do the John Wayne and whatnot, you know?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It just, there's some good stuff in there.
Speaker: No, I, I, I'm excited to see it.
Speaker: And whenever it's done, the good news is, is that,
Speaker: They are not going to announce it until it's done.
Speaker: And so there is not a announcement and then three years later you can buy it.
Speaker: That's not how they work.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: Yeah, and it'll be another – it's another pin that's in the genre of a – first off, fan layout.
Speaker: But the other aspect of it, the most recent pin that reminds me of it is Elvira House of Horrors.
Speaker: It is a pinball machine that by design has very wide shots.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And Cactus Canyon is the same way.
Speaker: And so there is an approachability –
Speaker: to Cactus Canyon for a wide variety of skill levels that I think is more palatable and more attractive to a wider skill set that people can step up.
Speaker: And most of the time when they flip that flipper at the ball, it's going to go into those one and nice wide shots.
Speaker: Yeah, it's the shots are as opposed to like two thirds up the right half of the play field.
Speaker: They're like three fourths up, but they are wide.
Speaker: Absolutely wide shots.
Speaker: Like you're not going to have too many bricks on this one.
Speaker: See, I kind of wish... I kind of want this game just because of where I live.
Speaker: It'd be really cool to have a Cactus Canyon in our Western Heritage Museum.
Speaker: I don't know if a lot of people know this, but Vernal was actually where Butch Cassidy, that was some of his stomping grounds.
Speaker: Same with Doc Holliday.
Speaker: Just there's a lot of Western history in this area.
Speaker: And so it'd be cool to have that here.
Speaker: We even have a dedicated Western museum where you can see the old pioneer coaches and stuff like that as well.
Speaker: Well, you should have a Jurassic Park there, too.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: Wouldn't that be great?
Speaker: I do have a Jurassic Park here.
Speaker: It's not out in public.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Well, I'm excited.
Speaker: I think they'll do a great job of it.
Speaker: And just whenever it happens, I'm glad it's finally announced that it's not like a, hey, we think this is going to happen because who knows?
Speaker: It could have been a bait and switch, but unlikely.
Speaker: I'm still remembering what, what was it?
Speaker: Three, two years ago when Gary Stern got up at, I want to say Texas Bimball Festival and they quote unquote announced all their games for like the next five years.
Speaker: And there was like, hello kitty on there and golden girls.
Speaker: And yeah, does anyone remember this?
Speaker: Like I thought it was brilliant.
Speaker: Something like that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Anyhow.
Speaker: I, yeah, no, it's good.
Speaker: It's good.
Speaker: That's what that's what pinball companies should just do.
Speaker: And then just like randomly insert ones.
Speaker: It's like look at Spooky.
Speaker: They obviously announced Ultraman technically a year before they even even unveiled it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, I didn't even know Ultraman was until they announced it.
Speaker: And then I still don't really know what it's about.
Speaker: Yeah, same.
Speaker: Obviously, you guys need Ready Player One.
Speaker: Yeah, I still haven't seen or read that.
Speaker: Okay, wait a minute.
Speaker: I've read the book, but it's been a while ago, and I've watched the movie at least twice because I watched it once, and then I watched it again with one of my sons.
Speaker: Did they have Ultraman in...
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: One of the Japanese characters, his robot that he chose was Ultraman, wasn't it?
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And he used the capsule, but he was also tied to the same conventions of he could only have it for, what was it, seven minutes?
Speaker: Correct.
Speaker: Because seven's very tied into their culture there.
Speaker: And so in their big boss final battle on that last planet, he was running up against the timer with the seven minutes.
Speaker: It was great.
Speaker: Anyhow.
Speaker: Yeah, it's a good movie.
Speaker: So, but yeah, so you have Expo in October.
Speaker: Is there anything?
Speaker: Is there anything in pinball happening in September?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Supposedly that's the next Stern reveal is what I've heard.
Speaker: We're getting close.
Speaker: Yeah, but that'll again happen online.
Speaker: They get way more clicks from doing it online than in our room.
Speaker: Yeah, but I guess the point being, though, is October should be pretty – like, Expo should be pretty chock full of reveals.
Speaker: Like, when we talked to Rob Burke on our show, the gentleman over Pinball Expo that's been going on for years, he said we were at least going to have, what was it, three or four reveals at Expo or before Expo.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Well, it is what it is.
Speaker: Yeah, so it may not be the reveal of the pin, but it may be one of the first big in-person physical touch points for those pins.
Speaker: For the pin, like for Stern, for instance, and also for CGC, where you have the first opportunity to actually put your hands on it and flip.
Speaker: the pen and certainly with Stern, if they announce something in September, you know, you, everyone knows they are going to have massive amounts of copies, physical copies rolling out the door by October.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, I was still impressed with the, I mean, technically the last Pemberg, they announced Jurassic park.
Speaker: Was it the week of, or the week before?
Speaker: And they had a row of them at Pemberg.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And then Keith won.
Speaker: It's like, it's like, dude, save some space for someone else, man.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: uh but no i think i think i think this exo is gonna be everyone's been dying for something i guess the biggest question on everyone's mind do you think that covid hinders it do you think we see another shutdown and and the expos take another hit of the rounds so to speak i don't know i've been nervous to buy tickets just because of that um
Speaker: Our hospitals are back up to 80 to 90% capacity where actually every day we're looking at how many people are in the ICU and whether or not we have to delay some things.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: Did you see Lollapalooza, though, two weeks ago?
Speaker: What was a month ago?
Speaker: 385,000 all there, packed in like sardines.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I don't get this.
Speaker: We'll not divulge into this because I know there's a lot of different ideas and aspects of the spectrum.
Speaker: If Expo is still going on, I will go.
Speaker: I say that's, that's the bottom line.
Speaker: I'm planning on going.
Speaker: I haven't bought my ticket yet just because I'm just waiting to get a little more confirmation on that, but I'm, I'm planning on going.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I'm, I am, well, I have my airplane tickets.
Speaker: I, we have somewhat have a hotel.
Speaker: I mean, we do have a hotel.
Speaker: I have to snuggle with some people.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That was the agreement.
Speaker: That is the agreement.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Actually, I will say we should probably get on booking the Texas Pinball Festival Hotel too.
Speaker: Dude, that sold out how many months ago?
Speaker: I know, but we can still get something around there.
Speaker: Yeah, there's still hotels right around there.
Speaker: Yeah, because we got to be there for our acceptance award when we win the Twippy, right?
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Booyah.
Speaker: Good luck.
Speaker: No, I'm sleeping on Colin's couch, so that's what I'm doing.
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: It's only three and a half hours away.
Speaker: It's nothing.
Speaker: It's like Josh and me.
Speaker: We're three and a half hours away, so it's all good.
Speaker: It's two and a half to your house.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Maybe three.
Speaker: Yeah, maybe three.
Speaker: Well, I think that's about an hour or so.
Speaker: Hey, at least we ended on a high note, right?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Good things happen in pinball.
Speaker: I was told to reverse your buts.
Speaker: You know, always say the negative first and then reverse it.
Speaker: But, you know, this is a terrible situation, but...
Speaker: a good reputable company with a good pinball machines coming out.
Speaker: See, that sounds so much better than like a good pinball companies come out with a good pinball machine, but, and there's a con artist in your midst.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yes, exactly.
Speaker: So, all right.
Speaker: Well, uh, hopefully we'll probably see in another two weeks.
Speaker: We've been recording a little closer just because of the awesome reveals and, uh, announcements, but still, um, looking forward to talking to everybody.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: Thanks again, Colin.
Speaker: Dude, it's awesome having you back on.
Speaker: I didn't know that you'd actually join us.
Speaker: We're like, yeah, come join us.
Speaker: We'll talk deeper.
Speaker: And you're like, okay.
Speaker: Yeah, let's do it.
Speaker: Yeah, it's good to talk with you guys again, and thanks for having me on.
Speaker: It's always fun to talk pinball.
Speaker: Well, it's certainly good, given you actually saw it behind the curtain at Deep Fruit, and it's not really that surprising that it ended the way it did.
Speaker: But it ended with a spectacular meteor into the ocean that caused tsunamis everywhere, so...
Speaker: I guess we owe Joe Lemire one now, though, because, you know, he's always like, when am I going to be on the show?
Speaker: Actually, he never says that.
Speaker: I'm just trying to.
Speaker: You've had Colin on twice now and not even me once.
Speaker: What's going on with this?
Speaker: We'll get you.
Speaker: No, Joe's a good guy.
Speaker: So is Jeff.
Speaker: All the Jeffs.
Speaker: I don't know if I know a bad Jeff in pinball.
Speaker: I know a few.
Speaker: You shall remain unknown.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: I'll see you in two weeks.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Thanks guys.
Speaker: Wait, wait, should we hurry and do our whole outro thing?
Speaker: Yeah, you should.
Speaker: If you'd like to get ahold of us, we are loser kid pinball podcast at gmail.com.
Speaker: If you'd like to get ahold of us on the socials, we are loser kid pinball at Facebook and Twitter and Instagram.
Speaker: so whatever your flavor is uh if i feel like streaming i do it every once in a while you can do that at loser kid pinball on twitch and also for those that don't know we have a discord if you'd like to join yeah and i joined today yay it it the the notes it's pinned to the top of our facebook so you just just go there and whatnot and if you'd like to get a hold of colin how could they get a hold of you my good sir
Speaker: Just reach out to me on Facebook.
Speaker: Just direct message me.
Speaker: Perfect.
Speaker: You can see his big trophy on Facebook.
Speaker: It's pretty sweet.
Speaker: I'm not going to lie.
Speaker: It is pretty sweet, yeah.
Speaker: So that does it for us.
Speaker: We will see you in two weeks.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Catch you later.
Speaker: Shut up and sit down.
