Transcript
Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to Lose Kid Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: We are on episode 146.
Speaker: I am Josh Roop with me, my co-captain as always.
Speaker: Scott Larson.
Speaker: We got an awesome guest joining us today.
Speaker: Scott, you've had quite the adventure and there's a new game out.
Speaker: We're focusing specifically on Avatar today.
Speaker: Tell us about if you're going to buy that magic, where are you going to buy it from, Scott?
Speaker: No, I'd contact Zach and Nicole Minney at Flippin' Out Pinball.
Speaker: Actually, I know two people personally who have purchased the collector's edition.
Speaker: from flipping out pinballs.
Speaker: So it's a great place.
Speaker: They have great customer service.
Speaker: So definitely reach out to them and they'll be able to hook you up.
Speaker: Yep, definitely.
Speaker: Well, our guest kind of came onto the scene crashing and kind of like blew us away back in May.
Speaker: And then he's just like part of the clan now.
Speaker: If you haven't checked out his site, his videos are fantastic.
Speaker: He loves Godfather.
Speaker: I mean, it's Vic VP.
Speaker: And I think you are a great example, Vic, of how...
Speaker: having virtual pinball can transition you into buying actual pinball.
Speaker: And you just did a video on this.
Speaker: It was like your one year owning pinball, which was a fantastic like 45-ish minute video.
Speaker: If you haven't checked this out, check out Vic.
Speaker: But we want to welcome on Vic VP.
Speaker: How you doing, man?
Speaker: Thank you guys.
Speaker: I'm just happy to be here.
Speaker: Thank you guys so much for inviting me on this.
Speaker: And again, I can't thank you guys enough.
Speaker: You guys were one of the two that messaged me after the whole whirlwind and fiasco media stuff.
Speaker: And you guys are very welcoming.
Speaker: And I'm very grateful that you guys shot me an email and called my nerves.
Speaker: So thank you for inviting me.
Speaker: And I'm just excited to be here.
Speaker: Yeah, man.
Speaker: We're excited to have you on.
Speaker: It's awesome.
Speaker: Well, you got to hang out with Scott and you guys went and did a little field trip like last Thursday, Friday.
Speaker: Where'd you guys go?
Speaker: We went to Chicago.
Speaker: We flew into Chicago.
Speaker: So full disclaimer, we did get JJP, Jersey Jack pinball.
Speaker: They had an event and they invited media people to come out.
Speaker: They did pay our expenses to come out.
Speaker: So we just want to make sure everybody's aware of that.
Speaker: with the caveat that they had no restrictions on the content that we were going to talk about.
Speaker: They basically said, you know, anything that we talk about is without bias.
Speaker: And it's our impression.
Speaker: So we're very grateful that Jersey Jack was able to do that.
Speaker: And so this is all about Avatar.
Speaker: This episode is.
Speaker: I flew in the night before.
Speaker: We went to Jersey Jack starting about 10 o'clock, and we were there until about 3 o'clock.
Speaker: So we started off.
Speaker: We got a little quick tour of Jersey Jack.
Speaker: They also took us back.
Speaker: Well, they talked about the game, talked a little bit about what was going on, went and took a tour around the factory.
Speaker: We got to see avatars that were on the line.
Speaker: We're able to see the mechs.
Speaker: We're able to see the underplay fields.
Speaker: able to see the cabinets.
Speaker: And then we went and grabbed some lunch and we played avatar.
Speaker: So, and then after that we went to interium, they had a section in interium that had all of their games.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: So the ones that they didn't have, they didn't have pirates and they didn't have a waz.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, but they had all the other games there.
Speaker: So this is actually a pretty monumental release for them.
Speaker: This is their 10th game.
Speaker: And they've really picked it up over the last couple of years where it used to be that they were taking years between games.
Speaker: So they were taking years to get another game out.
Speaker: They seem to have accelerated that.
Speaker: A few years ago, we heard Jack talk about wanting to release things more on an accelerated basis.
Speaker: It seemed like teasing out about every nine months or so.
Speaker: And they seem to have been following that for the last couple of releases.
Speaker: So that's actually been really good for them.
Speaker: So this is their 10th game.
Speaker: It's a new designer.
Speaker: So, Josh, why don't you give us the rundown on who was involved in this?
Speaker: For sure.
Speaker: So you got to understand, I was a little jealous because I start getting these notes.
Speaker: I'm at work and also my phone just starts boop.
Speaker: I'm like, what is going on?
Speaker: And Scott's taking notes.
Speaker: And because we obviously podcast together, he doesn't want me to lose these notes.
Speaker: So he's texting them over to me.
Speaker: And I'm like, what is what in the earth?
Speaker: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: They were they were quick little like, hey, this is what's going on.
Speaker: So it's a stream of consciousness.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So I'm assuming this is who worked on the game or all involved.
Speaker: So Mark Seiden is the newest designer to to JJP.
Speaker: This is his first release.
Speaker: If you haven't checked out Metroid, I'm assuming they're going to have it expo.
Speaker: Don't quote me on that, but it's a fantastic game.
Speaker: I was excited to see what he came out with with JJP just because I'm a huge Metroid fan and he did a great job with that.
Speaker: Metroid was a homebrew for those who didn't know.
Speaker: This was his own game that he just made himself.
Speaker: Then you've got on here Ken Cromwell, which is head of marketing, right?
Speaker: Is that his official title?
Speaker: Sorry, Ken, if I got that wrong.
Speaker: Eric Meniere, which got a new title.
Speaker: So he's just been a designer for a while, but now his new title is like the head of operations, isn't it, or something like that?
Speaker: He's like the George Gomez now of JJP.
Speaker: Yeah, he's basically like the chief.
Speaker: I didn't get his official title, but he is basically the chief engineer.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: Tom Capara, who left Stern,
Speaker: It's now the head over manufacturing.
Speaker: And Tom was over, not manufacturing, he was machining at Stern.
Speaker: He was one of the head guys.
Speaker: He also helped with Cactus Canyon and actually I think was the designer for Cactus Canyon as well.
Speaker: back in the 90s at Bally Williams.
Speaker: And you've got Brett Abess.
Speaker: That's the only person on here I don't know.
Speaker: Yeah, Brett Abess, he is actually the, so they are the part owners of the company.
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: So when they came in.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so I talked to Brett a little bit.
Speaker: He's super nice, super excited about being involved in pinball, wanting to bring it to the fans, try to make the best product.
Speaker: And, you know, he comes from a background where his dad has a lot of money.
Speaker: And so he's used to being in like a big business situation.
Speaker: And so he comes from that.
Speaker: He is over Jersey Jack.
Speaker: They are fans.
Speaker: They are personally fans.
Speaker: And so that's how they got involved.
Speaker: There were a couple that I didn't get on that list just because I didn't know at the time.
Speaker: And let's see if I can find those.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So there were also a couple other new ones.
Speaker: Leah Foskey, she did the art.
Speaker: And she comes from the, it was the video game background, right, Vic?
Speaker: Yeah, it was Hearthstone, I believe it was.
Speaker: Yeah, so she came from the video game background.
Speaker: And mobile gaming, too.
Speaker: I don't know if she's done actual console game, but it was, yeah.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: So definitely the video game.
Speaker: It was interesting because when we, she wasn't there, but when we talked about getting the asset integration and being able to do the art package,
Speaker: They said it was interesting because she actually had more freedom doing this than she typically does doing the video games.
Speaker: And that did stand out to me because usually it's the other way around.
Speaker: Usually when the artist is like, ah, I have all these constraints to work with.
Speaker: So that was something that really stood out.
Speaker: Especially with a Disney license.
Speaker: That's interesting.
Speaker: Also on here is Keith Johnson.
Speaker: You know Keith Johnson.
Speaker: johnson keith johnson you love his code from lord of the rings and okay but even back in the day yeah simpson but yeah lord of the rings but he's been doing the main code design architecture for all the jersey jack games yes and then you've got on animation the legendary john paul de win yep uh and he's he's been there at jgp for a while working on their animations
Speaker: And there is, okay, I'm trying not to get this wrong.
Speaker: It was Rachel Foskey.
Speaker: Am I saying that correctly?
Speaker: She's the head mechanical engineer.
Speaker: Oh, yes.
Speaker: I remember them announcing her.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Yeah, and so it was really nice to see that this game is bringing a lot of new and young blood into the pinball sphere.
Speaker: And they really come from... Rachel is a...
Speaker: She's a mechanical engineer.
Speaker: She's, she's certainly young.
Speaker: And this is great because we are getting new people into pinball and casting the net wider.
Speaker: It's, it's, it's nice just because a lot of, you know, for a long time, pinball tends to be a little bit of a self-perpetuating machine.
Speaker: And you get a lot of a lot of people who have been involved in pinball remaking and being re-involved in pinball.
Speaker: So being able to bring in more talent certainly broadens the exposure and broadens the the demographic that that is involved in pinball, which is only a good thing.
Speaker: Yeah, I agree.
Speaker: So what was your guys's first impressions walking into the factory?
Speaker: Why don't you tell me about that, Vic?
Speaker: I went to Ken and I was like, how do you get work done?
Speaker: How do you get work done in this amazing facility?
Speaker: It's like a very well-built machine.
Speaker: And when Eric was giving us the tour, you could tell he's passionate.
Speaker: And he knew where everything was.
Speaker: It was a fine-tuned machine.
Speaker: It was just from the beginning to the end and how organized and everything was.
Speaker: I was mind-blown by the whole thing.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: It is...
Speaker: I would say that if you're looking at different factories, Stern has an enormous factory.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So this is a smaller level, but it's still a big factory.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so you could tell that they were able to, to do a lot of stuff there.
Speaker: It is interesting because I did get this little tidbit that I was, we were trying to tease out.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So how many games do they make?
Speaker: You know, of course they don't release the figures anymore.
Speaker: They used to release all these things, but I did get, let's see if they are running at full capacity, they could make 80 games a day.
Speaker: Nice.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And, uh, I did specifically ask how many man hours does it take to get from start to finish?
Speaker: Um, 18 to 22.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So roughly three to four days to get something from start to finish.
Speaker: That's if they don't drop the play field and scattered the bolts every, every, that was a different tour.
Speaker: Um, uh, okay.
Speaker: However, ironically,
Speaker: Okay, Vic, do you remember this?
Speaker: They do a play field drop test.
Speaker: Yes, apparently four feet off the floor.
Speaker: Four feet.
Speaker: What?
Speaker: Wait, what?
Speaker: They suspend a play field four feet off the ground.
Speaker: Fully populated.
Speaker: We're talking a full, everything's on it, all the mechs.
Speaker: And then they, I don't know if they just release the power or they cut the cord or whatever, but it's a full drop from four feet onto a cement ground.
Speaker: And he said it's loud.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And what's the reasoning behind this play field drop?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So this is the challenge because shipping, we all know crazy things happen when you're shipping and shipping companies do not use kid gloves.
Speaker: No, they do not.
Speaker: So this is their way of trying to ensure that when it's put in a box and it ships out to a customer, that they have done as much as reasonably possible to ensure that
Speaker: that things aren't going to be broken or moving around or loose.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: So I thought that was an interesting, um, yeah.
Speaker: They even mentioned that they have a room with the flippers are just going for like days.
Speaker: Eric's like, it's just a loud room and it's very hot in that room.
Speaker: So they get, they're doing their testing and that was interesting to hear.
Speaker: So they must have moved that because when Scott and I went on the tour back in 2021, they had this like cage inside the like manufacturing area and it was going, whatever they were testing was going off the whole time.
Speaker: We're like, yeah, what's back there.
Speaker: And they're like, you can't see that.
Speaker: Like, but what is it?
Speaker: It's our next game.
Speaker: We're testing a mech.
Speaker: And it's like, so what would happen?
Speaker: Cause it's just us and Ken.
Speaker: Like, yeah, what are you going to do to stop us?
Speaker: Obviously, obviously we didn't, yeah, we didn't, we didn't peek behind the curtain.
Speaker: But,
Speaker: They do have ways, just like any manufacturing company is going to have ways of continually testing machines.
Speaker: And so they have balls that are rolling around play fields, flippers activating, and just making sure that you're going to get hours and hours and hours of wear on the play field from extensive testing to make sure that it's going to last the life of the game.
Speaker: I want to point one thing out.
Speaker: So you brought up the new artist, Leah Fowski.
Speaker: Is that what you said her name was?
Speaker: I like this because I feel like it differentiates in two different ways.
Speaker: So they brought on a new artist and that really differentiates JJP because we're not pulling from the same pool of artists that have already been in pinball.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I get there's some that come and go, but for the most part, I think the second way it differentiates is this isn't like your stereotypical pinball art.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: She's definitely taken it.
Speaker: It's cool because it's pinball art, but it's in a new direction.
Speaker: In my opinion, she did a fantastic job.
Speaker: Like I want to applaud her and applaud JJP for taking a risk and not just doing the same old same old.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, it definitely.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So let's get into that.
Speaker: There's other things that I'm going to talk that we want to talk about.
Speaker: But I want to get into, okay, so Avatar.
Speaker: Now, if you listened to us last time, we just had like a 10-second trailer to look at.
Speaker: And we did talk about this.
Speaker: So let's talk about everybody, Avatar as a theme, okay?
Speaker: And I did go out and say that this was...
Speaker: what I would probably consider a B-level theme in that it's very recognizable.
Speaker: Everybody knows Avatar.
Speaker: Everybody has seen it, has some sort of exposure to it.
Speaker: They're going to recognize it when they come into an arcade.
Speaker: However, it's not, you know, I would say Freckas.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: I just barely, I was making sure I got her so I could, so the mechanical engineers, I didn't say it correctly.
Speaker: It's, is that Freckas?
Speaker: I'm sorry, Rachel, if I'm sorry.
Speaker: if I'm saying it wrong.
Speaker: But it's a, it, it is a theme that, you know, if you look at, oh, sorry, Frerichs.
Speaker: That's Rachel Frerichs.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: I, I want to, I want to make sure that I was, I was saying everybody's name.
Speaker: It's that monkey on your back.
Speaker: I get you.
Speaker: I did.
Speaker: So I actually went back and I was pulling up in the background.
Speaker: I was watching the, the avatar video that had everybody's name in it.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: A-list titles.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: What's an A-list title?
Speaker: Star Wars.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Star Wars is an A-list title.
Speaker: Harry Potter.
Speaker: Harry Potter is an A-list title.
Speaker: Pokemon.
Speaker: Pokemon is not an A-list title.
Speaker: Um, dude, it's the highest grossing franchise of all time.
Speaker: How is it not?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: Do you want to go on with wind pinball machine?
Speaker: Um, that's not even near the top 25 franchises.
Speaker: Actually, when you adjust for inflation, it actually is.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Made movies, but not franchises.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Fine.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So yeah, this is, this is a solid theme.
Speaker: That is quite recognizable.
Speaker: And so in some ways, though, I think this is good because people aren't fully immersed in the lore of this.
Speaker: They understand it.
Speaker: OK, and there are super fans out there who are totally into it, but it doesn't have the handcuffs, I would say, that a Star Wars game would have and that like a Harry Potter game would have.
Speaker: OK, now I'm going to I'm going to throw it to Vic and ask your thoughts and I'm going to throw it over to Josh.
Speaker: I mean, again, if we're talking about Avatar, I am, I'm not in it.
Speaker: I don't like it.
Speaker: It's not for me when it was in the movie theaters and people were talking about it.
Speaker: I'm personally not into that, like sci-fi.
Speaker: I just, it's not for me.
Speaker: So when I heard that they were doing it.
Speaker: You at least recognize it.
Speaker: You knew what?
Speaker: No, no.
Speaker: I used to see blue and the ears and I knew, I knew who and what it is.
Speaker: But as far as me being a fan of the theme, it's, I, it's, I don't, I'm not a fan of the movie.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay, Josh?
Speaker: It does not do anything for me.
Speaker: I'm not a huge Avatar fan.
Speaker: Okay, which is fine.
Speaker: Yeah, it just isn't.
Speaker: Here's the problem with me.
Speaker: I felt like I don't like to go to movies to have a political message.
Speaker: And I felt like every time you watch an Avatar movie, there's some kind of underlying political message that they're trying to push.
Speaker: And I'm like, it's just not for me.
Speaker: I'm sorry.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yes, we all know what Avatar is.
Speaker: We know.
Speaker: Once you see the blue guy, it's like, all right, Avatar.
Speaker: Not Smurf.
Speaker: Avatar.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Okay, now have either of you guys been able to go down to Walt Disney World and see the world of Pandora down there?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It's really cool in that you're going through and you're walking through like an avatar for the Pandora forest.
Speaker: And it's really pretty.
Speaker: A lot of bioluminescent stuff.
Speaker: And when you're riding on, I don't know if you're riding on the banshee, because the banshee is the big one, right?
Speaker: The big bird.
Speaker: And what's the small other one that you.
Speaker: The whale.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, no, no, not the whale.
Speaker: I'm talking like the other thing, the other smaller bird.
Speaker: There's like the one that you connect your braid to and.
Speaker: And meld somehow with.
Speaker: Dude, I've watched this movie once and I just.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I haven't seen the sequel.
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: I haven't.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You're speaking French to me.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So the ride though is you're riding one of these creatures and you're flying around.
Speaker: And so.
Speaker: It's a, it is a really cool ride down in Disney world.
Speaker: So my point is that it's still a super popular ride.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Because the, because the visuals of it, especially at a theme park environment are very immersive.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so that, that's really what I was getting at with that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So now we're talking about the theme.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Let's, let's talk about the art.
Speaker: Vic, you said it feels a little bit more like a comic book yard.
Speaker: Yeah, I get the, I don't like to use the word cartoony because people could take that differently, but I would say comic book style.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What passes off for cartoon artwork nowadays too is kind of, it's like, yeah, yeah, I get you there.
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, I'm a 90s kid, so if I say the word cartoony, I automatically think like Looney Tunes and I think of like Hey Arnold and Rugrats.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, old school scratch style kind of stuff like that.
Speaker: If someone says cartoon, I immediately default to like the El Cheapo Disney straight to video cartoons.
Speaker: Cause I, like, I, like when someone says cartoon, I don't think, oh, this is like a high level release, you know, like Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast, you know, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker: I don't think Frozen, what I think is like cheap.
Speaker: That's really, so I, I appreciate.
Speaker: Like the Little Mermaid 2 where she gets a daughter kind of thing?
Speaker: Yeah, seriously.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And like all those garbage ones that I never saw.
Speaker: So I appreciate that not using the cartoon.
Speaker: I am a huge, at least growing up, I was a huge comic book fan.
Speaker: So saying comic book is an artistic style in itself, which is really big.
Speaker: So I don't know, Josh, what are your thoughts on the art?
Speaker: On the art, I think they did.
Speaker: I did think it was great.
Speaker: I feel like...
Speaker: I like the unique direction they've went with it.
Speaker: I think, you know, Dennis Creasel says this all the time on EGPs and Pimalshow, like, we've just gotten so used to, like, amping up the saturation to 10.
Speaker: And granted, like, you kind of are with this, but it's more like... This game is not 10.
Speaker: This is, like, 15.
Speaker: exactly but this is spinal tap this one goes to 11 yeah well you got saturation then you've got like uv lighting in three different ways and like but but the thing is is i feel like the artwork is something you would see more like with what pinball's been lately it's it doesn't feel like pinball artwork but it it does does that make sense like we're not doing this stare like old stereotypical stuff but we're going in a new direction i think they've done a great job with it
Speaker: There are two things that I will point out in the art and I'll see if you guys agree with me on this.
Speaker: There are some themes where the oversaturation, like you are being bombarded with a light show, you're being bombarded with colors, flights, flashing, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker: Sometimes it feels like it's off in that it doesn't feel thematically consistent.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And even though Godfather is a great presentation, okay?
Speaker: Vic, you have it behind you.
Speaker: Like, it's there, right?
Speaker: It's a great presentation.
Speaker: The light show for Godfather, it's a little distracting to me because it's not what you would expect in a Godfather universe.
Speaker: Yes, I hear you.
Speaker: The Godfather universe, it's in like the, it's a story going from like the 1950s
Speaker: 30s through the 1970s right and so that type of stuff was not present now i i understand why you do it by the way i understand why uh you know eric chose when when we did godfather to bring the pinball element because if you did something with muted tones and brown colors it's not going to bring people in
Speaker: Yeah, it's not approachable.
Speaker: Yeah, it's not approachable.
Speaker: It's not going to work for a pinball theme.
Speaker: So you have to pinball it up a little bit with with Avatar.
Speaker: You are.
Speaker: I mean, this is like a Skittles induced seizure.
Speaker: Like you are being bombarded with colors, lights, sound, art.
Speaker: But it seems consistent with what Avatar is.
Speaker: I was just going to ask that.
Speaker: I was like, because you said that you went into the world of Avatar at Disney.
Speaker: And I would assume like color.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And I feel like that's you get the color on that.
Speaker: And like bioluminescence is, you know, or whatever the, the glow in the dark stuff, that is a huge deal with, with avatar, with the world of Pandora, with that kind of stuff.
Speaker: And you see it a lot on here.
Speaker: So the one thing I want to point about the point out about the art, and I'm sorry if I'm stealing this from you, Scott, but my understanding is, is at, at the thing, I know that they said it in the video and whatnot, but I also, while you guys were there, they really, really stressed, uh,
Speaker: how much the, the Navi use their left arm.
Speaker: Like that's the lore of it.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And we did, we had some discussions behind the scenes on this.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: No, go, go ahead.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You can, you can tell exactly what my question was to you when we were talking about the art.
Speaker: So Scott takes it, has a picture of the side art of one of the Navi's shooting a bow and arrow.
Speaker: I can't remember her name.
Speaker: but she's she's shooting it with her right hand it's like it's like nefteri or uh yeah neateri if you go on pin side yeah you can actually see it on pin side it's that thing right behind you vic yeah so look neateri she is shooting with her so i don't know if that was reversed for some reason but okay it should have been on the opposite side of the cabinet or something like it's yeah
Speaker: it's so it's a nerd yeah okay i and i don't know and again if you're really gonna nitpick on something i that's a small thing the only reason why i brought it up to josh was because they made a big deal about being like immersive in the lore yeah like at the very end the match screen doesn't have numbers because navi don't have numbers so you have like
Speaker: the dandelion seeds that go and like settle on you and they don't have like,
Speaker: metal and they don't have straight edges and so even the inserts are creatively uh painted so it doesn't emphasize that okay that's a very small thing but like even the development video it's 18 minutes long and there's a good little chunk dedicated to them about the specific mode where you're playing with your left hand because you get like five times the points or something like that but as soon as you use the right flipper yep you're out of that mode right yeah
Speaker: And so that's when you said that, I was like, that seems like a small oversight.
Speaker: Like, and I get it.
Speaker: Like we're nitpicking here.
Speaker: Like we've knit.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Like, yeah, it's, it's, it's not, it's not a deal breaker.
Speaker: It's like, it's a poster.
Speaker: It's a poster.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: And it could be that just got reversed.
Speaker: because they were like oh it looks better this way yeah it would like i said it's really not a big deal if you're out there and you're like well i'm not buying this game now because she's shooting with the right maybe you need to reconsider your life options of like if that's really what you're like nitpicking about like maybe it's time like okay okay a little bit one thing i will say and this okay this seems to me um
Speaker: Maybe this is a style vibe that I get from different themes though.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: If you're going to do avatar, uh,
Speaker: there seems to be some sort of intensity in the facial expressions that you would expect.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So if you look at like them shooting or in a battle scene or something like that, and you know, there, there are times where they have a very aggressive hunter like focus in their face.
Speaker: The one challenge that happens with a lot of art that they, they sell for these different things is,
Speaker: sometimes that emotion seems muted.
Speaker: And if I look at the art picture, again, this is nitpicking, but you know what?
Speaker: We have an hour to talk about Avatar, so I'm going to.
Speaker: You're welcome, JJP.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Hey, you're getting our full constant.
Speaker: Hey, we paid attention.
Speaker: We paid attention.
Speaker: Scott took pages and pages of notes.
Speaker: I did.
Speaker: Trust me.
Speaker: I would have liked to have a little more of an intense action poster.
Speaker: And again, this is probably way overthinking a poster.
Speaker: But it seems, you know, it's like when you see a shirt that has something that's like, oh, this is, it's a family photo of the avatar.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And they're serenely trying to shoot an arrow.
Speaker: That's different than, hey, I'm going into battle and I'm trying to shoot something with that arrow.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And enough about that.
Speaker: Now, that is totally a personal preference and a personal just evaluation.
Speaker: That being said, it is a great visual art presentation of things.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I feel like we've talked about art for like a while now.
Speaker: We have.
Speaker: I just want to ask Scott one question.
Speaker: Go for it, man.
Speaker: Only because you mentioned before how you are deep into comic.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Are you...
Speaker: Would you be upset at me?
Speaker: Cause I said it was comic book style.
Speaker: No, I, I would not because I think, uh, I also have a different interpretation of comic book style.
Speaker: Um, and there, you know, there's another release we are going to talk about later, you know, uh,
Speaker: Stern has their comic book release, which is very comic book-y too.
Speaker: This feels a little different.
Speaker: This feels like comic book style, but also more of an art project.
Speaker: So I would not take any offense to say it's comic book style because there is a certain style that is associated with comic books.
Speaker: Yeah, I like the way you said it.
Speaker: I've got one more thing too.
Speaker: So the thing I like about it is when you have a mobile or mobile game artists, sometimes they overdo the artwork to make up for like the gameplay or like stuff like that.
Speaker: And so I feel like you're treading a really fine line because you don't want it to come off of like, like shadow legends or whatever that game is, or you know what I'm saying?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I have a better one.
Speaker: I have a better one.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Go for it.
Speaker: The art for Atari centipede is amazing.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: The game, not so much, but the art is amazing.
Speaker: Like, and that's how all seventies games were.
Speaker: Like the art was really cool because the game visual representation was not that cool.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: So next.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: When I first saw this, when I saw the spec sheet before they even released avatar and it said had six flippers for like two under play fields, there's like an upper play field.
Speaker: Did I say six flippers?
Speaker: You didn't say that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I mean, it just has a lot of stuff, right?
Speaker: And like the first thing that came to my mind was haunted house.
Speaker: And I was like, Ooh, like haunted house.
Speaker: Like it's a fun game.
Speaker: No, it's not.
Speaker: It's one of those ones... Anyhow, it is fun.
Speaker: It's a terrible game.
Speaker: No, it's not Bugs Bunny bash.
Speaker: Okay, it's not Bugs Bunny bad, but it's... It's not bad, but it's one of those things like...
Speaker: you thought you could, but you never stopped to think should you.
Speaker: It's the Jeff Goldblum Jurassic Parks.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so when I started hearing this, I was like, oh, crap.
Speaker: JJP is throwing as much as they can into the game to make up whether they feel like the price gap, whatever it may be.
Speaker: And I was like, how is this going to turn out?
Speaker: And then when it came out and I saw it, I was like, this is pretty fantastic.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You guys played hands on.
Speaker: How did it play with all the stuff in it?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You know, I'll let Vic go first.
Speaker: Go ahead.
Speaker: So I always, it's always crazy when you walk up first to a game because me personally, I'm just trying to keep the ball alive.
Speaker: You're looking at everything, looking at like all the amazingness, you're looking at the wire forms and all that.
Speaker: But I was very happy that we were able to at least play for like a good two hours.
Speaker: It played great, but if you asked me, like, what was I doing?
Speaker: I was just trying to keep the ball alive the whole time.
Speaker: And also trying to hit a couple of the unique shots.
Speaker: It was pretty cool.
Speaker: You hit a couple of shots, and then the ball would just randomly pop out, like, on the right orbit.
Speaker: It had its moments.
Speaker: But, again, it's like, you know, I walked up to it, and I was like – and I see how, like, Scott walked up to it as well.
Speaker: Like, Kale walked up to it.
Speaker: And you guys are, like, studying the machine, and I'm like –
Speaker: I'm like, I wouldn't, I'm not even at that level yet.
Speaker: I'm like, I'm just trying to keep the ball alive.
Speaker: And then I was mainly trying to get into the whole crapsuit battle, if I'm going to be honest, because I wanted to see that on the play field.
Speaker: But it was enjoyable.
Speaker: I had a good time with it.
Speaker: It was, did I understand the game in two hours?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: but i have hunger did you hear my game update it scared me my just to give you guys a heads up because godfather after two hours of like a track mode the guns go off so oh that'd be awesome i i think that's the first time i've heard the the uh the duck fart from the uh the updates so uh okay actually i'm i'm gonna put a pin in exactly what you said and i'm gonna come around to it at the end okay vick okay
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Going up to it.
Speaker: So six flippers.
Speaker: Now it, it didn't feel like you were adding flippers just to add flippers.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Which is nice.
Speaker: If you look at Josh, do you want me to just kind of go a little bit around the play field a little bit?
Speaker: And if you want,
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, so there are areas of the play field, but it doesn't feel like it's chopped up into, Hey, the, uh, it like linear, like it's a, it's a sharp demarcation between the, the upper right and the upper left and the lower right and the middle, right and middle left.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: it felt like everything organically flew together or flowed together.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Uh, the, there are some, some challenging shots and I'm looking mainly at the left upper side.
Speaker: Uh, there is a, there is a ramp that you can hit with all three flippers.
Speaker: And I don't think you can hit it with the fourth one, the right upper one.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: If I'm going to nitpick, I would argue it's a wide standard ramp, whereas a similar concept was done by Elwyn in Avengers Infinity Quest.
Speaker: And it's a little bit more of a shaped ramp.
Speaker: And so if you're hitting it from the right flipper, it has a little bit more of a trajectory that guides it up.
Speaker: And so it, it, it seemed like a slightly smoother shot.
Speaker: I am not going to begrudge Mark on that because Keith has done, you know, so many games that he's used to doing that trajectory.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The, but it, it, it is a fun game.
Speaker: The, the flow of it is a lot of fun.
Speaker: The, the,
Speaker: The shots I felt were makeable.
Speaker: Now, I did say Joel did mention, he's like, Scott, I actually, there was one shot that I don't think that you did hit.
Speaker: And I, I was not aware that I missed that.
Speaker: I didn't hit that shot.
Speaker: And it's because you are a little overwhelmed.
Speaker: There's a lot of stuff going on.
Speaker: And, uh, and so I need to dial in about if their shots are super hard, super easy, but I felt that you could at least keep the game going right there.
Speaker: Like, yeah, even, even a, even a professional average player, which I am, I could still keep things going.
Speaker: Oh, by the way, the, the best, uh, the best burn I got over the weekend as I was playing a game with Ron, I was playing Ron from slam tilt until, yeah.
Speaker: And I was playing Elton John and I was, I was really flipping just bad, poorly.
Speaker: And he turned to me and he said, Oh, that's right.
Speaker: Josh is the player in your group.
Speaker: I was like, that's, that's accurate and hurts at the same time.
Speaker: But it was really funny.
Speaker: Cause he was trying to give me like all the rules and like, Ron, I, I've never played.
Speaker: It was dialed in.
Speaker: It was like, I've never really played this game.
Speaker: So I'm overwhelmed, but.
Speaker: Now, Scott, do you know what shot you couldn't hit?
Speaker: Like, well, okay.
Speaker: I believe he was saying it was the, the, the left upper area.
Speaker: um on avatar yeah it was on avatar okay we were just talking about uh dialed in there for a second okay yeah no it was on avatar so no so i'm i'm looking at it i'm trying to zoom in it was like the jungle area right well yeah each spot's kind of so the play fields divide into five different areas yeah of the world so the upper left i want to say it's
Speaker: I see a lot of trees.
Speaker: It's not like where the ball locks.
Speaker: So there's like a vertical VUK and there was another, there's like a wire form that connects to another wire form.
Speaker: And, you know, so maybe it was the ramp on the left.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I can't remember exactly which one because I thought I had actually hit all of them.
Speaker: But either way, I thought that it was,
Speaker: It was fine.
Speaker: It was fun.
Speaker: There wasn't a shot that I felt that I was completely getting blocked from.
Speaker: So it could have been that I wasn't actively trying to shoot that shot.
Speaker: Now, again, depending on how your play style is, I don't know.
Speaker: I mean, again, I would consider myself average beginner average.
Speaker: I did notice.
Speaker: And again, I was watching all of you guys play.
Speaker: Me personally, I had like a 25 minute game.
Speaker: And I was mind-blown by having that long of a game.
Speaker: And I'm like, does Jersey Jack have these set up in a way to have the game go longer?
Speaker: What did you think, Scott?
Speaker: Were you playing longer than you normally played?
Speaker: For a first-time game, maybe.
Speaker: And they could have had him set up a little bit more of...
Speaker: I don't want to say easier, but more accessible just because they were trying to get us to experience the game flow.
Speaker: So getting into it now, we did talk about they have two lower play fields in this, which I think is the first time two lower play fields have been done.
Speaker: I think so as well.
Speaker: This was nice, though, because they were OK.
Speaker: There are going to be some people that criticize the first play field.
Speaker: Because the first play field you pop down and the pop bumper goes off.
Speaker: However, I did notice sometimes the pop bumper wasn't actively activating.
Speaker: And so I didn't know, was I supposed to be doing the pop bumper or so?
Speaker: I think that's, that's probably more of an early code thing that they're going to fix.
Speaker: Probably just adjust the switch on the pop bumper.
Speaker: So it's either that or legit.
Speaker: It could just be an early code because there was a little bit of a delay.
Speaker: you, you change the targets that the pop bumper is trying to hit with the flippers.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And then it drops down and activates the second lower play field, which is the, it's the mini play field with the two flippers, the crabs and that's the crab suit that you're fighting.
Speaker: So wait, you're telling me there's two play fields down the crab suit.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, no,
Speaker: There's a play field above it.
Speaker: That is just like one.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The pop bumper one.
Speaker: And then you go down to the mech suit one, the crab.
Speaker: You have to hit enough targets to get to crab.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And the crab suit one, it is a, it is a three quarter ball.
Speaker: So people wondering about, uh, the mini, the mini play fields.
Speaker: So my experience before was like Shrek where it has like a, uh,
Speaker: a half inch ball and it felt kind of unfulfilling just because you're flipping this ball and it's flying around.
Speaker: Uh, the nice thing about this that made it interesting is the lower play field is rotated maybe about 20 degrees or so.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so you're not shooting straight up and down.
Speaker: So it doesn't just feel like it feels challenging, but not too challenging.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: So you're still able, you're still supposed to hit some hit.
Speaker: First off, you're supposed to hit the targets.
Speaker: It's like three to five.
Speaker: Three targets.
Speaker: Yeah, three targets that are aligned.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And then the second time you go down there, it's harder because you have to hit the orbits.
Speaker: But it was fun.
Speaker: It didn't feel like I was a lot of lower play fields.
Speaker: You get there and you're just like, okay, just get this over with so I can get back up.
Speaker: Yeah, so luckily, it's like a timed mode for Crab Suit.
Speaker: You're only in there for the first time for, I think it's like 10 seconds.
Speaker: So you're kind of like, am I just going to be here all day?
Speaker: But then your flippers kind of just die if you run out of time.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: Gotcha.
Speaker: Well, and also speaking of flipping out pinball, if you go to their Facebook, Zach did actually take a picture in his hand, the six balls, and then the little one that goes in this play field.
Speaker: It's actually not too much smaller.
Speaker: I kind of had to be like.
Speaker: Well, so the standard balls are one-inch balls.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So it's a three quarter inch.
Speaker: So it's just slightly smaller.
Speaker: So it, but it felt natural too, right?
Speaker: Like it didn't feel like you were like that, that Stewie pinball.
Speaker: You feel like you're slapping a BB around.
Speaker: Like it's not it.
Speaker: You know what?
Speaker: It kind of felt it.
Speaker: I think it, um,
Speaker: I think it felt the environment better because it was like forced perspective.
Speaker: It almost felt like the lower play field was farther away.
Speaker: Yeah, that's what I think, either they mentioned it or it's in the trailer where they said like, that bowl is smaller on purpose to give you that visual look of it being like underwater.
Speaker: It also allows them to do more with the play field because if it's a standard size ball,
Speaker: they're smaller things that you can do with the flippers.
Speaker: You would have to have something a lot bigger, such as like the lower play field in ACDC, which isn't really that fun.
Speaker: It's cool looking, but it's not that fun.
Speaker: Now in ACDC, I'm not 100% sure, but I feel like you're constantly in there until like you drain.
Speaker: Yeah, it's, yeah.
Speaker: Now, real quick, because Scott mentioned about the pop bumper, you're right.
Speaker: Sometimes the bowl would just sit.
Speaker: And I felt like the pop bumper was cool because you should... I took the aspect of you should kind of nudge, but...
Speaker: now that i think of it maybe they should probably incorporate like the left flipper would actually activate the pop and then your right would change the target when you first get in there you don't realize that you have control of the target because i was trying to call out say that now in fairness it does say that on the other side like change the targets like change the target with the flipper so it that that would not be a
Speaker: a long-term confusion.
Speaker: That's like the first time you go down there.
Speaker: Like, what am I doing?
Speaker: Considering that the first time you played, so there were four games down there.
Speaker: The first time you played on the third, third one over and I played on the second one over.
Speaker: And so if they, if the ball both sat down there for a while, that tells me it's a code issue because if it were a switch issue, then, then only one of us would have experienced that.
Speaker: so gameplay was, was pretty fun.
Speaker: It sounds like it's a, did any of it feel unnatural?
Speaker: Cause like there's some games you play and you just like, things aren't feeling like they're in the right spot.
Speaker: Did this all feel like it flowed well and the shots were makeable and whatnot?
Speaker: I, I feel that this is, and it could be that the flippers are much better on this machine.
Speaker: Because when I played Elton, the first time I played Elton John was this weekend too, where the flippers felt snappy.
Speaker: They felt what I'm used to on a standard stern, really, or a Williams, right?
Speaker: So I have a lot of the CGC remakes.
Speaker: The flippers have a very crisp feel.
Speaker: And Elton John felt that way.
Speaker: Actually, Elton John almost felt like the flippers were a little juiced, which they could have been.
Speaker: I was playing it at Interium here.
Speaker: the flippers felt really snappy, which feels like an upgrade from what, like Guns N' Roses feels a little lag on the flippers.
Speaker: In my playing experience, Wizard of Oz is the same way.
Speaker: They don't have that really crisp flip, but this felt very similar to that.
Speaker: So with that, this felt like the most standard release
Speaker: that would be consistent with other high end manufacturers.
Speaker: And I liked the layout.
Speaker: I thought it was a lot of fun.
Speaker: The shots were approachable, the shots were reachable and it felt like the flippers were doing what I wanted them to do.
Speaker: What are your thoughts, Vic?
Speaker: I, uh, so again, for me, for Godfather was the first time I ever experienced a JJP.
Speaker: So from my understanding and research, I believe Godfather is like when the new flippers came out for JJP.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: They felt great.
Speaker: I don't really want to compare it to Godfather.
Speaker: I feel like it was much... I would say the word snappier.
Speaker: I don't want to copy you, but it felt good.
Speaker: That's the way it felt.
Speaker: It's like the flippers did what I expect them to do on other manufacturers.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Now, the one mech I was concerned about because it's kind of like in Godfather, but the...
Speaker: the droid slingshot um sometimes when yeah so you hit the left the far left ramp that will set you up on that top left flipper if you don't hit it it kind of just kind of travels down along the slingshot yeah and i visually i was like oh man this looks like a straight down the middle but it actually wouldn't do that i was actually surprised it wasn't but yeah
Speaker: The slingshot off the droid mech was very cool.
Speaker: I was really trying to focus on the shrimp.
Speaker: I was trying to see how that was.
Speaker: The dive ramp was pretty cool.
Speaker: And I'm a fan of the call out.
Speaker: When the girl said dive, I was like, oh, I got to go.
Speaker: The one shot that I feel was difficult for me personally was the eclipse shot.
Speaker: I don't know why.
Speaker: That right ramp, it was just a challenge.
Speaker: And it's a jump ramp that goes into a spinner, right?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: However, well, okay.
Speaker: It is... I'm going to cut you off, Scott, real quick.
Speaker: So it's actually funny when we were looking at the actual mech in hand on the factory.
Speaker: In the pictures and in the trailer video, that spinner, it looks like it's such a far shot.
Speaker: And it looks like it travels, but it's actually pretty close to the end of the ramp.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But yeah, it's a ramp to a spinner and then it brings it down to the right orbit.
Speaker: The challenge with the eclipse shot.
Speaker: And so there is a mode that is pretty fun.
Speaker: It's the eclipse mode where you start, you know, you start the eclipse and it's a, it's a really cool effect because the play field kind of dims and starts going from the right side to the left side.
Speaker: And you are building and building this jackpot and,
Speaker: And then the eclipse shot is you have built.
Speaker: So there was one time where I, I got like $130 million in that mode.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Or not dollars, but no currency, no currency.
Speaker: I got 130 million points.
Speaker: And if I had hit the eclipse shot, I would have got double all of that.
Speaker: And there is, you know, it's a pressure shot.
Speaker: You feel like, oh, you know, so, so it's hitting a shot under pressure that, that certainly was hard.
Speaker: I don't know if that played into it, but that definitely, uh, yeah, that, that was hard to hit at the right moment, but the, uh,
Speaker: We'll get into the lights, but that is, that is, well, actually let's just get into it now.
Speaker: That was a really cool effect as, as it was going across.
Speaker: Cause you had like the really bright lights.
Speaker: And then when the eclipse came, it really fit the mood.
Speaker: Yeah, I loved it.
Speaker: And when we were talking to like the whole team and all that, you don't really notice it off the bat on the first game.
Speaker: But as like the eclipse is leaving, the left side of the play field is starting to like lighten up.
Speaker: Yeah, it's like I don't think you could get it good on a camera.
Speaker: But in person, it was like, no, mind blowing.
Speaker: Okay, that's actually one of the problems with this game is trying to find a good way of capturing it on camera so you can see how it plays.
Speaker: You're telling me Rocky Mountain Pinball Show didn't do a great job this weekend?
Speaker: No, no, they didn't.
Speaker: It was...
Speaker: And that's the problem, right?
Speaker: When you get these games in the wild, it's hard to capture how they feel in person.
Speaker: And, okay, we have seen this before.
Speaker: We have seen this before when people talk about the art of games.
Speaker: And, you know, we saw it with John Wick.
Speaker: We saw all this kind of stuff, and people are like,
Speaker: It looks really good in person, like the foil and the art show and everything like that.
Speaker: But it's hard to capture that in a stream as a feature.
Speaker: But it really is an impressive, immersive element is getting the lights out.
Speaker: And the really, they, they did show some, you know, a prototype.
Speaker: They haven't finalized the play field for the collector's edition.
Speaker: That's going to have the 3d, but go and look at their video.
Speaker: Cause their video shows examples of the bioluminescent printing and it looks really cool in person.
Speaker: Yeah, they had like the two flashlights going on it.
Speaker: I'm like, whoa.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And now, at interior, I mean, you can see some.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So you've got three different UV inks in this.
Speaker: The red looks really cool.
Speaker: Can you really tell?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: He did it on the side art blade with the flame.
Speaker: It was insane.
Speaker: I was like, whoa.
Speaker: When you think red UV, that was red.
Speaker: It looked like a cut LCD trail that was illuminated from underneath.
Speaker: That's what it looked like.
Speaker: Kind of like Tron, like the bike trails off of Tron kind of thing?
Speaker: Okay, even just think of like a lightsaber, like a thin, wiggly lightsaber.
Speaker: I know it was really glowing impressively.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: The one thing I, because we're talking about the lighting on it, the UV on this was amazing.
Speaker: The only thing I can compare to UV is Stranger Things.
Speaker: And I only play that on location.
Speaker: And I don't know exactly how Stranger Things is set up.
Speaker: But when Stranger Things goes into UV, it blinds me.
Speaker: Like I can't see anything, but the UV on this, it's, they did it very clean.
Speaker: Cause JJP is good with that, with their like spotlights that they have.
Speaker: You don't like, it's not blind.
Speaker: You doesn't hurt your eyes.
Speaker: And when you see the flippers like glowing, it was mind blowing.
Speaker: It was cool.
Speaker: And it did visually.
Speaker: Then this was a happy accident.
Speaker: The flippers looked like they changed colors when they did the, and they, they, that wasn't even intentional.
Speaker: They, they turned it on like, Oh, that,
Speaker: That wasn't supposed to happen, but it looks really cool.
Speaker: I mean, we meant to do that.
Speaker: Well, they were they were up front that it was like a happy accident.
Speaker: But yeah, I was just mentioning also the under play fields.
Speaker: They are well illuminated.
Speaker: So a lot of under play fields, it's hard to see anything that's going on in there, but they have so much illumination on the lower play fields.
Speaker: So you could see so well underneath that.
Speaker: I was impressed by that.
Speaker: Maybe I'm the only one that was like, it looked really cool.
Speaker: No, I like the health bar on the crapsuit.
Speaker: It just visually gave you that look of like, wow, you're deep underwater and it would just glow.
Speaker: My only gripe with the crapsuit model is that it has like the two eyes.
Speaker: It looks like cars.
Speaker: Like a Cars character?
Speaker: I don't know what that's supposed to be.
Speaker: Like on top of the crapsuit, right?
Speaker: Maybe that's what the Avatar crapsuit looks like, though.
Speaker: Have you looked at that?
Speaker: Yeah, because someone pointed this out, too.
Speaker: They sent us a picture.
Speaker: Like, why is this weird smiley face on top of the crapsuit?
Speaker: I've seen it.
Speaker: I'm like, it looks like the... I looked at it as like, you know, because I have a three-year-old daughter, I'd look at it as like the cars, you know, like Disney cars with the eyes.
Speaker: That's like the only thing I didn't... I just visually would see that.
Speaker: But the lighting on it and what I really liked...
Speaker: was jjp did a good job that when you are in that bottom play field the lighting on the table it doesn't turn off but at least it's like you know like hey your eyes have to go to the lower play field now yeah right let's see i did take some pictures of that crab suit so let me see if i can get some good okay while you're looking that up the only other couple questions i have so custom speech by stephen lang he's a colonel quarry rich
Speaker: something like that okay the the the mech suit that stabby stabs on the playfield he's in that in the movie so uh how was the call outs like obviously you guys kind of alluded to like the dive earlier but like overall how like how is the sound in the call outs is it immersive like how is it okay i don't really see the smiley face on the crab guy like he looks standard
Speaker: I just see two eyes.
Speaker: White eyes and then two dots for the eyeballs, like the irises.
Speaker: But yes, as far as the quads, I've never seen Avatar.
Speaker: So take that.
Speaker: I don't think there was enough of the gentlemen that you said.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I don't think there was enough of them.
Speaker: This is early code, so there might be more coming.
Speaker: This is really early, yeah.
Speaker: Now, they did say they got quotes from the movie from all the characters they wanted.
Speaker: They didn't list them all off, but they said from all they wanted, okay?
Speaker: So those will be incorporated.
Speaker: This isn't a... And that was one big drawback with Pirates of the Caribbean, right?
Speaker: Is that, oh, you get a lot of sea scenes that don't have... Yeah, you get their pictures, and that's about it.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: And so, so they had that and there were like 400 custom line, like lines of call out.
Speaker: They also were able to get, so they had a hundred percent access.
Speaker: So this is all of the assets.
Speaker: So I guess let's transition to assets.
Speaker: They had a hundred percent access to all CGI stuff, which a lot of stuff was CGI.
Speaker: So they do have tons of stuff, and the LCD screen is well incorporated in this game.
Speaker: It is probably the... It's the best part of the... If you want to be thematically immersed in this, the LCD screen is...
Speaker: JJP does it the best, 100%.
Speaker: I thought you were gonna say that to date, I think it's the best.
Speaker: I think it's just like everything that's on that screen, the way they have it all laid out, I think it's the best they've ever done.
Speaker: It's the best of JJP so far, absolutely.
Speaker: And the movie clip integration, and this has always been the challenge, right?
Speaker: How do you incorporate movie assets in when you're not taking away from the gameplay?
Speaker: And I'm looking at you monsters when grandpa walks over to the book and flips and you're just dying the fifth time it's happened.
Speaker: It's just so painful.
Speaker: But no, this is great because it just feels like it naturally just flows and the stuff up there gives everybody who's watching you something to see.
Speaker: Yeah, it was visually, it was amazing.
Speaker: I was also trying to see like if there's much repetition videos.
Speaker: Like, you know, inside modes, like on Godfather is like, you know, you get like two or three scenes, not much repetition videos.
Speaker: I mean, you get your standard ball lock, you know, ball lock one animations.
Speaker: But again, the, the, the LCD, the, my biggest, I love the UI that like, I, I honestly think that if the UI didn't look the way it did, I think it would have done damage to the game, but the UI is just, it's beautiful.
Speaker: It's like a chef kiss on that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So overall, they've done 10 games now.
Speaker: How do you feel about Atar and where does it land in their 10 games?
Speaker: Is it towards the top?
Speaker: Is it more the middle or is it the bottom?
Speaker: Vic, you owns, I have Wizard of Oz, which is the earliest JJP.
Speaker: That's actually the only one that I have right now.
Speaker: But you have at least two and you played the other ones too.
Speaker: So what is your thought?
Speaker: It's like, I want to say it's like, yeah, it's the best thing.
Speaker: It's just, for me, the theme, it's not a theme for me.
Speaker: As far as comparing it to other games, though, I would rate it.
Speaker: You don't want to say the word, it's number one.
Speaker: But I would probably say, I'm trying to keep everything in mind, though.
Speaker: Animations, callouts, the gameplay, and all that.
Speaker: I think it's top, dude.
Speaker: I would rate it as like a one to two.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It's number one.
Speaker: I'll tell you why.
Speaker: People will now people got pushed back.
Speaker: People push back other other content creators that I was talking to push back and they're like, what?
Speaker: No, have you played Elton John?
Speaker: I'm like, yeah, I have played Elton John and I owned Elton John when it was called Spider-Man.
Speaker: Um, because I don't know when I, when it was Star Trek.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And by the way, that's Elton John is a fun game.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I know you have Elton John to this.
Speaker: Elton John felt like a, a blinged up version of,
Speaker: Of an older game.
Speaker: That's what it felt like.
Speaker: It's still really cool, really pretty.
Speaker: It is very Steve Ritchie, but it also just felt like it was nothing new that I saw with Elton John.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It felt like it felt like a, Hey, this is a bigger budget version of what he has done before.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It's not like it's bad.
Speaker: It's just saying I have already seen it.
Speaker: So this is recency bias, right?
Speaker: I owned a similar game.
Speaker: And Led Zeppelin to you on that as well.
Speaker: I own, I own, I still own it.
Speaker: So, and if you look at dialed in, okay, dialed in,
Speaker: is definitely a Pat Lawler theme.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: It is a Pat Lawler game.
Speaker: It feels like a newer version of a nineties game.
Speaker: It feels like, you know, the stuff he did in the nineties, still good, but a, a Jersey Jack style on an older, um, a Jersey Jack presentation on an older style game.
Speaker: OK, and you could and you could even argue the same.
Speaker: So Toy Story, Toy Story.
Speaker: There's a lot of Pat Lawler and Toy Story and Toy Story felt like a like Woody shoot out at at Paradise Pier in Disneyland.
Speaker: You know, it felt like it's in the world of Disney now.
Speaker: and it's in the world of Toy Story, but it still just felt like, hey, you're playing a game that's in the world of Toy Story.
Speaker: It's fine.
Speaker: But I played Toy Story, and I played Elton John, and I thought, you know what?
Speaker: And I played Dialed In, I got more time on it, and I felt like these are games that I have felt like I've played before.
Speaker: They're still good, but I felt like I've played them before.
Speaker: Avatar was the first JJP where I felt it didn't
Speaker: brought something new.
Speaker: It brought a fresh approach.
Speaker: It brought thematic immersion that didn't feel like a cereal box or a Walmart or a lunch box, which I kind of felt Toy Story felt like that.
Speaker: And Elton John, again, I love the theme.
Speaker: I love the music.
Speaker: I, the layout is something that I'm quite used to.
Speaker: I knew where all the shots were that.
Speaker: So
Speaker: And considering this has the best flippers, it has the best theme immersion.
Speaker: It has the best light show by far.
Speaker: And by the way, we're an hour into this and we haven't even talked about the topper on the CE.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, so, and that shows you just how much is in this game.
Speaker: So that's why I rate this as number one.
Speaker: I'm, I'm still going to come back to what you said before, because in my closing arguments, we are going to talk about who this game is for.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, so that, that's why I rank this as their best game so far.
Speaker: And I even told them that I told Candace, I told Brett this, I was like,
Speaker: This is your most complete game that you have done to date.
Speaker: And Kate, you could argue that Guns N' Roses would fit into that category.
Speaker: And I totally agree.
Speaker: Immersion, light show, music, music.
Speaker: uh, what brings guns and roses down for me is the, the flippers just don't feel, um, flippy enough.
Speaker: They don't feel snappy.
Speaker: And I think that's just an evolution on JJP, which is why the new version of the flippers are exactly what I expect across different genres of game.
Speaker: I don't have to feel like, Oh, these are JJP flippers.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I'm going to get my perspective.
Speaker: I did not play the game.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: but i have played every other jjp game except for godfather is actually the only game i've never played by jjp okay um i'm gonna i'm not running out to tell you to buy this game like you still should play it you should still may form an opinion for yourself but i want to lean towards what vic and scott are saying i think this is at their top end and the reason i'm saying that is i feel like we're going into a new direction like
Speaker: when I think of JJP, they've turned the page a couple of times, right?
Speaker: Like the first page was obviously wizard of Oz and Hobbit.
Speaker: And those were, were like, was it Ross is good and Hobbit was decent.
Speaker: And it was like, they brought in Pat Lawler and it brought something in.
Speaker: with dialed in that was just, was different.
Speaker: And now that I play it after all these other games have come out, it's still a good game, but it definitely felt lacking a little bit.
Speaker: Because I say that because then Pirates came out and Eric kind of blew us all away.
Speaker: There was so much innovation in Pirates.
Speaker: And I still love that little play, the little rocking, you know, pirate play field.
Speaker: And people love it too.
Speaker: Obviously, it's because there's not enough made.
Speaker: You can go with all your theories.
Speaker: And obviously, Pirates is still the highest, the one you're going to pay the most money for.
Speaker: I just looked for one, like $19,000, and it's the only one on Pinside.
Speaker: Oh, it's come down.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, I mean, yeah, it is what it is.
Speaker: But then we get into Willy Wonka, and that was kind of underwhelming for me.
Speaker: And the gameplay is all right, but it's just there.
Speaker: And Guns N' Roses is a really great experience.
Speaker: But it just, there's something missing there for me.
Speaker: Like, it's really, like, I enjoy the gameplay.
Speaker: I mean, it's the code.
Speaker: I can't just pinpoint it, but I love the immersion.
Speaker: I love the way that they did Guns N' Roses.
Speaker: But the interesting part to me, too, is I don't know if it's because Guns N' Roses is one of their best-selling games of all time.
Speaker: It is their best-selling.
Speaker: It is, yes.
Speaker: Jack did confirm that on our last show, or the last time we interviewed him.
Speaker: Guns N' Roses is the cheapest game you can buy right now on the used market.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: That's a volume thing though.
Speaker: It's gotta be a volume.
Speaker: They have the most supply of those games.
Speaker: So like 5,500 is, is what you can buy a Guns N' Roses SE right now on pin side.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Which is interesting because SE was, is like the super limited version.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like Jack did tell us that they stopped making them because they basically weren't selling much of them because people didn't want them.
Speaker: But yeah.
Speaker: But then with Toy Story, it felt like we took a step back.
Speaker: We got all this immersion and everything from Guns N' Roses.
Speaker: And Toy Story 4 just... I played it, and it's an enjoyable game.
Speaker: The problem is... And this is what I've always said for at least since Guns N' Roses.
Speaker: The problem is people aren't seeing the value for what you get in the game.
Speaker: And Toy Story was definitely that stumbling block, right?
Speaker: It also had the price jump, too.
Speaker: It had the price jump.
Speaker: And that was Pat Lawler's kind of like swan song.
Speaker: And it just...
Speaker: Whatever it was, it is what it is, right?
Speaker: And then Godfather came out, and it was really cool because it was like you could see they were trying to go a new direction.
Speaker: But when Elton John came out, like I get what you're saying, Scott.
Speaker: Like it's – we've seen this just – it's a – how did Robert Downey Jr. put it?
Speaker: It's the same dancer but different leggings, right?
Speaker: That's the way he described comic book movies coming out.
Speaker: But the thing with Elton John was is there was something different about it.
Speaker: And I think it's, maybe it's the light show, maybe it's kind of the interaction with the mechs.
Speaker: It just, it felt like they were going more.
Speaker: And Avatar, it feels like it's a definite jump from what they've done in the past to, to,
Speaker: close that gap between people saying, okay, is this what's in the game worth the value for what they're asking?
Speaker: And I feel like they're really closing that gap of we're trying to innovate in new areas to say, hey, guys, we're still the...
Speaker: How did Jack put it?
Speaker: The Corvette or the Lamborghini?
Speaker: The Ferrari.
Speaker: The Ferrari pinball.
Speaker: We're still the Ferrari pinball.
Speaker: And they are doing stuff stylistically that's different that does make it look a lot better.
Speaker: This avatar to me, from the outside looking in, this is the first time I'm like, yes, this is a game that I say you're still getting the most bang for your buck, essentially.
Speaker: The funny part about Elton John, though, too, as I was looking it up, Elton John is their second highest
Speaker: like value it's still retaining value i had someone message me today i'm like i've been kind of waiting for elton john because i want the game but i want to pay the price and uh they're not going down in price right so that tells me one of two things they've hit a stride of like they're they're they're outputting the right amount of games versus what the demand is right like guns and roses shows that like if you have way too many games out in the wild obviously it's going to bring that value down because then everyone can buy one
Speaker: But I think they're on the right trajectory here.
Speaker: I think they're finally getting their footing.
Speaker: I don't know if it's that transition from where Toy Story was.
Speaker: But overall, whatever you're doing, JJP, this makes me intrigued just going forward if Harry Potter really is one of the licenses you guys hold.
Speaker: I can't wait to see how you do that because let's be honest, I just went through all the lists of JJP.
Speaker: There's no one complaint I could give you is there's no Mac that I feel like has reinvent not reinvented pinball, but there's it's not unique, right?
Speaker: I look at other manufacturers and I feel like I'm just going to point out the Sentinel head, like the Sentinel head.
Speaker: It's, it's a new take on an old thing.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But it feels fresh.
Speaker: Whereas like when I look at avatar, I don't see a mech that stands out to me.
Speaker: There's,
Speaker: You've got a lot of toys.
Speaker: You've got the robot with the stabbity stab.
Speaker: You've got the crab suit multiball with the grumpy smiley face.
Speaker: But I don't see an interactive toy.
Speaker: And honestly, looking back across all JJP stuff, since Pirates, I don't feel like there is a mech that interacts with the ball that is unique and different than I can find from any other manufacturer.
Speaker: So that's my thoughts on Avatar.
Speaker: And so, yes, it's top towards the top of this.
Speaker: I would put Avatar up there with.
Speaker: Granted, I haven't played this yet, but like Elton John's definitely on top of my list.
Speaker: It's a great game.
Speaker: Guns and Roses is still a great game.
Speaker: Pirates is still a great game.
Speaker: I think this contends and is up there with them.
Speaker: Dialed in.
Speaker: uh i i guess i'm biased i enjoy hobbit i know it doesn't shoot the best there's an immersion there but i feel like they kind of lost they kind of lost going forward a little bit and then they gained it back so anyhow i've talked long enough for a man that has not played avatar to rate it as high as i have so i've always said guns and roses is the most immersive experience in pinball okay
Speaker: Probably still is probably still is.
Speaker: But when you have, you have to have everything come together to bring it to the next level.
Speaker: So you're talking theme immersion is one thing you're talking play field layout.
Speaker: Another you're talking about snappy flippers.
Speaker: That's another.
Speaker: So all of these things have been focused on at some point in,
Speaker: in all the previous nine games, this one feels like, you know, when you're generating a character in a game, right?
Speaker: This one feels like they're all another duck, just quick.
Speaker: They all kind of leveled up to a point where I don't see any obvious deficiencies.
Speaker: So that's why this is the best version of what Jersey Jack is putting out, okay?
Speaker: I totally understand what you're coming from with the mech.
Speaker: And there are some people who that is a huge deal for them.
Speaker: Having like the mech that interacts with the ball or chucks it, you know, this, this is the, the catapult going into Jackie or, you know, stuff like that.
Speaker: Frankenstein grabbing the ball and throwing it at you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Or the Jurassic park head thing that, you know, the dinosaur that grab the eats the ball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So there are some people who that's a huge deal for.
Speaker: I didn't notice that being missing in this game.
Speaker: So if that's your thing, then that is a line on your, on your ranking list that you could argue is not as high as other ones.
Speaker: But if you look, if I look at my complete package, what I'm really interested in, I didn't care.
Speaker: I didn't care that it wasn't there.
Speaker: So that's why I would argue this is still the best complete package of the other ones.
Speaker: I would be interested to see what other games would be like with the snappy flippers.
Speaker: I'd love to see what Guns N' Roses is like with the snappier flippers.
Speaker: Because I think I would have a lot more fun with it.
Speaker: if that were the case, maybe Wizard of Oz too.
Speaker: So I don't even know.
Speaker: Maybe I could reach out and say, is there a way of upgrading the old games to the new flippers?
Speaker: Because that would really change the experience.
Speaker: I might be wrong on this, but I think they have a board and apparently it's like a capacitor kit.
Speaker: Yeah, you got to change the cap.
Speaker: I might be wrong.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I'm actually going to reach out.
Speaker: I'm going to reach out and just ask because that is something I I would be interested in for previous games because that's always been how I've felt with the previous Jersey Jack games is the flippers have always felt inferior.
Speaker: And yeah.
Speaker: And so having the really snappy crisp flippers really does bring me more into Jurassic, uh, into the Jersey Jack.
Speaker: Um, I, okay.
Speaker: This is the first game where I've actually reached out and looked at availability and cost in Jersey Jack in a long time.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's impressive actually.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And now this is a theme that my kids would go up and say, dad, I want to play that.
Speaker: So I know that my curated arcade is very specific to a family.
Speaker: And, and that's where guns and roses is absolutely beautiful game.
Speaker: And, you know, I, I do enjoy the immersion, but I have young kids.
Speaker: It's not going into my home arcade.
Speaker: You don't want to see skeletons doing it on your, uh, yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Again, there's a family, there's a family mode, but there are other things that, that would fit that thing.
Speaker: And I would argue the same thing with like Godfather.
Speaker: It didn't fit, uh, the, the theme of my, my family arcade.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Toy Story, Toy Story did feel like there was something lacking in it.
Speaker: And so that's why I didn't, I didn't pursue that one.
Speaker: But this is the first one where I'm like, yeah, maybe I would.
Speaker: And Elton John is actually a pretty close.
Speaker: I still think it's fun.
Speaker: I will still buy it.
Speaker: But this, this is something that offers something different.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Now remind me though, Scott, are you a fan of Avatar?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay, Avatar is, it's fine.
Speaker: It's one of those themes that I thought was, it was enjoyable.
Speaker: I agree that the movies have a little bit of like typical Hollywood themes that feel kind of tired.
Speaker: I felt like the first one was definitely a commentary on like the Iraq War, which that wasn't a big leap.
Speaker: to see that.
Speaker: And on the second one, it felt like star Trek four and Titanic had a baby and they were trying to save a whale.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: If you're old enough, then you will know exactly what I'm talking about.
Speaker: And if not go and watch star Trek four and you're like, uh-huh.
Speaker: Scott's right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You're like Scott's.
Speaker: Um, and so, so I, yeah, it is pretty and it's pretty, it's fun.
Speaker: And I would argue that,
Speaker: yeah, it's not my top five themes, but it's something that is a solid B theme that my kids would be really interested in.
Speaker: And this is where I want, well, okay, well, you know, we'll transition into this, but I do want to get and talk to the topper, but let's talk about who is this game for?
Speaker: Like who would buy avatar?
Speaker: Because we've had a lot of great games coming out in the last couple of years.
Speaker: And so,
Speaker: What is going to purchase or move the purchase price for this game?
Speaker: Who's going to buy it?
Speaker: And why would you buy it?
Speaker: You know, honestly, I've talked to many people lately that has been very much like we're not buying into JJP because of the price jump.
Speaker: It is what it is, you know?
Speaker: they just don't want to pay into that.
Speaker: And so... Like for a home collection or for a routing?
Speaker: Yeah, for a home collection.
Speaker: This is the first time I've heard from collectors that are stingy with their money that they've considered buying a new JJP new in box because they felt like this is what they've been asking for from JJP.
Speaker: Yeah, this time.
Speaker: I think if you keep up this energy and this uniqueness, I say going forward, it's not gonna be hard to get people on the boat.
Speaker: I do wonder because they do limit their, you know, there's a limited edition and there's a CE and, and with avatar, there's a total of 6,000 games.
Speaker: It makes you wonder, let's say they do bring out Harry Potter and it's just absolutely wild, right?
Speaker: It hits every expectation.
Speaker: do they bump that number?
Speaker: Like they have for, for Harry Potter, they'd have to, it's an A-list.
Speaker: Like 6,000 units.
Speaker: That's, it becomes, it's an instant evergreen title.
Speaker: Like you could, you could do 10,000, you could do 15,000 units on that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Tell me about this topper though.
Speaker: Tell me, I want to hear about it.
Speaker: You keep teasing this topper.
Speaker: I want to hear about the top.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So think of the Mandalorian topper, but way better.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So if, if you look at it, the, the topper uses a very similar, uh, you know, um, technology, it uses the peppers ghost effect that,
Speaker: reflects up and it's, it's full body.
Speaker: It's the entire tire width of the back box.
Speaker: It's quite tall too.
Speaker: And so it's visually impressive.
Speaker: You can see this all over.
Speaker: Now, this is where I would argue you probably want to consider getting the collector's edition because the, the topper comes with the collector's edition.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And when you're looking at a comparable topper in a Mandalorian topper, that's $2,000.
Speaker: And I would argue this is easily, easily 1.5 to two times as cool as the Mandalorian topper.
Speaker: So that's where I would say, you know what?
Speaker: You're kind of looking at, and, uh, Kate, you have to look at comparable markets, right?
Speaker: So a stern, uh, limited edition is in the 13 five range, right?
Speaker: And if you buy a topper for that with like the fancy things like the shooter rod and all that kind of stuff, you're looking at 15.
Speaker: You really are.
Speaker: You're looking pretty close to that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And so would I rather have a stern L E with all of the stuff, or would I rather have an avatar collectors edition with all the stuff?
Speaker: And I would argue that,
Speaker: I would rather have an avatar collector's edition with all the stuff if you're going to be buying that because the topper is worth it.
Speaker: This could be one of those situations.
Speaker: It's not quite as deal breaker as like the Cactus Canyon, like with and without the topper.
Speaker: I think you can still buy the standard one and have a great, a great time with it.
Speaker: If you are like, no, I really want the cool topper, it's worth it in today's topper market to consider spending the extra $3,000 and getting the topper.
Speaker: This is definitely a game that a family would get into.
Speaker: Uh, now this is where you have to look at what is the market for.
Speaker: So is this game going to be a tournament type game?
Speaker: And this is where you'll always get the, the people who are really into pinball.
Speaker: They're always going to talk about that, right?
Speaker: Is that, okay.
Speaker: So who, who's going to do like high-end players?
Speaker: I don't know if high-end players will really get into this layout.
Speaker: Just because competition players, competition players are also looking for a very specific thing.
Speaker: They're looking for a layout that has some, some, some risk rewards, some high skill areas, some easier areas, but like that one shot that is super hard to get that only they can get, or they're looking for like a rule set.
Speaker: That's very tournament friendly.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Jersey Jack's never done that.
Speaker: And so in fairness, I don't know of any like top 100 players who are thinking, you know what?
Speaker: I really want to compete on an Elton John because that doesn't seem to be their target audience, which I don't think it has to be.
Speaker: This is a game that would really target, hey, I have a home arcade and I want people to come down.
Speaker: And I would guarantee Waz does this.
Speaker: When people come down, they look over and they see Waz.
Speaker: And how old is Waz?
Speaker: Woz is over 10 years old.
Speaker: And it still looks like a new release.
Speaker: People go over and they play Woz.
Speaker: And I guarantee if you had this downstairs with all of the other things, it is immediately number one eye candy.
Speaker: I want to go over and play that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I got to agree with you on that.
Speaker: I have to.
Speaker: You know, because we were talking about who's this aimed for.
Speaker: I, every time, every time I think JJP,
Speaker: I gotta say it, to me, it's for the home arcade.
Speaker: It is.
Speaker: It is.
Speaker: For me out here in New York, we don't have many arcades.
Speaker: We have Jack Bar.
Speaker: They have like an Elton John.
Speaker: I haven't been there yet.
Speaker: There's not many arcades here, number one.
Speaker: And they have Sunshine too.
Speaker: They have Sunshine.
Speaker: Yeah, we do have Sunshine too.
Speaker: We have a guy in Long Island.
Speaker: There's just not many arcades, number one.
Speaker: And then number two, there's not many JJP machines on location.
Speaker: And, you know, every time I look at my machines, it's like, to me, I'm like, that was meant for a home use.
Speaker: That's just, I, and in that, in that realm though, being home use,
Speaker: it comes the price thing.
Speaker: That's where people might be upset about the pricing with JJP.
Speaker: I feel like I totally get my money's worth.
Speaker: It's a beautiful machine.
Speaker: Not to mention they're built like tanks.
Speaker: So to me, this is definitely a home use kind of manufacturer company.
Speaker: This is the first one in a long time though, where I feel that if you are on a fence as an operator, you could easily take a risk on this one.
Speaker: maybe maybe maybe not some of the other ones there's your guns there's your guns yeah uh maybe i i could i could understand on some of the other ones i can understand on toy story we're like no it's too much i don't want to put it on location
Speaker: And I can understand with Elton John saying, well, okay, but it's similar to what we've had before.
Speaker: Godfather, that's an invite.
Speaker: You need immersion into the theme for environment.
Speaker: This is the first one you're like, you know, actually this would fit into an arcade and not feel out of place.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I agree with both of what you're saying.
Speaker: And I don't really feel like there's much to add to that as well.
Speaker: I think you kind of hit the notes on that.
Speaker: I felt like we've wrapped this up in a nice little bow.
Speaker: Now, just real quick, only because for me personally, I do want to touch up on the one thing as me being a JDP owner, the one thing that upset me.
Speaker: Number one, the wizard modes are not coded in.
Speaker: And number two, I got the impression that Insider Connect is never coming to JJP.
Speaker: So they never talked about – so Scorbit was originally with them.
Speaker: They're not doing anything like that anymore.
Speaker: I know Scorbit was taken out.
Speaker: It was talked about.
Speaker: However, I would argue it doesn't feel – so if you're going to look at reasons why you would resist in buying – and Vic, you just brought this up.
Speaker: Yeah, like that's –
Speaker: You wish there were an element of insider connected that, obviously, that's a Stern thing, right?
Speaker: And Stern has done a very good job of that.
Speaker: And it really has driven people to arcades with badges.
Speaker: And so on your wish list of JJP things, you're saying that you wish you had an equivalent...
Speaker: type of achievement score thing on JJP.
Speaker: And I think that's a fair criticism because we're a few years into insider connected.
Speaker: So it would be nice if they had something equivalent.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: To me, it's a revolutionary thing.
Speaker: People are like, I feel like, like I spoke to kale.
Speaker: He's like, people are lined up waiting to get these badges.
Speaker: Now it doesn't be badges.
Speaker: I don't care.
Speaker: Give me something like a me personally.
Speaker: I kind of wish there was a main high score leaderboard and I'd be happy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But the other thing I said, the biggest issue I have right now is that, you know, we didn't touch up on it.
Speaker: We were, I, at least for me while we were playing, I actually collected Pandora.
Speaker: I would have went into wizard mode and my game just like the back box froze.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: So it's still early code and we, and we knew that.
Speaker: My big issue though, is you're shipping the games out without the wizard mode in and,
Speaker: Being a godfather and I hear pirates, my biggest thing that hurts my heart right now is like, how long?
Speaker: And I asked it, and all they could say is soon.
Speaker: Well, that's always been a challenge with Jersey Jack.
Speaker: To be fair, it's always been a challenge.
Speaker: The wizard mode's not even in godfather right now, right?
Speaker: The final.
Speaker: So kiss the ring.
Speaker: Kiss the ring's not in there.
Speaker: And then, I mean, obviously Toy Story is, but it's kind of...
Speaker: It's like, hey, hey, do it again.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So is Guns N' Roses final mode even in there?
Speaker: I remember there was a recent update that like took like two or three, whatever, how old, I don't know what it is though, but I remember seeing the update for GNR and people like, yeah, like, and then like sales went back up for GNR.
Speaker: And now Vic, you can't let, let's, since you are a recent Jersey Jack owner.
Speaker: So updating the code, is that a big deal for you?
Speaker: Or does it, is, is it very, no, no.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: Is it, is it a hard thing?
Speaker: Is it a hard thing to do or is it an easy thing to do?
Speaker: Meaning like in a technical aspect?
Speaker: Is it technically difficult?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Do you just connect to Wi-Fi and it does it for you or you got to plug it in?
Speaker: Oh, you mean like an actual update?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like the process of updating the code.
Speaker: It sounds like it's easy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I thought you were talking about like a development standpoint.
Speaker: Like I have to go and code zero to ones.
Speaker: No, no, no.
Speaker: Like if you're like, oh, there's a new code.
Speaker: Is it hard to put it on your machine?
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Okay, good.
Speaker: Now, I will say, I would also personally like to thank Jersey Jack because I am not really the best at updating my Wizard of Oz code.
Speaker: I heard you ask this question.
Speaker: You're like, is there a dongle?
Speaker: I'm like, yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, because, okay, Wizard of Oz, it's also, you know, this is a 12-year-old game.
Speaker: And so they said, yes, there is a way.
Speaker: And I'm not that dumb.
Speaker: Okay, I have a Mac and people said it's kind of a pain to update it with a Mac.
Speaker: And so thankfully, I actually talked them into it and they were super nice about it.
Speaker: They actually ripped and did like the new code.
Speaker: for me and they, they got me some stuff there to help me out.
Speaker: And so I am going to update my wizard of Oz to latest code.
Speaker: Nice.
Speaker: And there's like, they even said, Hey, this is how you hook it up, you know, wifi and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker: And they could not have been nicer about helping me out with modernizing my Ruby red wizard of Oz.
Speaker: And so I would like to give a special thanks to them.
Speaker: And to everything they did to help me out because that's a huge deal to me that I felt like I was kind of stuck.
Speaker: We can't deny it.
Speaker: When it comes to JJP and their customer service, nothing beats it.
Speaker: When you just told me that story, I was like, I'm surprised when they did that.
Speaker: I'm like, whoa, that's awesome for you.
Speaker: But I feel like they would do that.
Speaker: This is Jason Allen, who was the software, who's one of the software guys with Keith over there.
Speaker: He was super nice.
Speaker: I'd like to personally thank him for everything.
Speaker: And yes, I, and he, he even sent me an email.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: This is how you do it.
Speaker: And this is what's going on.
Speaker: So, so if you guys, I have an old Jersey Jack that you're interested in bringing up to the, you know, the, the, to modern now that go, go ahead and reach out and they'll be able to help you out.
Speaker: So that's super nice.
Speaker: Cool.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like I said, I think we're kind of – it's almost midnight your time, Vic.
Speaker: I'm here all day.
Speaker: Don't worry.
Speaker: Trust me.
Speaker: I got hours.
Speaker: So one thing I do want to do, I do want to give a special thanks out to Jersey Jack for inviting us out.
Speaker: Hosting us, for Ken reaching out, inviting us.
Speaker: That was very nice.
Speaker: They were quite accommodating.
Speaker: We'd like to thank everybody at Jersey Jack who was there.
Speaker: Tom Capara, all the team that was there.
Speaker: Brett Abbas was there.
Speaker: And it was just super nice that they took this seriously as we are trying to put the best pinball machine that they know how to make out there and inviting us into their home, showing us the process.
Speaker: And even like small things,
Speaker: Like the, um, the banshees, there's six different, we didn't even bring this up.
Speaker: There's six different banshees.
Speaker: And so depending on what it's a random thing, like the banshee chooses you.
Speaker: So you can, you get six different colored banshees that could possibly come.
Speaker: So I thought that was, I thought that was a cool, a cool touch.
Speaker: But we just like to really appreciate everything they did to make this possible.
Speaker: This is the best way for me to get exposed to a new game so we can talk about it.
Speaker: So it was very kind of them to do that.
Speaker: And so I, again, just like to thank them again.
Speaker: They did not push us for any sort of editorial control over, over what we say.
Speaker: They, they were confident in their product to let it speak for itself.
Speaker: I think if you want to get your hands on this game, I know there's, well, obviously it was a Rocky mountain pinball show, but expo expo is where it's going to be at.
Speaker: And if you've never been to expo, get on it, man, because it's 40th year, like 40th year this year.
Speaker: And I, there's going to be some really cool stuff there.
Speaker: Well, JJP always has an excellent booth too, and they usually have almost all their games there.
Speaker: It's worth your time to get to Chicago.
Speaker: We're less than a month away.
Speaker: One secret, I know a lot of people say it's a pain in the butt if you're not staying at the hotel.
Speaker: It's not that bad.
Speaker: It's not that bad, but at the embassy, you can drive over.
Speaker: It's fine.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: One of the secrets is the hotel actually has a shuttle.
Speaker: So just call up the shuttle and they'll bring you over.
Speaker: No cost to you.
Speaker: Just tip the tip, the driver.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's all you got to do.
Speaker: So other than that, I, like I said, I think you guys did fantastic.
Speaker: And it's funny.
Speaker: Cause it's like, Oh, we miss this and miss that.
Speaker: I'm like there, you guys were there for the hours though.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, okay.
Speaker: Vic push your show.
Speaker: Push or?
Speaker: Push your show.
Speaker: Promote yourself.
Speaker: Oh, I don't.
Speaker: Where can people find you?
Speaker: Oh, you can find me on YouTube, Vic underscore VP, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok.
Speaker: I got a whole Linktree link going on.
Speaker: I'm just very grateful for you guys to invite me.
Speaker: It was very great to meet everybody on Friday at Jersey Jack.
Speaker: Again, big thank you to Jersey Jack and Ken Cromwell for inviting me.
Speaker: I'm shocked that I was like invited and apparently Ken Cromwell watches a couple of my videos.
Speaker: So I'm like, all right, awesome.
Speaker: I was very, I said, I was like, I'm resisting trying to fanboy out and take selfies with Joel and Colin.
Speaker: And, but yes, I'm just grateful for you guys inviting me.
Speaker: We had a lot of fun.
Speaker: Yeah, that's, that's all.
Speaker: I don't, I'm not going to, I'm not going to just explain myself, but yes.
Speaker: Thank you guys so much.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: It was awesome.
Speaker: Thank you guys.
Speaker: if you want to get a hold of us, we are loser kid pinball podcast at gmail.com.
Speaker: You can find us on Facebook, Instagram, X, all the places, Twitches, YouTube.
Speaker: If you're not on here, why are you not on there?
Speaker: Please subscribe.
Speaker: We're like, we're so close to hitting 500.
Speaker: I know it's a really small number on YouTube, but Josh is Hollywood pretty.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: I know it's nowhere near it's no, it's nowhere near our other numbers for like subscribers on like Apple and all that stuff.
Speaker: So I'm not even going to go.
Speaker: It's actually fun.
Speaker: Cause you get to see us actually interact and you see our, you see our collections or at least part of it in the background.
Speaker: And there's some unique content on there.
Speaker: Like if you, I know a lot of people were talking about pinball Olympics.
Speaker: You can go on our, on our YouTube and see the insane room that Scott Denisi built.
Speaker: They put his TNA in and it's just like sensory overload when you step inside this room.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Obviously, I didn't do a content creator last episode, and I feel bad about that.
Speaker: But I'm going to make this one pretty easy.
Speaker: Check out Vic VP and check out his YouTube.
Speaker: It's great stuff.
Speaker: He's the content creator of our episode.
Speaker: So go check out his stuff.
Speaker: It's got an awesome New York accent.
Speaker: Thank you, guys.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: Uh, silver ball swag.com slash loser kid.
Speaker: If you're not buying our stuff, I don't want us to tell you.
Speaker: Like we've got a bunch of people that bought the hockey van shoes.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I had the hockey Jersey and Vans.
Speaker: I wore the van shoes all weekend.
Speaker: They're really comfortable.
Speaker: I was surprised.
Speaker: They're really comfortable.
Speaker: People are gearing up for expo.
Speaker: I like there's, we've got a handful of jerseys that went out.
Speaker: Other thing too, really quick about the hats.
Speaker: Cause I've had a couple of questions about the hats.
Speaker: Yes, we are doing the hats.
Speaker: The pre list is I have it top pinned on Facebook.
Speaker: The way it works is you fill out a Google sheet and it comes to me and I'm holding onto all those Google sheets right now.
Speaker: And I will contact you once we shut down that form, which is at the end of this month, you only got like two weeks left.
Speaker: If you really want that hat, you don't have to go to September just in case you're listening in the future.
Speaker: So you don't have to be like, I will ship it to you and we can make that arrangement if you're not gonna be at expo, but save yourself some shipping.
Speaker: If you're going to expo, I can bring it to you.
Speaker: That's one of the main reasons I do a hat push this year is because I'm like, I'm gonna be in Chicago.
Speaker: A lot of other people are gonna be in Chicago.
Speaker: It's just easy to be like here, boom, save yourself like eight bucks or 10 bucks, whatever the shipping is nowadays.
Speaker: It's kind of out of control.
Speaker: And really we're not making anything on these.
Speaker: It really is just a fun thing for us to get hats out.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: There's all that.
Speaker: Did I miss anything, Scott?
Speaker: No, just check us out.
Speaker: Josh does a really good job with our social media, all the typical locations.
Speaker: And we appreciate everybody listening, spending time with us.
Speaker: And if you see us at Expo, please come up and say hi and take a selfie with us.
Speaker: We'd love to do it.
Speaker: Definitely.
Speaker: Vic, give us our last word.
Speaker: Oh, man.
Speaker: You put me on the spot.
Speaker: Oh, oh man.
Speaker: I'm excited for Expo.
Speaker: I'm very grateful and happy I met you guys.
Speaker: Thank you again for inviting me.
Speaker: Flip on, my guys and gals.
Speaker: Flip on.
