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Doctor who left the NHS for New Zealand, Is it really worth the move?
18 Plays4 months ago
Ellie - a NHS doctor who moved to New Zealand 2 years ago tells me about the pro's and cons of uprooting your life in the UK to move across the globe!
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Transcript
Introduction to Ellie and Her Journey
00:00:00
Speaker
I've had an absolute nightmare this morning. I've woken up and I've not got a single bloody tea bag in my house. Oh um no! That is a disaster. So on today's first episode of Leaving Med we have our guest Ellie all the way from New Zealand um who's going to be telling us a little bit about why she made the move and how it's been going ever since.
Why Move to New Zealand?
00:00:24
Speaker
It's been a couple years, is that right Ellie? ah Almost two years two years in January.
00:00:31
Speaker
Okay, so ah just for a little bit of background, kind of at what stage were you at when before you made the move over? um So I was thinking about it in F3, but I was in a job that I quite enjoyed. It was good for my career in London, a clinical fellow job. And so it wasn't until my F4 that I decided to come over for just a year.
00:01:01
Speaker
And kind of how were you getting on in the UK? Was it like a difficult decision? or um I think actually thinking about it back then, it probably wasn't a difficult decision.
Challenges and Decisions in Moving
00:01:13
Speaker
but The scariest part was ah moving to the other side of the world and that what was daunting was filling all the paperwork out. I think that were five was the most daunting process.
00:01:23
Speaker
um But um I didn't really enjoy my work-life balance in the UK at all. um I was getting home at 8-9pm a lot of the time and ah yeah, it's just it was dissatisfying and you didn't feel like you were doing right by everyone either because you were just constantly behind and busy and stressed and I was just like, I kind of saw it more as a traveling trip, as a holiday um and thought I'll just come for a year, ah originally just six months and then I decided I'll do it for a year but kind of travel for a lot of it.
00:02:06
Speaker
But in the end, I came out here and found, um yes, it was difficult, I guess, in the sense that I stepped up to being a med-reg from being an SHO, but that actually the work-life balance was a hundred times better um and um I was happier.
Settling In and Finding Balance
00:02:29
Speaker
um And so I found myself thinking, oh God, ah a year's going to go by and I won't have done any traveling. And actually I want to stay longer because the pay's great, the work's great. Everyone's nice to me. No one's shouted at me. I'm not nervous or anxious to make phone calls. um It's really well supported. Why don't I just stay a bit longer?
00:02:59
Speaker
Yeah. So um I'm sure that there's a few things in there that people can relate to. um But you mentioned about like the paperwork being daunting. What were the first steps that you had to take and did anything help you on that journey?
00:03:13
Speaker
Yeah, well, i was I was fortunate in that I went came through over here through an agency. um Unfortunately, that agency has, um and they've decided to close up shop. But there are other agencies that do almost the same thing. And I reached out to them and said, I was thinking about coming over. How would I go about getting a job, sorting out my medical license?
00:03:40
Speaker
insurance, um visas, everything and they were great because they laid it all out for me. So, they had a checklist and kept regular email contact and ah also made the effort to um phone me, um to ask about me and what I liked doing in my spare time.
Choosing New Zealand Over Australia
00:04:04
Speaker
to know where to try and get me a job so they helped me to get a job which was great and I know some people don't always do that they just they found the job themselves and then do the rest themselves but going through an agency was great and also there's no fees so why wouldn't you? Yeah makes sense to have someone sort of guide you through that process so like why why were you drawn to New Zealand and not say Australia?
00:04:29
Speaker
um I got the impression that all Brits were going to Australia and so I wanted to be different, but coming over here, um I actually went to a stats talk um the other weekend on the percentage of doctors in New Zealand that are Kiwi and British, and it's something like 70% are British and 30% are Kiwi.
00:04:52
Speaker
um And that but that's consultants, but it kind of tells you a bit more. And but yeah, as juniors as well, I wouldn't be surprised if it's a similar ratio. um So yeah, I guess. ah But I also, I liked more of the outdoors and I think I wanted it to be still a little bit similar to the UK.
00:05:14
Speaker
um I saw Australia as, I've never been, but as this big hot country and I didn't necessarily, I like the hot weather, but I didn't want that all the time. um And I wanted more of the outdoorsy aspect, which I think New Zealand possibly has more to offer. But then again, I've never been to Australia, so I don't know. um But yeah ah ah yeah, it was just a personal decision for me.
00:05:37
Speaker
Yeah, makes sense. So thinking about when you first landed in New Zealand almost two years ago, what were those first few weeks like?
Adapting to Life in New Zealand
00:05:48
Speaker
I just felt like I was on holiday. I loved it. ah um What was you know fantastic, the agency picked me up from the airport, um drove me straight away to sort out my bank account, um helped me pick out a secondhand car, um set me up with a footmo mobile SIM, sorted out my final details for the tax, for the medical council,
00:06:15
Speaker
everything. They were really good um and then I had a week's holiday in Taranaki which is a beautiful, beautiful part of New Zealand with two friends who are already living here and I just immediately fell in love with it. It just is a beautiful country. I instantly fell at home And then what about when you started working with with their big differences in the way that they practice medicine over there?
Work Environment and Benefits
00:06:46
Speaker
um So I started working um on a stroke ward um with some geriatricians. And so I wanted to do geriatric medicine, so it was close to home. and But the hospital tries and puts you with your initial rotation. So we do four-month rotations ah similar to the UK.
00:07:05
Speaker
um ah They try and put you in a rotation to start with that you feel comfortable with in um to kind of ease you in. And um I started a week or two after the F1 started. um And so they were new as well. um But the consultants were just, they're just so supportive. they're They round almost every day. They see the new patients and the sick patients every day. They are so approachable they're at the end of the phone or a text um that it the day-to-day job didn't feel hard work. Yeah.
00:07:50
Speaker
Nice. How have you found the pay? Is it similar to the UK? or um I think it probably is more than the UK. um It depends on what job you do. So you can be an SHO over here on what's called relief. So they have a system over here, which is fantastic. They should have it in the UK, where they have an additional four or five registrars, four or five SHOs who cover anyone who's on leave, on sick and they're called relief doctors and they get paid a silly amount of money um and you can do a full rotation on it and um I mean the SHO on relief gets paid more ah than a medical registrar on an ordinary run so that's what a lot of people choose to do.
00:08:37
Speaker
And it's actually but people say, oh, they pay you more because it's a stressful job. I don't think it is. I think actually because you're just there as an extra as a help because, you know, that person's off sick for the day or on annual your leave. You're just grateful for the extra support and um ah ah you're not expected to then to do the family discussions or to do more of the in-depth work for the patient because you're only there for the day. ah Sorry, I actually think the job's easier. um But then ah the ah The medical registrar job definitely does pay more than the like ah maybe ah ah senior ah ah a fellow in the UK or an SHO. And there's lots of opportunities to do extra locum shifts and things that does pay really good. so yeah I'd say the pay is better.
00:09:29
Speaker
and I've heard that you don't have to pay for like fees over there. Is that true? um Yes. So you get your medical counsel fees paid for. I think they're about $1,000 a year. um You also get your um initial visa paid for. It varies from hospital to hospital. They're actually cutting down how much they're paying off people's fees nowadays.
00:09:56
Speaker
um um one time they were paying for, um if you were coming from the UK, your flight, your visa, a month's rent, a month's car rental as well. They were publicic paying people a hell of a lot. um I missed out on that, unfortunately. And now I think they've got, you can certainly get most of your medical license fees, um your indemnity stuff that's automatically covered by the hospital.
00:10:26
Speaker
um yeah union fees are covered um and also training so um Your equivalent to IMT um over here is called basic training. And um it's very easy to get on to. You don't have to write a personal statement. You don't have to prove that you've done any quality improvement projects. You just apply and pay about $2,000, $3,000. And you have to have a consultant in the hospital say, yep, they they're good to go on the training. um And then it gets paid back by the hospital. So everything is
00:11:04
Speaker
paid for, which is great. and Even if you don't want to do training, you can do what's called in practice, which is just like having an online portfolio that you have to do for the medical council where they pay for those fees as well. And the canteen is free as well?
00:11:19
Speaker
Ah yes sir, the bigger. Lots of people are drawn into the lovely cafeteria food. I have to say, me and another guy, Matt, who's Scottish, um started a similar time. Matt loves the food at the cafeteria. and Yes, you can get um it's all free. um You can pile your plate high with sandwiches, sushi, hot food, drinks, chips, burgers, toasties and it'll be paid for and you get that um breakfast, lunch and dinner if you really wished. After a year and a half I'm tired of the food, it's not of that high nutritional value and some of it can be a little bit questionable. um So I do bring in some food sometimes just to have a bit of a break. But yes, it's a great, great benefit, 100%. And sort of now
Cultural and Social Adjustments
00:12:21
Speaker
that you're in training, is that, would you say that ah you're getting good learning opportunities? Like, are you getting teaching? How else does it compare to what
00:12:31
Speaker
your colleagues in the UK are experiencing in training at the moment? um I guess it's tricky to because i I don't truly know the extent of the training or the access to it. It's more the access isn't it because let's face it we can have training and organise training wherever we are in the world but if we are too busy to ever go We can't access it. And um I'd say that I've been able to access it because of free time on the ward a lot more frequently here. um We have an hour on a Tuesday lunchtime that is strictly training based teaching. And then we have a clinical reasoning session on the Thursday. We have a journal club on a Wednesday um and a grand round on a Wednesday as well. So there's quite a lot of teaching. Yeah. Nice.
00:13:23
Speaker
There's a lot of positives that you've mentioned. Are there any downsides that you think are important to mention? Yeah, yeah I guess it's um um it's all well and good me feeling like I'm on holiday. but um ah the The hardest part is friends and family um and being so far away, having to miss friends, weddings and big birthday events.
00:13:49
Speaker
um is really hard it's expensive yeah yes you get paid more over here but um it's still ah You know, it's hard. um I did a trip back to the UK earlier this year and the jet lag really, I really suffered with it. um And so it's not just, you know, a a plane ride away. um It is a week of getting back into that time um time zone. um So yeah, that that can be really hard and and also matching hours so that you can catch up with friends and family. um Yeah.
00:14:30
Speaker
Yeah, makes sense. I mean, it's quite a way away, isn't it? Yeah, the other side of the world. Have you managed to make sort of kind of a good group of friends out there? How's it been kind of building, you know, starting from scratch again? um Yeah, I i think um Brits are naturally drawn to Brits um and, um you know, shared experiences. yeah You know, I mentioned my friend Matt and there's ah ah there's a group of us um
00:15:06
Speaker
Brits and everyone's very friendly and I think if you think about it most outgoing people are the kind of people that move to the other side of the world to start work and so they are the kind of people that are open to making friends because I think if you weren't, why would you do it, you know? um ah The only thing I'd say is most people are quite transient so Often people, um there's a lot of couples um and they come for six months to work in the North Island, then six months in the South Island. um And so you make friends and then six months later people move on or a year later they move on. And so that can be hard. and But I've made some good Kiwi friends as well. um And I guess this is ah you get a little bit of that in the UK when people are changing on rotations a lot.
00:15:55
Speaker
um But yeah, that that's been a bit, a little bit hit and miss I'd say. Yeah, and when you've taken holidays, um have you managed to explore sort of a lot of the rest of New Zealand or other countries nearby?
00:16:13
Speaker
Yeah, I haven't made it over to any Pacific Islands or ah ah to
Travel and Exploration in New Zealand
00:16:19
Speaker
Australia or any other countries nearby but um I've done lots of trips around and though um I know some people, um two British guys who, lots of people, when they get here they buy a camper van, that's a pretty standard and every weekend they Friday night, getting the van off the go and they're somewhere new for the weekend. um It's very easy to travel. The only thing is um there isn't much, there isn't any real proper public transport. um And so you're relying on flights or driving and the roads, it is quite a long way to, can take a while to get anywhere, but you just get used to driving for two or three hours.
00:17:05
Speaker
to get to a a new place. um But it's very easy to travel and um lots of things to see and do and explore.
00:17:17
Speaker
And you're based around the North Island, is that right? Yes, in Hawkes Bay. um yeah and there's so there's i Personally, I'm biased because I really like the North Island. I think there's more to do and see in the North Island. I think the South Island is more scenic. um if you're If you're big, big into hiking, um that's probably the place to go. um But if you want a little bit more culture um and variation in the things that you see and do,
00:17:46
Speaker
I'd say the North Island is probably better. And I'm biased towards Hawkes Bay to because they've got lots and lots of wineries and lots of wine tours and tastings. Yeah, it's great. Sounds like a dream.
Advice for Potential Movers
00:18:03
Speaker
yeah um So just to sort of wrap things up, kind of to someone who's thinking about making the move, kind of maybe they're on the fence, what would you say to them? I'd say um if you don't get into training in the UK, I think it's worth coming out to New Zealand even if it's just for a year and saying staying open-minded because I think it
00:18:38
Speaker
um it's quite refreshing um it's um it's an opportunity to so we work from eight till four to actually have your afternoons evenings to to do even do things that you would do would want to do at home, you know, read a book and um ah go to the beach and but i actually have time to do that and spend time with people um whilst also ah you know You know, even if you are career focused, you can gain some really good experience out here. There's a lot of interesting pathology. There's some really good teaching. Everyone's very supportive and actually being a medical registrar here is
00:19:24
Speaker
nowhere near as daunting as I thought it would be. um I imagine it's different in the UK, but um I would say do it. and If you're thinking about it, do it. um You'll make money. um And actually, I was going to say there is a scheme which is great over here whereby um and So you don't pay into a pension, um but there's this scheme called MAAS where you pay 6% of your salary every paycheck into a savings account and your employer pays 6% as well. um That quickly builds up. I think I've got something like 19, 20 grand in there.
00:20:08
Speaker
um that you can't touch unless you decide to leave New Zealand and not come back. So a lot of people come for a year, apply for training, go back, and but they've got a healthy amount of money to then take back to the UK. Even if they if they've all the money they've made out here they've spent travelling, they've at least got that to kind of keep them going, yeah.
00:20:32
Speaker
So you get to keep the employer contribution as well. yeah Yeah. Or if you stay here and you use it as a pension later on in life. to That's pretty cool. Yeah.
Experiences in Rural Medicine
00:20:44
Speaker
And I just want to ask as well, um because you you mentioned that um like when we spoke before that you recently flew out to sort of do some rural medicine. Is that right? Yes. Yes. I went and did um a clinic, I'm on cardiology at the moment, um and I went with the cardiologist and a sonographer up to a row like more rural hospital um called Enwiroa to see some cardiology patients who wouldn't ordinarily be able to that come down to clinic down in Hastings, which is
00:21:24
Speaker
an hour or so drive. um Yeah that was really cool, got went in a little little four-seater plane um right next to the pilot, 50 minutes.
00:21:37
Speaker
trip up. Nice. Has it made you sort of enjoy being a doctor or did you sort of always, you know, enjoy it still despite its downsides in the UK?
Rekindling Passion for Medicine
00:21:51
Speaker
I think I'm a bit sad. I think I've always enjoyed being a doctor. ah um But I think it's actually made me, i've I've always enjoyed doing the job but I've never enjoyed doing the reading and you know you see an interesting case and you think oh I should look I should look that up and I never I always thought oh I probably should but I never had the energy I never had the energy I never had the time now I feel like I am I've got so much more kind of
00:22:23
Speaker
it's It's kind of reignited my interest in medicine. It makes me want to learn. I think having, I think IMT I'd find really difficult because I just wouldn't have that energy and motivation to actually do the reading alongside the experience, which I think is probably vital for training in the future and to pass exams. um So for me, that's worked really well. Great. Amazing.
Conclusion and Farewell
00:22:51
Speaker
Well, thank you so much for taking the time to speak with me. Is there anything else you want to add or any other closing remarks? No, I don't think so. That's great. Well, I'll let you get to sleep because it's quite late over there.
00:23:08
Speaker
um But yeah, thank you for coming on the first episode of Leaving Met. No problem. Best of best of luck with your podcast. It's going to be fantastic.
00:23:21
Speaker
thanks