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Florida Archaeology, Belonging, and Phil Collins feat. Shelby Foy - Ep 24
35 Plays3 years ago
In this episode, we "sit" down with Shelby Foy, a CRM archaeologist based in Florida! Listen in as we chat with her about life, her academic experience, and finding her passion in archaeology. How does Phil Collins tie in to this? Well, listen and find out!
Links
- Shelby's Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/shelbfo/
Contact
- Show
- Twitter: @idigitpodcast
- Email: [email protected]
- Alyssa
- Instagram: aal.archaeology
- Twitter: Lyssakemi
- Michaela
- Instagram: mm_digitalized
- Twitter: m_mauriello
Affiliates
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Guest Introduction
00:00:00
Speaker
You're listening to the Archaeology Podcast Network. You're listening to the iDicket Podcast, a podcast where we talk about the student perspective of navigating the world of archaeology and anthropology. I'm your host, Michaela. And I'm your host, Alyssa.
00:00:21
Speaker
Welcome back. Today we have with us another special guest, Shelby, who just graduated with her bachelor's last year in anthropology and environmental science, and just got promoted to curation manager this past Wednesday. So congratulations, Shelby, and welcome to the podcast. Welcome on in. Thank you. I'm happy to be here.
Shelby's Background and Academic Journey
00:00:46
Speaker
So tell us a little bit about yourself. Where are you currently in life and how did you get there? Those are big questions. That's a huge question. Let's go through all of it. Well, geographically, I'm in Florida. I'm actually from Florida. I've lived here my whole life, but I was originally from Tallahassee and now I'm living in Jacksonville.
00:01:16
Speaker
This is where I went to my undergrad and where I'm currently working for a CRM company. So yeah, that's where I'm at right now. So how did you get interested in archaeology? So I actually, it was a class I took. I'm a first generation college student, so I went to community college right out of high school, but didn't really
00:01:45
Speaker
have any direction and was just kind of working multiple jobs. It was kind of a big time to realize that the playing field wasn't exactly equal in higher education. I was aware of it when I was in grade school and stuff, but it was really, really relevant. And as I got older, then it deals with how your job and your success comes into play.
00:02:14
Speaker
made my way through my community college and then started taking a couple of classes at the university in Tallahassee. And I took a underwater archeology class. Yeah, I always wanted to do that. It was called World's Greatest Shipwreck. And it was really interesting. Like I always kind of had like a little bit of interest in history, but I wasn't like a nerd.
00:02:40
Speaker
Like suddenly it was like with archaeology, I guess I never really realized that you add in all of these, almost the sciencey part of it, like measuring and actually being able to visualize things. I was like, Oh, this is, this is actually really, really cool. Um, the hands-on aspect, I guess of it. Uh, so.
00:03:06
Speaker
you know, there was a lot of trial and error. And then I switched into anthropology and moved universities and actually ended up really lucky to be in a small program that worked out really well for me. And I got a lot of one-on-one time with professors and they really grew to like know me and helped develop and really diversify my skills. So it worked out well.
00:03:33
Speaker
Did the school that you transferred to also have underwater archaeology? Did you kind of branch out from there? No, they had the normal like anthropology four field approach. There were a couple like underwater focused people, but it's not like some universities. I know you can get your scientific diver while you're doing it.
00:04:01
Speaker
they didn't have anything offered like that, which wasn't necessarily something that I was pursuing. I've heard that Florida is a great place for underwater archaeology, which is why I asked. It is. So a lot of my really good friends have gone to the LAMP field school, which is the lighthouse. Oh my gosh, I can remember this acronym. Lighthouse Archaeological and Maritime.
00:04:32
Speaker
Sounds right. Yeah. Down at the St. Augustine Lighthouse, so they have done
00:04:43
Speaker
Is it a dig? Is it still a dig if it's underwater? Excavation, underwater excavation. Just add underwater before it and yes, underwater dig. The digging dive. Yeah, so a couple of the people that I work with currently have done that.
00:05:11
Speaker
So it seems like a pretty interesting thing. What did you end up focusing in for your undergrad degree?
Cultural Resource Management (CRM) Experiences
00:05:20
Speaker
Or like what area of anthropology were you geared towards? So I studied a lot of my research and my projects were focused on sites here in Florida, especially the coastal ones. And that kind of happened because it was the research area of my professors.
00:05:40
Speaker
But now that I've graduated, I still really gravitate heavily towards those sites. I really, really like the prehistoric, you know, indigenous coastal sites. A lot of shell middens and shell rings. And especially those, like, estuary and coastal environments where there's a lot of subsistence studies.
00:06:10
Speaker
That's awesome. And so you've been working with CRM since graduating? Is that? Yes. So I actually started kind of right before my last semester in undergrad, uh, almost by accident. Well, I moved over to Jacksonville when I was like 23 and around the same time,
00:06:40
Speaker
Someone that I was working in hospitality with from Palahassee also moved over to the same area down in St. Augustine and he had been working at a brewery and I was making my way through school and over the summer I was coming towards the end of my field school right before my last semester in undergrad and I got a text from him and he goes, hey, do you have any interest in CRM? And I said,
00:07:08
Speaker
No. It's like all of my professors say when you come to the end of your semester and stuff it happens at least once I feel like every semester a professor goes okay so like this is what you can do with your degree these are the things these are your options with an anthropology degree just so you know and like CRM is almost like always a footnote
00:07:37
Speaker
They're like, yeah, you can do cultural resource management, but like, do you don't really want to? Yeah. Yeah. And now that I've been in it, I can see why. But yeah, so I, I got a text from him and I initially said no. And then I was like, okay, well, but why are you asking? Oh, well, I have, I've met someone and she's looking for a field tech. I was like, okay, well,
00:08:07
Speaker
Let me, okay, sure. I'll meet the person. So I went down and met this person at a brewery and I was like, so nervous. Like code switched totally down all the way to professional mode. And in walks like the most badass person I've met before, like ever. And she, her name is Megan and she sat down and
00:08:35
Speaker
We basically, like this is the first archeologist I've met outside of. In the flesh. Yeah. Yeah. Like besides my professors. So I was so surprised how easy she was to talk to and how chill she was. And we became friends right away and we're still friends now, but yeah, she basically talked me into it. And how do you like it so far? What's it been like? It's been good.
00:09:05
Speaker
lie. It has been a lot of learning, for sure, which I appreciate, I would rather have a job that is having me, you know, constantly learn new things and apply them rather than being dull and complacent with being in the same spot. So
00:09:33
Speaker
Yes, that being said, there is a lot of downsides to CRM that I've just seen in the last year. It is a lot of quick work. There is a lot of money involved. And at least the company I work for really prioritizes getting paid at the end of the day versus doing quality work or really
00:09:58
Speaker
investigating like archaeologists do. Yeah, it sounds like CRM is really dependent on the company and the region whether you enjoy it or not because I've heard I have a lot of friends who really love their CRM work.
00:10:15
Speaker
that they've done, and then a lot of people who just absolutely hate it. And usually they're in very different parts of the United States or the world. Everyone in the UK loved their CRM job, which I can imagine is a lot cooler. It sounds like it's very region dependent. And I've encountered a lot of egos, like absurd egos in this field.
00:10:44
Speaker
Sounds right. Very few women also that you interact with in CRM, at least over here. That's how it is. I feel like I've only been interacting with female archaeologists, CRM archaeologists. My main coworkers have been women.
00:11:06
Speaker
super nice to just like take me under their wing and just like help me like figure out what I'm supposed to be doing because I'm like when I started the CRM job in August I had no real like real CRM experience in the US and like the last time I was really like honest I was like a few years before and then just doing masters and all that and so I'm just like I don't know what you guys want me to do here so then everyone's just been super just like oh no it's okay like let me explain this to you and I'm like thank you
00:11:35
Speaker
Yeah, I think my office is mostly women. We're on a project where we have a lot of subcontractors. It's probably going to be mostly men, but our permanent employees are mostly women. That's awesome. Yeah, it's been really cool. How was it when you first hired in? Was everyone super helpful as well or being eager to help you around and all that stuff?
00:12:02
Speaker
Yeah, so I was super lucky having Megan, that first person that brought me on because even on my first day in the field, she wasn't even assigned to the project and she made sure that she came out with me on the first day and really walked me through everything. And yeah, I've been really lucky as far as having mentors, which was a lot of fun. I don't know if you guys realize this, but so in Florida, our shovel tests are a meter deep.
00:12:30
Speaker
And I thought that was the norm until I started digging in other other states and like for our phase one our shovel tests were maybe like 15 to 37 meters deep. So being you know so early on a lot of my first projects were in Florida and I was like oh my gosh like I don't know how people dig through clay.
00:12:59
Speaker
It's crazy how every state has their standard for just general surveying too. It's all very different. What kind of work do you do with your CRM? Because for me, it was mostly site monitoring while construction was going on, that sort of stuff. It wasn't a whole lot of surveying and digging and test pits. Well, because I work for a small company, I have been able to bounce around a lot.
00:13:28
Speaker
which has been really cool. And it's also really allowed me to figure out where my strengths are. Initially I started out doing phase one. So those, you know, surveys where you have the shovel test pits, usually in 25 to like 50 meter intervals, depending on the project. And then I've worked on a couple of phase twos and threes where we're doing like the fold units. And I actually, one of the most recent fields
00:13:57
Speaker
works thing was a ARFA violation, which was kind of fun and sad, but a construction site had been, had destroyed its existing site. So we got to go and kind of find the extent of the damage and screen that and then basically figure out where that stopped and put a layer of mesh down. Yeah, so that had a lot of cool artifacts, which was also like
00:14:27
Speaker
simultaneously, like I'm finding these things that are really cool, but I'm also really sad about it because it's a destroyed site. Yeah. And so I've been able to do some cool stuff in the field. And then I've also probably the majority of my time has actually been in the office and the lab.
00:14:52
Speaker
where we get to just analyze artifacts and get it into a database, the normal kind of stuff, and then get stuff ready for repositories or the client, whoever it's going to. It's different with every single project. That sounds awesome. Yeah. What has been your favorite project that you've been working on so far or have worked on? Like to have a favorite, I should say.
00:15:20
Speaker
Definitely down in Cape Canaveral, just because I already like coastal sites a lot. So I got to work in Cape Canaveral. So we were digging an awesome site. And then on top of that, we were getting rocket launches that we got to watch as well. Whoa. What? Yeah. Yeah. So that was pretty exciting, like a weird merge of past and future. That's, oh, for real though. Wow.
00:15:50
Speaker
That'd be a good blog post. I just got like a little chill thinking about that. Like I'm holding this artifact that's from 1500 years ago while I'm looking at this rocket that's blasting off into the sky. Yeah, yeah, exactly. That's amazing. So what are your plans in like the near future? Are you thinking of staying in CRM or looking for grad school?
00:16:21
Speaker
Yeah, so I think I'm going to stay in CRM for the time being. I have been keeping my eye on grad schools. I actually got into a program that started this semester, and I didn't accept it because it was a business program. And the more I thought about it, the more I was like, I don't want to do this side of it. I don't want to tie myself to CRM. And what if this is the only master's program that I get to do? Do I want to not have it be archaeology?
00:16:51
Speaker
Yeah, I talked myself out of it. Do you think, are you going to try to stay associated with like Florida archaeology or do you want to try to check out other things also? What's the move? I think I'm open to checking out other things. That's another thing that I've kind of been on the fence with because there are so many things in Florida archaeology that I would like to pursue and explore a little bit deeper and learn more about.
00:17:22
Speaker
But I don't know if, you know, if I end up somewhere else, I would happily jump into archaeology elsewhere, you know? It's amazing.
00:17:35
Speaker
So we talked a little bit on Discord about you kind of being, you're not really that much older than like a normal undergrad, but you are a little older than typical bachelor students. So can you speak a little bit about that and just like your experience kind of coming in to undergrad later?
Returning to School and Personal Reflections
00:17:58
Speaker
There was definitely a lot of, I kind of just tried to stay quiet and
00:18:05
Speaker
no one noticed that, you know, how old I was, um, which wasn't like extremely older. I think I passed for most of it, but this also, I think my age kind of crept up on me because I was talking to my lab manager last week. I was like, Oh my gosh, I'm turning 28. I feel like I've, you know, I've been in undergrad for most of my 20. Yeah. I, I guess I think if I could do it again, I would probably be a little bit more confident with
00:18:33
Speaker
my age. And I think that would have allowed me to branch out and find a little bit more opportunities. And yeah, I'm not sure. I'm sorry, I don't have a good answer to that question. That's totally fine. Yeah, I sometimes feel like I went too fast, just like boom, boom, boom, right into things. Because I'm in my first year of my PhD now,
00:18:59
Speaker
as a 25-year-old right out of a master's program. And I'm like, maybe I should have took a year or two off and done something else instead of jump right back into academia. I will say that I have gotten compliments from my managers now from work. And I think it was because they didn't realize that I was a little bit older. They just knew that I was fresh out of undergrad. So they assumed I was earlier 20s.
00:19:29
Speaker
One of my managers, I remember we went to happy hour after work and I was sitting with her and we were talking about something and she found out that I was 27 at the time and she was like, oh my gosh, this explains your work ethic. And I was like, oh, she's like, that's why you have such a good work ethic. You're a little bit older. And not to say that, you know, younger people wouldn't, but I have worked a bunch of different jobs and have had like a lot of customers
00:19:58
Speaker
So maybe I'm just been like beaten down a little bit and I'm a little calder in situation. That's a pretty good compliment, I think. Yeah, I did appreciate it a lot. So what did you originally go into school for? Did you have an idea or did you kind of just go in and try everything out until you found?
00:20:24
Speaker
I was in the school for hospitality because I was working in restaurants. And I think that was initially the first time I took a break from classes was I was like, man, I could just work my way up within a restaurant instead of, you know, hospitality kind of seems like a dead end for me. And it wasn't as, I guess, academically stimulating as I hoped it would be.
00:20:54
Speaker
Wow. Was that like a trade school type program or? No. Oh, it was community. Actually was at Florida State. Okay. Yeah. And we'll be right back after this break. So I went on a interview with a different podcast recently. And one of the things they asked was, what is
00:21:19
Speaker
your favorite thing you've found as an archaeologist, like favorite artifact. So I want to see what your answer is for this also. Oh my gosh. I hate this question. Me too. Same. So did I. I don't have a good answer to it, honestly. OK. What are some of the things you've found then?
00:21:48
Speaker
Because with this question, I think a lot of people expect a specific object that's worth a bunch of money or something like that, like something very, very cool or has a cool story tied to it. And honestly, I haven't. A lot of my stuff has been basically the same kinds of things, a lot of indigenous pottery. And I think the coolest thing that I have found is
00:22:18
Speaker
almost a notion where every time I've been on a site where there's like a, there was a settlement, I, so a homestead site in the mountains, there was a bluff. There's a bluff here in Jacksonville that it's a significant site. I have like this moment where I'm like, yeah, this would be a cool place to live. Like, you know, like you just kind of like look around and you're like, you know what, I think I would like to live here.
00:22:46
Speaker
So I think that's one of the coolest things I found is whenever I'm on a site that someone else lived there, I kind of want to look at it and appreciate it the same way that they did. I can see why they picked this place. Yeah, like you've got a good view of the water. I would totally.
00:23:09
Speaker
I love that. That's so cute. I mean, like something about like that question, like you were mentioning, like you expect something that's so grand, like this immaculate artifact that needs to be in a museum, as Indiana Jones might say.
00:23:27
Speaker
I like the ones where it's just like how it impacts you. And so like with you like feeling that you belong in some way at this site and being able to be like, yeah, I can see it. Like that's, I love hearing like those experiences because that's so much more important than
00:23:45
Speaker
like this shiny gold something or I mean that's important but you know what I mean. I similarly responded that I hate that question. Mine was like you would think it's like kind of mundane but not so much when you talk about it but mine was
00:24:05
Speaker
being able to like actually see fingerprints in some of the pottery shirts that I would look at while I was in Mexico and just like feeling that instance of like being connected with the person who created the thing a thousand years ago or whatever and like that feeling is like my favorite thing that I have discovered in archaeology.
00:24:34
Speaker
I remember reading about one in my last semester where there was like a child's fingerprint and an adult's fingerprint in the pottery. Like they were teaching them how to make it. And I don't know if I was sleep deprived or stressed out, but I just like started bawling. I was just like, they were teaching them how to make the pots.
00:25:08
Speaker
It's so cool though that you can see that in an artifact. Those connections are very awesome. It's captured in time for years and years and years. Forever. Pottery never dies. We love it.
00:25:25
Speaker
I remember the first time I was in an archeological lab was in my undergrad and we're just getting a little tour of it. It was like little intro and we were getting shown shards and they were doing luminescent dating in there and being like, Oh, this is where we do this. And this is this. And here's some shards passing around that I saw like the fingerprint and I was just like, what, what is this? And so that I totally understand what you mean by like fingerprint.
00:25:52
Speaker
It's not satisfaction, but fingerprint. In other words, connection. There needs to be a term coined for it. The fingerprint connection. The feeling you get when you see a fingerprint in a thousand-year-old piece of clay. It's like that Tarzan moment when Tarzan puts his hand up to Jane.
00:26:16
Speaker
And their hands touch and he's just like, oh, we're just like each other. We're the same. Cue Phil Collins. The Phil Collins effect. That's what it should be called. They gotta coin it. It's the same feeling you get when you listen to Phil Collins.
00:26:40
Speaker
He didn't have to go that hard. He doesn't have to go this hard. The fingerprints, they got us. They got us. So pure. That's so bad.
Interactions with Indigenous Tribes and Community Engagement
00:26:54
Speaker
So do you, in your job, do any interactions with local indigenous tribes or anything like that? Or is there another metal man who does that part?
00:27:07
Speaker
We do, I don't personally, a lot of the project managers work with the Seminole tribe, which is kind of a unique situation because a lot of the remains we're working with are not direct, you know, ancestors of the Seminole tribe, but they do have kind of jurisdiction over it, so that's who we contact. And
00:27:31
Speaker
usually their responses leave it in the ground stop touching our stuff I we out here
00:27:48
Speaker
for CRM usually have a Native American representative also on site, like while we're working or surveying, that sort of stuff. So that's, that's the closest interaction I've had is just another person, like my age, but from the tribe walking around. They require the archaeological monitor and, or they call it cultural monitor. They require the cultural monitor and the tribal monitor.
00:28:15
Speaker
So that's where the archaeologist comes in and somebody from the tribe comes in. And then we just sit and watch and talk. Learn about each other. Yeah. I think that's what I enjoyed most about the CRM out here is the time you get to meet with other people too. It's not just all working. So I learned a lot about the local tribe that was in the area and some of their practices and what
00:28:44
Speaker
our native monitor believed in culturally and spiritually. And that was a really cool experience with her. She's in our Discord. She is? Yeah. What? She never really goes on Discord, but she joined in once. Carmen's here? Yeah, Carmen's in here somewhere. Wow. I'll have to find her. Yeah. Oh, Shelby, how did you find our Discord?
00:29:13
Speaker
Oh yeah, so it was through your podcast and then I think that I did get Instagram. Was it through the Instagram or through the Archaeological Podcast Network podcast and then the Instagram? Through the Instagram, yeah. Wow, okay, awesome. Which definitely would not have happened without pandemic.
00:29:37
Speaker
So, yeah, yeah. So that's some time around, like five months ago is when I was like, okay, I guess I play games now. And I'm going to do this because I can't do anything outside. I mean, I don't like the pandemic, but it's definitely brought a lot of good things with it also.
00:30:05
Speaker
like this experience of the podcast. Like we never would have done this if we weren't sitting around all the time. We should make podcasts. Yeah. Nothing better to do. But yeah, it's been really cool being able to meet so many different archeologists. And this community has grown so big in the last year. It's crazy how many people are on Discord. Yeah. You do a really good job of
00:30:30
Speaker
You guys do a good job of running everything. It's so organized. That is something I really appreciate when I pulled it up. I really appreciate all the different little tabs.
00:30:42
Speaker
Oh, thank you. That's good to hear. I like how people actually use them too, because that's the hard part sometimes is getting people to stay organized with it instead of just posting in whatever channel. Yeah. Everyone's really cool about that. Everyone knows how to navigate Discord, which is good.
00:31:03
Speaker
Pretty neat. We've had some heated conversations in there too, which I think have been good the same time. A lot of learning.
00:31:15
Speaker
Yeah, I was just thinking like the latest thing that was happening. And it's just, it's interesting because everyone comes from different backgrounds, which is a big part, different backgrounds, and different countries, countries, and like, yeah, different environments, totally. And having people come together, putting their opinions and like references and where they're getting their information from, it's
00:31:42
Speaker
very unique because sometimes you just think, oh, archeologists, anthropologists, we all think in a similar light, but that's not correct because everyone thinks in a different wavelength than each other. And then everyone needs to come together to figure out how to incorporate everything to make sense to each other. Yeah, definitely. It's crazy.
00:32:04
Speaker
I think what's cool about Discord too is how casual it is compared to other platforms. Cause I feel like, like Twitter, for example, or at least my Twitter has like an academic vibe to it where you don't really like post too much of like what you're thinking about certain events that are happening. But I feel like with Discord, everyone kind of just goes at it. It's pretty cool. Yeah.
00:32:33
Speaker
So I'm still kind of new to the discord, but from what I've noticed, it seems like the majority of the people that are active seem to be kind of UK based. And do you guys think that's because of like where your master's was and like, that's who you know, or
00:32:49
Speaker
I don't know, because we invited obviously a couple of our friends from our master's program. But I think most of the UK people who joined found us elsewhere. And I don't know how we got so many people from the University of York in our discourse. So wait a minute, where did you find us? And I guess some of the professors were sharing the links and stuff and re-tweeting.
00:33:17
Speaker
the Discord and about the Instagram. So that's all I'm thinking. There's just retweets, mayhaps, but... That is interesting though. Yeah. I think the UK is a really good place for like grad school too in terms of archaeology just produces a lot of
00:33:39
Speaker
cool archaeologists out of there. There have been, I've noticed a couple people from my company have gone, they did their masters in the UK, one in Ireland, but one at, gosh, I don't remember, it wasn't York, but I don't remember which one he went to.
00:33:59
Speaker
I really liked it. Even I feel like even if you don't necessarily love your program, just being over there is so cool, especially when you're studying archaeology, because you have access to all of the sites in the UK and you can travel Europe to for like a weekend trip or Scotland and that sort of stuff. So that experience is really cool, even like when classes were not as great or not what I expected.
00:34:28
Speaker
Like a lot of the program was also cool, but I think what took the cake was just like being in close proximity to that part of the world for a year. It was a really cool experience. Yeah. I don't have any complaints. I'm glad we got to do it the year before the pandemic instead of this year. We lucked out with that. Yeah.
00:34:55
Speaker
Were you able to walk for graduation, Shelby? I was. So I graduated December 19. Wow. So right before. Right before. Right before. Yeah. That must have been just so just satisfying one to like walk and do the whole graduation thing and then
00:35:18
Speaker
And then you have to worry about it. And now it's just like, oh, they're mine. Here's my, here's me on Minecraft. Minecraft has been pretty cool with reconstructing archaeological things too. Just complete worlds in Minecraft. I saw a lot of people did their graduation over Minecraft too. I saw that too.
00:35:48
Speaker
They're actually bringing in a new part of Minecraft called with archaeology. And basically you just get like a shovel and then you just kind of dig through dirt and sand, not even like a trowel or anything, you just have a shovel. And then you can find like little artifacts and stuff. I don't know when this update's coming out, but I'm excited for it and I will stream it.
00:36:12
Speaker
So my partner, this is going to sound, I swear he's not this lame, but he does still play RuneScape and RuneScape added an archaeology part recently. And I kind of, every once in a while I'm like looking over his shoulder and he's like, yeah, I'm sifting. And I'm like, what? You're sifting? Like, wow.
00:36:36
Speaker
They're just like, look who's the archaeologist now. Should we go play RuneScape? Time to go. That's so cool. I didn't know they did that. I didn't know that either. I just remember being bought to be a girlfriend.
00:36:58
Speaker
Do you have GF? Yeah. I kind of log in every now and then just to see how old my character is because there's like a 15-year cape that I can get. And I'm just like just shy of it. I have the 10-year cape. Wow. And that's about all I log in for. But now I have something else to log in for. Yeah. You should stream it.
00:37:26
Speaker
I know I should I'll do it so I think I hate that I know this but I think they might actually be at their 20 year now because recently my partner opened up Wikipedia and Wikipedia is on their 20 years and he's like
00:37:43
Speaker
Whoa, RuneScape is older than Wikipedia. It's like, wow, okay. It's like borderline getting to like internet archaeology now. Honestly, that is a relic now. Yeah, ancient. Gonna throw it in with the VHSs. Yeah.
00:38:06
Speaker
I mean, for California, archaeologically significant is 50 years, so pretty soon. I can't wait until there's like in-depth internet archaeology studies, just like mining for old sites. I forget who I was talking to. I was talking to someone that was going in and finding like just archiving software.
00:38:32
Speaker
And just taking like old software, old games, old systems, like archiving something of the sort. I don't necessarily remember anything else about the conversation except for that. And I thought it was very interesting. But I'm just like, that's just so weird that it's like, it is a thing, but I mean, it makes sense. And we'll be back after this break.
00:38:54
Speaker
In the Discord, you mentioned that you're happy to share some insight on alternative career routes and imposter syndrome.
Exploring Career Paths in Archaeology
00:39:01
Speaker
And I'm just kind of wanting to know what you're meaning by alternate career routes and kind of sharing your information, your knowledge, your wisdom with everyone. Well, yeah, so obviously I can only share my personal experience and I know it's going to be different for everyone, but I have noticed it seems like there's a whole lot of pressure
00:39:24
Speaker
especially in this field, to make it through as quick as possible and, you know, get the higher degrees. And I guess because I kind of jumped in a little bit late, I appreciate, I guess I appreciate the time that it took me to find it, you know, because I probably wouldn't have done archaeology if I had finished school, you know, at a normal time.
00:39:54
Speaker
And I don't think I would have had the same lens that I have now. If things had gone differently, if I hadn't, you know, taken the time to work other jobs and look at humans the way I do. So yeah, it has been, I don't have any like really good answers or good like general advice.
00:40:24
Speaker
because it is, I think, really case-specific. And I am still overcoming the fact that I don't feel like I belong. I don't feel like I'm an archaeologist because I'm inexperienced in a lot of aspects for some on my age. So yeah.
00:40:49
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like with the pandemic also, I think a lot of people are learning to do more of their own pace and what feels right.
00:41:02
Speaker
And everyone's kind of had the chance to kind of like sit back and analyze what they're doing with their life and whether they actually want to be doing what they're doing. So I think that's great advice to just like kind of go at your own pace and let life come to you and follow what feels good. Yeah. Yeah. And I think a lot of people, you know, we don't like to talk about this, but you do need to be real with your financial situation and where you're at because
00:41:31
Speaker
I think I saw a lot of people going through school the same age as me, but finishing so much quicker because they did not come from a low income background like I did. Or they had parents that went to college and were able to basically set them up for success in ways that my parents couldn't. They really did a great job. I really appreciate everything my parents have done for me, but they didn't have college degrees.
00:42:01
Speaker
So it's a different world, you know? Yeah, definitely. I was also the first one in my immediate family to get a degree. Both my parents had done some school, but then dropped out to do other work. And so it's definitely a different experience because you can't really get the advice from your parents on how to survive.
00:42:28
Speaker
the degree it's kind of just like a learning process on your own and they're there like rooting for you but like I can't help you but like you're doing great yeah that sort of thing and I think it took me such a long time to uh kind of seek out a support system and that was sort of a tough lesson to learn um yeah
00:42:54
Speaker
Did you really feel that it was your place when you went when you started the anthropology major and kind of around people in the similar subject that you were really interested in? Yeah, yeah, I really felt at home for the most part, besides being a little bit older. But I really liked, I guess I was kind of shocked to come from my perception of
00:43:22
Speaker
Like university education was, you know, you go there to do business stuff, which I knew better than that because like, you know, college or like, you know, coming through, through high school and having friends that were getting ready for college. When I was like, Oh, I already know I'm going to community college. That has been my, my option that I was given. I don't have any other options or at least I didn't think I did. So I think.
00:43:49
Speaker
the anthropology program at UNF, which is where I went, was really awesome at making people feel like they belonged. And it kind of felt like you were almost around like-minded individuals, but enough to create those dichotomies that you would have in discussions and stuff like that.
00:44:15
Speaker
Yeah, that's awesome. I think anthropology was a really good route for me. I'm glad you found it. It sounds like it's been a good time for you also. So that's amazing. Yeah, I think, yeah, I've always been pretty curious and like investigative. And I think anthropology really tied that all together for me. Like I was like, how do I pick something when I'm interested in everything? And with anthropology,
00:44:44
Speaker
there's so many things that you can delve into. And then archaeology just kind of really found like a little special part in my
00:44:54
Speaker
My heart. I really love how cross-disciplinary anthropology can be, especially with, you're in environmental, or you did environmental also, right? Yes. Yeah. Especially tying in geography and environmental science and climate studies and anthropology, archaeology, all of that can be under the anthropology umbrella, which is amazing.
00:45:24
Speaker
Yeah, so that was actually really cool. I would be taking simultaneously environmental classes with my archaeology classes. And I would go from one environmental class where, especially in the theory classes, where they would be having debates, where students are holding these discussions about how do we find sustainable living? How do we perfectly make a society that is
00:45:54
Speaker
low waste and sustainable. And then I would go into archaeology class and we would be working with artifacts from groups that lived in these like estuary and coastal environments and they did it sustainably. So it was just kind of like a
00:46:12
Speaker
fun moment for me to be like, Oh my gosh, guys. It's all tied together. Yeah, that's awesome when you can like see the connections. Yeah, we're learning a little bit about like the Anthropocene and climate and how
00:46:29
Speaker
ancient people affected the climate. Cause a lot of the times we think of like global warming as something that started with like the industrial age and the steam engine and that sort of thing. But people have been impacting their environment and climate for thousands and thousands of years long before that. So yeah, it's interesting what people think of like pristine environments.
00:46:57
Speaker
Even though everything has been modified in one way or another by people since people have been around. Very interesting. Something I'm tying in with or trying to tie in with my research right now. If you could say one thing to post high school Shelby, what would you say? I've thought about this before.
00:47:24
Speaker
And I don't think I would say anything. You're doing great. You're doing great. You know, and yeah, yeah, maybe, maybe some encouragement, but in reference to, you know, school and career wise, I don't, I don't think I would say anything. That's awesome. I'm, I'm, I guess I'm also afraid of like butterfly effect. Like, what if I just like,
00:47:54
Speaker
Fair enough. Send myself in like a completely different direction. Shelby, can you hear me? It's me, Shelby. Wait a minute. No, I don't want to turn left.
00:48:11
Speaker
I was gonna ask something in the same light of if you were to talk to people that are coming right out of a high school and kind of figuring out which path if they want to do an academic path that they wanted to do if you have any thing you would want to say to them. I guess my best advice would be to really, you know, make sure you're taking up responsibility for yourself to
00:48:39
Speaker
find your best opportunities because other people aren't going to find them for you. If you can really figure out where you would be happiest or what interests you, I think exploring those options and not even like, okay, this is a very big jumbled thought. I'm sorry.
00:49:06
Speaker
I think I really started making the most progress in finding out what I wanted to do when I started volunteering.
00:49:19
Speaker
Which is hard because if you're economically disadvantaged, you are working anytime you're not in school. So I really do hurt for, you know, people that can't do that. Like you really, really, really have to find the time. How are you going to volunteer if you're working two jobs? It came to the point where for me, I just ended up taking out more loans and really started prioritizing school because I was so afraid to be
00:49:46
Speaker
you know, set back even further. I was afraid to come out of my degree, you know, at such a disadvantage because that was what was drilled into my head. Ultimately, it ended up benefiting me to take that setback and have more freedom to, you know, volunteer and advance my career by doing things like that.
00:50:11
Speaker
That was very long. I'm sorry. No, I love that. I think that was very, very good advice. Sometimes it's hard to do what's best for you when you're focusing too much on
00:50:28
Speaker
You. You, yeah. When you're working so much that you don't have enough time to explore yourself, and that definitely is a luxury to have time to explore yourself. So figuring out ways to be able to do that should definitely be important. Yeah. And I mean, it's very much systemic, but
00:50:55
Speaker
Definitely. It is a privilege. Thank you so much for this inspiring chat. It was great to have you on and get your perspective of everything. Thank you for having me. Yeah, and congrats on your promotion. Oh, thank you. I hope it's amazing and you get a lot of really great experiences out of it.
00:51:22
Speaker
Yeah. Do you have any social medias or links or anything that you would like to give a shout out to? Yeah. I have Instagram where you can find, I don't have an archeology Instagram. I've like thought about making one. Maybe I will eventually, but for now I just have my personal one, which is at Shell Pro. So it's everything except my last letters in my name. So S H E L B F O.
00:51:52
Speaker
And there is a link in my bio, I guess, is the only thing that I have a link to. I helped make a museum exhibit for a little local museum here in the beaches with one of my last classes. Yeah.
00:52:10
Speaker
Yeah, so be sure to check out Shelby and her Instagram and that cool museum. And be sure to head over to our Discord where you can chat to all of us anytime you want. It's fun in there, I swear. I'm not being held hostage while I'm talking. I mean, we made it. We made it. Told you not to say that.
00:52:37
Speaker
I want my mom. Anywho, and we'll catch you guys next time. Thanks for listening. Bye. Bye.
00:52:51
Speaker
This show is produced by the Archaeology Podcast Network, Chris Webster and Tristan Boyle, in Reno, Nevada at the Reno Collective. This has been a presentation of the Archaeology Podcast Network. Visit us on the web for show notes and other podcasts at www.archpodnet.com. Contact us at chris at archaeologypodcastnetwork.com.