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Ep #4 Coffee Expeditions: Larry Clarkson - NFL and CFL Offensive Lineman, Travel and History Enthusiast & Firefighter
62 Plays5 months ago
Join us on this captivating episode of Coffee Expeditions as we sit down with Larry Clarkson, a man of many talents and passions. Larry is a former professional offensive lineman in both the NFL and CFL, a dedicated firefighter, and an avid traveler with a deep appreciation for history.
In this episode, we explore Larry's fascinating journey from the gridiron to the firehouse and beyond. Hear his thrilling stories from the football field, the challenges and rewards of firefighting, and his adventures around the world. Larry shares his insights on the importance of teamwork, resilience, and the pursuit of passion in every aspect of life.
Grab your favorite cup of coffee and join us for an inspiring conversation filled with tales of athletic prowess, heroic firefighting, and incredible explorations. Whether you're a sports enthusiast, a history buff, or a travel lover, this episode with Larry Clarkson is sure to ignite your sense of adventure and appreciation for life's diverse paths.
Checkout more from Coffee Expeditions on Instagram and Tiktok at: @CoffeeExpeditions
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Transcript
00:00:01
Speaker
um Bye!
Introduction and Guest Background
00:00:08
Speaker
Okay, we're live. We're doing episode four of the Coffee Expeditions podcast. I've got my good friend, Larry Clarkson. We've known each other for, well, probably well over like 28 years, almost. Yeah, since 96, I think. Yeah. So Larry's co-worker, we worked as firefighters together for a long time. And you know, before that, you played in the NFL and the CFO and had, you know, professional football career.
00:00:35
Speaker
Do you mind maybe just introducing yourself for for the viewers and watchers and listeners there, Larry? Sure. My name's Larry Clarkson. um I grew up you know in Abbotsford and after high school, went down to the State University of Montana to play football down there. and then you know we you know i I had a middle in NFL and and CFL career before I decided to move on. you know, into a new phase of life.
Larry's Personality and Influences
00:01:06
Speaker
and And that's, you know, when we met when I got on the fired part. Yeah. so it's It's one of those things where, um you know, having met you and having known a few other professional athletes always struck with you over the years how humble you are. And it's it's it's something that I've drawn upon, you know, as a friend that you know, I always remember calling you my Zen, you know, because things would be going on at work would be like a little bit, you know, maybe a controversial topic or a tough call and you're always so even keel and calm and I kind of wanted to talk about that when you know, as we get into things because I, you know, I wondered, like, was that something that was natural for you or that you picked up through football years or, you know, It's it's an interesting thing that that not a lot of people have, right? Where you're able to stay calm under pressure and and whatnot. Yeah, I think it's a combination of ah you know my personality and the influence of you know coaches and my parents. and
00:02:02
Speaker
you know, other other individuals in my life and also really sitting back and being analytical and looking at the people who aren't like that, you know, and and and we've all had those coaches or yeah captains or whatever who are losing their minds, right? And, you know, and and you just, you're like... it you know it it if you're if you're self-aware enough and you see that effect on on yourself you know and and how you know you start to you know to you know get yourself out of control when everybody else it was always something that that kind of came naturally i mean i was probably
00:02:38
Speaker
a very, you know, I guess low emotion football player. I wasn't one of those guys, you know, smashing heads on the sidelines, trying to get yourself psyched up, you know, to get angry or whatever. I was a much more analytical player. And, but I also, you know, the, the real positive you know, men in my life, you know, leadership wise, we're all very, very calm, you know, under control, you know, little, ah little emotion, really, you know, it's interesting, because
00:03:11
Speaker
that That's something that I'm fascinated with is leadership. As you know, like I'm trying to study, you know, Jocko willing, he's helped me out enormously, just understanding leadership principles, because I didn't really have anything to go by. And it seems to me as professional athletes that the ones that I've met, they've had those role models often in their life, not saying all pro athletes, but like, you know, are all experiences are the same, but it seems like especially if your team's sport enough, you're going to see those those leaders that are really, really good. and And you can try to like, okay, well, maybe I don't want to be like that guy, but I do want to be like this other individual that's calm and whatnot.
Leadership and Teamwork Lessons
00:03:44
Speaker
I think with leadership, you know, I always used to struggle with the idea is leadership naturally born. I think there is a little bit of that, but I do feel with leadership, you can improve yourself, you know what I mean? By by by observing and and thinking about it and trying to learn the principles of of that, right?
00:04:00
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I mean, you're right. It's ah it's an always evolving thing and then then we're not born with it necessarily. I know that, um you know, especially with the fire service, you know, we we have that evolution that's quite good, you know, where you've got 20 years or you know it was less than that for us before we were officers. But you know if you're paying attention to the job and you're looking at you know people and and you know calls and you and you just want to pick from here and from there. yeah
00:04:35
Speaker
um you know and so You know, I can remember individuals back to when we were rookies, you know, uh, John voice was a captain that always was pretty calm dude. And I can always remember just this mind blowing episode where we were on this big call. It was a natural gas leak. We had to evacuate a school, I think. And we, you know, it was like, you know, just chaos and everything. John turns to me and I'm like a one year guy, you know, maybe, maybe not a probie, but pretty, pretty low down the totem pole and he's this grizzled old vet.
00:05:08
Speaker
And he goes, Larry, what am I missing? And it was just like, what? yeah know like for sure like What is he doing? And that stuck with me for my whole career. And that and I never, ever you know had that. arrogance of I know better than everybody else because I, you know, I didn't. Yeah, and it's a huge key point. And I very much tried to operate the same way. I've done the same thing. I had ah an electrical problem. It was in ah in a ah bus loop where there was an underground electrical fire. And I had and ah one of our new guys, he was electrician, he'd only been on six months and I'm like, you you stay with me, you know, because we all have experiences that
00:05:49
Speaker
day that are beneficial and when you're when you're on a team, you know, you want to use everyone's input. You might might not might not be able to act on everything, but to have that input I think is so much better than, okay, I'm going to tell you what to do and go do it and don't say anything because now you're shutting people down that might have great information, could be a safety concern, it could be expertise, you know, because you don't know everything. And did you find Like, so when you were in, you know, obviously playing high level football, uh, did you find it was similar there where like, as a team aspect, like people like work together and how that communication or was some, sometimes yes, sometimes no, the, the, the really good teams.
00:06:31
Speaker
did that, right? Like, you know, like it just, you know, you look back and you see, man, the really good teams I had a chance to be on were, you know, uh, the coaches were calm, you know, the players were calm and working together and, you know, putting in extra work after practice and that it wasn't, uh, you know, let's amp the emotion up, you know, more and more, and you know, and, and, and, you know, you were doing the little things right all the time and, ah Bill Walsh always had this saying is perfect practice. you know He didn't want to put three or four hours into a practice right every day. like you so that's That's a waste of time because if you're doing it wrong, yeah you know and and but he always wanted to make it perfect. But if after an hour, the practice was great. All right, boys, that's it. That's awesome. To the showers. right and so that Not that I was there that long, but i mean that just that some of those memories,
00:07:28
Speaker
um you know, and and and and watching like Hall of Fame players like Jerry Rice or Joe Montana stuff and the in the and the professionalism and the work that they put in and they weren't degrading people. They weren't, um you know, in San Francisco had a unique policy because every sport team that I ever played with, you know, would have like a rookie. You know, hazing's a wrong, you know, that's what it was, but it wasn't, you know, hazing's a ah politically incorrect word. It's like an initiation. Yeah, initiation that everybody did, you know, and and and that was fine. I'd gotten up and had to sing in college and at at the cafeteria, you know, like, I mean, yeah you know, i I mean, we all did it, but at San Francisco wasn't there. That wasn't there. That was, you know, their policy was that you're on the team, you know, you're an equal, you know, where there's no, you're not treated any different. And he would chew out you know the highest level guy. you know ah Bill Belichick is famous for that now where he would chew Tom Brady out interact this yeah and just rip him like he would the rookie receiver who was making mistakes. I haven't played for all coaches, but a lot of successful coaches seem to have that trait where
00:08:44
Speaker
You know, you treat everybody the same. There's no favorites. There's no, yeah you know, special. And that's really hard to do because, you know, I would imagine for someone like Bill Belichick with Tom Brady and and his slight level of, you know, incredible performance. It's pretty hard to not say, Hey, you know, Tom, yeah, no, no worries. I know you got this or whatever. yeah You've won six super balls or whatever. he yeah and And then you've known him a long time. He's a, you know, he's a friend and, you know, yeah know he's a player under you as a coach. And so I think though, If you can do that and that eat and that fairness comes through and everyone sees it and then everyone's hopefully pulling in the same direction versus all. all This guy gets favoritism and it's harder on me or or whatnot.
Football Career and Transitions
00:09:25
Speaker
The other thing like, you know, one of the things I took away from i mean so much from Jocko's teachings.
00:09:31
Speaker
ah I always say, you know, you can't go too far wrong if you do what's best for the term team first over yourself or first. Did you find that was a common theme as well through like football or? Yeah. Once again, with the successful teams, yeah I can remember in the CFL. You know, my first year with the Lions, it was a really successful year. We had a veteran team that I came into as a rookie and was accepted into it, started right away. We went right to the Grey Cup. You know, we lost the Grey Cup, but without, you know, here or there, it was a really close game. And that team was really tight, you know, we're veterans. The veterans are, you know, we're
00:10:12
Speaker
going out for dinner after, you know, like like everybody bonded together, but then things fell apart and it was different things. Players got traded, cut salary issues were huge in the CFL, right? If you were making too much money, you know you know, you got released even if you were starting veteran or whatever. It wasn't like the NFL that had that blank check. ah mentality. And and so it deteriorated over the next three seasons to a point where you know we were, I think we had three head coaches in three years or something like that. And and so and they're and they're just bringing waves of other players in every week you know to ah compete to try and replace you. And they're not whining because that's that's just the nature of professional sports. But
00:10:59
Speaker
what What happens then is that now it's your livelihood and there's no guaranteed money. you know it's it's It's not like you're sitting in baseball or hockey and it's like, well, if you don't like me, coach, then give me my 8 million or 5 million or 4 million and you know ill yeah elsea I'll go to junior or whatever, you know the the farm system. None of that in football. And, you know, and that happened to me after, you know, into the fourth season. And then all of a sudden I'm, you know, on a on a plane to Calgary. And, you know, I'm like, well, what just happened? You know, like I mean, I was at the pinnacle starting in the Great Cup yeah a couple of years earlier. Now now you're off to Calgary. Yeah, they released me and i'm I'm picked up by Calgary. And then, you know, and then it just... you know the It changed my whole out outlook on things at that point because you know when things get bad, you start to look out for yourself. you know and and so
00:11:57
Speaker
you know It's something that you really have to be aware of. know It's interesting because ah because if you're having like that much staffing changes, that much coaching changes, it's really hard to build and create momentum for that team because like you said, it's the little things and building up. So now if you're having that much change in turmoil and you're trying to work towards a championship, that's I would imagine almost impossible and less things just somehow click and everybody just figures it out. But I don't think it's that easy when everyone's that good at that, you know, at the highest levels.
00:12:31
Speaker
pull pull it You know, I've had a taste of it from the coaching side of things and we won a provincial championship with my son, Tom, in grade 12 when we won the provincial championship for football. and You know, we, we worked on that team, uh, right from when they were in grade nine, you know, we had, we had of this, you know, incredible group of kids. I always laugh about this because, you know, you're talking about, you know, percentages of athletes, right? You know, cause we always, you know, 99% of most athletes don't have it, right? Like, yeah you know, and you got that 1%. Well in grade, grade nine, the first team meeting we have,
00:13:10
Speaker
uh, four dads walk in and they're all six, six, and they're all a played college sports, you know, and it's something like that, you know, and, and, and so we, we know their sons all have potential, Henry, but that, that, that, that's beside the point. But, uh, the staff that we, we had, and we rode those kids right through the grade 12 and it was a similar thing. We were all calm coaches, but we never had no favorites or whatever. I pulled myself from coaching my own son. You know, even though I was, you know, as qualify, you know, more qualified than anybody in the room, but we had to bring another guy in, um, to coach the offensive line because I couldn't coach him, uh, properly and still be, you know, still be dad, right? Because there's just, it's just too hard. Right. And that's so wise because I, I've seen, I saw that a little bit in soccer where, you know, that you would, you would see that potential, even if it wasn't happening, the optics were like as favoritism to that, to that. Yeah. Or the flip side where you destroy your relationship with your kid, that he grows up. Yeah, ultimately the most important thing at the end, I think. And my son was one of those one-percenters who had the physical gifts to go on to something higher, you know? Yeah. And so when you started in like, or was it early on? Because you played sports pretty much your whole life, right? Well, you know, my sports career is very unique because
00:14:39
Speaker
and I sucked through my youth, right? I tried hockey, I tried baseball, I tried soccer. and I just didn't have. you know I was this giant gangly kid right yeah and um yeah I was fully grown at 13. I am 6'8", basically. and The only sport, and well yeah even lacrosse, was really hard for me because sure I was so much bigger than all the other kids that when I would hit them,
00:15:11
Speaker
they would crumple into a ball and cry and I'd get a roughie. So I'd spend yeah it's been most of the game in the penalty box because kids were just crumpling down and that and so I'd stop playing, you know, when I was eight or nine, I think lacrosse. And so I was struggling athletically. And then um there is this ah there was a couple of these aha moments where I walked into a you know, a junior high in Abbotsford in grade eight. And all of a sudden this coach comes or this man comes running up to me and says, who are you? You know, my name is Larry. He said, no, where have you come from? I said, I was at, you know, Margaret Stanterson Elementary, you know, and he's like, you're playing rugby.
00:15:55
Speaker
Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah, that sounds great. I've been a basketball guy, you know, i I shouldn't say that I wasn't good at basketball, but I wasn't great at basketball. I was a giant dude, you know, in elementary school that could just turn around and, you know, dunk on an eight foot net, right? But, but, but rugby opened this whole new world to me, you know, athletically because I could run pretty well at that point. And, you know, I was six, eight, you know, I was only like two, two, two 15 or something like two 20, but still how old are you at that point? 13 or 14 or whatever I was. Right. And rugby allowed me the, the aggression that had been limited to me, and you know, all three sports. Sure. Yeah. And all of a sudden like, Oh, I can tackle these dudes. I can, I can, you know, I can, you know, and that's good, but you know, it's good. and so i
00:16:48
Speaker
fell full into basketball and rugby. you know and that that Those are my sports. right and then I you know trained and and we ran all the time. ah you know and By grade 10, the success that had again given me confidence-wise. and I was scrimmaging with ah the first division men you know in Abbotsford. I was under the wing of this this coach. it was a scottie He was from Scotland. and he had already set up that I was going to go and do like a school in in ah Scotland for rugby. And one of the men that was was you know mentoring me too from the men's scene, he was playing for Canada ah you know as as a rugby player. yeah and there Everything's looking great and I finished grade 10 and
00:17:36
Speaker
And then also now at that point you went eight, nine, 10, grade eight, nine, 10 in Abbotsford. And then you went to the the big school, Abby Abbotsford senior. And then once again, it was like deja vu. I'm walking down the hallway the first day and all of a sudden this crazy looking guy comes up and he says, who are you? And I'm like, how many players? Well, I'm the football coach, Bill McGregor. And he says, you've got to come out to practice. And this was like five days before the start of practice in grade 11. I'm like, OK, sure. And by the end of that year, I had
00:18:12
Speaker
I quit rugby and the coaches just freaked out because they had all these big plans and everything. I was going to play for Canada and all this stuff like that, but the man who was mentoring me, and I'll always bless him because You know, big time guy who's playing for Canada, but, you know, he had a regular job and he said, Larry, he said, listen, he says, you're, you're good enough. You're going to get a scholarship to the States. You're going to, you're, you're most likely going to get to the CFL and stuff. He says, I'm playing for Canada at this point. And I have to pay for my own airline ticket to go to the world cup. yeah so yeah So he says, there's no future financially for you. You'll have the pride of playing for Canada that it's different now. I mean, that's easy.
00:18:54
Speaker
And so I was like, oh okay, I'll focus on football and basketball. you know and tri and And so I was a multi-sport guy the whole way through. but There was none of this sports stuff. Football just evolved. but Before my grade 12 year, you know U.S. schools were you know come you know approaching me and um you know and just morphed. but you know Um, you know, just to talk about my own career, I mean, I was, I had, ah I had an insane work ethic, but that's, that's common, right? I mean, there's lots of athletes who have an insane work ethic, but yes I was that.
00:19:31
Speaker
you know was without sounding arrogant here, but at that that less than 1% of the population. you know her kind of perfect combination The height, the size, the athleticism, you know and and and and so when you combine those two, you will have an opportunity. It's not guaranteed, of course. but um you know, lots of people with great work ethic and strive to be frank, but you just don't have it, right? Yeah, absolutely. i meant i've've I've spoken to a lot of families over the years who've come to me about, oh, my son's really good at football. and you know yeah It's hard to say. like
00:20:06
Speaker
You know, if you're getting offered by a Canadian school, take it. I mean, you're not, you know, yeah you know, you don't have it. you know it's It's interesting because, you know, I'm i'm recreational and pretty much everything I do in terms of sport, ah but I've been lucky to play recreationally with some professional ex-fesional athletes and, you know, like hockey a little bit in, you know, like jiu-jitsu, you know, I've seen the pros in like triathlon. And when you see that up close, you realize, oh, that's why you get paid money to play this sport. It's incredible to see in person.
00:20:42
Speaker
and And I think sometimes people have never had that experience and they kind of made, you can have a bit of a false dream there. You know, it's like, until you see it. And that's one thing I was going to ask you as as we as move along here, but it's a good time to maybe touch on it. When you were in the CFL and the NFL and and University of Montana, did you, were there some times where like you're surrounded by all these incredible athletes, these stud players, was there times where like, Oh man, like that guy blows me away. Well, I'll tell you, I just was thinking about this the other day after you had asked me to do this. And I always remember really questioning my, you know, how good I was. I was at the NFL combine, you know, and so there's the top, I don't know what there was 18 to 20 offensive linemen in the country. You know, we were all, you know,
00:21:33
Speaker
all Americans, can you know you know all this stuff, you know lots of accolades. And it was different a bit in in in in the 80s because we didn't have computers and we you know you couldn't like look up. you know you know you couldn't You didn't know a lot about other guys, but we're all big dudes, right? I mean, we're all six, four plus, we're all 320 plus, we're all bench pressing 225, 25 times or more, you know like all this stuff. but there's one guy and he was the dude, right? Like he was, really his name was Randall McDaniel and he was a offensive guard out of North Carolina, I believe. And it wasn't an elite, like it wasn't bigger than us. He was like a six, four, three, 20. So, you know, guy, but when you watched him,
00:22:16
Speaker
It was like, we're all sitting there. you know I mean, that we're the elite and we and we're sitting there with our jaws wide open, right? and and And here's Randall and he runs a 4.8 and he bench presses 36, 37 reps with 225. And his vertical is almost 40 inches of that size. So this is a world-class athlete, no matter what size, yeah you know, and and and he's that big. where Randall goes on to a 14-year career and he was elected to the Hall of Fame, wow you know, I don't know how many years ago now, but he was the the dude, right? And and and so he, um that
00:22:55
Speaker
made me realize is that, okay, this pro thing is going to be really hard because you've got limited rosters. There's never been like a, a league, like a, like a sub league or, you know, for the NFL, right? Like, yeah, you know, they've played around with Europe and stuff like that, but they don't send their, their top backup guys there or whatever. um And that was kind of the first inkling of like, I'm going to have to now have some luck, you know, injuries and get an opportunity or, but you know, whatever, to prove myself because man, every year, there's a whole bunch of there's a bunch of guys come here. And that's what ended up happening. I hung around for a bit, you know, got, you know, never played in their in a regular season game, you know,
00:23:41
Speaker
made a bit of money, you know, all this kind of stuff. But, you know, I, I never had that break, you know, I never had that, like, oh, somebody goes down in the playoff game and I'm in, you know, and and then I get my name, you know, whatever. And after two years, that you know, there's two generations of players that have come again, you know, year after year of all these stud guys. And so now you're just an afterthought race. Nope, we're moving on to the next, uh, You know, and I'm on, you know, I've been drafted by the Lions, ah you know, when I came out of college, and so they had my rights, and then, you know, I came back to the Lions. right on yeah yeah
00:24:16
Speaker
So yeah, so that even at that point, I realized, oh wow. you know and and end you know and And I've struggled you know emotionally with my football career you know because i um I felt disappointed you know at at certain points. And you know and when I ended the way it did in the CFL, I felt disappointed and kind of embarrassed because I had always thought that I was going to be this 10-year veteran or you know whatever. But now when I look back, it's like the best thing that ever happened to me because I i was only making like 60 grand a year in the CFL. right yeah And then you know some of the guys that I had played with in the CFL, Jamie Buis and Glenn Leonhard and that, they had left the Lions a couple of years before me, had gone and gotten on with Burnaby Fire and that's what I'm talking to them and they're like,
00:25:06
Speaker
Dude, you gotta get you got to get on this, man. You're not going to play the rest of your life. You got to get out now. I'm making more money than you now yeah as a three-year guy or four-year guy in the Burnaby fire. And so that was the first time I'd ever thought
Firefighting and Family Legacy
00:25:20
Speaker
about the fire department. So that's what kind of gave you that that spark to to go that route. Yeah. And then then it helped my transition because I was able to move into a you know, a great career, right? <unk>ve i've I've lived the dream of little boys where, you know, I've had, I was i was a football player and then a fireman and, you know, I haven't had a real job in my whole life. yeah it's That's amazing. But I mean, one thing though, like, ah that I wanted to touch on, I know we've talked about this before is, is when you went to University of Montana, I i remember you distinctly talking about setting goals and having discipline.
00:25:54
Speaker
Is that something that's correct like that as you were getting the you were looking up like that kind of quarterly like Gav got a hit more weight or or is that kind of something that was a big yeah, you know, I was always a pretty honest person with myself, you know, and I would I would take the coaching I would take the advice, you know, and and and I knew going in like I mean you go into your first day of college and you're in the and you're getting the testing done. And you're like, holy crap. These guys are putting up some big numbers. Huge numbers, yeah. I can imagine. and i can't I can't survive that, right? And and so i I took a red shirt year, my first year, which
00:26:35
Speaker
You know, you have that five years to play for in American college, right? And so they just said, first day said, you're not ready. You know, like you're not, yeah, you're you're not even going to travel. You're not, you know, like you're just not ready. And so you're going to, you're going to eat, get in the weight room. You're going to be on the practice, you know, on this, on the scout team, you know, and learn. And you know, every time I i would take that on as. you know I'm going to make myself the best you know of this and you know and I'm going to challenge the starters by being the scout team guy and I'm going to get them as good you know as ready as I can and yeah yeah and then just lived.
00:27:16
Speaker
the football, you know, and sometimes to the detriment, you know, like academically and, you know, things like that, because yeah it was more important to go, well you know, get my squat workout in than they go to class or, you know, right whatever, you know, and so, um you know, it was, it was, it was a single focus. you know, what that it did turn into success. But then once again, like like yeah coaching changes can can also be to a benefit, right? And so i we had had a staff that i that had recruited me, had given me my scholarship, had made me a starter my second year. You know, I shouldn't really have started, but we weren't on a very good team at that point.
00:27:55
Speaker
And so they were like, okay, we're building for the future. You know, Larry, you're going to start as a, fresh you know, as a freshman, like your second year freshman. And I wasn't ready. I mean, I i was getting ragdolled out there by men, you know, and and I'm 18 and you know, and there's these 22 year olds yeah yeah just jacking me up, right? But it was it was the best thing for me because it was a learning lesson. and but But then that staff got fired. And I still had two years left, but then ah one of the most influential men in my life, Don Reed, came in um at that point. and And once again, another guy like Bill Walsh, just calm and honest. And you know he would tell you when you're not doing well, but he's not in your face yelling this stuff. He said, no, you need to. And he just believed in me. and and and
00:28:45
Speaker
you know, everything went sky high that that year, you know, and then all of a sudden I got on the national, you know, attention thing, you know, because of my play that year, right? So that's immediately what I was thinking about, you know, I had a bit of a, you know, you could call me to a little bit rougher childhood and upbringing and i had some really influential influential people in my life. My, who might call my mom was the girl named my aunt. She's massive. and But then when I got in the fire service, cause I was, you know, pretty wild, you know, coming out of high school and I got lucky getting the volunteer fire department. him And there was guys in the volunteer fire department that were
00:29:18
Speaker
key influencer, influential people in my life that really turned me in a great direction. And I think, i you know, I wish that was what happened more for more people that are struggling out there to have those key people and and also have the cut the ability to take and tell you what they say. Sometimes you you're not you don't know, that you know, it's easy to dismiss someone when they're giving you some, you know, some advice, you know, whatever. But if you can do that, man, it can just change your life right around. I know it did for me, like getting into the fire service was the the biggest blessing in my life, right? You know, yeah, I mean, we're not a lot of young kids nowadays aren't even having that opportunity, because we're not interacting, you know, there's not that interaction that was, you know, that the thing and, yeah and kids sports is so so different now than, you know, what it was for, you know, when when when we were growing up,
00:30:09
Speaker
you know, that you played sports and your parents wanted you to learn teamwork and, you know, how to persevere and stuff. Now it's like everybody wants their kid to be, yeah you know, the dude, you know, I keep saying that term, but yeah you know, they, they all think their kid's great and you know, and this and that I'm going to move them to Surrey or I'm going to move them to Langley. or yeah and And then it's wrong because I mean, once again, I mean, that's all we should be looking at, you know, with sports and, and, other things that from the childhood is like developing qualities that will get you through life because even though I was who I was, I still had to work for 25 years you know to get a pinch. you know like yeah you know like we're not We're not sitting around by the pool for you know after it's after I turned 30. It just doesn't happen. right and so
00:30:59
Speaker
um you know
00:31:02
Speaker
with yeah Our kids need to have experiences so that they can they can grow. and And that's one of the reasons, you know, people have asked if one of our two youngest boys went off to play college football and they're like, oh, aren't you going to send them to UBC so they're home? And I said, no, because I said, that's where they're going to learn, right? and you know They had differing levels of success in college now, but they came out you know as college graduates and they were they were men when they came out. right They had faced ah you know hard times and ups and downs and had to had teammates. and you know and i wasn't We weren't there to hold their hand. yeah you know talking on and and and so
00:31:42
Speaker
um And, and now they've, they've got their careers and are, you know, are doing well and stuff. And, and, and that's what sports is should be about. Right. And it doesn't have to be just sports, but it's, you know, Sports is, uh, it's my daughter's is, you know, like they both played, you know, you know, locally, kind of fairly high level of soccer and it was great for them. They did got like so many life lessons out of that. And one of the, you know, when we first started, you know, you the same thing as parents, you get that, Oh, you know, maybe they're going to go somewhere or be some, you know, And I remember one of the distinct moments that, that sort of like, and my girls did great. I was very proud of them. And, but this one gal I've been hearing about her name was Jordan Heidema, I believe her name. And she, she's, she's a um, everyone was talking about how incredible this player is. I didn't know who she was. She's the same age as my daughter. And we were doing, they were doing, they were doing a fitness, uh, testing where they kind of do like, you know, sprint test. And like this one is like faggots faster and faster. It's like 20 yards, 20 yards back, a little break and it gets quicker and quicker.
00:32:38
Speaker
And she was doing it with the older girl. And I didn't know who this girl was. And I see this, I see this, but I see her and I'm thinking, I wonder if that's the girl. Cause she just had an er ah aura of confidence and she's with the older kids and she gets going. And I. blows them all the way. Like all the parents stopped, all the coaches stopped to watch this. And she was 13 years old, I think roughly. And I was like, Oh, that's, that's an entirely different. Yeah. That's, that's a national team player potentially or whatever. And I think she went national team at 16 played. Yeah. I think she's still playing professionally, just an incredible, you know, my daughter was lucky to just play a little bit with her and it was impressive to watch. And that was an, that was an eye-opener. And I think, you know, when you have that eye-opening kind of like moment, you're like, okay, yeah, this is what,
00:33:22
Speaker
This is what, you know, the difference between like kind of maybe where your kid is and where like the elite professional or, you know, the child might eat. Yeah. And sometimes it's a blessing, I think, for individuals that they're not good enough, you know, because then there's not those expectations, right? And so, you know, I'm glad in some ways that my sons didn't reach a pro level because Man, like, one's a police officer here in Surrey, one's a firefighter, you know, like, they're they're they're in their 20s and their careers are set up, you know, and so, you know, it's like, man, you know, if they had done what I, you know, I was fortunate, I was 30 when I got on the fire department. At that time, i was i was I was a bit old, you know, like, yeah and... You know, they didn't have any serious injury, you know, like, like, yeah you know, and so in some ways I'm thankful that they got the experiences they did, but then it was done. You know, let's move on. yeah You know, they, they, they had new goals to go after, you know, uh, those kind of things. Moving into their careers. And yeah that's an interesting thing, like to say that, uh, emergency services in your, is it in your family's an understatement right now that you got yourself, you know, career professional firefighter. And then each of your sons, like it, one's in fire, one's in police, one's in ambulance. Yeah. That's incredible. Yeah. Like, I think they.
00:34:38
Speaker
all you know grew up listening to me coming home and and just talking about my days. And and I think you know they they didn't they wanted that variety that their jobs bring and the and the four on four off. And now it's 24s for the yeah you know the fire guys. but But I think they were all looking for, you know, they saw the lifestyle, they saw the, you know, none of them are greedy, you know, I want, you know, to make it, you know, a million dollars or whatever. They know that the lifestyle that we lived, you know, with those salaries was was really good. and and And so, you know, and and we never pushed anybody.
00:35:15
Speaker
You know, anyway, I mean, it's funny with my son, Tom, because I brought him in for a day at hall three one day, and him and Matt both came in. They were both college kids at the time, and we had a great day. And I had this, like, beauty crew. Like, I mean, just, just, you know, Eric Wilson and, you know, like, it was just on and on. He just fun and optimistic and energetic and stuff. And so we had this great day and ate, you know, ate food and, you know, we're putting, you know, they went up in the ladder. You know, I shouldn't maybe say this because, you know, It probably wasn't legal, but they, you know, and at the end of the day, my youngest boy, Matt, he's like, dad, I want to quit school. I want to get it become, you know, he's 20 at the time. I want to quit school. I want to become a firefighter. And I'll finish playing football, get your degree.
00:36:02
Speaker
And Tom's like, I don't know, you know, and he's the one who ended up being a police officer. I was like, how could you not want to be a fireman? Let's make for some interesting conversation. while There's a lot of rivalry stuff. Well, and your other son is a high, high level ambulance. Yeah. He was a critical care or he is a critical care paramedic. He's he's working out of a salmon arm right now. um not as a critical care, but he's a specialist, like an ALS specialist position. Did he work on that helicopter? Yeah, he did that for a couple years. And he's got, you know, he's got a family, you know, my, um he's got two sons. um And they just wanted to change a lifestyle and get out of the lower mainland. So he took this position in in salmon arm and they
00:36:52
Speaker
you know, sold their little rancher here in the lower mainland and and bought a farm ah up in Enderby. you know so yeah So, I mean, I don't like it that they're that far away, but yeah but it's, nice lifestyle i dream you know, it's a dream move. for what is One of the things that like, you know, I'm getting closer to retirement here. and The biggest thing I always say I'm going to miss is the guys and the, you know, being around the kitchen table. I and imagine for your sons, you know, um you know being around emergency services people, there is that team aspect that they would have had and their theirre sports and whatnot. that's That's something that I'm going to greatly miss. you know ah Did you find that when you went into retirement, that was a bit of a tough transition? Yeah, there definitely was. i mean you know My timing was not great in some ways because COVID started basically when I when i left. it was it was It was just starting. and so
00:37:40
Speaker
Um, you know, that stopped travel plans that we had for us and things like that. So we didn't do that first year and a half, I guess, you know, was, was pretty quiet. You know, my wife, you know, my, my wife retired, not much after me and that. So we were doing a lot together, but, um, you know, it was, uh, it was a slow transition into retirement at that point, but you know, we, you know, I, I still have contact guys come play some golf sometimes with, with the guys, you know, and that. But, you know, you do need to also broaden your horizons when you retire. Right. And so you can't you can't stay in the past. um And so but yeah, that definite, you know, I've I keep saying that, you know, I miss I miss I miss some of those guys. I miss I i miss the meals. I miss that. You know, yeah I don't miss any calls. I mean, the other than reminisce about a big fire or something like that. Oh, man, that was really cool. yeah i That was exciting. Yeah. Yeah. we yeah a Good job and yeah um helped a bunch of people at the um
00:38:39
Speaker
The one thing that I find with the fire service is that, you know, it's an art of fire department is everybody brings some level of expertise of whatever they're interested in. So, you know, we say one of the benefits is like, say you want to be a mountain biker. There's guys that'll teach you how to be a mountain biker. You want to be a hunter, there's guys that'll teach out to you how to be a hunter and on and on. So it's, it's a pretty special place, place to be, but yeah. There's nothing like it, right? I mean, you know, I'm not necessarily going to say the police and, you know, ah paramedics, there they're they're a different breed, and they don't have quite that, you know, team where I mean, my my son's working out of a station and Sam and Armand's got seven or eight people on show. So they have some some of that, right? And then Tommy's got friends and s SPF and that and and and that. So I mean, you know, it's not like it's, you know, a solo, you know, a solo journey for any of those guys. Yeah, yeah, it's, it's, um it's been definitely an amazing time being and in the fire service. And one of the things that
00:39:36
Speaker
I wanted to touch on, but we'll
Differences in Football Leagues
00:39:39
Speaker
come back to it. But, um, when you're going through, you know, University of Montana, NFL and then CFL, did you find a stark difference between the games? Like, like, like, you know, from like, like, like university football to NFL to CFO. Cause it, I, I, you know, I obviously understand football, but I, I'm kind of lame and I'm not an expert by any means, but I've heard that there's quite a difference between NFL and CFL. Yeah. Cause what? the The basic thing is that they're they're two different games. I mean, you interesting you're not going to bring up an NFL team necessarily and just crush a CFL team if you're playing CFL rules on a CFL field because they're not they're different games. And and most of the your CFL guys are
00:40:27
Speaker
A lot of them are as good as the basic NFL guy. They're just a little bit, you know, they didn't fit the the the guidelines, right? They weren't big enough, maybe, you know, this or that or whatever. But and I'd seen NFL guys come up and just get caught after a day or two, really you know, that had played a little bit because they just weren't built for the CFL game. I see. And yes, they're the elite of the NFL, or it is the elite of the NFL. I mean, they'd be dominant anywhere, you know, and Jerry Rice running on a CFL field with all that room. You know, you're never going to, you know, you're never going to stop them, right? And they couldn't stop them in the NFL, but
00:41:03
Speaker
Um, you know, the, the NFL is a power game in a vacuum, you know, like where you're, everybody's just grinding and smashing and, you know, like, like, you know, and you're just wearing people down, right right? Not, not a lot of blowouts in the NFL, right? You're just, <unk>re you're just trying to, you know, win the small battles and beat and beat and beat where CFL, you're just throwing all over the place. And that's where it got that way. A guy like, you know, Doug Flutie or whatever, you know, great talent, right? ah Matt Dunnegan, you know, those guys could play anywhere, but they didn't fit the NFL because there was 5'10", or whatever. Right, as a quarterback. yeah Yeah, so you're sitting in a tight NFL pocket with a bunch of 6'7", 8'6", 8' linemen. It's pretty hard to see on a tight field, whereas now like Doug would set up at you know, seven yards, take the shot and snap, and then he dropped back another, street like he'd be 10 yards behind the, but then he could see everything. And that would never go in the NFL, right? So so he he dropped back, throw threw it all over the place, you know, and- Is it fair to say that CFL is kind of a little faster game? I don't know, i like the individuals aren't faster, but the game itself is is a lot more um
00:42:19
Speaker
Uh, to the perimeter, right? Like you can get the ball out, you you know, you allow people to get out. Whereas in the NFL, you you throw, throw a swing pass or whatever. I mean, guys are closing all the time. And so you're, you're only getting some gains or whatever, right? interesting yeah Yeah. So, I mean, you know, obviously the NFL is the better game. It's the most dominant players, you know, those things, but Um, a lot of those NFL guys would struggle in the CFL. Interesting. yeah Yeah. So the, so, you know, I've done a little bit of jujitsu and I've, I've, uh, a little bit. gone read yeah You keep doing this every issue, man. So yeah the, uh, I've been lucky to grapple with a wide array of people and I've had, you know, I usually, when I start off around, if I haven't met someone, I'm like, Oh yeah. Have you ever grappled before? You know,
00:43:07
Speaker
Boy, I know I did a bit of high school wrestling. Usually I always find people that say I did a little bit. It's usually like, you know, five to 10 years, you know, or whatever. But, and and so I've had it where, you know, I noticed straight away if I had a wrestler ah and, you know, the one of the biggest things is hard to get them on their back. You know, you yeah't like it's hard to, hard to flip. I rolled with some football guys, a couple of big football guys. I rolled with one guy. He was a defensive, um I think he played professionally 12 years in the CFL. wow And he was huge. he was but He was a big guy like you and like terrifying, to be honest with you. But I couldn't, what I found is I had to move myself around him. He he could move me wherever he wanted. And I realized it's like, oh, this guy's moved people professionally for a living. yeah And I wanted to ask you is is, as an offensive lineman, can you like summarize a couple of things like,
00:43:58
Speaker
like people will look at it like the collisions and that, but there's more to it than that. To me, it's like balance, you know, moving your foot position, I would think. And then the other side of it I want to ask you about is like the injuries, like, because ah to me, one of the biggest things would be fingers, because you're you're kind of coming fingers up, don't you? Like, is it, you can't, ah is it? Well, to go back to what ah my job as an offensive lineman and the best description I had heard is that you are an energy to absorber. Interesting. Because you've got these elite defensive linemen across from you and their job is to get to the guy with the ball, right? Right. So your job is to be able to stay in front of them and absorb all their energy, right? Because if this guy is so good that you can't get him, can't make contact with him, then you're in trouble because yeah he's around you, he's down the side, he's done an arm over, he's done, you know. And so, you know, you're fine with him pushing you back. Like, you don't have to blow people up every play, right? Like, you're not, you know, like, like at the lower levels, like when I was in high school, and then eventually in college, I mean, I'm, my job was to just drive people into the ground and make their lives a living hell. But when you get to those higher levels, that ain't happening. Yeah, they're all big. They're all strong, right? So you, the really good ones are, you know, getting in the way of people all the time. And it's like, okay, I know what this play is. I know where the ball is probably going to go. I know what this guy wants to do. So now I've just got to be able to move and stay in front of him. And that's and that's why the size and the size has gotten continually bigger.
00:45:33
Speaker
And even when you, you'll see how sloppy some of these NFL guys look, you know, where they've got big guts on them, but that's because they can absorb, they can absorb that they can absorb that energy. right And then so, and then you just wear them down because, you know, you go 70, 80 plays a game, you know, that's, that's exhausting for, for a defensive player, yeah you know, and. You know, you just, um, you know, so that's kind of the name of the game as an offensive lineman, right? And then so, and you know, you're playing games, like if you're passing the ball all the time, you've got to, you have to, you have to play games with the your your opponent, the guy you're you're facing every day, because he's got his moves and counter moves. And then I've got to have some counters to his counters, you know, a little bit of a mind game, right? Was there ever times, I imagine this didn't happen so much in the professional, but was there ever times where like someone came out, they just surprised you with raw power or, or like, or, or was it so...
Endurance and Injuries in Football
00:46:28
Speaker
No, film study is so intensive in in the in football. yeah And it doesn't, you know, we, we'd started it in high school, even in the early eighties. Right. And so we were, interesting we were filming every other team that we would play. Right. And so and in college it went to a new level, whether we have technicians who are breaking down, uh, play by play, and then they would send you a package of plays. And, you know, and that was part of your, your job, you know, during the week before the game was to study your quality and everything. thing And then the pros, you know, took it to a whole new level.
00:46:59
Speaker
And then the pros, especially the CFL, you're seeing the same guys three, four times a year. yeah So then, you know, you start to develop, you know, I know what he he does here, he does there. and literally you Not that it always helps because, you know, there's so many moves that he can do, right? So I would... ah you you know i would know like okay which hand i'm gonna punch with you know or or yeah i'm gonna take a step there i'm gonna do a short set on him or drop back a little bit and let him come into me you know so it's always an an evolving.
00:47:31
Speaker
you know, game each time. And, and then there's just some guys that you just, you know, it was really hard to do anything against. yeah just I would imagine that, that gentleman you talked about before with the incredible, like the Hall of Famer, yeah somebody like that. must just be an happy Yeah. Like he would have just been dominating even NFL guys at that level. Right. And just, you know, and just and and yeah and And as part of your question with the injuries, but that's what equals success is your ability to play through pain.
00:48:09
Speaker
to a point where, you know, you can't play because of, you know, like something's torn or something. But I mean, I, I missed one game in 12 years of football, like from high school to college pros. That's impressive. And that was with a second degree medial collateral tear. And so I missed a week. Wow. like thanks That's incredible. We put the brace on it and shot it up, right? Yeah, right. So that ligament was a mess, but i you know I still had half a season to play. And if I wasn't, I could lose my spot, right? Right. Yeah, the pressure. And of course, you know you got sprained ankles, you got broken fingers, and sprained thumbs, and you got you know ah
00:48:51
Speaker
like concussion or this or that. you know you know you're Your ability to get out of bed every morning and go to practice and you know and and coaches hate it when you don't practice. right right yeah and so you know If you're a borderline player, like I always seem to be all the time and in the pros, you didn't take a day off because the next guy who moves in and practice could be you know like be your end. And so, and so but I never had an ACL or I never had a you know a broken foot or you know all those kinds of things. I mean, I had lots of sprains and strains and stuff, but I was pretty pretty fortunate.
00:49:32
Speaker
You know, I was laughing with my boys because I, I, I had some off season issues, but a lot of times that was muscle imbalances, you know, and I would get so strong in the squat that I would start having hamstring issues. Interesting guy. I was just, my quads were mass. Quads were growing. But my, you know, I had trained my hamstring and so I'd have a pull in the winter workouts and I'd have to, you know, do those kind of things.
00:49:57
Speaker
You know, it's that pain threshold because you're always in pain. Yeah. yeah know I remember, I think I was talking to you. I've had a little bit of small finger injuries, but that seemed like one of the big ones to me that you, as an offensive lineman, you're like, because you're coming in and trying to slow them down, your hands are coming up. And it was just almost like when a basketball hits a tip to your fingers. Oh, it's constantly. I've had one one thumb rebuilt and the other one has to be done too. she's yeah you know so Because the the the fingers aren't bad. I mean, I've had them dislocated and stuff, but the thumbs, like the the joints are gone. And so they you know it's much better now that they rebuilt this one. sure so yeah you know um there And there is a price to pay you know for for those higher level sports, right? And and yeah and I don't know what the long term... I can only think of one time that I had a
00:50:48
Speaker
you know that I realized I had a concussion. you know I'm sure I've told you that story, but i was in it was in college and we're in the middle of a game and and our quarterback throws an interception downfield. It was 20 yards downfield and this big middle linebacker picks the ball off and he starts running. and I'm near there and I'm trying to trying to get to him. and And, you know, he's probably 240, 245 or whatever, you know, I'm my size and and and we're coming together. We're we're heading together, you know, and all of a sudden he's like, I'm going to run this some bitch over. You know, yeah he comes straight at me and I come straight at him and we smash into each other. And ah and on on contact, I'm out. Wow. But the next thing I do is I wake up on the bench and
00:51:41
Speaker
there's nobody around me. like Like, like, I'm like, there's no trainers. There's no, there's no, there's no team doctors or whatever. And I'm like, somebody must've carried me off. Oh, nobody's paying attention to me. I'll get, so I go back into the game and stuff like that. Um, the next series after, after our defense got it back and That night I started having these massive, massive headaches and spinning and stuff. And so I went to the hospital and they hospitalized me for a night, you know, and then just let me go. But um we went to watch film the next day, I think it was, or two days later. And I'm waiting for this play and and it shows me smashing into the sky and we're both on the ground. And then all of a sudden I jump up.
00:52:24
Speaker
And I run off the field and then the sideline shot of, you know, shows me kind of sitting there and all of a sudden sees my head bobble. So I blacked out, you know, but I'd still run off the field. It's incredible. Like I always say it's incredible what the human body can do. Like when you see these USC fighters, you know, you know, they get knocked down like a massive kicker and and yet they're still fighting, but there's, they're not, you know, it's just instinctual or whatever. And they and then, you know, 20 seconds later comes, but they come back, you know, and they're able to carry on. It's just, it's absolutely um amazing what the human body can endure. And I think like, you know, when you look at any professional sport, you know, hockey or you really see like,
00:53:07
Speaker
like these guys taking it to the max and it's impressive, right? Yeah, and you do pay a price.
Education and Family Values
00:53:14
Speaker
I feel fortunate that I'm not as... I wake up in pain every day, but I'm going to be 60. I think everybody's in pain at this point. It just takes me a little longer to get going in the morning than I used to. Get the creeks out when you wake up in the morning. Yeah, so I mean, it's definitely part of it. it's and It's an impressive story. I love talking to you about your football. And when you were in Montana, and we'll talk about this hopefully a little bit, because I know you enjoy history, right? you Did you take a you got a degree in American history? there is You know what I never like, like, you know, a big mistake I had was I didn't finish everything. You know, I like I had to do my teaching
00:53:58
Speaker
ah year or whatever, you know, whatever they call it up here. Yeah. And i I never got to it. I said, Oh, I'll come back to it. Right. And so, so it was unfinished because I was like, you know, ah my intentions was to go back, but then football, and we, my wife and we had babies and yeah it on so far no excuses, but um that that drove me with my sons was that they had to graduate, you know, like with with their stuff. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, makes sense. Yeah, it's I love the
Travel Experiences and Reflections
00:54:30
Speaker
idea. The reason I asked i love the idea history and and I know that we've had some awesome discussions about you've done a lot of reading over the course of your life and and and and you're doing a lot of traveling now too. And
00:54:42
Speaker
you know, you must see that when you're out like in the countries you've been in. You see some of the like the historical places and and whatnot. is there Is there anything that sort of stands out? You know what? Every trip overseas I get excited, you know, because me we're such a young, we're just babies here in Canada, right? i mean I mean, as far as, you know, white people, you know, coming to Canada, were were yeah we're we're we're just babies, but yeah I mean, we're standing, um where was it, that really hit home one of the first trips we did, and we're in southern Italy, and we're in Lecce, I think it was. And there was this excavation going on, and they were been they'd been digging out this this ground for a new bank in the in the city. And you know there's there's high rises around and everything else like that. And I guess what happened was that all of a sudden one day,
00:55:35
Speaker
you know, the excavator hit something. So then they start moving around. And then they kept going and stuff. And and when we got there, they had, you know, exposed a half of a, uh, of a stadium. Oh, wow. And it was all marble and, you know, they weren't, they had gladiator fights going there. It was like 15,000 seat capacity or something like that. oh wow And nobody was excited about it. I mean, everywhere they turn, there's something 2000 years old and it just makes the contractors, you know, like angry. now there Yeah, we got to stop construction here. and but But just, yeah, like everywhere we go. And, you know, we we were in Panama this winter, you know, and in January. And, you know, we went to this one spot outside of Panama City. And, you know, the oldest church, there was a second oldest or the oldest church in the Americas, Catholic Church in the Americas.
00:56:33
Speaker
1512 or something, 1520. You know, they got just like like just the just the madness of of ah of how old everything is, right? And, and you know, Italy italy was, marvel everywhere you turn there was, you know, the the stuff that's only a thousand years old is abandoned, you know? like i mean you know That's what I'm going to ask you. Cause I think of, when I think of football, I've only been to one NFL game. I want to, obviously wanted to love to go to more, but I went to the Seahawks game and, um, I remember, I remember walking in the stadium and it's a loud stadium, like the fans are loud and they're kind of known for that. And, uh, I just thought, man, this might've been what it was like walking into the Coliseum. Well, here, here's, here's a great story. Cause we, one of the things we did was we went to the Coliseum in Rome.
00:57:19
Speaker
We'd done the Vatican and Trevi Fountain and all the stuff. But the the big one for me was going to be the Colosseum. And we paid extra for the gladiator experience. oh man And so you got to walk out onto the the fighting it's the fighting ground. so awesome yeah and It's just like a new look up. And it's just like, oh my god, this is no different than playing in San Francisco or whatever. yeah can yeah and And all the lower levels are marble, and they all had the family names inscribed in the seats. And, you know, they had all the poor people sections that were more vertical and and yeah steeper, but they had running water, bathrooms, you know, as a Coliseum. Incredible. And, you know, just the vast, you know, so and and and I think they said it was almost 60,000 capacity or something like that. and And what they've done is that half the floor is there, you know, where they where they did their fighting. And then the other half is exposed.
00:58:13
Speaker
where all the support staff was down, like where all the animals were kept. Like like you remember in the movie Gladiator when the lot when the ti tigers come out? Yeah, that's that's real. Like that they had them all in animal cages underneath these floors and stuff and this water and the all this stuff. And it's just like, Oh my lord. This is so incredible. yeah like when you you know I think sometimes because we don't have video of that, you know you don't have photos. It's hard to imagine. and You sometimes think, oh, they're like they didn't do things they didn't do things very well. But when you look at that, that's incredible. They probably weren't that different from us. Well, Roman stuff, like to be around you know none of our stuff here is going to be around in 2000 years. right I mean, there's nothing that's going to keep us.
00:58:58
Speaker
The Romans were unbelievable. I mean, it was just, you know, everywhere you turn. you know and and And that's what I've really become passionate about is these experiences, you know, around the world, because every country, yeah you know, we've got them here in Canada, but that's, I'm kind of leaving, like, like I've done a ton of BC. My parents, when I was a kid, I mean, we, we traveled all over the place and into Bela Kula and Fort Nelson and, you know, ah Dawson Creek, you know, all this stuff. So I've seen a lot of BC and, but, but for right now and what, you know, you call your go-go years, you know, I want to see the world, right? And I want,
00:59:36
Speaker
I want experiences and everything. And and when I'm in my 70s and I don't feel like being on a plane for 11 hours or whatever, then I'll buy a camper van and we'll we we'll sure we'll do Canada, right? But I just, um you know, Chris, when when he was on your earlier podcast, chris work there yeah and and I feel exactly the same as he does. is ah Everywhere you go in the world, 99% of the people are great, you know, the people just live in their lives. yeah They're good people, right? That's what struck me about that podcast is just like how amazing, you know, he's going to these places like the, you know, the Namibian desert or the and and the people are awesome. yeah And and you you get this impression that, oh, it's going to be like,
01:00:19
Speaker
Obviously, you have to be aware, you have to do your due diligence wherever you are. I mean, even in Vancouver, you have to be careful where you are. But it it was really refreshing to hear him talk about how incredible the people were in all the yeah incredible countries he's been at. Yeah. And then in some countries, you know the people might be not quite as friendly because they're tired of tourists or whatever, but still, it's just like... like i't bad anybody be rude to us. I mean, I love Americans. i love you know like you know and We just got back from you know spending almost six weeks in the States and and and enjoyed every day, right? yeah
01:00:54
Speaker
But, you know, whether we were in Panama or we were in Italy or Spain or Portugal, you know, like, you know, like it's just a positive experience. yeah and And, you know, maybe we're going to have a negative thing sometime or whatever. But, um you know, it's been it's been ah like ah an awakening because that's so awesome we'll talk to friends of ours who are scared. You know, they won't even go to the States. It's very common. You know, and and I'm like, well, yeah, but you're watching Fox too much. Yeah, we see an end about how, you know, there's a civil war gonna happen, you know, like, it's we were in Austin, Texas in September, and then we went down to Galveston. And that area, that's kind of like asking a little bit about the American history, because there's so much down there. And we went to San Antonio, we've got to go to Alamo, which is weird, because the Alamo is right, I thought it's going to be in the
01:01:42
Speaker
You know, looking in the desert, but it was right in the heart of the city of San Antonio. or whatever Yeah. yeah like great and and And it's cool. They've got a great display. I was enthralled with like reading about the history of it. and yeah But it was awesome. yeah Great time in Texas. It was incredible. Americans do their national parks and monuments so well. Amazing. I don't know if you've been to Custer's battlefield no in Billings. It's an hour outside of Billings, Montana. And it's a great site. like you know they've they've become they've They've changed it over the years from like, oh, it was an awful massacre to now, you know they have a balanced um ah balance display there. okay you know But they had gone in and x-rayed all the battlegrounds and found the skeletons that were ah that were buried. They were able to place headstones of
01:02:33
Speaker
all the U.S. soldiers who died and where they were on the hillside. So you you start at the at the bottom and you see how the the whole battle evolved. And then right to where the last stand was where Custer and some of his men. but you know However many hundreds of guys they lost or whatever, but it's really surreal. like i mean I haven't seen anything like it. yeah but sounds but but you know that we We love the national parks in the States. i mean we we you know whether like This last trip we had gone through Montana, Wyoming, ah South Dakota's mind-blowing. They've got like the Black Hills and Badlands and the Mount Rushmore and you know, all that stuff. And then we went down to Utah and they've got their Mighty Five, you know, ah Zion. yeah you Yeah, you did Zion. Zion and Arches and Bryce Canyon and so like, I mean, they they're all just amazing because you can drive right up to them, right? And then then you you you get out and and experience it, right? Yeah. So, I mean, I know we have all those things in BC, but they're really hard to
01:03:36
Speaker
Unless you're helicoptering into some of these areas. Sometimes too, like having done a bit of hiking and whatnot, it's beautiful. British Columbia is incredible, but sometimes with the dense forest, you don't get that. I would imagine Montana, or you can see for Grand Canyon. Utah is probably my favorite state. There is nothing like Utah. Really? These parks, they're all different and they're You know, and we do, and we, and, you know, we just got to experience the Grand Canyon, which is another just mind blowing, like nothing like it. Right. I haven't been to Grand Canyon, but we, we, when we went to Vegas, we actually went out into the desert and did some of the hiking in the desert. That's incredible. Nothing like the Grand Canyon, but it's like a taste of what it might be like. So I can just, I can just imagine the, um, do you have some like places that like a bucket list still that you want to go to? Yeah. Yeah. We're, um, uh,
01:04:32
Speaker
You know, this, this is a goal one because I mean, we got to train even harder or now. Like we've, been we've trained for six months to do the, the Grand Canyon hike that we just did. But for my 60th, I'm hoping to do the Tour de Mont Blanc, which is in France, and it covers three countries, France, Italy, and Switzerland, and you do 170 kilometer mountain track. all lot and it's all And they've got all these, you know, um, they call refugios and little hotels and stuff. And so you're, you know, you're hiking five to seven hours a day through these mountain, rain you know, so, oh, wow. So that's, that's a bucket list. but But, but yeah, the other bucket list stuff though, I mean, we, an African safari, you know, that, that, that's um incredible. yeah We saw ah Bob and Curry and his wife, uh, the pictures from, from theirs, they just got back and just, just, I mean, there's so much the world. I mean, we, yeah you know, we're going to be in England and then
01:05:30
Speaker
going over to Austria and Slovenia and that in this summer, um which which we're really looking forward to because there's a little some tours like a walking tour we're doing and then a a biking tour.
Retirement Plans and New Beginnings
01:05:42
Speaker
What are some of the other bucket list stuff? I mean I I want to go to Iceland. Oh, yeah. I mean, that that's something I i want to go see the volcano. Incredible landscape. Yeah, I mean, not necessarily turned on by big cities anymore. um You know, I've done Rome and I've done, you know, some of those so and at Venice and ah Florence and some of those things and in the Spanish cities Lisbon. But, you know, right now it's just about like the active
01:06:16
Speaker
expedition, active adventures, you know, where we're, we're hiking and that. So yeah, I like the idea of both. One thing I was sort of thinking is when we talked about, you know, going into retirement, it seems like you've sort of found that next sort of chapter. And and I, like, I'm about a, I think about a year and a half away from retirement. And that's kind of what I'm starting to plan. And, you know, uh, again, you know, Jacqueline has this company, uh, she's on front. We were watching a leadership, um, uh, seminar and it actually happened to be about getting ready for retirement and it was geared towards emergency services. And I think that it's something that ah isn't often talked about enough is like, and and what they were saying, it was actually Navy SEALs running this this seminar but day or webinar. They said, it's a good idea about a year and a half out, start thinking about what your bucket list ideas were. Would you recommend that for guys? You know, i the fire service is awful. if Nobody talks about, you know,
01:07:12
Speaker
things like that and yeah well I'll play golf or do this and whatever, but you can't do that. And I heard this shocking stat. And there's a problem with stats now is that, you know, I can't verify this right or wrong. But the latest stuff out of the US s was that retirees only spend like 15% of their the retirement savings before they're you know not doing anything or whatever because they're there um frightened you know of the stock market collapsing or this is going to happen or that's going to happen. And and and and that's one of the things that's a beauty for us in emergency services because you've got your pensions. And you know if you do things the right way,
01:07:57
Speaker
yeah You're never going to run out of money. yeah yeah and so you know I think that you have to go into a mindset of attacking retirement and and whether that's a new hobby, a new career, a new or travel. Mine is travel, and but and i'm just I'm doing everything based around that. what's I'm either seeing my kids or we're traveling. yeah That's awesome. yeah you know and i don't have A lot of time for anything else right now. You worked your whole life. So you want to enjoy that next chapter. And one of the Navy SEALs were saying in their thing is, because they they go through that too. you They come out of an intense career. and and And one thing they were saying is maybe try to also find it doesn't have to be this you know the same thing you were doing with something similar. where you find a group of people that are kind of like minded, maybe whatever you might be into to be mountain biking or whatever, just to have that outlet. And rather than like, you know, maybe, you know, becoming, you know, ah in your house by yourself and not having a network of people around you. But did did you find like that something that like you know Well, I realize now that you know our lives are broken up into chapters. rain know And so if you're living in the past and not making a new chapter, then than you're in a dead zone. That makes sense. It's not a comfort zone. It's a dead zone, right? That's exactly what the seals are saying. And so when we got to that retirement point, yeah and once COVID cleared up and stuff, we said, man, you know I had my
01:09:30
Speaker
You know, youth is one chapter. And then I had my football career was another chapter. And then the firefighting and raising a family was another chapter. And so we we're and now at this new chapter. and I want something unique. you know I want i want you know want something that I'm just going to smile about yeah you know when I can't yeah do those things anymore. Because I was in this... I won't call it a rut because I really enjoyed it, but I loved my acreage. I loved raising animals and having a garden and being with my kids and all this stuff and maintaining a pool, you know like all this stuff. and then But when everybody was gone and and we're sitting there going like,
01:10:11
Speaker
ah youtube why what What tomatoes I'm going to grow this year isn't really what yeah I'm not excited about. And that's when we made a big change and sold and, you know, downsized and everything's been geared toward that. There's a great book. Is it Bill Perkins? I think it is a Die with Zero. And it's not just a financial book, but it would I mean, he is a financial guy, but his his his basic premise is that, you know, you need to get to the point of death where you got zero left, you know, like late like like I've done it all as much as I can do, yeah you know, and and and I'm not wasting my retirement because man, it's
01:10:54
Speaker
It's not like you've got another chapter necessarily after that. You're you're you're gone. you know Everybody says they're living longer and all this stuff, but i mean you know with our careers, our you know i mean there's there's no going to tease. When I was diagnosed with a heart arrhythmia six, seven years ago, I mean, and it's been fine, right? I'm on medication, I've never been hospitalized, you know, I was never, ended up never being, like I forgot it, but as long as I'm on medication, it doesn't affect me. But that just opened my eyes to like, man, I'm a diagnosis away or I'm this or that or, you know, and it'll be gone and then what have I got to talk about in this chapter of my life?
01:11:38
Speaker
um Can't just live off, you know, and say, oh, I'm just going to hang out with the guys I worked with, you know, for the rest of my life or whatever. Right. So I, uh, when I got into fire service, um, you know, obviously life changing for me. Uh, I didn't have really much of anything and ever thankful to, you know, the city of Delta and local 70, 63, which is our local and. and and And actually the other fire departments too, because I have friends in other fire departments that helped me and guided me along the way. ah But I definitely wanted to make sure that I did things like in in life and and all the way through. I don't want to get to like sort of my deathbed and look back and go, man, I wish I'd done a little bit more. I wish I'd played guitar. I wish I had gone mountain biking, you know, I kind of, and obviously within reason, we all, you know, you don't have.
01:12:20
Speaker
ton of money to do everything. But you have to you have to manage that a little bit. And and um so that I think that that's kind of why I find that I transitioned to retirement. and Important discussion is because you want to maximize and have fun and like life's precious. yeah and you know, you're in these different chapters again, I mean, with five kids and, you know, my my daughters and and that, I mean, we it was all in, right? You know, like like, we didn't do, we didn't travel at all hardly, you know, we didn't yeah <unk>t have, we had lots of experiences, but it was the different kinds of experiences, right? And so,
01:12:57
Speaker
I remember you you'd come into work in a tiny little toilet at Tercel and just like six foot eight getting out of this little like but you were you know you were operating on a budget right and yeah you know and it was you know you you had those car and I'm the same way you know I'd drive like a little Honda Fit or whatever yeah it' but I'm not six eight you know it's yeah not quite as intimidating. Well as I'm really proud of my sons because they all you know are doing really well financially well my my son who's a cop who owns owns a house and and that and he drove a Corolla until it was 370,000 kilometers, right? It was an 03. He wasn't, you know, financially, they they're they're responsible. But, but um you know it's it's to go back to that book, it's not about just
01:13:44
Speaker
not having any money at the end, but it's also about just no no regrets, right? so and And just saying like, man, you're just, you're hammering at it and you're you know um just doing what you can do, right? and so and what And then you have to decide how you're going to get there. and if Um, my wife and I realized that, you know, we were going to be comfortable financially, uh, with maybe a trip a year or something like that. But we had to make some sacrifices to get to where we wanted to go. And so then we got rid of our, our place and that, that stuff for people. I know there's people who will never, never give up their family home or whatever. Yeah. but Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's memories there. Yeah. But we, we said, well, it's, you know, time to make new memories, bond right? and And that, that freed up.
01:14:27
Speaker
you know, the finances to have have the extras, right? and And I try and tell that to a lot of guys at work that are, you know, saying, Oh, I got to work way longer than they do and things like that, that, you know, the money's there if you're, if you've done things the right way and, and, you know, the younger generation might be a different story, but I mean, for our generation, if you've owned a home and you've paid your bills and, you know, yeah done what you've done, then you got that we have that we have this wealth available to us that, iss only It's only going to go to your kids if you keep your house for the rest of your life. yes you find too I know we chatted a little bit about this. Something I think is important to consider in retirement is like, yeah you're like sort of almost like your first 10 years, your next 10 years and your last 10 years and like planning that out. Like, cause you're like, you you might not be, I don't know, climbing Kilimanjaro when you're like 85, you know? And is that something that you're kind of strategically looking at? or
01:15:19
Speaker
like and I used the term the go-go years before. and so weve we This isn't something we made up, but we we read you have your go-go years, your slow-go years, and then your no-go years. You don't see many people over 75 doing much. There are exceptional people, but I i can't count i you know i'm I can't count myself as like, oh, when I'm 80, I'm going to be yeah you know doing this or whatever. I don't know what my body's going to tell me. You might not be hiking through the Grand Canyon. Well, no, exactly. And so so everything I'm doing right now is to push ourselves and our our experience and our senses and our our our physical stuff. So everything now you know and is to
01:16:05
Speaker
see stuff that we would never have seen you know if we if we didn't do it. I'm not saying we're not going to take comfort
Grand Canyon Adventure
01:16:10
Speaker
stuff too. like This Grand Canyon trip, we killed ourselves for three days and then we went to a resort for three days. you know out pool we got to have yeah a little bit of both right yeah ah maybe yeah you know so The challenges of of some of these things also just, then once again, it makes you uncomfortable. But then the reward that afterwards is like, oh my god. I have to tell you the story that about our Grand Canyon trip. And weird we taken this trail down this what's called the South Kaibab Trail. And there's two trails that come off the south rim that go all the way to the bottom. And so the South Kaibab Trail and then the Bright Angel Trail. And the Bright Angel Trail is
01:16:54
Speaker
um You know, it's a a little bit longer trail, but there's water every mile and a half. They have water piped up, cupped up the canyon and that. So it's all, you know, it's pretty safe other than you've got to climb, you know, as much as you do. The South Kaibab Trail has the mind blowing. views, right? Like, like, like where you're sitting out over, ah you know, 3000, 4000 foot, you know, caverns, or you're sitting above the, you know, the the Colorado River and and that. and And so we said, Okay, we're gonna, we're gonna go down the South Kai Bob and
01:17:28
Speaker
And just to to back it up a bit, the reason we were doing it in late June was because you have to enter lotteries now to go into the Grand Canyon. oh yeah they ado i didn't know that you know And so if you want to camp down in the bottom, you have to enter a lottery interesting to to get down there. And so ours came up, and but it was for June, you know and we knew it was going to be hot. But you know so we trained our butts off. and now but you know I'll continue the story, but we yeah we go down the South Kai Bob and it is amazing. And we're three quarters of the way down, but then the heat just crushes us. It was 108, 109 degrees on the trail and there's no water there's no water on the trail. So you're you're packing three, four liters of water with you.
01:18:15
Speaker
And we're getting low at this point. And you can get, you can get through that pretty fast. Yeah. And we're getting low at this point. And we, and we had dialed in our electrolytes and we've got tablets, electrolyte tablets were taken my regular, but you know, so all that stuff to it, but we are getting absolutely crushed and every little bit of shade and there's hardly, there's no tree, obviously there's no trees and stuff, but every once in a while you'll have a little shady spot. And so, and we're just like struggling. I'm going to go, Oh my God. You know, I've got my in reach, you know, and I'm like, shit, am I going to have to push the button? Cause that's not what I want to do. Right. I mean, my pride and kudos to Dana. She, she, she got through it too. And we get to the bottom and you cross this black bridge it's called. And it's one of the two bridges in, in, in the bottom of the grand canyon.
01:19:03
Speaker
and the Colorado River's flowing there, right? And so we just basically stagger off this bridge and we're out of water. We'd been out of water probably for 40 minutes or something like that, which is our own fault, right? I mean, we should have carried another leader at least each. and we come off and we get down the trail and we're trying to find a ah trail down to the river, right? And so we just basically are just like these, you know, something from an old Western movie, you know, where you finally find water, right? And so yeah we grab our water filters and we throw off our packs and we just both dive into the Colorado River. But what they don't tell you about the Colorado is that when it comes out of, I think it's Lake Mead that it it comes out of, but when the water comes out of
01:19:48
Speaker
like me, that's at like 700 feet deep or something like that. So that water's ice cold. So we go from where we're red flash. We're cooking hot to ice cold. And I dive in. And Dan is smarter. She just kind of gets into the showers. I'm just like fully immersed. and I stopped breathing. I mean, the cold has sucked it out of you, but the sensory around my skin, I've never felt anything And like that. And I don't know if that's what, you know, taking heroin or fentanyl or, you know, I don't know. Like it was like my electrons were just like. You know, mind blowing, right? But people drown in that river every year because of that cold and the current, you know, because it takes your breath away, right? So unfortunately, we were in this little eddy and stuff, and so I was able to stand up, you know, all this stuff, but I never experienced, you know, so that, that kind of stuff, I challenged myself to coming down. Like it was way harder than I thought because of the heat.
01:20:48
Speaker
And, you know, we were way smarter the rest of the trip. We got meals and, you know, we had meals and, you know, took, you know, a day down there. And then we, we hiked back out, but be because we took the other trail, we had water every mile and a half. So, you know, we, we, we were able to make it up, you know, I won't say without many problems, but it it was, it was hard, but we, you know, we made it out. But, yeah you know, it's, it's those kinds of things where, you I mean, you know A lady came down later that afternoon, she had to get medevaced out because the heat got her so bad. And two days after us, a guy in the 60s died on the trail from heat exhaustion. I'm not trying to make it sound heroic, but it's like and it happens all the time. sure no yeah
01:21:31
Speaker
but we We were so happy once it was done. We were so much pain and so many, you know, everything else and cramping and doing all this stuff. But it was just like, we were just like high five in each other.
Simple Joys and Historical Contexts
01:21:41
Speaker
And it's going through those adverse times, you know, you know, in an adventure or a hike trip or it just, it really makes you appreciate everything in life that much more. Like, you know, I've been on some very easy, you know, sort of like hunting trips and that, and compared to like what some guys do, right? Some guys are like traveling for two days, big jet boats are incredible.
01:22:02
Speaker
But you don't have running water, you don't have lights, which is when I get home, every time I get home, I'm like, man, get in my bed. It's like, oh man, this bed's amazing. That is so true because we're laying in our tent in the bottom of the Grand Canyon and even the nighttime temperatures haven't dropped below 95, right? And so we are... Basically, because of the weight, we had gone ultra light. We just had those little accordion foam pads, and we had to shoot. And that's it. Very little comfort. And so we're laying in this filth and sweaty. We had gotten into the river and stuff, but we were all night long. We were just sweating and stuff. And so we were pretty feral for three days until we got to the very top. melt and, you know, we're sweaty and, you know, everything else. But it was like, man, that first shower was just like, oh my God. It feels so good. And having a light switch you can turn on or, or having running water at your disposal. Like, like the appreciation. And I think, I think that's one thing that travel allows you to, is the appreciation from what we have here. Absolutely. You know, the, um,
01:23:03
Speaker
We had this amazing experience in Panama, and we were staying in Panama City for a month, and there was a um ah thing you could you could you could buy, and you could go out to the San Blas Islands. I think Chris had had mentioned, ah had dropped the name, but it's off the coast of Portugal and the Carribeans. And what in Panama had turned ah these 900 little islands over to the local indigenous people and gave them autonomy and just said, okay, they're your islands, right you know no government oversight, whatever. So a lot of them have set up, you know, these
01:23:44
Speaker
um little tourist things you know and so you work your way there to the coast and they have a boat to pick you up and we get to this this island this little tiny Gilligan's island kind of thing and they've got a hut some huts over the water and It must be beautiful. It was so gorgeous, but it was so simple because you just ate a like ah fish that they had caught. that day They had a few beers and a few cans of Coke, but you know there's there's no power on the island. or whatever you know like and and um Sometimes that's simplicity. you know and Then you come from ah an all-inclusive, which is just like so excessive. You got everything, yeah. Everybody's complaining because the beer, the steak wasn't properly done or whatever. and Send this back. yeah you know But yeah, that that that flipping of like experiences and then you appreciate what you've got and and you know running water and you know everything else. I think more people in need or should have those experiences if they can, because it it really makes you appreciate what you have. When when you go from having you know a little bit of struggle, a little bit of adversity to
01:24:52
Speaker
Oh man, yeah, that's pretty awesome. When I get home, we've done a great job building our, you know we got we have our house, we have our, you know and even something like a fridge where you have you know cold food in there. It sometimes gets forgotten. We can underappreciate those things. Yeah. And and and i seen I was listening to a thing with a psychologist on our podcast and he was talking about how as humans, a lot of times you, when your problems get less, you just make more problems, right? Like like the smaller things become a problem, right? And so now you're yelling. Yeah. And then a lot of people will be yelling because they're, you know, they're cable TV, you know, the channel is not working properly or, you know, it's, yeah you know, and
01:25:32
Speaker
you know, 50 years ago, or, you know, in World War Two, you're, you're, you know, you're worrying about all these other things, or, you know, 100 years ago, you're worrying about, absolutely you know, yeah smallpox, or this, or that, you know, and so we've, societal wise, we've, we've become, you know, too spoiled in a lot of ways, right? i So I did this, I did this job, and um on the Atlantic Ocean, it was a sunken ship that I went and did some rescue stand by work for. And we had to meet every day on the dock And i don't know anyone and i'm probably the most under qualified guy there. And these guys are like, some of them are like deep sea divers. Like they're like, this is a holiday for these guys, right? For me, this is a huge adventure. yeah Scary. It's terrifying. We're going out in the, we're going out the ocean every day. And they're like, you know, we work on the, you know, you know, one degree, like just above zero in the Baltic ocean with huge waves, cutting ships apart. And it's just like,
01:26:26
Speaker
You know, so when I did, I did that for like 12 days and when I got home and I was going to work and you know, I love my job. It's yeah amazing. I was like, wow, this is so nice compared to to what I just went through where I'm stressing all day long and you know yeahre yourre you know, you're trying to like survive and like it was one of those places where There was no looking at your cell phone because you could die. yeah right you you You could get knocked off a ship by equipment. you know like and And we had this one moment where we were on this barge and this huge boat came in and the barge was tied up to the sunken ship. And this this boat this boat was coming in to deliver supplies. And I was talking to this really ancient sea sea mariner guy. who was like an old guy and he had great stories and i just like, just so enthralling and I see his eyes light up and I'm thinking like, if this guy's eyes are lighting up, like what, you know, what's going on here? I look at the boat and it's coming in pretty hot and and he's like, brace, like grab something and I'm like, okay. So I grab a railing and this boat hit this barge so hard and everybody like was like, you know, got kind of their feet taken out and then like they had these huge green ropes tied to the sunken ship.
01:27:43
Speaker
When everything kind of stretched out, the ropes went white, you could hear them. Like, like, these are like thick, like four to five inch thick rope. And you're just, you know, cringing, thinking you're going to get hit by, you know, whatever. And then it cursed it all balanced out. But like, all these guys are like seasoned vets. And I, is one thing I always like listen to, like, you know, when we go on calls or whatever. if someone's an expert in their field and they're nervous about something, like listen intently kind of thing, right? So, but coming home from that was, you know, I was very nice to get home. I thought that was great, great opportunity. It was definitely, you know, I felt like, actually you turned me onto this movie, you know Walter Mitty, The Secret Life, I love that show, right? And that's how I felt. I felt like Walter Mitty going on this little adventure or whatever, right? But I want to do everything he did except in the water with a great white. That's not what I wanted.
01:28:32
Speaker
it's it's i'm i' I'm so stoked to hear that you know you found like the the traveling and and and and the history. and what Is there any, like so far in all your travels, like is there any other things that really stand out like in your mind like historically or that you know that you that you that you really blew your mind? or um Yeah. I mean, they went, we go back to the Roman stuff because I mean, we were in Spain and Portugal and they've still got like aqueducts and you know things that are still standing. Did you go into Vatican or? Yeah, we went to the Vatican too, which is um so overwhelming. Yeah. That's what I've heard. Everyone, even like, like Joe Oregon, you know, this his play he he's been there. He's just, yeah and you you only, like, if you go for a day,
01:29:21
Speaker
you have time to see one of their um museums, and only and you have to rush through. really like the you know If you're gonna do the Sistine Chapel, and um like I think we did the... Oh, what did we do? man, the man, the one section we went through was all carpets, like, you know, like, like what yeah weaved out of gold and all this stuff. But I mean, this, it just, there's eight different sections to the Vatican. And, you know, there's a an Egyptian one, you know, like the the wealth that's there and the stuff that the church has taken. yeah and hard over yeah it's hard It's hard to, you know, even comprehend, right? Like, I,
01:30:07
Speaker
I came out of the Vatican and I didn't even know if I enjoyed it because it was so overwhelming. So wise, yeah. I've heard that from a number of people. it's It's just overwhelming. Yeah, because I mean, in in in Florence, like the museum's there, like the the statue of David is there that was done by Michelangelo. And so so you can go and sit and just kind of look and it's like, my, you know, mind blowing that some, somebody's hands yeah carved this giant, you know, 20 some foot perfect human being, like, you know, the striations and the tabs and like, you know, like there, yeah, there's some just, yeah, mind blowing stuff. Hey, and, um, I really want to go to, uh, Egypt. It was interesting talking to Chris Mark because he, you know, he has his cycling adventures and he cycled through Jordan. I think Israel, Jordan, Egypt.
01:30:56
Speaker
on one of his trips.
Future Travel Aspirations
01:30:58
Speaker
And yeah I'd love to go there one day. Yeah, that's that's on the list too, like for the pyramids and all that stuff. It's mind blowing that the pyramids are right in the city. Yeah, that's so close. Because had heard about ah like a Nile River cruise you could do and things like that where you you know go go all the way down and stuff. But I yeah i mean, that's a little hard right now. you know It's a pretty unstable area. Yeah, that's it. You got to again do your research. Yeah. but maybe be a week um I'd like to see Turkey. yeah her turkeys like Turkey is a cheap Greece, really. like you know basic Greece is really expansive, I've heard, and it's tons and tons of tourists, but ah it's people that we follow to spend a lot of time in Turkey, and you get the same stuff as as Greece, but at a fraction of the price is a lot quieter. and so so i think I think I'd like to do Turkey. i mean i know
01:31:52
Speaker
you know the um yeah i mean I mean, explore Slovenia a bit more. We're going to be riding riding through parts of it this summer, but you know they they have this Julian Alps and you know like yeah these crazy ah hikes all through there. and you know so A couple of the guys at work were saying Croatia is supposed to be incredible. It's supposed to be like me just ridiculous beaches. Every time I turn the computer on, there's something that goes, oh, we got to go do this or we got to do that. you know we got you yeah you know and and
01:32:24
Speaker
you know, even England, you know, we're going to, we're going to be spending 13, 14 days or something in England this summer, oh you know, and we're, we're, we're doing this, this, um, hundred and some mile Cotswolds way walking. So it's just all through little villages and countryside, you know, and a lot of the history, country history of, of England, and then a few days in London to see, um, you know, see a few sites and stuff. But, uh, And then we're going to Austria, and then we're riding from Austria down to the Italian coast, which is 400 and some kilometers. So shorter days. Everything's so much closer over there in terms of countries, right? Well, and the beauty of traveling, especially to Europe, is that they are so dialed in with these tours, you know, where you can pick whatever
01:33:13
Speaker
Um, yeah, whatever kind of tour you want. If you want a guided tour, uh, where you got a guy, hi you know, taking you on hikes or bike rides or whatever, you can pay for that. You know, we're doing, you know, a little bit more like a upscale self-guided tour. So, um, like when we're in, in Austria, they take our luggage. We just have to wear a day pack. They've got our bikes ready and we've got a destination. I think it's average 60 K a day or something like that. And you ride, and when we get there, our luggage will be there. The hotel reservation is already done. They just go out and buy a meal. and you know And so they'll follow that all the way through the tour. And so um I don't necessarily have to do all the planning. you know I pay somebody to do that. but But we also don't want to be in groups right now. you know We want it's nice to be able to stop where we want to stop. Do your own thing and yeah maybe grab some food or you know stop here or there. Yeah. Because because initially, like like when when we first started traveling, we had a travel agent and they would plan every day for us. And you know and then we just found like, well, you know, it's, it's, you know, it is, it is, a you're able to do it if you, if you have ah an open mind, right. And, um, yeah. So, um, uh, we're at a boat, an hour and a half, are you okay for time? yeah for now we'll week over it wow One question that I had, I've been asking everyone is, uh,
01:34:33
Speaker
You don't drink coffee, but if you were to have a drink of your choice with anyone, you know, alive or past, is there someone that comes to mind and like kind of where you would do that?
Historical Figures and Final Thoughts
01:34:42
Speaker
Oh, i I always thought like Winston Churchill would be a guy. That's what that's what Stefan said too. yeah I think he'd be incredible. You know, just just that his life. And i you know and he's he's got his faults and you know and imperialism and all that stuff. But just you know being in the last Calvary charge of the British Empire, I think it was, and then he's flying on jet planes you know as prime minister and in the 50s and stuff. And filming up for D-Day. Oh, and to step in in a losing situation like that, where they basically dump the government on him and 39 just say, well, we're out. yeah know You can surrender to the... Nazis, you know, and yeah just, I said to Stefan, I said, I guess, you know, you can, maybe it would be tea you'd have with him. He laughed at me. He said, no, no, that it would be some sort of alcohol. Yeah. it Like a whiskey or something or a bourbon or whatever. Yeah. So, um, yeah, that, that guy jumps, you know, and of course, you know, there's some other figures that I guess.
01:35:42
Speaker
You know, I've been sort of saying that i'm I'm big on Napoleon. I'd love to, you know, sit with him for an hour, even, you know, maybe a couple of days outside of one of his great bottles and just pick his brain. And, you know, and and like the interesting thing I said this before is that, It wasn't just his warfare that was interesting. he he was I think he was quite a quirky individual, but um the life he led, even outside of that, was my own. I say it's like 100 lives in one. you I think at 24, I think he was like a general. yeah It's just like, what? Yeah. The opportunity arose to a guy that was ready for greatness, right? Yeah. he yeah
01:36:23
Speaker
And I think if you take that guy almost any generate or any time in life, probably similar, he's gonna rise through the rain. Yeah, because I mean, I saw so something one time where, you know, they were showing like the generals who like them the guys with the most battles that they won as generals. And I think the next general who was like, you know, Genghis Khan or something, my dad had half the wins. Like Napoleon had like 53 or that. I can't tell exactly, but he won just battles after battle. He just happened to lose, you know, and there was a, you know, it wasn't a given that he he was going to lose Waterloo, right? and No. Yeah, even even then, and I think that was part of it that, you know, like, you know, I went and saw the movie that came out recently and there was like good and bad to that movie, I guess. Yeah, I but i was a bit disappointed with the movie myself. Yeah, I was a little bit too. And I was, you know, listening to his autobiography is his huge, like 45 chapter book or whatever. But the thing that struck me with him, you know, he was knocking it out of the park for like, you see, 50 or 60 battles. And then, you know, I don't know whether it was ego or mistiming or whatever, i just finally caught up to him. And yeah, because I mean, there's lots of lots of um questions about, you know, what was he
01:37:40
Speaker
having issues, you know, health issues that day or, you know, this or that because I mean, but Wellington was one of the top generals of all time too. The guy won battle after battle. He beat all of Napoleon's generals. island yeah Yeah. And so it was two great ah guys facing each other. And one thing that fascinated me about him is that he would be like in Egypt, you know, conquering Egypt in his manner, you know, suffering and things are going on. I mean, while he's writing his love letters to his you know his wife, Josephine, who was his like, you know, this great general that's got, you know, thousands of men under command, but the one thing was his what his wife was just, you know, you just loved her so much that, you know, yeah but it's an incredible story. Yeah, no, for sure. I mean, you know, that that great, you know, is it the great man who makes the ah history or is it the history that allows the man to have this, you know, the chance, right? You know, I'm just, you know, same with Churchill, right? I mean, if he had been
01:38:37
Speaker
feelix If he had accepted a role in the government in the 30s that was offered to him all the time, he would have been in the government that collapsed, right? ands Interesting. And somebody else would have got been given that job. yeah you know Without Churchill like me, what is what does history look like? How does it turn out? Is there a Jew left alive in Europe? Do the Germans just take over the world at that point? Well, yeah, they probably don't take over the world, but they take over England. And they can then turn all their attention to Russia. You know, I don't think they would ever have invaded the US or whatever. I mean, that's not happening because of the oceans and stuff like that. I mean, that's my opinion, but I mean, the history of Europe and Russia would have been radically different if England had surrendered. It's funny, like timing, you know, I always say timing can be everything, you know, and like for Churchill getting, not taking that position and then getting taken in is, you know, obviously things lined up well for
01:39:34
Speaker
everyone. Well, that's awesome, buddy. Anything, any other last thoughts in terms of like, you know, stuff that we've covered a lot of ground today. Yeah, no, I know it's been a bit meandering for me, but you know, it's been a real pleasure though. Yeah, man. I appreciate the opportunity. Thank you for coming on. We've had lots of great conversations over the years. Yeah, well, I've learned from you as much as you know, you say you learned from me. So I mean, it's You know, you've always, you were always a pleasure to, you know, work with, uh, you know, I appreciate it. Yeah. It's just good. Oh, right on. Thanks brother. That's awesome. My friend.