Transcript
Speaker: Hello and welcome to today's episode of Red Eye. I'm Jane Williams. Coming up in this episode I speak with Mohana Dayash about the surprise arrest of the co -organiser of a Calgary rally in support of Palestinians.
Speaker: As the bombardment of Gaza continues and the death toll of Palestinians mounts, thousands of Canadians are calling for a ceasefire and an end to the occupation of Palestine by the Israeli military.
Speaker: These protests are being met with a concerted international effort to suppress rallies and speeches that express solidarity with Palestinians. On November 5th, the Calgary co -organizer of a large rally in support of Palestinian rights was arrested and charged by Calgary police.
Speaker: I'm joined today by Mohanad Ayash, a sociology professor at Mount Royal University in Calgary. Mohanad Ayash is also a policy analyst at Al Shabaka, the Palestinian Policy Network. He was born and raised in East Jerusalem before immigrating to Canada. Thanks for joining me today, Mohanad. Thank you so much for having me, I appreciate it. What happened at the rally on Sunday?
Speaker: So from my understanding and what I saw, this was a peaceful protest that lasted for about three hours, maybe three and a half hours with a huge turnout. Almost 2000 people were there. That's the biggest Palestine solidarity rally I have seen in years here, possibly ever.
Speaker: And after the rally was over and everybody was dispersed and going home, the main organizer and the sort of the lead emcee of the rally was Sam. He was on his way home with his parents and sister, I believe, waiting for their train and the police came and arrested him. And they told him in front of his parents, they arrested him. His mom was, of course, very shaken by this.
Speaker: And they told him that it was for disturbance of the peace. And later on, we find out that it was all because he led the chant using the very popular and widespread slogan, from the river to the sea, Palestine will be free. And the Calgary police has decided that this is somehow a quote unquote anti -Semitic phrase.
Speaker: that causes a disturbance of the peace, which is quite frankly outrageous. But that's where things are today. They have indicated that charges have been laid against Wussam. And yeah, we're waiting for next steps at this point. And I believe his court date is December 12th, if I'm not mistaken. Was there any disturbance of the peace taking place at the rally?
Speaker: No, none. Absolutely none. And these organizers have worked closely with Calgary Police. The community liaison has had a very good working relationship with these organizers for years. In fact, I distinctly recall many of the speakers thanking the police for being there and for keeping everyone safe.
Speaker: There was a good working relationship with the Calgary police, but the Calgary police are the ones that have betrayed that trust at this point. And, you know, it's my understanding that prior to the rally, the police did have a conversation. I'm not sure which police, which members of the police did that, but members of the police did have a conversation with, with Salmon, other people who are organizing this rally. And from my understanding is that they told them that this is being considered now.
Speaker: that the slogan from the River to the Sea Palestine will be free is now being considered as potentially a hate speech or an offensive anti -Semitic phrase. But that no arrests would be made that day. I in fact recall that with Sam himself
Speaker: When he told the audience and people at the rally that this conversation was had prior to the rally, he followed that up by saying, so look, I understand if you're uncomfortable chanting with that, that is your decision if you don't want to chant it. But he also said that the police told him
Speaker: that no arrests would be made that day for using that slogan and for participating in that chant. So he said, while we're still able to, let's chant it together. And then they go and arrest them three or so hours later. I mean, it's outrageous. It's outrageous that they have decided, by the way, to begin with, that this is even anywhere near remotely close to being an anti -Semitic phrase. This is simply a distortion of the meaning of the slogan and an intentional distortion at that.
Speaker: I want to ask you about that, but first I want to just check with you. They've added a hate motivation to the charge. Yeah. I mean, it's best to speak to lawyers about these charges. It's not my area of expertise, but it's my understanding that they have, I don't know if the charge is a hate crime, but they certainly have indicated that this qualifies somehow as anti -Semitic phrase and therefore hate speech.
Speaker: I'm not aware of any legislation existing right now in Canada that claims that. So there are many questions that need to be cleared up and answered by the Calgary Police, by the City of Calgary, and all of the political representatives here. Questions such as, when was this decision made? What experts were consulted when they made this decision that this slogan is somehow an anti -Semitic phrase? Did they communicate to WSSAM and others that people would be arrested that day?
Speaker: Or did they tell them, no, nobody will be arrested today and that this is still being considered? These are all questions that don't have answers and we don't have any kind of clarification about that from Calgary Police or the City of Calgary. This phrase is being characterized by supporters of the State of Israel as a chant calling for the expulsion or death of Jews living in historic Palestine. What's your response to that?
Speaker: I mean, this is simply a distortion of reality and it is a purely, it's a political statement on the behalf of like these pro -Israel groups are making this statement as a, as part of a political strategy to suppress support for Palestine in Canada and beyond.
Speaker: and to censor Palestinian speech that is critical of the Israeli state and that calls for the right of Palestinian refugees to return to their lands and homes. And it is not a coincidence that this is being stepped up now at a very moment where more Palestinians are being expelled from their lands and homes. And these pro -Israel groups want to make it, quote -unquote, a hate crime or hate speech.
Speaker: to call for the return of Palestinians to their lands and homes. The fact of the matter is that the United Nations has recognized the right of the Palestinian refugees to return to their lands and homes, and that this is an ongoing aspiration of the Palestinians who were expelled from their lands and homes in 1948 to return.
Speaker: which they have every right to do. To label such rights and aspirations for freedom as hate speech is a brazen attempt to silence and censor political speech. And the notion that this is a zero -sum game
Speaker: is a very Israeli way of thinking and worldview. It is not a zero -sum game. This land can be shared by both peoples. The call for the Palestinians to return to their lands and homes from 1948 onwards does not mean the expulsion of Israeli Jews.
Speaker: It means that Palestinians have the right to return to their lands at home. Simple as that. And then the land can and should be shared. But there should be equality and freedom for all in the region between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea. It's simple as that. And anything else is a distortion and an attempt to censor political speech, like I said.
Speaker: Now you've written that when criticism of the actions of the state of Israel is equated with anti -Semitism, there is an impact on the fight against the very real anti -Semitism that exists in society today. Can you talk about that?
Speaker: Absolutely. And I'm not the first one to say this, obviously. Many Jewish scholars and activists have said that. Many from independent Jewish voices in Canada reached out to me to thank me for writing that piece last summer. I've spoken publicly about it in other talks because it is quite dangerous.
Speaker: for the Jewish community when you conflate criticism of the Israeli state with anti -Semitism. Look, one of the anti -Semitic tropes that exist out there is that every Jewish person in the world has their first allegiance to the Israeli state and therefore is not to be trusted within whatever country they live in.
Speaker: This is an anti -Semitic trope. And when the Israeli state conflates critiques of the Israeli state with anti -Semitism, it actually pushes forward this anti -Semitic trope. People come to then associate Jewish communities all over the world with the Israeli state.
Speaker: This has incredibly dangerous consequences. And it also, as it weaponizes, so that's one. Number two, as it weaponizes anti -Semitism and claims that people are committing anti -Semitic acts or participating in anti -Semitic speech when they're critiquing the Israeli state, people see through that. People don't buy that. The majority of people don't. Institutions might.
Speaker: But the majority of people don't. So when you do that, what you're doing is in fact diluting the meaning of anti -Semitism. And people start to go, well, every charge of anti -Semitism must therefore be false. And this is also extremely dangerous because anti -Semitism is real and has to be named and opposed wherever it appears. But it is not
Speaker: It has nothing to do with the Palestinian struggle for liberation. It has nothing to do with opposing a paratide and settler colonialism and genocide and the expulsion of Palestinians from their lands. And so I worry for everyone's sake when these kinds of weaponizations of anti -Semitism take place. It's a very dangerous road that we're going down.
Speaker: To go back to Wasam and the arrests that took place, it's not an isolated incident in the current attempt to criminalize support for Palestinians. What should we be doing to protect the right to protest what's going on in Gaza?
Speaker: Yeah, so this incident is part of a larger worldwide effort to suppress support for Palestinian solidarity and to speak very loudly against the ongoing genocidal operation against Palestinians in the Gaza Strip.
Speaker: It is critical at this moment that people power stand up to the complicity of institutions across the world in this genocide against the Palestinian people. And institutions within Canada and the US and the UK and France and Germany are seeing that people are not aligned with what the institutions are saying. They're very much opposed to what their institutions are doing.
Speaker: And because they don't want to change course, because they see their strategic interests as tied with the Israeli state continuing to exist as a settler colony and an imperial outpost for American imperial interests in the region and other Western imperial interests in the region, they are trying to suppress the public's support for Palestine.
Speaker: And so we must all commit ourselves to opposing this kind of censorship. People should be writing to their local representatives, provincial representatives, federal representatives, to police, to everyone, continuously telling them that you do not accept the silencing of Palestinian voices. You do not accept the censorship of political speech that is yearning for an alternative future away from all of these horrors
Speaker: away from all of these enormous violences that we're seeing unfold before our eyes. At these moments, we need people power to speak up for an alternative future now more than ever, so we cannot allow state institutions to silence that. So this is really critical. People should reach out to all of their representatives, to police, like I said, to everyone who will listen, to media, and demand that we all oppose these attempts to censor political speech.
Speaker: Thank you so much for talking with me today, Mohanad. My pleasure, thank you. Mohanad Ayash is a policy analyst at Al Shabaka, the Palestinian Policy Network. He was born and raised in East Jerusalem before immigrating to Canada, where he is a sociology professor at Mount Royal University in Calgary. He's currently writing a book on settler colonial sovereignty.
Speaker: The Red Eye Collective is based in Vancouver. You can check us out at coopradio .org slash redeye.
