Transcript
Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to Loser Kid Pinball Podcast.
Speaker: This is episode 76.
Speaker: I am Josh Roop.
Speaker: With me, my co-captain, as always.
Speaker: Scott Larson.
Speaker: And Scott, we just wrapped up an awesome recording session with Triple Drain.
Speaker: And we figured, why not?
Speaker: It's early for us.
Speaker: It was like midnight for them.
Speaker: But we figured, why don't we jump on and kind of give some of our thoughts?
Speaker: This is bonus time.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Actually, ironically, I didn't realize how early it was.
Speaker: I actually got up at five this morning.
Speaker: Well, you said you're mentally running on fumes like, well, he must have worked early this morning or something.
Speaker: Well, because I worked overnight, but I was very lucky in that unusual.
Speaker: But I I finished up early and I got to bed around 11 o'clock and then I didn't get a call to go back until five.
Speaker: So I actually got six hours.
Speaker: So actually, that's pretty good.
Speaker: So, you know, it's been a while since we've been on and even just talking news or anything like that.
Speaker: Last episode, we did the Christmas episode, which, by the way, thank you for everyone that reached out.
Speaker: They said they appreciated the show.
Speaker: We had a really amazing response to it.
Speaker: I didn't realize we'd have so many people reaching out.
Speaker: Even people love the music.
Speaker: I thought that the punk Christmas music might not.
Speaker: Oh, it's funny.
Speaker: But there was a lot of people that loved it and even knew the songs.
Speaker: I was like, oh, wow, cool.
Speaker: And then we had, you know, we've heard the Rush rumor for a little bit now.
Speaker: And then we had an announcement.
Speaker: And now it looks like Rush is a reality.
Speaker: And we haven't even talked.
Speaker: We didn't even really talk rumors because last time we talked was like the beginning of December.
Speaker: Well, we've talked about it and we've speculated, I think appropriately, that it was in line for Borg.
Speaker: We didn't know.
Speaker: So I think that seemed to be more of confirmed, more than rumors.
Speaker: We didn't know anything about the art.
Speaker: We didn't know anything about the code and we didn't know anything about the layout.
Speaker: We I hadn't seen any leaked pictures or anything like that.
Speaker: And so it was it was fun to speculate.
Speaker: But yes, the the the owl is out of the bag.
Speaker: It definitely is rush.
Speaker: And, and if you want one of these rushes, um, you, you, and you're not on the list now in line.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It is time.
Speaker: And we recommend Zach many and Nicole many with flipping out pinball.
Speaker: They do all of our stuff.
Speaker: We appreciate everything they do for us.
Speaker: You were having a heck of a time finding an Ellie, right?
Speaker: Scott, I was, I actually had resigned to just get a premium.
Speaker: Um, I had asked around a little bit and I wasn't super interested in, in buying an, um, a marked up one.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I, I felt that, you know, I could get a, uh, I could get a premium and I could make it good enough.
Speaker: Um, however, when I saw the reveal, I said, uh, I really want a Nelly if I can find one.
Speaker: And so I actually posted a little bit and I had asked Zach a while ago and he said, you know what, you're outside the list, but you know, there is a list.
Speaker: And so, and I said, okay, that's fine.
Speaker: I'll just get a premium and give me all the, all the mods and I'll do my best on it.
Speaker: And he messaged me.
Speaker: Apparently someone decided not to get theirs.
Speaker: And so I bought my LE from Zach and him called mini.
Speaker: And I also at flipping out pinball.
Speaker: And so money's off and I got my first insider kit today that I bought.
Speaker: I order from them too.
Speaker: So I can't figure out which game I want to put it on yet.
Speaker: So,
Speaker: That will be interesting to see.
Speaker: Maybe there's some suggestions out there.
Speaker: Zach has always been very good to us, and so we highly recommend him and Nicole for your pinball needs.
Speaker: And remember, if you want something, please let them know.
Speaker: Because there is a waiting list for most things.
Speaker: They can get almost anything you want, but just realize that it's in your best interest to tell them what you want.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Well, and I was listening to Final Round today, and Jeff and Martin had made an excellent point that I guess I really hadn't...
Speaker: processed yet but you know a lot of people complain about wait times in the pinball industry it's not just the pinball industry uh you know they were talking about like yeah everything if it has a computer chip in it you're waiting for someone said they uh bruce nightingale and his wife were waiting on like a bed frame because it had a special feature to it
Speaker: We went to buy a bed.
Speaker: We went to buy a bed for my daughter today and we were at Costco and we asked them, they said, well, this is the time furniture.
Speaker: So just in case you're wondering, Costco has seasons just like anything else.
Speaker: And January is the furniture season in Costco.
Speaker: Uh, so we, I, I actually forgot that, but I went there and, and, uh, so we were looking at the mattresses and they said, actually, we usually have them here and you can try them out, but because of the shipping shortages.
Speaker: So yeah, the shipping things are, it's a real thing.
Speaker: And I'm kind of bummed.
Speaker: I, uh, so my, uh, my golden girls, um, hobby, uh,
Speaker: is buying ornaments like Christmas tree ornaments from Hallmark.
Speaker: And they're usually super nerdy.
Speaker: So I got some Star Wars ones and Harry Potter ones, but I ordered two and they didn't come in.
Speaker: So I don't even know if I'm going to get those.
Speaker: So we'll see.
Speaker: You'll get them in July when you want it for Christmas again.
Speaker: Oh, it's fine.
Speaker: Actually, we didn't even, because my wife's shoulder surgery, we didn't ever decorate the tree.
Speaker: We put it up, but we didn't actually decorate it.
Speaker: Anyway.
Speaker: So I got to ask you, it was announced last Friday.
Speaker: It was teaser trailer time, which we all know that Stern always puts out some kind of small teaser.
Speaker: Tuesday.
Speaker: It was a theme.
Speaker: Wasn't it Tuesday?
Speaker: No, it was Friday last week where they showed just the owl video.
Speaker: Oh, okay.
Speaker: The owl going through the snow and then rush.
Speaker: Boom, right?
Speaker: And then Tuesday was the actual reveal of the game.
Speaker: It's funny because I've been so...
Speaker: on the fence of how this was going to be received.
Speaker: We've talked about the winter curse, you know, January time, winter time, first quarter always seems to have a rough time moving units.
Speaker: Uh, so I didn't know how this would go rush itself.
Speaker: Uh, they are fantastic musicians.
Speaker: I will give them all the credit.
Speaker: I was joking with you yesterday that, uh, Neil Peart, uh, God rest his soul passed away a couple of years ago, uh, was the Josh sharp of drumming because he's a fantastic drummer.
Speaker: But he's always in second place.
Speaker: Jason bottom.
Speaker: Oh my goodness.
Speaker: Or Buddy Rich.
Speaker: And so, yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But Buddy Rich, you could actually, you could actually go with Buddy Rich because Neil Peart did a tribute album called Burning for Buddy.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And so he actually is, yeah, he has the ability to do that.
Speaker: But yeah, anyway.
Speaker: But being great musicians doesn't always translate into a great pinball machine.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And so that's always my concern.
Speaker: I mean, Led Zeppelin is arguably one of the best bands that have ever existed.
Speaker: And we know how that pinball machine turned out.
Speaker: Not for the lack of trying.
Speaker: You know, after everything's come to light, it sounds like it was more of a licensing issue and more jumping through hoops than it was anything else at that point.
Speaker: Yeah, and it's challenging, too, because it depends on how involved the band is or lack of involvement or how cooperative or how uncooperative.
Speaker: And by the way, we don't have any huge inside information on Zeppelin, but it does seem to be that they weren't.
Speaker: I guess the take home message is it wasn't as open to them as you would like to have for a creative pin.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Well, and I made this point on triple drain, you know, it's, it's easier to make a pin and put more depth into it.
Speaker: When you have like with rush, you had Geddy Lee, you had Alex Lifeman on board.
Speaker: They were there in the recording room.
Speaker: They have all the rights.
Speaker: They're on music.
Speaker: it was not hard for them to say do this do that they checked off where in led zeppelin's case you have people that passed away you have a state you have four five six hoops to jump through and it makes it a lot more rough you're spending more time jumping through hoops than you are working on a game i would speculate too that i bet the license was more expensive
Speaker: And I, I'm just, I'm just guessing because I'm Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I love rush, but Led Zeppelin is a different level.
Speaker: It's a different level of, of popularity and ultimately popularity means more expensive.
Speaker: I mean, we all know that the Beatles license was the most expensive they'd had to that point.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So to wrap this back, um, I was nervous that rush wasn't going to be received well and, and being, uh,
Speaker: There's a lot of chatter on Facebook.
Speaker: There's a lot of chatter on Pinside.
Speaker: The squeaky wheel seems to always direct the course of the way the cart's going, right?
Speaker: And it's making me nervous that people are being loud.
Speaker: It seems like this thing has come out and people are very pleased.
Speaker: Well, most people.
Speaker: You look on Facebook and Pinside, not so much.
Speaker: But there's got to be something right when this game is pretty much sold out their first couple runs.
Speaker: And we're looking three, four runs down the road already on Rush.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And the Ellie's were pretty much gone before they was even announced.
Speaker: They were gone.
Speaker: So basically, sadly, the K, it's a blessing and a curse, right?
Speaker: Because you want something that you're interested in to be popular.
Speaker: You want it to be succeeding.
Speaker: I mean, you don't want to be like,
Speaker: Um, okay.
Speaker: I've, I've said it before, uh, watch, if you want to know a documentary that's super interesting and kind of depressing simultaneously, watch the way of the puck because it is air hockey and it's these super passionate people.
Speaker: Just think of tournament pinball, but equivalent passion for air hockey and,
Speaker: Air hockey is, I'm sorry, it is dead.
Speaker: Like there there's, it's not the same level of excitement that pinball has.
Speaker: And I watched it at the same time, back to back.
Speaker: I watched that and I watched special when Litton, it both had the same vibe of this is a dead thing.
Speaker: And I basically just bought an air hockey table and a pinball machine.
Speaker: So it was just weird.
Speaker: But you want that, like, you want whatever you're passionate about to be that successful, because that drives the companies investing money into the product.
Speaker: That drives them to actually elevate the product and make it better and increase the build of material.
Speaker: Yes, the cost goes up, but you're getting a better product.
Speaker: And so...
Speaker: If you want an L.E., then I would definitely contact your distributor and kind of find out some rumors out there.
Speaker: If you think a game's out there, they can't confirm or deny that a game is coming out, but they certainly have interested lists.
Speaker: So contact your distributor, but yes.
Speaker: So if you wanted one, you can still find, we all know that if you want to pay the right amount of money, you can get about whatever you want.
Speaker: So you can still get it, but if you want it for a reasonable price, contact your distributor, contact Zach and Nicole and say that you want to, you're interested in this theme if it ever comes out.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Well, and we did an episode, I want to say a couple months back, and we called it the secret sauce.
Speaker: And we talked about how theme was the secret sauce to a pinball machine.
Speaker: And I've decided to backtrack on that.
Speaker: Theme is very, very important.
Speaker: It's not the only thing.
Speaker: It's theme integration.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And looking at...
Speaker: I think it was a brilliant move by Geddy Lee and Alex Lifeson in the early negotiations with making a rush pinball machine.
Speaker: They said, we want to bring in Ed Robertson because he knows pinball.
Speaker: And if you haven't checked it out yet, go on Stern Insider and listen to the Ed Robertson interview.
Speaker: They talked about...
Speaker: He got a call from Jody.
Speaker: Jody Dinkberg.
Speaker: And Jody was like, they won't make this unless if you're helping direct.
Speaker: And listening to some of his direction going off about song selection, being a pinball machine, and just some of how they were able to integrate it, it makes Rush that much more desirable.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I think that is for anything now.
Speaker: I'm looking at, we just saw the reveal, not even the reveal, the stream.
Speaker: Well, sorry.
Speaker: I'm talking about queen.
Speaker: We saw queen.
Speaker: And we don't even know how it's going to play.
Speaker: We haven't seen code.
Speaker: Yeah, but it's not, it didn't, it didn't feel good.
Speaker: Like when you, when you looked at it, it looks like someone who knows very little about pinball put it together.
Speaker: Yes, it feels like it fell short.
Speaker: We're getting to a point in pinball where these are very complex machines.
Speaker: They're not even what they were five years ago.
Speaker: The code is insane on these, and they're almost becoming a love letter to whatever theme it is.
Speaker: And do you want your love letter to be a Rush pinball machine the way that they have went in and made this...
Speaker: just oozing with everything rush you know we joked about the time machine being a washing machine and you're like dude they had a washing machine on the stage behind getty as a joke and so it's theme appropriate for it to look like a washing machine and so it's funny because it's little details like that i'd rather have that
Speaker: I hate picking on Led Zeppelin because they're such a good band and I enjoy their stuff.
Speaker: But I feel like Led Zeppelin was a very cookie cutter.
Speaker: And so I would rather want that.
Speaker: The code is still good.
Speaker: The code is still very good.
Speaker: And the light show is very good.
Speaker: And I think the theme integration is actually quite good in it.
Speaker: But there wasn't enough to take it to the next level.
Speaker: It's missing that heart.
Speaker: It, it, yeah, it, wow.
Speaker: And, and, and we love Steve, Steve.
Speaker: I mean, Steve's come on the, but it did feel, I'm not blaming it on the designer.
Speaker: You're kind of, you're kind of backed into a, you're backed into a corner sometimes by licensing constraints.
Speaker: And we've talked about this before when, when something comes out and you're like, why did they choose it?
Speaker: They probably didn't choose that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like that was probably what the licensor told them to do.
Speaker: And so,
Speaker: I they were definitely more more guided with style limitations on Led Zeppelin than other machines.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, and I would argue the same thing with Star Wars, right?
Speaker: I mean, we all know Steve can make a great game and Star Wars, I think has the same, the same criticism that it doesn't feel like it feels like it hits all of the, um, it hits the marks, but it has the personality of a Star Wars lunchbox.
Speaker: Well, I think it's also that suffers from, it's a stop and go game stuck in a flow body.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it seemed a little bit like a disconnect.
Speaker: But you know what?
Speaker: To be fair, every designer will have the game that doesn't connect as well as they want it to.
Speaker: Yeah, but I guess this is the case in point.
Speaker: Look at Godzilla.
Speaker: Was Godzilla a desirable theme?
Speaker: How many people did you talk to before Godzilla?
Speaker: No, I'll take you back even more.
Speaker: Okay, you take me back as far as you want.
Speaker: Iron Maiden.
Speaker: I mean, Kate, my the funniest line before all of these pins came out, the funniest line I ever heard was from Jeff Rivera from the pinball podcast.
Speaker: I was hanging out with him and or or no, I think he said on his podcast is he said Iron Maiden sounds like Rush got drunk and decided to play metal.
Speaker: And he hates both Iron Maiden and Rush.
Speaker: And he wanted Led Zeppelin with all of his heart.
Speaker: And so you cannot tell me that Iron Maiden, the secret sauce was the theme.
Speaker: It was not.
Speaker: It was not.
Speaker: But I think that the theme can help elevate it to the next level, though.
Speaker: Iron Maiden stood on its own because of Keith Elwin and his excellent design.
Speaker: But for the most part, you can look at Lord of the Rings and a very similar game of Sopranos.
Speaker: But Sopranos is nowhere near as popular as Lord of the Rings because it doesn't have this, the merging of the two.
Speaker: No, I agree.
Speaker: And so I think that's what we're coming down to now is, is pinball companies need to realize these games are love letters to the things that they are building them for.
Speaker: And you, you either want that gushing with fan appreciation and little juicy nuggets here and there, instead of just artwork on a play field that you can, you can revolve through some songs and stuff like that.
Speaker: So I,
Speaker: I will, I'll share a little bit that my friend who's, he's actually one of the, he's the general manager of a Ford store here.
Speaker: And I talked to him a little bit about selling cars.
Speaker: And he said, one thing I try to tell my agents is,
Speaker: If you feel like you're fooling the customer into buying something that you either don't believe in, or if you feel like you're spinning it and so they're getting, you know, they're getting a bad ish deal.
Speaker: Like they can tell, like, you don't think they can tell, but they can tell they there's something about it that doesn't feel right.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And it doesn't hit on every level.
Speaker: And I would argue when you get a machine that is like that, you, there's something about it.
Speaker: You're not exactly sure what it is, but it just doesn't fire on all cylinders.
Speaker: What almost feels like it's went from professional to amateur.
Speaker: I mean, perfect example, like at Thunderbirds.
Speaker: I would say soulless though.
Speaker: It doesn't have that soul thing that makes you connect with it on an emotional level.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So let's talk about, so Rush comes out, people start seeing this for the first time, and I'm kind of baffled at this point of the comparisons.
Speaker: Borg's been around for 20 plus years, correct?
Speaker: He's been around since the 90s.
Speaker: A long time, yeah.
Speaker: So he's, actually it's been 30 years.
Speaker: Yeah, no, Borg's basically been in pinball forever.
Speaker: Yes, he's he's one of the elder statesman's now of Stern.
Speaker: It's funny because you look at Borg and he's been around for 30 years.
Speaker: And the next seniority is what Keith Elwin?
Speaker: And he has four games.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: So even going back to, you know, going back to the data East games.
Speaker: So Borg has in in pinball database.
Speaker: He has credits back to 1992.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So I, I, I, yeah, so, so definitely not the, the lead, but he's, he's been around, he's been.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And, uh, like I was saying this on triple train, I don't feel like Borg's ever been known for easy shooting games.
Speaker: It's always been kind of a little on the rougher side.
Speaker: Yeah, I'm looking at every single game right here, and all of them are butt kickers.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: When you think Borg, what do you think of?
Speaker: Munster's the only outlier.
Speaker: But when you think of Borg, you think of two games.
Speaker: You think of Iron Man, and you think of Metallica.
Speaker: Well, okay, three games.
Speaker: I'd say Iron Man, Metallica, and yeah.
Speaker: And those are the ones, well, okay, Walking Dead.
Speaker: I guess you can, any of these games that you're saying out, they are not like, it's not a fun ride.
Speaker: And you have to strap yourself in.
Speaker: You're earning it.
Speaker: You're earning every shot.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: So thinking of Borg, when this comes out, you owned an X-Men.
Speaker: And I played your X-Men.
Speaker: So I recognize this right off the bat.
Speaker: I'm like, this is X-Men, which is fine.
Speaker: It's not a big deal.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: I would say it's similar to X-Men.
Speaker: It definitely like the top down.
Speaker: You can definitely the pop bumpers are in the same spot.
Speaker: The scoop is in a similar spot.
Speaker: You have a shot up the middle, which would be similar to the Magneto shot.
Speaker: You have the upper flipper shot.
Speaker: So there's a lot that you will recognize on this.
Speaker: So people start liking this to Iron Maiden.
Speaker: I know you have a different point to this, but why?
Speaker: No, not Iron Maiden.
Speaker: This is like, if you're going to say anything, it is similar to X-Men.
Speaker: Why Iron Maiden?
Speaker: You know what?
Speaker: I might not have agreed with this at first, but David Fix, I now understand why.
Speaker: People shouldn't have a comment until five years into the hobby because Iron Maiden is not...
Speaker: Close to rush.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm going to tell you why you're wrong on this.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You tell me why I'm wrong.
Speaker: Again, I'm not, I am not saying it is the same as Iron Maiden.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm saying the elements, the, so a few things which make people say, well, I do kind of feel a little bit of Iron Maiden.
Speaker: I would say first and foremost, we're just going to call it the washing machine ramp.
Speaker: The elevation of the washing machine ramp, which is very similar to the premium.
Speaker: And so there is that.
Speaker: Now, I also know that they have the shot through the bumpers.
Speaker: that Borg has, but he did that with X-Men 2, and so that's not unheard of.
Speaker: That was the gambit shot.
Speaker: But I can see how people would be like, well, there's the shot through the bumpers on the left side.
Speaker: There's that.
Speaker: And there's kind of a quick horseshoe type ramp.
Speaker: It's not in the same location.
Speaker: So I, I, I certainly am not defending that as much, but I can understand vaguely why they said it.
Speaker: And there is the diverter on the premium that Iron Maiden has that goes up and down.
Speaker: And there is now it goes to a different area.
Speaker: The diverter, like the, the diverter went actually underneath the play field in Iron Maiden, but there,
Speaker: uh, the, in the Borg one, there is a diverter that allows it to go back to the, um, the second, or I guess the middle right in lane or the closest, the innermost right in lane.
Speaker: And so while I am totally not defending that because it obviously has more similarities to X-Men, I totally get why someone would say, well, I can kind of see some Iron Maiden.
Speaker: So there's some elements in there, right?
Speaker: true but you could say you take that same equation you'd be like well there's some elements that are similar to i don't know adam's family there's a shot through the pops with an upper flipper that goes to a ramp w ith it and a side shot well as we know it's a fan layout with three flippers exactly didn't someone say that so yes uh
Speaker: Oh, my goodness.
Speaker: Yeah, no, no.
Speaker: OK, moving on.
Speaker: But yeah, OK.
Speaker: So again, I'm not defending it, but I can at least say why.
Speaker: OK, so your next question, I immediately looked at that and said, that looks a lot like X-Men.
Speaker: So what was my response when I saw that?
Speaker: Wasn't it like, I hope it's not a clunk fest like X-Men was?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like I was nervous because for some reason, and I know there are some people who love X-Men, but, and I think it's still one of the prettiest games I've ever owned.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's good on you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh yeah, man.
Speaker: The music was terrible on that.
Speaker: But for some reason, I just had a hard time connecting and enjoying that game because it just felt like I could never personally dial in those shots.
Speaker: Well, and what's made me funny is every time I came over to your house and we talk X-Men, like, I don't understand how anyone could own anything but the Magneto one.
Speaker: Like, how does Wolverine controlling the magnet balls make any sense compared to Magneto controlling them?
Speaker: Yeah, I don't.
Speaker: It just seems kind of crazy that there was ever, like, that should have been the only Ellie that,
Speaker: But, um, and, and really, I still think it's one of the prettiest games that you will ever see.
Speaker: And honestly, let's be honest.
Speaker: If you, if you've been doing this for three decades and we're comparing it to a game he made 10 years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's 10 years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so what, in my opinion, what does it really, at this point, what does it matter?
Speaker: Well, they're not going to be the same at all.
Speaker: Okay, I would say that the one super positive part of this is that
Speaker: I mean, designers aren't stupid.
Speaker: They know when a game is well received and when, and they are, they are more intimately aware of the flaws of the game than you are, even as the most passionate fan.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so if you had the ability to retool a layout that didn't quite make it, don't you think you would make it a lot better?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, case in point, look at Deadpool.
Speaker: Is it the shink shot?
Speaker: Yeah, it's the katana ramp shot.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: No, it's okay.
Speaker: What are they calling that?
Speaker: But compared to, it was originally done on the first Avengers.
Speaker: The Avengers.
Speaker: And that Black Widow shot was terrible.
Speaker: It was hard and it was not fun.
Speaker: And now it's come to one.
Speaker: That shot now is very fun on Deadpool because it's like, it's nerve wracking because it's like, oh, but it feels so satisfying every time you hit it now.
Speaker: That is a classic example of taking something that didn't work and making it work.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I guarantee and they even had like fixes on the they had fixes on Black Widow to fix it.
Speaker: So, yeah, it still just didn't.
Speaker: It still just didn't connect.
Speaker: So, yeah, I'm trying to find.
Speaker: Sorry, I you're fine.
Speaker: You, uh, you distracted me.
Speaker: I'm trying to find the name of that.
Speaker: Dang.
Speaker: Dang you, Josh.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Straight to heck.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, no.
Speaker: And while you're looking that up, I mean, yeah.
Speaker: I will still defend it.
Speaker: I mean, it's a good layout.
Speaker: I still enjoy X-Men.
Speaker: Or reverse Tron, whatever floats your boat.
Speaker: It was basically a reverse Tron, yeah.
Speaker: And so it would make sense that it would be considered like, hey, this will be a great game.
Speaker: And it just didn't hit it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I do, I think the Rush layout does look good.
Speaker: Let's go around the stream looked great.
Speaker: I'm glad that Timmy and Ray Day and Jack were the ones streaming it.
Speaker: They did an awesome job.
Speaker: Like I said, you do have to take these streams with a grain of salt because these are top, top tier players.
Speaker: Some of the best in the world or the best in the world.
Speaker: Yeah, but man, that looked so smooth, didn't it?
Speaker: Yes, it looked butter smooth.
Speaker: And like I said, it's probably going to be one of those things you're going to have to play some games on it.
Speaker: You're going to have to get your hands on it and you can't judge it by the first,
Speaker: five games would be my my suggestion you can go the jeff rivera route don't judge it fully until you've put your name on the high score and i'm i am an avid follower of that um i played shrek for the first time uh yeah two days ago i wanted to like shrek and i just i could not get into that either it just felt like it was so samey so
Speaker: Well, and I, I got my high score on the second game and I, I, we were talking about this in the group chat on slam tilts.
Speaker: Cause there's a lot of people in there and, and, and I asked him, like, is there anything else I could have seen?
Speaker: And there really wasn't like, there were like more modes.
Speaker: Nope.
Speaker: You got it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They're like, there's a super duper wizard mode that no one ever gets to.
Speaker: So like far, far away.
Speaker: So don't worry about that.
Speaker: Raymond said that.
Speaker: And if the world's number one player said that it's impossible to get to, I, I, you, you have to take the glass off to get, to get that.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: If he says that you can take it to the bank, that is certified gold right there.
Speaker: But my point being is, is, is a lot of people want to judge this game already based off of theme and a layout that they think they know.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: However, okay.
Speaker: In fairness, what has the judgment been?
Speaker: That it looks just like how I made it.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: No, no, I'm saying what, but they have looked at it though.
Speaker: And the orders are going like through the roof.
Speaker: That's what makes me chuckle.
Speaker: Like people are ordering it.
Speaker: How many people have complained on Facebook about this?
Speaker: Like another, another dad rock band.
Speaker: And it's like.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Here's, here's one thing.
Speaker: And this is, uh, I will give Josh Sharp credit for this.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: One time in a, in a group chat, I had mentioned about my frustration with Stern, uh, toppers, you know, I, I buy toppers, right?
Speaker: I like toppers.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so I said, why don't they just make a billion of them and sell them for $350 or $450?
Speaker: And you'll still make more money on it by selling with volume than you will.
Speaker: You'll get a smaller margin, but you sell it with volume.
Speaker: And he said, that's great.
Speaker: The only thing you do not have is any data to back it up.
Speaker: And he said they do market analysis.
Speaker: So they know these things.
Speaker: And so there's a reason why they're doing it the way they do it.
Speaker: And so there's a reason why these pins with these themes are coming out is because they've done the study and they know that they're going to sell.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So you may, you may love a K-pop, which I think is a band from South Korea or something.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But yeah, you may love them, but if they put out a K-pop, they've probably done the market analysis to realize they're not going to sell the same amount that they will by making a Led Zeppelin, by making a Rush, by making a Van Halen pin, by, you know, whatever.
Speaker: Well, and let's, let's be honest.
Speaker: Like, I hope I don't offend anyone with this comment because
Speaker: But the people that own these or that are going for Rush, that are going for Led Zeppelin are usually seasoned professionals.
Speaker: They're people that are later on in their lives.
Speaker: Kids are out of the house.
Speaker: They have a little more in their bank account.
Speaker: They're not going to make... I graduated in 05.
Speaker: I've been out of high school for 15 years.
Speaker: I'm in my mid-30s.
Speaker: I've got kids at home.
Speaker: Let's be honest.
Speaker: I am not the demographic to be going for because how many kids or how many people at my age have...
Speaker: extra cash they're willing to throw out a pinball machine for let's let's say one of the bands from the 2000s let's say they they were coming out with a a fallout read him creed no let's do fallout boy because that's more my generation okay it's still a bigger band uh how many fallout boys do you think they would honestly sell and i know there's people are gonna be screaming it from the rooftops on facebook and pin side saying oh that would be a fantastic theme but honestly
Speaker: You're not the people that have the money right now.
Speaker: Don't care about fallout boy.
Speaker: I don't.
Speaker: I think I know though.
Speaker: They have the, I'm on fire.
Speaker: That song.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: That's the song.
Speaker: And then they also did the song I know.
Speaker: And by the way, I have zero interest.
Speaker: And for reference, I graduated 30 years ago this year.
Speaker: See?
Speaker: And so you've got to understand that Stern is first and foremost a business.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And you think that you understand marketing and all this stuff, but you don't understand that Stern has been in this alive for 20 plus years and they've done this market analysis.
Speaker: I'm not defending their decision to make a rust pinball machine.
Speaker: I am.
Speaker: I'm not saying...
Speaker: I'm not saying they're selling.
Speaker: Well, no, I agree.
Speaker: But what I'm saying is, is like, I would love to see a fallout boy pinball machine.
Speaker: I would love to see a some 41 pinball machine, but you're, it's not going to happen right now.
Speaker: Not until at least 20 years from now, we're, we're finally talking about having a nineties band pinball machine.
Speaker: Nineties guys.
Speaker: That was 30 years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: 30 plus years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, so here now we've, we've gone over,
Speaker: Rush deserves to be there and we are, we're excited for it.
Speaker: So you're excited for it.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I am excited for it.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But you're at least excited enough for it.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'll put it this way.
Speaker: I'm excited that there is so much love to this game.
Speaker: There's so much put into this game that comes from a person that knows rush.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And by the way, hit me up.
Speaker: Cause I got now.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: So I got an L E and now I just need all the other translates.
Speaker: So I need the pro and the premium.
Speaker: So let me know.
Speaker: Um, okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So what is your take on the look?
Speaker: The, so let's just talk about the art.
Speaker: What do you think about the art?
Speaker: I like the artwork.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: The only place that I could see that they fell short, I felt like they did fall a little short with the faces in the middle of the play field.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: And the reason being, I don't know the band from the 70s.
Speaker: I know Geddy Lee's classic look of the round, purplish-tinted glasses, which they kind of did.
Speaker: His hair's...
Speaker: not as long.
Speaker: Like you look at Alex Lifeson, his hair short.
Speaker: Now they went with more of a classic seventies look, which is great.
Speaker: But honestly, Neil Peart in the middle looks more like Lemmy from motorhead.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: However, ironically, he did look very similar to that around 2112.
Speaker: So this is very, the only thing that's different on this, Alex and Neil are very 2112-esque.
Speaker: Getty with the soul patch, he didn't have the soul patch until probably the 90s.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, but does it change your idea at all?
Speaker: when um this was the artist chimed in on this and said this is actually we went through with rush and this is what they wanted yeah and i think that's awesome if that's what they wanted yeah and so so that was that was their uh take and so yeah it was um yeah so uh michael barnard
Speaker: I'm hoping I'm saying that correctly.
Speaker: But yeah, so he's the one who said, actually, Rush had a lot of input in this.
Speaker: And they said, well, actually do this a little bit.
Speaker: So this is the look that Rush wanted to present.
Speaker: I want to point out something I really like Michael did.
Speaker: I don't know if it's because he did it or if it was the direction that he was made.
Speaker: One of the back glasses, I want to say it's the premium.
Speaker: It has like the owl and then it has like that.
Speaker: So the owl is front and center in the pro.
Speaker: K is it that one?
Speaker: There's one where it's almost like they mixed and matched like three different albums.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So the, and the premium, you have the owl flying off to the right, you have running up the middle, which is a, an homage to moving pictures.
Speaker: They're their biggest album.
Speaker: And then you have, man, I, I know that.
Speaker: I know that, uh,
Speaker: I know that Ed said this, what these are, but it's like a totem thing.
Speaker: So it's running.
Speaker: So anyway, yes, that's the premium.
Speaker: But it's like taking three different albums and meshing them well together with a different background from a different album as well.
Speaker: When I did my research on Rush Live,
Speaker: One of their things is they had like really intricate intros.
Speaker: If you looked at like their most recent concert before Neil passed away, it was like 2018 in Brazil or somewhere like that.
Speaker: And it was seriously like a five-minute montage.
Speaker: Maybe it wasn't that long.
Speaker: Two-minute montage.
Speaker: of like all their album artwork alive.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like it was moving, it was doing different things.
Speaker: It was goofy.
Speaker: It was, and I felt like that encapsulated, like this artwork did a fantastic job at it.
Speaker: And I love the owl.
Speaker: I think the owl just looks amazing on this artwork.
Speaker: They did a good job.
Speaker: So I wrote very similar to to Iron Maiden, where the the art direction from Iron Maiden was an artist named Derek Riggs.
Speaker: OK.
Speaker: And we all know that Zombie Yeti did it.
Speaker: However, Zombie Yeti was able to stay true to Derek Riggs.
Speaker: And a very similar thing, but take his own take on it.
Speaker: And so it actually fit very well with the imagery of Iron Maiden.
Speaker: I would say that this is probably a little more surprising because it's more of a comic book-y feel.
Speaker: And even hardcore Rush fans are probably not going to be as familiar with the comic book version of them.
Speaker: But I think they did a great job of theme appropriate things.
Speaker: I feel like it was very well balanced.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'm happy with the art.
Speaker: I know there's people have complained that really a ton on it.
Speaker: I don't know why.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It's one of those, it's first world problems, right?
Speaker: You're right.
Speaker: Why did the artwork look like this?
Speaker: However, in fairness,
Speaker: the attention to this art versus the attention to the art on Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Like you can, by far miles and leaps and bounds.
Speaker: You can tell this was an investment, a labor of love.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So you may or may not like that style, but you can tell it definitely was a labor of love.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And that's part of, because like I said, I love love letters to whatever theme you're talking about.
Speaker: Like I said, I can't tell you of any Rush album I've sat down from beginning to finish and actually finished it.
Speaker: But I can usually pick out a good handful of their songs.
Speaker: I can tell you from knowing the top scraping of Rush's surface, this is definitely hitting that love letter on all cylinders.
Speaker: The one thing that will also reassure people is with Iron Maiden, the challenge was is that I definitely know the difference between all the songs.
Speaker: But I also understand if someone who is not a fan of Iron Maiden can say,
Speaker: the music just drove me crazy.
Speaker: I mean, that was Martin Robbins.
Speaker: He, he sold his Iron Maiden Ellie because he's like, after a while, the music just drove him crazy because it is that high tempo.
Speaker: It's going a hundred miles an hour.
Speaker: And it, every song has a very similar vibe.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: You will be surprised by how nuanced and how different rush sounds.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Because they are so prog rock, progressive rock.
Speaker: It tends to be more of,
Speaker: I don't like an orchestral approach or something that is not as it's not basic.
Speaker: And, and really most rock bands are, you know, it's, it's the stereotype, right?
Speaker: Sex, drugs, and rock and roll.
Speaker: And if you watch behind the light of stage, uh,
Speaker: It was Paul Stanley or Gene Simmons because Rush opened for a kiss a lot.
Speaker: And he said at the end of the show, you know, there we were backstage.
Speaker: We were back at the hotel and we had, you know, your typical after show party with, you know, girls and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker: And he said, and Rush were in their rooms reading books.
Speaker: And so it's just a different vibe, like whether or not you agree with it, it's a different vibe and they, their lyrics reflect that.
Speaker: Uh, I actually sent to my brother, uh, if you want to know how amazing the lyrics are, which by the way, we're written by the drummer, right?
Speaker: Um, just go to YouTube and hit rush songs.
Speaker: And there's actually a rush one with the lyrics there and you can read the lyrics along with it.
Speaker: And you can say, wow, that there's way more to that band, the lyrics anyway.
Speaker: than I originally thought.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: So honestly, all in all, I think that rush, I like it.
Speaker: I think, I think they did a great job.
Speaker: Um, I'm not, I don't know.
Speaker: I guess I'm easy to please though.
Speaker: Any new pinball is good pinball, right?
Speaker: Like, okay.
Speaker: But like, what do you think of the play?
Speaker: Like, I love the modifications he did to the, the X-Men theme.
Speaker: I like the diverter path up on top that he did.
Speaker: I do like the washing machine.
Speaker: That is a cool... The time machine, whatever you want to call it.
Speaker: That has the ramp that raises up and down.
Speaker: The double scoop.
Speaker: Double scoop was interesting.
Speaker: I like the left orbit, too.
Speaker: If you hold up the right upper flipper, if you hit that clean and it comes all the way around, it puts it right into the scoop for you so you can lock a ball.
Speaker: I do like...
Speaker: I feel like that's one hard part with Borg is like with Ninja Turtles is you have every shot you have to earn.
Speaker: I like a couple give me shots.
Speaker: I think that's why everyone likes L1 games is because there are hard shots you feel like you have to earn.
Speaker: But there are some give me shots like the T-Rex shot.
Speaker: There's some shot or the spinner shot, you know.
Speaker: So you have a ball lock on the left side.
Speaker: You have, so you have two wire forms and you also have two vacuum formed like pathways.
Speaker: And so I, I'm really curious cause we, we do have a, I've talked with Borg a little bit online and when things calm down a little bit, he's going to come on.
Speaker: And I want to ask him specifically about,
Speaker: When you're choosing ramp, because there is a method to the madness.
Speaker: There's a reason why he specifically chose a vacuum form ramp for two of them and wire form for the other two.
Speaker: And I don't know if it's speed because aesthetically you'd think, well, maybe you just do the same one, but there's, there's a reason for that.
Speaker: And so I'm curious to find out what it is.
Speaker: I feel like this project, it came out on all cylinders and looks great.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So I want to play.
Speaker: I'm glad you got the LE.
Speaker: This gives me an excuse to come to your house here in like a month.
Speaker: And it's, it makes me chuckle though, that you're going to get rush before you even see your Godzilla.
Speaker: Yeah, or a Mando, by the way.
Speaker: You're still waiting for Mando?
Speaker: Still waiting for Mando.
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: So you're guaranteed a rush before almost all the 2021 releases.
Speaker: However, again, people, if you want to get a game and you really are dying to get it, then definitely VLE is the way to get it first.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay, so let's talk about code, though.
Speaker: His last game...
Speaker: um was what was that who tim's no no no sorry so borg's last game yes so it was turtles yes and uh so dwight is great he has a different approach to rule sets he does yep and uh some people really connect with it other people uh find them challenging um so this is i think you're putting it very nicely
Speaker: Well, okay, but I legitimately all rule sets have different styles, right?
Speaker: And it's like an art, right?
Speaker: Everybody has their own designer, everybody has their own coder, everybody has their own art package, you know, so they could put their dream things down.
Speaker: So Bork has worked with a lot of different designers.
Speaker: And so this is interesting because this is the first time he's working with Tim Sexton and Raymond Davidson.
Speaker: And Tim's the lead.
Speaker: But obviously having the world's number one player and having Tim, who is a highly competitive pinball player himself, who comes through it from the tournament approach,
Speaker: How does that make you feel about the game?
Speaker: It makes me excited and nervous at the same time.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Tell me more.
Speaker: The reason being is I'm excited because I feel like we are now starting to gravitate towards this top tier players making code is what is making code amazing right now.
Speaker: It is not hard to argue that Elwin is making fantastic games right now.
Speaker: And it's a lot of it's due to the code direction he goes.
Speaker: um tim did great on led zeppelin i enjoyed the code there and he did great on black knight i thought that was done wonderfully and so it makes me excited because i feel like there's gonna be a lot of depth but that's the problem borg is brutal so how do you explore depth of code when you've got brutal games like borg and that's where we bring in when we were watching the stream it seemed multi-ball heavy right
Speaker: And so I don't know if this is just because it's early code or what's going on here.
Speaker: And they might balance it back a little bit.
Speaker: But I think that's the best way to explore this game is being able to do it through multiball.
Speaker: It probably will be, yes.
Speaker: And I loved that it was a fast game.
Speaker: And I am not the guy who likes to trap and shoot.
Speaker: I'm not that guy.
Speaker: I will do it for games when I need to, but especially on a rock game, you do not want to trap and shoot rock game.
Speaker: You want to keep that pedal to the metal.
Speaker: And so I was really happy and surprised that they were playing and having, I would say, decent ball time.
Speaker: So I guarantee, at least at first, I'm going to close the out lanes out and I'm just going to explore this thing.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And then hopefully as I get better, then I'll start ratcheting that back on the game.
Speaker: Um, yeah, it's the multi-ball.
Speaker: It'll be interesting to see how that's utilized.
Speaker: However, you can definitely change that because like in, um,
Speaker: In tournament Metallica games, a lot of them have modified it.
Speaker: And so, you know, you don't necessarily just have to do one thing or, you know, they may crank it up a little harder or, you know, things like that.
Speaker: And so you can still make this mean for elite players.
Speaker: So I'm not too worried, but I like that scalable.
Speaker: I like that I will, as an above average home player, I'm not a tournament player.
Speaker: I just don't have time.
Speaker: I like that I will still be able to play this game.
Speaker: And I think that that resonates with other people.
Speaker: And the reason I'm saying this is because Rush is a good band.
Speaker: But with the reception that we're seeing right now, I don't know if it's part of just the resurgence in pinball.
Speaker: But you can't tell me that every single person that's ordered this game so far is a diehard Rush fan or all from Canada.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: All the Mountie police or something.
Speaker: Yeah, I'm actually surprised.
Speaker: I'm pleasantly surprised that it doesn't seem to be just hardcore Rush fans.
Speaker: Because I was concerned.
Speaker: And we talked about this before.
Speaker: Would it make a good theme?
Speaker: I'm like, I don't know.
Speaker: And I attribute that again.
Speaker: Listen to Ed Robertson as interview with Nate Shivers.
Speaker: They did a really good job of he, Alex, and Getty all together
Speaker: negotiated the, the song list that it was like, you know, and he, he called him, he's like, give me your bangers.
Speaker: Like you, you hit that and everybody immediately recognizes the song and they are excited to hear it and play it.
Speaker: And they chose really great songs for a rock pinball machine.
Speaker: Well, and it wasn't only like great songs that recognize it was like upbeat songs as well, because we don't want stairway to heaven essentially.
Speaker: Well, and that, yeah, that would be so hard.
Speaker: But they they chose, you know, Rush has 19 studio albums to go from.
Speaker: So they were able to.
Speaker: And I and the amazing thing to me is he said that he, Geddy and Alex had 15 of the same songs out of 20 on their list.
Speaker: And that's how you know, I, these are, okay.
Speaker: Ladies and gentlemen, these are professional musicians.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: They know great songs and Ed knows great pinball.
Speaker: So absolutely.
Speaker: He is going to help guide that.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: And having Ed be.
Speaker: You know, the lead to make sure that in Rush said, we don't know anything about pinball, but you're the pinball guy.
Speaker: So we want a good machine.
Speaker: And that's when you know you're going to get something special in the secret sauce because they are more interested in having a good pinball machine than just having another product with their label on it.
Speaker: I'm right there with you.
Speaker: I was very skeptical on a rush pinball machine, but they have definitely proved me wrong this week.
Speaker: I am very impressed with the product that they've put out.
Speaker: They appeased any fear that I possibly could have had.
Speaker: And absolutely.
Speaker: And having Borg do rush and he knows rush.
Speaker: And so I, I actually was messaging him back and forth and there is a great, um, uh, interview about rush in rolling stones.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So, uh, go and just Google that and look it up.
Speaker: And there is stuff in there that I didn't know about.
Speaker: And so it's a great read.
Speaker: Go ahead if you want to know more about Rush.
Speaker: That's a great read on that.
Speaker: So I think we've talked plenty about Rush.
Speaker: We're 51 minutes in, plus we talked Rush on Triple Drain.
Speaker: Yeah, for 90 minutes on Triple Drain.
Speaker: So go listen to Triple Drain.
Speaker: I do feel like we covered different aspects.
Speaker: Oh, absolutely, yeah.
Speaker: No.
Speaker: So, uh, if you haven't listened to the triple drain episode, don't think it's just us spouting the same stuff over again.
Speaker: Actually, I would say they're very different.
Speaker: Like what we talked about here is very different.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so, um, one other thing I wanted to hit, uh, it is award season and we, I know that we've always joked that we are all for the awards.
Speaker: Like Scott said last year, that's all we do this for, right?
Speaker: Is the money guns and the glory and the awards.
Speaker: And, uh,
Speaker: Honestly, we're joking, but we do appreciate those that felt like we are one of their favorite podcasts that they went and pre-voted for us.
Speaker: And we announced it on our podcast.
Speaker: Like, yeah, we're in the pre-vote.
Speaker: If you want to do it, go for it.
Speaker: But we didn't post it on Facebook or anything, if I remember correctly.
Speaker: I may have had my grandmother ask if she could vote.
Speaker: We're definitely supportive of what Jeff does at this Week in Pinball.
Speaker: I think he has some excellent deep dives.
Speaker: So that's actually where I go when I want to read it.
Speaker: And so... I was very impressed with his Rush deep dive.
Speaker: He did a great job.
Speaker: Oh, absolutely.
Speaker: And so, okay, we are not underplaying it.
Speaker: I think it's a very worthwhile thing.
Speaker: We also don't want to be accused of
Speaker: of
Speaker: inappropriately influencing the voting, I guess that's correct.
Speaker: So we want to make sure I have the same attitude as like Martin and Jeff over at final round.
Speaker: I think it's one of those things like we really appreciate the support and everything, but we, we do this content because we enjoy doing this.
Speaker: And because you guys like to listen, interact with us, we don't do it because it's twippy time and we have fun.
Speaker: We need to vote legitimately.
Speaker: This is, this is one of the best parts of the week for me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: i agree and uh i thank you thank you for support i was surprised that we made made it's because we got slap saved last year and yeah um and and shout out to final round to jeff and martin for not making it i know i know they don't give a crap but uh
Speaker: Yeah, between that.
Speaker: Okay, but come on.
Speaker: It feels good.
Speaker: There's a little validation for what you do.
Speaker: It's awesome that Pinball Profile made it.
Speaker: And the reason being is Jeff has been doing this for how many years now?
Speaker: And he has shined lights on aspects of this hobby and this industry that don't get lights shown on very often at all.
Speaker: And so it's very cool to listen to a pinball profile that is timeless and go back and find an interview that just, I didn't know anything about this person.
Speaker: Jeff was talking about them two years ago and you go and get a deep dive on this person.
Speaker: You know, it just, it shines a light on, on this wonderful hobby.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I'll just put that away.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, but no, thank you.
Speaker: Thank you, uh, for voting us.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: we're definitely not, we know we won't be the number one, which is fine.
Speaker: It's not a big deal.
Speaker: Well, okay.
Speaker: We may be go vote, go vote, go vote.
Speaker: Uh, no, no.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But, um, but legitimately get your plumber to vote.
Speaker: Oh, wait, I am a plumber.
Speaker: Nevermind.
Speaker: Get your, get your anesthesiologist to vote.
Speaker: Get your plumber to vote.
Speaker: Get your HVAC guy to vote.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Scott, while you're sitting on your phone during my surgery, I need you to go to, I'll do it between cases.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: Um, yeah.
Speaker: So anyway, it's, uh,
Speaker: But it's good.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: So what are you thinking?
Speaker: Do you want to go through some of these things?
Speaker: Let's be honest.
Speaker: I've already said this to other people.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: 2021 was not a fantastic year for pinball.
Speaker: 2020 was actually pretty impressive.
Speaker: But 2021, it's coming down to Godzilla and Mandalorian, in my opinion.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: However, I think that I was surprised because there are aspects that I'm like, you know what?
Speaker: I didn't really consider that.
Speaker: And so so let's just we're not going to go down every category.
Speaker: OK.
Speaker: But what I do want to do is, first off, I want to talk about.
Speaker: you know, we, and we talked about this in, in this week in pinball and the, the Twippy.
Speaker: So, um, theme.
Speaker: So of all the themes that just came out, which one where you're like, yes, that theme needs to be done.
Speaker: Out of 2021.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Out of last year, yes.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: The theme that I was shocked and actually was impressed.
Speaker: Okay, surprise theme that they did.
Speaker: Okay, we can do that.
Speaker: Surprise theme they did and the one that you're like, yes, absolutely.
Speaker: Like, that is a perfect theme.
Speaker: Well, it was a surprise when I heard it.
Speaker: I said, yes, that's the one they needed to do was Mandalorian.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I was actually surprised.
Speaker: But then again, I'm not a huge horror movie fan, so Halloween doesn't do it for me.
Speaker: And I don't know much Japanese film.
Speaker: I knew who Ultraman was, but I can't tell you.
Speaker: I have no idea.
Speaker: Led Zeppelin's a good band, but that pin does nothing for me.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Just theme alone, though.
Speaker: That's what I'm saying.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So theme-wise, Led Zeppelin doesn't hit it for me.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I would say my one and two would be Mandalorian and Led Zeppelin coming up because Led Zeppelin, great.
Speaker: Everybody's listened to Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: But Mandalorian, it was one of those themes that it's kind of like Guardians of the Galaxy where...
Speaker: you're like, that's actually a, a current thing that so many people right now are talking about.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's challenging because Stern has been, well, pinball has been burned by thinking a theme is going to be great.
Speaker: And then just, you know, the Johnny mnemonic thing, right.
Speaker: Where they think it's going to be great.
Speaker: So they make a pinball machine and then they look at it and they're like, Ooh, so.
Speaker: As Gomez is leaving the theater.
Speaker: He's like, can we get out of this?
Speaker: Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so, yeah, I think that for theme alone, Mandalorian, hands down.
Speaker: Yes, that is the right thing.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, and this is hard because of lockdown, I haven't gotten out to play everything, but I've been able to watch streams on it and things like that.
Speaker: So, like animations and display.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So what do you think?
Speaker: I still think Godzilla takes this one, even though Mandalorian, the clips are good, but it's a lot of like two, three seconds of it.
Speaker: And then it's like a freeze frame with a color change.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I feel like I enjoy the Godzilla ones more because they're cheesy and they just, they fit the theme.
Speaker: And watching when you're hitting that inner loop and it's coming back and you're getting that dude's head to spin.
Speaker: That's fantastic.
Speaker: Those animations, I feel like, are top notch over everything else that's come out.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I may be an outlier on this one.
Speaker: I think Sorcerer's Apprentice.
Speaker: No, I can see that.
Speaker: It's I, it's a different degree.
Speaker: And I understand why people may think may have issues with P3.
Speaker: I understand it is a different version of pinball.
Speaker: It is not your standard version of pinball, but being able to integrate a ball with the animations on the play field and on the screen, it, it,
Speaker: It's challenging.
Speaker: And I remember playing that with you at expo and I thought, wow, they like, this is really clever and fun.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: It's, I, I don't, it's not going to be for everyone, but I, I felt the animations and display.
Speaker: I gave it to P3.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: No, I, yeah, I can see it.
Speaker: I will not argue with you on that one.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So a light show.
Speaker: I'm still Godzilla.
Speaker: I think there's a lot of cool lights.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I put Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: I put the- And I can see that.
Speaker: I put the interact, like the interact.
Speaker: And obviously this is the next step with what JJP did with Guns N' Roses, right?
Speaker: I know it was kind of simultaneously developed.
Speaker: I'm sure that the word got out and they figured out ways of doing the chicken or the egg, right?
Speaker: but um i'm man if you don't have those light bars on led zeppelin it is a completely different game yeah true so that that's why i chose that one so and like i said i'm not going to argue that that one as well but i just i feel like uh it's just something about godzilla it's the spinning of the mecha godzilla the light show there it's just i feel like there's a lot of integration that makes that game come to life okay i and i love godzilla too right
Speaker: I struggle with toys and gimmicks.
Speaker: Because I'm not really... Hands down with Godzilla.
Speaker: Like, really, what else do you have?
Speaker: You have a spinner that comes out of the playfield?
Speaker: What, Mandalorian?
Speaker: You've got the rotating playfield?
Speaker: Godzilla, you've got an up-and-down skyscraper that changes... Okay, yeah, I'm just saying, like, toys and gimmicks, I'm not even sure what... Like, what does that mean?
Speaker: Like, when people say best toy in a game, I'm always like, what are you, like...
Speaker: What are you talking about?
Speaker: Like, what is a toy?
Speaker: Like, is it something that's unique to it?
Speaker: Like guide me, Josh, help me.
Speaker: Dave fixed me.
Speaker: Tell me what I should.
Speaker: I'm missing here.
Speaker: So when I look at, I've got, I've got four games in front of me.
Speaker: I've got Avengers.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: If I were to look at a toy on there, it's almost, it would be the Avengers tower.
Speaker: Something that is aesthetically very close to like the theme.
Speaker: Visually identifiable.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You know, I'm going to, I'm going to summarize it like this.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: A toy or a gimmick is something plucked directly from the theme and
Speaker: and somehow then inserted into the game and made to interact with the game.
Speaker: Like Ninja Turtles, Turtle Van.
Speaker: That was plucked directly.
Speaker: Theme specific.
Speaker: The Turtle Van was plucked directly from the TV series and it was put in the game and the balls divert through it.
Speaker: Look at the T-Rex on Jurassic Park is plucked directly from the movie.
Speaker: It's something that...
Speaker: is visually identifiable to that and then world cup soccer you've got a goalie that moves back and forth and you got a big soccer ball that spins so toys and gimmicks to me are something that you would for that theme is plucked directly out of the real world or out of that out of that movie the book whatever it may be and it is placed directly on the play field and when you look at the play field you go hey that's baby yoda or you go hey uh um
Speaker: I don't know why I keep thinking Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: Like with Mando, you've got the Razorcrest.
Speaker: When I think toys and gimmicks, that's what I think of as that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So now we talked about theme.
Speaker: Let's talk about theme integration.
Speaker: Godzilla.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, okay.
Speaker: Tell me Godzilla versus Mandalorian then.
Speaker: Because that would be my one and two.
Speaker: So with Godzilla, I feel like the theme integration is a lot better because you have a destroyable skyscraper.
Speaker: You have the Mechagodzilla that grabs the ball.
Speaker: You have a destroying bridge.
Speaker: You have that Magna grab.
Speaker: Yeah, that Newton ball thing, which is awesome.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I mean, heck, look at when you drain and you get the shoot again, it's Godzilla kicking his little boy back into the place.
Speaker: You know, and it's so funny because it is, it is comical.
Speaker: I mean, it's these, these, these dudes in rubber suits and absolutely you're right.
Speaker: And the tag team clips are fantastic.
Speaker: They're just, everything drips and uses.
Speaker: And don't get me wrong.
Speaker: Mandalorian's theme is integrated fairly well with the episodes, with the clips and stuff like that.
Speaker: Honestly, I don't feel like the upper play field.
Speaker: I feel like it takes away from the game more than when it adds to it.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And that's why I think that Godzilla is better at theme integration than Mandalorian.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Best music and sound effects.
Speaker: Do you go with the give me here?
Speaker: Like I feel the same with carry.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like music, sound effects.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I'm going to play the music takes priority card here.
Speaker: So the Led Zeppelin does.
Speaker: And I'll put Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: See, that's the problem.
Speaker: I feel the same as Carrie Hardy.
Speaker: Like this music was never made for pinball.
Speaker: It was made for mass consumption.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: But, but guns and roses won last year.
Speaker: And it's basically the guns and roses entire catalog.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: But the, it,
Speaker: I can see it going both ways.
Speaker: I can see it being like, yes, it is integrated into the game.
Speaker: It is music.
Speaker: It wasn't necessarily made for the pinball machine, but then I feel bad for people like Jerry Thompson that spends all this time integrating and, and putting original music into a pinball machine and making it work.
Speaker: And it's, well, okay.
Speaker: We both met Jerry and Jerry is awesome.
Speaker: And okay.
Speaker: I don't think Jerry would have any problem with me saying that Led Zeppelin music is iconic.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so I'm going to take the icon over his stuff, even though love you, Jerry.
Speaker: Good stuff.
Speaker: So I would not be shocked if it's Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I still, I do like, and yeah, it just, I'm going to leave it at that.
Speaker: Cause it's going to sound very contradictory if I, if I go into what I was going to say.
Speaker: So I'm just going to, I'm just going to leave it at that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Best call outs.
Speaker: I thought the,
Speaker: Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: No, I think Godzilla is all multiball.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's the best British man I've ever heard of.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's like a Simpsons character.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I, I call, I said Mandalorian.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I, I think that Apollo Creed doing the, doing the call outs.
Speaker: I mean, he's, he's a great actor and he was perfect for that role.
Speaker: So I, I'm actually going to call that.
Speaker: I think you're going to say Godzilla.
Speaker: I think Godzilla and it's because of the, the, the reporter.
Speaker: Good golly, Miss Molly.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh no, no.
Speaker: It's, it's appropriate level campy because it's self-aware.
Speaker: I totally get it.
Speaker: Um, but I, I'm just going to say I'll take a Carl Weathers.
Speaker: And I don't blame you there.
Speaker: I don't blame you there.
Speaker: Sorry.
Speaker: Maybe I guess I like Godzilla.
Speaker: I can't wait for mine to show up.
Speaker: I know, right?
Speaker: I need new pinball, gosh dang it.
Speaker: It's been too long.
Speaker: Seriously, you and Keith Elwin and Godzilla, it's the Archer meme.
Speaker: And if you don't know what it is, just Google it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay, best rules.
Speaker: I think we're both in agreement on this one.
Speaker: Godzilla?
Speaker: Godzilla, yeah.
Speaker: Or Led Zeppelin?
Speaker: Let's go.
Speaker: You know what, Kay?
Speaker: I actually like the rules of Led Zeppelin.
Speaker: No, I'm not saying I don't.
Speaker: I'm just saying that Godzilla definitely is the farthest creator.
Speaker: The problem is Godzilla, because the entire theme works better than it gets the nod.
Speaker: But I actually put Led Zeppelin as second because I thought it did such a good job.
Speaker: And I put Mandalorian as third because I really...
Speaker: Stern does have the best rule sets out there.
Speaker: They do.
Speaker: And especially in this year's running, like it's, it's definitely dominated by a storm.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Best play field and layout.
Speaker: I mean, come on.
Speaker: I've been saying it.
Speaker: Come on.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: You can say it too.
Speaker: It's Godzilla.
Speaker: Go, go, go, Godzilla.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I would give an honorable mention to, to Jack and Jurassic park.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I was pleasantly surprised with, I think that he, okay.
Speaker: He surprised me given that he, given that I had not, I had no expectations whatsoever.
Speaker: that game is fun.
Speaker: And it's very fun.
Speaker: And given the limited budget he did that on, I actually thought that was... I just didn't even know what to expect, so I didn't have any other expectations.
Speaker: So... Okay, so best artwork.
Speaker: Okay, how are you going to... I like me some Zombie Yeti.
Speaker: Okay, this is where I'm going to... I'm going to vote for Zombie Yeti also.
Speaker: However...
Speaker: Close.
Speaker: Like it's, it's a coin flip because I think the, um, that, uh, Martinez did such a great job of Mandalorian too.
Speaker: Yeah, no, I agree with you there.
Speaker: So that actually, oh man, I wish I could, I wish I could possibly say a tie on that one.
Speaker: Because I love the artists that they've got for Stern.
Speaker: All of them are doing so good right now.
Speaker: They really are firing on all centers.
Speaker: I'm going to put Halloween as an honorable mention.
Speaker: Because I think, okay, full disclosure, in the Pinball Industry Awards, they actually had it separated for best play field artwork and best cabinet artwork.
Speaker: So best cabinet and back glass artwork.
Speaker: I voted for Halloween.
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: Really?
Speaker: Yeah, I did because I the reason why I say that is based on that picture alone, spooky sold out.
Speaker: Yeah, it's probably true.
Speaker: So that was so I'm looking at the the most valuable player on the machine.
Speaker: And that's exactly what it came down to.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So a game of the year is, I think we can, we can say is Godzilla.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Halloween.
Speaker: Yeah, man.
Speaker: I, I, I wish Halloween were better.
Speaker: I really do.
Speaker: It just, I feel crestfallen when I think about it.
Speaker: So I guess the other question too, is do we see a change?
Speaker: It seems like it's been the kind of the same thing for the last few years.
Speaker: Uh,
Speaker: in the entertainment section of twippies, are we going to still see straight down the middle take YouTube like they have since the beginning dead flip take since the beginning on streaming?
Speaker: Can I take pinball podcasting?
Speaker: Uh, or are we going to see any shake up there?
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Straight down the mill has done less videos this year compared to what they have in previous years.
Speaker: Deadflip has been doing a lot less, but then we did find out he became an official employee of Stern.
Speaker: Yeah, so I think things are going.
Speaker: I would probably say, I mean, streamer, there are more things now.
Speaker: I think the challenge is for people to beat it, you're probably going to...
Speaker: have to develop a carve out a following that differentiates and i don't know how you do that yeah um i we we know that fox cities does a great job um we know that i'm buffalo pinball basically does a great job too it's multiple people streaming uh flipping out pen i all these guys they are they are great at that yeah um
Speaker: I would argue the most with streamer, though, I'm guessing it's going to be Carl D'Angelo.
Speaker: And the reason why I say that is because he had the most iconic moment last year when he got to the end of Halloween and it crashed on him.
Speaker: And he's just kind of like, and Carl's an elite player too.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I don't know.
Speaker: The problem is they all seem very close, right?
Speaker: The products seem very, they're great.
Speaker: But I don't know.
Speaker: I don't know what else to think.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So what do you think?
Speaker: I think we still see more of the same.
Speaker: I think these people have made quite the following and quite the fan base.
Speaker: It's a very strong fan base.
Speaker: They'll follow through previous years.
Speaker: I was going to say a lot of people are just happy to be on the nominee list.
Speaker: It doesn't bother me one bit.
Speaker: It doesn't validate what we do
Speaker: You know, I, I've going to expo, I just, it was weird to see how far that you and I have come.
Speaker: Meeting people, carving out our little niche in our, in our podcast and earning the respect of those in the industry.
Speaker: And, you know, by and far, I would, I, I just love that we have done that for ourselves.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's really cool to walk up to George, George Gomez.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I was like, you probably don't know who I am.
Speaker: And he's like, I know who you are, Josh.
Speaker: Like you're from loser kid.
Speaker: And it's like, Oh,
Speaker: And, you know, when he says he wants to come on your show because he respects what you do and he'd be more than happy to come shoot the breeze with us, that made me feel like we'd made it, you know?
Speaker: We have an interview that we're working out that will hopefully happen by the end of the month.
Speaker: And if the person does decide to join us on the show, I mean, that'll make me feel like we've made it.
Speaker: You know what I'm saying?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I...
Speaker: And I love that we, when we went to expo, like every person that we talked to, we have, we received positive feedback from them.
Speaker: And most of the people we talked to, I'm like, we want to get you on the show.
Speaker: And we still do.
Speaker: It is challenging to find like the right time to put that person in.
Speaker: Especially when we do really 24 to 25 episodes a year.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And so it just kind of depends, but really it's,
Speaker: It's kind of surprising to me because this for me, podcasting, this is what we do like podcasting.
Speaker: It's, it's like you and I talk three times a week and we probably message each other about every day.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, and it just feels like I'm calling a friend and talking about a, a fun thing we do.
Speaker: That is a nice distraction from the, the challenges of daily life.
Speaker: I agree.
Speaker: So it's, it feels surprising to me that, that anybody else enjoys listening to it just because it just seems like, you know, calling up a friend and talking, I guess.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I'm glad I, and I appreciate every single person who has been in that silent chair position and has just enjoyed what we've talked about.
Speaker: It really does.
Speaker: Well,
Speaker: I want to give a quick shout out to your point, to your point.
Speaker: Here you go.
Speaker: Ready for this?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, I don't know if you guys saw on the Facebook page, I got a smartwatch for Christmas.
Speaker: My wife wanted me, I've always had a Fitbit cause I just, I just want to see what the time is and maybe a quick text so that way I don't have to pull out my phone.
Speaker: And, uh, I got a smartwatch and then I figured out how to make your own face on, on the smartwatch.
Speaker: So I made a loser kid one, very basic, just something that would have been fun, uh, free for anyone to download.
Speaker: And I received a message from a pin cider, 6.5 degrees.
Speaker: Really nice dude.
Speaker: He, he sent us, I've downloaded a facer.
Speaker: I've searched, there's a kid.
Speaker: I'm not coming up with anything regardless.
Speaker: You're a loyal listener.
Speaker: And I'm like, I don't like, wait, what?
Speaker: Yeah, it's, it's super nice.
Speaker: And seriously, I, I, I'm, I'm just happy that for, okay.
Speaker: I,
Speaker: I'll get a little into the weeds here.
Speaker: I've always felt like the mill house.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: I've always felt like I was never the guy that people hung out with.
Speaker: I just happened to be around someone who was more charismatic than me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: No, I get you.
Speaker: And so this is kind of a shout out to anybody who else has felt like that in their life.
Speaker: And if,
Speaker: If they want to come and hang out and we can be the mill houses and just know that I, I don't care if anybody else thinks you're cool.
Speaker: I think you're cool.
Speaker: And it's just, it's fun to make a, a seat at the table for anybody who's willing to come.
Speaker: And you're valued and you're important to me and you're important to Josh.
Speaker: And so that's been the biggest thing that I've appreciated throughout this whole process is that on some level, we have made a connection with someone.
Speaker: And even if it's just one episode, we have appreciated the ride.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Obviously, we were appreciated enough that we got at least 100 votes or 100 plus votes to be a Twippy nominee.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And so it still shocks me every morning when I wake up and my phone alerts me because since I made that watch face, it will tell me when someone's actually synced to their watch.
Speaker: I still haven't done it.
Speaker: I have the Apple Watch.
Speaker: That's funny.
Speaker: So you haven't done it.
Speaker: So there's people that isn't us that is sinking this.
Speaker: It's free, but it's still.
Speaker: I am not the most technically savvy guy out there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: Anywho.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So, but my point being is in high school, I would have never thought that like, like I was in a touring band.
Speaker: I opened for bands.
Speaker: I always felt like the opener.
Speaker: I never felt like the headliner.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And so it's cool that we've, like I said, we've carved out our little corner in this hobby and it's cool where we've come over these last three years.
Speaker: And I appreciate that.
Speaker: Appreciate a lot of the friendships.
Speaker: I will not a lot.
Speaker: I appreciate all the friendships that we've made along the way.
Speaker: And it's still mind boggling me to me that people that I never would have thought of that I would ever talk to message me on a weekly basis.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And I can't tell you how many people, friends, genuine friends that we have met through this process.
Speaker: I appreciate those.
Speaker: There was a lot that reached out this last Wednesday.
Speaker: I don't know if you saw my Facebook post.
Speaker: My dog that we've had for 12 years, she has been battling cancer.
Speaker: And she was old enough to the point that they just couldn't do surgery on her anymore.
Speaker: And it was let her enjoy her last few months because the cancer is going to take her.
Speaker: And, uh, and Tuesday morning, we woke up to the, the scary realization that it was, it was time.
Speaker: And, uh, she wasn't eating, she wasn't drinking, she was vomiting blood everywhere.
Speaker: And, uh, we had to make that, that decision of, of, do we let her keep living this life or, you know?
Speaker: And so finally my wife and I gave our kids one more night with our dog and, uh, we said goodbye to her on Wednesday.
Speaker: And it was probably one of the hardest things, um,
Speaker: I've done, I like, I haven't lost a kid or anything like that.
Speaker: I can't ever imagine that, but losing a pet when it's been a part of your family for 12 years is rough.
Speaker: And especially in that way, when you lose them to something like cancer, it just, it's even that much harder.
Speaker: And, uh, I appreciate everyone that reached out.
Speaker: Holy crap.
Speaker: Like I didn't realize how many people actually cared and sharing their stories.
Speaker: Uh, I appreciate when people share their stories because, uh,
Speaker: They know where I know where they're coming from and like, don't ever feel like you're turning into yourself or whatever.
Speaker: Like if you want to share your story, go ahead.
Speaker: But no, I, a lot of it was people from this community and I appreciate that.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I, and I, I message you too, but when you hearing you tell it, it reminds me of my dog who,
Speaker: I lovingly referred to him as my step dog because when I married my wife, he was eight years old.
Speaker: But we had him for another, well, I guess he was probably 10 years old.
Speaker: So we had him for another seven years.
Speaker: And he was an old dog, but we noticed that he was getting down.
Speaker: And I went to work and my wife had said, we're going to take him in just to see
Speaker: And so I was working and she calls me and says, we're putting him down.
Speaker: And my kids were crying and I was crying.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it's hard.
Speaker: So my heart goes out to you and it's been...
Speaker: It's been four or five years now, but it still brings back memories that part of you is gone.
Speaker: Well, and just even realize it was, she's laying there on the table and just realizing this is the last time I was going to fill her fur and just pet her.
Speaker: A lot of times at night, as soon as I got home, she would sit by my side and make sure that I pet her head.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And me realizing that wasn't ever going to happen ever again.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: time is short advantage of it while you're on this earth.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Tell those that you haven't talked to in a while that you love them and make sure they're doing okay.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I think that's a good point to stop.
Speaker: Let's wrap it up before we become crying messes on this show and whatnot.
Speaker: But thank you.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: And I haven't got a chance to send the reward back for even, you know, when we had Zach on.
Speaker: I've been so busy, but I haven't forgot about you.
Speaker: And we will definitely get your swag bag out from loser kid out.
Speaker: So thank you guys so much.
Speaker: And certainly we, we always appreciate it.
Speaker: If you share, share us and share our thoughts, we certainly want to connect with everybody we can.
Speaker: And as always, everybody is welcome to the table.
Speaker: Yep.
Speaker: Always judge a person upon their character and on and on anything else.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: If you want to get ahold of us, we are loser kid pinball podcast at gmail.com.
Speaker: It is better to get ahold of us at loser kid pinball on Facebook or our individual accounts at Scott Larson or Josh Roop.
Speaker: We're also on Instagram, Twitter, and Twitch.
Speaker: If you want our direct links, go to soundcloud.com slash loser kid pinball podcast.
Speaker: I think that pretty much wraps it up for us.
Speaker: You got anything else for us, Scott?
Speaker: No, just looking forward to another two weeks and really happy that Rush is going to be awesome.
Speaker: And you're probably going to get a lot of guests that are Rush-centric over the next little bit.
Speaker: And that's just because I'm a total fanboy.
Speaker: Nothing wrong with it.
Speaker: So, all right.
Speaker: Talk to you later, Scott.
Speaker: Okay, see ya.
Speaker: Shut up and sit down.
