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Sounders needed a win exactly like that one
1.6k Plays2 months ago
Apparently, the Sounders are good again.
Coming off that frustrating tie with the Earthquakes, the Sounders got back to their winning ways with a professional win over the houston Dynamo.
There wasn’t really anything special or impressive about their 1-0 win, but it was maybe more important that way as they showed they could both beat a team they are likely to face in the playoffs and held on for a one-goal victory.
They’re now officially in the playoffs, control their destiny for home-field advantage in the first round and have a lot to play for in these final three games.
Mark Kastner fills in for Aaron, along with Jeremiah.
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Transcript
Sponsorship by Fullpool Wines
00:00:02
Speaker
This episode of Nos Arietes is sponsored by Fullpool Wines, a Seattle-based wine retailer and proud sponsor of Nos Arietes since 2011. Fullpool was founded in 2009, is based in Seattle, and is owned and operated by longtime Sounders supporters. They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, Pacific Northwest.
Will Bruin Joins Sounder at Heart Network
00:00:25
Speaker
Hi, I'm Will Bruin, and I was just recognized as a Seattle Sounders legend. Now I get to do voice reads for the sounder at heart podcast network.
00:00:40
Speaker
about sell it um
00:01:16
Speaker
This is fucking awesome. This is a Let's go to Southern bro.
00:01:30
Speaker
ever since Sounder at Heart brought a commentary that we didn't take over seriously. Ghost of Seattle!
Episode Introduction and Guest Host Mark Kastner
00:01:41
Speaker
Welcome to another episode of NOS Adietes, sponsored by Fullpool Wines and the Sounder at Heart subscribers. We're recording on Monday, September 30th, 2024. I am your host, Jeremiah Shan. Aaron is on vacation, so friend of the show, Mark Kastner, is here to fill in.
Sounders vs. Houston Dynamo Recap
00:01:58
Speaker
Well, I guess the Sounders are good again. Coming off that frustrating tie with the Earthquakes, the Sounders got back to their winning ways with the professional win over the Houston Dynamo. There wasn't really anything special or impressive about their 1-0 win, but it was maybe more important that way as they showed they could both beat a team that they're likely to face in the playoffs and held on for a one goal victory.
00:02:18
Speaker
They're now officially in the playoffs, control their destiny for home field advantage in the first round and have a lot to play for in these final three games. Mark, what did you make of this win and what do you think it says about ah this team going forward?
Playoff Atmosphere Discussion
00:02:33
Speaker
Yeah, I think the game itself had like a very playoff feel to it, at least watching on TV. I don't know. I agree i agree i don't know if it was the same being in the stadium or in the press box or whatever, but I just think like the stakes were evident, ah even if you have to like bend reality a little bit, because they would have qualified regardless of what they did on Saturday night. But it does feel good that their sounders kind of took matters into their own hands and didn't. It would have felt not great to kind of like back into the playoffs. like Yeah, like absolutely. But yeah, I just thought it was like a really professional performance. I think there's
00:03:13
Speaker
you know, kind of listening to what Spencer has to say after the game and just kind of like picking up on context clues. I think they pretty much know that the perfect version of this team is probably not going to show up this year, but i I still do believe that the version of the team that the coach can get this team to show up is good enough to do some damage and and potentially capable of making some special moments in a year that's been um lacking in them. Let's put it that way.
00:03:48
Speaker
yeah and And it's funny that that you say that because this is a team, because I think that's that's a pretty good summation, I think, of how we've talked about the team, of how the vibe around the team is.
Sounders' Performance Since June
00:03:59
Speaker
And yet you go back to June 15th, which is the 2-0 win over Minnesota United. And there's actually a story on Center at Hurt right now that is available to paid subscribers.
00:04:14
Speaker
that sort of details ah how the Sounders have turned the season around. But they're 10-2-2 now in league play in that time. I'm not saying this is going to happen. And there's a lot of distance between where they are now and and getting to this point. But if they were to win their last three games, they would probably finish second or third in the West. They would have one of the best second half performances in MLS history. I think they would, they would only be two points worse than they were in 2018, which is the best second half performance in MLS history.
00:04:48
Speaker
Uh, and yet it doesn't really feel like they're hitting on all cylinders. It doesn't feel like they are like they've they've played some attractive soccer at times. dave you know But they've also had a lot of frustrating moment they've seemingly had more frustration than then celebration this year. And that's a lot because they've kind of run face first into LAFC at every chance that they've had a chance to do that. And that sort of, I think, is what is looming over all of this. But it's funny, I don't i don't know. i have a heart It's funny, I have a hard time reconciling reconciling that this has both been
00:05:27
Speaker
Basically the best team in MLS since that June 15th game. And yet it also feels like it's been a slog and really frustrating. Yeah, I do suppose that if that other shoe does drop in two months or six weeks or whatever it is, right then I think you and I probably both naturally have a different feel about how the season went, especially if it's LAFC that takes them out in the playoffs. Yeah. Well, takes them out in the playoffs last season and every competition this season, right? Basically like four straight knockout competitions or whatever whatever it is. Um, but yeah, it's, it's a little weird because
00:06:11
Speaker
Typically in kind of like the way and MLS functions is turnarounds like this tend to happen when you fire a coach or sign a player. Right. they down there other here And it's just kind of like they got healthy.
00:06:27
Speaker
yeah They got healthy and they they sort of, they did make some tactical tweaks. And I think yeah we Brian's story does a good job of, but they are like tweaks. They're not dramatic changes. I mean, basically it's inserting Paul Rothrock into the starting lineup. It's slightly changing the way that you asked the right back to play. And it's, I mean, and it's, and it's maybe giving a little bit more attacking freedom to ah Obed Vargas, but there's not, these are not dramatic changes. These are really tweaks.
00:06:56
Speaker
Yeah. And, oh and like having theoretically your best player be somewhat healthy for a run of games does actually matter, believe it or not. Yeah. yeah the page in your i Are you talking about Pedro de la Vega? Yes. yeah i mean Even though he's not really contributing, the fact that he's on the field does seem to help.
00:07:15
Speaker
Yeah, the quote on it's the quote unquote best player. It's the like, right? Yeah, yeah. No, I got it for a lot of money. He's hardly played the season. I think our best player is obviously Albert Rusnak. And I think it's crazy that people even have conversations about his contract worth. I mean, he's been. Yeah.
00:07:33
Speaker
You know, it it is it is funny if you even if you just go back and you look at their performance since he got healthy, which was around game five or six of the season. Like, I think his first really healthy game was the five zero win over Montreal. And if if you just even can if you just look at their season since then, it's it's been ah a pretty good season again outside of those LFC games. Yeah. And I do think it's like um It is interesting that this team so obviously needed...
00:08:09
Speaker
something to change because it was kind of a it was a slog there for a long time. And it it was even a it was even more of a slog while things were also turning around because people didn't know that they were turning around yet. So I think i think that the feeling around this team is different in the last, say, like seven games when you just voted out 14 games. so um because like an narratives take a lot longer to shift than like actual facts. yeah yeah yeah yeah um But it is just interesting seeing players play in positions that you know are their best positions.
00:08:51
Speaker
bye you've for some reason one you know one reason or another haven't seen them there like for instance earlier this season I didn't think Christian Roldan looked like a starter playing right mid he looked slow he wasn't he's not creative enough out on the wing there's there was like no dynamic relationship with his brother playing right back then Alex gets hurt a little bit. Christian plays right back and it's like completely different. And then now now that he's settled into like a central midfield role, which I think is is his best position. It seems and that at this point, I think it would be crazy to suggest anything otherwise, right?
00:09:34
Speaker
Yeah, he just looks like he looks faster in that area of the pitch than he ever did on the wing, which makes sense. Yeah, obviously wingers are and fullbacks are faster than central midfielder players, but that dynamic aspect of his play that we've gotten so used to since he seven, eight years since he's been here. It's like back now that he's just like he like physically he is 10 to 15 yards in a different spot on the field and he just looks like it like a completely refreshed different type of player. Right. And it's and it's even sort of a similar with the the funny thing. I mean, I guess it's it's maybe unfair to say that it's a similar role to what he was kind of asked to do as a right winger because he was sort of
00:10:21
Speaker
He was playing inside so much, but he's he's I guess he's playing deeper now than he was then. He's he's essentially replacing Jel Paolo at this point. And he's arriving into the play just completely differently. So when he was on on the right wing, yeah he was often the...
00:10:42
Speaker
like the start of a play, like in the start of that kind of like action, if you will, where now he is able to be involved deeper in buildup, which I think Better suits his strengths the older he gets because he's just such an intelligent player. And then also once the ball has finally arrived into taking action in and around the box, he's able to arrive to the ball instead of being stood still and receiving it. And I think that just makes a huge difference for the type of player he is.
Jordan Morris' Impact as Number Nine
00:11:17
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's that's probably true. I suppose we should also mention, and we've talked about this on the show before, but the other big change that happened at that same time was Jordan Morris moving into the number nine spot and really sort of taking ownership of that spot, which we've seen, man, ah and that's a a big part of this this story as well, is is Jordan has just really I would say statistically it's almost silly to debate whether or not he's better as a nine right now. Like you can go back and take the way he played at the end of last year and you combine it with the way he's played this year and you have the equivalent of a full season of ah performance at the number nine and he is performing
00:11:58
Speaker
at ah at an elite level, he's scoring at an elite level. Yet it was funny, i we were talking with someone in the press box, and Tim and I were talking with someone in the press box on Saturday about this very thing. And and I think it it sort of, I think, illustrated what people's concern with Morris at the nine is, and it's sort of vibes. It's, it's, well, he hasn't scored in big games, which is, which is true. Like he hasn't, he hasn't scored recently against LAFC. He has only one career goal against the timbers. And I think those are the really the games where you want to see your number nine come through. Those are also games coincidentally that Rollroy Diaz has this great history of scoring against LAFC and the timbers.
00:12:41
Speaker
So Morris hasn't done that. But ah aside from that sort of semi statistical point, Morris has really been it's it's really just like, oh, he just doesn't give off that number nine energy the way that they want him to. But he has been really outstanding as a number nine this year. Yeah, but I would even push back on that, like.
00:13:06
Speaker
that narrative that he doesn't show up in big games. Like on the way to the 2019 MLS cup, he scores a hat trick against Dallas. He's torched the galaxy previously. There's a ton of playoff goals. Yeah. A ton of big goals against the galaxy. You're right. Going even back further to 2016, he has like a Jordan, like flu game, Michael Jordan, like not Jordan Morris against against the rapids. He scores a goal where it,
00:13:33
Speaker
I think he even like injured his knee. um I mean, he definitely took a nasty hit. Yeah. yeah like and In his defense, nobody on this team shows up against LAOC or the Timbers anymore. What's the point in arguing that? yeah i mean i and I do think that that speaks more to a failing of the depth of talent. like the What the Sounders really need is another high-end player. and i don't and I think that we've gotten really focused on saying that needs to be a number nine and we don't need to go
00:14:10
Speaker
too far down this because we we got into this last week. But I, I, I think this was just another example, another, another point in the favor of saying of like, it's not that Jordan can't be the number nine. It's that the sounders just need another good attacking player, another goal, dangerous player. And sort of the player who is emerged right now is Paul Rothrock as you know, he's hit the sample size is still small.
00:14:38
Speaker
But this is a player who now has six goals and four assists against MLS competition in league's play and MLS regular season. You you combine between those two competitions, he's averaging basically 0.67 goal contributions per 90 minutes. that's That's very, you know, that's great. That's very, very good. That's right in line with, you know, Albert and Jordan Morris. And if he can continue that,
00:15:08
Speaker
that you know That's really all you can ask, I suppose, at least for now. And I thought, you know, Rothrock had the goal in this game. He was at least in the first half in the middle of all their dangerous chances. He continues to just put in big performances. It's very impressive. Yeah, I think it's it's so interesting that um him as a player has emerged as like the answer on the left wing, which has primarily been the black hole for the Sounders since.
00:15:46
Speaker
I mean, there's knock-on effects, but you could go all the way back into last season where Morris was having to play out there, and right and then Raoul gets hurt, and just stuff gets shifted around. But like the style of player he is, without kind of talking about the credit he deserves as like a person and like coming up to, is, I think, like so interesting, because I think a lot of people were like, hey,
00:16:15
Speaker
we need a left winger like this instead of the left winger that Leo Chu was trying to be or Jordan Morris was trying to be. And it is like, kind of goes further back to where we kind of started this conversation and was like, it's just a minor tweak. you have You had a player with this profile, maybe he's not as good as other players. That's right obviously not really up for debate anymore because of the performances he's put in.
00:16:40
Speaker
But it's like, hey, you know, like we're committed to playing this like idea of the left back that we have. We need a type of winger that pairs with that. And it's no coincidence that in this run of games that Paul Rothrock has been kind of showing out in terms of like actual production on the scoreboard.
00:17:02
Speaker
the team just looks way more solid on the left side now. right wait they're like It plays the Nuju strength, it plays the Obed Vargas strength, it plays the Jackson-Reagan strength a little bit further back and more kind of tucked in. And then when you can trust the left-winger to do all the things that Paul Rothrock has been able to do, you ah you end up actually getting the best out of kind of like everybody else on the field. and yeah yeah I think that's a great it's a great observation. It's often said that soccer is a weak link sport and you see that ah in situations like this where if you can just
00:17:42
Speaker
improve your weak link on the offensive side. Like that that's usually often, you know, the weak link sport is oftentimes used as a way of talking about your defense, but it's true probably with your offense too, especially when one of your primary attackers is just not very productive. And that was been, that has been the sounder's problem for a good deal of the season is that they just aren't getting dynamic movements out of their, out of both wings. And for all the Pedro de la Vegas,
00:18:13
Speaker
You know, there is a element of he doesn't look completely in sync with his teammates. I thought in this game, I really thought he was his most effective that he's been. He was consistently dangerous. He was popping up in in good spots. He was a little unlucky not to have a goal or an assist in this one. Like he hit his he had a great ball that came where he came sort of rushing into a ah he had two sort of ah these opportunities where he came rushing in on a on a sort of second ball. And on one of them, he had it blocked. And on the other one, it was cleared off the line where it would have either been a goal or a tap in for Jordan Morris. So I was overall encouraged by De La Vega. And he still doesn't have the production numbers that you'd like to see, but he is at least creating danger that has to be accounted for by defenses. Yeah. And then there's just this level of like,
00:19:11
Speaker
effort that both him and Rothrock put in on the wing. And it's not that like other players that have played in those positions this season haven't been trying. Like nobody would ever accuse Christian Roldan of being lazy. that's right yeah yeah That's not the type of effort I'm talking about. there there It's an element of like a decision has been made about what I'm going to do with the ball before I get it and what, what I'm going to try to make happen here. And I think in kind of the, the dog days of this season, they're like, the attack was so like rudimentary and like slow and it just never like developed fully. But with like the types of players that Rothrock is and do a much kind of like, I would say higher ability, although we haven't seen the production.
00:20:01
Speaker
with De La Vega is like.
00:20:05
Speaker
they're just going to do something and it might not work, but they're going to go win the ball back. And because they're like both, I think, very sort of like underrated in terms of their like pressing ability, but they're they're going to like try something. If it doesn't work, that's fine. We'll recycle it or we'll go win the ball back. And but we're constantly going to give the defense or the opponent something to think about. And then I think like that was on display I wouldn't say perfectly in this game, but you saw like how dangerous the threat of the Sounders attack was, like just from like existing in the mind of the Houston Dynamo. like They were down um maybe several of their ideal 11, I don't know, at least three or four guys. But still, like that the the thought that the Sounders could- Certainly two at the very least. Yeah, two yeah. but They're arguably the other two best players.
00:21:03
Speaker
Okay, yeah. um Just thought like the idea that the sounders would be able to like turn around and go do something was clearly their all game and Houston was worse because of that. So you're right to point out that most people when talking about a weak link, maybe identify a center back.
00:21:22
Speaker
or a goalie that isn't good enough. Or even a left back or a right back. Yeah, or even defensive midfielders. right yeah but really like i think the ideal One ideal I think Brian Spencer has that is actually coming to fruition this season is They're a strong defensive team because of their threat of offense and their ability to like, you know, they didn't have all the possession in this game. You know, they only scored one goal, but the threat, the threat of them doing more was there. And that was the platform that the entire team played on. And.
00:22:03
Speaker
I think like that level of front-footedness is why Yeymar was able to have like a man man-of-the-match type performance that he had, why Christian Roldan looks more dynamic, why the wingers are able to kind of like put in the shifts that they did, so on and so forth. but long Along those lines, you know I was just looking at the stat and it it jumped out at me. In the second half, Houston had 69% possession,
00:22:30
Speaker
They only took two shots, both of them were from outside the box for a total of .05 expected goals. That is what I think the Sounders have been missing this year is the ability to sort of just kill off a game the way that they did in that one. They didn't have to do it with the ball at their feet all the time.
00:22:49
Speaker
But they did a really good job of just making sure that for all the possession Houston had, it was always in front of them. They were never behind. They were never struggling to catch up. they were never out They were never out of position. It was just a masterclass sort of positional defending type of game, I thought, in the second half.
00:23:15
Speaker
Yeah, and you you called out that possession number, like even though the sounders didn't have the bulk of the possession in the second half, they had more touches in the um opposition's box.
00:23:28
Speaker
so i just going to show you that like I don't even necessarily think they like played direct on in the second half. I think they just kept the game like in front of them and they were completely happy to let it kind of play out there. But when they did get the ball, there was like a purpose with it. They didn't take a bunch of shots, but yeah a lot of that's kind of like they were trying to get the final pass to have the the good shot and all that. And I think the most encouraging thing about the game against the Dynamo is the atmosphere around the game felt serious for yeah like the lack of a better term. ah And then the game happened on the Sounders terms. It didn't turn into something that they didn't want it to happen and they had to overcome and still win. It was like, hey, weren're prop you know we're not
00:24:23
Speaker
going, we're not at the races kind of like offensively, but we're still going to win on our terms. And that's what I was most encouraged by, I think. Yeah. Yeah. No, I would say that's all, that's all that, that is all fair. Thank you for listening to the sound root heart podcast network, which now includes no sunny at this lobbing scorchers and the cooler yield. We've been independent since August of 2023.
00:24:50
Speaker
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00:25:05
Speaker
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00:25:30
Speaker
What did you make or you as we go down into this last three games? Like I mentioned, they they control their own destiny. Now that that would probably require for them to get home field advantage.
00:25:43
Speaker
They probably need to go undefeated in these last three games. They almost certainly need to win at least two, if not all three of these games, but they do control, you know, that's not outside of the realm of possibility. First big test is against Vancouver. That's on Wednesday.
00:26:02
Speaker
This feels like a ah point where they can really start making some statements, right? Like they can, they're going to be on the road against Vancouver, on the road against rapids, and then at home against the Timbers. They have an opportunity to really make a statement in these last few games. Yeah. And I think they kind of like have to, if, yeah if this season's going to mean like,
00:26:28
Speaker
Anything? yeah Like realistically, I don't think the Sounders are going to win MLS Cup. That doesn't mean I think they can't. I just think... i is I got you. I got you. However, you don't have to win MLS Cup to have a successful season. You can kind of like...
00:26:54
Speaker
show your intent. And I think like this year, for better or worse, has turned into a transition year, yeah and which is a bummer because it's the 50th anniversary. It could have been a year to like make a big statement.
00:27:10
Speaker
And they also had, and I think it's also we're saying that they are, they have something like peak performances from Jordan, from Yamar. theyve They've got a lot of players in their prime, a lot of good players in their prime who are performing at the top of their game and they just aren't getting the support level that they need for this to be a true, true contender, I think is yeah maybe what you're getting at. But like if you look around and MLS,
00:27:37
Speaker
Nobody's like really playing well right now. um I have some theories about why that is, like taking a break in the middle of the season to play a stupid tournament. Probably not a good idea. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, just it's funny. I was just looking at this. I'm going to share this stat because I think it's interesting. Inner Miami is on something like an eight game unbeaten streak. they've They've only lost once in their last like 15 games, but they've drawn three straight games.
00:28:05
Speaker
Yeah. And they have looked particularly good Columbus obviously is kind of in a similar boat where, you know, they just got their blow their doors blown off by the Sounders. they They drew a very winnable game this last week. And these are the two top, Cincinnati has really kind of fallen off. And then the West is even more wide open, I think. Yeah. I i think like and in particular, the West is like, the Sounders aren't going to finish first in like the regular season, but if you If you look at the teams ahead of them, like kind of benching like the voodoo around LFC assigned, I don't think that the galaxy are that much better. They have two players that I think are better than anybody else on the Sounders. But yeah, all those two pieces end up fitting together. Doesn't. Still like it's still a little weird for them, but like. like
00:28:59
Speaker
The fact that Colorado and Salt Lake have more points than the Sounders currently is or are on the same amount of points is a testament more to like the Sounders lacking this season more than it does to I think either of those two teams, um which I hope not a lot of fans from those two teams listen to this podcast. It'd be weird if they did. But hey, if you are listening. So I do think like you have to Do they have to win these three games? No. But if you start looking at the three games individually, you feel really bummed if they lose or draw. <unk> anya yeah yeah I agree with that fully. If any one of these results will feel like a big letdown if they don't win.
00:29:51
Speaker
so you end up coming back around to being like, no, yeah, they're all, you got to win. Right. Um, you may as well. Yeah. And they like, don't play a particular, they haven't played particularly well against teams like on the same amount of points for more than them. So you've got one, you got the next game is a team that's on the same amount of points as them ahead of them in the standing because of gold differential or wins. No, that's the next games of Vancouver, but
00:30:24
Speaker
Right. Sorry. yeah method is rapid You're talking about the rapids. Yes. I'm trying to make a convoluted point that they should just win. They should just win. They should. I mean, and honestly, like the whitecaps are for as much as the sounders might be playing on. I mean, the centers should be relatively fresh, certainly compared to the, to the whitecaps. The whitecaps in league play are in the middle of a three game win this run.
00:30:49
Speaker
They did, I guess they did beat Toronto in the Canadian Championship, but they are going to be, they're they're playing on much more tired legs than the Sounders are, theoretically. The Sounders so just came off a 10 week or 10 day break. a So the Sounders should be more fresh for this game. The Sounders have a decent history of success in Vancouver.
00:31:11
Speaker
This is the kind of game that the Sounders should absolutely be targeting as a as a winnable match. they need to you know and And this is a a total aside, but they also need to win to keep their hopes alive in the Cascadia Cup, which you know I realize is more of an end. like Winning the Cascadia Cup is not itself a huge goal, but this year,
00:31:35
Speaker
if they were to win the Cascadia Cup, it would do a huge boost to their, you know, that if they need to win these two games, if they win these two games, again, and against Cascadia opponents, that's, they would win the Cascadia Cup, but they would also do a huge boost to both their, their very real prospects, but also sort of the vibes around the team.
00:31:59
Speaker
So, yeah, I mean, I think the Whitecaps game absolutely should be a game that they look go into as, we should win this. Not a, it would be nice to get a point. Yeah, and obviously, depending on how the the games go, they have an opportunity to finish the season as like the best defensive team in the league. Like, at least based on goals allowed, which I think is a pretty important metric. That's the metric I think that we all know.
00:32:26
Speaker
um And so, yeah, they should win all three. All three should be a shutout. And, you know, they'll go into the playoffs feeling like anything can happen because I think realistically, at least in the West, anything like can happen. Like they don't have to. Like the the the reality of last season sort of situation happening again, where they draw LFC pretty much beat the brakes off of them.
00:32:57
Speaker
but this time actually end up scoring a few of those goals. They should have where it goes in to halftime to zero and the game's like effectively done like that. That could happen. Like it that reality is not very far away from like what's possible this season. So, and then like if LAFC is not in the way, I feel good about the chances of playing any other team. Yeah. If ah if these next three games go like,
00:33:26
Speaker
Well, yeah. and And the way that those playoffs stack up right now, the sounders would be on the road playing a best of two or three with two road games against the rapids in the four or five meeting. And then the galaxy would be presumably waiting in the Western conference semi-finals and LAFC would have to navigate a, uh, they would play the Houston dynamo in the first round who, by the way, the dynamo just beat LAFC. Didn't they?
00:33:55
Speaker
Uh, and then they would play RSL in the, in the second round. I don't know that it's a given that they're going to get through that. I will take like, I would take the sounder's chances the way the playoffs are lining up today. Uh, frankly, I would, I would take that those chances and you know, we'll see, we're we're going to get a much better sense of that in the next, the next few weeks for sure.
00:34:19
Speaker
But I do feel reasonably good, I would say, about where where the sounders are heading down the stretch here. ah But there was one other big thing that got discussed. Almost, I was surprised at how big of a deal they made of it in the post game. But I want to take a break.
00:34:39
Speaker
We'll come back and we'll do a little segment on the Club World Cup, which we found out the Sounders will be playing all three of their group stage games at home, which is which is big news. But I was i was ah honestly a little surprised at how big of a deal the Sounders made out of that on Saturday. But why don't we take a break? We'll come back. We'll talk about that. You're listening to NOS Adiatus.
00:35:04
Speaker
Welcome back to NOS Audio Desk. So as you probably know by now, it was announced on Saturday that the sounders would be hosting all three of their group stage games at the Club World Cup, which is a pretty big deal. ah If you don't know, the Club World Cup in next year is going to be an expanded world Club World Cup. There's going to be 32 teams. Among those 32 teams are legitimately most of the biggest clubs in the world. We're talking Bayern Munich, Real Madrid, Chelsea.
00:35:40
Speaker
Juventus, Inter Milan, ah most of the big club, Boca Juniors, ah River Plate, you know, go on and on. it's It's most of the world's biggest clubs are going to be at this
Sounders Hosting Club World Cup
00:35:53
Speaker
tournament. And there's a very real possibility that the Sounders will host some games in that tournament or ah I'm sorry, some they will host some games for sure, but they will host some of those teams games. And it'll be interesting to see how that that all plays out.
00:36:09
Speaker
But one of the things that I think is gonna be interesting is A, I'm curious how big of a deal fans see this as, but B, how getting out of the group would be a very different kind of group and getting the biggest games possible would be another like if I think internally the Sounders are probably hoping for give us the biggest opponents possible and we don't really care if we get out of the group whereas I would imagine most fans would probably think no I would like a manageable group because I want to see how far we can go in this thing I don't know where where do you fall like do you think people are gonna care about the club World Cup you might have a better sense of this than I do I don't want to be that way
00:36:55
Speaker
bubble popper or the blue. That's OK. That's what I'm looking for here. But I like I'm kind of looking at like the schedule of when this is supposed to happen. Yeah. And it's like three weeks, four weeks after a Champions League final. Yeah. That's like I I could very realistically see a team like one of the big European teams like Bayern Munich, for instance, being like,
00:37:22
Speaker
We just played a 60 game season. We're not we're not cutting our like preseason short, but we'll do the kind of like commercial song and dance around around it. So that or like Real Madrid is probably going to have ah there's no euros next year, but there is other kind of like competitions that their players go play internationally. So I'm like.
00:37:53
Speaker
I think European teams will treat it as a like summer pre-season friendly thing like that they do every year. and she he said this is This is like a month earlier than what normally European teams would be coming to the United States for pre-season, right?
00:38:10
Speaker
Yeah, it's because like the idea that it's just like sort of the natural part of their preseason, it actually falls like between what would normally be there. I mean, it's like right. And this is this is off season normally for European teams, right? Yeah, it should be. Although it doesn't seem like they get to do that anymore. Right. It seems like because they added more games to the Champions League. Right. Seasons tend to go deeper and deeper. For some reason, there's two international breaks in the fall, which doesn't make any sense than anything.
00:38:40
Speaker
Um, and you have, put you have players like on Manchester city and arsenal and. the, like the high end teams being like, we were playing too much. Yeah. yeah there isn Yeah. I saw a thief pro, which I'd learned this week is, is an actual, like they actually have bargaining power in among UEFA competitions. They, they apparently do have the ability to strike, but the in part of their discussion of, of,
00:39:14
Speaker
this extreme fixture condition, they noted that top players could could play theoretically 85 games in a year. That's crazy. i So in ah the 21-22 season Liverpool played every game possible to them.
00:39:34
Speaker
And how many now that was like 60 odd games? so I think it was 68 games. So that they obviously played every week game. They went to their two domestic cup finals, the Carabao Cup and the FA Cup finals. And then they made the Champions League final. It's a lot of games. And that like pretty much completely ruined their following season because a whole host of reasons. This isn't a Liverpool podcast. ah And I don't i don't particularly and want to relive some of those moments as a fan myself. um i And then, okay, setting aside what I think or I don't think European teams are going to do, I'm fascinated with how the Sounders actually handle this because
00:40:23
Speaker
It's ah really not good timing for that, like for them. i like They're not going to cancel League's Cup because of this. It's going to be very interesting to see how MLS handles this because you're right. it it could My suspicion is what they'll do. is they will give this because it like The group stage is like usually played over about a 10-day stretch. so It's not crazy to think that they could just schedule in sort of a break for the Sounders.
00:40:56
Speaker
like ah essentially give them a buy during during that period. But if the Sounders get out of their group, I have to imagine there's going to be league games on their schedule. And are they just going to like delay those games? and and like I really, really hope.
00:41:13
Speaker
that they figure out a way to have the league's cup overlapping with the club world cup. Now that will that will create problems because the whole point of league's cup is is to draw attention. And if you're competing with the club world cup, that's not good for attention, I would imagine. But i don't this is going to be a mess. It's it is a scheduling mess. There's no way around it. um Yeah, I mean, I
00:41:40
Speaker
I don't want to say I'm skeptical it even happens, because so like some something called the Club World Cup is going to happen, then the sounders are going to play in it. But the sort of like but's say integrity of competition, I don't think is going to exist.
00:41:58
Speaker
and i think that um I would probably agree with like it would be really cool to see Real Madrid whatever version of that. They're like people like players in Real Madrid jerseys playing in Seattle. Yeah. ah I doubt Jude Bellingham is going to be there. I doubt Mbappe is going to be there. Hey, maybe they have to be. I don't know. I mean, yeah.
00:42:26
Speaker
I would just kind of be like, hey, cool, the sounders played Real Madrid in a competitive game at some point in the like it happened. I just don't see the like path, the viability for this being. Which I think was like the heart of your original question was like, I don't yeah think this is a thing that fans want.
00:42:48
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, it'll be interesting. i I do think that the sound, you know, we we just put out a survey on our Twitter account where we asked fans basically how interested they were in this. And these are admittedly sounder heart readers. So these are people that are inclined to be interested.
00:43:04
Speaker
And right now, we have about 250 votes. Half of them have said, I'm going no matter what. And then the other half basically broke into three camps. One was it depends on who they're playing. The other was depends on who the Sounders sign. And the other there was only 11% that said they don't care. But ah what I thought was interesting is that It depends on who the Sounders sign is beating depends on the who the opponent is 22 to 16. I do think the Sounders are putting. I don't know if they're doing this on purpose. I don't think they're doing this on purpose, in fact. i But I think the Sounders are going to end up putting a lot of pressure on themselves to make some big signings this winter, because I think they are putting so much energy. They've already put a lot of energy into promoting the Club World Cup.
00:43:57
Speaker
And especially now that they have three games, I think fans are maybe going to wait around and see like, sure, we'll get invested in this, but give us a reason. Like show us you're serious about this. And the Sounders are going to have the ability to go out and make some big signings this winter. And I think ah justifiably, a lot of fans are going to say, sure, we'll get into this. If you show us, you're serious about it.
00:44:23
Speaker
and And that doesn't mean, you know, I don't think anyone's going to sit here and be like, oh, they're better than Real Madrid, even if they were to somehow beat a weakened Real Madrid team. But from a ah Sounders perspective, I do think Sounders fans want to see the Sounders at least not embarrass themselves. Yeah, but how much of that is actually like to do with the Club World Cup versus like? They just want them to go sign people.
00:44:46
Speaker
well Yeah, I mean they've been the Sounders have kicked this can down the road since a long time let's say since they won the Champions League. Yeah, I kind of agreed upon like Timeline for this stuff. some Yeah, we argue earlier cool, so maybe some people would argue later, but I like I
00:45:14
Speaker
I think that the sounders, regardless of if the club world cup is happening or not, have put themselves in a predicament where they have to hit big on winner signings.
Need for Impactful Signings for Club World Cup
00:45:24
Speaker
No, I agree. Even if they win MLS cup, I still think that that pressure is the same virtually. Yeah, they got I would say even more so. but It might be because like if the sounders can... let's No one's here predicting the Sounders are going to win MLS Cup, but let's just say through some degree of good fortune and and sort of the brakes going their way, they were to win MLS Cup. i don't I don't think that changes anything about the underlying complaints people have about the roster, which is it's missing some high upside players. and And if you are seriously going to try to sell the Club World Cup as ah as a real competition,
00:46:12
Speaker
And you're gonna sell it as an opportunity to see the Sounders go toe to toe with some of the biggest clubs in the world. You owe it to yourselves to put your best foot forward. And beyond that, I think they also like MLS is what it is in terms of it, you know, on any given team can win on any given week.
00:46:31
Speaker
But there're I do think that that they have to show some ambition when it comes to competing with the top teams in the in the league, especially if they want to consider continue to be considered one of the top teams in the league.
00:46:44
Speaker
Yeah. 100%. I, and I think I ultimately, I think the club world cup happening next summer is detrimental to the sounders 2025. I mean, I definitely think it has the very real potential of sort of undermining their potential for 2025 in that if they were to go on like a, you know, if they, let's just say they made it to the round of the quarterfinals or something in the club world cup, that's going to have knock on effects of their season, for sure. but And then, yeah, i but I also think that, the ah yeah, they shouldn't do League's Cup. I think the sound is... I totally agree with that. i Yeah, yeah no no question there. No question there. Well, anyway, that's probably what covers most of the ground. science cover let's Let's just do that. Let's find some good players.
00:47:39
Speaker
sign some good players. Why don't we just, that's the message and win a mosque cup and go win MLS cup and but start by beating the white caps. Yeah. All we're asking for is everything. and But yeah, nothing short of it. Yeah. and That's what, that's what we've been raised to believe we deserve as Sanders fans. I don't think that that, I thought, I think that was a sarcastic dig that I don't think is fair.
00:48:06
Speaker
um for calling you out on that. But I think that at the very least, give us something to hang our hat on this season. Yeah, and yeah I agree. I agree. I totally agree. I was i mean, I was being sarcastic, but I was being serious also. like this is the The reason that Sounders fans have high expectations is because the club has encouraged them.
00:48:32
Speaker
Yeah, that what like more than that, like told us to have those expectations.
00:48:39
Speaker
Like children Joe Ross not around anymore, ah but around the sounders. I believe he's still alive. I don't think he's dead. He is. I haven't checked on lately. I would i feel like the sounders would have done something if. Yeah, they would have they they would have made a note of it. um And that's where I get all my like entertainment news.
00:49:02
Speaker
Anyways, ah I feel like he really kind of distilled in us fans that like we should expect to win every game. And um maybe maybe that's a message that The Sounders should embrace once more. Yeah, yeah. I think that's that's that's that's a good place to to end this. I did want to, of course, give ourselves a plug
00:49:32
Speaker
Please become a subscriber to Sounder at Heart. ah That's what your subscriber dollars are what make shows like this one possible. They are what make all the great content we put on Sounder at Heart possible. It's what gives Mark a reason to get excited about Sounder at Heart himself. But also, thank you, Mark, for doing this. Thank you for filling in for Aaron.
00:49:57
Speaker
my I might on you again before Aaron's back. Who knows? Cool. I hope Aaron is enjoying Memphis, Tennessee. yes I hope they're not hit too hard by all of this flooding. Jeez, I should check on him. I think it's on. ah I think.
00:50:15
Speaker
The flooding is more on the eastern side of the state. Yeah. Okay. Good point. Memphis. I just know they have and big rivers there. Yeah. Good point. No, you're right. Your your your geography is coming through here. ah But thank you to Likit for producing this show. Thanks to Fullpool Wines. Thank you to our existing subscribers as well. I am Jeremiah O'Shan, signing off for Nos Arietes. Remember, you'll never be out alone.
00:51:17
Speaker
We love you. Let's win another one!