Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
No we’re cooking with gas
64 Plays5 months ago
We finally having a bonafide winning streak to talk about.
Fresh off their seven-point week, the Sounders followed that up with another come-from-behind win, this time beating the Chicago Fire 2-1.
Like their previous two results, the Sounders needed to come from behind in this one. But after playing some of their least inspiring soccer of the season during the first 30 minutes, they recovered to have one of their best halves of the season.
Both goals came from the penalty spot, but they were the product of continuous pressure with Albert Rusnák converting the game-winner in the 92nd minute. It marked the first time in Sounders history that they won consecutive games in stoppage time.
They’re still barely in the playoffs in the No. 9 spot, but after going 6-2-4 in league play over the last two months, they’re just three points out of the No. 4 spot.
In this week’s episode, Jeremiah and Aaron discuss the Sounders’ improved fortunes and try to determine how sustainable it is.
Sponsors
Nos Audietis is the flagship podcast for Sounder at Heart, which became a reader-supported website on Aug. 21. You can support us by becoming a paid subscriber, learn more: https://www.sounderatheart.com/about/
You can also support the show by checking out our line of merch including every past YachtCon design and our latest skull-and-crossbones logo.
"Diversions" audio provided by Sounder at Heart subscriber Lars; find more of their music: https://despatchesfromseattle.com/
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Sponsor
00:00:00
Speaker
Hey, this is Christian Roldan. And Jordan Morris from the Seattle Sounders Football Club. And you're listening to NOS Arietes. This episode of NOS Arietes is sponsored by Full Pull Wines, a Seattle-based wine retailer and proud sponsor of NOS Arietes since 2011. Full Pull was founded in 2009, is based in Seattle, and is owned and operated by longtime Sounders supporters. They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, the Pacific Northwest.
00:00:28
Speaker
A.O. Shen! Let's go! What a save by Fry! The Seattle Sounders have done it! MLS Cup win! Here come three years through the middle to crown it the vehicle! And now they truly can't stop the celebrations. It's the Sounders' MLS Cup! Niko Liddo leaves out!
00:01:12
Speaker
Is that what you young people call twerking?
00:01:28
Speaker
Welcome to another episode of NOS Adietta, sponsored by Full Pull Wines and our subscribers. We're recording on Tuesday, July 2nd, 2024. I am your host, Jeremiah Shan. Joining me today is my co-host, Aaron Campo, and our engineer, Lickit.
Historic Comeback Victory
00:01:42
Speaker
We finally have a bonafide winning streak to talk about. Fresh off their seven-point week, the Sounders followed that up with another come-from-behind win, this time beating the Chicago Fire 2-1.
00:01:53
Speaker
Like their previous two results, the Sounders needed to come from behind in this one, but after playing some of their least inspiring soccer of the season during the first 30 minutes or so, they recovered to have one of their best halves of the season. Both goals came from the penalty spot, but they were the product of continuous pressure with Albert Rusnak converting the game winner in the 92nd minute. It marked the first time in Sounders history that they'd won two consecutive games in stoppage time.
00:02:18
Speaker
They're still barely in the playoff spot at number nine, but after going six, two, and four in league play over the last two months, they're just three points out of the number four spot.
Playoff Position and Performance
00:02:28
Speaker
Things really do seem to be trending up, Aaron, even if they aren't quite what they want them to be.
00:02:34
Speaker
This is kind of like this is good, right? Like this feels like they are vaguely back in this. I think that for the last couple months, several months, we'll go a couple months. Yeah, that's good.
00:02:51
Speaker
the Sounders have been about what we expected them to be I think at the start of the season. And I think we've been cautiously alluding to that for a little while now, but I think it's I feel pretty confident in that that those first five games were an aberration and that
00:03:09
Speaker
The team that we have is sure as hell not perfect. They can be very frustrating. They are not the world's most exciting team. Although, you know, they've been pretty exciting the last few games, I guess, just not maybe in the way that is ideal, the right kind of excitement, I suppose, but it's been fun to watch.
Winning Tough Games
00:03:29
Speaker
But yeah, you know, they're a team with flaws that is really, really good at certain things that
00:03:35
Speaker
has remembered how to win games, difficult games, you know, at no point over this stretch have the sounders look great for, you know, for longer than a half.
00:03:48
Speaker
or so. Yeah, that's a good point. But, oh, Minnesota, they were probably good. That's true. That's true. Minnesota, they did look pretty, you know, good for the whole game. But, you know, I think that that was true of the run they went on last year as well towards the end of the season, right? They're just a team that knows how to win games and a team. The things that this seems very good at are
00:04:13
Speaker
Not things that lend themselves to games feeling dominant, I guess, for lack of a better way to put it. But it's like one of the games where you look back in hindsight and you go, Oh yeah, they were, they were pretty comfortable. They won that one pretty comfortably, but they aren't games that you, uh, like you said, they aren't games where in the moment they feel easy.
00:04:38
Speaker
Yes, yeah, I think that's the that's a great way to put it. It's weird like the Chicago game. You know, they went into half horrible half horrible half as bad maybe as the first half against Houston.
00:04:51
Speaker
just playing a much worse team and at home. And I still felt relatively confident they were gonna win that game.
Offensive Improvements
00:05:00
Speaker
And even up until, I mean, they get the penalty to win the game in stoppage time, I still felt very confident they were gonna find a way to score in that game. And I don't know why. But I just did. And I think that
00:05:15
Speaker
The Sounders are also maybe starting to remember that they're, they're capable of doing that. And, uh, I don't want them to make a habit of it. I'd like them to go back to one of the games, the way they did against Minnesota. You know, New England is, has been better lately, but they're a bad team that the Sounders should beat at home. It'd be nice if it was a little more comfortable, you know, than the last few.
00:05:38
Speaker
Well, you know, we've talked about this early in the season, especially like maybe the biggest flaw wasn't that they were losing games. It was that they were boring as fuck. Yes. And at the very least, the last two weeks, this has been a fun team to watch. These have been fun games like even going back to the RSL all going all the way back to the RSL game.
00:06:02
Speaker
Like, don't count the Kansas City game. That was awful. I don't want to relive that at all. But, you know, basically every other game they've played during the last, you know, month or so has been entertaining and fun. You know, here's a crazy stat for you.
00:06:21
Speaker
Currently, 81% of the Sounders games have been decided by one goal or less, meaning it was a tie. They are still sort of punching below their weight in terms of what you would expect them to be getting points-wise out of those games. They're only getting 1.29 points per game, which is pretty close to their season, their overall points per game.
00:06:44
Speaker
But it's, you know, it's, it's not the worst that, you know, like the thing that killed them in 2022 is they went seven, 15 and five in one goal games. Uh, you know, right now they're five, five and seven. So it's, you know, they're doing a little, doing a little better, uh, as far as that goes, uh, or they're doing a lot better than they were in, in 2022. But, um,
00:07:07
Speaker
I don't know. It's just, it lends it. My point being is they play a lot of close games. 81% would be if they end up at this high of a percentage, this would be the highest percentage of one goal games they've ever played, at least under Brian Schmetzer. I don't have the data beyond the Brian Schmetzer era, but that's, I think, I don't know. I thought that was kind of interesting.
00:07:28
Speaker
Yeah, it is. I mean, they don't make it easy to watch. I'll say that. No. From an emotional perspective, at least. And I would love them to get beyond that. But I do think there's nothing about the way they've been winning games and racking up points over the last couple of months that feels flukish or unsustainable to me. Right.
00:07:51
Speaker
And I think that that's the critical important thing. It's not really about how comfortable you feel. It's about how repeatable the things that they're doing are and the way they're winning games. Are they going to get, you know.
00:08:04
Speaker
two actually given penalties and four arguable penalties in every game. No, they're not. But those penalties came from good attacking play, right? Exactly. They forced like they were they were penalty all four of those penalty shouts came from situations where they were putting Chicago under a lot of pressure, right? And
00:08:26
Speaker
And Chicago broke a couple of times. If you get the ball into the box and attack the goal, you're going to put teams under pressure. And if you put teams under pressure or not, things are going to happen. You know, goals are going to go in, penalties are going to get drawn, like stuff's going to happen. And that's sort of like what the Sounders offense is right now, which is like,
00:08:48
Speaker
Make stuff happen, guys. Great, great. And I do think that that is in contrast to some of the penalties they got earlier in the year that were just maybe a bit more fortunate where it was guys facing away from goal or handballs from situations that weren't especially dangerous. This feels like a team that is maybe not.
00:09:05
Speaker
a great attacking team, but that is attacking with intention and starting to create a little bit of chaos, which I think is a positive thing given the players they have on the team. I think is a pretty good sort of approach to the attacking phase of the game is just to try to, like you said, try to just make shit happen. Right. And you know, like there, you know, we've made a lot of, you know, a lot of this is directly
00:09:31
Speaker
tied back to how good are they offensively. And for a lot of the season, we were really stressing out about how bad they were offensively. Like this was a team that looked like they could not score from open play for, you know, a significant portion of the season. And, you know, right now they're ranked 17th in goals per match, which isn't to say that's great, but it's
00:10:00
Speaker
You can be competitive at 1.4 goals per match. And they're giving up 1.2 goals, which is seventh best. So they're 13th in expected goals.
00:10:17
Speaker
which is, again, not, they're not blowing the doors off anyone, but these, that's what you need to be, you need to be, to be respectable. That's kind of where you need to be. Yeah. And they, they're almost certainly going to end up scoring more goals than they did last season. Not the highest bar in the world to clear. Obviously they score 41 last year. That's not good, but they're improving on that at least. And it does look like they'll be, they'll, they'll, they'll improve on that.
00:10:41
Speaker
And I think, again, I haven't done the math on this, but I think if you remove the outlier of those first five games where they literally could not score to save their lives, I think things probably look a lot better over the last 16. So yeah, stuff is not good, right? The team is in ninth place. Their goal difference is not great. Their home record is not great.
00:11:10
Speaker
they have some, I think, obvious flaws. But their home record is a lot better than it was a month ago. Their goal difference is better than it was a month ago. You know, there are four, one, and five at home right now. Four, one, and five is not good enough, right? That's that four that's really problematic. But they've only lost once at home this year. Right. You know? Like, and that was a pretty psychotic game, I think it's fair to say. Yeah, I just...
00:11:37
Speaker
There's a danger of being too positive, I think, because things could still fall apart very easily. If you look at their next three games before League's Cup, they've got, or next four games, sorry, they've got the Revs at home, they're at Austin, they've got St. Louis at home, they've got LAFC at home. I think eight points is
00:11:59
Speaker
Maybe not what you would say is what you expect from that, but I think that's achievable. And I think that they have put themselves in a big enough hole that, you know, eight points feels like a reasonable goal from those from those games. There would be two wins and two ties or three wins. Yeah. And I think you should beat the Rebs. They should beat St. Louis. Yeah, those are they can beat Austin.
00:12:26
Speaker
Sure. And they have LAFC at home. Right. And so if they get eight points from those games, they'd be at 36 points. They'd be tied for fourth in the West on a points per game basis based on where things are at. Now, if they get four points from those games, which I would be surprised by, but
00:12:48
Speaker
I wouldn't be crazy. Then they're at 1.3 points per game, which is what they're at right now. Right. So they're probably right around ninth. Yeah. It's in that year. I mean, I think that's the thing is that they've got, I wrote about this in my column this week, which is they've, they've done the work to get their head above water at this point. They're at 500. They are three points out of fourth place. They are.
00:13:16
Speaker
They're now comfortably at ninth, right?
Playoff Ambitions
00:13:18
Speaker
I guess I should look at this. They're okay. They're only one point up on Austin. That Austin game actually ends up being maybe a pretty important game, but they're right there, I guess is my point. They've got everything to play for.
00:13:37
Speaker
They're unlikely. You don't. Sorry. They're unlikely to get into a situation where they've got two teams ahead of them to get into the playoffs. Right. Yes, they. Right. Exactly. Which is which is notable. They essentially they very much are in control of their own destiny in terms of like where they ultimately finish. And, you know, they they don't need to go on some crazy run to.
00:14:02
Speaker
get into a, like, I think fourth should be their goal. Like, that's, to me, what realistically you should like, we got to get the fourth because that's going to get us home field advantage in the first round of the playoffs. It's achievable. There's no reason we shouldn't set that as a goal. Like, that should be, to me, their focus. Yeah.
00:14:21
Speaker
That feels very realistic. If they play the way that they have played for the last two months over the last 13 games of the season, they will finish fourth. I don't have any question. If they play at a 1.8 point per game pace for the rest of the year, they will finish fourth. No doubt about it. If they play at 1.8 points per game and don't finish fourth, you sort of, okay, you take your chances.
00:14:48
Speaker
Right. But I feel like if this team can play at that pace the rest of the way and do it in the way they've done it, it's a team that can make noise in the playoffs for sure. And yeah, I just I think back a lot to people talk about the 2016 season in the context, you know, of of major comebacks from the big hole.
00:15:08
Speaker
For obvious reasons, but I think a lot about the 2018 season, right? And just like how quickly things can turn around where the Sounders through 21 games in, in 2018 had 26 points, which is too fewer than they have now. And they ended up on, I think 51 right that year. And they finished a 54 59 and 29. Yeah. They went on a crazy ride the second half of that year, but right.
00:15:32
Speaker
I'm not expecting the Sounders to win. What did they did? They did like one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, nine in a row and then five and then five in a row. So 14 of their last 16 games were wins. Right. Not expecting that. Right. But just the the margins are so so thin. Right. There's still 13 games is a lot of season left to play.
00:16:01
Speaker
I don't know. I don't know how I feel about this team, I guess. This is my point. Yeah, I don't. I don't know either. Yeah, I will say this. They got to win this game against the revolution. This is yes, it's not the it's not a literal must win in any like way that we're used to saying it, but their. Their ability to.
00:16:31
Speaker
position themselves. Absolutely. If this is a game, they have to win. Yeah. And they get like, they got to, you know, I think they, they, they probably have to win the St. Louis home, like that, that St. Louis home game too. And then they sort of take their chances with LAFC at home and take their chances with Austin on the road. But those are four games that they should expect to get points from.
00:16:58
Speaker
That's what the standard they should be holding themselves to. And by the way, they've got an open cup game next Tuesday, a week from today, where we are right now that, you know, if they, if they go
Upcoming Matches
00:17:10
Speaker
into the league's cup break, sitting in fourth, heading into an open cup semi-final, I, I don't have anything to complain about, to be honest with you.
00:17:23
Speaker
No, I mean, I can still find stuff. But yeah, I want them to add some talent and I want them to, you know, play more attractive soccer. But from a results perspective, that's all I can ask for. That's a great turnaround. I mean, I think that you can't from where they were and what they had to do and what they have to work with. I think that's about all you can expect is that kind of turnaround. And, you know, coincidentally, the league's cup
00:17:47
Speaker
break, not break, but the league's cup portion of the season and the secondary transfer window opens two days, I think before that. Yeah. The 18th. Yeah. So I think what happens in that LAFC game and all the games prior, I don't know. Maybe that informs what they decide to do, right? If they're in ninth and kind of.
00:18:12
Speaker
You know, yeah, they'll probably sneak into the playoffs, but let's just wait until the winter and figure it out. Then maybe the more attractive option if they're in fourth and they're looking good and you feel like, hey, this team could actually win an MLS Cup.
00:18:29
Speaker
You know, add a gold dangerous winner or whatever. Right. Then that probably maybe hopefully changes the equation a little bit. So yeah, it's, it's a huge four games coming up. We said that about the last four games, because the whole, they put themselves in the beginning of the season means that every stretch of games is important from here on out. Right.
00:18:50
Speaker
unless they go on some crazy terror and get themselves into favorable playoff position comfortably. But even then, you don't want the momentum to die, right? So yeah, they have made the season interesting. And lately, that seems positive. That seems like a positive thing.
Roster and Player Roles
00:19:11
Speaker
Yeah. Uh, so let's dig a little bit into the state of things right now. You know, it does feel like the sounders should go out and add something talent wise, but
00:19:27
Speaker
I can also understand I will say I understand the desire to at least really understand what you have before you go out and do something. Sure. And, and the big, the big question is, yeah, is Pedro de la Vega back? Is he healthy? Is he you know, if he's a starter by the end of the this, if he like, let's just say he starts the LAFC game, that to me, changes the way you approach the
00:19:55
Speaker
you know, that's one less player you feel like you have to replace, right? That's one less open, open starting spot. And, you know, that's, you know, it's good, that's good information to have, I suppose, but if he's not available, if he gets hurt again, at that point, you probably have to assume like, we don't know if we're gonna have him, we have to treat him like he's not on the roster, like he's pure bonus.
00:20:26
Speaker
I don't know. I don't know where I was going with that.
00:20:30
Speaker
I think the other player who has suddenly emerged, and I don't know what to make of him, frankly, Paul Rothrock. I don't think he's a starter. I think he's probably best used as sort of like a spark off the bench. But man, the Sanders sure do look a lot better when he's on the field, don't they? They do. Yeah. I mean, I think that part of that is just the things that he's doing are things that other players are not doing.
00:20:57
Speaker
Uh, and if he doesn't even need to be doing them at a super high level for them to be effective, right? He's just causing problems. He's running at guys. He's bringing a lot of energy to games. Uh, he's, he's providing another runner, which I think is huge. I think is a really underrated, uh,
00:21:16
Speaker
benefit that he brings. But I also don't want to be patronizing him or take anything away from him. Like he is producing. He is doing good things. He's making things happen. And that's that's not what he's not, you know, looking into those things like no, he's doing positive things on the field. And, you know, it's it's been super important. And I think the guy that I am beginning to really think he resembles a lot is Lamar Nagel, where
Impact of Substitutes
00:21:46
Speaker
He has a limit to his upside. He has a limit to his ceiling, but he's going to do positive things for you on the field if he's getting playing time. And right now, I mean, the Sounders just need somebody to do positive things for them in the attack and to give them another outlet, to give them another willing runner, and to give them somebody who's going to attempt to make things happen and press.
00:22:12
Speaker
and do all of the little things that I think add up to being important. And he's absolutely providing that at the same time.
00:22:21
Speaker
It's, you know, he's not, I think he's not a guy who has played himself into not being a guy that you're actively looking to upgrade on, right? Like nobody's going to say, uh, we can't go out and sign a gold injurious winger. Cause he's going to take power off rocks. Right. Like, uh, but I'm super glad he's gotten these runouts and gotten an opportunity to play and, and show what he can do. Cause what he can do has been super positive. I don't think you can really underestimate how important that's been to their turnaround.
00:22:51
Speaker
Well, and I do think that there's the nice thing about his game is that there's potentially always sort of a place for a guy like that. Like he doesn't need to be a 90 minute player to be effective. He's showing that he can be effective with.
00:23:07
Speaker
limited time on the field. And, you know, it's, you know, like he even said it today, you know, he's already seeing that opponents are playing him differently, and that they're already sort of adapting to his tendencies. But theoretically, that should just open up other like,
00:23:25
Speaker
It's all trades, right? It's all trade-offs. And if they're paying more attention to Paul Rothrock, that just means that theoretically, they're paying less attention to Jordan Morris, or, you know, Raul Rui Diaz, or an Albert Rosnack, or whoever else. And so, theoretically, that just opens up more space for them. So, you know, that's a good problem to have. And
00:23:48
Speaker
You know, I'm really excited to see what he's doing. I think the player who is a little bit more in danger of losing a role is Leo Chu, who does seem like he needs... He's someone who it doesn't feel like he's... It seems rare that he's effective off the bench and he sort of needs these longer runouts, but he's still not doing enough with the runouts he's getting, I think.
00:24:18
Speaker
Yeah, I think I agree with that. I like Leo Chu, but there are a lot of players like this, especially, I think, players with his skill set in his position who can do incredible things and be so dangerous in the attack, whether it be directly being goal dangerous or setting up other players, running at guys, doing positive things that way.
00:24:45
Speaker
But he can also just have huge long stretches where he's completely anonymous, right? And it's like, yeah, obviously, if he could be that guy, when he's at his best for 90 minutes every game, or 30 minutes every time he came in, provide that kind of performance, he wouldn't be playing an MLS, right? So that's like part of the trade off is that sometimes you're just going to get more inconsistent players when they have those abilities. But
00:25:10
Speaker
He's just not, he's just not showing it as frequently as I think you would hope for somebody who has been kind of an automatic starter when he's been healthy, I guess. And I think, especially with De La Vega coming back when you say, who's the guy who's going to make way? I mean, for me, it's probably Rothrock, right? Because.
00:25:36
Speaker
he can't do some of the things Leochu is capable of doing, but that it's even a question is kind of crazy to me. Yeah, I mean, it'll be interesting to see what they do because it's also maybe not as simple as that because I think we also are going to get into a situation where is Alex Roldan the starting right back or is Christian Roldan better served? Christian Roldan I think is going to be on the pitch regardless. I don't think he's the player who's going to get sacrificed.
00:26:05
Speaker
in a, you know, post Pedro de la Vega becoming a starter universe. I think he's going to be on the pitch one way or the other. And, you know, it might be right back, you know, it might be de la Vega on the left or on the right and and Leo Chiu on the left or Christian Roldan on the right and de la Vega on the left.
00:26:29
Speaker
and then maybe it's Alex Rodon and maybe Orack maybe it's Reed Baker Whiting like the sounders have some options and I've been saying this for a while like this is not I know that there are times when it feels like the roster is broken if there's a few pieces missing but when it's all put together
00:26:48
Speaker
There's a lot of depth to like right now. Nathan, who I think is a very good center back, is having a hard time getting on the field right now. John Bell is out with... He missed the last couple games while he was with Jamaica at the Copa America. He can barely get on the field. Reed Baker Whiting is going to have to find minutes.
00:27:11
Speaker
you know, we deal with this question in the mailbag later this week, but like Cody Baker is barely getting on the, he's not even making game day rosters.
Roster Depth and Potential
00:27:21
Speaker
And this is a player who looks like a perfectly capable defender. So, you know, there's a lot of pieces here that I think add up to a competitive roster. And, you know, I still want to add to it, but when it's healthy, it does look promising.
00:27:39
Speaker
Yeah, it definitely does. And there are a lot of different. I like that the pieces are not like for like interchangeable. You know, I like that your options at left back are new who Bell Nathan, I guess, theoretically or read Baker Whiting, who is a completely different player. Right. Right. Choo and Rothrock, completely different players. Masovsky and Morris and Rudy is all all pretty different from each other. Masovsky as a winger is a completely different player. Right. So, yeah.
00:28:08
Speaker
Um, you can, you know, you can mix and match and, and do different things based on the opposition. And that's, I think underrated quality. Um, but I, I'm definitely with you in that it feels like the top end is what's missing right
Need for a Star Player
00:28:25
Speaker
now. Right. Like that really elite player to put everything over the top, because I think, man, if you have that player, everything else is already there and.
00:28:36
Speaker
I think you've got to hope that Pedro de la Vega can be that player the rest of the year, and then you can maybe find another one of those guys in the off season to really take this roster to the next level, and that it doesn't get blown up to a point where you have to do major surgery.
00:28:54
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I guess another, and another thing I hadn't even considered is, I suppose there's even a way that you can construct this where Rui Diaz is the nine and Morris is coming off one of the wings and De La Vega is on the other and. Yeah.
00:29:07
Speaker
Yeah, you could. I don't necessarily think that's their best look, but anyway.
Conclusion and Podcast Developments
00:29:16
Speaker
Well, that feels like a pretty good place to call it. We're going to do a preview episode of the New England match later in the week. We also have a mailbag episode coming up later in the week where we're going to deal with a lot of the other ancillary issues surrounding this team.
00:29:32
Speaker
But I think that's it. I think that's what we got. So thank you, Aaron. Thank you, Lickit, for producing this show. Thank you to the listeners for supporting us and making this work. Hopefully you also have had a chance to go check out Lobbing Scorchers, which is
00:29:52
Speaker
part of a growing SoundRite Heart podcast network, which we are gonna be adding another podcast to soon. So be on the lookout for that. But all that said, I am Jeremiah O'Shan, signing off for Aaron Campo and Lick It, this is no sari at this. And remember, you'll never get alone.
00:31:08
Speaker
We love you. Let's win another one!