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04. America's Next Top Model with Zoë Klar
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WANNA BE ON TOP? Helen and guest Zoë Klar discuss Cycle 1 of one of the most important, genre-defining shows in reality television: America's Next Top Model.
LINKS!
Song of the week: In Da Club by 50 Cent https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qm8PH4xAss
Prometea the cloned horse: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prometea
Robyn reading the bible instead of charming men in Paris: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tFEMOpt5SU
Class of '03 is an independent production hosted, written, and edited by Helen Grossman.
If you have a memory or an idea for the show, please call in at 724-CLASS-03 and leave a voicemail or send an email to classof03pod@gmail.com.
Follow Class of '03 on Instagram @classof03pod or visit our website classof03podcast.com.
Our logo is by Maddie Herbert of @dame.studio and theme song is by Luke Schwartz and Evan Joseph of Sawtooth.
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Transcript
Introduction to Class of 03: America's Next Top Model's Influence
00:00:00
Speaker
Okay, jump off this building and look pretty. You have one shot, go.
00:00:34
Speaker
Hi, and welcome back to Class of 03, the podcast about the year 2003 and all the ways it's still relevant today. I'm your host slash classmate, Helen Grossman. And this week, our subject is the face that launched a thousand reality shows, Tyra Banks and America's Next Top Model.
Diversity and Beauty Standards in ANTM: A Critique
00:01:02
Speaker
In the first moments of the first season or cycle as any true ANTM head would tell you, Tyra Banks tells us that she started this show to help people understand how to get into the field of modeling.
00:01:18
Speaker
She and her production team launched a nationwide search and received thousands of audition tapes to take someone from obscurity to fame in just eight weeks. She says, I'm looking for originality, for creativity, for humor, all colors, all shapes, and all sizes. Some of these girls you would not look twice at on the street, but all know when I can make them into something.
00:01:45
Speaker
For all of Tyra's promises of a cast with all colors, shapes, and sizes, the final three women on cycle one of ANTM were strikingly but not shockingly similar. They were all very tall, very, very skinny white women whose primary difference was their religious affiliation.
00:02:06
Speaker
The show was cancelled after 15 years in 2018, but its lexicon and its lessons are still very much alive to anyone who ever watched the show and believed that they too could be plucked from obscurity. If only Tyra saw something special in them, if only they smised so fiercely that their raw beauty was undeniable.
00:02:28
Speaker
In its early days, it's heyday. The show set and reinforced beauty standards and created this kind of blueprint into how to become a model. And I don't have any research evidence or polling data or Pew Research Center studies to prove this, but I suspect that the show really affected the psyches of young people watching it as well as the way that those same people would eventually learn to represent themselves on social media. That's just my hunch though.
Cloning in 2003: Science, Ethics, and Influence
00:02:58
Speaker
The truth is, the winners of America's Next Top Model were always the ones who made themselves in Tyra's image, the ones who didn't cry during their makeover, who accepted whatever horrifying challenges they were placed in, who took feedback like, your accent is horrible, or you walk like a man, and embraced Tyra's vision of what they had to endure in order to make it in the industry without question.
00:03:25
Speaker
But Tyra, she wasn't the only one molding things into her image when America's Next Top Model began in 2003. That year, there were monumental and important strides in science around cloning. Yeah, I did just make that leap.
00:03:41
Speaker
So cloning obviously didn't actually start in 2003, but it was a surprisingly big topic of discussion in scientific communities as well as in the US government and in the United Nations. Let's backtrack a few years from our usual backtrack to 2003 and talk about the birth of Dolly the sheep. Dolly was a sheep born in 1996 who was the first cloned mammal derived from an adult cell.
00:04:10
Speaker
So Dolly, she died at age six in, you'll never guess, 2003, left a scientific legacy that was hugely influential and impactful, in part because her successful birth after over 500 failed attempts proved that you could take a cell from an adult mammal and essentially reprogram it using a technology called nuclear transfer to create a clone. So Dolly had been created using a cell from an adult sheep's udder.
00:04:40
Speaker
Throughout the rest of the 90s and early 2000s, there were other cloning experiments, but 2003 marks a standout year for the achievements and the discourse around the ethical ramifications of this kind of scientific endeavor. Part of the discourse I think has to do with the fact that right around New Year's Eve 2002, as 2003 was approaching, a company called CloneAid announced that they had produced the first human clone.
00:05:06
Speaker
Clone8 is a really interesting and bizarre company. It's owned by a religious sect whose theology is based on the idea that aliens created humans through cloning, and now humanity's mission on Earth is to continue cloning.
00:05:24
Speaker
Cloneaid starts promoting their human clone in late December 2002 and by early January it's of course huge news. It's all over the papers, in part because of the company's suspicious PR tactics, but also the fact that Cloneaid refused to allow any genetic testing on the baby to confirm that it was in fact a clone.
00:05:45
Speaker
Then, on January 4th, 2003, Clonate announced the birth of a second human cloned baby. Again, they had no evidence to back up this claim. So, just four days later on January 8th, the bill was introduced into the House of Representatives, called the Human Cloning Prohibition Act of 2003. And shortly thereafter, a similar bill was introduced in the Senate, which was never voted upon.
00:06:08
Speaker
even though it had passed in the House. In October of 2003, the United Nations took up the issue of human cloning, but essentially delayed any kind of resolution for another two years on it.
00:06:21
Speaker
Even with the panic around human cloning raging in early 2003, there were major and important developments in animal cloning that year. Dolly the sheep's February 2003 death raised a lot of questions about the efficacy of the cloning science, but on April 1st, researchers cloned two bantangs, which is a species of wild cattle from Asia,
00:06:47
Speaker
using frozen cells from an animal that had died in 1980. Later in 2003, scientists in Spain cloned a Pyrenean ibex, a kind of wild goat species, that had gone extinct in 2000. The cloned ibex died shortly after its birth due to a lung defect.
00:07:07
Speaker
making it the first species to go extinct twice. In June, scientists in Italy produced the first cloned horse named Prometea, a few other clones from 2003, Ralph, the first cloned rat, and Idaho Gem, the first cloned mule.
00:07:24
Speaker
I also have to mention that the Star Wars movie that came out in 2002 was Star Wars Episode 2 Attack of the Clones and in 2003 there was the Cartoon Network show Star Wars Clone Wars. So that's just a lot of clone stuff in the popular imagination for one year.
00:07:45
Speaker
While the scientific and political establishments grappled with these developments in cloning, there were fewer overt discussions about the kind of conformity and standards promoted through America's Next Top Model. Yes, we're circling back to America's Next Top Model.
00:08:01
Speaker
Cycle 1 of the series premiered on May 20th, 2003 on UPN and aired through July.
The Reality of Reality TV: ANTM's Unique First Season
00:08:09
Speaker
The first season is I think really a standout in America's Next Top Model because it's so unlike any of the future seasons that you think of when you think of America's Next Top Model.
00:08:20
Speaker
It has a really low production budget. It's brand new. It has nothing to reference. So it felt raw. It felt more real somehow, more like actually representative of what being a model could really be like. This week, I talked with writer, producer, and co-host of the Bad Boy podcast, Zoe Klar, about Tyra, the women, and the drama of Cycle 1, and how we remember the show from watching it 20 years ago.
00:08:50
Speaker
So this is episode four, America's Next Top Model. And don't forget to stay tuned after the discussion for our song of the week.
00:09:17
Speaker
Okay, I'm Zoe Klar, and in 2003, I was 13. Do you have any prominent memories of 03? My Bat Mitzvah. Uh-huh. You know it. I know it. September 21st. Amazing. Huge day in history. That definitely stands out because, look, I wasn't popular.
00:09:40
Speaker
But I unfortunately had my bat mitzvah on the same day as a kid who was. And everyone went to his bar mitzvah, not mine. And they all got really sick airbrush tees. But jokes on them because I had sumo wrestling. You're a theme with sumo wrestling?
00:09:57
Speaker
No, but you remember those like big outfits. Oh, yeah. Yeah, you had like the balloon like the you had like a classic bat mitzvah party. Did you? No. Well, yours was in 2003. Mine was in September 2003. Yeah. Wow. Twins, twins, September three bat mitzvahs. Wow. OK. And you didn't have any. Well, you had no games, no games. What? No, I mean,
00:10:21
Speaker
We did a weird thing. You know, we did we did the service in the morning and then instead of having a party, we like rented a huge bus and we drove out to the city of industry to this diner where my uncle knew the owner of the diner. It was like a Greek diner with like roller waitresses. This is I've never heard the story of your bat mitzvah before. I think because I honestly was like, I'm so embarrassed by it.
00:10:48
Speaker
I'm so, like, it's so weird. Yeah, My Bump Missful is actually at a nightclub. Oh, wow. In the city? In the city, because my godfathers planned it, and they were caterers. And so they did the catering, and they also chose the venue, which was a nightclub. And we had to leave by 11, because at 11 PM, the burlesque show started. Oh, wow. So as we were, as like all of us were pouring out of the,
00:11:14
Speaker
As all of us were pouring out, the burlesque crowd was coming in and there was definitely a blow up doll. Wow. Ready to take my spot as bar mitzvah girl. I bet everyone who went to that other kid's bar mitzvah wished that they could have seen the burlesque crowd. You know what? That in and of itself was like enough to get people there. You're right. To go to a nightclub in NYC.
Influence of ANTM on Personal and Societal Perceptions
00:11:35
Speaker
So sick. Come on. I mean, it wasn't it wasn't cool to the people at that school, though, because they were like, let's go to the rainbow room. You know what I mean? Yeah. They were such a rainbow room crowd. What were the trends in the New York City private school when we were in what, seventh, eighth grade? I mean, I get all of it so conflated with each other, but like, I guess a juicy jumpsuit. Right. Yeah. Does that sound right? That was big for this era. Huge.
00:11:59
Speaker
Some people definitely had cell phones. I don't know about the cell phones that came out in that time. I think I had a Motorola Peanut phone. Does that sound right? Yeah, I had a similar one. It was like the one from Charlie's Angels. Okay, I'll believe you. So definitely that, definitely cell phone charms.
00:12:19
Speaker
Definitely, you know, latex belts that had huge holes in them. Yeah. We see some of those in this in this series. Oh, yeah. The series is really such a lot into the fashion of that time. Like, absolutely. I truly a horrifying time. And I was also thinking about low rise jeans. Yeah.
00:12:37
Speaker
Um, as I do. Yeah. And they're, they're coming back to haunt us. I know, but they couldn't have come at a worse time. But yeah, no, 2003 low rise jeans, light wash, boot cut. Oh yeah. You know that those jeans that just had like the tiniest little zipper. Yeah. Maybe two inches of zipper maximum, but also so many pockets.
00:13:02
Speaker
Yeah, so many pockets like how you like stuck between low rise tight jeans and pocket filled cargo pants.
00:13:11
Speaker
Yeah. Such a weird time to be alive. Such a weird time to be a teenager. Yeah. And to like have a body that's growing. Disgusting. Disgusting. Disgusting. OK, well, let's talk about America's Next Top Model. I would love nothing more because we just spent four hours watching it. Does that is that breaking the fourth wall too hard? No.
00:13:38
Speaker
So do you remember when America's Next Top Model premiered? I don't remember like the day it premiered, but I definitely remember it being like appointment viewing for me and my mom. And I know not to, you know, switch gears too hard, but I know Queer Eye also came out in 2003. And that was another show my mom and I watched together. Wow. Yeah. I don't know what it was. And we also watched Animal Precinct, which was on Animal Planet. It was like about the ASPCA going in and rescuing like pit bulls and stuff.
00:14:07
Speaker
That's cool. I guess. But yeah, anyway, I definitely watched the show with my mom. What impression or impact did watching the show have on you? I think like you don't realize how much you're internalizing. Yeah. And, you know, we watched a couple of episodes of season one, an episode from season three.
00:14:31
Speaker
And it's like in the first, first of all, in the first episode ever, they're doing away in. Yeah. And they're showing everyone's height and weight on the screen. Yeah. And they're shamed if they're too skinny. And then they're shamed if they're not skinny enough. And, you know, then there's everyone in the middle who are like sort of going at the two sides.
00:14:57
Speaker
And it's like a weird, you know, in my mind, what I remember is like constantly wanting to be thinner. Yeah. And that being my takeaway was like, well, I mean, I was fully convinced I could be a model after watching the show. Yeah. My main takeaway was like every time I'm going to the mall, I'm at risk of being scouted because I'm such a drop dead diva or whatever. Like, I think that that was a big takeaway for a lot of people. Yeah. Was like.
00:15:25
Speaker
Anybody. If this could happen to Adrian or Shannon. Yeah. Two small town girlies. Certainly. It could happen to you. Yeah. And it never happened to me. Yeah. Not yet. Not yet. I haven't aged out yet, even though the 26 year old on season one is like practically geriatric.
00:15:46
Speaker
They really treated her so yeah I mean it's also offensive that like the oldest person who was like the quote-unquote mother of the group was also happened to be the quote-unquote plus size model yeah and like Plus size on season one versus plus size on season three vastly different completely different. Yeah, I mean I
00:16:07
Speaker
I assume, and we barely watch season three, and I don't really remember, I remember in later seasons, like when girls would gain weight throughout the season or lose weight throughout the season, they'd be like, you come in a plus size girl, you have to stay a plus size girl, or you'd come in a not plus size girl, you have to stay that way.
00:16:27
Speaker
I feel like that was such, you cannot change. You're in a category. They put it all in this industry, you're cast this way or that way. They always say shit about the industry. In this industry, if you're late, you're going to lose the client, $17 million. It's like, okay, Tyra. Absolutely. Everything is an overall lesson.
00:16:49
Speaker
Yeah, I feel like, you know, we are in an interesting moment for Tyra, where we really watch her transform in this series. And I in the episodes that we watch, you know, we see Tyra come in almost as like a peer, even though she's kind of a role model. And then by the end, she's like giving inspirational speeches. She's giving
00:17:11
Speaker
Tough talks. Tough talks, which become, of course, a staple of the show. I mean, the most iconic moment of the show is her yelling at that girl in season six, I believe. We're rooting for you. We were all rooting for you. We were all rooting for you. That was iconic, though. When my mother yells at this, it's because she loves me. I was rooting for you. We were all rooting for you. How dare you learn something from this?
00:17:35
Speaker
She definitely, and we saw that change happen. You're right, it's like she has this like peer, like the intro of the show is like, people come up to me all the time and say like, how do I become a model? I wanna be a model. And she's like, well, this is how, this is the show that's gonna make you a model. And then halfway through, she was like, oh shit, but I'm a producer on this show.
00:17:55
Speaker
I think that you could see it in her eyes in the middle of in the middle of the season, which starts getting tough on them and giving kind of lectures. Yeah, she feels the surge of power. I was soapbox man. Yeah. And, you know, like Janice Dickinson, meanest person I've ever seen. Absolutely. Absolute frickin harsh, harsh.
00:18:16
Speaker
Yeah. That's the kind of person who's like, oh, well, I had to be sexually assaulted.
Challenges and Pressures in ANTM: A Deep Dive
00:18:22
Speaker
So you should, too. Totally, totally. And Tyra is always like one of the world's first supermodels in her intro. And it's like the first every episode. No one's keeping track. OK, no one cares.
00:18:34
Speaker
But Janice is incredibly consistent in her bitchiness and harshness. Like, that- Yeah, and also harsh about things that are unchangeable, you know? Harsh about things- Your skin texture. Exactly. Skin texture, your body, you know, no one's gonna want a plus sized girl. It's like, okay, well, she's been cast on this show. You know, you can't just eliminate her for being in that category when that's the reason she was cast. I mean, that's kind of mind boggling to me.
00:19:03
Speaker
Right. You're right. It's like they were always casting for diversity purposes, but there was no way any of them would ever win. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's it's interesting because in this season and season one, their diversity comes up.
00:19:19
Speaker
And I think that in our like modern 2023 lens were sort of trained to look for those intersectional moments. Like we have Ebony who's like this very powerful black lesbian woman who's very like open about that. Yeah.
00:19:35
Speaker
And she's very dark skinned. And you have Robin, who's, you know, who's black and evangelical. And you have Mercedes, who's Latina. And then that's kind of like all that. The only way that it's mentioned. Yeah. Whereas like the diversity in the house ends up being like a militant atheist versus true versus the evangelicals. Yeah. There is a big divide between the Bibles and the non Bibles. Yeah. Like it's.
00:20:01
Speaker
i feel like the overall theme of that entire season the overarching theme is about religion absolutely and like you know the nudity the nudity shoots which like throughout the entire show there's always a person who doesn't want to do the nudity shoots because of the lord the lord himself the lord himself and
00:20:21
Speaker
you know it's the same thing where it's like if you want to be a model you're going to have to get naked and you should know this by now and god will still love you yeah god loves models god loves models even if it's fake nudity even if you're wearing a g-string it's okay a g-string that they can edit out yeah double strap
00:20:39
Speaker
They really went in on the double strap. Yeah. I mean, the Bible is kind of a character in this season of television. Totally. And she pops up all the time in the limo with the Frenchman. It's just like any time Robin can pull out a Bible, she has it on her hip ready to go. Yeah. Like, I wonder if the producers are like, here, just read your Bible in this limo.
00:21:01
Speaker
I do feel like it was interesting because you said American Idol came out 2002. Yeah. So the first season of American Idol comes out in 02. You know, the bachelor comes out in 02 as well. The bachelorette will come out in 03. So interesting. This is really like the emergent. Yeah. I think what's so unique about America's Next Top Model
00:21:27
Speaker
is it's a competition show like American Idol. Yeah. But you have the home life aspect of it, too. Totally like the real world or like I guess they have that on The Bachelor. That's a huge part of The Bachelor. But The Bachelor is not a competition in the same way. It's a talent competition. Yeah. Where like this show is just as much about them at the house in the model loft with the photos of Tyra everywhere as it is about them doing these photo shoots on the roof.
00:21:55
Speaker
Yeah, I think this is kind of one of the first shows that really in the reality format like takes this idea of you have to be talented, sure. But personality and popularity feels like it's equally as much a part of it. Yeah, they do talk about personality a lot on the show and they really harp on like. But they're also just as judgmental about it.
00:22:23
Speaker
oh totally you know there it's like either you're too fat or too thin you're too cheery you're too upset like adrian i guess as a tomboy and they like always made fun of her voice and the way she walked and like how she carried herself and it was always this i don't know it was
00:22:42
Speaker
A point of judgment. For that she wasn't. Some she didn't have the personality of a typical sort of right and model right but at the same time I feel like Adrian becomes the blueprint because.
00:22:59
Speaker
she is the most improved and ultimately that kind of becomes what this competition is about. It's like who can Tyra form totally Tyra force into the mold. Yeah. Yeah. And Adrian takes notes. She does. She she slicks her hair back.
00:23:17
Speaker
you know, whereas the other contestants. Exactly. She puts her hair in the clip. Whereas the other contestants don't take that feedback. Yeah. And they feel like in future seasons, they're much more forceful about that. We're giving you this advice to further your career. Yeah. And they're also way more judgy in future seasons about what they wear to judging. I remember that being such a huge part of it and being like, take off those earrings. Take it in. I don't know.
00:23:42
Speaker
Robin wore that ridiculous hat and they made her take it off, which like, thank God, because that was on my screen for one more second. But they do get way more like specific about that type of thing and presenting like a model and acting like a model, which of course is all fucking made up anyway. Absolutely. Tyra, I think walked her last Victoria's Secret Angel runway in like 2005. OK. So she's still going. She's still going. She's still a model. She's still a model. A working model. And then this is kind of her pivot.
00:24:12
Speaker
to TV. Yeah. And she pivoted. She pivoted. I mean, this show, like I feel like it had a way more of an impact on reality television than it did on the modeling industry. Yeah. Like I can looking at it now, like I watch every single fucking version of RuPaul's Drag Race.
00:24:31
Speaker
And I can I can see it. I can see how this influenced RuPaul's Drag Race. I could see how it influenced Top Chef. Absolutely. It's just the celebrity host that's like sort of a expert, you know, like.
00:24:49
Speaker
whatever judging, encouraging sometimes, the younger generation. Yeah. They're giving like 10 percent mentor, 80 percent judge, 10 percent dictator. Dictator. Yeah. Honestly. Yeah. Yeah. They really break them down.
00:25:08
Speaker
But yeah, you can see it and you can see the pressure cooker-ness of the show change from season to season. In the first season, I was shocked at how often they got to leave the apartment. I was like, oh, they're letting them go out in the city. They're letting them go around Paris and go to Jim Morrison's grave. What a thrill. But I feel like in later seasons, they realized
Tyra Banks: From Model to Media Influence
00:25:35
Speaker
the more they can control them and like really fuck with them, the better the show gets. Absolutely. I mean, that's the reality television model. Yeah. I will say, like, other than Queer Eye, it was kind of my first exposure to gay men in a way. Even the inclusion or the prominence of Jay Alexander. Completely like the first season had an utter lack of misjay. Yeah.
00:26:04
Speaker
Miss J and I think a lot of the queer creatives around who ultimately are the ones who really cultivate the talent, are the art directors, are the stylists, are the ones who really prop up these women who are ultimately being photographed for the male gaze, of course. Naturally, naturally. They take a lot more prominence in later seasons.
00:26:29
Speaker
And that has to be a call by Tyra. I mean, Tyra for all her shit, it does feel like she's sort of taken a backseat because of all the heat she got in the last several years. Race swapping photo shoot. I mean, that was bad. Listen, there were a lot of really cringe things that were done by her hand. You know, the decisions that she made ultimately
00:26:53
Speaker
who again, I can't speak for tires. I don't know if she's like, I'm doing this because I believe that beauty comes in all colors. Like she says that in season, in, in the very first episode, all shapes, all sizes, all colors, like, but at the same time, it's like, you can't help, but notice that the final three of season one are like three way fish white women who are like just so traditionally beautiful, so skinny. Yeah.
00:27:18
Speaker
Well, Elise is a nerd. Elise is a nerd, Adrienne's a tomboy, and Shannon is a Christian. So that's diversity. Everyone fits into a neat, you know, a neat little box. Well, Elise is too smart for her own good. She's so condescending. I mean, in an iconic 2003 crossover moment, she's wearing a Shins t-shirt in one episode. She's wearing a Shins t-shirt. Yeah.
00:27:44
Speaker
Of course, we know later she ends up dating the keyboardist from the Shins who assaults her and is arrested. I did not know that, but I learned that today. Yeah, just a crazy crossover of convergence. But it also tells us a lot about Elise and her alt identity. So alt. Well, she was gonna go to med school, which isn't very alt of her. No, and she never did. Yeah, no, she never did. Adrienne feels like the real...
00:28:13
Speaker
what you said earlier about like it being like she's the oddball and like it ends up like kind of working in her favor and it being like celebrated
00:28:23
Speaker
First of all, not how I remember her at all. Like how she actually is is not how I remember her. I remember her being like just this elegant, beautiful woman. And it just goes to show that when I was 13 watching the show, just because she's like a tomboy who dropped out of high school, it didn't clock as something weird or different. Like I thought Shannon, the Bible girl was weird. Yeah. I mean, and she was. She totally was. Yeah. Not as weird as Robin, the Bible woman. The Bible woman.
00:28:51
Speaker
Well, when I think of George W. Bush and I think of the Bush era, I think of evangelicals. And you're right. Shannon would have loved Bush. Of course. Yeah. Shannon loved Bush. Shannon loved Bush. Speaking of Bush. OK.
00:29:06
Speaker
Oh God, what? Episode one, these women getting their bikini waxes. Oh, they did do that. Yeah, they did do that. They really showed more than you would have thought. Yeah. I mean, Tyra is like a huge was a huge name. Yeah. And a huge draw.
00:29:27
Speaker
And, you know, to her credit, like not every person, not every model can be a host. And she embraced the role and she had a personality and like it doesn't I mean.
00:29:42
Speaker
A lot of it was probably fake. Her personality? Yeah. It reads fake. It does read fake. It reads fake, but that was also part of the appeal of it. I think to get to the level of success that Tyra was trying to convince these women she had, she had to be fake. It's also selling the story that this whole industry is kind of fake.
00:30:06
Speaker
Yeah. Right. I mean, they're telling Adrian, like, don't talk like that. They don't walk like that. Like the blatant racism on the show is fucking wild. Yeah. And with the voice thing specifically, I don't remember what season it was. I think her name was Danielle and I believe she won. Mm hmm.
00:30:22
Speaker
she had a gap in her tooth. And I think they shaved it to make it bigger, or they wanted to shave it to make it bigger. There was something with shaving the gap. No, they wanted it to be smaller. Oh, they wanted to fill the gap. This was part of the reason why Tyra was sort of re-evaluated in the public discwares. Was because they wanted to tighten her up that gap. That clip resurfaced.
00:30:42
Speaker
But she had a southern accent. Yeah. And they didn't like it. They did not like it. No, they did not like it at all. But they had no problem with Shannon's other accent.
Cultural Context of ANTM and Its Impact
00:30:52
Speaker
I had a problem with it. I found it irritating. But Shannon, who was from California, was she?
00:30:58
Speaker
Shannon, they kept calling her Miss California, but maybe that was just because her hair was blonde. I think it was because her hair was blonde and she had a lot of teeth. She had a lot of teeth, perfect teeth, she kept saying. And maybe Adrienne said that. Oh yeah, so Adrienne to say that. One of the most sort of chilling moments was in the makeover episode of season one and Ebony, who already had sort of a close shave
00:31:23
Speaker
Yeah, it was like a near buzz. It had like a. It was a near buzz. She had a little tuft. She had a little bit. Yeah. She had a little tough though, which is I guess it was like kind of mohawk-y, but not even. And they didn't have the right clippers to cut her hair.
00:31:38
Speaker
I thought it was really horrible that her complaint about how inappropriate it was that they didn't have the proper equipment or personnel to give her a proper haircut was grouped in with the same people who like complained about having their hair straightened. Agree.
00:31:56
Speaker
Yeah, it was like, you know, they would list the people who are crying. They'd be like, well, she cried because she had to take out her fifteen hundred dollar weave. She cried because, you know, she didn't want to go blonde. And Ebony's over here crying because they gave her a horrible haircut because they didn't know what they were doing because they were in like a very white salon and she is not a white person. Yeah, it was and they were laughing at her when she was complaining about it. And they were like, really?
00:32:27
Speaker
Disrespectful. There's like probably a whole discourse around like Tyra and blackness that I feel and equipped to discuss. Yeah. But she's constantly like, I don't go around saying I'm black. I'm black, you know. Yeah. But I also feel like in her role, she she clearly cares about giving opportunity to women of color and like mentoring them in specific ways. And so
00:32:54
Speaker
it did feel really uh it just felt really retrograde to have her to have this contestant treated this way for a complaint that was so legitimate i didn't like the way the woman was cutting my hair the way they were having conversations in front of me should we write her name
00:33:15
Speaker
It is uneven. It's very upsetting to an African-American woman to go into a salon and to do her hair incorrectly. It's very inappropriate. It doesn't make any sense to me. She just gets going and cannot stop.
00:33:32
Speaker
And it's a little bit weird. So there were some areas that it's kind of shocking to see, for example, that they clearly film this in a hotel room that's tiny. Very small hotel room. The production budget is very small. Almost depressingly small. Almost depressingly small. It's so much so that Tyra's like, I put them in one room because that's what being a model is like. No, it's not, Tyra. Yeah. It's like, we get it. Your production budget was really low.
00:34:02
Speaker
you know and by like season whatever you know by season seven they're walking into this huge mansion yeah and this it's like they have a quote model's loft and it's like four rooms with 12 beds in each room it's like wild right like two girls have to literally sleep in trundle beds yeah they're trundle beds i forgot about the trundle beds yeah what an absurd twist another thing that's
00:34:28
Speaker
I think also like speaks to the sort of evolution of not just the show, but like the format of reality TV in general is like in this season, it's really cut and dry. Like there does seem to be this sense of like, if you're a model, you're judged on like your walk and you're judged on your photo. And yeah, like some of your photo shoots are going to be uncomfortable or like going to push you. They're going to push you into places that you're not used to going. Right. You might have to be naked. You might have a snake on you.
00:34:58
Speaker
in future in future seasons we have like you have to walk across pebbles in a river wearing nine inch heels like there's this push to the extreme totally
00:35:13
Speaker
in like future seasons whereas this actually feels like it's just sort of the purest of like these are kind of like this is if you were a model you would be given these assignments right in the most basic form right it's like you're going to be naked selling jewelry fine yeah that makes sense yeah i mean a beauty shot with a snake like i've seen wilder things
00:35:33
Speaker
You're right, in later seasons they're like, okay, jump off this building and look pretty. You have one shot, go. Like, oh, no problem. Yeah, like we're going to electrocute you. And Tyra's like, sometimes when you're a model, you get electrocuted and you can't let it impact your face. And I see the electrocution all over your face.
00:35:55
Speaker
Yeah. You don't have what it takes. You don't have what it takes. Where's your neck? Where's longer neck? Longer neck. Your hands look like a claw. It's like, yeah, you were stabbing me in the neck. Adrian's club foot. Oh, God. Well, I guess she has huge feet. I mean, she does have a big feet. She does. At the end of the day, she does. But that was also, you know,
00:36:16
Speaker
her feet only come up in that first episode and she really learns.
ANTM's Narrative and Industry Reflection
00:36:21
Speaker
She learns from Janice's cruelty. She hid those clompers for the rest of the season. Yeah, no, she did learn. She did learn. I mean, I think that probably the strangest challenge was definitely the prove yourself as a lady to these French men. That was so weird. There's no way that that's actually relevant. The challenge has definitely changed.
00:36:43
Speaker
yeah because you're right yeah they were in france it was the final four they had to like eat escargot with these four schlubby fucking french dudes and at the end the men picked which one they thought was like the most ladylike um which one i guess embodied the spirit of couture oh yeah it was about embodying the spirit of couture um naturally yeah
00:37:08
Speaker
Anyway, Adrian won, so clearly it was not about being a socialite. It was a personality contest. It was a personality contest. And obviously she was going to win that. No question. Because she ate the escargot. At least it was close. She was. But she ate the escargot.
00:37:23
Speaker
Yeah, and she engaged them in conversation, whereas Shannon, 18-year-old Shannon, didn't know how to interact. Robin was knee-deep in her Bible. She couldn't be bothered. Robin, not saying one word, reading her Bible in the limo. So good. Unbelievable. So good. Iconic. Honestly, yeah.
00:37:46
Speaker
I feel like if I were the oldest person in the group and were being forced to charm
00:37:56
Speaker
a group of hideous. So ugly. You know, skeezy Frenchmen. I've never seen greasier baguettes in my life. They were so ugly. You know, she said, these guys aren't real social aids. She did say that. I'm not expecting them to participate in this. It's like, let's go and talk to you a night longer. These cat-datted, lustful type of men were there. You could tell about their conversation. They weren't socializing. That's the reason why I tuned them out.
00:38:25
Speaker
That's all she did for like four hours with these dudes with Read the Bible. You know, Robin, for her getting the villain edit, you have to give her credit that she really did say, these are my values and I'm sticking to them. You're right. You're right. And she definitely got the villain edit. She would have been kicked off a lot earlier in future seasons for being so unwilling to bend to Tyra's demands. Right.
00:38:53
Speaker
And I feel like they did. I don't know why they kept her around because it's not like her photo shoots were that incredible. But they kept reiterating like this is what women look like. Like we need to keep her on because like women look like Robin. Like no one looks like a five eight.
00:39:11
Speaker
stunning person. There was like no one under five nine the whole season. Wow. Remember the short girl season? Yeah. They really opened my eyes. Like I never saw a short representation like that in the media. I do feel like
00:39:31
Speaker
Tyra's influence and this idea of a personal brand. Mm hmm. She's planting that seed in 2003. Yeah. More than any other like reality TV. Definitely. You know, judge contestant. Well, because like American Idol, you win a record deal. Yeah, which is big. I mean, for Kelly Clarkson and no one else. But it was big for Kelly Clarkson and.
00:39:57
Speaker
Tyra's whole thing is really about like, what is your one thing? You know, she'd be like, you look like an alien, use it. You have the worst nose I've ever seen. That's your superpower. Like, you know, she would put you down really bad. But also try to like say, what is the thing that makes you you and what makes you unique? And like, what is the thing that is going to make you a superstar? Whatever. Yeah.
00:40:24
Speaker
and build that. And it was usually the thing that she hated the most. She'd be like, Elise, your thing is that you're so smart and you need to use that to your benefit, but also you're so smart and you're so condescending and I hate you and you're out of the competition.
00:40:39
Speaker
I think you are so smart. But one thing with that intelligence is it can intimidate people. And there's a way to use that intelligence in a way that doesn't feel like you're maybe putting down other people or sounding derogatory.
00:40:58
Speaker
her whole like last interrogation where you know they say to her do you believe that modeling is more than just beauty and they sort of but this is the reason why she sent home is because she ultimately doesn't agree with Tyra is because she doesn't take Tyra's yeah she doesn't take Tyra's
00:41:18
Speaker
Yeah. Tyra wants her to say, through this experience, I've learned that modeling is about the inside and the outside. Yeah. Which is ultimately the sort of message that Tyra is trying to instill in people in every season. Also, she's constantly trying to prove that it's a skill. Yeah. You know, like you can be pretty and be a horrible model in front of the camera. You can have like
00:41:39
Speaker
the best face in the world and then the second you try to walk down the runway, you fall on it and you look like a big dumb dumb. It seems like her goal is to prove that she is a skilled individual. I do want to talk about the product placement real fast.
00:41:54
Speaker
I mean, now, when we watch reality TV, let's talk about Top Chef, because I know we both watch it, it's like, and you're gonna win $100,000 furnished by Saran Wrap. On this show, we were watching the first episode, and you were like, why is everyone wearing baby fat? Like, what is that zipper? Is that baby fat? Why is she wearing baby fat? Then, Comorally Simmons is one of the judges. And the final runway is a baby fat runway.
00:42:23
Speaker
I loved the baby fat integration because- It felt seamless. It felt seamless. I was gas lit or whatever. Yeah. Well, I kept saying to you, what's that cat logo? Why is she wearing a cat necklace? Yeah. You were like, I need that necklace. I need a cat necklace. It worked on you.
00:42:44
Speaker
even after 20 years totally of having like saran wrap shoved down our throats yeah you're still falling for it i'm falling for it well because it was such a perfect integration for the season baby fat is also like such a distinct early 2000s brand totally
00:43:03
Speaker
And you know, like the Marie Claire fashion editor was also one of the judges. That wasn't shoved down our throats. But I also didn't come away being like, huh, I need a subscription to Marie Claire. I was like. No, but they are the only reading material we see in the series is the Bible or Marie Claire, which is also.
ANTM's Evolution and Legacy in Reality TV
00:43:24
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. It's like you got you know what the militant atheists are reading and you know what the what the Christians are reading.
00:43:31
Speaker
And it also, like, for whatever reason, I'm like, oh, Wilhelmina models, like the prestige because that was the prize. Like, I would not know what the fuck Wilhelmina models was when I was 13 if it was not for her, her being Tyra. But I know what it is now. And even still, when I think about it, I'm like, oh, damn, that's a good modeling agency. Like, I don't fucking know. I have no idea. I couldn't tell you a good one. And Wilhelmina doesn't last beyond season one.
00:44:00
Speaker
Interestingly, they moved to Ford. Can we just talk real quickly about Amanda from season three saying that her son was conceived to the second on 9-11? Yeah. She was like, I'm a mother and I'm so proud of being a mother and my son was conceived to the second on September 11th.
00:44:20
Speaker
Must be weird for the kid to know that. Must be weird for the kid to know that everyone knows that. I mean, what a beautiful time to be conceived. I do think an interesting thing about 2003, though, is its proximity to 9-11. Oh, totally. I mean, so we know that the girlies go shopping because they have extra time in New York. Yeah. And Adrian,
00:44:46
Speaker
is wearing an NYPD shirt. She is. And then at another time, she's wearing an an FDNY shirt. It's a tank top. It's a spaghetti strap. A spaghetti strap. Yeah, it is. Yeah. And that like lit this little, you know, light bulb in my head of like, oh, we're in New York post 9-11. Yeah. And this is how it's being represented right after 9-11 and even like through 2002.
00:45:13
Speaker
we were in this like lovey-dovey phase, where we were all like, American flags, like let's, you know, remember freedom for us, like let's embrace each other and take advantage of our time that we have. And then by 2003, it feels like that faded and like the jadedness of our generation. And I guess, you know, I guess they're elder millennials, we'll say.
00:45:40
Speaker
geriatric millennial the geriatric millennials really you know you you can see it you can see it in them how how i mean i don't know maybe i'm just reading it into it too much i don't think there's such a thing as reading into it too much i think you're right i mean i think that like part of it is also represented through this christian atheist thing yes right yeah you're so right
00:46:03
Speaker
Let's talk about Adrienne and Elise. And there's a moment in season at the end when they're deciding who's the winner. And they say, fashion is edgy now. Fashion is edgier. When they call Adrienne the future and they say, oh, she's this punk rock girl, she's constantly making the punk rock finger gesture. That's her personal brand.
00:46:25
Speaker
It is her personal brand. And Elise who has this sort of like pixie, the shins, and then that versus like catalog-y Shannon. It does feel like there is this acknowledgement of a more like alternative
00:46:43
Speaker
the incoming of something different. Tyra loved to make broad proclaimments about fashion, and every season she'd be like, you're the future of fashion, you're the future of fashion. She said that every single time. So this was the first time she said it, so maybe she believed it actually. And I can see why she would say that, because it is in direct opposition to the Paris Hilton's that are being shoved down our throats.
00:47:09
Speaker
Okay, so before we finish off our analysis of America's Next Top Model, in the spirit of 2003, what are the aspects of America's Next Top Model's premiere season that you loves? Okay.
00:47:33
Speaker
I love the competition meets home meets real world. Yeah, I love that. I like I feel like that's such a unique thing that America's Next Top Model did that is now so prevalent in every reality show, not every, but a lot.
00:47:57
Speaker
I love Adrian. I love that they made Adrian lovable and like interesting and like a full human being like I think with a lot of reality shows now there's like a characterization where they're like they do put people in buckets and even though they did it with her where they're like you're the punk rock girl you're the Jesus freak whatever.
00:48:17
Speaker
they'd still felt more well rounded. Because Shannon was like, I love Jesus, but I can be goofy and wear weird glasses. It wasn't like as trying to shove people. The edits weren't as honed as they are now.
00:48:32
Speaker
even Elise, like the judges are like, you're smart and that's your thing. But like, Elise was so much more than just the smart person. And we saw that as viewers, even if the judges didn't. So I do feel like the over editing of reality TV hadn't taken over yet. And there wasn't this like, we need to build characters out of these people. It was like, we can just let them be people. And maybe, you know, I do think that change, you could even see that change by season three. Absolutely.
00:49:01
Speaker
I loves. My loves it for America's Next Top Model season one is seeing Tyra at a pure transitional moment, you know, before she sort of became a before she
00:49:21
Speaker
created a character for herself to play as the host of the show when she saw herself as this very fluid entity in the show, kind of a mentor, kind of a teacher, kind of a judge, kind of a dictator, kind of a creative director. There's a brief purity and a brief moment where I feel like we get to see something very sort of real about Tyra, and I love that. My other loves, Daniel Bizarro.
00:49:51
Speaker
Yeah. Just kidding. No, no. We love Daniel Bazzaro, even though he made them posed in a freezing cold.
00:50:01
Speaker
Daniel Bizarro and his assistant Elizabeth Moss. Not to be confused. Different Elizabeth Moss. Different Elizabeth Moss. Yeah. I love how. Well, this is a double edged love. OK. You know, I love that it made it feel accessible to people that you could watch that show and look in the mirror and see a model in yourself. And as a cultural force, I just feel like there was nothing like that before. Yeah. Maybe it's just the age.
00:50:30
Speaker
And we were the perfect slash worst age. Exactly. And that's why it's a double-edged sword. It's like the other side of that is that you simultaneously get the feeling that it could be you, that you have the potential in you. And then the other message that you're getting is you're not 114 pounds, five, 10, like Elise. Yeah. Also, like if you're not getting discovered at the mall, it's because of something that's inherently wrong with you. Right.
00:50:59
Speaker
which for me, it was just wrong place, wrong time. I'm really glad that we watched it because I don't think it's given enough credit for what it did for reality TV. Loves it, it's my Bible. That's another thing I love is like what a time capsule it is to like Bush era cultural differences.
00:51:19
Speaker
And in young women, these 19, 20, 21, and if you're ancient, like Robin, 26 year old women are like embodying that divide. So so drastically. And you can see how so much of it is like self-inflicted. It's like they're forced. They're forcing themselves to choose between, OK, either I'm in love with Jesus or I'm a degenerate. And like there's no spot for in between.
00:51:46
Speaker
America's Next Top Model, change the game, Tyra, problematic queen, but we appreciate her contributions. No doubt. I appreciate her contributions to the world of reality TV modeling.
Podcast Conclusion and Reflections
00:52:00
Speaker
Honestly, I don't know.
00:52:03
Speaker
But reality TV, I watch a lot of it, and I can for sure, like, she did something. Her and Ken Mock. Her and Ken Mock, and actually a later producer of the show, Kenya Barris. No. Yeah? I just got chills. Yeah. Any last comments on America's Next Top Model? Any last memories? I guess I would say I have two photos in my hand. Two beautiful women stand before me, but I only have one photo in my hand. This photo represents a girl who's still in the run into becoming America's Next Top Model. That's it. That's it.
00:52:40
Speaker
So, this week's O3 throwback song of the week was actually requested by multiple people when I first launched the podcast, and that's probably because it's one of the most enduring anthems of that year, Indaclub by 50 Cent. The first single off of 2003's best-selling album, Get Rich or Die Tryin', Indaclub hit number one on March 8th and stayed at the top of the charts for nine weeks.
00:52:58
Speaker
Thank you.
00:53:25
Speaker
Thank you so much for listening to this episode of class of 03. We'll be back next week with another new episode that I'm really excited about. So please subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts. Also rate and review us if you want to nominate a song of the week or
00:53:44
Speaker
Share a story about 2003. You can get in touch at classof03pod at gmail.com. Call us at 724-Class03 or follow us and message us on Instagram at classof03pod.
00:54:01
Speaker
Thank you again to Zoe Klar for joining me today in conversation about America's Next Top Model. I loved it and I loved watching four hours of the show with you. You can follow Zoe on Twitter, Instagram, or TikTok at Zoe Klar and listen to her podcast, Bad Boy Pod. Our show is written, produced, and edited by me, Helen Grossman.
00:54:25
Speaker
And our theme song is by Ruth Schwartz and Evan Joseph of Sawtooth. Our show art is designed by Maddie Herbert of Dane Studio. Class dismissed.