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58. 'Now And Then' - The Beatles (2023)
115 Plays1 year ago
‘Now And Then, We Miss You’
60 years after forming the most iconic band the world has ever seen, The Beatles are back (we still can’t believe we’ve typed this sentence!) with a brand new song and their last ever new single.
Using John Lennon’s voice from a 70s demo, George Harrison’s guitar work from a 90s session and new Drum and Bass tracks recorded by Ringo and Paul in 2023, the Fab Four have continued their legacy as innovators and pioneers by using new AI technology to extract audio and splice these different tracks together to create a brand new song!
In an emotionally charged episode, Laz & Felipe discuss, in detail, the last ever new Beatles song.
Before you listen to the episode, we encourage you to watch the short documentary documenting the making of the song and the music video…
Documentary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APJAQoSCwuA&ab_channel=TheBeatlesVEVO
Music Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Opxhh9Oh3rg&ab_channel=TheBeatlesVEVO
LONG LIVE ROCK ‘N’ ROLL
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Transcript
Introduction and New Beatles Song
00:00:11
Speaker
Hello there, and welcome back to another episode of the Long Live Rock and Roll Podcast with your host, Lazz Michaelides, on this side of the screen, and on the other side, my co-host, Mr. Felipe Ammerim. How you doing, man? All good, man. How are you doing? Good, yeah, very well. Hello, everyone. Yeah, welcome back to another show. This now, we did an American Pie episode, didn't we? The song-only episode a few months ago. And now we're back with another song episode, and we had to do this one because it's rather crucial, isn't it, Felipe?
00:00:40
Speaker
Yeah, there's no way we wouldn't talk about this, right? No, definitely not. What we're doing today is we're going to talk about the new song.
00:00:49
Speaker
Did you hear that Felipe? The new song by the Beatles. It just sounds awkward. Did you ever think you'd say those words in 2023?
Origins and Creation of the New Song
00:00:59
Speaker
No, I was really excited when the song came out, just because I could say the Beatles have released the song again in my lifetime. It did happen before when I was about 11, they released the other two, but it's interesting.
00:01:15
Speaker
Yeah, and I mean, I've never had one in my lifetime, I don't believe. Well, maybe no, I think you're probably one year old when they release the other two. But just revel in this moment, guys, we have got a brand new Beatles song released in 2023. Let's talk about it. And I'm really just talk about it. And I'll tell you why it's because I've made no notes for the episode, because I've listened to the song, I've watched the documentary, I watched the music video, I've read about all the technology used. And I just can't wait to chat to you about it. So let's get going.
00:01:45
Speaker
I think the first thing to know is that the one thing that doesn't make this song a Beatles song, you tell me if you agree, is that this wasn't them all together in a studio writing. This was a demo from John Lennon's recording tapes that he then, that's what they chose to use as the new basis of this new song. So it is a Lennon song, isn't it?
00:02:10
Speaker
Yeah, it's a John Lennon solo song, I would call it like that. It does sound a lot like this stuff he did after The Beatles. Yeah. But you could say the same about Real Love and Free as a Bird, which they release in 1995, if I'm not wrong. If I can, if I can talk a little bit about Anthology before. Yeah. Is the Anthology project
00:02:33
Speaker
was, that was a really ambitious thing that they did back, started in 1994. I believe everything was released in 95. So they basically released what we believed was everything the Beatles haven't released, you know, that they had available somehow. So they released
00:02:56
Speaker
all the the outtakes from studios and so I think there's some live stuff there's like bits and pieces of them talking about interviews and stuff and two brand new songs at a time Real Love and Free as a Bird who is the same thing there were they were demos that that John recorded at home
00:03:17
Speaker
So basically Yoko came to them and said, look, I've got these tapes that John did at home. You guys want to use them. And then George was very excited about it. So the three of them got together again and did that.
Technology's Role in Reviving the Track
00:03:33
Speaker
So one of the songs was Now and Then. So that song
00:03:38
Speaker
couldn't be finished because you couldn't quite isolate John's voice and and bring it up in the mix so because the piano was too loud so it was because you know it's not like it's not like when he was recording demos at home he was doing multi-track recording so he was just playing guitar or piano and singing on top of it so you have one track with all those sounds so it's really hard if you compare now and then with Free as a Bird and Real Love
00:04:07
Speaker
John's vocals are not really that clear in those two songs. There's loads of effects, which is a Beatles thing anyway. He loved to sometimes overdo the effects. It's fine. It's the psychedelic feeling about it. It still works, but it's clearly, for me, a way of kind of hiding the low quality of those recordings. They're not professional recordings.
00:04:30
Speaker
so but they could get away with those two songs but they couldn't do it from now and then and they were running out of time and getting frustrated so George recorded some acoustic guitar some rhythm guitar and they kept it I've probably Ringo and Paul recorded their parts and kept it but they couldn't uh fix the vocals and they gave up so now many years later they
00:04:55
Speaker
they have the technology which came from Get Back, isn't it, when they're doing the movie. Yeah, so let me talk about this part. Let me talk about this part, please.
00:05:04
Speaker
Some subtext, The Lord of the Rings are my favourite movies and my favourite books of all time. Felipe knows how much I go on about it. Oh my God. How did it manage to mention Lord of the Rings in this show? I'll find a way if I can. Peter Jackson is the director of Lord of the Rings and as people know, I will not get too much into it. My love for Lord of the Rings is not appropriate for this show.
00:05:26
Speaker
But during the filming in Lord of the Rings, Peter Jackson and his crew made a lot of technological advancements. You know, little things like in some of the battles, they made it so that the animated figures, if they bumped into one another, they'd go different directions. Little technological advancements that people weren't really used to at the time. And Peter Jackson was always about innovating. What can we do differently? About five years ago, I might be wrong, but around then he found some footage
00:05:54
Speaker
from World War I films that he remastered and he added color to. That's called They Shall Not Grow Old. And he re-energized those videos. Then two years ago, I think, he did the Get Back Project, which was the same kind of thing, taking all of the studio and rehearsal footage for The Beatles recording the, which album was it? Let It Be.
00:06:25
Speaker
Yeah, let it be. Some songs that came out on Abbey Road, they were produced at the time. So they were in this rehearsal and Peter Jackson found the footage, gave it colour.
00:06:36
Speaker
rendered it in 4K so we could all enjoy it more, found the audio, put it together. And that's what we had that come out on Disney Plus a couple of years ago. That was the get back films.
Recording Process and Beatles' Legacy
00:06:45
Speaker
Now, during that process, Peter Jackson and his team found a way to use AI and just technology in general to their advantage. And they were now able, this demo tape that Felipe is talking about, they were now able to split the piano from the vocals.
00:07:03
Speaker
Which is just, I mean even, I know it's 2023, but even that's still remarkable. Well you have some apps now, you know, there's some apps that you can download to your phone, that you can do that with any song. So basically you pick the instruments, it's like, oh, I want to, you know, mute the drums or bring the bass up or whatever.
00:07:20
Speaker
Anyone has access to that kind of technology to the point I would dare to say that if they sent us that that tape, we could have done it at home now like AI is so advanced that you know that technology is now available to pretty much anyone.
00:07:35
Speaker
And it's quite impressive. I'm totally in favor of using this the way they used. And I think it's remarkable that we can hear John's voice crystal clear. Beautiful, isn't it? So just to finish that section off, Peter Jackson then gave the vocals, of course, to Paul McCartney. And then Paul and Ringo got together.
00:07:58
Speaker
re-recorded their parts of drums and bass and some backing vocals and we're in the situation now where we just have the new Beatles song. I still won't get used to saying it, it's not normal, it's not normal. But yeah, I mean, do you want to talk about anything I just mentioned? Yeah, but yeah, yeah, I mean, actually, so in regards to the process, you said they were not recording it together.
00:08:25
Speaker
Yeah, some people would say it was not really a Beatles song because they're not playing together. But how many of this stuff they did back in the day, they were not together in the room. They were like actually one of the first bands to experiment with multi-track recording and they did loads of overdubs. And sometimes, you know, one of them wouldn't be in the studio. They did like a huge chunk of Abbey Road without John in the studio.
00:08:52
Speaker
Um, you know, so, so is that, that kind of stuff. But can I just quickly add, sorry. Can I just add that this world we're living in, look at how you and me are talking now Metallica's new album, 72 seasons was all done through COVID. Sorry, during the lockdowns. So they, that they were apart and they, they write together over zoom and James Hetfield would come up with a riff idea and he played to Lars, just like the way I'm talking to you and Lars would say, yeah, follow that.
00:09:19
Speaker
then they'd get together 24 hours later and James would have finished the song. That's not songwriting as a band, is it? But it doesn't matter. This is the day and age we're living in. Yeah, that's one of ways of writing songs. I'm a big fan, as I said, a million times of like getting together in the studio and jamming until you get to a final arrangement. And the Beatles did a lot of that quite in the beginning, like when they started, but they started experimenting with multi-track recordings and then obviously did a lot of stuff
00:09:49
Speaker
that didn't include all of them, like the ballad of John and Yoko is actually only Paul and John, no one else is in the track. So that's one example. So Paul played the drums and the bass and I think the piano, John did the guitars and the vocals. So there's even proper Beatles songs. So what I would say, right,
00:10:09
Speaker
uh not that i think there should be an argument about oh is this a Beatles song but what i would say is uh what makes it different is John wasn't writing those songs to be recorded by the Beatles so that is the main difference right there's loads of songs he did back in the day they would write alone
00:10:30
Speaker
but to be part of a Beatles album. So they would bring their contributions and maybe even add to the song writing itself. There's a difference between just writing the song and arranging the song. So Paul was a guy that would come up, according to John himself, Paul was a master of the middleweight.
00:10:48
Speaker
which is that eight bars in the middle of a song that there's that one part that only happens once in the song that kind of takes the song to a different direction so it doesn't get boring you know so John said that many times he got stuck and Paul would come with a middleweight in one attempt and just do it and it would be perfect
00:11:05
Speaker
so yeah so sometimes they would write songs separately and someone else would contribute to something and also there's the the whole environment when you're in a band and someone would come up with an idea like a hard day's night was a phrase that Ringo said uh eight days a week was another thing that Ringo said he doesn't get the credit as songwriter but he gave the names to those songs
00:11:26
Speaker
Yeah, some of the most famous times. So without Ringo, those songs wouldn't exist in a certain way. So not only without his drumming, without his ideas. So being surrounded by your bandmates is completely different than being at your apartment writing songs. And what John did with Real Love, Free as a Bird, and Now and Then was exactly that. He was in the Dakota Building in New York.
00:11:53
Speaker
just playing around and fiddling with his guitar and piano and writing some stuff. And that wasn't meant to be Beatles recordings, right? But one thing I want to say as well is that he never ruled out...
00:12:10
Speaker
Maybe when they finally split up, they were not considering it a reunion right away, but Lennon didn't rule out coming back as a band again. So he mentioned there was an interview, they said, yeah, I'd like to play with the boys again and something like that. So they were considering at some point to do that reunion. And as tragic as it is that John left us too early,
00:12:36
Speaker
uh we didn't have that reunion and I would say there wasn't a chance for the Beatles to mess up like as a four piece band they didn't get together like let's say in the 80s to record something that would be way worse let's
00:12:54
Speaker
potentially way worse than what they did in the 60s. So like that tragedy kind of spared us from a possibility of something bad that could come out of the Beatles actually getting together in student recording, but it could have been a masterpiece. We will never know. I agree with you that something that is so mythical and legendary about the Beatles is that
00:13:22
Speaker
What they achieved in those seven years was mind bending. I still can't believe the breadth of work. I mean, some of the stuff they've done, and we spoke about it in our episode, I think it was episode 22, Rubber Soul, so go and check that out if you haven't listened to it. They were always innovating, pioneering, pushing the boundaries of technological advancements,
00:13:52
Speaker
songwriting, genre mixing, they were always doing it. And they did it one year after another. It's not like, you know, when you think, I just think go back to Metallica again, there was like eight years between one album and then another six years between the album. And it's fine. I don't mind that. If you're touring and giving the fans live shows, I don't mind that. But the Beatles in the 60s was a very different time, admittedly.
00:14:13
Speaker
But to top each album, each album just got better and better and better. And to do that in seven to eight years is just such an achievement. And it's because it just kind of ended so abruptly on the rooftop that I think that almost cements their legendary status. Because you're right, if they'd have come back in the 80s,
00:14:35
Speaker
God, I could have been a masterpiece, but knowing what the 80s was like and what pop music in the 80s was like. There's a certain, I don't know, there was a curse with the 80s. It just doesn't work.
00:14:47
Speaker
I would not like to. They would probably add their ridiculous reverb on this neotram. And synths all over the place, keyboards, you know. The Beatles used keyboards, don't get me wrong, but appropriate keyboards. But yeah, the legendary status about them is because they ended on such a high note. But then all four of them went off and did their own different thing with not equal success, but near high success for all of their solo work.
00:15:14
Speaker
Yeah, you always got the feeling this is, I don't know, this is not the Beatles, but it's the next best thing. Yeah, exactly. That's exactly what you think when you listen to the solo stuff. So in that sense, I would say clearly to me, this song is a Lennon song performed by the Beatles. So which, to be fair, they did a lot of that, you know, writing songs alone and just recording as a band. The difference is that song wasn't
00:15:43
Speaker
uh written when they were together so uh so obviously there's there's gonna be loads of people talking about they shouldn't have done this like i remember uh you know back in the day when they came up with anthology uh and they released the first uh two tracks and um because this i see this project as a continuation of of that so like like the third song uh but
00:16:08
Speaker
When they came up with the idea, we got together, the three of us, they actually played together in studio, which is super cool. But they said we needed to have John's voice in it. We couldn't call it the Beatles. And that's kind of a clever thing in terms of marketing. You can't criticize them for using the name, the Beatles, without the word. They have never used the Beatles as a brand.
00:16:29
Speaker
if you don't have the four of them involved in the in the in the in the album, maybe a couple of tracks that some people wouldn't be there, but they didn't do that project back in 1994, 95 as a three piece. They could have, you know, imagine post, oh, you know, I got some of my my songs here and George could have said the same, like, let's just record a few of us. And I think some people would dig it. But lots of people would say, oh, that's not the Beatles because John is not there. They shouldn't have done it. But loads of people were criticizing them for doing it whilst John is not here.
00:16:59
Speaker
But I would say, you know, why not? Yeah, I feel like they've done, again, this just adds to their legendary status, the one saying about, I feel like they've just done everything right.
Ethics and Challenges of Completing the Song
00:17:09
Speaker
They've never, they never seem to have made a decision where you go, oh, do you know what, that's not a good look for George, Paul and Ringo. You know, the example you just gave, imagine they bought their own songs and tried to call it the Beatles without John.
00:17:21
Speaker
That is a point where I would have gone, do you know what? I mean, I get it. And they've never done anything wrong like that. There was talk before this song came out, Paul McCartney. I don't know if anyone heard this or saw it on the news or anything. A few months ago, when they were preparing to record this song, Paul McCartney comes out and he says, I think he comes out with a statement, something like, oh, we've used AI to get John's voice back. And people were like, took that headline. They were like, whoa, hold on.
00:17:51
Speaker
you mean you've ai generated john's voice no how you can't you can't do that this is wrong so there was a bit of an upheaval about it but they thought they were recreating his voice but paul didn't exactly get it right they were using ai through peter jackson's technology to split the vocals apart from the piano so let's put that for anyone who thought it's an ai voice it's not this is john's voice from a demo he recorded on a tape in the 70s mixed with
00:18:20
Speaker
some George Harrison guitar work from the mid-90s, the rhythm guitar section if I'm not mistaken, then drums and bass and backing vocals from 2023.
00:18:31
Speaker
And it's a Beatles song, man. I don't care. It's a Beatles. Yeah, it is. And it's, yeah, let's talk about the song, right? So it's, it's, um, the one thing, right, I would say is, can I ask you before you go in, did you like it? I loved it. Yeah. Okay. I loved it. I really liked it. And, uh, I even got one of my students to play. So it was teaching the other day. I'm a drum teacher as well. And, uh,
00:18:56
Speaker
uh one of my students she was a Beatles fan and she was learning Come Together and then and they say let's play the new Beatles song how weird it is to say let's play the new Beatles song uh and yeah so please carry on please no so one thing about the song for me um
00:19:15
Speaker
This is where I think it could have damaged John's legacy in a certain way, but that's not what I think, but it could have in the sense that I would consider that those tapes are not only unfinished songs, but the songwriting itself is unfinished.
00:19:38
Speaker
Do you understand? What is an unfinished song for me? Let's say I've finished lyrics, melodies, and the chord progression for a song, and I do it on the guitar, and I send it to you and say, Las, this is the song. The melody is there, the lyrics are there, so can you do some bass and keyboards and whatever?
00:19:59
Speaker
and then you go there and record the instruments. So you're doing the arrangements, but you're not actually touching the essence of the song. You know, you could, you know, let's add a verse or a middle eight, whatever, no, but let's say you're just going to finish what we call the arrangements, the instrumental parts of it and back and vocals and all that stuff. But you could say the songwriting process is finished
00:20:24
Speaker
When you do a guide track and send it to someone to put the instruments on top of it, the songwriting process is most of the time is finished. So you're arranging and not writing is a different thing. So this whole thing makes me think that maybe John hasn't finished those songs.
00:20:44
Speaker
Maybe he wanted to add a middle weight. Maybe he wanted to change the lyrics for the chorus. So basically the Beatles were finishing arrangements for a composition that probably wasn't final, which should be saying, why not? So are you saying that you feel that
00:21:08
Speaker
John might not have been happy with this new song because it wasn't the way he intended it or it needed more. Maybe he thought it needed more.
00:21:19
Speaker
Listen, if you watch the 12 minutes documentary, I know you've watched it. Yes, so quickly, guys, in the description below, I should have said this at the start, really, but we do recommend that you A, listen to the new song, obviously, B, listen to it via the music video, the official music video, because there's loads of lovely footage. And they've done a few nice little bits where they've got
00:21:45
Speaker
2023 pool and then they've superimposed some 1960s pool in it's really it's quite nice and then there is a 12-minute documentary the links for all these will be in the show notes below um but the documentary is fantastic because it really shows the process of what they went through uh what happened in each decade to get to where they got to today um so yeah the links are down below make sure you check them out sorry for the bit please Karen so i'm saying like um it's it's not like
00:22:14
Speaker
necessarily a song that was completely finished as a song itself before.
00:22:22
Speaker
before adding anything else. So yeah, some people might claim this like, well, it's not really, not even a finished song. And they, I don't think so in this song specifically, they didn't add more lyrics or an extra verse or anything. They just put their parts on it, right? Well, it feels like quite a simple song, doesn't it? There's not much movement. It doesn't really go around sections. We know the beat was quite simple. You know, verse, chorus, bridge, chorus, outro. But this does feel very simplistic.
00:22:50
Speaker
Yeah, it's the same formula that they used in terms of what they play on the song as well. It's the same formula they use for the other two songs they release in 95. So like a slide guitar, a very straightforward drum beat which Ringo was really creative. He would use the toms to kind of build a groove for this song. It was very straightforward kind of
00:23:10
Speaker
rock and roll groove, and the BVs, everything they did was pretty much in the same style, like it sounds to me. So as I said, if you watch the documentary, it sounds to me that they're trying really hard to not mess up with the Beatles legacy. And there's some points where John's son and Paul are talking about, oh, he would be happy with us doing this. So they constantly justifying
00:23:38
Speaker
doing it. I think they were like kind of aware that some people say we shouldn't have done it and then they throughout the documentary Paul says a couple of times oh yeah John would be so happy that we're doing this like oh he was totally in favor of using the the last you know technology available for whatever so it's like saying you know guys John would love this uh yeah uh maybe they didn't even need to say that and I would say one thing Yoko is the one person
00:24:06
Speaker
who is responsible for whatever John left behind. If someone has the right, if some person who is here, alive at this moment in time, is entitled to decide what happens with John's music, that would be Yoko. No one knew him better than her. I'm just looking through because I believe, I'm just doing a quick Google, because I believe that Yoko handed the tapes
00:24:36
Speaker
No, no. Yeah, she didn't. She did. Yeah. She got in touch with George, if I'm not wrong, and said, Look, I've got some tapes. That's that's how they started the project. Yes, that's correct. Yeah. Yeah. This is not 2020 with Peter Jackson. This is the 90s. Yeah. No, they had it since the 90s. So basically, what I'm saying is, if anyone has the right to the side of
00:24:59
Speaker
anything about whatever John has left for us. I think Yorgos is the person for that. I mean, she was his wife and she was the closest person to him. So she says John would be happy with this. Well, it's a bit
00:25:15
Speaker
I mean, how can I argue with her on that? Like, oh, no, John wouldn't like it if she says he would. And if she decided, so I think it's fair enough, you know. Yeah, it's just it's more that if you if you look at it, you could definitely look at it from an economic point of view if if Paul or Ringo were coming out saying, right, we're going to do a song. And it was only then
00:25:36
Speaker
And I don't want to accuse them, they're all nice people, but you know, you could, someone with, what's the phrase? With a cynical eye, we could look at that and say, oh, they're just trying to make money now. But the fact that, as you said, Ryoko has given her blessing, given the tapes to George or Paul, said, listen, this is what John would have wanted. And
Significance of the Beatles' Last Song
00:25:55
Speaker
I think it's great. Yeah, so this man's, you know, widow and son said, go on and do it. So, you know, so, but, okay.
00:26:05
Speaker
All of that, in the end, let's say, let's play a what if game. I like these. I wrote a list of what ifs. Okay. So what if we actually knew what was John Lennon's choice? What if he said, no, that song isn't finished. I don't want it to be recorded by the band. And maybe we're still a bit frustrated about the fact that there's a song that could have existed as a Beatles song. And it didn't. What if
00:26:33
Speaker
they were playing together and actually going through the song together and writing it together. But yeah, but they did so much of like, so much motor track recordings and so much stuff as individuals, not only as a band, whilst they were a band. So I think it's irrelevant.
00:26:56
Speaker
But my main question would be what if they simply didn't do it, even considering that Yoko gave them the tapes and a lot of people wanted to listen to it and they said now let's just not finish this last song. So it's been advertised as the Beatles last song and it will be the Beatles last song because they have
00:27:21
Speaker
They haven't got anything else left to release. And that's the last time they got together to do something with John's voice in it. And remind you, George, I think he only played the acoustic guitar.
00:27:34
Speaker
really didn't do the slide. Yeah, nothing else. Nothing else. Yeah. So there's not much more of George George recordings left to be used. So that is the last Beatles song. So what if they didn't do it? Would you be happy to just to know that this song was let me answer they didn't finish. Let me answer that because what this has done to me for me in about 2018 I
00:28:01
Speaker
I'd heard all the hits of the Beatles, obviously you come together as your hard days, nights, but you remember this because this is when we started touring together. In 2018, I discovered the Beatles properly, went through every album, listened to them, tens of times each album, picking my favorite songs.
00:28:18
Speaker
through the whole discography or the anthology and that is I studied them, I studied the music theory behind it, you know what kind of key songwriting aspects Paul and John used all this stuff, studied the history of the Beatles, I just fully immersed myself and I was forever grateful that I did that because as any musician will tell you when your world is opened up to the Beatles it's how simple
00:28:45
Speaker
they make good songwriting that just connects to any musician because you hear a song and you think, God, I wish I could write a melody that was that simple yet so effective. God, I wish I could do a solo that worked like that, that actually doesn't require hours and hours of practice. The Beatles for every musician, and I don't want to take this away from non musicians as well, for every fan just showed how good pop music could be and how original and raw and organic it could be.
00:29:16
Speaker
So because of this, I say I love The Beatles. They are one of my top 10 favorite bands. I think that's, yeah, goes without saying. I forever, I knew I was never gonna go and see them. I knew I was never gonna see them live, obviously. You know, John died 15 years before I was born.
00:29:34
Speaker
But there was always the unanswered questions of what if, just you said, what if they did a tour? I mean, I know George's past as well, so I wouldn't really be that appropriate. But what if they did a tour with AI holographic things of them? Would I go and see it, would I not? My point is that this has been an incredibly emotional couple of weeks for me.
00:30:02
Speaker
Even as someone who has only had the band in their life for five or so years, seeing this was very emotional. And at the end of the music video, you know, they take the bow and Paul and George, Paul and Ringo, sorry, George and John fade out of the video two seconds before Paul and Ringo do. And I honestly, I was close to tears, man. The whole thing has just been a fantastic closure.
00:30:32
Speaker
the Beatles. That's the best word I could think. Closure. I am so proud and I'm going to be able to go to my kids and say I was there when the final Beatles song was released. But Dad, what do you mean? The Beatles started in 1962. How can you be in there in 2023? Well, let me tell you how. I was there for the last ever Beatles song and
00:31:00
Speaker
which is feeling a little emotional now it was overwhelming watching that documentary because five years ago I watched all these behind the scenes videos I watched the the crappy footage of this that and the other I heard them how they put this song together and then three years ago I got to watch the get back movie which was fantastic and that was another little thing of oh this is what the Beatles did back in their day but what the Beatles always did so well was use technology and
00:31:31
Speaker
yeah, technological advancements to their level, whether it was in the mid 60s and they were playing around with switching the tape around on Revolver or putting in backwards piano solos, they always had a knack for doing what was innovative and pioneering. And they've done it again here by using AI technology to split apart a demo and get John Lennon's voice for us. It's funny. It's just so romantic. It's such a romantic end.
00:31:58
Speaker
that John has been gone for 43 years now but his work is still with us and then we can still get something out of this and it's just absolutely thrilled me. Yeah I think it's funny that we grew up watching sci-fi movies where
00:32:20
Speaker
When the rise of AI happens, it's always a tragedy and it's always the end of the world. The machines are going to try to take over this and that. And AI is real to a high level now and it has given us
00:32:38
Speaker
somehow a Beatles song in 2023. So yeah, maybe the end is near, but for now, AI has helped us. So what I'm saying- Can I ask you something? No, I was just asking you, because you are older than me by about 10 years or so. 10 years, yeah.
00:32:55
Speaker
You have liked the Beatles for longer than me. I'd say you have a better relationship with them because, you know, you said several times on this show, you have lots of bands that you like, but in terms of bands you love, there's like five, isn't there? And the Beatles are one of them. Did you feel emotional when you were listening to this?
00:33:16
Speaker
man, as emotional as I can get. It's like, yeah, I'll tell you, I'll tell you my first experience with the Beatles, probably my first attempt of singing along with a song ever in my life was when it was a little kid. And that movie came out at Ferry Biller's Day Off. Is that the name? Yes. Yeah. Ferris. Yeah. Yeah. So. So that movie, so did the main character sing, twist and shout?
00:33:45
Speaker
at the end of the movie. And I was like, I want that song, I wanna have it. So it would play on the radio or whatever, but I was just asking, I wanna sing along with that song, I wanna listen to that song again and again. So my mom got me this Beatles tape, I guess, I think that was it. And so I had a way of listening to that song and I would listen to it twist and shout over and over and over. I didn't know that they were the Beatles, I didn't know they were from the UK, I didn't know who John Lennon was.
00:34:14
Speaker
but then I was listening to Jones like
00:34:19
Speaker
screaming vocals at the end of their first album, isn't it? That's where that song was. So that was my first real experience with music when I fell in love with the song. And I was a young boy, so I didn't understand English, of course. I could barely speak my own language. I was learning stuff.
Musical Magic and Production Contributions
00:34:40
Speaker
And I was like, I want the song going. I love that. I love that song. And I wanted
00:34:45
Speaker
I wanted to listen to that song all day.
00:34:49
Speaker
thinking like, you know, 30 odd years after that, and the Beatles, they touched my heart again, you know. And it's like, when I was listening to it, here's my first impression. So we talked about this one day, I think I was on a bus, and I put it on my headphones, you know, noise cancelling, all that shit. So it's like, I'm in my own world listening. So yeah,
00:35:19
Speaker
So the bass comes in, John's voice is saying, yeah, yeah, it's all right. It's all right. It's all right. When Ringo plays a couple of hits on this near.
00:35:29
Speaker
to bring it to the chorus. I was like, fuck yeah, this is the beat. It is the beat. When you hear those simple drum fills, but they're so effective. It's so intense and the way he plays that he's got that swing that only Ringo has. And as a drummer, I can recognize that. And I was like, yeah, Ringo is there. So to listen to Ringo playing your fill,
00:35:52
Speaker
and leading to the chorus and John's voice is there. Just like, man, I can't stop smiling. I'm so happy. Just this for me is worth it. And I'm so glad that Paul and Ringo got together to finish this because I think it's just beautiful. Okay. Let's say, let's say for real that it wasn't great. It wasn't, it's not one of their best songs. I think the whole emotion
00:36:16
Speaker
behind it is the story, you know, behind the song, more than anything else. Yeah, just one thing.
00:36:24
Speaker
If it wasn't great, I would say, yeah, good effort, boys. Many thanks for doing this again for the fans, right? Because they don't need it. They don't need the money or the fame or anything. So thanks for doing this anyway. But it is a beautiful song. And it's so funny that the one song they couldn't finish back in the day, they finished now. It's so poetic. The lyrics like, now and then I miss you.
00:36:51
Speaker
Isn't it beautiful? There's speculation about what the lyrics are meaning. Some people think that it's talking about Yoko, just a general love song. Others, and maybe this is a bit too romantic, you know, tell me what you think, but others think this is a message to Paul. It could have been, yeah. Regardless, I'm a fan of not knowing and
00:37:15
Speaker
interpreting the lyrics in a way that speaks to you. So Felipe, you do what you want, but I'm going to interpret this as a John message to Paul and Paul and Ringo, as you said, come together to finish this song. I just can't stop smiling, man, when I think about this song because that they are a band of such epic proportions in everything they did, in the legacy that they left, in the fact that all four of them, excuse me, all four of them,
00:37:45
Speaker
afterwards proved that they were talented enough people that they could have a career on their own.
00:37:54
Speaker
But when all four of them came together, they made this band that was unlike anything anyone else has heard ever, The Beatles. They're the best band in the world. There you go, I'll say that. The best band in the world. And this legacy they've left behind that all four of them left The Beatles and went on and wrote incredible music, but it just never touched the music of how good it was when all four of them got together. And I just think that we've got the same thing here because you've got John, again, whether or not he intended it for The Beatles, I don't care.
00:38:24
Speaker
You've got John writing one of his songs, his vocal melodies, his chord progression. Then in the 90s, when they tried and tackled it, you've got George doing exactly what he did so well, vibing some rhythm guitar, and I suppose some lead, into the song. How can I make this work? What can George Harrison do that George Harrison normally does to make this song work with my guitar? So we've got some of George. And then in the end, we've got Paul and Ringo back to do the drums, the bass, and backing vocals.
00:38:53
Speaker
And I just feel like when you look back on all their work and you understand how closely they work together, and I got this from watching the Get Back movie, the three parts, really, really good. They knew each other so well. Don't you think, Felipe? They knew each other so well. And I think that Paul and Ringo, despite what anyone wants to say, I think in their heart, they knew, and I think they probably did do, what they,
00:39:23
Speaker
thought John would have wanted. Does that make sense? I don't think, I don't think Paul, although he had the chance to, I don't think Paul went, yeah, you know, John's written this kind of bridge, but I'm going to do it here because I'm Paul McCartney. I think going back to what you said 10 or 15 minutes ago, they were doing this to honor John, as well as meet some new Beatles. So that's, that's why I believe I'm so happy. I'll say, I think there was so careful with not going
00:39:52
Speaker
too far from what a Beatles song could be. If they were recording this in the mid-60s, they would probably experiment and do something unpredictable, but they were predictable in a good way. They intentionally added loads of
00:40:11
Speaker
very typical Beatles ideas and the strings were written and conducted by Giles Martin, who was George Martin's son. So that's part of the legacy. So George Martin was the Beatles producer, he was the guy who actually guided them
00:40:34
Speaker
through discovering music in many ways and classical music and he was the guy in charge of arranging the strings and reducing the band since the early days and stayed with them for a long time. For those who don't know who George Martin was, it's kind of like he was more than a producer. Didn't they call him the fifth Beatle? He was called the fifth Beatle. Because he had so much of an impact on their music and not him being a normal producer and being like,
00:41:00
Speaker
guys the label wants more songs about love so come on let's write well you know he they give him songs and they just be like george go and do your thing and he put orchestras behind it any am i am i right in thinking any beatles song that has an orchestra that's george mine oh no not all of them because i think uh letty b was another yeah i think he did well is there's a couple of albums he's not part of it but for most of their career it was him and yeah you should can you google that lass how can i
00:41:30
Speaker
how can i have forgotten the name of the guy who did let it be because they released a verse so i wasn't happy with the strings in let it be on all the orchestral stuff that's why they released let it be naked which is the same album but only with with them without without the orchestra so i've got the answer for you the only one he didn't produce was let it be
00:41:51
Speaker
Yeah. So he produced everything. And that was given to Phil Spector for those issues. Yeah, Phil Spector, of course. But yeah, George Martin worked so closely with the Beatles. And again, if this reunion could have been made any better, it would be by getting George Martin's son to produce the strings.
Upcoming Episodes and Music Video Critique
00:42:08
Speaker
And again, it is another... It's a tribute, isn't it? It's a tribute.
00:42:12
Speaker
to George. To George Martin, to have his son as part of it. And obviously he wanted to do the best job to honor his dad. It's just so poetic. I don't think... Bar John and George still being alive, and we discussed this at the start of the episode, if they were still alive, we don't know where we'd be now. But Bar George and John being alive, this is the most fitting end you could have to a Beatles career.
00:42:41
Speaker
Yeah. 63 years, man. 60 years after they got together, releasing their final ever single. I still can't believe it, but I've had a few weeks to sit with it.
00:42:55
Speaker
Oh, I just feel emotionally drained man. Like the Beatles means so much to me. And this is why I'm asking you because I've only been one of my favorite bands for five years and you've lived with them like your entire life. It's like, it's just made me so emotional to listen to that song. And it's like, I don't care what people are going to say. Like there's always going to be negative comments about, you know, they shouldn't have done it. Oh, it's not the greatest Beatles song. Well, my main thing is
00:43:22
Speaker
Isn't it so much better than the average crap fuck music that we can listen on the radio now? Jesus. I mean, first of all, you're correct. And second of all, it's proven because they're top of the charts again. Oh, yeah. And now, I mean, after all these years, we have the Beatles and the Stones on the charts again.
00:43:44
Speaker
And someone would still say rock and rollers die. Yeah. There's a little little spoiler there for people. So the next episode, we've got a very, very incredible interview lined up, which we can't wait to do. The episode after that, we're doing a different album, which we haven't quite chosen yet. But the episode after that, we're going to be doing the Rolling Stones new album as well. So it's like, yeah, we need to talk about this. The Beatles and Stones, a new single that you have.
00:44:11
Speaker
But yeah so look forward to that and make sure you join us for all our episodes of course. Do you think about the video that you think there's any like a best and worst moment in the video for you? Well because there's a couple of things I didn't like about the video but just let me give you my opinion on the song because I haven't given that yet.
00:44:35
Speaker
I liked it and I agree with you. It's far from the best ever Beatles song, but I thought it did a job. There's one thing, one thing I didn't like, but I get why it's there. Paul's backing vocals that he recorded this year because he sounds old. I don't know if anyone agrees with me, but he sounds old and you can just kind of hear John's mature 1970s voice. Yeah.
00:45:00
Speaker
mixed with Paul McCartney's old 2023 voice. You can just, you can hear him in the back of the mix. Listen, it's been mixed really well, I have to say. It's not incredibly obvious, but it's because, you know, you just hear him like, then I miss you. And like, well, I'm not trying to, this is no, this isn't a lass on me. That's such a bad impression. That's a no, but that's, I think that's an accurate impression of how he sounds now.
00:45:26
Speaker
yeah this isn't allows unleashed because i love the song but yeah listen the only thing that threw me off was hearing Paul McCartney's old voice harmonizing but the song's called now and then now Paul McCartney now and then John Lennon i've got no issues with it would you like would you like to listen to that song without backing vocals wouldn't be a Beatles song and i'll tell you my favorite moment of the video is when you see Ringo and Paul
00:45:54
Speaker
sharing a microphone for the bvs and it's just absolutely beautiful one thing i didn't like about the video i thought it didn't look entirely good and i believe the video was directed by peter jackson um so yeah very rare for me to criticize something peter jackson does um the super imposing when they got george and john dancing next to paul and ringo at certain stages i
00:46:19
Speaker
I don't know. That part, and when Joan was kind of conducting the orchestra, those parts looked a bit creepy. Yeah, it didn't feel exactly right. But I like when they had young Paul with
00:46:36
Speaker
you know, old Paul, old Paul, old Ringo and young Ringo. Yeah, that is okay for me. You know, but when they put the four of them together, I like when they show a footage of the four of them young together. And it's just a weird thing is it feels me like literally, there's a ghost in the room. When they when they bring the other two in the same image, maybe that could have been avoided. But again, it's just an opinion, you know, and it's, yeah, and I've had to really rack my brains to think what do I not like about this whole thing?
Final Reflections and Listener Engagement
00:47:05
Speaker
there's very little pull pulls backing vocals are not perfect in my opinion and one or two little moments in the videos i thought were a little yeah i don't know cringy is that the word but man oh yeah 2023 and the new Beatles song i'm just gonna say again and i'll just sort of say that
00:47:25
Speaker
We're trying to be alive. We're trying to be alive. You know what my dad used to say to me, oh, you know, I was around when the Beatles and the Stones were playing on the radio every day. I say, yeah, I can say that now, old man. We can say that now, yeah. I'll read my dad and I'll say.
00:47:45
Speaker
You know that thing you said I'd never experienced? Well, listen to this. Brilliant. Do you have anything more to add? Yeah, one thing I want to say is I always believe that music is
00:48:00
Speaker
In the worst case scenario, the best excuse to get people together is just an excuse. As well crafted as it might have been and as good as the songwriting can possibly be, etc, etc.
00:48:19
Speaker
People go to gigs because they want to see their favorite musicians and be surrounded by people who like the same sort of stuff. So you do a party and you play some music so everyone can connect better.
00:48:34
Speaker
So I think it's amazing that music has this power of connecting people for real. And he has reconnected the Beatles after all these years and reconnected them with all of us. So yeah, because, you know, every now and then I miss them. Well, you know, I titled this episode, you know, I titled these episodes. So if we do an album episode, the official title of the episode will be
00:49:00
Speaker
Uh, rather sold the Beatles 1965, just so people know, but then I do, I try and do a kind of little funny title, which might be a pun on one of the song names. And this episode is called now and then we miss you. Yeah. Because I think this really has brought up a lot of happiness, sadness, John and George not being with us. Happiness that Paul and Ringo still are at their old age. Um,
00:49:27
Speaker
emotion that they never thought they'd hear another Beatles song, another new Beatles song again. Emotion from hearing John's voice on a tape in his apartment a few years before he died. Hearing George's guitar on the track, you know, five years before he died. It's just been an incredibly emotional experience, but it's one I'm so happy that I've been a part of and been in here to experience.
00:49:59
Speaker
Amazing, isn't it? Yeah, I just I want to laugh. I want to cry. It's just overwhelming. Yeah, it's just overwhelming because anyway, no monologues today because I will cry. And I didn't prepare when I feel like everything I've said. The one thing my conclusion would be John was probably the most honest songwriter of his time. I think his lyrics were, you know,
00:50:29
Speaker
they were a reflection of his true feelings about everything else. And when you consider that he hasn't finished the song and he was, or, you know, we never know if he intended to release that or not. So there's no reasons to fake anything in it. So it's a true, honest reflection of his feelings in a moment in time. And it's about missing good moments with people you love.
00:50:58
Speaker
So it doesn't matter how you want to twist it around and say, well, it's not about the Beatles reunion, it's not about Yoko's, it doesn't matter. It's about the feeling of, you know, we had good times and then I missed those good times. And then the Beatles got together once again and gave us
00:51:18
Speaker
some more good times and help to create more memories, which is absolutely beautiful. And I said these memories will live with me forever. I remember the first time I heard the last ever Beatles song.
00:51:35
Speaker
Yeah. Guys, thank you for joining us on what has been a especially emotionally charged single song episode. But I think there was no other way we could have done it had to be a whole episode dedicated to this song. So it's just too important. Let us know in the comments on YouTube. Write to us if you
00:51:54
Speaker
if you care that much. What did you think of the song? Did it touch you emotionally? Even if you didn't like the song, could you appreciate it? So be sure to get in touch and let us know. As usual, please hit all the buttons to follow us. Give us a like, a follow, a subscribe. If you're listening to us, give us a review on Spotify or Apple. Please, any review really helps us and pushes us up the charts. If you're watching us on YouTube and seeing our lovely rock and roll faces and beards,
00:52:21
Speaker
then please give us a subscribe, like the video, share us with anyone you think might enjoy the content we do because, you know, we're an independent podcast, we do it because we love the music and the response we've gotten from these last 50 episodes has been incredible and there's been many more to come. So thank you again for joining us on this Long Live Rock and Roll podcast episode.
00:52:46
Speaker
Yeah, thanks for listening to us again and for all the support since the first episode. And yeah, keep on rocking everyone. And as usual, take care and long live rock and roll.