Transcript
Tim Sackett: Hey everybody. It's another episode of the Frontlines Podcast. I'm Tim Sackett, one of your hosts. I'm with my BFF, Madeline Lorano. Another host, Madeline, how are you doing?
Madeline Laurano: I'm doing well, Tim. It is good to be here. weve I mean, we spent... all of spring and summer on the road together. And now I miss you. It's fall and I haven't seen you in three weeks.
Tim Sackett: I know. I think it's yeah it's coming up. A couple of weeks, we'll we'll be at RecFest. And we have a guest with us, Steve White, who is the current TA leader at Gap. Gap Inc., the clothing store.
Tim Sackett: Steve, how are you?
Steve White: I'm doing great. You're doing great, Tim. and Madeline. i appreciate you guys having me um always a pleasure to be around you guys i'm not just saying that
Tim Sackett: and we're We're all going to be at RecFest USA, so that'll be cool. We'll get to see each other there.
Steve White: Super excited about that too. So a breakfast.
Tim Sackett: so So, Steve, we I have one question we'll lead we lead off. We asked all our guests, but then I have a second follow -up because it's important for you now being a Gap, you know, kind of leader. The first question is, what was your first frontline job that you've ever had?
Steve White: That's right. I remember you asking Adam this and mine is not nearly as exciting. as As Adams was, right? i mean that That was pretty cool stuff.
Steve White: ah like for For me, I mean... I am. ah early on, so. grew up in didn't grow up in a rural area like adam talked about i grew up in long beach california right so uh so you know when i um my first front line job was at a ah store Ah. It was just a small store in the in the area. and so Worked at that store, you know really focused on customer service those sorts of things. So
Steve White: um And it was it was great. I mean, it helped shape my my thinking around, you know, overall interacting with customers, you know, companies making, you know, money and revenue, how that drives everything. So I just, ah but it not nearly as cool as as corn. and all things
Madeline Laurano: Those Midwest jobs.
Tim Sackett: what what kind of store What kind of store was it?
Steve White: it was just this it was it was a small corner store it sold all kind of all sorts of
Tim Sackett: Like a little bodega type.
Steve White: Yeah, like a bidet.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: Amen.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: So like little knickknacks.
Tim Sackett: Nice.
Steve White: and sorts of thing so
Tim Sackett: All right.
Steve White: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: My follow -up then is we're going to RecFest. The biggest mistake people make are... Coming in to Nashville with 90 degree heat out in the field.
Tim Sackett: And they have a... long pants and a jacket and you know Are you going to wear some Gap cargo shorts or not?
Steve White: You know what? I was that guy last year who wore long pants and a jacket.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: uh
Tim Sackett: And they're sweating, just sweating.
Steve White: No. All right. Yeah, isn yeah.
Madeline Laurano: to
Steve White: just so that just I like to think cool thoughts, right? And that that keeps myself... uh keeps me cool uh in the heat so i don't know i think i i've got some some uh some heavyweight uh gap shorts they're blue and black so i might wear those those two days And and be good.
Steve White: Okay.
Madeline Laurano: That's good.
Tim Sackett: Madeline, you don't know this. I don't think I shared these with you, but like as soon as Steve told me that he was going to gap. I immediately went into AI and took his LinkedIn photo and put him in Gap clothing outside of a Gap store.
Madeline Laurano: oh you said yeah
Tim Sackett: The Gap hoodie, the khakis.
Madeline Laurano: You sent it to me.
Steve White: No stitches.
Madeline Laurano: I um i definitely saw this. Steve, is this a gap?
Tim Sackett: Thanks.
Madeline Laurano: Is this a gap? jacket we've got on here.
Steve White: banang puer Banana Republic. Republic.
Madeline Laurano: Oh, yeah, man that's a good one.
Tim Sackett: Banana Republic.
Steve White: Yeah, Banana Republic.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: So I...
Madeline Laurano: The family.
Steve White: ah I love, you know, all all the brands. I usually shop. Old Navy and Banana Republic, a ton. And then Intaj, my wife. shops. Yeah, like.
Steve White: a little too much now but it it helps with the discount but but a lot a lot.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: Lori would have been texting me the other day. She was in Chicago and she's got a niece there. She's like, and just randomly she was like hey i gotta tell you guys like the gap is back And she's like, you should ask Cameron. Cameron's my middle son who lives in New York.
Tim Sackett: And so I laughed and I sent that text to him and he's like, 100 % gap. Everyone's like wearing the gap right now.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah. Gap is back.
Steve White: this again.
Madeline Laurano: I have to tell you, like when I was growing up. If you had a plastic gap bag that you walked around school with, like you put your books in it. you were rich and if you
Tim Sackett: yeah but Rich.
Madeline Laurano: You would wear, I use my. gap plastic bag the whole year like it could never ever Like, it was it was see -through by the time the year was over.
Tim Sackett: yeah
Steve White: That's awesome. i
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: I, uh, you know, gap bag. was just introduced right so the gap bag just launched
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Steve White: as an accessory on September 8th.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: um super cool stuff like really really nice bags So, yeah. the Check it out. It's really cool.
Tim Sackett: i just We're going to have to take pictures and post them on LinkedIn when Steve's at breakfast.
Steve White: Really cool.
Tim Sackett: I want to make sure he's got some gap he has some stuff on.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: Because somebody asked me, they're like, there's no way he's going to wear some gap catch shorts to breakfast.
Madeline Laurano: ah
Tim Sackett: And I'm like, well, I've never seen it, but you don't know. Yeah.
Steve White: Never know.
Madeline Laurano: Gap shoes.
Steve White: Yeah.
Madeline Laurano: Doesn't Gap have shoes now too?
Steve White: uh i think there there are shoes yeah there there's like um like gabby so mules and i mean there's all sorts of things on there you know you go to the app and search the site there's There's a lot. and a lot.
Tim Sackett: we're gonna We'll see. We'll see if he shows up with a bunch of gap gear on.
Madeline Laurano: Gap cowboy boots.
Madeline Laurano: ah So Steve. from RecFest last year, this is a big change, right? The gap is a new role for you. and a new organization.
Steve White: yeah
Madeline Laurano: um this is all about frontline workforce and the companies that are on.
Steve White: yeah
Madeline Laurano: there's a huge hourly workforce as part of those organizations. When you were thinking about what options you had, and Tim and I know a little of the backstory where you had a lot of options, what made Gap appealing or what made even going to another organization with a huge frontline workforce appealing to you?
Steve White: i think there's there's a couple of things right like tim talked about with cameron like get the gaps back i think that's as huge the brand resurgence is is significant the the growth within uh gap inc as a whole but certainly with the gap brand being such an iconic brand is it was really important to me And I think where the TA function is going, the focus on frontline, right, frontline hiring within the the TA organization.
Steve White: um and that impact that it makes like i'm thinking about the gap workforce is 80 000 plus individuals you know, with the four brands, Athleta. gap.
Steve White: Old Navy and Banana Republic. Um, all those brands being so significant and how like you know what the the hiring that we do and how that's significant to the the growth of the brand and what we're doing and how we're. We're really driving the CEO and the board's vision right to to really.
Steve White: you know. continue to to uplift these brands and and serve our customers in the most effective way. So when I think about that, I mean, I think we have a phenomenal opportunity as a talent acquisition team to really drive that success. my One of my peers, Jody Levinson, who who who handles
Steve White: um like dc recruitment and her team um they do a phenomenal job within that that um that realm and that that piece of the organization we implemented paradox recently right as ah as a team in an org So that's been a phenomenal.
Steve White: uh piece in addition to to what we're doing and how we're growing as a as a team and as a as a business and and uh simplifying hiring right for for those pockets of the organization so thinking about all those things i knew that like on the way in and i'm like okay, like we're headed in the right direction. We're doing the right things. and we're really focusing on like really driving the fundamentals as a TA organization.
Steve White: which is a large focus on frontline hiring in order to to really serve the brands well. and grow the business.
Tim Sackett: Steve, what's your like philosophy and strategy when you come in as a new TA leader? you have this window that... everybody thinks you're the smartest guy in the room for like a small for a little bit of period right And so you can you can definitely push change, but also you have to figure out what's really happened and what's going on. like When you come into a new role like this, like what's your philosophy and strategy about how to tackle that?
Steve White: Yeah, you're right. I mean, everybody. thinks that until you make your first mistake and then everybody's like who is this bomb that we brought in. um No, but... but ah i think so for me i usually want to to make the connections right connect connect with the team.
Steve White: connect with the business. I want to know, like, how how do we make money? You know, what like what's driving success? What's the strategy of the business? i think oftentimes as ta leaders we focus a lot on i like how many wrecks do we have open i mean all those things are important what's our time to fill numbers, all that good stuff. but But in reality, it's like. How does the business make money?
Steve White: What's the strategy of the business? Where are we going? what is the What are the most important things that the business is doing in the next 12 to 18 months, two to three years? um so then we can really apply and and develop a TA strategy that that aligns with those things.
Steve White: And then that the you know in terms of connecting with the with the team, I want to make sure I'm building relationships across the business. So I always say relationship opens the door for for healthy conflict. And at some point in time, we're going to have to have it. right i hate to say that and try to lead off of that but it's it's just the reality on that.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: Whether it be within the team, there's going to have to be some some healthy tension. uh in order to to get to our greatest good and then uh and then within the business right so like with business leaders it's hard to influence a business leader without having a relationship with it And oftentimes we... take a transactional approach to it. And I want to make the connections, deep connections as quickly as possible. to to understand you know what the business is doing, where it's going, and then who the people are that are running all these aspects.
Steve White: And then I want to. trying to understand like the the the different aspects of the team. uh to to starting Dig inside of the culture. right i want to know like what's our culture today how do we think and act as a unit and as a team and then what aspects do we need to start to to potentially shift in order to go from where we are to where we need to be. So I'm really starting to to lean in on this concept of not high performance, but better performance.
Steve White: Like, how do we get to a lot of people think that well we're a high performing organization, we're a high performing group where this is a high performing person. And and i'm I'm like, how do we change that? that dynamic and really start to think about like what's what's meta performance looks like look like how do we go beyond and above
Tim Sackett: Yep.
Steve White: this concept of high performance that everybody feels like they have already.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: to to really thinking about like, how do we get to ah the next level of that? and thinking about like bringing in what we felt like was impossible and make those things possibilities.
Tim Sackett: I love the fact that like that focuses in like, how do we make money? I think one of the biggest failures I've seen with T8 leaders across every industry. is they get into a job and they're like, okay. 90 % of our hiring is over here. We got to focus on that. There's all kinds of like activity.
Tim Sackett: And you're like, well, wait a minute, the 10 % of hiring. that makes all of us the the money that we all the other 90 % can happen. No one's over here taking care of that. because those are the hard ones those are the managers that are just more difficult to deal with and i'm like if you would just focus on the 10
Steve White: Right.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: The other 90 % is going to happen. Like you're going to be fine. But we tend to go, oh, let's focus over here because it's easier or it feels more comfortable. And we can get a lot of stuff done. And then they go.
Tim Sackett: I don't understand why the executive team thinks we're failing. it's like because you you don't you're not focusing on the same thing they're focusing on, which is... How the hell do we make money? And let's take care of that those people.
Tim Sackett: you know.
Steve White: Yeah.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: Yeah, exactly. And I think about like There are two people. that I listen to on this topic quite a bit. There's one guy, his name is Tim Sackett. You may know him. uh and so in the the talent fix um which i just i just bought for my team And we're going to start reading.
Tim Sackett: It's not, this isn't even ah like, we didn't even like. like put this in as a plug, like before the show, like, Hey Steve, at 11 minutes in, we're going to plug the book.
Madeline Laurano: I love that you brought that up. I know.
Steve White: No. What to do you do?
Tim Sackett: ah
Steve White: No, we didn't.
Madeline Laurano: I know.
Steve White: I randomly text you, right, Tim? I randomly texted you like a couple weeks ago. It was like, hey, like I want to buy this for my team. like that you know would you be willing to come in and have this conversation with us so no this is not a shameless tackle plug this is just the reality so between tim and and jim domico right like like talking to both ah both Jim and Jim and Tim.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: about these things like that's a huge focus right of them as ta experts and ta leaders and and And I love that thought process and but adapted it and adopted that into like how I think about TA, how I lead my team.
Steve White: And so I think that's just really, really critical. and
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: if which aren't doing that today regardless of where you lead right if it's if it's frontline iron if it's you know hourly hiring if it's it's corporate hiring or another space uh it's that's critical it's so important ah to to really focus in on that because No matter where we are, like we have to be thinking about like how does the business make money and then how does our work impact that?
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: How are we impacting that? And that's how we should be measuring our success, I think. uh with like is the business is the business we're supporting making money And then, you know, then we've got to start to ask ourselves the hard questions like, should our goals be tied to that?
Steve White: That's a totally different situation. You're going to love that.
Tim Sackett: Yeah. I mean, that's, yeah. Like, I mean, who is it? Patty McCord, the former CHRO at Netflix when they originally he started her, her big, her like famous quote is.
Tim Sackett: eight HR and talent acquisition doesn't need any new metrics. Because we have business metrics. Okay. is this Is this impacting margin?
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Tim Sackett: Is this impacting revenue? It's like, why are we creating new stuff? like we already like The business has already told us what's important.
Steve White: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: you know
Steve White: Yeah, and in reality, I mean our job is to to make money for the business. Like we're supposed to sit. like if People are the most important asset in any organization. We're bringing the people in. So if the people we're bringing into the organization, if they're not driving the business forward, transforming the business on a regular basis.
Steve White: And we have to look at ourselves. and say like who who did we bring in here right like like oftentimes we want to point to the business and say like oh the business isn't doing this right or they're not leading this well it's like well you know we brought in those leaders right who were were
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: nigger at so you know how can we reshape our thinking and then reshape the way we are engaging with both business leaders inside the organization and then candidates to make the right pairings So.
Tim Sackett: i had i had a health system I've had health system leaders, government leaders, and higher ed leaders come to me and go, well, Tim, that's all fun and good, but you know we're a nonprofit.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: We're blah, blah, blah. This is not how we work. And I'm like, oh, Pookie, that's so cute that you believe that. Like. your tax dollars are your revenue or insurance is your revenue or the students coming in paying tuition is your revenue.
Tim Sackett: Like you're still driving revenue and you're still causing expense. And there's nothing different between private industry and public industry in terms of that concept of saying. How are we making sure we're using the best use of the dollars and expense dollars that we have to drive even more revenue or better use of the revenue we have?
Tim Sackett: yeah
Steve White: Yeah. One of the things I think about, like I'll i'll use Google and I'll go to go to Google. Just look at the simple Google reviews of a certain. place whether it be a store or whatever right like When I was at Walmart, Sam's, you look at the like specific Sam's Club stores right within a certain area and you look at a Google review related to that store.
Steve White: And then if the Google review is below 4 .0, you start to wonder like, okay. who are the people that we have representing our brand in that store in that club or whatever it is right And then art, like how do we start to rethink and reshape?
Steve White: how we're bringing people in into to our organization that are going to represent us well. and that are going to make our customers. Happy. with shopping. And so same thing, right? In any other organization, I think it it's just so important. But I think sometimes we just. We disconnect. It's like. a cognitive dissonance right between like how the business is performing and then how we're doing our work.
Steve White: I hope we can. um I'd love to see us just like pull that thread all the way through and make that connection more often.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Madeline Laurano: with gap's interesting because like this brand is so big and like we've been talking about but gap has made this huge comeback how has the candid experience changed in your perspective or how do you expect it to change?
Steve White: Yeah. I say, I mean, there's a huge focus. on candidate experience here. This isn't a a company line. that i'm going to share it right now but this is like my real experience within the organization. I have never seen.
Steve White: an organization more focused on wanting to have. a phenomenal candidate experience that I have here. And I see it from the top down, right, in the organization. And so so from a TA perspective.
Steve White: That's a huge focus of TA and has been. uh for quite some time it's a huge focus of you know leaders in the organization as well business leaders in the org uh also and so um you know there's there's work That needs to be done. and is being done.
Steve White: in order to make that. you know, go from aspirational to actual. in in many ways. but But I've never seen Madeline ah an org that's more focused.
Steve White: on really improving and enhancing the candidate experience as I have here. And so there's a lot of a lot of ways that we're working on doing that.
Madeline Laurano: you
Steve White: We're doing some work right now to try and ensure that that we we're creating consistency. um in terms of you know how candidates are engaged and and then how leaders are, you know expectations that are set with leaders. I mean, a lot of work that's going on right now to to just ensure that. that that cohesion's there.
Steve White: uh the consistency is there and so uh so candidates get that that seamless experience and we talked about i mean the paradox
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: implementation as well so so for our candidates there in the distribution centers, things like that, that are experiencing that, they're they're able to. uh really uh they we've seen an increase or you know an improved candidate experience there and Paradox has the... um the the survey right of candidates.
Steve White: after they they've been able to use the tool and we call our tool a Bridget. so you know gap is one of the gap models is bridging gaps right and Gap's been around since 1969, so Bridging Gap since 1969, so we use Bridget. uh as the name of the the as as our tool uh name and so ours are as our our ai systems name And so so, you know, Bridget's engaging with the candidates really well.
Steve White: and then the candidates are responding really well. and share good feedback around. it So that's another area right where the candidate experience has really been been enhanced and increased.
Madeline Laurano: when When you came in and you were thinking about the candidate experience, whether it's through the survey tool or whether it's just drop -off rates, like where was the biggest breakdown in the candidate experience? like Where did the most work need to be done?
Steve White: that's ah That's a good question. I'm going to be honest with you on that one, Matt. I hadn't really dug into that that piece of the data yet. Like I said, it's a little bit outside of the area that I'm directly responsible for.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: um but But yeah, i'll I'll need to look into that. and and and make sure I can give you an answer once we get together and in Nashville. um well Too bad. um'm umm I'm sorry to everybody, all all the listeners here. I'm not able to do that.
Steve White: give that answer here today.
Tim Sackett: Thank you.
Madeline Laurano: Well, every area.
Steve White: I have to get mad.
Tim Sackett: Hey, Steve, we're all good.
Madeline Laurano: board can be able to experience so
Tim Sackett: at After breakfast, we're all going to be together again at work days. Future of Frontline Summit.
Madeline Laurano: Right. Mm -hmm.
Tim Sackett: um out before Workday Rising, you're one of the co -chairs. When you think of like the table stakes right now, when it comes with frontline workers and AI. like where do you think an organization should be i'm not saying gaps there yet but like and because every every company right now is in their own kind of like pathway of when they're going to get there but as there's certain things where you go hey there's there's just table stakes that we need to have
Madeline Laurano: no
Tim Sackett: and we need to deliver upon. For you, what are those things?
Steve White: i think um i think speed is is important right in terms of like how how do we engage with candidates engage with them quickly right move them through the process as quickly as possible i think that that is that's not that's true for frontline more than any other area but it's certainly true and
Tim Sackett: And has that – so when you talk about that timing piece, has that transformed from like – five years ago today in your mind in terms of like before it was like Fast might have been, oh, we need to get with them within a week.
Tim Sackett: And now maybe it's hours, minutes, who knows.
Steve White: yeah yeah it's minutes and hours now for sure and i think it's i think that's shifting across across the board in all segments of hiring. um because i mean we our expectations as consumers have changed. Right? So significantly. and so like when we look at that and then we start to juxtapose that to to how people are looking to experience every other thing in their lives.
Steve White: Hiring is no different. and and and where we've been able to achieve that in so many areas, right, to to be able to to have results in minutes. I think about, like, you know, my friend Melissa Oakley, who, you know, leads TA a over at FedEx.
Steve White: And they use paradox. um for hiring and they can you know hire an individual in minutes right for uh for their warehouses those sorts of things i mean that that expectation has changed significantly and i think it's changing across the board what we're seeing like in terms of even whether it be frontline or even outside.
Steve White: Our candidates don't want to to sit and wait days. to hear an answer from.
Tim Sackett: ah They just, yeah, they they feel like they're ghosted if they don't hear back immediately.
Madeline Laurano: Not even ours.
Tim Sackett: I think the consumerism piece that you said is critical. like um like i like literally you know i'm a golfer i got polo i got a million polo shirts if i get if i go on gap right now order a polo shirt it's probably 24 to 48 hours that thing will show up in my house And there's another brand, I won't name the brand.
Steve White: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: but i literally and their polo shirts are four times what i would pay for gap right And I remember making an order.
Steve White: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: And it was like eight days before my shirt. I actually actually emailed the CEO. And he was just like. shot. Like he was like, I'm like, and I told him, I said, I'm like, look. I know I pay way more for your shirt.
Tim Sackett: you know, then another company I would go to. So there's no reason that you shouldn't have that. that that thing should be I actually expect it to be faster because I'm paying that much more. and you're and it in and so like And again, they did the right thing with the customer and took care of me, blah, blah, blah.
Steve White: Right.
Tim Sackett: But I'm still like... But still like I ordered another one like a few weeks ago and it still took. five days, whatever. I'm like, you got to be kidding me, man. like How can you not figure this stuff out if you're going to charge that much more? But the consumerism piece, we're we've gotten so...
Tim Sackett: And I think it's the Amazon side. it's like If I order something in on Amazon, it's like there the next day.
Steve White: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: And you're like. Oh, I think So if i'm now if I'm applying for a job, I want my interview the next day Yeah.
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Tim Sackett: You know.
Steve White: It was cool. People's expectations, like we can't. separate the consumer from the candidate right like those individuals are the same They're the same and we should We should celebrate that.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: because like we want like every interaction is a consumer -based business we should want those individuals to actually be consumers of our business too right and so like then so as a from a candidate experience perspective.
Steve White: We need to be thinking about like, how are we impacting the consumer brand of our business? by taking you know forever to get back to our to to the the applicants and candidates that are in our pools.
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Steve White: And so like we need to shorten that time. to make sure people are are you know getting a similar experience to what you just described, 10, 24, 48 hours, right? Like, how quickly are we getting back to people? so then they They should like. We're going to say no to 99 % of the people.
Steve White: that that are applying to our jobs right or that we interact with. And so how do we say no, but then keep them as raving fans of our. or or even create raving fans of our businesses.
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: And we're not doing that today. I mean, this is beyond.
Tim Sackett: That was my...
Steve White: i mean but
Tim Sackett: That was my next question. When do you feel pressure because you have this really hot brand, you have your shoppers are your candidates. They come in, they're like, oh my gosh, I'm so excited. I got this new gap gear on. But then when they apply, they expect that same level of like hip. cool.
Tim Sackett: Like. The the the thing. And so now like, do your leadership team, like, do you guys feel like there's pressure to to create this employment brand that matches your consumer brand?
Steve White: I think that... I, I... i won't say that like there's a there's a pressure But I do think that they're... is like we're we're working to create. Great alignment. Right.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: Between the two. And it's so important. to make sure like as you know Gap Brands. And Gap Inc. overall, you know, serving our customers really well, continuing to grow. a Gap Brands is growing tremendously.
Steve White: um like we need to be able to to serve and and interact with our candidates in the very same way. And then, you know, I think that there are probably some people who are applying to our jobs or who we're reaching out to, right, sourcing proactively.
Steve White: that may not be customers of our brand. Right. So then how do we then like. create an experience that makes people say like, oh, shoot. like i didn't consider this before but how do i do it now Right.
Steve White: And so.
Tim Sackett: Hey.
Steve White: on
Tim Sackett: i I want to share something with you.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: Hopefully you haven't done this because I don't feel like an idiot, but like there when I was at Applebee's. And like, there was some, I can't remember. It was some leader. They're trying to drive, you know, again, trying to drive revenue, trying to drive salary. Hey, for every, those 99%, they don't get the job.
Tim Sackett: Let's send them. a free appetizer if they come into a restaurant kind of thing. It was like, oh God, it's so terrible. I'm like, no, we can't. that Hey, by the way, we didn't give you a job. come have some like chicken wings you know it's like come on don't do that so So here's what I'll say, Steve, don't ever like.
Madeline Laurano: free. You're welcome. You're welcome.
Tim Sackett: Turn me down for a job at Gap and then send me a 10 % off coupon for like a gap to come into a Gap for some clothing. now But here's what we did. I said... Actually... If I give you all the email addresses of everybody we've turned down.
Tim Sackett: Now, from a brand standpoint, it's not coming from TA or HR. It's coming from Apple. Actually, Applebee's just say, hey, come in. And the actual turn in number on those was super high because what we found was the people who are applying to us were already our fans, right?
Steve White: Yeah. Yeah.
Tim Sackett: but they did But it was cheesy to go, hey, we we're not going to give you the job, but come in and have like a free appetizer.
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Tim Sackett: But when we sent it from the actual brand that was just coming from Applebee's .com, like, hey, special offer this week, come in. you know And the the the turning rate was super high on that. so You do with that information what you will.
Steve White: Right.
Tim Sackett: from the business standpoint, but I'm just telling you. you know Take care of your fans.
Steve White: I'm always new. I think I was already stealing that idea from you before, Tim.
Steve White: Yeah.
Madeline Laurano: yeah
Steve White: filed it away. I'm i'm waiting to.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: to to really start. We know it all.
Madeline Laurano: yeah
Tim Sackett: Just be cautious.
Madeline Laurano: this time I'm going to apply to a gap job just to get a discount.
Tim Sackett: yeah Who's in the room? Some marketing person would go, who is this idiot telling us to send out a 10 % coupon?
Madeline Laurano: Yeah. Yeah.
Tim Sackett: giving away margin like that.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah. ah Let me know when you do I'll apply and get that 20 % discount from corporate. Yeah So you're like, here we go. um It's interesting like this. I think about this. whenever we do this podcast about, okay, the 99 % of people that are not getting the job, how do you create a great candidate experience? And that's what I like about, you know, paradox, especially because.
Madeline Laurano: I mean, if you're not going to get the job, you at least want to be leaving the experience and saying I was given a fair opportunity.
Steve White: yes
Madeline Laurano: And that's not going to happen if you just have a human contacting all of these people applying for frontline workforce jobs. Like that's not going to happen. I mean, it can happen through. you know, scaling technology and a positive experience.
Steve White: Yeah.
Madeline Laurano: it's like i was at least given a fair like i didn't get the job i can come back applying a month, but at least. somebody did i know that it was i was being considered
Steve White: Yeah. and madeline i look at i'm not saying this isn't a shameless plug here either like I send out TA insights to to my team every week. Right. And so and i I just do it through. I mean, it's not. Anything special. I'll use perplexity.
Steve White: right now have perplexity search the web every week and give uh some of that information i usually say like pull some of this info from madeline arano's you know like aptitude research and you know and so um So my team and I would look at like some of the the AI research and things like that, that that you've done. And there's some things that that are related to.
Steve White: Thanks. ta teams or or really company adoption right of ai versus like um you know candidate adoption of ai and it's so much
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: so much wider right this candidate adoption of ai is so much wider it's moving so much faster And then company adoption, I think was somewhere around like 13 % or something like that. if I'm not mistaken. and so like i think that there's A lot of that that that needs to like we've we've got to figure out like how do we accelerate this sort of change and growth. while while of course protecting our organizations.
Steve White: but ensuring that we can support our organizations through um you know through through technology through automation through you know the way the world is going it's not going that the the the the toothpaste is out of the tube right it's not going back in so we we need to make sure we're really focused on how do we leverage the technology in the right way to create the best candidate experiences because regardless of like sometimes companies may feel like hiring isn't as you know it's ancillary it's not as important it's not the main thing in the war
Steve White: uh you know when you're in a consumer -based business you have to ensure that hiring is is at the forefront of what we're thinking about what we're doing because we interact with way Way too many people. far too many people. that could impact our our brand and individuals experience and ultimately the revenue. organization.
Steve White: I'm constantly thinking about like how to each candidate is, ah you know, is a revenue stream or revenue connection right to the organization. and if we're handling those individuals as well. We're continuing to help, you know, the marketing and and the branding of the organization as well as our employer employer brand.
Steve White: If we're not. then you know that you know we're potentially losing customers for for the brands on a regular basis. And we the the best way for us to do that now, like you mentioned, Madeline, is...
Steve White: is like connecting with individuals. leveraging technology to be able to do that. And and then, you know, not because recruiters are we're we're're we're human. We're going to be flawed. We're not going to do we're not going to be able to get back to everyone. We're not going to do it as quickly as they need us to or want us to.
Steve White: um and so leveraging the technology to be able to do that is going to be it's it's paramount to how you know we'll experience success as as a business and i think just tying those experiences into to to the revenue is so important. And I think sometimes as TA leaders. I don't know if we do that.
Steve White: right ah there's been
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: But I haven't done that enough. And so, and I know TA, I've talked to recruiters and recruiters don't tie that in. They're like, hey, I just, I need to put. the next person in the seat and fill these jobs.
Tim Sackett: Yeah. Butts and seats.
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Tim Sackett: I'm feeling Rex, man.
Steve White: Yeah. I'm like, every rec is ah every open job, every rec is a business problem that we're solving.
Madeline Laurano: Yep.
Steve White: Right. So whether that's a you know line cook in an organization or a package handler in a company or retail associate right in a store. like every wreck is a business problem that we're solving.
Steve White: right and and we need to make sure like we're thinking through like what what business problems are we solving and then how can we do that in the most effective way to really drive revenue and success for the organization.
Tim Sackett: I'll get you out of here on this last question. What's the friends and family discount code? i just
Steve White: um
Tim Sackett: you You just put it out there publicly. no one's We'll get it afterwards. Don't worry about that.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: Yeah, no attempt.
Tim Sackett: No, Steve.
Steve White: i uh you know they they they give i that was one of the things when when i was going through the process and i was like man what's the discount Right.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: I wait all the way to the the offer and I'm like, oh, geez, here's it. This is pretty fantastic. I'm pretty excited. And I go and tell Taj. and And she's like, oh, yeah, you got to say yes to this job now.
Steve White: i was like okay Fantastic. And then they give us an online account, right? And, you know, for the the employee and the spouse.
Steve White: and i don't even have access to it tim it's not it's not most of my email If you time to email. i have to go to her in order to to order a new game with a discount
Madeline Laurano: ah
Tim Sackett: You just have got bags showing up on the on their doorstep every day.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Tim Sackett: like What is this?
Steve White: Oh, it is. It pretty much is what it is between her and Bailey. our youngest.
Madeline Laurano: Yeah.
Steve White: they're ordering all the time sweat they're like jeans and jean shorts and sweat suits and like
Tim Sackett: that's That's awesome. All right. You too. Thank you so much, Madeline, of course. I will see you in a couple of weeks, Steve saying. I appreciate you guys coming on for everybody.
Tim Sackett: This is the front lines. We'll get you out of here and we'll, you know, we'll come back again next time. Steve, how does everybody get ahold of you if they want to connect? What's the best way?
Steve White: a LinkedIn. LinkedIn is the best way to connect. If you just search Steve White Gap. You're fine.
Tim Sackett: Yeah.
Steve White: Minnesota.
Tim Sackett: There's only one Steve White on LinkedIn. There you go. All right.
Steve White: stop
Tim Sackett: We're out of here. All right, buddy. thanks you Talk to you guys are later.
Steve White: ah and go
