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Her Media Diary Episode 36: “Gender Equality Advocacy from the Grassroots” with Amie Joof
23 Plays17 days ago
Amie Joof is a journalist, activist, and women’s rights advocate, with over 35 years of experience.
Madame Joof discusses her passion for journalism, her commitment to gender equality, and the importance of mentorship in empowering the next generation of women leaders. She also shares insights into the challenges and triumphs of advocating for women's rights in the media landscape.
She stresses the need for early intervention in addressing gender issues. She also calls for greater engagement with educators at the preschool level to instill values of equality and respect from a young age. By addressing these issues early on, we can create a more equitable society for future generations.
Subscribe to Her Media Diary now on your favourite podcasting platform https://linktr.ee/hermediadiary
Learn about African Women in Media at https://africanwomeninmedia.com
List of Organisations/Resources to Support Women in Media
· International Women’s Media Foundation (IWMF)
· African Women in Media (AWiM)
· Public Media Women in Leadership
· International Journalists’ Network (IJNet)
· Media Career Development Network
Recommended
Transcript
Madame Amidou's Journey in Media Leadership
00:00:09
Speaker
I remember at one point in my career, I was even supposed to act as manager of the national radio. review Then, for me to to be given that position to act became a problem.
00:00:21
Speaker
And they started looking for other people who would do it. And most of the people they went to told them, look, it's Madame Amidou who should be the acting manager. She mentored us. we've worked with her and we know that she's capable to do the job.
00:00:35
Speaker
I didn't know that all those maneuvers were going on. On thing one day, they had to hand over to me as acting manager of the national radio.
Future Media Landscape: Gender Equality Vision
00:00:44
Speaker
But it's later on that I got the full story and the argument was that you know some of these women, they will not say strong women, they will say you know some of these women.
00:00:53
Speaker
When you put them there, they you change everything. Of course we will change things for the better.
00:01:04
Speaker
Imagine a world where we have gender equality and equity in and through the media. This is our mission at African Women in Media.
Introduction to Her Media Diary Podcast
00:01:12
Speaker
I'm Dr. Yemsi Akimobola, your host, and this is Her Media Diary, a podcast that captures the lived experiences of African women working in media industries.
00:01:22
Speaker
In this episode, I'm joined by Amy Joff, a journalist, activist, and women's rights advocate and an absolute legend with over 35 years of experience. Madame Joff discusses her passion for journalism, her commitment for gender equality, and the importance of mentorship in empowering the next generation of women leaders.
00:01:44
Speaker
She also shares insights on the challenges and triumphs of advocating for women's rights in media. Throughout the series, we will be in conversation with African women who have been media legends by virtue of their long years of experience and invaluable contribution to the growth and actualization of gender equality in a smooth media.
00:02:04
Speaker
By inviting these voices into conversation, we hope to provide solutions to break down barriers faced by African women in media industries.
00:02:28
Speaker
pleasure to have you join me in Madam Joff. First of all, I want to make sure I'm pronouncing your surname correctly. It's Madam Joff? Joff. see Joff, yes. Joff. What does it mean? What does Joff mean? Well, Joff is my surname and um It doesn't have a meaning really, but it's very common name in Senegal and the Gambia. Okay, okay. Yes, I'm from the Gambia. Yes, yes. I'm Gambian by nationality. No, no, absolutely. i know I know that you were chair of the National Women's Council of the Gambia in the 90s. So I definitely know that you're from the Gambia. And also you were the first president of the female president of the Gambia Family Planning Association as well.
00:03:11
Speaker
all Right, so yeah. So you're one of our legends in terms of women, media, gender development. you know You are one of the inspirational figures in the area and you've been doing this for a very long time, a very, very long time. What sparked your interest and your engagement in this field?
Amy Joff's Early Influences in Journalism
00:03:30
Speaker
i mean I think my interest started when I was in high school. i I wanted to do three things. Each time I was asked by my teacher in high school um At the end, what would you like to do? would say I'll either do law, journalism, or interpretation because I love languages.
00:03:51
Speaker
okay It started since high school. And when I was in high school, um I was also given the task of following the news and then writing a summary of the news and placing it on the wall so that, you know, we will have some general knowledge, you know, in the classroom discussing what's happening in the world. yeah So from a very early age, I was interested in listening to radio because my father was a keen radio listener, especially the BBC. so
00:04:22
Speaker
That really inspired me. And then um when I finished school, I went straight into broadcasting. I joined Radio Gambia at the age of 18. Wow. Wow. that's That's amazing. So as you mentioned earlier on, you grew up in Gambia. Which part of Gambia and what was it like growing up? If you could take us all the way back to your earliest, fondest memories. I was born in Bakao.
00:04:44
Speaker
At that time, it was a village. Okay. About 11 kilometers from the capital, Banjur. and I lived with my mom and my dad, blessed memory, and my siblings.
00:04:58
Speaker
And we had a huge family because um in our tradition and culture, it's very common for an uncle to raise his nephew or his nieces and also other relatives.
00:05:11
Speaker
So we had a big family. My mom had eight children. And I also had other siblings of the same father. yeah So um it was quite a light family.
00:05:22
Speaker
And down we all went to school. My father sent all of us to school, boys and girls. So we had equal opportunity for schooling. Unless you were not invest interested in learning, then that was another issue.
00:05:35
Speaker
But the opportunity was there. But I would have spent some time of my childhood with my grandmother. My mother's mother. okay Because my father was a public servant who worked at the health department and was posted outside the area where we live.
00:05:52
Speaker
So my elder brother and stayed with our grandmother and that's how we grew up until we went to high school before our parents came back to Bakao for us to continue to go to high school.
00:06:04
Speaker
So growing up, you know, with my brothers and my cousins, it was quite an experience. And the competition was subtle, you know, being a girl and, you know, having to study, but at the same time doing household chores, it was not easy, especially on weekends. But during the week, it wasn't difficult because we're given the opportunity to have time to do our homework, to prepare for the next day.
00:06:32
Speaker
But we still had to help our mom in the house, you know, to do the chores. But I grew up in a family where at a very early age, there was distribution of labor. I remember on Saturdays, my brothers and my cousins, the males, will do the laundry.
00:06:47
Speaker
And my sister and will go to the kitchen. But they will do all the laundry in the house. And they will clean the house as well. you know So then on Sundays, we have to iron our uniforms.
00:07:00
Speaker
And I had my eldest brother, of blessed memory, who was very good in those chores and he would always come and help me to iron because i didn't like ironing.
00:07:10
Speaker
So iron my uniform for the next day. So at a very early age, there was division of labor in the house. So it was not like we were brought up in an environment where, because we were girls, we were told that you have to do this and the boys should have all the time to go and play football or to go to school.
00:07:29
Speaker
and you will have the time to do your homework. We didn't encounter that at a very early age. I mean, from some of the things you said, there's a couple of things that you and I have in common. One, our love for our maternal grandmothers. Of blessed memory, as you said also, I really, really loved my grandmother so much. and She was such an inspiration. She didn't get the opportunity to go to school, but yet she's somebody that carried herself with so much grace that you wouldn't even know that she'd never went to school, you know?
00:08:00
Speaker
And though she is gone now, she left us in 2016, you know, I always have in the back of my mind with anything I'm doing, you know, how would she want me to behave now? How would she want me to be? What would she want from me in this situation? And the other thing we have in common is our dislike of ironing.
00:08:22
Speaker
No matter how much I try, i just cannot get those creases out. That's just not something that you know that I do or enjoy doing. But I'm interested to hear more about the influence of those people, those key people in your life, like your
Family's Role in Shaping Joff's Resilience
00:08:36
Speaker
grandma.
00:08:36
Speaker
or what What has been the influence of them in your life? My grandmother influenced me a lot in terms of being able to survive in whatever environment you find yourself in.
00:08:50
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in terms of respecting other people, respecting their views, respecting elders, and speaking the truth. My grandmother was a very outspoken woman, and she never hesitated to tell you her piece of mine if you are wrong.
00:09:07
Speaker
No matter who you are, she was very outspoken and very generous as well. Graceful woman who didn didn't go to school but spoke many languages.
00:09:19
Speaker
who also um was married to my grandfather who was a soldier. And before independence 65, my grandfather was sent to Sierra Leone. So my grandmother went with my grandfather to Sierra Leone and picked up the Krio language there.
00:09:37
Speaker
So she had this mixed culture, you know, from Sierra Leone, the Gambia, but then lived in an environment where spoke many languages because many languages they spoke in their local at languages. So I learnt that from her and then as I grew up under her guidance I found myself speaking three Gambian languages, Wolof, Mandinka and Fulani.
00:10:00
Speaker
So that helped me a lot and she was also very much interested in our education because when my father and my mom went up country and left us with her, she knew she had the duty.
00:10:15
Speaker
to make sure that we pursued our schooling and she was very committed to that. And the other thing I liked about her was she exposed me to many things like after school I would go with another cousin to the beach because Macau is a fishing area, it's on the coast, the Atlantic Ocean, to buy fish.
00:10:34
Speaker
You know, I couldn't swim though, I was afraid of the sea and still I am. but very early At a very early age, to know how to go to the market, to know how to go and buy fish, to come back, to prepare dinner.
00:10:48
Speaker
So at a very early age, she taught me those things. But also because I had a responsibility to perform in the house like she was doing and to be by her side. So that helped me a lot.
00:11:03
Speaker
And she also, especially in the evening, would tell us stories. you know, storytelling, which always had moral lesson at the end of the story.
00:11:15
Speaker
And that really, you know, gave us an insight as to how society, you know, how complex society is and how also we need to navigate, you know, to find our ways in society. So I found that very useful. My mother also played a very important role because she also did not go to school.
00:11:37
Speaker
you know, but very intelligent, very responsible, you know, had this, um how do call it, around her she had this aura of attracting everybody, even my friends, you know, would come home, they would chat, you know, growing up it was very, you know, sociable because Your friends' mothers are your mothers. They are your reserve as your mother as well in the society.
00:12:06
Speaker
Your mom also serves as their mother. Your dad as well, you know. So we grew up in that culture. Most of it you don't have these days. And that also helped us grow up respecting each other.
00:12:21
Speaker
but also knowing our rules and responsibilities and at the same time that we needed to be focused to know where we were heading to. And that was very important because they they kept reminding you that you're going to grow up. Even if you get married, you have gone to school, you must work.
00:12:39
Speaker
You have a responsibility to take care of your parents and you also have a responsibility to take care of your siblings, your cousins, the extended family. So at a very early age, you have that high sense of responsibility.
00:12:52
Speaker
But you have these people who were not visible in the background who were really giving you the strength to move forward. That helped me a lot. Absolutely,
High School Media Activities
00:13:01
Speaker
absolutely. And you mentioned earlier on about some of the things you began to do in high school that was kind of,
00:13:07
Speaker
demonstrating the path you then followed around media, women's rights, children's rights. So take us on that journey and from those moments and how you developed to where you are now.
00:13:18
Speaker
um moment When I was in high school, um I loved reading, you know, and um listening to radio because of my service influence. So in the morning, i would summarize the news bulletin, the 7 o'clock news bulletin.
00:13:32
Speaker
I listened to it or the earlier bulletin. and then I have the summary which I'll place on the wall and then to say this is what I heard on the radio today and then we will discuss it.
00:13:42
Speaker
So I was also amongst the team that would go and take part in a quiz or debate for the school and also to take part, in fact one time we went to take part in a radio program um It was a um a program between two high schools. We were at St. Joseph's High School and our male colleagues from St. Augustine's High School were there.
00:14:06
Speaker
So the moderator will ask questions and then we will give the answers. They will ask you what is the meaning of UNESCO for example. So at that age, in the late 60s, most of us wouldn't know what UNESCO meant.
00:14:22
Speaker
If you listen to the news and if you also read some of the things that were published in some of the newspapers, you'll be able to have that general knowledge.
00:14:32
Speaker
So at a very early age, I developed that. So I was able to share some of this information with some of my classmates. you know I was also the head girl of my school, St. Joseph High School, which was very rare at the time, because for somebody who is not Catholic by religion, to be head girl in a Catholic school in those years was not something that was common.
00:14:58
Speaker
so but The school was very accommodating. We had all denominations and we went to school there. So when I got to the fifth home, preparing for my O-levels, I was with the head girl of the school and I had four captains.
00:15:12
Speaker
But that's also where my sense of rebellion started. okay Because I remember a tech girl at one point was given homework to do. We came back and we couldn't do it.
00:15:24
Speaker
It was either geography or mathematics, I can't remember. And we couldn't do it. But the teachers thought that because we were doing very well in other subjects, we just refused to do it. And you know, in those days there was corporal punishment.
00:15:37
Speaker
Yes. good The principal of the school called us, we went to the office and she said she was going to give us the cane on our hands. So I told her, you can't beat me, I'm the head girl of the school, you cannot beat me in the office.
00:15:50
Speaker
And the other students, you know, know that you are beating us. Then that will erode, you know, our authority in the school. And I think she was shocked that I said that. yes So I said, I'm not good i'm not going to take the cane so you I can resign you know from the position of her guy, but I'm not going to do the cane because we couldn't do the homework. So my poor captain, more rebellious than me, also followed suit.
00:16:17
Speaker
So that's how they removed us from those positions.
00:16:23
Speaker
And they weren't in other people. So for us, It was okay, so long as we refused to be king, you know, and, you know, that was going to erode our respect and authority in the school.
00:16:36
Speaker
So we refused. So the head guys' group was shot-lived, but I say, refer to it, as you know, and let people know where it was shot-lived. Okay. yeah Well, I mean, from i mentioned earlier later on that you were the first woman president of the Gambian Family Planning Association.
Empowering Women through Leadership
00:16:55
Speaker
You chaired the National Women's Council of the Gambia.
00:16:57
Speaker
But you've also gone on to lead a lot of other initiatives and organizations, including the one that you're executive director of now, FemDev, so the African Network of Women, Media, Gender and Development. So I imagine that all of those kind of initial upbringing, the stories you shared with us, as allowed you to emerge as a kind of leader, right? And also in terms of your um experiences of being first in many environments, how would you describe those experiences of being first woman or first lead or, you know, that kind of rebellious nature also that you speak of?
00:17:32
Speaker
um What happened was that you find yourself in a situation as a journalist working on some issues. When I joined the Uganda, I read the news.
00:17:44
Speaker
because at that time were told that as a broadcaster you have to be versatile. So you would read the news, you would present programs. You know, when the senior staff went for the training outside of the Gambia, they would just ask you to do programs even without training.
00:18:00
Speaker
And because you've been following those who were there, so you were able to do some of those things. But as moved on, and then being exposed to many issues, covering issues that related to women's problems, women's issues, getting out in the field, interviewing people, women who were on the farms, women at the health centers, because I later moved to a section that was responsible for rural broadcasting and adult education, because I went to Ghana and studied adult education while working and then came back and continued working.
00:18:36
Speaker
and My experience in Ghana exposed me to many things, radio listening groups, going to the rural areas, and then seeing what women were doing. Then it gets to a point as a journalist at that time where you see your role as just going out to the field, covering events, recording programs,
00:18:58
Speaker
compiling the programs and broadcasting them on the radio. And that was it. Whether the programs had impact or not, you wouldn't know. Because there was nothing like audience research or evaluation of the programs or a systematic method of gathering feedback from the people, you know, who were listening to the programs.
00:19:19
Speaker
And what we did was we set up a radio listening group okay and did some campaigns in collaboration with the organizations that were working in the area of reproductive health family planning.
00:19:34
Speaker
I was already a volunteer of the Gambia Family Planning Association as a member. but then um Going out with them to the field to the record programs, attending their meetings, im taking part in workshops, and then you find out that you are exposed to real issues that people are facing in the community.
00:19:56
Speaker
Childbirth issues, women dying from childbirth, pregnancy-related deaths. You know, babies dying early. You know, and those kinds of things. So, as you do that work, you are able to come up with ideas that relate to what you are doing at the radio in terms of programming.
00:20:14
Speaker
And then you're also able to share with those people you work with, whether it's Gambia Family Planning Association or the National Women's Council, the Women's Bureau, whether it's other organizations, to say, I think, as an organization, as an NGO, you...
00:20:31
Speaker
should be able to do this kind of programming in collaboration with the Ministry of Health, with Radio Gambia, which was then the only national radio we didn't have TV at the time. and And then you sit down together and you form a team of script writers.
00:20:50
Speaker
So we've done all that. Script writers writing the synopsis for the drama program because some of us at radio were trained in radio drama production. writing and production. So you apply those skills.
00:21:02
Speaker
So as you move with people and then you are part of the team that leaves each house to go to the rural areas, sometimes for five or eight days to record materials for programs and come back.
00:21:14
Speaker
And then getting feedback from the radio listening groups, from the women to find out what their views are and coming back to use that in programs, you build that confidence. But you are also able, I was also able to inspire my colleagues but I was not alone in it.
00:21:29
Speaker
I worked with other people, men and women, some of whom I mentored, you know, and who were also committed in what we were doing. And they were part of the team that, you know, I worked with.
00:21:42
Speaker
So I very early on learned that it's always good to have a team. It's always good to share experience. always good involve other people.
00:21:55
Speaker
So the day you are not around, those people will be able to follow suit. Not only that, they can also pave their own way to get to higher heights and to be able to do what they want to do in their career.
00:22:07
Speaker
And this gives me innermost satisfaction today. When I see some of the people I've worked with, both men and women, at Radio Gambia, who today have paved their own career path and are doing fantastic jobs wherever they are.
00:22:22
Speaker
And that gives me the satisfaction that I was able to do that. Then it's the same thing with the women National Women's Council. I was nominated to chair the National Women's Council because of the work I was doing at Radio Gambia for women, going with the Women's Bureau staff on field visits,
00:22:41
Speaker
recording interviews, you know, helping them develop, you know, some communication plans and things like that at no cost. You know, you build up that respect, you know, and in the process, people can also assign you to certain tasks to head a national women's council, working with leaders in the community, and you learn a lot from them.
00:23:02
Speaker
And when I was at the, as chairperson of the women's council, we established the first women's community radio station in the Gambia. Two women radio community stations.
00:23:13
Speaker
And we trained the women so that they could produce their program. And at the same time, we had with the Women's Bureau, it was a World Bank funded project, video halls where women were also taught to use the video camera to record, you know, things that they could discuss at the community level.
00:23:31
Speaker
So empowering women to have access to those skills and to those tools gave most of us innermost satisfaction that at least you know we could share the little knowledge and experience we had other people.
00:23:45
Speaker
So it was the same thing with the other organizations that I worked with yeah Some of my colleagues also joined and we worked with them. And today, most of them are doing the same work that we've been doing and other people are doing Like right now, I'm part of a team of mentors for the Female Journalist Association of the Gambia, Women Journalist Association of the Gambia.
00:24:07
Speaker
I was in the Gambia recently sharing experience with the young female journalists. You know, so you are mentoring them um offline, online, you know, and it's good because if you don't do it, um it's like you are not sharing the little knowledge that you have, the little skills that you have.
00:24:27
Speaker
You are not also encouraging other people to come close to you to learn. But at the same time, you also learn from them, you know. So I think those things are very important in the kind of work that we do.
00:24:39
Speaker
And it has motivated me to move further outside of the Gambia, come to Senegal, work with other other people. We established this organization that is the network, you know, Inter-Africa Network for Women, Media, Gender and Development.
00:24:56
Speaker
So um that was a vision that I had, you know, very early on. to share because you travel, you meet colleagues from different countries, Nigeria, Sierra Leone, Liberia, other Francophone countries, and they tell you what you are also doing in their country.
00:25:14
Speaker
And that also motivates you so to do more, you know, in whatever field you are.
00:25:26
Speaker
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00:25:41
Speaker
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00:25:57
Speaker
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00:26:10
Speaker
Together, let's promote adequate inclusion and representation of women in Africa.
Challenges Faced by Women Journalists in Gambia
00:26:19
Speaker
I mean, it's it's very clear from kind of the experiences and the stories that you've shared that whatever position you found yourself in, you had made sure there was some kind of impact, right? And also kind of adapting to the environment and the need need of the environment. It's really interesting to hear the things you were doing with the community, but then how you were inspiring other journalists as well.
00:26:37
Speaker
So I'm interested to know, in those years of working for Radio Gambia, what was it like for you as a woman journalist in that space? and It wasn't easy. It wasn't easy at all.
00:26:48
Speaker
um because one of the lessons I've learned and which has landed me and some colleagues into trouble but not very serious of trouble was that you want to address certain issues on radio.
00:27:03
Speaker
Let me take the issue of female genital mutilation. I was president of the Gambian Committee on Traditional Practices that dealt with female genital mutilation, i.e. marriage and all the traditional practices that are harmful to the health of women and girls.
00:27:17
Speaker
At the same time, I was a public servant working at the National Review. And our section was responsible for health programs, women's programs, educational programs.
00:27:28
Speaker
So discussing this issue on radio was difficult. Covering the workshops, then recording interviews, and speaking about the issue which was taboo, and still is taboo in some of our communities, was a problem.
00:27:42
Speaker
And it got to a point where We received a memo from the administration that nobody should talk about female genital mutilation in the program. I wrote back, I responded to the memo, and they and I told them that, okay, we will not mention female genital mutilation, you know, fight against female genital mutilation in the program, but at the same time, we are not going to promote any messages that promote female genital mutilation.
00:28:09
Speaker
because it's against the national health development policy. And that's where I also learned that as a journalist, if you want to do activism, you should be okay with the policies that exist in your country.
00:28:22
Speaker
You should be okay with the laws that are in the constitution, the provisions in the constitution. You should be okay... with all the support that these UN agencies give and all the agreements that your government have signed and the monies that they receive from those organizations.
00:28:39
Speaker
So that at any point in time, if they were to tell you that, you should not talk about this on national radio. You tell them that the Gambia government has signed a memorandum of agreement with this agency and they've received this money to promote women's health and body but integrity You need to know that for you to be able to have an argument so that you just have to continue to do what you are doing. Nobody can stop you.
00:29:04
Speaker
That was an issue. The other issue is that was that when you are outspoken as a woman, when you go to management meetings and you are outspoken, Not only what it's just for you, but also for colleagues, for us, for the staff you're working with, other colleagues who are working.
00:29:20
Speaker
It was common before management meeting for people to come to us, some of us, they will come and say, you know we don't have anybody to defend us when you go to management meetings. These are our problems.
00:29:31
Speaker
Then I will take notes and say, okay, but you, are you doing your work correctly? Are you following your schedule? Are you doing this? I ask questions that I say because I don't want to be embarrassed when I go to that management meeting.
00:29:42
Speaker
I need my facts. So when you go to the management meeting and you raise some of those issues that most people don't want to address, you are rebel. They will not tell you that you are a rebel.
00:29:53
Speaker
But sometimes I found myself once, management had a meeting and they excluded me. I was in the studio recording. Somebody came and said, you're not at the meeting. I said, what meeting? They said there's a management meeting.
00:30:04
Speaker
I said, really? I'm not, I wasn't aware. I stopped the recording and I went, I knocked the open, I went and I sat down. I said, nobody told me there was a management meeting, but I'm here. The people will find ways and means.
00:30:16
Speaker
We had, the way we were saying to put you in the deep freezer. But you have to refuse for anybody to take you and put you in a freezer. But, So you need to be able to do that.
00:30:27
Speaker
One, come to humanity. Two, do your work as you should. Three, speak... ah when you are at meetings. Fourthly, don't belong to any group that is there to defend the status quo of the organization to the detriment of people who are working there.
00:30:45
Speaker
And that earns you your respect. I remember at one point in my career, I was even supposed to act as manager of the national radio. But at that time, we had started having difficulties with the regime that was under President Yahya Jammeh.
00:31:02
Speaker
Then, for me to be given that position to act became a problem. And they started looking for other people who would do it And most of the people they went to walked with me and told them, look, it's Madame Amijou who should be the acting manager.
00:31:17
Speaker
She mentored us. We've worked with her and we know that she's capable to do the job. And we didn't know that all those maneuvers were going on. On thing one day, they had to hand over to me as acting manager of the National Radio.
00:31:31
Speaker
But it's later on that I got the full story. And the argument was that, um you know, some of these women, they will not say strong women. They will say, you know, some of these women.
00:31:41
Speaker
When you put them there, you know, they will change everything. Of course, we will change everything. things yeah for the better. We will change things like you cannot have an Imam using State House Mosque in his sermon to insult people who are doing campaign against female genital mutilation or to insult people who are leading organizations that are campaigning against traditional practices.
00:32:05
Speaker
When that Imam is recorded and it's worked on the station, as a manager you tell the person who has recorded it to run edit. the insults before broadcasting the the material.
00:32:17
Speaker
You know, when you also tell them that you cannot just take a schedule and just be changing a schedule like that when you have a broadcast schedule. You have to respect the schedule because you have to respect the audience. You cannot change it because there's going to be a statement by a minister.
00:32:31
Speaker
So you just remove a program that's on that schedule permanently because somebody's statement has to come. That has to be negotiated. And those people should be informed that this program is not coming at the scheduled time.
00:32:45
Speaker
It's coming later tonight so that they can arrange to listen to the program if they are interested. But I must also say that through collaboration, I was able to get the support of also men within the institution.
00:33:00
Speaker
Men who I've worked with, men that I still continue to work with, men who but have the opportunity to also attend some of the trainings we attended, whether it's gender training,
00:33:12
Speaker
whether it's doing programming on women issues and things like that. You share those opportunities with them and then when they are exposed to those opportunities and to those perspectives, then you will see that that will reflect in the work that they do.
00:33:29
Speaker
But being a woman in that kind of job was not easy because you also had the family responsibility of raising your kids. I was lucky to have my mom and my mother was the one who helped me to raise my children because I had to go to work. I had to travel outside of the Gambia.
00:33:47
Speaker
I had to go to meetings and also to the interior of the country. And obviously you're the executive director of the InterAfrica Network for Women, Media, Gender and Development. Tell us more about that and how, you know, the kind of work that you do. The organization has its headquarters in Senegal, here in Dakar.
00:34:04
Speaker
And we work in West and Central Africa. And, well, mainly with women journalists, men men as well. And then we also work with um organizations that share the same objectives as PANEDEV, you know, giving a voice to women, um looking at issues, monitoring the media to see the the issues of representation and sources of information, who speaks in the news,
00:34:32
Speaker
who is interviewed, who is given a voice. Those are some of the issues, the things that we address. Looking at issues of training, capacity building for media, looking at women in leadership in the media, but at the same time conducting research, looking at issues that are covered, but using the data to do advocacy and also to train people in the media.
00:34:54
Speaker
because We work with civil society organizations but We work with the local government authorities. We work in the communes. Here in Senegal, for example, we have the communes in the municipalities where we have the women and the young people on issues of gender-based violence, traditional practices that take place you know in the remotest parts of the country.
00:35:16
Speaker
So we do not only work in Senegal, but we work in other countries with partner organizations. If I take the case of Sierra Leone, for example, and before the elections, We did one media monitoring on women's political representation with another organization that is based there.
00:35:32
Speaker
And we did the monitoring and then online did the data analysis. And then I was in Nigeria, in Enugu, doing election observation and that's where I presented the report from. So we look at issues of governance as well because it's not just about informing educating and entertaining as far as the media is
InterAfrica Network's Role in Media and Advocacy
00:35:55
Speaker
concerned.
00:35:55
Speaker
We are in all the issues that relate to good governance in our country, that relate to issues of diversity, equity and inclusion. So in the area of inclusion, but evil we work with people with disabilities.
00:36:11
Speaker
You look at some of the issues that concern them. They enjoy a lot of gender-based violence and discrimination wherever they are.
00:36:22
Speaker
So in the area of governance, election observation, you look at what the media is doing. If there are opportunities to train media practitioners, Ukraine them, when you also work with the women organization in terms of women political participation and representation in their political parties, as well as in positions that are put out there for election, you also do that kind of work with them. We work on the global media monitoring process.
00:36:50
Speaker
with World Association for Christian Communication. yeah And we've been the that has been coordinating West and Central Africa. And apart from that, we've also been asked to even train some organizations like in Mali,
00:37:07
Speaker
on media monitoring. So we do all that, apart from the research, the advocacy, the publications that we do, audiovisual materials. um The networks that we belong to also, we also support them in terms of developing communication strategies, in terms of doing some productions, and also in terms of training on issues relating to gender and women, youth and you know other issues that relate to women's development.
00:37:36
Speaker
And i mean, you were director before you became executive director since its beginning, right? So to round us up today in this episode, as you look forward, so you've had decades and extensive experience on women, gender, media development, press freedom, all of those things, child's rights.
00:37:55
Speaker
As you look forward next 10 years, next five years, and looking backwards also on all the things you've learned, all the achievements you've had, all the ways in which you see the environment changing for the better, changing for the worse, what are the things that you are hoping that we do not repeat? What are the mistakes, the issues around gender equality in media that you're hoping as we're looking forward that we're learning from the past?
00:38:20
Speaker
I'm looking forward. um I believe that one of the things we have neglected is working with young people who are in the school. preschool, because when they go to preschool, the teachers are there.
00:38:36
Speaker
We need to engage those teachers at preschool level. who work with children who go to preschool and then see how from a very early age these issues are addressed not like the way they are addressed with adults but in terms of colours that they want children to wear blue for boys, pink for girls and in terms of toys that are provided in the preschool environment those kinds of issues and that we can only do if we engage some of the schools and then be able to exchange with them
00:39:10
Speaker
and then see how you equip the teachers, you know, and those who take care of the children. And going further, primary school level. um When you look at the curriculum in our schools, in our country, the issues relating to gender and some of the issues we've all been working on are not dealt with there. So probably, at the level of the primary school, if those issues are not addressed in the curriculum, we need to work closely with the Parent-Teacher Association.
Early Gender Equality Education: Why It Matters
00:39:39
Speaker
We need to work closely with the school boards that exist, the teachers, and have some kind of discussion and dialogue and exchange to see how we are able to raise these issues, even if formally.
00:39:54
Speaker
They are not in the school curriculum, but as extracurricular activities. And it goes up to the level of high school as well. Even though at the level of high school, most of the organizations that work on this issue have been working with some of the high schools and engaging them in some of the work that they do.
00:40:14
Speaker
And other organizations are also doing and inviting them to take part in programs, to write essays, on some of these thematic areas. But i I think we need to do more on that.
00:40:25
Speaker
We also need to do more on policy. Because no matter how much information you give out, how much training you conduct, how much work you do, if policy issues are not addressed, if your advocate is not based on on facts that you can use to convince policy issues and make sure that out of everything that you do, there is a policy advisory that you prepare that should be submitted to the relevant ministry or institution that is responsible for that issue.
00:40:59
Speaker
I think we need to do more of that. I also feel that there still needs more networking. for more networking. We have a lot of organizations in West Africa, in Central Africa, in Africa as a whole, working on all the issues that all of us are working on.
00:41:19
Speaker
We need to network. We need to document. Documentation is a big cut. We need to document the experiences that people have had. What you are doing, you're documenting. I've listened to the podcast, some of the podcast, and the anne I must congratulate you for the excellent work that you are doing. Thank you. In putting together this information that other people can listen to, the information alone that you are putting on the podcast can help younger people to listen and learn. And at the same time, not make the mistakes that some of us have made in the past.
00:41:55
Speaker
you know So I think we need to document. Most of people of our generation have not documented. That was when we started the time of typewriter or the authorite, people have written papers that they presented at meetings, scribbled, handwritten, not typed.
00:42:12
Speaker
They can't even find them. So I think it's very important um for us to document our trajectory, what we have done. And I think what we're doing, you know, is an opportunity that, you know, should be replicated or should be expanded to include more women, you know.
00:42:30
Speaker
And probably even, not only in English, but also in French, you know, to see whether there's a possibility to get those interviews. The people have done also the same work that You are doing the same work that I've been doing that other people are doing, but whose first language is not English.
00:42:53
Speaker
So that's also a lesson I've learned in the work that I do, because we work in all the three languages, mostly English and French, plus in local languages. But we also try to work with the Portuguese-speaking countries, even though we don't speak Portuguese, but some of them understand English and French.
00:43:10
Speaker
Thank you so much, Madam Joff. It's been such a pleasure. I'm really, really honored to have done this interview with you to capture your years of experience and to learn from you. You've actually inspired me and got my mind, you know, turning in terms of the future of my organization, African Women in Media. So it's such a pleasure. i really look forward to meeting with you. Thank you. Thank you.
00:43:32
Speaker
so Thank you very much for this opportunity. I must say it's the first extended interview I've had over the years. you know and um i can assure you that i'm ever ready to share my skills my knowledge you know which is what i'm doing now mentoring you know i'm in the process of transitioning from the organization you know and making sure that a new team takes over you'll be in the background you know giving advice whenever you are needed but at the same time you don't stay at home and uh
00:44:08
Speaker
not share little experience that you have with other people. Thank you for the opportunity. God bless you. And thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you so much.
Conclusion: Mentorship and Gender Equality
00:44:24
Speaker
One of the key themes of my conversation with Madame Joff is the importance of mentorship. Something that she emphasizes, especially the need for experienced women to guide and support younger generations, ensuring that they have the tools and knowledge that's necessary to succeed.
00:44:40
Speaker
Her own experiences as a mentor has been incredibly fulfilling. can hear how much of a pride she takes in seeing a mentee thrive in their careers. As we look to the future, Madam Joff stressed the need for early intervention in addressing gender issues. She calls for greater engagement with educators at the preschool level to instill values of equality and respect from that tender age. By addressing these issues earlier on, we can create a more equitable society for future generations.
00:45:10
Speaker
As always, drop me an email at EMC at African Women in Media with your thoughts. And if you'd like to join me on an episode of this podcast. And in the show notes, there's a list of organizations and resources to support you if you've experienced any of the topics we've discussed today.
00:45:26
Speaker
And as always, subscribe and follow Her Media Diary on your favorite podcasting platforms. Please do click that follow or subscribe button. Remember, you can also tune in to our partner radio stations that broadcast episodes of the podcast across a number of African countries. That's West African Democracy Radio and RISE Radio in Sierra Leone.
00:45:48
Speaker
and don't forget to to join the conversation using the hashtag HairMediaDiary.
00:45:56
Speaker
HairMediaDiary is a product of African Women in Media, an NGO advocating for gender equality in the media industry. And this episode was hosted by Dr. Yemi Siak Mbobola, produced and edited by Blessing Ude Obase as part of a four-episode series on media legends.
00:46:14
Speaker
Our music featured in this podcast is by Nana Kwabena. Thanks for listening and join us again next time.