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Injury Time Episode 10
22 Plays1 month ago
We discussed Gabriel's groin injury playing for Brazil, and lead into how to manage a Premier League club with multiple international players. What's it like dealing with the different national teams? Also, can a club really just "pretend" that a player has an injury? Finally what's it like managing all that travel?
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Transcript
Introduction and Host Updates
00:00:01
Jonathan Bird
Right, hello everybody. um Welcome back to Injury Time. We've had a couple of weeks off. ah I'm Jonathan Bird and I'm here with Shabazz Murgle.
00:00:13
Shabaaz Mughal
Just me today and John.
00:00:15
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, yeah, no Ian today, unfortunately. um He's travelling back from Venice and hasn't hasn't quite made it back in time to record. it's...
International Break and Player Management
00:00:23
Jonathan Bird
so it's The evening of Sunday the 16th of November we are in the middle of an international break talking football again.
00:00:31
Jonathan Bird
um and We we've we've talked before ah um about the managing players away on international duty. and particular ka Ian was the England team doctor at the...
00:00:44
Jonathan Bird
he was a two boup suian but he was talking about
High-Profile Player Injuries
00:00:47
Shabaaz Mughal
2.10 here.
00:00:47
Jonathan Bird
um
00:00:49
Jonathan Bird
the World Cup in South Africa in, mum's 2010
00:00:53
Shabaaz Mughal
to here
00:00:58
Jonathan Bird
and about how he had one player, quite high profile player who got injured in training and he'd already had a call from the club team doctor before he even assessed the player because the press had been there at the at that at the training session.
00:01:11
Jonathan Bird
um So we thought we would talk a little bit about um You were the team doctor at Spurs for how many years were you there?
00:01:21
Shabaaz Mughal
and I think about 12, quite a long time.
00:01:25
Jonathan Bird
Yeah. And so you were a Premier League club. um And thought we'd talk a little bit about the club side of managing international players.
Groin Strains and Sportsman's Hernia
00:01:38
Jonathan Bird
um And you know, with we will always try and bring in an injury. so We know that Gabriel Magalice, the left side of centre back for Arsenal, has possibly tweaked his groin or something, ah playing for Bazaarly at the Emirates on Saturday, the friendly against Senegal.
00:02:01
Jonathan Bird
um
00:02:04
Jonathan Bird
So firstly, just on an aside, groin strain, what's the kind of but's the city the the bracket for the quickest into the longest?
00:02:15
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, and
00:02:16
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, you know what, groin strain is a bit of a, it's a bit of minefield because it can be anything to do with around the hip and groin. So it doesn't necessarily just mean, so normally we typically think groin strain is an adductor strain.
00:02:31
Shabaaz Mughal
um and if
00:02:31
Jonathan Bird
yeah and he said that what what the they they they've apparently said are Dr. Strain.
00:02:36
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. Which, you know, in itself, sort of minor adductor strain, you're looking at, about four weeks. um It's not actually much of an issue to get running again, straight line.
00:02:49
Shabaaz Mughal
It's more when you start doing ball work and really wrapping and striking the ball, that's when it can tweak. But you've got to be so careful because often adductor strains are, I mean, they can just happen, but they can be that there's overload and the abdominals are not working correctly,
00:03:12
Shabaaz Mughal
adductors are overworking, could be that there's some underlying hip impingements, there's not the good mobility in the hip. And then you know, it can also be the dreaded sort of lingering sportsman's hernia groin, which can give some non specific groin pain.
Player Management Conflicts
00:03:29
Shabaaz Mughal
And it's more to do with the deep abdominal muscles and the weakness there and not true herniation. And it can be quite controversial and the management of that can be quite tricky as well because often players feel quite good.
00:03:42
Shabaaz Mughal
You'll do a bit of rehab, they're fine. As soon as they play, it recurs again. So it can sort of grumble along. And I think, I don't know the ins and outs, but Cole Palmer's out with a groin injury.
00:03:55
Shabaaz Mughal
He's been quite a while and it sounds like being managed conservatively, but sort of looking from the outside in, you think that's just sort of grumbling along and they've given him plenty of time.
00:04:07
Shabaaz Mughal
And he may well end up needing surgery at some point for the sportsman's groin, which in itself is quite contentious about what they do and what they repair. But generally, in my experience, sometimes that needs doing and that's sort of the more definitive solution.
00:04:27
Shabaaz Mughal
So yeah, always anything around the hip and groin, it's never that straightforward or never that simple. So as an Arsenal fan, you should be fingers crossed. It's just the adductor strain and not, you know, they can develop adductor tendinopathy as well.
00:04:41
Shabaaz Mughal
And that's real problem. problem to treat, takes a long time, grumbles along. He can still play, but not quite at the same level. So you often hear about players at the end of the season having a groin operation.
00:04:55
Shabaaz Mughal
And it is often this where something's happened in the season and it just sort of, and it can affect their performance as well. So tricky one.
00:05:04
Jonathan Bird
yeah i mean we've we've got We've actually got plenty of cover um and ah along along the backfall from Calafiore who's also apparently carried a bit of injury to Hincapiรฉ and
00:05:11
Shabaaz Mughal
Hmm.
00:05:19
Jonathan Bird
and
00:05:20
Shabaaz Mughal
Oh yeah, he's not played it. Has he played? Yeah.
00:05:23
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, yeah, he played he played in the Champions League.
00:05:27
Shabaaz Mughal
Okay.
00:05:27
Jonathan Bird
He was playing at left-back.
00:05:30
Shabaaz Mughal
They got it from Leverkusen, didn't they?
00:05:30
Jonathan Bird
Sorry, no, in the Carabao Cup in left-back. yeah and but But there's also Christian Mosquera, who has deputed for Saliba on the right side of the...
00:05:33
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:05:35
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:05:41
Jonathan Bird
as right-side centre-back. I think he can play both sides. so
00:05:43
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:05:44
Jonathan Bird
And Calafiore is strictly centre-back. So, anyway, I mean... you know Although Gabriel is a superb centre-back, but also has a goal threat as well.
00:05:55
Jonathan Bird
He's the big slab-headed.
00:05:57
Shabaaz Mughal
Very good player, very good player.
00:05:59
Jonathan Bird
yeah Yeah, he's he's a superb player.
00:05:59
Shabaaz Mughal
indeed
00:06:02
Jonathan Bird
But yeah, so anyway, so let's move on to...
Standardization in Sports Medical Practices
00:06:05
Jonathan Bird
You were saying that when you've got international players at your club... How do you, you know, and you've got, you know, at a club like Spurs or any Premier League club, I mean, how many of your first team squad do you think are internationals for variety of different countries?
00:06:25
Shabaaz Mughal
I mean, international break often, it used to be like Ghost Town, there's barely anyone there, because most players were a part of international team, so, you know, during my time there, yeah, yeah you'd be surprised, because, you know, you see someone like, for instance, Troy Parrott, who's just done extremely well for the Republic of Ireland, scored five goals this week, he was a
00:06:39
Jonathan Bird
Even if they're under 21s or something as well, that you even, yeah.
00:06:54
Shabaaz Mughal
a young player at Spurs and he'd been, I'm pretty sure he was getting called up to the Ireland squad when he wasn't always sort of on the fringes of the first team squad at Spurs. So, you know, there's there's a lot of players that get called up and it can be all over the world. So, I mean, during my time there, I remember we had sort of contingents of players. We had a group of Croatians at time, Brazilians, we had players from places like Honduras,
00:07:25
Shabaaz Mughal
African nations, um who else? Belgian team. So they're all over the world basically, South Korea, et cetera.
00:07:36
Jonathan Bird
Of course.
00:07:36
Shabaaz Mughal
So it can be a bit of a logistical minefield because obviously players are keen to go off on international duty as they should be, you know, it's a great honor representing their country.
00:07:36
Jonathan Bird
her
00:07:50
Shabaaz Mughal
ah And they will go the instant the game finishes prior to an international break. And often that game might be on a Sunday. So game finishes.
00:08:02
Shabaaz Mughal
And, you know, you may not, they may, they may not report. You may not have got all the little knicks. So often, often footballers can get, you know, they may feel something in a game. They may not feel something in a game. It may be the next day they come up and pull up with a bit of tightness in the groin or,
00:08:21
Shabaaz Mughal
the hamstrings. So for instance, Gabriel may well have played completely fine, flown to wherever he's gone. Next day, he might have felt some tightness.
00:08:30
Jonathan Bird
Well, actually, he was in it was in he was in London. It was bizarre.
00:08:32
Shabaaz Mughal
Okay.
00:08:32
Jonathan Bird
It was at the Emirates.
00:08:32
Shabaaz Mughal
All right. So he, yeah. So, but you know, for instance, so if you've traveled abroad, but even, even aside from an international break, players may not feel an injury till the next day sometimes or the day after when they report.
00:08:45
Jonathan Bird
Hmm.
00:08:47
Shabaaz Mughal
So what I'm trying to say is essentially they'll be all off and you may not know if they picked up a little issue before they've gone because there's sort of a mad rush.
00:08:58
Shabaaz Mughal
They've got to get to the internationals report as soon as possible. And then it's the communication you have with their medical departments and it's it's quite a logistical procedure. So you've got your club secretaries dealing with their counterparts.
00:09:13
Shabaaz Mughal
ah You might have physios dealing with their counterparts, doctors dealing with that. And it's like sometimes information comes back in little dribs and drabs. It's not necessarily, you know, this perfect line of communication that it should be.
00:09:26
Shabaaz Mughal
um And things change so much, you know, national teams might change their medical setup. So you might have developed a relationship with one medical team and suddenly they're gone. Somebody else comes in.
00:09:38
Shabaaz Mughal
Likewise, at a club, things can change. Um, So it is tricky getting all the information. And I think that can be a real challenge because sometimes just the the challenge really is getting getting the information. the players struggling with something?
00:09:56
Shabaaz Mughal
Are you trying to get across that they're struggling with something? Can you try and... you know You've got a... The club's interest may be that they should play limited minutes.
00:10:10
Shabaaz Mughal
National team have their own interests. There may be some clash there. So all in all, it's quite a tricky thing sort of control, I guess.
00:10:21
Shabaaz Mughal
You don't really have much control of that situation.
00:10:25
Jonathan Bird
And and do you um do you, when you're man when you're trying to manage players who have gone off everywhere, is there a conflict between internally the club with, you know, we're the ones that pay their wages and they go off to play some friendly they come back crocked.
00:10:41
Shabaaz Mughal
No.
00:10:44
Jonathan Bird
Is there a tension there? like we We kind of imagine as fans that maybe there is a tension there, that it's you know it's annoying.
00:10:46
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah,
00:10:51
Shabaaz Mughal
there may be at some level, but I think we don't really get involved in that as medics. But I'm pretty sure they get paid.
00:10:59
Jonathan Bird
you remember that, you know, it was always that, there was that thing about how Alec Ferguson would force his players to pretend they had something else, they had some kind of knock. you think there was anything in that?
00:11:11
Jonathan Bird
Or was that just...
00:11:12
Shabaaz Mughal
I think that's quite a unique situation and he's quite a unique character to have that much control. I don't think in the modern game there's that control. And I think FIFA have been quite strict with their rules and regulations about reporting.
00:11:23
Jonathan Bird
So that would never... do.
00:11:29
Shabaaz Mughal
So even if you've got a little knock, you have to report. And then it's the national team that can decide. So there's a lot of power for the national teams now.
00:11:41
Jonathan Bird
even though in you know in quotes, we pay their wages, that that doesn't really hold.
00:11:45
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, but I think they compensate as well. So they, I'm pretty sure national teams pay or federations pay when the players are there or there is some sort of ah financial recompense there as well.
00:12:00
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, no, but not if they get, because it's that frustration of being getting a knock during, you know, you think, know,
00:12:10
Jonathan Bird
you England had already qualified and in the game on Tuesday, Bikai Saka played the the full 90 minutes.
00:12:12
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:12:17
Jonathan Bird
i And that can be a little bit frustrating, you think, when when you've got the Christmas period coming up. ah really intense period of games and Saka is one of the most important players in in the Arsenal squad and that's the same across any any of those clubs whose players played played the full minutes.
00:12:36
Jonathan Bird
Sometimes quite useful, something interesting you know you think it's quite useful for them to have minutes but when you think you know they need to be a bit of rest surely.
00:12:39
Shabaaz Mughal
yeah but i think youre you I think you're seeing it only from the club point of view but remember there's a World Cup at the end of the year and those players are trying to
00:12:47
Jonathan Bird
Yeah exactly.
00:12:54
Shabaaz Mughal
play for their places, play for their place in the team, even play for their place in the squad. so And the national team will argue that they have limited time with the players, so they want to see them playing.
00:13:09
Shabaaz Mughal
And if they're fit to play, remember, if they're not on international duty, it's not like they're not training. So they might not be playing the game, but they will still be training in the two weeks that they're,
00:13:24
Shabaaz Mughal
back at their club and there's nothing to say they couldn't get injured at their club as opposed to at the national team. And often if you speak to players, players enjoy playing a game much more than they enjoy training.
00:13:38
Shabaaz Mughal
um So I think that that's quite a, and I think it comes actually probably from Sir Alex Ferguson and that time of Man United being so dominant.
00:13:49
Shabaaz Mughal
and him being so domineering that there's almost this urban legend about him pulling players out. I think the reality now is that as a club, because of the rules FIFA have got,
00:14:03
Shabaaz Mughal
you don't actually have that much control or power and even if the player's injured the national team has the right to make them report make their own assessments and even stay with them for rehab during that time and that often happens as well where the player might may be injured and will still stay with the national team for rehab rather than be sent back to the club sometimes they'll get sent back to the club rather stay with them so
00:14:15
Jonathan Bird
Mm-hmm.
00:14:32
Shabaaz Mughal
I think it's just having a balance that actually both parties have a vested interest and a player playing for their national team is obviously more valuable and a more valuable club asset as well.
00:14:45
Shabaaz Mughal
So their value goes up there ah if they're representing their national team and not just a club team. And I think it's just something... You have to accept as club personnel that the national team is just as important and has just the same sort of, I guess, control, guest power over the players as a club does as well.
00:15:15
Shabaaz Mughal
And ultimately the players want to play as well.
00:15:15
Jonathan Bird
So do
00:15:17
Shabaaz Mughal
They want to go to their national teams.
00:15:20
Jonathan Bird
did you ever worry about the um about the quality of the medical facilities when they go away? mean, do you remember, going going back a few years, remember Roy Keane, Roy Keane moaning about the facilities at the island camp.
00:15:30
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, yeah.
00:15:35
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:15:35
Jonathan Bird
um Did you ever worry about that?
00:15:38
Shabaaz Mughal
ah Yes, is a quick, a short answer to it Yes, you would, because when you go away in Europe and you see some of the sort facilities,
00:15:48
Shabaaz Mughal
um the And the interpretation, and this is, you know, where they're supposed to have sort of UEFA checklists and go through and this equipment, and they've got to go through with all the equipment that's supposed to be there.
00:16:02
Shabaaz Mughal
And when you see that, and it's not that great, and they may not fully understand what you're trying to sort of get across that, you know, for instance, um I remember going to places and having like a spinal board with a block and straps was like a essential requirement pitch side.
00:16:26
Shabaaz Mughal
And they'd have a very different interpretation of what that was in some places. So it does make you worry. um But again, everything, i think,
00:16:39
Shabaaz Mughal
if I think of my time at the, when I started in football towards, and then compare that towards the end, everything became so much more sort of, um, you know, under guidelines and having strict, uh, criteria and FIFA's, FIFA's medical set up, actually, they've got their own medical advisors.
00:17:02
Shabaaz Mughal
They've got like a central medical, um, team, I guess, um, So their role really is to go out there and make sure that everything is standardised. And I think that's happening more and more.
00:17:14
Shabaaz Mughal
I mean, I've been out football over the last, or five years. So I wouldn't know, but my expectation is that things, because they did improve from when I started when I left, and my expectation is they're continuing to improve and that there's minimum standards.
Medical Team Roles in Football Clubs
00:17:29
Shabaaz Mughal
um But I think we need to that's a big thing to advocate for is minimum standards across the board in football from, i mean, we talked a little, a little while ago about non-league as well but I think this is the thing we should have it across the board non-league throughout the league throughout the countries there are certain things that are non-negotiable pitch side and they're things like obviously spinal board um a defibrillator the right sort of qualified medics whether that's paramedics or you even doctors
00:18:08
Shabaaz Mughal
It's sort of taken for granted if there's a doctor pitch side or in any sort of medical setting or doctors there were all right. But you've got to think what type of doctor is that?
00:18:18
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, what is the training of that, Doctor?
00:18:18
Shabaaz Mughal
So. Yeah, exactly. So really, it should be people who are seeing this sort thing day in, day out, which is emergency medicine. And even, you know,
00:18:31
Shabaaz Mughal
As sports medicine doctors, as orthopedic surgeons, as GPs, you're not seeing emergencies day in, day out. You're not dealing with emergencies day in, day out.
00:18:42
Shabaaz Mughal
So there is an, I always felt that when I built the medical team at Spurs, it was really crucial to me to have people who were from each relevant speciality in the right place.
00:18:56
Shabaaz Mughal
So really the sort of tunnel doctors, the team pitch side doctors, their main skills should be emergency medicine. because that's the people who are seeing and dealing with these things.
00:19:08
Shabaaz Mughal
And then, you know, your sort sports medicine is more about an overall sort of overseeing the whole process and understanding what each injury means and understanding the sport.
00:19:23
Shabaaz Mughal
then obviously working with the orthopaedic surgeons who are going to operate if that injury needs surgery.
Impact of Travel on Player Performance
00:19:29
Shabaaz Mughal
And then you need GPs as well, because you know, half the time, the problems that your playing staff may have are sort of normal everyday things like coughs, colds, infections, etc.
00:19:45
Shabaaz Mughal
So having that skill mix is crucial.
00:19:48
Jonathan Bird
yeah i mean
00:19:52
Jonathan Bird
I think it's it's interesting you know with the parallels with and Formula One. so When um you know Bernie Eccleston revolutionised how the Formula One was, and it tend to tended it was essentially haphazard to a bunch of different um circuits around the world, mainly in Europe,
00:20:16
Jonathan Bird
and the medical facilities were just unique to that particular circuit and there was no standardisation at all and what Bernie Eccleston brought in standardisation of the commercial side of things so he had standardisation of advertising and selling the rights and which made everyone and um a lot of money but there was also the standardisation of medical facilities and it was so Professor Sid Watkins, neurosurgeon at Royal London
00:20:24
Shabaaz Mughal
Hmm. Hmm.
00:20:43
Jonathan Bird
And he was in charge of that, so that you had to have. So that so now it's just taken us data for granted that if you are bidding to have Formula One race, um at your circuit, you have there is a whole there's a big book full of things that you have to have.
00:20:57
Jonathan Bird
You have to have you know the helicopters and the dedicated medical team and you have to have an operating theatre. There's all sorts of things you have to have available.
00:21:02
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:21:03
Jonathan Bird
You also have have to have a hospital that is available for any injuries that the they go straight to, what specialities you have. And and that kind of thing you just a assume happens, of course. I mean, you know.
00:21:15
Jonathan Bird
it doesn't just happen automatically. It takes a lot of effort.
00:21:16
Shabaaz Mughal
No. Yeah.
00:21:18
Jonathan Bird
And it's interesting to hear that there are now standard standard things you have to have. So you it would be a bit easier now would it if you you're sending players off to, you know, AFCON's coming up in January, isn't it?
00:21:31
Jonathan Bird
Which is obviously one of those weird things. If you have African players, like they they go away mid-season. But even just with the World Cup um or or the Euros, it must be a little bit easier, I suppose, knowing that there is a standard, you know, there is ah there's standard equipment.
00:21:48
Shabaaz Mughal
Definitely. I think it makes, you know, gives you reassurance, but I think it's right. It's how it should be. I think the NFL does something really similar because had some experience with the NFL coming over and playing at the Spurs stadium and and sort of having meetings with them and understanding what their requirements are.
00:22:10
Shabaaz Mughal
And they're pretty, um you know, they their medical input's heavy. So they want, they have like neurosurgeons, orthopedic surgeons, sports physicians, everyone has to be there pitch side.
00:22:23
Shabaaz Mughal
And like you said, with the Formula One, and like we've evolved with football as well, those clear sort of emergency action plans, which hospital would you go to for what sort of condition?
00:22:36
Shabaaz Mughal
What's the direct access? um But, you know, arguably you need it even even beyond that. So like you're saying with the Formula One where they must have teams on standby ready.
00:22:51
Shabaaz Mughal
um i don't think that level has been reached here as yet, but that's probably the...
00:22:56
Jonathan Bird
yeah but be but but but you're never going to have the kind of injuries you you would get in Formula 1 you know major multiple injuries all at the same time
00:23:01
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:23:05
Shabaaz Mughal
True. Yeah.
00:23:09
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, it is interesting how things evolve over time. And I wonder what the the landscape will be like in sort of 10 years time. I'm sure it will just hopefully keep getting better and and better over time.
00:23:24
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, um mean, it's interesting you're saying that you you you you have orthopedic surgeons actually pitch side in the NFL. mean, they have much bigger squads, I suppose. Hmm.
00:23:32
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, yeah. Well, they want, they used to want, um, pitch side x-ray access. So they would be doing... And the NFL games, remember, they're very long and stop-start.
00:23:48
Jonathan Bird
Hmm.
00:23:48
Shabaaz Mughal
And I'm pretty sure, you know, there's two sort of teams within the team, isn't there? The offence and the defence. And they can go off and not be involved quite some time.
00:23:59
Shabaaz Mughal
So you could have, you know, in that time, you could get an x-ray and make sure there's not a fracture and then continue.
00:24:07
Jonathan Bird
really?
00:24:08
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. So they wanted an X-ray on site.
00:24:12
Jonathan Bird
That's interesting. I suppose you have got the time, because it obviously football you can't do that.
00:24:17
Shabaaz Mughal
No.
00:24:18
Jonathan Bird
In fact, there's there isn't any sport. I mean, maybe cricket, but you know not in rugby. You don't go off and then come back on again, do you?
00:24:25
Shabaaz Mughal
But and NFL games last for hours.
00:24:28
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, it's kind of three hours or something isn't it?
00:24:29
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:24:32
Shabaaz Mughal
I'm sure even longer at times. They can really go on.
00:24:36
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, to try and fit fit it all the fit all the all all the gameplay around the around the advertising because it's primarily about advertising isn't it
00:24:42
Shabaaz Mughal
Indeed, yeah.
00:24:44
Jonathan Bird
Anyway.
00:24:45
Shabaaz Mughal
yeah So yeah, in ah in essence, I think the big answer to your question is when players go off on international duty, it's tough and you get dribs and drabs of information.
00:24:57
Shabaaz Mughal
And sometimes, you know, they play in different time zones as well. And by the time they come back for the game, they might be coming back. So you might have a game on Saturday.
00:25:08
Shabaaz Mughal
They might be coming back early hours of Friday mornings.
00:25:12
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, really.
00:25:13
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, so it can be, and all that travel, you know, there's big decisions to be made. Again, think travel and that, what we don't, sometimes, you know, kind of almost gets forgotten, I guess, or not gets as much attention as it should.
00:25:32
Shabaaz Mughal
But football players are still human beings. They still have normal, reaction to lack of sleep, to picking up a cough or a cold, etc. They're not superhuman and just created just to play football.
00:25:46
Shabaaz Mughal
So you've got to take in you know, if you fly, if you flew to a conference over the week, ah and then flew in, we're in a conference in, I don't know, the States, and you're in a different time zone, then you flew back to England, and then you had a clinic the very day, you flew back in the morning, you had a clinic in the afternoon,
00:26:04
Shabaaz Mughal
You're not going to be at your best or if you're operating the next day, you're not going to be at your, at your top level. And yet with football, it's this expectation that they're going to be perfect.
00:26:18
Jonathan Bird
yeah i mean and You can see how the sort of Champions League, well so European competition has madly expanded particularly with the the former Soviet republics and there's that carry act
00:26:30
Shabaaz Mughal
Hmm.
00:26:32
Jonathan Bird
um carry out who are in k kazakhstan Eastern Kazakhstan or something?
00:26:38
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, yeah. We've played them, actually. I've played them. I'm not me. At Spurs, we played them. I remember going there.
00:26:45
Jonathan Bird
What, away you went away?
00:26:46
Shabaaz Mughal
I'm pretty sure. i tell you what, the memory gets fuzzy when i was thinking about this the other day. I've covered well over 500 games, so it gets a bit fuzzy where you've gone at what point.
00:27:00
Shabaaz Mughal
So, yeah.
00:27:01
Jonathan Bird
because i mean I looked it up and they are, because I think Real Madrid played away there. and we're We're playing them at home actually. Because you know with this you know that you know with with this new league format, yeah it's just not it's not home and away.
00:27:08
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, it's kind of random. Yeah.
00:27:10
Jonathan Bird
So you just, we we were we we happen to be playing them, but at home, so that's our last game. um But certainly, think it was Real Madrid have played them away and it's further east than Mumbai.
00:27:25
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, I do. i
00:27:26
Jonathan Bird
And that's insane. And that's that's that's apparently European competition.
00:27:27
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. Yeah, I'm pretty sure we did.
00:27:29
Jonathan Bird
And are you supposed to fly all the way out further than further than flying to India to play a game and fly all the way back?
00:27:32
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:27:36
Shabaaz Mughal
yeah Yeah.
00:27:38
Jonathan Bird
And how did you supposed to manage your players with that?
00:27:40
Shabaaz Mughal
I mean, I remember we've definitely played in that part of the world. I remember playing in, there was game in Ukraine and it was, there was some civil unrest then. They weren't sure whether the game was going to go ahead. I think this was before the war.
00:27:56
Shabaaz Mughal
And I think we flew out and something happened. So it is, I mean, like in a way, the world still revolves even if football is going on so it's not like the world stops just for a football game
00:28:09
Jonathan Bird
Yeah.
00:28:12
Jonathan Bird
Well, although you say that, that actually people would rather watch football than fight and they would move heaven and earth to make sure the football goes ahead.
00:28:23
Shabaaz Mughal
maybe maybe it gets yeah yeah
00:28:31
Shabaaz Mughal
the Yeah, yeah, I think it's, ah there's a lot that happens beyond just the football match that I think is hard to really understand, like the travel, the you know, the disruption that goes with it. So sometimes you can really understand why players pick up injuries once they've been away and they've traveled, lack of sleep, you know, they may have picked up a little subclinical infection,
00:28:59
Shabaaz Mughal
just lowers their, their sort of resistance, their resilience, and then things can happen.
Podcast Conclusion and Future Episodes
00:29:06
Jonathan Bird
did you When you were flying, do you fly, you you always flew like in a private jet?
00:29:12
Shabaaz Mughal
Generally, yeah, so you, for the games in Europe, you'd have your own chartered plane. If you pre-season, you tend to go commercial airlines, but you'd go business generally.
00:29:27
Jonathan Bird
Yeah.
00:29:28
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:29:29
Jonathan Bird
What, you would fly from like Stansted or something?
00:29:32
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, we used to be mainly from Stansted. yeah
00:29:37
Jonathan Bird
I'm just thinking about the comfort of the players when they're they're flying back from
00:29:40
Shabaaz Mughal
mean, that side is pretty good. So when you fly in a private plane, you have a private terminal, you still have to check in as such and get checked, but a lot smoother.
00:29:53
Shabaaz Mughal
There's not really... I mean, there is always waiting, but everything's a lot more comfortable and smoother, which makes... But there's a lot flying. So, yeah, being a footballer, you will be exposing yourself to a lot of flights, domestic, European, international.
00:30:15
Jonathan Bird
Because if you're playing you you're playing Newcastle away, then you'll fly, won't you?
00:30:18
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah, you fly, yeah.
00:30:20
Jonathan Bird
but where where's Where's the wheres where's the kind of nearest place that you fly to?
00:30:20
Shabaaz Mughal
And...
00:30:24
Shabaaz Mughal
the The cutoff used to be Midlands, so anyone anywhere beyond the Midlands, you'd fly up to the Midlands, you'd normally coach. Coach trips are really good, actually. there there are They're underrated. used to actually really enjoy a coach trip. It was underrated part of the sort of football world.
00:30:45
Shabaaz Mughal
Flights,
00:30:48
Shabaaz Mughal
we had some ropey flights at times in the UK, you know, traveling up north, bad weather. And I'm sure that didn't that wasn't good either because you'd have some yeah ropey flights and then you know you're playing a game the next day and it's not good for the old stress levels, I guess.
00:31:13
Jonathan Bird
did Did you have players who were scared of flying?
00:31:16
Shabaaz Mughal
I think we had, I remember vividly we had two or three flights where you know it was pretty ropey. Like you felt like you dropped out of the sky and whether you're scared of flying or not, after a few of them, affects your sort of how much you like flying.
00:31:37
Jonathan Bird
Yeah, because because famously Bergkamp, towards the end of his career, stopped flying, didn't he?
00:31:40
Shabaaz Mughal
I'm not, yeah, I'm not surprised because he would have flown so much and there's no doubt when you fly that much, you experience some bad flying experiences. Just, it's like the law of averages.
00:31:53
Jonathan Bird
if If you do enough flights, then there will be ones where there's turbulence and it's quite frightening.
00:31:54
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:31:57
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. Yeah. I remember one one time, think it was a it was in South Africa, and we were coming into land, and at the last minute, the plane just suddenly took up again.
00:32:15
Shabaaz Mughal
And then the pilot, I'll never forget the words because said, oh, we'll just turn around and have another bash at it. And I thought, oh my God.
00:32:29
Jonathan Bird
Well, was that like a pre-season friendly?
00:32:29
Shabaaz Mughal
Thankfully it landed all right.
00:32:33
Shabaaz Mughal
That was a pre-season year, South Africa. Yeah.
00:32:37
Jonathan Bird
We'll have another bash at it.
00:32:38
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. So some ropey moments, some flights.
00:32:43
Shabaaz Mughal
Definitely.
00:32:45
Jonathan Bird
Right, interesting. Nice little bit of a ramble at the end there.
00:32:48
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah.
00:32:49
Jonathan Bird
OK, look, cheers, Shabazz. We will hopefully be back next week. um We'll see and we'll hopefully get Ian Beasley in. but um
00:32:57
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. Back to the full quota next week.
00:33:00
Jonathan Bird
Back to full quota, exactly. Exactly. Well, I mean i suppose it's it's appropriate that we're on the international break, so we haven't got as many people around the club.
00:33:07
Shabaaz Mughal
Yeah. Yeah. Some, some, uh, traveling internationally. Yeah, definitely.
00:33:13
Jonathan Bird
um
00:33:13
Shabaaz Mughal
All right. Thanks John.
00:33:15
Jonathan Bird
Right, OK. Cheers, Shabazz.
00:33:16
Shabaaz Mughal
All right.
00:33:17
Jonathan Bird
and Goodbye from me, Jonathan Burden.
00:33:17
Shabaaz Mughal
Take care.
00:33:19
Jonathan Bird
Goodbye from you, Shabazz Mogul.
00:33:21
Shabaaz Mughal
See you. Bye. like
00:33:21
Jonathan Bird
Cheers, everyone.