Transcript
Speaker: Alright, what's going on guys? Welcome back to the Savage Boston Podcast slash live stream. We're here tonight streaming on Twitter and YouTube. Go follow Savage Boston on YouTube. We got a special guest tonight. We got Tim McCone from 98.5 The Sports Hub. How are we doing, Tim?
Speaker: Doing good. Thanks for having me, guys. i appreciate it. Yeah, thanks for coming on, man. I know we're we're just telling Tim he's had ah just only only like four hours of warm-up sports talk today already. He needed some more, had to come on. Had to get those extra takes out, for sure. Yes, exactly. Yeah, just got extra. get you couldn't get him off through Zoe and and yeah you had to get him out here. so um All right, cool. Well, just just initial thoughts. so I feel like obviously we can talk about the game and stuff, but I want to kick it off with just trade deadline stuff because – It feels um it's a hot topic. Feels like obviously what people want to really discuss. So um do you have any thoughts so far? do you want to start with Christian Barmore? Any thoughts on do you feel like they're actually going to move the player? Should they move the player? It sounds like they're going to be selling. and I'm trying to figure out like what their approach is at the deadline here. Just give me your initial take on what's going on, Tim.
Speaker: I just think for the money that he makes and and certainly I think some of the stuff may be off the field as well, that maybe there's some headaches there. So with the with the amount of money again that you have tied up in them, if they feel like they can move off them, especially with the emergence of Durden here, it feels like over the last few weeks too. If they can pull something off and maybe they look into it, I would still be, I don't know about you guys, I would still be stunned if they wind up selling pieces off of this team. I just think when you have Drake May, quarterback, and some of these pieces that are ultimately going to come back offensively, I don't know how you sort of peel some of this stuff away, especially when you see across the roster, what happens when you lose some of that depth. And so look, Jordan's come on. That's great. If he goes down in two weeks and you move Christian Barmore, for a late round pick, I'm not necessarily sure um you know that puts you in a great position moving forward. So maybe that's a conversation you can sort of have in the off season. But right now I would be stunned by that. I would be really, really surprised if you see a guy like Carlton Davis i get moved. I know that's another name that's been floated around. I just think that the strength of this defense, the secondary, so for them to move off of him,
Speaker: And again, I get it You're going to have sort of a financial crunch here. This offseason with Drake may get a new contract. I just find it hard to believe right now you're going to move off of a player like that, which means both of those guys will be gone by the time this podcast is done. And I look like an idiot. But yeah, no i I don't see it.
Speaker: Yeah. Well, just to tune in. It's like I think the bar more. Barmore thing first, it feels like they're actually – it feels like they're going to move that player. I mean, like that's what it feels like to me. Like Barmore feels very real.
Speaker: um That's like a move they would typically make or at least the old Patriots would make of like dumping a high-priced veteran who's dropped in snaps. Like that feels like – like you can You can work the logic there, and then again, like can you get 85%, 90% of that with Corey Durden, who's playing pretty well?
Speaker: um It's still, though, it's like the optics, right? If you're trying to make a Super Bowl run, if this is your Super Bowl window, why are we offloading? You know I mean? Why are we offloading pieces? Shouldn't we be loading pieces? No. Brett, why don't you me your initial take?
Speaker: Well, so that's my opinion when it comes to Carlton Davis. i I think when it comes to the defensive line, we do have enough depth pieces there. Yeah, Durden stepped up. I think Josh Farmer is a pretty serviceable backup behind that. You've seen Barmore snap counts go down.
Speaker: And McCone talked about it, right? It's the off-the-field stuff. How is Barmore going to be responding if his play continues to reduce and they're continuing to elevate Durden? Does it become a problem in the locker room? Carlton Davis is a guy, though, that I look at and say – We don't have great depth piece behind him. I don't think Woods has looked very good at all. Like we're not doing much with Vildor. Like I don't know what we're going to do if we were to trade off Davis.
Speaker: I get the salary dump, but if you are trying to make a legitimate run this playoff, and this playoff series coming up, you're hopeful that you get healthy on the offense. Most of these guys should be coming back in time for the playoffs. Why would you want to trade off a guy like Carlton Davis? That's the one that just doesn't make sense to me.
Speaker: They're putting feelers out there. Ultimately, I don't think either gets moved. I don't think either one is actually going to come to fruition, nor do I think we're going to act. I think we need to add. I'd love it if we added an interior offensive lineman or a defensive end. I just think we we've invested way too much draft capital, way too much cash this past offseason. They're just not going to have the appetite to do it. so They're hopeful they can kind of swing a guy like Carlton Davis to get an edge guy, or they're hopeful they can dump off Barmore and get potential picks rather than having to lose him at the end of the season.
Speaker: I don't think either is realistic. I just don't like the move of Davis optically, though. Like, to me, like, that's the piece where I look at and say – it's just not a good fit overall because even if you were to add an edge guy, great. You're still getting soft in the backend and our backfield is not looking that great.
Speaker: And we'll get into the game against Miami, but like we played pretty soft and I don't feel very confident about how our defense is playing to this point. Yeah. If there were so, I mean, people bring up adding players, but like,
Speaker: Again, when he, so there's been a lot more hype about like selling players, but who are who are we bringing in? You know, is there like someone like Tim, do you have anyone you, want to bring in is there you know these is there a position group you want to improve you know well I look we we get a million calls on on wide receivers certainly because that's obviously like you know the sexy position I just I find it really hard to believe that they're going to invest more draft capital in that position right now ah considering the AJ Brown trade considering the fact that you paid Romeo Dobbs in the offseason
Speaker: So I don't think wide receiver is going to be a spot, especially when you just kind of consider once these guys come back to, I don't know what that sort of looks like if you invest again at that position. So i'd I'd be really stunned if it's wide receiver. You you mentioned an edge rusher. I wouldn't hate that just because of the depth there. Again, it it feels like that's,
Speaker: sort of a constant issue when we talk about this this roster where it feels like you're you're one injury away from from being really short at a lot of these positions so so maybe that's it I I think this is going to be a relatively quiet deadline though though for the Patriots that's sort of the sense uh that I get I'm just not sure the appetite there right is there right now for them to give up uh more draft capital to but to bring players in at this point Yeah, the wide receiver part is kind of silly to me because you look at it and you say, we have guys that are coming back that are going to elevate the play. Whereas defensive end, i mean, Draymond Jones seems to like never be able to finish a game. I don't know what that is. Old-timer.
Speaker: Yeah, just it it's once a game. It really is. For him and Davis, like for what and that's probably why they probably have Davis on the block because he can never finish a game. But Draymond Jones, like every game he's banged up and he's just kind of working through it. Like we almost lost Yakis this week. We don't really have guys behind them on the defensive end.
Speaker: That if one of those guys goes down, we're like, oh, well, this guy's going to eventually get healthy. Like, that doesn't get us. On wide receivers, yes, you can say that. So I agree. We've talked about this last week. It made no sense for us to be able to look at a guy like Josh Downs or bringing back a guy like Diggs. Yeah, it sounds good on paper, but, like, realistically, you're not going put any investment into that.
Speaker: you know, get because you've already done it on the wide receivers. Defensive end, you need a person on that side. I would love it if we went out and got a guy like Khalil Mack. I think that would be a perfect fit. I think you're going to get sellers. You're probably going to get him at pretty low value because he's an aging player. And you just need a rotational guy to add to, and that could be a piece that you could realistically get. I don't see them getting anything from a wide receiver offensive set.
Speaker: Well, so a couple of guys mentioned, I want to mention some of the comments in the chat. So um people, couple of guys, Pat's rebuilding era says, does Harold Andrew exist? Someone else earlier said, What's up with Harold Landry?
Speaker: you know i don't know what you've heard, Tim. what i what So what I heard, before I ask you, what I heard now is before the season started, Kevin Stone with BC and I think New England Journal. i figure New England Football Journal, Yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah Kevin Stone's been around a bit. He basically is like, i don't know if Harold Landry's ever playing again.
Speaker: Then I hear from a couple people who at practice who are telling me that Landry's like actively doing drills in front of people. and they're not allowed to report on it.
Speaker: So you hear two things and those are both true. Okay. So I hear two things and then I'm like, well, just cause he's doing drills, obviously it doesn't mean he's like ready to go play. So,
Speaker: I don't know. At this point, to be honest, it feels like this is borderline like career ending for Harold Landry. I'm not actually sure he'll ever be able to go again. I'm just not sure. So, Tim, what are you what are you going on? We had Mike Reese on this afternoon. I think this was the first week we actually didn't ask him about Harold Landry, but every week leading up to this, it's it's been essential. to what You've said, too, where he – He really hasn't heard anything period, which is certainly not a good sign in terms of him him coming back. So I just, I think to have any expectations that Harold Landry is going to give you anything of value this year, I think is, is unrealistic basically at this point.
Speaker: Yeah. And, and, ah and again, I know that, um yeah, Bryson, a couple interesting comments for Bryson sunken cost fallacy with wide receivers. Like I agree. I agree, but,
Speaker: yeah also who do you move who do you move on from? you know what I mean? It's like, I understand the the concept, but it's like, okay, like how similar is Josh Downs to Pop Douglas? Like if you're like, let's trade a fifth round pick for Josh Downs, are you getting the similar player? Is Josh Downs 10% better than Pop Douglas? Like I'm not, like that to me is not a massive upgrade there in the slot. And then like you basically, you do have to wait for AJ Brown to come back and see what you actually have for AJ Brown. Yeah.
Speaker: And then Romeo Dobbs is going to come back. So I don't, so it's, and I don't think, I don't think you, I mean, Bryson's not on the pod, but I don't think literally, like I really don't know how different Josh, Josh Downs is from pop. I really don't.
Speaker: I know people like, like Josh Downs and he played with Drake a while ago. I just don't know. I personally know, maybe, you know, I don't know. I don't know how much better he is. So I don't know Any thoughts on that, that Brett?
Speaker: Again, i talked about it last week. I wouldn't really go after a guy like Josh Downs. I don't think there's a significant upgrade there. You also got to mention Matt Collins, which has been basically Drake May's security blanket for the last two years in a number of ways. So he's coming back.
Speaker: We're just, we're not going to go out there and get these wide receivers. It's, it's flashy. It sounds good on paper, but in reality, it's just not going to happen. So I don't really entertain it all that often. don't,
Speaker: I'm really looking at it from the standpoint of can we just get our guys back and get healthy and see what that looks like once we have them in play? Because we really haven't had any real snaps where we've had our full offensive weapons healthy and ready to go.
Speaker: Like one half against Seattle. That's it. Right. That's that's pretty much it. Yeah. So how can you judge what the offense looks like with all of those guys if they're not out there?
Speaker: So we got to wait and see. And it's just unfortunate that it's all happening all at once. And it's happening to these guys. We had really great injury luck last year. This year, we're one of the worst injury rates in the entire NFL. It is what it is.
Speaker: People don't like pop. have Pat's pro in the chat here. People not like him says, uh, good evening. We need a legit wide receiver three. Love pop. He's not the guy. well Again, he's not the wide receiver three. He's like wide receiver four slash five wide receivers one, two, and three are down.
Speaker: So stop saying wide receiver three is not there. We know he's not wide receiver three. Yeah. And I, and I do think, I think, yeah, if they want to go get Josh downs, like a true, I obviously i'm not going like have an issue with that. Like, i don't really, I honestly don't care about fifth round picks. And I know like people we talked to a lot about people overvaluing um draft draft material, like draft stock, man, 20, 27, it's, it's great. But like I'm high on rounds one through three, four and 22, like once you get five plus in any draft, yeah, it just like gets, gets sketchy for sketchy for me. So yeah.
Speaker: and don't know. Is there a, Tim, is there a position you want to upgrade at? Is there something you feel like they need to target? i don't know, upgrade, but again, like another defensive end, just to to add depth to that to that position, I think would be huge. Like you said, you kind of had the scare with Gabe Ackes on Sunday, which just kind of, again, reinforces the fact that if Draymond Jones goes down like he does once a game or Gabe Ackes gets banged up, I'm not really sure what else you have at that position. so So that's where I would target right now. If I was the Patriots, that's where I would want to invest rather than a wide receiver.
Speaker: Yeah, true. um Interesting. So, I mean, people mentioned Khalil Mack is like a decent target, but it feels like if you go to the Bears, like that kind of feels like a shoe in. That feels like where all the talk has been. i don't know if that changes yeah because of but what they gave up for um Simmons last week, but I don't know. if It feels like that's sort of the landing spot. I'm with you on that.
Speaker: mean, Derrick Henry, someone brings up in the comments, should they pursue Derrick Henry? Like, i like some of these ideas. They're they're like fun ideas. like it's I mean, would they – do you think the Ravens are going to trade you Derrick Henry?
Speaker: Why would they? I don't know. I mean, i like the Georgia Pichons idea. They blow it up. Yeah, there the Pickens thing would be wild. I mean, that would certainly – yeah, you're – Do you have the locker room to sustain that? That's a big personality. I don't know. they're bringing in right now. I don't know. I love George Pickens. I think Pickens absolutely nasty, like disgusting wide receiver. I love Pickens.
Speaker: So, like, I would love to love to have Pickens come in here. um Yeah, we had it was so funny. People were mentioning earlier today. i don't know. Have you ever had Bedard on your guys' show with you guys?
Speaker: No, no, we have we have not had Bedard on, on pendant two. No. He was tweeting out today is something about how Drake Mays has almost gotten like multiple of his wide receivers killed with apparently like hospital ball. I don't know, man. It's, yeah it's, Hey, you guys, you know, you guys work at the same, the same building, the same facility there. And,
Speaker: I don't know. that's not that's not That's not how I see it. I don't know. I'm a pretty good quarterback. I don't know. Call me crazy. i don't know. if i did I thought he played pretty well Sunday. Yeah, that was that was a wild take when he's basically doubling down on not only saying that the high ankle sprain injury was due to a Drake May ball, but then on top of it, he almost got Hunter Henry killed this last game. And I'm like, okay, okay.
Speaker: That's true. You guys did. I look at it and say, so out of the what 20 targets he's thrown AJ Brown, he had like two off balls. And other than that, the rest of them have been basically in the bread basket, but you're going to criticize that one. Yeah.
Speaker: Yes. mean, also, first of all, we got to realize like not, i don't need to turn it into a Bedard bashing, which I'm happy to do. Truly. i am, but I'm happy to go off on him anytime. But, but,
Speaker: there's so much randomness to injuries and how many poorly, like even like low, low thrown slants have like not resulted in people getting high ankle sprains. I mean, the, the absurd, uh, percentage of that is very, very low. So I think to blame the quarterback for injuring the player is, is pretty fucking stupid. Um, it's ridiculous anyway, regardless. So like, I wish there, I wish there was more,
Speaker: Juice would like trade rumors. I wish there was more targets the Patriots have been linked to. But unfortunately, I've been scouring you know everyone's reports. There's absolutely zero attached to the Patriots getting players and only hype from just Burt Breer about who they apparently want. About selling. a Fowler came out with something last week. I don't know if you guys saw it. It was like 25 30 notes, I think it was. I forget what. And not one with the Patriots. It was crazy. It was crazy. So, no, I'm with you on that.
Speaker: I did. I read the entire thing and I was i couldn't believe there was like zero mention. The Patriots weren't in the article. So, all right. Well, how are feeling? So how do you feel about the game against Miami? I mean, as far as performance wise, like did that give you, I don't necessarily think you feel like better about yourself after that, but like what' what's your thoughts, Tim, him about the Miami game in general? I thought that was one of the worst halves of football during the Mike Rabel era for New England in that first half against Miami. I thought that was really, really bad. And then I thought you saw in the second half what it's like to have an elite-level quarterback in one of those games. I go back to, like, the Gerard Mayo era. I think it was – was it in Buffalo maybe when the Pats went up fourteen nothing against them and you thought maybe they had a chance and then –
Speaker: instantly Josh Allen just kind of flipped that game and you're like, oh yeah, they have a guy like that and and and the Pats don't. And so yeah to me, even with being shorthanded with the weapons and we talked about the receivers and not necessarily needing to upgrade, it would have been nice to have an upgraded wide receiver core ah for for that game against Miami, right? But even with that, I just thought you saw you saw Drake May truly look like one of the elite quarterbacks in that game. I thought he was i thought he was awesome in that second half against the offense. I really did.
Speaker: Yeah. Brett, what did you think of the game? What's your initial take? Well, I said it at the time, thank God for Drake May, because we really have nothing else to work with on offense. And you just watched how that game went, especially in the first half, just maddening how much we just couldn't move the ball, how inept we looked across the board. just Self-inflicted mistakes all over the board, man. It was brutal.
Speaker: Brutal. Yeah. So it was just incredibly frustrating. But to me, like the biggest takeaway I have and the biggest concern I have going forward is is the defense. Again, it was another performance where they just didn't look good. We talked about it last week when it came to the Jets. I've been continuously on the defense. I think their stats are really kind of overstated. i think by and large, their defense is subpar at best.
Speaker: And it's frustrating because this is supposed to be the strength of our team right now. we're pretty much healthy on the defensive side of the ball. We should not be struggling as much as we're doing, but we can't seem to stop the run. We are playing very soft zone on defense. This is supposed to be Rabel's bread and butter. These are guys that Rabel brought in to do. And like, to me, that's the part where I'm like the most frustrated and concerned going forward because our defense is just not showing up. We have a big test coming up against Green Bay and it's going to be helpful because Green Bay's offense sucks. but they have legitimate weapons and Jordan Love is a good quarterback. I just look at it and say, with what Miami has, they shouldn't have been able to move the ball as successfully as they were able to do it against us.
Speaker: We did not look good on a defensive front. And that's the part that I look at as being the most concerning. Yeah. I want to talk about, did you feel like, I know Christian Gonzalez, like,
Speaker: Is there an issue with him playing zone? I know like it's like a genuine topic. like Why are they going to keep having him go play like a deep third or something like that if he's just playing off? like i don't like I think that was weird. like He got not necessarily burnt twice, but like he had two pretty soft zone coverages.
Speaker: And he got that they completed against Gonzo right in front of his face. And neither of the coverages looked good, right? And so I was like, at the time of it, was like, what are we doing? like So is it this that he can only, like he's elite when he's shadowing a guy playing one-on-one with elite competition and he's like stimulated and you get him in a soft zone and he can't function? Like what's up what's up with with Gonzo in the zone stuff?
Speaker: That's a great question because I'm with you. I thought that that was wildly frustrating watching that game. And I think just defensively, like you guys kind of talked about it too. I think when you see sort of seen them go up against real offenses, I'm not talking about Miami, obviously. I mean, it was frustrating in that game. But whether it was Jacksonville, Chicago, I i i do think you have questions sort of long term about what the ceiling for this for this defense is when you talk about sort of the the upper echelon offenses that you potentially are going to be going up against here.
Speaker: yeah Yeah, I don't know what it is either. Last week, you would, I guess, attribute it to like he was sick and he might not have been able to play against Chicago. So that was where you thought maybe he's just not feeling well.
Speaker: This week? I don't know. I mean, it's not like... Is Christian Watson playing this week? Really quick. Is Christian Watson going? I haven't heard anything... Other than that, I mean, again, he jumped out of an ambulance in that game last week. So I don't know if that's a pullback on that. But like, yeah, as of as of now, I think he's got – as of now, I believe he's supposed to, yeah.
Speaker: I think if Watson plays and you can just tell Gonzo just like DK Metcalf style, you tell him like just shadow him. Right. Maybe that's it. Like you said, dude does he have to get up for a game like that? Is that sort of like that challenge is what sort of motivates him and and gets him fired up? I don't know I guess we'll we'll find out.
Speaker: That's interesting. I just wonder like how are they coaching? I know it was um extremely similar to Stephon Gilmore, right? When he came and again, they're playing a ton of zone with him and then he was struggling. That's good call. Yeah. Yeah. Right. yeah And that that's like the comp, not even just personality wise, but as soon as they started playing him, man, a man, all of sudden you're like, Oh, that he won defensive player of the year.
Speaker: Right. So like, I think they just can't, like, i saw someone else have the statue, the Patriots, because that ah offense played like 73% zone. against Malik Willis, who's by far their highest zone percentage this season.
Speaker: By far. Like, they clearly were just really nervous about Malik Willis scrambling and getting outside the pocket. So they're just like, all right, we'll just play zone and let him try to throw on us. Just try to throw and convey they up just beat us in a conventional fashion, which, right? yeah I mean, i maybe that's not bad on paper, but like you said, too, it was frustrating to watch at times, no doubt.
Speaker: Yeah, like didn't actually really work in the first half, though, you know, like it didn't it wasn't good like they drove the ball pretty well. So, yeah. um Yeah, it was very, it was very up and down on the defense. I think at times the defensive line got pressure, but there were other times where Miami was able to hold up. I think same thing goes with the run games. There was times we were able to stop, but by and large, they were able to move the ball effectively. So,
Speaker: no there wasn't anything i would look at and point to the defense it gives me a ton of confidence going forward saying like yeah when we go against elite level ah offenses that are not quarterbacked by malik willis we're going to be able to stuff them and we're going to be able to stop them i i hope that's the case i hope this is just gonzo basically saying i'm gonna take a bye and kind of go through on cruise control I hope that's the case, but it's just it doesn't look good for the defense and how they're performing to this point, which is a concern because on offense, Drake's finding a way to make solutions. The offense is finding ways to get into the end zones and make things happen with like nothing around them.
Speaker: Defense, it's like, you got to be, if you're going to be the highest paid player, like you have to be a factor. You have to be a force. Milton Williams, if you're one of the highest paid defensive linemen, like you have to be a factor. You have to be a force. And I just feel like those guys haven't been produced in the last few weeks.
Speaker: Well, have you seen the differences in like even coverage coverage statistics between when they're in zone or man? Like when they play man, they're one of the best defenses in football. When they're in zone, they're one of the worst. They're like 31st or something. They're terrible.
Speaker: um For whatever reason, it's just not translating. And then they blitz in zone. Like Kayla Williams picked them apart. Picked them apart. yeah Like we zone blitz anytime. Yeah. So, yeah, i think they clearly have have issues with that. i don't know why they can't figure it out. But um I think like they're saying like if, you know, yeah, here's Bryson saying if pass can't get pressure, they're not good. Yeah, it's true. I mean, they have to get pressure and you got to like find a way to get pressure with. I like when they have Ackes in there and ponder like Ackes ponder.
Speaker: Milton Williams and Durden, if you need four down. Or, again, if Barmore is fine too. Obviously, if you're rushing the passer, he's just inconsistent sometimes. um But, yeah, i know I think if you get those guys in there, clearly like they should be able to get some form of pressure. I think Christian Ellis is playing a really good defense.
Speaker: I agree with you. yeah Yeah. Flying around the field. Splane had issues last week, but it was better this week. Again, this is a pretty shitty Miami team. Does it concern you guys at all that Miami is so shitty?
Speaker: and they struggled and struggled against them? It does, and I think you come off a really emotional game against the the Bears. I think you're looking ahead to the stretch you have coming up with the Packers and the Lions and two big games right there. And I just think just from an emotional standpoint, I think that's sort of a letdown trap game right there in Miami. And and the fact that you had you had nothing on offense, too, to kind of top that all off. um ah you got out of there with a win. And I think really that's all that matters. That would have been a horrific, horrific season changing loss had they, had they lost that game.
Speaker: But the fact that you pick up that and just take the win and keep it moving. Yeah. They, they clearly didn't have their, their game. They weren't really playing for it, but, I don't know. This is also a situation where you go, well why is that the case? Like, why are we struggling so far on the road? I mean we, we never showed up for Jacksonville and they just ran away with it. Cause they're a much stronger team. We struggled and didn't really show up against Miami. And then they almost ran away with it. You go against the jets and it's like, you just allow that team. That's pretty garbage. Just linger around. So,
Speaker: You know, it's just it's a makeup of the team that I'm I'm just trying to understand like where they're at mentality wise and Getting that championship pedigree like is it there because they're just struggling to put away these teams Yeah, you're getting the win, but in what fashion? Like it's one thing to say we just put them away and we put them away easily Because we're just clearly the better team and then there's we just kind of middled around for three quarters then we pulled it out in the end in the fourth quarter that's not a recipe for success long term and they're going to run into problems going down the road so yeah it's a win it's just it hasn't been a feel-good win for a while now yeah but look who look who who are the three teams they've lost to like who who have they lost to this year the yeah the Bears in the
Speaker: yeah those are the jacksonxville and the bears are like the twograss teams in the nfl Like right now, the two best teams. And Seattle is is still Seattle. And you should have really beaten Seattle up in the fourth with the whole fucking – looking back, i they should never have lost that game. Seattle could be 3-5 right now.
Speaker: But they're still obviously like an incredibly strong team. But like they've they've lost to two of the best teams in the NFL. So they're still five and three You know, like do they have problems? Yeah, they fucking problems. Like I don't know. Like the A.J. Brown shit, I wanted A.J. Brown so badly to come here.
Speaker: I was a huge fan of AJ Brown, like advocating for I don't know how long I advocated for trading for AJ Brown, but I have too many tweets over too long. Yeah. You can't scrub it. It's over. People know. There's no scrubbing. I've i've i've learned i can't scrub anything anymore. Like people have the receipts. Like if you want to go find my old like Javon Baker takes, like you're going to, you're going to find it there and you'll torture me with ah yeah screenshots Jalen Polk, you know, like in training camp, whatever. um But
Speaker: But yeah, a j I've loved AJ Brown for a long time, man. I've wanted him here for years. I've been tweeting about him for years. And I'm just so disappointed, so disappointed in the performance so far. I'm so disappointed. not just I actually couldn't believe when he came back that he dropped all those balls. was like, what am i when i watching?
Speaker: I've never seen someone play that poorly in my life. but it was it was ah It was atrocious. I'm with you. I was team A.J. Brown, too, and was back. And and the the the weird thing was in that Jets game, it wasn't the ankle. You weren't looking at it going like, oh, this guy can't move or anything. No, yeah you just couldn't catch the football, which was he move well out of it yeah kind of a concerning thing as a wide receiver, right? So, yeah, no, I'm with you on that.
Speaker: It's frustrating for a guy. We gave up a first round pick expected him to basically elevate our entire offense to only get 20 targets. And he's basically been a non-factor all year.
Speaker: He has been a non, I mean, he was okay. Had some okay moments in Chicago, I guess, but, um The problem is I don't like questioning the training staff, like coming from a medical background. Like I, I'm typically will default to, I believe that they're doing what they, they believe is best for the player in this circumstance.
Speaker: I wonder if they weren't doing what's best for the player and we're instead trying to do what's best for the organization. Now, I'm not accusing anything like malpractice anything like that, but I think they're like, hey, are you healthy enough to play against the Bears on a short week? Are you happy enough are you healthy enough to play?
Speaker: And he probably said, I'm healthy enough to go. They said, you're clear to go. and where Versus they could have been like, hey, man, we're going to recommend a pitch count. you're going to on a 25 play pitch count.
Speaker: Right. Well, he definitely was on a pitch count. That's for sure. you know He had over 50 snaps against the Jets and then and then played that that Bears game too. as though you know the The concerning thing for me is that it's not the ankle, though, too. it's like the It's the knee that he's had issues with that's kind of flared up here. So like that that that, to me, is is pretty frightening if you're Patriots fan because that's sort of been the one thing you look at going, that that's so that that's what I felt like could potentially derail this trade from the beginning, right? is just Does that knee sort of fall apart on him? And so for that to now crop up after already what's been a disappointing first half of the season is is is definitely not the start that you wanted when it comes to this trade.
Speaker: I was surprised reading that tweet real quick, but a tweet by Dan Rotman, who's friend of the show, who's a good guy. And by the way, again, like people, you know, obviously you're saying like, oh, a doubting Dan's tweet, like, oh, he said multiple weeks.
Speaker: I don't doubt Dan. And I think Dan is well sourced on this. And I talked to Dan. I think he's well sourced. And I would be surprised if AJ played this week. Really surprised. I think that would surprise a lot of people. I think the expectation is he's going to be out at the earliest a couple weeks. We'll see.
Speaker: I hope Dan's wrong. I really do. I hope he's ah totally hope he's wrong. I don't think he is wrong, though. So I think they're like being extremely cautious now after a flare up. You need him for a fucking playoff run.
Speaker: Yeah, you do. You do. I think you get Matt Collins back this week. I'd be really surprised if you don't have Matt Collins back. yeah I'm with you on AJ Brown. I'd be i'd be stunned if he winds up playing on Sunday.
Speaker: Yeah, and just to kind of piggyback on the comment about like the knee versus the ankle, i agree. When it was the ankle injury and you had people knocking the you know trade asset, and why did you go get an aging wide receiver trading at first because now he's injured he can't play with a high ankle, and will he ever be back the same? It's like, well, you you can't predict that. like That's just going to happen. That could happen to anyone.
Speaker: The knee is something where it's like, no, that was a known issue coming in. and And now that this is flared up and on top of it, there's really not a lot of sourcing as to like, what was the causation? Like what happened? We're all speculating is what it is. But it's widely reported that no, no, this is tied into the knee issue that he has.
Speaker: Now, how did he re-injure it? How did he aggravate it? What is that it? That's the hush-hush part, but at least it's the knee. So we know that, and that's that is the concerning piece because we can't have that be a flare-up issue that holds him out and sidelines him and becomes ah a lingering issue long-term. Because if that is the case, then yeah, that is a point where you look it and say, Well, was it the right move trading at first? I'm not there yet. I still think this guy is going to come back and be healthy and really support us. I was on, I was for the trade at the time. I'm still for the trade. I think it's too soon to judge. It's, it's just a little bit concerning. It's,
Speaker: I think there's like there's a place now for some judgment. I don't want to judge it, but I think there's i think you can have like a some degree of judgment if you want. You can say, hey, are they maximizing? They traded a first-round pick for this guy. right like So you can you can judge it. If this was another team, if this was any other franchise, what would you say?
Speaker: I don't think I'd say anything different. i don't think i'd say You don't think so? If this was a different franchise, you'd be like, I don't know. the Bills had traded for him, if the Bills had traded a for him. Yeah, and he's out half the year already with a degenerative knee and they traded a first.
Speaker: Yeah, i like I would be elated, but I don't think would have been like... Like at the time, oh if they traded and got for AJ Brown for a first round pick, i'll be like, oh, fuck, the Bills got AJ Brown. Like, that's horrible. Like, we're screwed, all that stuff. And then if you went down with an injury, I'd be like, oh, that sucks for them. But I don't know if I would criticize them necessarily. Again, if it's the knee and it becomes a long-term thing, which is not there yet. It's not there yet. If it becomes a longer-term thing, I would say, okay.
Speaker: He can salvage this. Like, I think it's fair to judge it. But I think, dude, if he comes back in a couple weeks and leads you down the home stretch and, like, all sudden has five catches, six catches, seven catches a game with Drake, Dobbs is back and Hollins is back and Vera Tucker's back. And you're like, oh, I see this vision. Yeah. right Yeah.
Speaker: If that all happens, then I think it's Which, way, that's on the table. What you're describing is 100% on the table for this team. All those guys you expect back. And I think that I wouldn't be stunned if at the end of the year you do kind have it rolling on offense with those pieces, for sure.
Speaker: Yeah. i don't think it's crazy. I don't think it's crazy that they can be really good. I just think, though, you have nine games left, and um basically six of them are against – do this in my head, the Packers, the lions, uh, you know, divided venue of the, buy the chargers.
Speaker: Yeah. They should be beat the chargers. Any, you at some point then soon you have the chiefs and the Vikings. Um, Oh, you're talking about the tough games and you fit, you close out with the Denver. Yeah. Like we have six hard games, right? Like it's like, um,
Speaker: Packers, Lions, Chiefs, Vikings, Broncos, and there's one more. But you have six difficult games. for but The Bills, right? and you say that And the Bills again. Yeah, the Bills the Bills. So, like, that's six very legitimate teams. And, like, couple those – you know, the Chiefs defense is really hard.
Speaker: The Vikings defense is crazy. So, like, you're going to find a way. But Vikings offense is horrible. So, you'll have to find a way to win at least half these games. Like, if if you win – If you win five games, you get to the postseason. So you got to win five of nine.
Speaker: And can you do that? Right? That's what I was going to ask you guys. This last two-game stretch heading into Dubai, Green Bay and Detroit, what is that?
Speaker: What's a success in your mind coming off those games? I think you can split half and half. I just think like you would have – I would have been like if they had guys healthy, I'd say you sweep these games.
Speaker: Like, I think you're better. If you're healthier, I think you're better than green Bay. i think Love is a deep decent player. They throw deep a lot. If Watson's not right, and you can man up Watson with Gonzo. Like,
Speaker: And then Green Bay's defenses came on. They're pretty good. So they're coming on. That's tough. But I think i think you beat Green Bay this Sunday. It's going to be tough, but I think you beat them. And then the Lions in Germany in the morning, I got no clue what happens there. that I'm with you on that. It's just a wild card game. yeah Yeah. Yeah. That's a complete mess. You're in a different country. Like those international games are insanely unpredictable. But I think you've got to beat the Chiefs at home.
Speaker: Are they in the road for the Chiefs? i think they're No, they're at the Chiefs at the chiefs Monday night. yeah that's did that's tough spot That's a tough spot. That's tough, and I think you can still beat them.
Speaker: And the Vikings, you got to beat at home. So I think you win. You've got to win at least five. You get the ten wins. Get in the dance. Yeah. I'm happy with that. Yeah, I agree. I think the the Packers well versus the Lions kind of comparison, the Packers are a more favorable matchup. The Lions are coming on strong right now. The Packers are really kind of up and down, and they haven't really played a whole lot. but I get both of their defenses are pretty soft, so i guess that benefits us from an offensive standpoint when we're trying to get healthy.
Speaker: i just i think Drake's strong enough to be able to overcome those and beat the Packers at home. i think because it's the Lions and it's because it's an Oversea, and I feel like that team's coming on more strong now,
Speaker: than the Packers are. That's the game that probably concerns me the most. So i think if you go one-on-one out of those two games, get into a bye, play the Chargers, like that should be favorable to pick up couple of wins there.
Speaker: And then i think we hit pretty much the real toughest stretch that we're going to have all year. you know Basically going against the Bills, going against the Vikings, going against the Chiefs. Those three games are monsters.
Speaker: It's exciting though. I mean, honestly, like it should be exciting. Like you're, you're, these are all high level, like primetime matchups. All them. You don't have one o'clock till like, I forget one like way late late December, I think. Right. Isn't it? yeah Remember we played the jets and then we don't get another one o'clock game until the jets yeah till the jets. Yeah. Tim, how many wins do you think they end up finishing with?
Speaker: I think I said 11 going into the season, and I think 10 is probably what you're looking at, 11 potentially, but right around there is is where you're going to wind up, I should say.
Speaker: I think there's a potential A.J. Brown waits until after – Again, I hope this is not true. I think he waits until after both these and NFC North games and then comes back after the bye. Yeah, you give him the bye. If you can keep him from flying to Germany too, I don't know. bit yeah you know It's like a de facto IR stint and you're basically just like back. so like again like i Again, correct. i like I want him to play. I want him to play.
Speaker: Want him to do good job. um Is there any key matchups you're looking forward to in the game this weekend, like Patriots versus Green Bay? Is there anything you're keen in on or that you're interested in seeing?
Speaker: i Look, i we we talked about sort of the receivers coming up. I want to see if Matt Collins is back, what what that looks like, if they can kind of work him back in as well. Like you said, I don't expect A.J. Brown to play in this game, so i don't think you're gonna have that. And then Gonzalez versus Watson on the other side, I think is going to be, if Watson's playing, sort of ah a big-time matchup to keep your eye on.
Speaker: But this should be it should be a fun game. It'll be fun to have Brady on the call, all of it. I just think yeah that this this one will be big.
Speaker: Yeah, I want the defensive line to feast. This is a game where you should be able to feast and get after it, and then that's going to help us to get some hopeful turnovers. It would be great if we won the turnover game for once this season. Man, that's so the other thing about this defense, man, is they just cannot they cannot come up with turnovers right now. It's brutal.
Speaker: Brutal. We can't come up with them and we give a turnover up every game. At least. I'm surprised with the Chisholm turnover. Like that surprised me actually that he like let that happen. Like he's usually like, I know this is a fantastic peanut punch. I understand like sometimes it just.
Speaker: takes the It happens, but yeah, no, I'm with you on that. Yeah. Yeah, that was that was surprising. We just we haven't won the turnover battle all year. So I think this could be the game because I just think this is one where the defensive line focus on the turnovers. There's also a team like they've they've been known to make a lot of dumb errors. Like they've done a lot of dumb stuff. Like I don't think LaFleur is a great coach. I think he's a good offensive coordinator, but like by and large, not great, great game management. They've made some dumb errors.
Speaker: Like, I think there's ways we can capitalize on that and hopefully get something that turns in our tide. I do think, though, it's going to be pretty high scoring. I think this one's going to be a pretty good back-and-forth type game.
Speaker: Really? Yeah, I think – I mean, again, I'm not high on our defense right now, and I think the Packers are going to be able move enough, and it's just going to be another game where we're going have to have Drake come out and be special.
Speaker: I mean, this is like – Genuinely speaking, they're five and three So, in reality, isn't this where exactly where you wanted them to be right now? Like, really? like Like, isn't this kind of like exactly what needed to happen right now?
Speaker: Well, I mean, we talked about it coming out of the first four games of the year. You said if you if you were 500 coming out of that, you'd be in a good spot. And then yeah like and you see what happens in Chicago. and So, yeah. No, you're right. i mean But it how you got there, too, like you said, like the Seattle game was was right there for you. And it just – You know, so that leaves a sour taste in your mouth coming out of that, even though you you wind up beating Buffalo, which is a great win for them. So, yeah, no, you can certainly see the positives in five and three, but you can also look at it and say, like, man, you you left something on the table there in Chicago and Seattle, honestly.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the good thing that I would look at with a five and three record is a like we talked about, we're. heavily injured and those guys are coming back, but, but b like we're making a lot of self-inflicted errors, which should be correctable.
Speaker: Like those things should correct themselves and they should be something that we could be able to resolve and then start to solidify and get in, get better. I mean, you watch that Miami game.
Speaker: I can only imagine what was going through Vrabel's mind in that first half, just like, questioning everything going on about the coach. The amount of times they showed him, by the way, in that first half. think I've seen a coach be showed a broadcast more one half than Rabel was in that first half. Man, it was constant, constant. I mean, that guy was just like churning, being like, these mother effers keep making these stupid effing mistakes. Why the eff? You know what I mean? Like, we're because we're all thinking it. And he's like, come on. Like, you got to get another false start. Oh, my gosh. Like, he's Yeah, you can't get the ball up Wilson. You had another bad snap to get over there. Drake like he's like, what the hell is going on? And so you hear him in the press conference. He's like, yeah, you know, league quarterbacks don't make excuses. He's just like being excellent and picking up where things are getting sloppy. But like internally, he's got to be so furious.
Speaker: So just going through some, some stats here for green Bay, right? Just to overview, they don't score that much so far this season. They especially had a bad start to the season, right? They're twenty third in the NFL. They score 21 points a game. They give up 20 a game, right? So they they're not scoring that much. Their scoring defense is pretty good. They don't give a lot of points per play. the Yards per game, they give up 314. That's 10th in the NFL. It's not bad.
Speaker: um Their defense is is turning into a pretty decent unit. But, like, again, their own offense, they're not they're not amazing. Their running offense is horrible.
Speaker: Horrible. They're 32nd in the league in run-play percentage. They only run 34% of the time. So they pass a ton. um They only get 2.9 yards of carry, yards of rush.
Speaker: So they basically don't run a lot, and they can't run. so i don't know if there's something going on there with just their offensive line being atrocious. They have injuries there, but they're not they're not rush running the ball well whatsoever. They only run 21 times a game. They only get 60 rush yards a game. Throwing-wise, they're the number one team the league, opposite side of the spectrum. Throwing, they throw 66% of the time. That's the top in the league. They throw a ton.
Speaker: Okay? um And again, the yards per pass, seven yards a pass. They, they throw it 39 times a game. They get 270 pass yards a game. That's second in the NFL. So again, like they can't run the football, they pass a ton, but they do it decently. And I think, I believe I don't have this in front of me, but Jordan love has, I think the highest or or deepest, whether it's like a dot, like he basically has the most, uh, you know, 40 yard passes, 20 yard passes. Like he throws downfield the entire game and he throws a lot. So, That's kind of like what you're you're going against. And I think, you know, can that play into your favor? Like, I think it can. If you're healthy secondary and you have Gonzo manning up, you know again, like if Christian Watson is healthy, just shadow Watson the entire game. Just say, this is your job.
Speaker: Take him out of the game. Eliminate him, which is what Gonzo can do. And I think if you do that, you can you can win the football game. You know?
Speaker: Yeah. i Again, i just – maybe I'm just so down on our defense right now because of how we played against the dolphins and the jets. I just, I don't feel like we're stopping really anyone at this point. So until we do that, I don't really know how we're going to produce. Like I said, the matchup I'm looking forward to is, is can our defense get after it and get, and get to love to basically disrupt and hopefully force some turnovers. If that's the case, then great. This is the matchup that should be the case. But I would have said the same thing against Miami. The defense was going to feast and this was going to be a cakewalk and that wasn't the case. I would have said the same thing against the Jets. The Jets are going to fold and they're not going to be able to push it in after halftime because we pretty much leaned on them and that was not the case.
Speaker: So, I'm just going to continuously believe that Drake May is going to figure it out and our defense is still struggling to find their footing. I hope it's the case against the Packers. I just think ultimately LaFleur is a strong enough coordinator and I think the Packers offense with Love and Watson, I think there's enough there that they're going to be able to move the ball that it's it's going to be a little bit of a struggle.
Speaker: Hope I'm wrong. Yeah, I think their defense is pretty good. Like their past defense is good. Their run defense is pretty good. I think they have their their their solid defense. it's It's interesting. They're like, they're solid. They're kind of a solid team. It doesn't mean, I thought looking a few weeks ago, it was this was going an easier game than it looks now. I mean, again, they have to travel. You're at home.
Speaker: Energy should be high, you know, stuff like that. So while we go around and um we'll get towards wrapping it, Brett, you can tell me what's your prediction, what's your score for the game and and who wins?
Speaker: I'm going to say the Pats win. I'm going to say it's 30 to 24. I think it's another three plus touchdown game for Drake May. I think he's just going to continue to be efficient.
Speaker: But as I said, I'm going to say what's going to help us is the turnover. We're going to win the turnover battle of this game.
Speaker: I'm going to Pats in this game too. I'm going to go New England. So I think it's going to be a really tight game. But ultimately, I think the Pats come out on top, I like that. That's like similar than similar to what i was going to say. I'll guess. I'll change my i'll change a score. I'll say like pats, something like that. I feel like they'll win by a score.
Speaker: um I'll be there and it should be fun, hopefully. now It's going to feel like it's midnight, though, with the clock change. I'm going off the clock change. It's a night game, man. Yeah, yeah exactly.
Speaker: We're all like old old guys now. like this is like I can't do the fucking clocks, dude. I could do a whole podcast on the clocks. ah Just an hour of the clock talk. I'm going to name it. It's a new new pod, clock talk. Clock Talk's not a bad name, man. That's half the battle right there. That's a great name.
Speaker: I feel like I could really market that. anyway But for real, I'm tired. But yeah, so yeah, anyway, um anything else you guys want to – any final thoughts, anything you want to cover to go over or you guys get everything off your chest you want to get off?
Speaker: No, think that's it, man. Look, i if you can split these two games, at leave if you can walk away with a win against Green Bay, I think you're and you're in an awesome spot moving forward. And I think it's going to be interesting to see what winds up happening at the deadline. If they actually do peel off some of these pieces, again, I still – man, I'd be really surprised if they did that and if they actually wind up making an addition too. So i'm um I think it's going to be a fun few days here for Pats fans.
Speaker: Yeah. And the trade should happen this week, I think. And I would say, like, I think they're going to trade Travion Henderson. i think they're going to trade off Barmore. And as long as you're getting like a nose guard back, like Grover Stewart from Indy, getting someone with a real run stuffing player back. I'm a fan of that. That's fine.
Speaker: um But you just can't sell. And I really don't like selling Carlton Davis. He's played pretty well this year. i'm not he has man he has yeah i know he's tackling really well like i'm not into just like getting rid of people just because to get rid of them like they're just like oh it's expiring and it's a lot like let's just trade them like that's that's bullshit like that's like playing really well for you yeah i agree with you yeah it's playing really well let's trade them like that makes no fucking sense that's like you know that's like baseball teams who shut off assets whatever it's bullshit Anyway, thank you guys for tuning in. Appreciate everyone coming on for the live stream. Thanks, ah Tim, for coming on. we Appreciate you taking the time.
Speaker: and And, yeah, we'll catch you on 98.5, catch you on the radio. No, thanks, guys. i appreciate it. This was awesome. All right. Thanks, everyone, for tuning in. I'm going wrap it up. Peace.
Speaker: Peace.
Speaker: End the stream.
