Ep 51: Stairway to Canada with David Dennis

Transcript

Speaker: Thanks for tuning in to the Loser Kid Pinball Podcast.

Speaker: This is episode, what are we on?

Speaker: 51.

Speaker: 51.

Speaker: Come on, we just had 50 last time.

Speaker: I'm so glad we weren't recording just 30 seconds earlier.

Speaker: So with me, my co-captain is always Scott Larson.

Speaker: It's Scott.

Speaker: Let's get our wonderful friends of the podcast.

Speaker: Let's talk about them for a second before we introduce our guests.

Speaker: Okay, first and foremost, if you want to pick up that new pinball machine or pinball swag to upgrade your machine, please check out Flippin' Out Pinball.

Speaker: I just got my new Avengers topper, and I'm going to be installing it here soon.

Speaker: And so that's a great place to either get a machine or bling things out.

Speaker: Zach and Nicole have always been great to work with.

Speaker: Also, if you want to look at how to play that pinball machine, check out Rate A Pinball.

Speaker: He is currently the world's number one, and he finished this year as number one.

Speaker: So he's a great resource for you.

Speaker: Also, if you want to find out more about the things going on in pinball, please check out This Week in Pinball at Jeff Patterson.

Speaker: And right now, the Twippy Awards are going on.

Speaker: So if you feel so inclined, please go ahead and cast a few votes and vote for your favorite machine, favorite podcaster, favorite, et cetera.

Speaker: Also check out the Pinball Loft.

Speaker: It's a blog of my friend and he'll be able to help you out there.

Speaker: If you want to pick up those pin shades, so if you want to play on location but actually be able to see past the glare of the glass, go ahead and check out pin shades.

Speaker: If you want to pick out some extra art, check out Brian Allen.

Speaker: He just released a Whitewater Alternative Translight, which is a lot of fun, has a lot of Easter eggs from the Williams Valley era.

Speaker: And if you want to light up your translights that have been sitting around and gathering dust, please check out Lit Frames.

Speaker: They always have a good deal going on and a way to spruce up your pinball.

Speaker: area also if you want to check out some more information on pinball please check out pinball supernova and if you're looking at the history of pinball a great podcast that has just finished their 10th episode is the silver ball chronicles that is on the t the pinball network and currently with us we have the co-host of the silver ball chronicles uh way up from the great white north the land of russian getty lee it's david dennis

Speaker: Hey, how is everybody?

Speaker: Thank you for having me on.

Speaker: This is the top of the mountain, the loser kid pinball podcast.

Speaker: It's a big deal to be on this one.

Speaker: Well, thank you.

Speaker: I will.

Speaker: We don't feel that way, but no, we shower us with more praise.

Speaker: We don't mind.

Speaker: That's right.

Speaker: I just need to get that ego going.

Speaker: So I get all the softball questions, all the praise and love.

Speaker: It's going to be amazing.

Speaker: Okay, first off, I do want to start off.

Speaker: I saw David post something on Facebook, and this is how we started interacting.

Speaker: It was about the election time, and they had Canadians be like, and I had a guy eating some Lay's ketchup potato chips and staring out the window like Mrs. Kravitz from Bewitched.

Speaker: And so I talked back and forth, and David actually sent me

Speaker: some culinary treats from Canada.

Speaker: And so now I have been able to enjoy Canadian cuisine.

Speaker: And even when I was at Epcot Center, I got some, okay, how do you pronounce this?

Speaker: Is it poutine or is that what it is?

Speaker: That's the way to go.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: So if you get the Francophone pronunciation, it's poutine.

Speaker: And if it's, you know, your Anglophone kind of way, it's like poutine.

Speaker: But, you know, it doesn't, it's tomato, tomato, really.

Speaker: It's, all it is, is the most amazing thing that fills your heart with love.

Speaker: And fills your, yeah, your arteries with a plaque, so.

Speaker: But hey, it was very good.

Speaker: And so anyway, I promised him a shirt and in true to form the last of the year, I've been completely slammed the last two months.

Speaker: And so I have not been able to get that off again.

Speaker: Those things will be out and I'll probably recruit Josh to help me send those things out because he is much better actually getting to the post office than I am.

Speaker: I can't believe Dennis Creasel has one of these, one of these hats and I'm, and I'm without one of these hats.

Speaker: And, and quite frankly, I think I am much more charming than somebody like Dennis Creasel.

Speaker: Well, Dennis is kind of, I've, I've mentioned this before.

Speaker: If you watch SpongeBob, he is kind of the Squidward.

Speaker: He's, he's usually trying to get the job done, but he's not really the ray of sunshine.

Speaker: The Zach is so,

Speaker: Anyway, good times.

Speaker: So we will get things up to you.

Speaker: So Dennis, how are things up in Canada right now?

Speaker: Things are going fairly well.

Speaker: We've had a very mild sort of beginning to the winter.

Speaker: So we're all very pleased at how this is going.

Speaker: Um,

Speaker: My area, particularly when it sort of comes to the COVID outbreak and whatnot, we are probably one of the best places in the entire world when it comes to caseload and where to live and where to be.

Speaker: So we're incredibly lucky.

Speaker: We're taking it incredibly serious here with masking since like July.

Speaker: You know, everybody is physical distancing like you would not believe.

Speaker: So it's turned out fairly well here for the most part.

Speaker: I do very much miss people.

Speaker: I haven't been to any events.

Speaker: I haven't gone to any tournaments in Nova Scotia, which is the province next to mine.

Speaker: I haven't played a lot of the newer games, and that's a bit of a bummer.

Speaker: But in general, how things are going, I would say significantly better than most places.

Speaker: That's really good.

Speaker: I feel like in the retrospective of the year, I feel like all I do is I go to work and I come home and not really do much of the other stuff.

Speaker: We've been able to do some limited events.

Speaker: Like I picked up

Speaker: Turtles machine and I also picked up an Avengers and was able to get some people over but a couple people over we wore masks dropped them down but it just the dynamic is different usually when events get around there's there's fun there's eating there's drinking there's playing and when you're it feels more sterile I guess and it doesn't have that relaxing feel the social aspect has been completely nuked this year

Speaker: Yeah, and you have this weird anxiety all the time, which doesn't help you when you're trying to relax with friends as well.

Speaker: But, you know, it could seriously be a lot worse, especially where we are here in Canada.

Speaker: But the expectation with that vaccine...

Speaker: the distribution of that here.

Speaker: Canada is all about sort of lefty bureaucracies and government overreach.

Speaker: And so far, the vaccine rollout has been going incredibly smooth, incredibly fast.

Speaker: Testing is easy and quick, and majority of it is online.

Speaker: So things have gone really well here considering what they could be.

Speaker: Yeah, I got my vaccine two weeks ago, and so I have not grown a third head, but I have been able to read mine, so it's been really useful.

Speaker: Nice.

Speaker: Sadly, it's just my mind that I'm reading, and I'm kind of boring.

Speaker: It's like the sound of rocks.

Speaker: Yeah, exactly.

Speaker: It's all good.

Speaker: So anyway, you have a good New Year?

Speaker: You have a good Christmas time?

Speaker: Everything was great.

Speaker: Things have gone really, really well.

Speaker: The family had tons of fun.

Speaker: We were able to do the Christmas dinners.

Speaker: We were able to do all of that stuff because caseloads are so low.

Speaker: Got to see a few friends and play some pinball with their collections here locally.

Speaker: And I did a lot of tweaking.

Speaker: I got a couple of new coils there on some Black Fridays.

Speaker: And of course,

Speaker: Those show up right just before Christmas, so you're able to do some soldering and fix a couple of coils here or there, strengthen them up.

Speaker: So yeah, I would say I got ahead quite well this year.

Speaker: That's awesome.

Speaker: And we are going into the new year now.

Speaker: We had an announcement recently.

Speaker: So we kind of all knew this was coming.

Speaker: We've heard about it.

Speaker: Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: Let's talk about initial response.

Speaker: And one, when you when I tell you the word or the band Led Zeppelin, what do you feel when it comes to pinball?

Speaker: Oh, it's rocking out, right?

Speaker: It is the definition of rock.

Speaker: And I have to be totally transparent.

Speaker: There is one rule in my car, and that is never turn down Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: Are you being sorry with us right now?

Speaker: That's the one rule?

Speaker: That is the one rule in my car.

Speaker: Never turn off Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: So if it's on the radio or I have it on Spotify, it never gets shut off.

Speaker: And in fact, it rarely gets turned down.

Speaker: It is pretty great.

Speaker: I have two children.

Speaker: I got a five and a half year old and a two and a half year old.

Speaker: And I've had to teach them a very difficult lesson a couple of times on you never turn Led Zeppelin because they don't want to listen to it.

Speaker: And I say, and I had to, and I have to explain it to them and, you know, they cry, but it is important life lesson that they learn that Led Zeppelin is to not be turned off.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: Is that, did they turn it off when they were shoveling?

Speaker: You know, is that why you sent them out to shovel your driveway?

Speaker: Cause I mean, I saw you, saw you yelling at them.

Speaker: That's right.

Speaker: They, they, they, they need to learn these important lessons in life.

Speaker: I'm a, you know, I love Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: I'm not a, I'm not a massive Led Zeppelin fan.

Speaker: I'm not a, I don't have that, that level of love like a Jeff Teolis has, but I really do enjoy Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: I think they're a fantastic band.

Speaker: And I think that this is an amazing, amazing theme for, for somebody like Stern to pick up.

Speaker: I totally agree.

Speaker: I think that a Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: Well, they're one of the top, what is it, seven bands to ever break like over 300 million albums sold or something like that.

Speaker: I mean, they've obviously etched their name into the histories of rock and roll and music in general.

Speaker: just how many people have they influenced, right?

Speaker: How many bands have, you know, Robert Plant, Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones and, and, and, uh, John Bonham, you know, how many bands have they influenced to do what they do now?

Speaker: Like that it goes well beyond, they've played some awesome rock songs, you know, and sold some albums.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Wow.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: No, it's a standout theme for sure.

Speaker: And I would consider one if I was in that era for a new in-box pinball machine, if I was in the market for something like that.

Speaker: That would be something I would consider.

Speaker: But it's a Richie, so there's no major surprises when it comes to Playfield layout.

Speaker: I think the big surprise here is how it's coded and what the code is going to be like.

Speaker: And I think that's where the game is going to shine.

Speaker: Yeah, I totally agree with that.

Speaker: See, when I thought of Led Zeppelin, I'm thinking, okay, if I ask you to name three icons from a different era,

Speaker: So in the 50s, in the 50s, you would definitely say Elvis Presley, right?

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: Oh, I would, yes.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And in the 60s, you're going to say the Beatles, Rolling Stones, and pretty much everybody else, right?

Speaker: So you're talking bands that other bands say, I want to do what they're doing.

Speaker: So that's different.

Speaker: So you have the, and then think of the 70s.

Speaker: Is there a more iconic band band?

Speaker: You could say Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: You could probably say Fleetwood Mac.

Speaker: I would honestly, if I was going to fight you on it, I would say ACDC is up there with Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: But I guess I look at ACDC and Back in Black came out around 1980.

Speaker: And so I would consider that the end of the 70s.

Speaker: But if you're looking at a band that drove the 70s, even Aerosmith said the reason why we made it big is because

Speaker: Led Zeppelin wasn't touring around here every year.

Speaker: And so they're like, Led Zeppelin's not coming, but Aerosmith is coming.

Speaker: And so that's when they made their chops because, you know, I would say Aerosmith's a good band.

Speaker: It's a great band, but I don't think it moves to the icon status.

Speaker: But Led Zeppelin is an iconic band.

Speaker: And when you look at the 80s, the iconic bands, I would say Van Halen,

Speaker: I would say ACDC.

Speaker: I would actually say, and I'm going to push back on this.

Speaker: I would say Bon Jovi because once they release their stuff, there is a shift in the way other bands are making music.

Speaker: And you could say the same thing about Guns N' Roses.

Speaker: They were a glorious sunset to that 80s sound.

Speaker: Then you had Nirvana, who twisted things and moved on.

Speaker: Well, they were 90s, though.

Speaker: No, no.

Speaker: I'm just saying I'm moving on with icons.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Okay, gotcha.

Speaker: You got Nirvana, you got Pearl Jam, and U2 is, okay, I forgot U2.

Speaker: I would say U2 is probably the biggest iconic band of the last 40 years, even though they really haven't done much in the last 20 years, really.

Speaker: But really name other bands that are super iconic.

Speaker: And anytime you can land an iconic band or an iconic theme, whatever it is, you're going to take it.

Speaker: No, I totally agree.

Speaker: I think that my first impression of Led Zeppelin is the art feels to its era.

Speaker: I felt like it hits the 70s feel on the mark.

Speaker: I also felt like, though, that we've rehashed this play field before.

Speaker: And like David said, man, it's Steve Ritchie.

Speaker: You kind of know what you're going to get with it.

Speaker: But the thing that kind of...

Speaker: is a no it's weird to me is like when you think of steve ritchie and you think of this layout you think of star trek you think of spider-man you think of you know and all those have in commons that warp ramp and it just it feels right you know it's spider-man i guess it loops back around to the left side but still it's like the greatest shot in pinball yeah and it's weird to me that

Speaker: Now this is technically behind a paywall because you don't get it with the Pro.

Speaker: You get it with the premium and the LE.

Speaker: It's a weird move to me.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: Is there anything new about this?

Speaker: Yes, I will give you that.

Speaker: But I think you're going to find that they have made compromises or they've made decisions based on what they can satisfy for the location pinball because you're still going to sell the majority of your machines in the pro price range.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: then you're going to get the collectors and the premiums and some sort of mix out there.

Speaker: But it's a challenging thing to kind of walk that line.

Speaker: So I don't know.

Speaker: I think it's good.

Speaker: But if you really look at the 50s and 60s and 70s, there wasn't much variation in pinball layouts either.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Well, but here's the thing, though, like from what I've heard, though, is the pro has had lukewarm reception to at best.

Speaker: numbers wise being bought.

Speaker: Like it is obviously if you want this game, people are buying premium or Ellie.

Speaker: It's not the pro on this one.

Speaker: So do you think though, that's because locations aren't selling games like there is no like location pinball right now.

Speaker: And so you're mainly selling to a home collector.

Speaker: I would, I would say yes, but,

Speaker: look at Turtles and Avengers this year.

Speaker: Avengers has sold pros to locations, even though locations aren't really technically open.

Speaker: I mean, I know people that own pros of that.

Speaker: And Turtles, it seems like the pro is the better way to go versus the premium LE.

Speaker: Oh, don't tell me that kills me.

Speaker: I have a premium.

Speaker: But my point being is, I feel like the numbers will go with the machine that feels like it's worth it the most.

Speaker: Yeah, I mean, if you're trying to find that value proposition right now, we're buying a box of lights that...

Speaker: is more expensive than what it actually costs to actually build.

Speaker: But if you're looking for unique, fun, interesting things, the premium LE of this is stellar.

Speaker: If you're a diehard Zeppelin fan and you just want the tunes and the good time, you're going pro.

Speaker: If you're more of the player collector hobbyist, you're going in premium LE.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Like, I mean, I don't, when it comes to art in, in general, the premium LE package, I think is beautiful.

Speaker: And if people are going to freak out, okay.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: There's a difference though.

Speaker: Road here.

Speaker: Dennis, there's a difference though.

Speaker: You have the play field and you have the side art.

Speaker: And so are you lumping them both together?

Speaker: I'm going to jam them both together.

Speaker: I'm okay with the black and white because that is Led Zeppelin, right?

Speaker: That image is Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: And as a Led Zeppelin fan, I'm like, yeah, I'm good with that.

Speaker: Now, would I rather a hand-drawn, you know, Franchie-esque band members...

Speaker: Beatles treatment.

Speaker: Well, yeah, of course, but this isn't going to make me, you know, drive to Chicago in the middle of the pandemic and burn stern to the ground.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, the, the, the pro with the, the Zeppelin three album art, um, you know, my least favorite album art, like of all of their, you know,

Speaker: albums, right?

Speaker: But it is Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: I, you know, I got to give them, that's the brand.

Speaker: That's the, you know, that's the iconic album.

Speaker: I, you know, it's not the greatest.

Speaker: It's thematically consistent, I guess.

Speaker: It's artistically consistent with what Led Zeppelin has done themselves.

Speaker: Exactly.

Speaker: And it looks like, you know, a pop star in the seventies threw up on the album cover and that's exactly what this machine looks like.

Speaker: So I can't, I can't, I can't fault them for that.

Speaker: Well, and I think this is a prime example.

Speaker: This is your first one if you're ready to start taking tallies.

Speaker: I think this is where when a licensor gets involved versus one that just is somewhat interested, like Guns N' Roses versus Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: I mean, Led Zeppelin, it sounded like the band.

Speaker: had a lot of direction of where they want stuff to go on Led Zeppelin or, uh, guns and roses on, on Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: And it wasn't for the better, in my opinion, artwork.

Speaker: Like, like David said, I mean like album art number or their number three album, would you really pick that as your main artwork?

Speaker: That's probably what they wanted because that's exactly how they envisioned their pinball machine.

Speaker: You listen to Eric with Guns N' Roses.

Speaker: Slash came in with an entirely different concept of what the pinball machine was going to be for Guns N' Roses.

Speaker: He came in as a fan of pinball saying, you know, pinball art is this.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: And get me a great artist and make me pinball art as opposed to the licensor for Led Zeppelin saying, this is Led Zeppelin.

Speaker: Here's flip through the book and find what you like.

Speaker: Exactly.

Speaker: And so I think that that is the difference between I think that's the problem that Stern is now going to have from here on out when it comes to licensors, especially with Gary Stern's remarks on Super Awesome Pinball Show.

Speaker: It's like if we can't mod these things and we're going to be threatened to, you know, whatever it may be, because we're changing it from stock to

Speaker: then people are going to demand better product coming from Stern when it comes to artwork and stuff like that.

Speaker: You're going to have to work a little closer with the line sister because it's obviously can be done because look at slash and Eric with guns and roses.

Speaker: It also depends though on, um,

Speaker: Now, that's not necessarily a good or bad thing.

Speaker: My attitude is if you are contracting with someone who they have created a product, they've created a brand, and depending on how involved or non-involved they want to be, sometimes that makes it better and sometimes that makes it okay, mainly because

Speaker: That's their product.

Speaker: When you have Iron Maiden and you have the classic iconic visual style of Iron Maiden was done in the 80s and it was done by an artist named Derek Riggs, who

Speaker: He wasn't actually a trained artist, but he had a very style that resonated with him.

Speaker: And what Zombie Yeti was able to do in the Derek Riggs style was still consistent with what Iron Maiden was trying to do.

Speaker: Now, with Led Zeppelin, I look at this art package and...

Speaker: I look at it, I don't have a problem with that.

Speaker: I look at the way that Led Zeppelin has crafted their brand.

Speaker: They've always been very jealous of how they want to present themselves.

Speaker: And I don't have a problem with that because the alternative is, okay, so you're just not going to get a machine.

Speaker: If you don't want to do what Led Zeppelin wants to do, then it's their product.

Speaker: So if you're not willing to work with their constraints, then maybe you need to go somewhere else.

Speaker: I think it's worth it.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Like dealing with those issues.

Speaker: I think it's worth it.

Speaker: They're going to sell a ton of these.

Speaker: And some licensors, when they say easier to work with, what that means is that they don't really have much input.

Speaker: They're just going to let you do what you want.

Speaker: Now, okay.

Speaker: That's great.

Speaker: If you have a good idea, but what if your idea sucks?

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And legitimately, right?

Speaker: We're assuming that, oh, well, the person who has the most creative control, they will produce the best product.

Speaker: But how many things has... Well, I'll use Star Wars for an example.

Speaker: Like Star Wars books.

Speaker: I read like a... I saw there was a series of books that were supposed to be done after Return of the Jedi.

Speaker: And I listened to them on audiobook and I thought...

Speaker: yeah, I mean, it's okay.

Speaker: The story was okay, but it wasn't great.

Speaker: And my attitude is they probably just rubber stamped it.

Speaker: It's going to be a book that we're going to put out that's in the Star Wars theme and it'll sell because of that.

Speaker: But maybe if they had more constraints, so they said, no, why don't you push it this way?

Speaker: Why don't you go that way?

Speaker: Sometimes that's a better thing.

Speaker: Having unlimited creative control is the difference between the last three Star Wars movies and The Mandalorian.

Speaker: So you have the Mandalorian who I, uh, what's the guy's name?

Speaker: Uh, the John Favreau.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Favreau.

Speaker: So you have John Favreau who does it, who's amazing at what he does and is, he knows how to do it.

Speaker: And the other three, I think the had, uh, at best they had mixed reviews because they had all the control to do what they wanted.

Speaker: Yeah, but I think it's hard to compare with that one because John has built a repertoire of – he knows what he's doing over decades with Disney.

Speaker: And so it's hard to compare, especially where it's Stern is building a product that is a representation of what the licensor wants –

Speaker: I just I don't know.

Speaker: It's hard to compare, but I get it.

Speaker: Like, I get it.

Speaker: I get what you're trying to put out there.

Speaker: OK, but there is one thing that I don't hear a lot of people talking about, which I think is really impressive, is the lighting system with the integrated side decals, even on the premium.

Speaker: Yeah, very nice.

Speaker: And I think I don't hear a lot of people talking about that.

Speaker: And I look at that and say, that's actually pretty amazing.

Speaker: That's on the level of integrated pin stadium stuff that they were able to integrate into and not an aftermarket.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And you're not going to bang them when you lift the play field up and down.

Speaker: Um, you know, there, you don't have to worry about magnets on and off.

Speaker: Like they are really, really cool.

Speaker: Um, led integrated, like it's a, it's very, very cool.

Speaker: Uh, granted the GNR, um, hot rails are a similar product, but, but I, I, I haven't seen a GNR in person to see them and actually, um,

Speaker: you know, actually dive into what they are.

Speaker: But when I look at these, I think, man, that's pretty darn cool too.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: It feels a little more, uh, thematically consistent though.

Speaker: If you have a seventies band, you're not going to want that blinding over the top light.

Speaker: You're going to get some nuanced lighting and

Speaker: And I, I don't know, this is a personal thing.

Speaker: I bought a truck and so I'm actually looking at upgrading the lights so I can see things.

Speaker: But I went to purchase one of them and said, hey, are you putting this on a straight car?

Speaker: Because they're way too bright.

Speaker: And I wonder at some level, is there a Guns N' Roses has a crazy amount of lights.

Speaker: And I'm sure it's great.

Speaker: And I haven't played one in person, but I'm wondering at some point, is there too much?

Speaker: And this seems to be more of the I would get a lava lamp topper and put it on this machine.

Speaker: Yeah, it fits the theme.

Speaker: It's very cool.

Speaker: I don't know.

Speaker: Overall, I think it's a good machine.

Speaker: I'm honestly, personally, me, I'm glad they came out with Led Zeppelin because I can't handle buying another new in box because I just bought turtles.

Speaker: I've bought Avengers.

Speaker: It's like if they came out with another theme that was geared directly towards me, it just it wouldn't work.

Speaker: And so maybe that's how a lot of people across the board are feeling, because the last two were more geared towards a younger generation, in my opinion, where this would be getting those collectors of the vintage age.

Speaker: Of a certain age.

Speaker: So you're saying I'm a collector of a certain age.

Speaker: I'm a distinguished gentleman.

Speaker: A vintage.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: I'm a vintage collector.

Speaker: All right.

Speaker: So, yeah, I am actually getting this.

Speaker: I'm getting the premium and I'm quite excited about it.

Speaker: So, yeah, I went I went Simpsons earlier in the pandemic here.

Speaker: So I am all tapped out for all purchases for the next couple of years until I can get my children to generate some sort of level of revenue.

Speaker: Or you decide Simpsons is no longer doing it for you.

Speaker: Exactly.

Speaker: You know, Simpsons was my first machine, and I actually don't think that that will leave.

Speaker: I think Spider-Man, I think I've scratched that itch.

Speaker: It's time to sell that on.

Speaker: And I'm actually really glad that I'm able to sell Spider-Man to bring in another Ritchie game because that's my only Ritchie game.

Speaker: When it comes to Steve Ritchie games, when you're talking stern Star Trek at a competitive price on even the pro or premium LE level, you're getting somewhat similar things.

Speaker: What you're missing out on, though, is this Tim Sexton code, which I think looks...

Speaker: totally unique oh yes it's chase the blinking light which is stereotypically a a steve richie you know design but it's it's gone to another level where the lights change based on where you are in the song and combos left to right like i am so excited to play this because i think it is just gonna be a riot

Speaker: Does it does it feel anything like to you guys that this feels like a.

Speaker: I don't want this to sound insulting.

Speaker: I actually think it's a good thing.

Speaker: But kind of that rock band thing where it's making a video game out of all these songs that you know, and it's actually putting it together in a fun way.

Speaker: And that's what Steve and Tim together are doing with these.

Speaker: Because I really like what he did with Black Knight because I felt more like that

Speaker: that video game draw.

Speaker: And I like, it was a different take than the chase, the flashing light.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Kudos to them for sure.

Speaker: I just kudos to Stern.

Speaker: Cause I mean, there are hires in the last two, three years have been so good.

Speaker: Like,

Speaker: You can't argue that they've got a super team going over there between Tim Sexton, Raymond Davidson, Keith Owen.

Speaker: They're picking up so many good, fresh blood that's going into these games, and you can feel it through these games.

Speaker: They are getting...

Speaker: Nice new designs.

Speaker: And that's why I'm not passing judgment on Led Zeppelin yet.

Speaker: It's not for me because it's not my theme, which is, you know, like I've always said, like the theme can be like a pinball machine is kind of like what you're looking for and maybe a spouse or someone else.

Speaker: But the beauty of the machine is the artwork.

Speaker: That's what's going to draw you in.

Speaker: But the personality is the play of the game and the code.

Speaker: And that's what keeps you coming back for more.

Speaker: But yeah, I think, I don't know, that's probably pretty good on Led Zeppelin, don't you think?

Speaker: Yeah, no, sorry.

Speaker: While you were talking, I was looking back and forth at all the close-up pictures of the playfield to see what else I could be missing on that.

Speaker: There's a lot of tight horseshoes in there.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: So...

Speaker: Yeah, no, I will tell.

Speaker: Yeah, it'll be great.

Speaker: But I again, they've been putting out some really good machines.

Speaker: So I'm looking forward to this one.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: So let's talk about David.

Speaker: You have started a pinball podcast with Ron Hallett.

Speaker: Let's let's talk about that.

Speaker: Yeah, so I'm the co-host of Silver Ball Chronicles from the Pinball Network, which is a history of pinball sort of podcast.

Speaker: So rather than a couple of guys talking about Led Zeppelin and the new pins, Ron and I sort of chat about historical figures, machine eras, technologies, those kind of things of the bygone eras of pinball.

Speaker: And if you're looking for a different kind of podcast, Silver Ball Chronicles is that kind of podcast.

Speaker: I totally agree.

Speaker: And the one thing that I appreciate about the podcast that you and Ron have been doing is, can't remember this last episode or the one before, someone had mentioned COVID.

Speaker: You had mentioned COVID and Ron's like, hey, hey, hey, we're trying to keep this timeless now.

Speaker: No time markers of what era this is.

Speaker: We're trying to make it so anyone can listen to this at any time.

Speaker: And I think that's awesome because the problem with pinball podcasts, it is very...

Speaker: news based and so to go back and listen to one from a year ago and like or two years ago like head to head uh you're only gonna kind of see what happened back then it's almost gonna be like a time capsule kind of thing where this is not doing that so yeah and that was not necessarily the goal of of the original show so back at about this time in 2019 um so wait let me let me wind that back

Speaker: Back in around December of 2019, I was thinking, hey, you know, I would, you know, I'm enjoying these podcasts.

Speaker: I chat on stream with Dennis Creasel and a few others.

Speaker: And, you know, I've

Speaker: my opinion I feel is not, you know, any more valid or more important than you guys or the others and adding just another one of me to the, to the mix, even though I am incredibly charming.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: I don't want to just sort of rehash the same news over and over again.

Speaker: Cause, cause guys like, uh, guys like Christian line and Franchi and you guys and Dennis and, and Zach, like they do just such a great job already.

Speaker: I thought if I did a podcast, what would it be?

Speaker: And I remember that Jeff Teolas on Pinball Profile did sometime last year in 2019, I guess now, he did an anniversary show for Tommy the Album where he brought in John Borg and talked about Tommy the Machine.

Speaker: And I thought, wow, that is something that was really kind of interesting and cool.

Speaker: So I went and I listened to some of the older podcasts like Topcast and I was, and I, and I could hear these stories,

Speaker: being weaved throughout pinball history.

Speaker: And I know that seems a bit silly, but Steve Ritchie being the character that he is, he has all of these amazing stories that he's told time and time again.

Speaker: How do I bring those out for new people like myself in the hobby who've only been around for a couple of years?

Speaker: Because I like to learn and I come from a history background, I found it very easy to pull those stories out and then weave them together in a narrative.

Speaker: And that was where I thought, okay, this is different than me talking about the latest pinball machine.

Speaker: And it's great.

Speaker: I, and the chemistry between you and Ron is really great too.

Speaker: Like I get chuckles from one of the episodes you guys were talking and all of a sudden you're like, Oh, it's been 45 minutes.

Speaker: If, if you want to shut it down, we're biweekly.

Speaker: So we are the perfect amount of time to listen to.

Speaker: Now's the time to shut us off and then turn us back on next week to the last 45 minutes.

Speaker: You know, it's just, just great stuff like that.

Speaker: It's,

Speaker: It's making history fun and not making fun of history.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: The interesting thing about Ron, and I'm appreciative of Ron like you would not believe, is he adds this elder statesman dynamic to the podcast where he's done a lot of soldering on a lot of these old machines and he's played a lot of these old machines.

Speaker: And he's been around when some of these stories are told.

Speaker: and maybe given more context than they are when the person who is there tells them.

Speaker: So he adds so much to that podcast, but originally when I sat down and I said to Dennis,

Speaker: in early 2020 when all the sort of podcasters, you know, resigned in one week, I guess, for lack of a better term.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: I reached out to Dennis and I said, Dennis, you know, now that you don't have a podcast, would you want to do this podcast with me?

Speaker: And he's like, well, you know, there's some other plans.

Speaker: I got something going on.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: But, you know, and he goes, why don't you talk to Bruce Nightingale or Ron Hallett?

Speaker: And I thought, well, you know, I've never spoken or met these people.

Speaker: So why are they going to even talk to me?

Speaker: And at the time, I was thinking, okay, Bruce Nightingale would be pretty good because I envisioned the podcast to be a little more silly than it actually has ended up being.

Speaker: And I figured he would be really great to bounce off of.

Speaker: But unfortunately, he was running the Silver Ball Saloon in East Rochester, New York, and he would not have enough time, I don't think.

Speaker: So I was like, well, maybe I'll reach out to Ron.

Speaker: And Ron was like, I don't have to edit.

Speaker: And I'm like, no, no, you don't have to edit.

Speaker: He's like, do I have to, do I have to write down a lot of stuff?

Speaker: And I'm like, no, not really.

Speaker: He's like, oh, I'm in.

Speaker: And I'm like, well, okay.

Speaker: And then I was like, well, I'll show you the show notes.

Speaker: And I reviewed the show notes sort of over Skype with him, sharing my screen.

Speaker: And each episode I've got typed out is like 5,000 point form notes, words, right?

Speaker: And he's like, yeah, this is great.

Speaker: I'm like, so, you know, that'd be great if you'd come aboard.

Speaker: And he's like, oh yeah, no problem.

Speaker: And then like a week goes by and I'm like, ah, you know, I didn't ask him like 100% are you in?

Speaker: And then I reached out and I'm like, yeah, are you like in, in like a hundred percent?

Speaker: He's like, man, I told you like six times I'm in on this.

Speaker: And I was in, I'm in.

Speaker: You just need to do the work.

Speaker: I'm in.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: And I was like, oh my God, I'm doing a podcast with Ron Hallett, right?

Speaker: The slam tilt guy.

Speaker: And it's, he has added so much to it that, you know, he wrangles me in a lot.

Speaker: He tells me sometimes when my jokes are really not funny and I have to cut them out.

Speaker: And there's a lot that I cut out to jokes that I've made.

Speaker: Is it a Canadian thing or is it just jokes in general?

Speaker: Well, we just have this self-deprecating sense of humor, Canadians.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: There's rarely things that are off limits.

Speaker: And for the way the podcast ends up, it does have some silliness and some fun running jokes in it.

Speaker: But again, I had envisioned it to be a little more silly.

Speaker: And Ron has brought that down, and I think he's brought it down to being incredibly good.

Speaker: And I'm super happy to be doing the way I'm doing because I'm able to pay homage to a lot of people who don't normally get their names out there.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: you know, Python Angelo, people know Python Angelo, but they don't know how, you know, how crazy the man actually was.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know, people don't know why the, you know, Gottlieb System 1 games are so bad, except for three of them.

Speaker: So let me tell you the story as to why that happened.

Speaker: And then I'll throw in a couple of, you know, humorous stories in there and hopefully that'll help.

Speaker: So that kind of fun stuff,

Speaker: it naturally comes out with, with us.

Speaker: And I'm so happy to have somebody like Ron with me.

Speaker: Oh, I totally agree.

Speaker: It's, it's awesome.

Speaker: It's a very good, it's a very good show that you got your guys's chemistry together along with the stories make for a great show.

Speaker: And that's, that's all you want to in pinball, right?

Speaker: Like us, us getting all this free content is very demanding of what we receive.

Speaker: And so we're, we're glad that you're able to obtain that bar.

Speaker: A lot of it is just sort of, you know, listening to it.

Speaker: I do a lot of driving for work from time to time and I'm in the car for a couple hours and I'm like, oh, listen to this.

Speaker: And then as I'm going, I'll kind of maybe write down on a piece of paper, a couple of notes here and there, copy and paste some of the, some of the resources that are really good are written resources.

Speaker: Cause then I literally just copy paste things in and then it just sort of naturally happens.

Speaker: It's the editing of the podcast.

Speaker: And I know that's a cliche.

Speaker: So if you're, if you're,

Speaker: on the podcast cliche drinking game, now's the time to drink.

Speaker: The editing is the worst part because there's quotes that we'll say and I'll bumble through a quote or I'll misquote a year or a name and then I'll cut it out.

Speaker: And I have a lot of mannerisms because it's like we're naturally having a conversation here, which is easier.

Speaker: But if I'm like, oh, hey, Ron, why don't you read this quote?

Speaker: I got to cut out, hey, Ron, why don't you read this quote to make it sound like he's just saying it.

Speaker: And that happens like 40 times.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: So it's so weird though, because I don't have any problem with the editing.

Speaker: What about you, Josh?

Speaker: Josh.

Speaker: It's not too bad.

Speaker: One of the things, I don't know if this is something you do, but you can have a pad of paper next to you with a pen and just write down your timestamps as you go through so you know exactly where to edit out.

Speaker: It kind of cuts back on the time process.

Speaker: It's every three minutes.

Speaker: You can be like, most times I just throw them on.

Speaker: You can tell with the 50th episode, there was some editing there, but at one point I totally spaced to edit out.

Speaker: I'm like, am I echoing Scott?

Speaker: And he's like,

Speaker: No, no, I think we're good.

Speaker: I forgot to edit that all out.

Speaker: And so it's like, it sounds like us fumbling before playing a clip.

Speaker: And I was like, eh, like that.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: Can we talk about that day really quick?

Speaker: I'm sorry.

Speaker: I'm going on a tangent for a second.

Speaker: Like that day was, was a sucky day for me.

Speaker: Like I woke up, got to work.

Speaker: My wife texts me.

Speaker: I'm not going to tell you the story that happened, but let's just put it this way.

Speaker: Literal crap hit the fan.

Speaker: Like that's about as good as you're going to get out of this.

Speaker: Oh, come on.

Speaker: Tell the story.

Speaker: I've already discussed it.

Speaker: We're not.

Speaker: I've already discussed it with my wife.

Speaker: We're not.

Speaker: She's forbidden you from talking about it.

Speaker: Out of respect to other people, we're not going to talk about the story.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: All right.

Speaker: All right.

Speaker: All right.

Speaker: All right.

Speaker: And so, uh, and then noon hits and I'm helping clean up a mess that happened that morning.

Speaker: And we get a call from my son's school and he'd slipped in on the ice, hit his head and gave himself a concussion.

Speaker: And, uh,

Speaker: And we're like, crap.

Speaker: So we had to run there and grab him.

Speaker: Oh, I forgot to tell you, between all of this, I didn't receive a call.

Speaker: I called FedEx because we had some issues with shipping with Avengers.

Speaker: And it ended up somewhere skumwampus.

Speaker: And so the dude had got his truck stuck.

Speaker: And he's like, if you want it sooner than this time, you need to come pick it up.

Speaker: It was funky.

Speaker: And so I ended up picking it up with a liftgate truck.

Speaker: And I lowered the lift gate all the way down, got the, got Avengers in the back of the truck.

Speaker: And then the gate wouldn't come back up.

Speaker: And so I'm stuck in the middle of nowhere with a lift gate that I can't get to go back up.

Speaker: And so I had to use a come along and ratchet it up.

Speaker: And any who, that was, that was before the crap hit the fan.

Speaker: And so.

Speaker: Like seriously, by three o'clock in the afternoon, it just – it all just kind of melded together.

Speaker: And so when we started recording episode 50, even Scott was like, are you sure you don't want to put this off for like – Yeah, you were not happy.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You're like, are you sure you want to put this off?

Speaker: And I'm like, no.

Speaker: Like we've been prepping for this for –

Speaker: a week or two now between clips and editing and stuff like that.

Speaker: I just want to, I just want to record like this will be like a good end of the day.

Speaker: And then for some odd reason, my microphone did something super funky, but we didn't realize it till it was all done and said.

Speaker: And I'm like, I'm not going back to record my whole thing that we just said.

Speaker: So that's why, that's why I was like, when I posted it and I said, Hey, like Josh's audio quality is not perfect.

Speaker: That's because I was like, you know, I'm done.

Speaker: That was the cherry on top to the whole day.

Speaker: Yeah, just time to move on.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah, fish or cut bait.

Speaker: And you're like, I cut.

Speaker: I'm done.

Speaker: Yep, I cut bait and called it good.

Speaker: So anywho, sorry, that was my random tangent about episode 50.

Speaker: But back to Silver Ball Chronicles.

Speaker: So...

Speaker: Did it just kind of naturally flow with TPN or is there a specific reason?

Speaker: Is it because like Dennis was like, Hey, you should hit up Ron.

Speaker: Is that why you ended up on TPN or is there?

Speaker: So kind of during that sort of purge at the beginning of 2020, um, I was like, Oh, I'm thinking about starting this, this sort of this podcast.

Speaker: And I ran it by Dennis cause he, he had done editing before he had used, you know, editing software.

Speaker: He, he knew what kind of microphone to get.

Speaker: And I was asking that stuff.

Speaker: And then he just sort of reached out and said, hey, would you like to join TPN?

Speaker: And at that point, I didn't have to learn how to set up a feed or an RSS feed.

Speaker: I didn't have to get a SoundCloud account.

Speaker: I didn't have to do any of that stuff.

Speaker: He's like, yeah, you just send us the podcast.

Speaker: We'll put it up.

Speaker: And then, of course, the natural question then is like, do I have to put a flipping out pinball account

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: You know, stinger on.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Like, you know, can I make jokes about Stern pinball and, you know, the lack of things on the play field and things?

Speaker: And that's when Zach reached out.

Speaker: He goes, man, say whatever you want.

Speaker: You know, I don't care.

Speaker: And I'm like, no, but really?

Speaker: He's like, yeah, like, we're not going to kick you off or whatever.

Speaker: slap you down or anything like that.

Speaker: Do whatever the heck you want.

Speaker: And, you know, they said, do a couple episodes and we'll see how it goes.

Speaker: And we did a couple episodes and we're like, yeah, man, this is great.

Speaker: Keep it up.

Speaker: And they've been incredibly, incredibly supportive

Speaker: beyond my expectations.

Speaker: There's times where Dennis reaches out as my producer seducer, and he'll say things like, you know, this was good, but did you really have to talk this long about this one topic?

Speaker: And I'm like, yeah, that's probably true.

Speaker: Probably didn't have to talk about it.

Speaker: I could have cut that like 30 minutes out, right?

Speaker: Or he's like, hey, why don't you try balancing your mic a little bit better?

Speaker: or Zach will reach out and be like, Hey, you know, when you're doing your show notes, can you include these?

Speaker: They've been beyond incredibly helpful.

Speaker: And all of the podcasters on TPN will, will say that they'll come out and they'll say, Hey, you know, they, everybody here is helping and supporting me and building on what I was doing, which I think is inevitably the goal of that network.

Speaker: Um,

Speaker: And I'm pleased to be a part of it.

Speaker: Now, you know, if I ever left or anything like that, would, you know, would I go to Indiana and leave a flaming bag on Zach's front step?

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: Yes, you would.

Speaker: But, you know, I don't think so.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Like, we're all adults and we're, you know, it's fun.

Speaker: We're all having fun.

Speaker: Well, and I think also the beauty of TPN is it's got its own built in fan base.

Speaker: Like that is one of the hardest things about starting a podcast in pinball.

Speaker: The joke is, is there's what 78 podcasts out there.

Speaker: It's just whatever's your flavor.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: The problem is, is if you don't network and you don't, uh,

Speaker: get yourself out on social media and pin side and stuff like that, it can be a lot of work.

Speaker: And so TPN takes that work and kind of negates it a little bit for you.

Speaker: And that is the beauty of it because, trust me, it is hard to build a fan base.

Speaker: Oh, hands down.

Speaker: You had mentioned at the beginning here that the Twippy voting had started this year.

Speaker: And Ron and I got an email from Jeff Patterson at This Week in Pinball.

Speaker: And, you know, he said, hey, by the way, guys, you just finished just outside of the dropdown for the Twippies this year.

Speaker: I just wanted to give you a heads up.

Speaker: And I thought, man, that is so gracious of Jeff that he would reach out and let us know.

Speaker: Because quite frankly...

Speaker: I didn't think we would even be remotely close to being on the list, let alone just outside the list.

Speaker: I think if I didn't have TPN doing a lot of that promotion and popping up into people's feeds the way we had been, I don't think we would have that exposure to even be remotely close to making it on the top 10 Twippy list in our first year when we haven't even had 12 months in.

Speaker: I think there's a lot of positives to be said there.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: Well, I want to make a case in point.

Speaker: Have either one of you heard of the play better podcast?

Speaker: No, I had never.

Speaker: No, go ahead.

Speaker: No, no, I was thinking about it.

Speaker: Yeah, no, I've, I had never heard of them.

Speaker: until i can't remember if jack danger had posted that he got some swag from them or something like that and it's it's very richie based i mean it's competitive base is what it is but you know they're using the skull from no fear is their logo and stuff like that and it's i would have never had heard of them because i wasn't searching for that if it wasn't for jack danger and so

Speaker: My advice to anyone starting a podcast, first, have a good concept.

Speaker: Do your own thing.

Speaker: And then second, network as much as you can.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: One of the things that's pretty cool on TPN is they have an off-the-record podcast.

Speaker: And a lot of the podcasts that have on there, like Just Another Pinball Podcast with Joel Engelberth and I,

Speaker: and Craig Bobby's TPS, the pinball show midweek, that sort of started off as what they called the off the record one time deal, where anybody with a microphone and some editing software can do an, you know, a one off podcast if you want to, and see how it goes.

Speaker: And if you get a positive response, and people enjoy it, you know,

Speaker: people will send you an email and be like, Hey, you know, I think this is pretty good.

Speaker: Or why don't you talk about this or whatever?

Speaker: And you get that feedback and then maybe you try another off the record, the same thing.

Speaker: And maybe you get a little bit better feedback and then maybe the TPN, you know, folk, myself included,

Speaker: would, you know, say, Hey, this, this is a good, this is great, right?

Speaker: Why don't you, you know, why don't you join as a full-time podcast?

Speaker: Here's kind of a day of the week or, uh, you know, biweekly or fortnightly as it were.

Speaker: And then you could do your own podcast and come into the TPN, you know, network.

Speaker: So if you want to do your own podcast, you can just come on board and do it.

Speaker: And again, there's no commitment required.

Speaker: There's no, you know,

Speaker: necessity to bow to anybody just to do your one-off podcast.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And I say, why not do it recorded on your phone?

Speaker: I mean, there is no risk or, or of losing anything by doing it with loser kid.

Speaker: Like we have to pay for our own hosting through SoundCloud and we have to, you know, there's, there's payments up front that you have to get done before you can even get one episode out.

Speaker: Why not take advantage of what TPN has to offer?

Speaker: If you, even if you've thought about doing a podcast and you have an idea, you know,

Speaker: You might be the next Silver Ball Chronicles.

Speaker: Oh, thank you.

Speaker: That means a lot.

Speaker: So I want to move on to our next subject because it's something that you're heavily involved with, and I think this is going to take up the rest of our time.

Speaker: Let's talk about the Pinball Industry Awards.

Speaker: And this sounds like it's kind of a brainchild of some of those there at TPN.

Speaker: I want you to kind of explain what

Speaker: where the concept came from, kind of who the brainchild of this initiative is and what you hope to gain from it.

Speaker: Yeah, the Pinball Industry Awards, really co-founded by Zach Many and Dennis Kreisel of the Pinball Network, it's really sort of from their gray matter that this has appeared.

Speaker: But I think the idea of a Critics' Choice Award or Critics' Choice-based award

Speaker: judging panel is something that many people have, have talked about.

Speaker: And I'm sure you've had discussions and things like, what if, you know, an expert chose it, or what if pinball podcasters chose the games and, you know, the best music and sound effects like that conversation is not unique.

Speaker: It's not like we, you know, Dennis or myself or any of the members of the, the, the pinball industry awards governing committee, you know, came up with anything kind of on our own in a,

Speaker: What we were able to do is we've got somebody like Zach, who's a bit of a hype man.

Speaker: And, you know, he's, he's able to push people to sort of say, Hey, let's do it.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Let's like, let's actually get off the couch and do something.

Speaker: And that's where we said, okay, well, what would it look like?

Speaker: I remember I had a discussion, I want to say March, maybe February of 2020, and I sent Zach a message and I'm like, what if TPN had its own awards, right?

Speaker: Like what if TPN had its own awards?

Speaker: He's like, well, that's not going to work because, you know, we can't just give out awards.

Speaker: That's silly.

Speaker: And then he said, Dennis and I are talking about something.

Speaker: We'll let you know.

Speaker: So it rolls forward till about November.

Speaker: And he's like, hey, here's what we want to do is we don't want to have just TPN voting.

Speaker: We want to open it up to all pinball media as judges.

Speaker: And what does that look like?

Speaker: And then that's when we build a committee.

Speaker: And on the committee, it's myself, Dennis Creasel, Zach Minney.

Speaker: There's Jesse Jay from Jesse Jay's Pinball Podcast from Australia.

Speaker: There's Josh Jacobs who does Silver Ball Stories.

Speaker: And George Fisher, who does Don't Panic Flip.

Speaker: So we kind of created a core group and we said, okay, well, if we created these awards and here's our high level goal, how do we manage that?

Speaker: And that's when we start, that's when sort of the, you know, the real work started.

Speaker: And it sounds like it's been quite in-depth.

Speaker: The one thing I do appreciate that you guys are doing about this too is it's not drawn out over months.

Speaker: Like you're starting today, which is January 1st, and it ends on the 26th, correct?

Speaker: Yeah, so we wanted to do it.

Speaker: There was some discussion as to when in the year to do it and should we do an awards ceremony.

Speaker: Inevitably, and I'll leave that to sort of Zach to sort of,

Speaker: maybe describe what his inevitable vision will be

Speaker: But, you know, we didn't want to really piggyback off of an event.

Speaker: We wanted to have our own sort of destination event.

Speaker: This year, of course, it's online, so that sort of solves itself.

Speaker: But we wanted it to be in January.

Speaker: We didn't want to conflict with the Twippies that happened in March.

Speaker: We didn't, you know, we didn't want to do anything the same as that.

Speaker: So we set out to be as totally different from any other awards ceremony as we could in pinball.

Speaker: And, you know,

Speaker: The idea was really that we didn't want to do a popular vote.

Speaker: We wanted to do a critics choice vote.

Speaker: So we had to come up with a way to choose judges.

Speaker: And those judges, you know, we had to vet them.

Speaker: And then, of course, then you get into, okay, well, how do we vet people?

Speaker: And how do we prevent people from gaming the system?

Speaker: And what are the rules and the criteria around who qualifies, right?

Speaker: Like all of a sudden you create this big frigging bureaucracy, right?

Speaker: And so we were able to sort of get that in the can and get that solved.

Speaker: And that's over at the pinballindustryawards.com.

Speaker: So the pinballindustryawards.com.

Speaker: And all of that documentation as to who qualifies as a judge in what we call pinball hobbyist media, which is people like yourselves, all that information is there and you could apply.

Speaker: So if you wanted to be, if you were a podcaster, for example, and you wanted to be a judge to vote for best art, best code, best machine, game of the year, that kind of stuff, you can apply to do that.

Speaker: So then you apply, there's a form.

Speaker: And then, of course, the committee members have to look at it and say, well, this person counts, or this one doesn't, or this person is this.

Speaker: So that was the major goal.

Speaker: And then we wanted to get it sort of done and in the can by January.

Speaker: So we wanted it to be short voting times, short application times, get it done.

Speaker: We didn't want to drag it out and then have an event, you know, in October of next year.

Speaker: Yeah, I get you.

Speaker: So, David, with you brought this up, this isn't really intended to be a competition with TWIP.

Speaker: And I just want to make sure that people know that that certainly is out there.

Speaker: We support this week in pinball and support what Jeff is doing.

Speaker: So this is just a, I guess, a different take on looking at it, just like a different podcast or something like that.

Speaker: We're just trying to look at it and say, OK, what would a podcast

Speaker: I guess an interested group, um, almost like, uh, okay, this is the view.

Speaker: This is the pinball version of the view, right?

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And, and then exactly that's it.

Speaker: So if you're pinball hobbyist media, so if you're a podcaster, if you're a streamer, if you're a pinball writer, uh, if you're, you know, involved in some way that's sort of beyond being just anybody with an email address, uh,

Speaker: you know, video content creator, you have a different critical eye.

Speaker: And we wanted to make sure that this sort of hobbyist media was able to make the choice.

Speaker: Now, in the end, we'll see at the end of January on January 28th at 8 p.m.

Speaker: Central,

Speaker: You will be able to figure out, okay, did this experiment actually work with the pinball industry awards?

Speaker: And, you know, that will be, will these critics awards be different than the Twippies in March, right, that are chosen by popular vote with anybody with an email address?

Speaker: And we're excited to offer a different piece.

Speaker: But again, we're not competing.

Speaker: I have a silver ball swag store for silver ball Chronicles, which is co-owned by Jeff Patterson, right?

Speaker: I'm,

Speaker: big supporter of twip i give to the monthly on their patreon so you know i am in this for the hobby to add a little bit something extra because you know do we need another award show i don't know probably but do we need another youtube channel or another podcaster like it's free fun content right and yeah i'm stuck at home in a pandemic right i can write some verbiage for a website like come on

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: I guess that's I've always said this, that this is another way of bringing more chairs to the table, just a different perspective.

Speaker: And everything kind of adds synergistically to all the things that we have going on.

Speaker: So I like that it's it's basically a different take as opposed to.

Speaker: Well, Pinside, there's a lot of great content and great things on there, and we all use that.

Speaker: But we tend to realize that in many threads, there are some vocal people who try to drive the conversation, and it drives things away from a consensus view.

Speaker: And so this may be a way for people who are

Speaker: active involved in the pinball industry to have some sort of discussion and consensus to say, well, this is what we feel is the best in this category.

Speaker: And I think it's, uh, it certainly gives a different perspective and I like that.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: It's, it's just a fun, it's sort of a fun way to do it.

Speaker: We also, um, have some interesting takes on things like art and things that make us a little bit different when it comes to, to cabinet play field, um,

Speaker: that kind of stuff.

Speaker: So there's a, there's a bunch of things.

Speaker: And I think people in the end will be very excited with the way things turn out.

Speaker: It's going to be a lot of fun.

Speaker: And in addition, so what we've done, you know,

Speaker: One thing that is with, you know, Pinside and awards and things like that is they are highly, highly competitive.

Speaker: And that creates a lot of rifts within the pinball hobby.

Speaker: And we wanted to be able to recognize, um, outside of, you know, machine of the year and art and the industry folk, we wanted to recognize some levels of excellence amongst streaming and podcasting and photography and videography, um,

Speaker: that was not based on a popular vote because there's already the twippies and they do a much better job of managing that.

Speaker: They do a much better job of doing, you know, a competitive popular vote.

Speaker: We wanted to do something very different, but we wanted to avoid a lot of conflict and hurt feelings and anger.

Speaker: And some people, for some reason, just really want that, so they go to Pinside and they'll post on things.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: It really makes you wonder what their spouses deal with on a day like this.

Speaker: Wow.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know what I mean?

Speaker: Like you are the happiest person I've ever seen on the Internet.

Speaker: What is your real life like?

Speaker: You know what I mean?

Speaker: Maybe their spouses drive that kind of attitude.

Speaker: You never know.

Speaker: Birds of a feather.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: One thing I want to point out, though, because you are talking about the one thing I've noticed with the Twippies in the past.

Speaker: Honestly, this is just my perception.

Speaker: There hasn't been much drama when it comes to the categories that have to do with pinball machines like artwork.

Speaker: And yeah, some people like, yeah, this probably deserved it more than the other where the drama comes from.

Speaker: is, is this category of streaming, podcasting, you know, photography, um, well, you know, YouTube, yada, yada, yada.

Speaker: And so why did you guys decide to go with that can of worms when you could just focus solely on pinball machines?

Speaker: Yeah, there was, there was a lot, there is a lot of discussion among this, the central governing committee, um,

Speaker: And we wanted to be able to say, you know, there's some serious people out there that are doing amazing things in streaming.

Speaker: You know, Jack Danger, George Fisher at Don't Panic Flip, Manu at Mystery Science Pinball 3000, Carl D'Angelo at IE Pinball.

Speaker: There's a lot of content providers out there.

Speaker: And we wanted to be able to recognize them in a way.

Speaker: And it was really our goal to do that in a, as drama free way as possible.

Speaker: And I think that in some ways that is in its, in itself sort of created a bit of an issue.

Speaker: And Dennis Creasel had mentioned this, um, on the special podcast about the pinball industry awards and

Speaker: And this is highly experimental.

Speaker: So in addition to the Pinball Industry Awards voted on by the pinball hobbyist media that all applied for their judges, we created a secondary category called the Excellence Awards.

Speaker: And that's excellence in streaming, podcasting, photography, and videography.

Speaker: And what we wanted to do was

Speaker: was rather than bring in those judges, um, from the, the judging pool that we have through application, we wanted to have that as a smaller, more closed group.

Speaker: And we would have a, uh, online video chat discussion, um, argument, um, you know, defense and nomination process.

Speaker: And what we would do is we would take that information and, um,

Speaker: you know, put it on the website as to who was nominated and who went through.

Speaker: The main goal was that we didn't want to have a winner, right?

Speaker: We didn't want to say, hey, here's 10 people.

Speaker: Hey, group, pick a winner.

Speaker: And everybody else is a loser.

Speaker: You know, we didn't want to do that.

Speaker: We wanted to have a recipient and we wanted it to have, whoa, sorry there, Google.

Speaker: Oh, wow.

Speaker: Where was she three months ago to help out?

Speaker: We wanted to have that recipient, and we wanted to have a closed judging pool.

Speaker: The problem is if we start bringing in a bunch of people as judges, they all have agendas and people they don't like.

Speaker: There's no secret that Zach Manning has problems with some people in the industry.

Speaker: You don't say.

Speaker: No.

Speaker: Really?

Speaker: But Zach is only one-twelfth of the people that were in our meetings.

Speaker: You know what I mean?

Speaker: There were 12 people in our Excellence Awards meeting.

Speaker: Many of the names you will recognize, and all of those names will be published after the event.

Speaker: All of the information will be published after the event.

Speaker: But just because Zach Manning has an issue with somebody doesn't mean that that person is not nominated.

Speaker: And it doesn't mean that the positives and the negatives of that person are nominated.

Speaker: So I think he takes a lot of heat when he doesn't actually need to take a lot of heat and a lot of people crap on that.

Speaker: But what we did is we created the Pinball Industry Awards Excellence Awards Subcommittee.

Speaker: God, we're so good at creating bureaucracies here.

Speaker: Seriously.

Speaker: And what we did is instead of a popular vote runoff, what we did is we had all of anybody at TPN who wanted to come aboard of this, you know, this judging category, this panel.

Speaker: they could nominate somebody and then defend their nomination to the group.

Speaker: They would say, hey, I want to have X person should receive a Pinball Excellence Awards in streaming.

Speaker: And then they would defend that person.

Speaker: And, you know, there were pros and cons and this person and that person.

Speaker: And then the next person would have a couple of minutes to nominate somebody.

Speaker: And we went through a whole list of nominations.

Speaker: And then at the end is the hard job where we say, do we have a consensus as to who we think rose above all of the other excellence category nominees?

Speaker: And, um,

Speaker: In some cases, it was very clear.

Speaker: We were like, yes, all the other people obviously have displayed some pinball excellence, but this one individual should be included.

Speaker: And of course, there may also be categories where there are multiple recipients of an excellence category award.

Speaker: Because quite frankly, we couldn't just say this person was better than this person.

Speaker: There were no winners, right?

Speaker: We wanted recipients.

Speaker: I think what that has done, though, is it's opened up some critiques to say, you know, we're trying to give TPN awards, right?

Speaker: We can't beat Kaneda on our own merits for a Twippy.

Speaker: So what we're going to do is we're going to create our own award show so we can give ourselves our own award.

Speaker: Well, I mean, come on.

Speaker: That's going to be a lot of fun going online the day after this and me giving Silver Ball Chronicles an award.

Speaker: you pull up the podcast category.

Speaker: It's, you know, Jesse J and silver ball and the pinball show and final round.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: Like, come on.

Speaker: The other issue is,

Speaker: that TPN by happenstance happens to have a lot of really good content providers.

Speaker: So then, then the conversation in our meeting sort of, you know, do we exclude those people?

Speaker: Do we, you know, we can't give ourselves awards or should we, or how would we like, come on guys, we do as much work as everybody else.

Speaker: Maybe we should recognize ourselves.

Speaker: So because it is highly experimental, there will be changes in,

Speaker: you know, going forward as to how that sort of has run, but our heart was in the right place.

Speaker: I think inevitably the, the outcome, you know, people will be, will be happy and people will have fun.

Speaker: But, you know, the idea was that we wanted to give excellence awards to people, not have a bunch of popular votes and,

Speaker: You know, we didn't want, you know, Scott to pick up, you know, his phone and call one of the judges on this committee and be like, hey, you know, you should you should give me an award because, you know, I'll give you some free anesthesiologist advice.

Speaker: Yeah, that'd be great.

Speaker: Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So our hearts were in the right place.

Speaker: Right.

Speaker: So inevitably, I think it's going to be people are going to be very surprised.

Speaker: It's going to be really professional.

Speaker: We're going to h ave a lot of fun.

Speaker: Really.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: I think it's something new.

Speaker: I think it's something fresh.

Speaker: I can see the direction that's different from with TWIP than this.

Speaker: And so I really think it's a good, it's a good thing to be doing in the hobby itself.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: The third piece to this is that we wanted to have some public engagement.

Speaker: So we didn't want to, you know, be elitist, right?

Speaker: Where only a person with a pinball podcast that's done seven podcasts in the last 12 months can vote.

Speaker: You know what I mean?

Speaker: We wanted to open that up a little bit more.

Speaker: And the excellence categories that is run by the closed TPN committee, you know, that sort of made that even smaller.

Speaker: So we wanted to create another thing.

Speaker: And this is all on Zach Minney.

Speaker: He wanted to have a pinball machine hall of fame.

Speaker: And instead of voting for the people that made the machines or the designer who gets all the glory and or the head programmer that gets all the glory, but there's 40 people at Stern working on a single machine now.

Speaker: How do we give the machine itself an award and everybody who was involved in that gets to celebrate it?

Speaker: So we chose, if you go to thepinballawards.com and you scroll down, you can choose on the Hall of Fame or click on the top of the page, I guess.

Speaker: And we're choosing machines from different eras.

Speaker: So electromechanical is a write-in because there are so many of those.

Speaker: I didn't want to create lists.

Speaker: So, so Jesse J Martin, Martin Robbins did an amazing job collating these lists together.

Speaker: There's 70s, Solace State, 80s, 90s, 2000s, and 2010.

Speaker: So you go in, you click vote now, and you can choose your favorite machine from

Speaker: from those categories and they, the machines will get a nod at the pinball industry awards ceremony on January the 28th at 8 PM central.

Speaker: Awesome.

Speaker: I'm looking forward to it.

Speaker: I'm excited.

Speaker: Jump into the 2010s.

Speaker: Please choose Tron.

Speaker: I want to make sure that I keep my game's value up.

Speaker: So that is the only lobbying and underhandedness that we're trying to do here at the Pinball Industry Awards is to make sure that Dave can keep his Tron's sale value up.

Speaker: Yeah, sounds good.

Speaker: I agree.

Speaker: You're going with the slam tilts approach.

Speaker: I respect that.

Speaker: Yeah, you're trying to drive it up.

Speaker: Let's talk about Stern Classics, Solid State Stern Classics.

Speaker: Yes, exactly.

Speaker: I did vote for a Stern Solid State Classic, though.

Speaker: The official pinball machine of the Slam Tilt podcast is the one that I choose.

Speaker: I chose.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You chose Gammatron?

Speaker: No, that's not the official one.

Speaker: I also voted for Simpsons Pinball Party in the 2000s category because I own that machine.

Speaker: I want to keep its value up.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: All right.

Speaker: So you're basically just voting for everything you own.

Speaker: So basically what you're saying is everything you're saying is completely unreliable and biased and you should start a flame war on Pinside.

Speaker: And that's exactly why we didn't want to have that type of award for game of the year as well as we tried to make the excellence awards close.

Speaker: Oh, there you go.

Speaker: Well, David, this we're, we're getting close to wrapping up.

Speaker: We really appreciate you coming on, doing some clarity with this pinball award stuff.

Speaker: Cause I know, you know, everyone's curious and there are stuff that usually flies within the first day or two about, you know, like you said, the people saying that certain people can't win awards.

Speaker: And so you got to make your own.

Speaker: But, uh, I truly firmly believe if you feel like there's something wrong in the industry, you should try to fix it or see if there's a way that you can help that issue.

Speaker: Like Stern Pinball, Stern Playfields.

Speaker: If you're worried about their quality, I would recommend maybe starting up a playfield company and making them better and trying to sell your product to Stern because let's all agree that Merico has had their chance.

Speaker: Yeah, if you have issues with the way Jersey Jack makes their GNR playfields and they're chipping and pooling and you're angry about that, go ahead and cancel your CE order.

Speaker: Yes, exactly.

Speaker: Like it, I'm just going to reference to vote with your money.

Speaker: Is that what you're saying?

Speaker: With your money, right?

Speaker: Like, yeah.

Speaker: So everyone else can jump on that CE.

Speaker: No, because everybody will, will get rid of those.

Speaker: Cause there's all these issues.

Speaker: If there's a problem, there's a problem.

Speaker: If not, we're all ignoring it.

Speaker: It's the worst.

Speaker: Exactly.

Speaker: You got anything else for Scott?

Speaker: You know, I'm just looking forward to a new year.

Speaker: I'm looking forward to being able to get people vaccinated.

Speaker: I'm looking forward to people's businesses going back to normal.

Speaker: I'm looking forward to being able to interact with friends that I feel like for the last year I have really been isolated from.

Speaker: I'm looking forward to people getting their businesses back online.

Speaker: I'm looking forward to people

Speaker: finding hope and not being afraid anymore.

Speaker: And so that's really what I'm looking forward to in the new year.

Speaker: And I hope that everybody who's been drastically affected by COVID, either emotionally, either financially, or I know people have lost loved ones, that we can all try to look forward to a better year and be able to bring more hope this year.

Speaker: And so that's what I'm looking forward to.

Speaker: Yeah, I was actually planning on going to the Pintastic show, which I hear in New England is fantastic.

Speaker: You know, well-run, professional, really great.

Speaker: And I was going to meet Ron for the first time and likely Bruce.

Speaker: We were going to have probably a pint or something like that and hang out.

Speaker: And then that all went out the window.

Speaker: So I'm looking forward in 2021 to seeing the people that

Speaker: getting out there.

Speaker: Hopefully we'll all be vaccinated in Canada by September.

Speaker: And I'll be out there licking flipper buttons at a show soon.

Speaker: Yikes.

Speaker: Got to test this vaccination out.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: Oh my goodness.

Speaker: Well, if you want to check out, if they want to reach out to you in the Silver Bar Chronicles, Dave, how do they do that?

Speaker: Yeah, so you can reach us on Facebook at facebook.com slash Silver Ball Chronicles.

Speaker: You can also email us, Ron and myself, check the email quite regularly, silverballchronicles at gmail.com.

Speaker: And we'd love to hear from you.

Speaker: We really like engaging with people, which...

Speaker: is a byproduct of doing the podcast that I'm, I get to chat and have these silly and awesome conversations with like Australians.

Speaker: Like, come on.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: When did I ever think I would be chatting with like a guy named Rarden who has a, you know, an El Camino.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: You know what I mean?

Speaker: Like that's pretty awesome.

Speaker: Or two random dudes from Utah.

Speaker: So yeah.

Speaker: Or two, two random dudes from Utah and their five wives yelling in the background.

Speaker: Exactly.

Speaker: All of them.

Speaker: That was a Mormon joke.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: No, we got it.

Speaker: I got to say, I really appreciate you sending that clip.

Speaker: It was fantastic.

Speaker: I think it's the one that got me laughing the most out of them all.

Speaker: I was a bit stiff in my delivery, actually.

Speaker: After listening to some of the awesome ones that people did, I was like, I really tried to play it like straight face deadpan, and I probably should have.

Speaker: been more a little more natural but i really did enjoy your 50th episode uh mark silk cracking me up

Speaker: Oh, yeah, no, Mark's great.

Speaker: And the funny thing is, I talk to Mark pretty regularly in the background on things, and the guy just sounds like a fun guy.

Speaker: I just wish that I lived closer to him because I would totally be hanging out at Mark's house, hanging out with his dog and playing his his his home pin version of Star Wars all the time, because it just sounds like such a great event just going over to his house.

Speaker: Absolutely.

Speaker: And thank you so much for having me on guys.

Speaker: It really means a lot to, uh, to sit down with, uh, with you guys, because I know Keith Elwin probably couldn't make it this, this week.

Speaker: So it's nice that I was your backup.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: Well, I got it.

Speaker: Oh, go ahead, Josh.

Speaker: Well, I got one question before we go and then I'll do our little send off thing, but, um,

Speaker: One of my favorite bands in high school was... Okay, do not bring up Aquabats again.

Speaker: Oh my gosh.

Speaker: No, no, sir.

Speaker: They're from California, but Sum 41 is from Canada.

Speaker: I didn't know if you were into them or if you guys even know who they are up there.

Speaker: I have a really funny Sum 41 story.

Speaker: So in university, the way that I survived buying my beer money was that I was in cell phone sales.

Speaker: I was in cell phone sales.

Speaker: And I'm from a sort of rural Canadian community.

Speaker: I live in a city.

Speaker: It's a very metropolitan city, but it's a very urban city.

Speaker: It's very trendy, but at the same time, it's very small, especially by American standards.

Speaker: And all of a sudden these guys come in, three individuals, and they all have sleeves in their tattoos and sort of dark hair and clearly not from my hometown.

Speaker: Okay.

Speaker: And I was like, wow, these people are different.

Speaker: Yeah.

Speaker: And they had to buy a cell phone charger or something.

Speaker: They're in our small, you know, rural Canadian mall.

Speaker: And they bought a cell phone charger and they were on their way.

Speaker: Two minutes later, somebody comes from one of the other stores and says, oh my God, did you know who that was?

Speaker: And I'm like, no, not at all.

Speaker: And they're like, that's Sum 41.

Speaker: And I'm like, huh, how about that?

Speaker: And that is my Sum 41 story.

Speaker: That's awesome.

Speaker: You can recognize them because they're freaking short.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: Like I met them and I'm like, is this just typical for Canadians or did they just build them small in their town?

Speaker: Like, why are they so small?

Speaker: Canadians are small.

Speaker: They're like five, two is the average height of a Canadian.

Speaker: Yes.

Speaker: We don't have the, we don't have the hormone milk like you folk down there.

Speaker: I guess.

Speaker: So yeah.

Speaker: But thank you for coming on, David.

Speaker: And if you want to get a hold of us, we are Lose a Kid Pinball Podcast.

Speaker: You can find us at Loserkidpinballpodcast at gmail.com.

Speaker: Send us your email there.

Speaker: Contact us on Facebook at Loserkidpinball, Instagram, Twitter.

Speaker: We have not started an OnlyFans.

Speaker: I know a lot of people have been clamoring for Scott to open up the OnlyFans.

Speaker: But he's denying the ladies out there.

Speaker: I apologize.

Speaker: Oh my.

Speaker: Hey, I only celebrate with one lady.

Speaker: You know, my five wives.

Speaker: It just depends what day.

Speaker: They're all the same wives, though.

Speaker: Thanks again for coming on.

Speaker: Shut up and sit down.