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00:00:01
Ranking Sacred Stones Characters and Reacting to the Community Tier List!
212 Plays9 months ago
Over the last month I've been polling the community tab on how good each Sacred Stones character is! We react to each community ranking and give our own thoughts on each unit.
Akira Sou - Akira Sou - YouTube
Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/ActualLizard
Discord: https://discord.gg/PuSNGxEF
Twitter: https://x.com/ActualLizard
Music: Jehanna Vibes - D3ejus
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Transcript
Introduction & Community Polls
00:00:04
Speaker
Hello everyone and welcome to the third episode of Sacred Stoners, and we're finally going to talk about the namesake of this podcast. I don't think we've talked about Sacred Stones yet. Over the last month or two, I've run some community polls on my YouTube account ah in the community tab, ranking each Sacred Stones unit. Now that it finished, ah we're going to go through them, talk about where you guys place them and what we think about these units. ah Just for reference, when I asked people to tier, I gave no criteria. I gave four tiers, so there's really good, pretty good, just okay, and not so good. And I asked people to rate units based on their best route. ah So people rated based on a variety of play styles. So I'm personally going to be trying to talk about units ah from a variety of play styles and not just an efficiency perspective, because I feel like it would be kind of a dick move to be like, you guys can rate on anything, but I'm going to talk about efficiency and dunk on you. ah So I'm not going to do that.
00:01:03
Speaker
But with us today, I have Sequitor as always.
Guest Introductions & Unit Performance Discussion
00:01:07
Speaker
Hi. And we also have Akiraso of YouTube fame. Hi, I'm Akara Soh. I run a small YouTube channel where I mostly stream fan and fan games and make videos to try and draw more attention to them, with rare other analytical FE videos. FE8 holds a special place among the fan and games in my heart. I started my channel with an LTC of an FE8 rebalance and later streamed an Iron Man of FE8 where all playable units have zero speed base and growth.
00:01:37
Speaker
Liz and I have even discussed FE8 before on YouTube when we discussed changes that we'd make to the FE8, promotion bonuses. So yeah, I guess let's just get right into it. One thing I wanted to call out at the beginning was just some general comments about FE8 that I saw throughout all of the characters, which was that that I just wanted to touch on, which were that doubling in FE8 is trivial and supports Generally, I think doubling in FE8 is like slightly harder than people think it is. Like not that much harder, but a little bit harder. There are actually some bosses that you can fail to double and Rangers have speed. Rangers have speed and also like fighters slash brigands actually tend to have speed. Yeah, like they're not going to double you, but some of your less fast units won't double them. The game also i like has thresholds. i don't
00:02:33
Speaker
I don't know if FE7 has any thresholds, like at all. moed as some Mostly the bosses, it's for that one, yeah. The last map has some stuff because the enemy's there of hands, but like 90% of enemies in FE7 can be doubled, including the Merms, which is like, okay, that's a choice. Yeah, like the only fast generic I can think of off the top of my head is the Valkyries. Yeah. And then supports in general, I also wanted to touch on. I just don't really get supports when I play sacred stones. Even when I play slow, I don't tend to unlock a lot, ah which is why I am not going to talk about that much here, because I just don't usually get them. Yeah, I don't usually get them either. I get supports when I grind them in the Tower of Olney, but like I'm not sure that's really. Yeah, actually you know, but OK, that's enough preamble
00:03:25
Speaker
The first character we had was Erika, who was placed in Just Okay.
Erika & Seth: Ranking Analysis
00:03:30
Speaker
And some of the things called out in the comments were that she promotes late and gets Seagland and a horse, which makes her good for one-rounding monsters, and that she can be okay in the early game due to axes and a lot of enemies having them. I'll start with my thoughts on her, I guess. I could see bottom of Just Okay. I would, I maybe would have gone not so good. Yeah, I think I would have gone top of not so like towards the upper end of not so good. I do agree she can be okay in the early game due to axes, but she's not even that good against the axes. She's not guaranteed to double the brigands in chapter two. They have to roll down on speed. She can kill monsters in the late game, but so can everybody else.
00:04:17
Speaker
It's a seven move horse. Yeah, me when I look, it's not even, it's not even Ellywood moments of promoting to an unpromoted Cavalier because he's still swordlocked. That's true. She doesn't even get javelin. Like I was playing FE seven recently and javelin. Ellywood is like a thing. It's not good, but it's a thing. Erica doesn't even get that. Um, but I still probably would have put her in like just okay. Cause like if you give her some of the early game exp, she is like, Essentially a decent axe killer, which is like something, but it's it's pretty low. It's it's not a niche that really needs failed in that game. So yeah, I'm fine with just OK. Like I said, I think top of not so good is where I would have gone, but and I think the comments are basically correct. You can one round monsters. You can kill some axe dudes. She's not the best at it, but she could do it. I like to use her, but like I don't. That's about it. She's never really a powerhouse.
00:05:14
Speaker
Oh yeah, I mean, she's my favorite character in the series, so I love using her, but... Yeah, but like, I won have i wouldn't put her high. Alright, next up is one I think we will find very little disagreement on. Seth. And that's Seth. He was voted into really good with 90% of the vote. Yeah, I mean, thank God. If he'd been ranked anywhere else, I feel like a lot of this would be dedicated to us talking about Seth. Yeah. Which I desperately don't want to do. The only and even some of the the low votes just to maybe explain some of them. I know some of the people said in the comments that they voted him low because they felt he had a bad effect on game design, which is like maybe fair, but not really what we're ranking here. Yeah. Yeah. Seth is just the best answer for the entire game to most problems that don't require a staffing or flying. Yeah.
00:06:11
Speaker
pretty much. And like he can be a big part of the solution to problems that do require staffing or flying because he can be staffed to go places and he can be flying rescue dropped places as well. Yeah, I feel like maybe some people the first time they play sacred stones kind of expect him to fall off Because you know, he's a jagan that's in theory what they're supposed to do But he just keeps killing stuff the whole game His only real flaw is he can get a little unlucky on speed on average his speed is fine But it's like kind of just fine. So if you get a little unlucky, he might need a speed wing but
00:06:49
Speaker
I like to give him the speed wing if he needs it because then he just, he doubles and kills everything for the whole game. Well, it's also like, who's really like claiming the speed wing otherwise? I mean, like, I mean, there are people who also who otherwise want it, but like, do they have a better claim than Seth? And I don't really think most of them do the one unit that could make a case for it. would be Ephraim Kormag. Yeah, that makes sense. I could see that, yeah. Whereas there are there are other units that want it, but I agree, don't make as good of a case. Like, Uso wants a speed wing, but... Because I was thinking, like, Erika Garak would like the speed wing, but... He was who I was thinking of, yeah. Yeah.
00:07:33
Speaker
And sometimes he can get it because like I said, Seth doesn't always need the speed wing. Yeah, exactly. Just sometimes it's like his one flaw, he can get a little unlucky and then he's not fast enough to like double fast gargoyles or something. And oh no, he can't run around the faster gargoyles. What terrible unit. It's crazy. I mean, everyone else can do that. All right. ah So general agreement on this one then. Oh, yeah.
Franz & Gilliam: Strengths and Debates
00:08:01
Speaker
Yeah, next one's another one I agree with the commenters on. We haven't gotten into too much disagreement yet, which is Frans in pretty good with 59% of the vote putting him in that category. ah Commenters noted that he was
00:08:16
Speaker
ah One of the stronger early game units, people seem to say third best early game unit, but that there is an opportunity cost to trading him because there's a lot of early games that early game units don't want EXP. ah Some disagreements on whether he's better or worse than the other calves and and by how much. This was also our first Ceph 2 unit. I made a note anytime a unit got called Ceph 2. So Franz is Ceph 2. No, Franz is Seth 2-1. There we go. Yes. ah I would describe Franz as like Seth 0.5 maybe, but that's about it. I will say I've never actually used Franz though, so I mean I'm not the best reference. You've never used Franz, really? No, I don't know why. I just never had any interest. Fair enough, I guess. Yeah. yeah
00:09:06
Speaker
I'm gonna i'm goingnna be a little nice to Frans here though. I don't think Frans is Seth too, but I think third best early game unit is actually under Saligat. I would say second best early game unit. Who do, um like when they say third best early game unit, who are the people they put ahead? I'm assuming it's Seth and Vanessa. Yeah, that's who I would figure too. Yeah, that makes sense. Which Vanessa is better than him, but I don't think in the early game. oh Okay. When I hear like best early game unit, I assume like, um, like best units out of the early game in general, not best units in the early game. Oh, that's fair. Oh, so did you, so sec, did you maybe think, um, like Vanessa and alter slash molder? one Oh, no, I think, um, I think I was thinking Vanessa then Franz, but I was thinking harder could be that third spot also gotcha. Yeah. yeah
00:09:57
Speaker
and I don't think that would be crazy. I think you could make an argument. Oh, I think you could definitely make an argument for it. Yeah. While I was wondering what people were saying. But yeah, I think in the early game, this is your second best unit. He's got a good move. He's not like bulky, but he's not squishy. Yeah, he feel like a hitter like. He'll die in like three hits instead of two, because like if it gets hit by like two axes, she's dead. Yeah, his speed is good. He gets a couple of levels and he starts doubling things. He can switch for weapon triangle advantage. So he's got swords in the early game where it's all axes and you get to like chapter five where you start seeing or chapter six, I think is where you start seeing more lances um and then you can switch to a lance to and that's fine. Yeah. ah So really good in the early game, I think.
00:10:48
Speaker
We're going to talk about this a bit more when we get into the other horses, but I think Franz feels better than the other horses in like a casual play through because his offense is better. Mm hmm. Well, yeah, um I mean, that makes sense, right? Because he ends up being faster than Kyle would be and often stronger than. Yeah. Stronger and tankier than Ford would be. Right. I also think he has I think he has like the training arc, too. where it's like a lot of people get him like from like he's like start to level one right so they like use them for most of the game and have like this not training unit obviously but they see the growth in that unit and I think people like that um whereas like the two other Cavs they obviously get a lot of levels but they don't feel like they've been with you for as long as they get most of theirs in 5x
00:11:38
Speaker
Yeah, well, and I think the more challenging combat you want your cav to do, the better Franz feels. And I feel like the more you kind of like optimize for speed, the more you just throw Seth at things. But like, if you want to use a unit other than Seth for these things, Franz is faster than Kyle by a notable amount if you're using them for more than bare minimum combat. Yeah. So, yeah, I agree. Pretty good. Yeah, i would I would put him there. Yeah, I don't. Oh, I do also did also want to make a quick note, even if you don't train him, he still makes good contributions in the early game because he's true for Vanessa. Yeah, Vanessa needs help killing things early. Yeah. hold um And he could maybe be paladin three to if you train him a little bit. And but you don't want to give all of the XP to other units. He could maybe take that second night's crest.
00:12:26
Speaker
Yeah, I wouldn't argue with that. Next up is Gilliam. Gilliam went into just okay with 52% of the vote. This is the first one I really disagree with. I was surprised by this. I would have put Gilliam in not so good. I don't like this unit. I would say the comments generally felt pretty negative on him, pointed out that he's got pretty low defense. A lot of the tone was like, I guess he can become a great knight, but It's not that good. And I do it. So I agreed with the comments. Yeah, his basis feel like really low for some reason, which is like ah sorry are they feeling love because he doesn't have personal basis. Oh, yeah. No, that'll that'll do it. But it's like weird because he's like a little four and Franz is like one and like they write it so that he should feel like a more competent fighter than Franz does. But like even in chapter two, he doesn't. Yeah, OK.
00:13:22
Speaker
One of my favorite things about Gilliam is that he's the Vulnerability Tutorial, so if you play with tutorials on, I believe the first thing Gilliam does is attack a soldier, miss, and get doubled. Phenomenal. That's sad. It's really depressing. That's really sad. I'm pretty sure that's true. getting dolled by a GBA soldier though really? on his joint map? well it's scripted i wouldn't say yeah it's scripted oh he actually does okay okay he does get dolled by the axe guys though which is like actual damage or maybe it's an axe guy and not a soldier i'm pretty sure he attacks a unit gets doubled and i think you're right okay if it's an axe guy actually then sure i can see it if it was a soldier i was gonna say that's a new low
00:14:04
Speaker
Yeah. I think the other thing that hurts Gilliam, because I just played Fe7 too and I was thinking about how like, Oswin's pretty good in that game. Yeah. But Fe7 has a lot of secondary things to be doing on early game maps. Whereas Fe8's early game is like pretty linear. Like it's mostly you could just send your good units at the objective. And there's not another super important thing to be doing that you can do on low move. Like the kinds of things that you want to do are like chapter five, someone needs to grab the villages, but Gilliam's no good at that. Yeah, it needs to, it's ideally Vanessa. Like that map is so good for showing off like how to use Vanessa. So just like lackluster bases and then like maps that do not support the kind of unit he is.
00:14:53
Speaker
Yeah. If you could get him to Great Knight, Great Knight does help. Yeah, no, it definitely does. I also like his like growths aren't, I mean, his growths are fine, but like they're not even like super high in defense. I feel like GBA in general does not like high defense growths. I know Fe6 particularly is insane about them, but even like this game, I want to say it's under 50 still, which is... Oh no, it's 55%. Is it? Okay. No, it's his strength that's lower, which is also not good. Now I remember. Yeah. Yeah. Well, he also only has like 30 speeds, so he's not going to grow out of that bad base. Oh, yeah, he's not. No way. um Well, I mean, apart from that one, don't you remember that one run I was doing of F8 where like my Gilliam got speed like like 13 out of 14 levels for some reason? That's pretty funny. Yeah, that was really funny. All right.
00:15:44
Speaker
Seems like we agree, Gilliam. Not the best. Yeah. Yeah. No argument. Yeah. No, he should. I don't think ah too just okay. It's too high. a cut for him yeah ah um I hate saying just okay. It's too high for you to do on the opposite end of the spectrum, though. Vanessa went into really good with 54% of the vote placing her there
Vanessa & Moulder: Utility and Efficiency
00:16:09
Speaker
I agree. I thought the comments were pretty spot-on pointing out, ah you know decent to good combat flying utility early join Maybe a little bit too much emphasis on the combat if I want to nitpick something um But I thought the commenters were pretty spot-on on this one. Yeah, I guess the like
00:16:26
Speaker
I guess in terms of like the early game stuff, there's parts about like how you know she gets killed she can get kills when someone else sets them up for her. which like you know is not something that you shouldn't do. But like, you know, her combat early is not good. She's not even really good at having kills set up for her. yeah In chapter two, you lower a brigand for her to kill and she still has like a 60 something hit rate and they kill her in like two, three hits. yeah It's like you have to like put in a lot of effort with it. I mean, it's definitely worth it. um But like it feels bad. It feels really bad.
00:17:08
Speaker
yeah Yeah. I mean, you should definitely do the training arc. I just feel like it sometimes it goes a little under spoken how annoying the training arc is at the beginning. I feel like my hardest take is that I don't like Vanessa, but it's it's less of a she's not good and more of a I don't like this unit feel. That's fair. I think I do. I feel like even later on, like how combat doesn't get like. massively great i guess like the main thing i'm thinking of right is um like chapter 15 like you can have her fight all of the um wyverns towards the right hand side of the map but that's usually with the help of the like the dragon spear which is effective damage so like yeah that's the weapon i would describe vanessa's combat as typically good enough i was gonna say when you think about like what you need her to do like in erica route it's like
00:18:01
Speaker
ah She can help out with some of the combat on Chapter 9, or just do Rescue Dropping. Then like Village of Silence, she's going to go kill spiders and moguls. um And then 15, she's going to take the dragon spear and go kill dragons. Probably the most demanding enemy she's going to fight is Voltr. Yeah. Oh, God. Yeah. ah Which she can do. You need to train her for that, but she could do it. So, yeah, very good unit, but like primarily for rescue dropping utility. I think she functions a little differently on Ephraim and Erica route. On Erica route, I care quite a bit about her combat because of those couple of maps that I just mentioned and more coming later. I was going to say Cormac's the big factor with her. Yeah. Whereas in Ephraim route,
00:18:46
Speaker
I don't do. you I don't know if you even need to promote Vanessa and Ephraim route, because he gets you get core mag and he does your combat. Yeah. I mean, you have the whips, so like there's no reason not to. Well, I guess the reason would be to train someone else in the early game, right? Yeah, I feel you yeah guys kind of want to give her. I guess for most what she has to do in the early game, you don't really need her to train to train her, which is like pretty good. Like, I feel like even in like the scenario, you're not using her. she still gets a lot of use. Like I don't like using her that much long term and I still use her a lot for like the sixth village or the villages in five.
00:19:24
Speaker
um just rescue dropping and like that's like a lot in and of itself yeah or even like distant blade even if you didn't train her she can still go drop ceft to the south or grab the village i feel like it's a real testament actually to like how much um as hard it is to like say what like the game developers intended or whatever i think it is a testament how much stuff they specifically like put in the fea early game for flying units to do yeah And that's a niche she's like stuck with, like she's only covering for a while. And I would say for like, um, a lot of the maps were like, you really need it initially for like speeding up gameplay. Like I feel like she's doing a lot, even if you don't deal with their combat.
00:20:05
Speaker
Yeah, she's making pretty big contributions there. Yeah, like I don't like I it's hard to not argue. She's not worthwhile. And even without the combat. Yeah, great unit. I agree with ah the comments. He's really good. Yeah. Next up is Mulder. He went into pretty good with 48 percent of the interesting. I thought that he would have gone into really good, but I think i think it might be a difference with per perspective of perspective here, possibly. Yeah. I think this is the biggest unit where play style super heavily affects where you're going to put him. Because if you play the game fast, he's basically a free warper and none of the other one, none of the other warpers are.
00:20:51
Speaker
But if you're playing slower, that becomes a lot less big of a deal. and Yeah. I mean, like, like if you want the higher magic, right? You can just like stick with Natasha. And if you're spending like the extra terms on six, when you've got the torch staves, like you can make up the difference in weapon rank easy. Yeah, I mean that's the thing like if you're allowing yourself to take some extra turns to spam torch or whatever Then Mulder becomes a lot less exciting because the war his his boon is that the warping is basically free
00:21:24
Speaker
but he's not better at it than anybody else. Like basically every other candidate is better than him at it if they get into it. Yeah, exactly. Like obviously in an efficient context, it's mostly like his warping is sufficient apart from like the finale warp, like some of like the very late game warps in a casual content, having further range for your warp better, obviously. I was going to say like um a lot of a lot of casual players might not even be dealing with warps, to be honest. Yeah. Yeah, that's true. Whether that's even a factor or not, I'd say, is a big thing for him. Yeah, but I mean, I guess that's even like the thing about like you know if you are like just deploying him as a staff bot for Physic, for instance, you'd be like, oh, his range is terrible.
00:22:07
Speaker
Yeah, that's true. And that's going to be a bigger field thing for casual playthroughs 100%. Yeah, so like, I think for the way that I usually rate units, I would put them in really good, but I don't have any problem with pretty good for my like no criteria, generalist play style ranking. I think it's fine as well. Yeah. i it It respects the that he can get to warp quick and it's really good but that not every playthrough cares about that. Next up is our first trainee and the highest rated trainee. ah Ross went into just okay with 43% of the vote. I feel like that's like one of the most divisive ones so far too.
00:22:47
Speaker
that doesn't surprise me based on the comments ah this is by far people's favorite trainee by like a tremendous margin ah people really like the hatchet people like berserker they like that he comes in the early game so he's not hard to train and i think all of that is true yeah yeah i mean i was just gonna say i was like i don't think that surprising as well like you know he's super low level at a point in the game where like your only notably high level unit is staff so it doesn't feel as like terribly out of place as do Amelia or Ewan when they join later down the line it doesn't feel impossible to train him which i think is the big problem with Amelia and Ewan is training as like unit feels
00:23:32
Speaker
I think also in terms of the payoff, as as you said, Lizard, Berserker, people like the crit bonus, people like the water slash mountain walking, even though, for instance, Amelia eventually being able to get on a paladin horse is like, you know, cool. It's like, well, we have other paladins. We have a billion other paladins. right whereas here this is the first berserker you can get and we'll get to this later but people don't like the other berserker that much yeah i know exactly like the hatchet's also just like a really handy weapon like give him one two range with like some semblance of accuracy it feels really good to use to be honest yeah it feels really good to use absolutely so i can understand yeah and of course it has to be said we can give the hatchet to somebody else
00:24:25
Speaker
But it does make him easy to train. I also think it helps that chapter three is like it feels like a map that's designed to be taken slower. You obviously don't have to, but like it's like it's just a very cramped space that feels really easy to train Rosson. Yeah, I mean, they give you that guy. You can just chuck a hatchet. Yeah. the Wall in a couple of levels. It also just feels really good to get that exp up and not have to do that much for it. It's like, oh, I want to use Amelia. And if I want to use Amelia, I have to like find an enemy that she can hit with. and just keep doing that. And it feels awful by that point in the game. Yeah, I mean, it's. That being said, I don't want to guess this guy. Yeah, I mean, he's not. Yeah, I'm trying to figure out where I put him between just okay. I'm like, what was the bottom category? Not that good. but like Not so good.
00:25:12
Speaker
Yeah, this guy's kind of on the border. Yeah. I'm fine with just OK. But um but yeah, like the the issue with this guy that we haven't talked about is his. So his bases aren't great, which is fine because he's it's good. But his growths aren't great either. He's got 50 strength, which is cool. ah But he's on 30 speed, which is a real problem for him and 25 defense. ah He actually he doesn't get that bulky. Yeah, he's like the classic fighter where it's like, oh, you get 2 billion HP, but you have like eight defense. But even his HP doesn't get as high as you would think for a unit with a 70% growth. The base is so bad. So yeah, he's OK. You can train him pretty easily. His stats become like OK. And he has some unique utility with the water walking and mountain walking. yeah I mean, his bulk is pretty good if he's standing on a mountain. True.
00:26:08
Speaker
I think Ross kind of coasts on good unit feel over anything else, which he does, that which I think is is a big deal for a lot of people. So I'm not surprised by this place, but. Next up, we have his dad, Garsha, who is just okay with 55% of the growth, just like his son.
Garcia, Colm, & Artur: Contributions and Challenges
00:26:33
Speaker
ah Commenters pointed out that he really suffers from a lack of hero crest. Most people seem to use him early game and then drop him. And some people point out that his speed is a problem, but at least you can kind of fix that in the late game.
00:26:48
Speaker
Which that's basically true he the the lack of hero crest is a problem, ah particularly in Erica. I was going to say, I feel like that nailed most of what I would say on him as a unit. I think people kind of sleep on him to some extent. Like, I think he has some nice early game contributions that people don't really ever talk about because Ross just is feels more fun to to to use. um But like it's kind of hard to really like rate him in the sense that it's like I feel like there's like a very large gap between him and Ross. But like, it's all in the same tier. And when you're voting like this, it's it's you can't really show that.
00:27:27
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I guess as well, it's like, because a lot of people here have said that, you know, they drop our Garcia, it's essentially the question of like, short term Garcia versus long term Ross, is what this kind of looks like is happening to me, which are like, two very different like comparisons to be making, right? yeah I would say Garcia's alright if you want to use him long term too. He actually has pretty similar problems to Ross where they both struggle with speed. But Garcia does not have the ah the benefit of being able to like water walk or anything. and No fun crit bonus either. ah Both of them probably want a speed wing. I think it's pretty hard for them to get one. Yeah it really is. um
00:28:17
Speaker
The other nice thing for Ross actually over Garcia is I was just saying Garcia has a hard time promoting because like an Erica route, Garrett comes with your hero crest. Pretty hard to justify giving that one to Garcia. That's right. And then it's pretty hard to justify using an unpromoted Garcia until like chapter four. Yeah. Yeah. Whereas Ross gets to use the ocean seal. And like, I don't know if unless you're really big into calm, which I mean, I think there is an audience. There is an audience for Colm, but I would if if you told me there's one promotion item and I can compete with either Colm for it or Garak Yeah every single time every single time
00:29:02
Speaker
yeah
00:29:04
Speaker
But yeah, just OK is right. I agree with the placement here. Next one is Nami. Oh, my God. 57% of the vote. ah Poor Nami. What were they doing? She only has four base. It's really sad. the The only thing that I mean, the comments were mostly dunking on her poor stats. The only thing that she kind of has going for her is that you get an Orion's Bolt early and literally no one else can use it. Yeah, but then like you could just sell it. And it's a game where money's not tight, so like you could sell it, but you don't need to. like the The issue with that is that you like if she was like level like five or like higher and it was like not a ton of levels to get her there, I'd be like, okay, maybe she could chip her way there and then she'd have like something, right?
00:29:58
Speaker
But you got to like put in the work to get her to that. Yeah, it's my level like it's like it's a lot like I've done it. I like to do it. I think it's fun. But I did it four times. I don't know if I don't know if I do that in the play through in the same paper. um She does get a good promotion, at least Ranger is a good promo. I do think, though, her bulk makes it like she gets a sword but it's hard for her to use it yeah it's really hard for her to use the sword like she has bad hp and then terrible defense and res so just kind of like you don't really get to fight anyone who can counter you freely yeah i mean like it's nice it's there i guess and she can do rescuing or whatever but once again it's a seven move force it's like
00:30:51
Speaker
If I, if I want a seven move force, I have one. I have like three actually, unless I'm like iron manning, I guess. Yeah. Like if I'm going to deploy a unit for rescue dropping, like I'll just use Ford, right? Like, yeah. I mean, especially with how squishy she is, right? It's kind of like, well, if neither of you can really live ahead, then might as well be the one I didn't have to promote to get there. Right. Yeah. It's like even like the niche cases I can think for, like they all take too much effort to be useful for those niche cases. Yeah. Well, next up is her automatic support partner, Colm, who went into just okay with 59% of the vote. And this was my favorite comment section because about a third of the comments were, quote, he opened the chest. Like, that's really funny. That's really funny. and They're right. He do. He opened the chest. Yeah. I mean, it is. Now the problem with a unit who opened a chest is that we could buy chest keys in this game.
00:31:49
Speaker
But he does have a couple things that he gets to get before you can buy chest keys and that he gets to steal. So he gets you an energy ring. He gets you some gems. ah There's a Draco shield he can steal plus some of the less important stat boosters here or there. In the early game, he gets you some of the chests in chapter eight, assuming you didn't like save a key from five X and the items there are pretty good. What is it? ah It's a robe, a silver sword and whip. I believe so. So that's not bad. I like that alone it's like just okay to me like you get me an energy ring and a whip sure yeah I agree I definitely agree yeah I mean he's like your typical thief utility I mean I'd say he's solid in that regard I guess as well like um
00:32:36
Speaker
Although this is something that is not necessarily going to be relevant because you can just buy Torch Staves, including from the Overworld, um over like the Chapter 5 location. like he can like provide he He does provide like additional site on the Chapter 6 fold, for whatever that's worth. Yes, which is actually yeah, it's it's not a because there's like some calves on that map that can surprise you if you don't have big fun. I mean, it's definite it's definitely like you don't have to do anything for it. Like it's a pro.
00:33:10
Speaker
Yeah. He also gets desert item credit for however much you value that, ah which is tough. It's because it's like it's good items, but I feel like he gets like 40% credit for of them because there's another thief and also non-thiefs can get them, but not reliably. Yeah. I mean, i there's art some credit weirds because like, we can't just be like, Oh, well, if he's part of the reason why we get the warp staff, then we give him 20% of the credit for every warp. Cause yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's like, how do you, how do you evaluate like, Oh, I'm giving you four tenths of the credit for getting. Yeah. I mean, he's fine. He's perfectly fine. I feel like it's hard to write themes because it's like, you have to like increase their value based on like what items are getting you. But then that just leads you to like, to like the warp thing. If column was like necessary to get warp.
00:34:00
Speaker
Would I, like, break comb really highly? That doesn't feel right, but, like, probably. There's something that I have seen some people discuss where they largely rank units on, like, the strategic value that they provide, which in Colms' case is very low, right? An example of this would be, like, that one chapter of Fe4 where Du has to put a bridge down. It's important that he does that. It saves a lot of turns, but it doesn't change anything about how you play the map. It just saves you some turns. Or like in Kolm's case, that he gets you the warp doesn't change anything about how you play the map. yeah It just saves you some turns, right? It just saves you actively ending turn for like 10 billion years trying to get the fucking warp style.
00:34:46
Speaker
But next up, we have Artur, who went into pretty good with 62% of the vote, comments mostly noted that he can warp with higher magic than molder and promotes with sea staves, also gets slayer access, which gives him effective damage against monsters, and he has low luck, so he gets pretty loud. Oh, the low luck. I hate it so much. It's really annoying. Yeah, it's the reason I don't use a bit of iron bands. So many characters in Sacred Stones just don't have luck starts. Well, I it's also Lucius has the same thing, so I feel like they wanted it to be a monk thing that they have really low luck. I'm not really sure why. Maybe to differentiate them from clerics, but like I don't I don't really know how much clerics care about it either. But but yeah, the low luck is it's so bad. I hate it. In in Artur's defense, I do think you can play around that low luck without too much difficulty. Yeah.
00:35:41
Speaker
I mean, you can. Because I feel like I mostly attack things that don't counter attack me or things that counter attack on magic, oh yeah which are unlikely to kill him even on the grit. And I mean, he comes pretty. There still feels really bad. He comes with a pretty solid faces. He's like he's doubling a lot of the enemies in his joint map. I mean, they are, but like it's still nice. It gives you some time to keep boosting his stats up. No, it's still nice. And I feel like Luke struggles more. than he does in that regard, which admittedly is probably because she has three con and decided she should get way down with fire. Yeah, three con moments. A choice. Yeah. Yeah. The comments were right about what's good about him, though. Slayer access is nice for Erika route because you have those ah middle maps. Yeah. Creeping darkness maps. And there's some of the some of the scary monsters, too, like.
00:36:29
Speaker
You don't need Slayer for the zombies and skeletons, but it's nice for like the dogs that units have trouble doubling or the gargoyles. Oh, yeah. The spiders that have a lot of players fight a lot of these during the round. The staff thing is true to warp is good. Arthur promotes to see Steve so he can get to warp in a timely manner, which I value more in Ephraim route because there's another unit that I like to get warp in Eric. So what? Yeah, but it is a good trade if it is. Besides all that, I would probably still put him in pretty good. I think he has a lot going for him, but I don't think he's like as big of a factor as like a lot of other units in really good art. Yeah. Next up is a very similar unit to Artur, Loot.
Lute, Joshua, & Ephraim: Potential vs. Limitations
00:37:15
Speaker
And she also went into pretty good with 50% of the vote. so
00:37:19
Speaker
Basically, Luke got put into the same tier, but if you look at the voting, people clearly thought she was a little worse than Artur. I would also generally say that. Yeah. Yep. I think it's about right. Notably, she has three base con, so in-made, she loses speed to literally everything. I can't deal with it. I'm so sad. It's so tragic. She does not get C-staves on promotion, and she is slightly more annoying to train than Artur because she joins at level one, And she joins ah closer to the end of chapter four than the beginning of chapter four. So like... Or she can even join at the end of chapter four. That's true. She can join after chapter four. It's really funny because like Arthur joins and he's like, you need to like get to the village and save my friend. The village is in no danger. You can just leave it. She'll just... Can anything you even destroy it? No. Nope. But yeah, I mean, I think that the point is that Arthur...
00:38:16
Speaker
gets a few rounds of combat on that map. So he could maybe be like level two and change or level three by the time you like start. getting Yeah, that's true. That being said, she's not that much harder to train no when you promote her. The con situation actually reverses ah where loot can get more toe might without losing speed yeah harder. Yeah, assuming you got to make money. Yeah, because um thunder has more might than shine. She doesn't lose light or she doesn't lose speed to thunder. He loses a speed to shine. She also gets a horse. works So I feel like it's a situation where it's kind of you're trading more mobility, which like results in better combat, I feel, ah versus slayer and easier access to war. Yeah, I would say slayer and easier access to war probably wins out, but
00:39:10
Speaker
loot is still pretty good to me, especially on Erica route where like, again, I don't care about the warping as much from these units. I feel like that conversation here is like pretty similar to like Garcia versus Ross and that they're both like, you're getting a similar quality of unit, but like the difference is more just where they'd be on a tier, like a single tier. I don't think you're like losing it. Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, I mean, I think this is also like, it's tough because we only have four tiers to work with. Yeah, we had like six, maybe she could be like a tier lower me when you because YouTube polls only have the option for. Yeah, you can't do more than I don't really know how much getting that granular would really matter.
00:39:52
Speaker
it's just like yeah year old but yeah for like a community poll it's like 8 billion people yeah like this kind of complete this kind of comparison between like these two silky units is the only time i would ever say this like distinction matters
00:40:10
Speaker
ah but next up we have another staffer we have Natasha who went into just okay with 58% of the vote in that tier the main comparison point the comments were making was obviously Mulder the other early staffer general agreement was that Mulder was better but opinions ranged from buy a lot to buy not very much at all again i think this really just heavily depends on how fast you yeah game yeah because like Because getting from D to C staves, if you're taking some extra turns, is not hard. You literally have the map off your hands where you can do that. Yeah, or like like we could sit on creeping darkness and spam torch. Yeah. So I think at a slower play through, the differences between them are fairly minute. Yeah, I'd agree. Yeah.
00:41:02
Speaker
I do think Mulder is better because the differences are are the differences are even there on slower playthroughs. Like Mulder has the option you could bench him for a couple of maps. He'll still hit his staff ranks. um And then obviously in faster contexts, it's a lot easier for him to hit his staff ranks. Well, in faster comp, depending on how fast the context we're talking about is and how optimized it is, you still train up her staff rank as well. Yep. Yep, you do. Yeah. And I also. and also Because like someone has to like someone has to be able to like use her man, use rescue, et cetera, et cetera. So it's not like a stays as the only benchmark we're trying to get to do. Yeah, that's true. She also does have a cool promotion. I feel like Bishop gets a lot of love because of Slayer. Yeah. But for these staffers where I don't really care about their combat, Valkyrie's. bat Yeah, I was going to say, yeah, like neither really wants combat. I mean, I know there's like some.
00:42:00
Speaker
like funny stuff you can do with Mulder, but I mean, I would say for 90% of players, Mulder isn't really seeing combat. Okay, 90 is a lot, but like for most people using Mulder, I would say they're probably not using Mulder for combat. um But the extra move on Natasha is just nice in general. And if you are using her for those extra staff rank, like boat like stuff, I mean, you realistically can get her to that and just have her use her for like extra stuff. Because like being on a horse gives her stuff like um like the rescue stuff, which isn't really important or like extra staff range, and you're not putting like that much extra effort like it's not like naming where it's like, do another training arc, put all that exp into it. Natasha isn't competing for as much exp, I would say. Yeah, hmm. Well, I just thought of something actually, if we don't mind grinding like our post staff rank, I don't know why our point of comparison would be Mulder.
00:42:53
Speaker
i Have this in my notes About to say the problem for Natasha at a slow pace is the moment we start to say What if we just spam torch on creeping darkness? My immediate thought is what if I do it with loot? Yeah these kids that we get god We get better magic We have our horse earlier Yeah But that's why I would put I mean, you're higher, right? Like, I think that's I was going to say, like, I feel like like that's like a fair comparison. But it's like, is would that like change anything? Because I would say the reason why I have Natasha and just OK. And every other staff are higher. Yeah. and and And yeah. And none of those things I would I'd say would put her higher. It's just like, oh, these are things that are nice. It's what's keeping her out of not so good, really. Then what's.
00:43:43
Speaker
putting her into pretty good, i would I would say. That's fair. I guess it's i guess it's just in i guess it's interesting though. I mean, it makes sense that like the obvious this comparison point would be, ah you know, the other staff locked unit who joined like, ah you know, two or three maps before. Yeah, so just okay. she In slower playthroughs, she can do good stuff, but maybe other units do it better. In faster playthroughs, there are still reasons to use her. Yeah. Um, next up we have Joshua who has voted into pretty good with 51% of the vote. Uh, only real comments were on like how good his base stats are, which is true. And that one, two range is really important in f Fe eight. I feel, I mean, once you range is really good in F8, but there's lots of things for one ranges to do. Yeah. in that age Yeah.
00:44:38
Speaker
I will say when I made my video on Joshua many moons ago, I said that I thought he was underrated. I do not think that anymore. I think ah pretty good is pretty good for Joshua. Yeah, um yeah I don't know. i I think I think that's pretty good for him. Also, the beauty of Joshua is you have a bunch of shitty combat units and Seth and they're there eventually some of those units are going to grow to not be shitty combat units. But for now, they're shitty combat units. Joshua's here in one rounding things.
00:45:13
Speaker
ah So for me, he was like a bell curve of a unit like do you know that meme with like, ah like a newbie on one side of the bell curve on the veteran on the other side and then the ball is like some other guy. Yeah, that was like the, that was, I was that meme with Joshua cause I first played FE8 and I was like, this unit's great. He kills everything. Then I got to the, you know, I played a bit more FE8 and I was like, oh, this unit sucks. He doesn't have one, two range or a horse. And then now I'm like, this unit is great. He kills everything. yeah He does also suffer for lack of hero crest a bit. He doesn't get to promote until late in Erica route.
00:45:56
Speaker
I feel like i like it's kind of ah feel like it's not as bad it's definitely not as bad as it is for Garcia at least. no He doesn't need his fast promo games as much. yeah He doesn't need his promo games to kill everything. yeah whereas like he's also like It's also not like Garak where like you're getting like hand axes on a promo. Like he's not getting out of swordlock regardless of what you do. In fact, the challenging bosses that you might want to use Joshua to kill don't exist until after that second hero crest. Anyway, like the unit, the enemies I might want to kill with Joshua, like the hard to kill ones are like, maybe I have him fight Kayla. Yeah, I was thinking Kayla. Yeah. And he gets to promote before that as long as you don't have some third hero crest unit you're using.
00:46:43
Speaker
Yeah. So I don't know. I mean, I would I would leave him in a similar spot. The base is really like his base is like even like it's I don't want to say it's similar to Vanessa because they're doing very different things. But I feel like those high bases are useful even if you're not using. Yes. In a similar way that if you're not using Vanessa flying is still helpful temporarily. Because he can even like set up kills for people where but because often he's in situations where um He can choose to either not kill with an iron sword or not kill with a steel sword. Yeah. And set up a kiln or kill with the killing edge, ah which, by the way, might as well be a PRF for him when he joins, because you don't have another C rank sword user except for Seth and Seth doesn't need it. Yes, that does not mean that unless you're like giving Erica Erica. Erica starts in these swords.
00:47:39
Speaker
Yeah, that's why I mean, like i you'd have to give her like, yeah, she can get there, but you have to want to get her there. but Yeah, that's what I mean. like You have to like give her everything. All right. Are you guys ready to move on to? Oh, oh, is it time? The the result that upsets me the most. Oh, yeah. This is time. I know Ephraim placed really good with 64 percent of the vote. Only five percent of votes total were below pretty good. That's so sad. That's so sad. The comments mostly pointed out. Enemy phase as well has good bases, so he doubles. He can take on groups of enemies because he has one-two range. ah This is set three, by the way. um but He has a training opportunity in 5x, and when he hits late game, he gets a horse and a strong weapon.
00:48:31
Speaker
um ah This is, like I mentioned, probably my most disagreed with placement. For me, he's like, top of OK or bottom of pretty good. Yeah, I was. Yeah, that's that's roughly what I was going to think I was going to put. Actually, he's like around where Joshua is to me. Yeah, I actually yeah I can see that. um I would put him a little higher than Joshua, but but not by that. but Well, I guess in that case, I was going to say because I'm a hater, I'm going to just say, OK, but if I'm saying he's a little better than Joshua, then I have to say pretty good. Yes, sorry. You've been contractually obligated by myself.
00:49:09
Speaker
was this Was this about him being able to take on groups of enemies? That's not true. Yeah, that's that's I think people underestimate um the limitations of Ephraim's bulk. Because his offense is good. The offense is like not a problem. um But he really can't take that many hits and he's not dodgy enough that you're going to want him to be dodge tanking.
00:49:35
Speaker
His PRF is good. um I think like eventually, I think like eventually he gets like and enough defense that like not enough, but like more defense that like he can take a little more. But especially early, he's like only taking like at most two enemies. I don't think he's taking two most of the time. um Yeah, I would say like three plus is when I start to mostly worry about Ephraim. Yeah, but this is sacred stuff. Like I have units that can take three plus. Right. So yeah. Yeah. His PRF is good. I think. makes it really easy to use him throughout a playthrough like even if you don't want to like invest in him he can pretty much always pull out the ragon leaf and kill a horse oh yeah it's it's great it's really convenient it's a great peora it's so it's so nice i i will i think ephraim gets a lot of um like good unit feel vibes just because well first of all people love
00:50:30
Speaker
the infantry Lance, I it just is. It's a fact. There's no denying it. it It's cool. We don't get it as much as we probably should. Reasonably, it's neat. um But also just like five acts is just like really easy to train a unit like him. It's not even like you necessarily like you should just like it makes it easier to do it in five acts if you want. Like obviously in faster playthroughs, I think you should train one of the horses, but like I feel like it would be overly prescriptive of strategies to be like, you can't train Ephraim in 5X. Yeah, he was like, you can't train Ephraim. Everyone knows that you have to like put him in awesome saddlebags, carry him to the front.
00:51:11
Speaker
He just can't fight otherwise, you know, there's just no way. I do think in faster playthroughs he can suffer from being rescued syndrome. Yeah, I mean, especially on Ephraim route, right? He really does suffer from ah like the fact that he basically always needs to be carried by someone else to get somewhere. His late promotion is good. Siegmund is good. He gets a horse. It's a seven move horse, but it's still, a you know, seven move is fine enough if you have good stats. Like the reason I had a problem with the seven move for Nami and Erica is because they don't have good stats. Yeah. ah So, yeah, I'll go pretty good on Ephraim, but I'm not happy about it.
00:51:53
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, I know. yeah i like But like I you can't you you can't only agree with the five percent of vote fair enough. You can't go with enough. What about democracy? All right. Think about the people. I'm going to disagree with the people again on the next one.
Ford & Tana: Utility and Training Ease
00:52:10
Speaker
Next up is Ford. Ford went into just OK with 60 percent of the vote placing him there. OK, wait, well wait, wait. If you don't mean to ask what was the vote for Kyle and what was the percentage on that? Pretty good. Fifty seven. That's too big a gap. That's too big a gap. Yeah. Yeah.
00:52:29
Speaker
people are so mean to forward like it's just I'm gonna be honest though I think it's mostly just a meme yeah because the comments weren't as mean to him I most people pointed out like I mean he's a cav he's the worst cav but a cav is a cav he has a very very fringe upside it doesn't really matter that he starts a level higher than Kyle so Maybe you could get them to promotion faster, but like in practice, it doesn't really matter. They both promote by chapter nine, which is what I've seen. I've seen people like I've seen a couple of people actually like mentioned this, like not like the fair actual sense, like actually mentioned this as a point in this favor where they actually care about like how much experience they can fill into like their units. Right. So. I mean, it is a factor or it like it is technically something, but it's like very technically something.
00:53:22
Speaker
yeah Potential user of that second Knight's Crest if Ron's didn't like get to 10. Yeah. Yeah, like I don't like it's. Pretty much most of the stuff you can do with the other two you can do with Ford like. Yeah, he is the worst calv though of the three. Yeah, I mean, like it's it's a slight downgrade, but it's like if we're like. loot and ardor are like Garcia and Ross aren't far enough to be in different tiers. I don't really see how far I could see it if Kyle was like fringe pretty good. And you were like, OK, maybe like but but yeah, it was pretty solid, pretty good. So I think Ford's got to be in there, too. Yeah. Yeah, I think so. Yeah. um We kind of talked about Kyle a bit here. ah Kyle's a little bit better. He has a pretty solid base bulk. Ford's a little faster, but like not really so much that it matters.
00:54:15
Speaker
Kyle is Seth for, by the way. Yeah. I mean, that makes sense. The other thing that's really tragic about Kyle. Well, it's not, it's not the thing that's tragic about Kyle. Something that's tragic about Gilliam. Yeah. I'm pretty sure they have the same base defense like he and they probably do. then god I like Kyle. Kyle's a fun unit to use.
00:54:39
Speaker
Yeah, I like in fact I've never used him also, which was I guess I'm missing out all this. He's pretty bulky, which is nice, I think, for the paladin to roll because it means if he if you mess up a bit and you bite off a bit more than you can chew, ah he's a little less likely to die. He does have worse combat than Fron. He's not going to double as much, but I can live with that. I have other units that I want to use for difficult combat. Yeah, I mean, especially if you're having like, if you're having like your second pal didn't do things like rescue dropping and that and that's something that you like mess up in the execution for whatever reason, right? Like him having better defense and the speed difference not mastering as much with the rescue penalty is just like isn't upside that he has better bulk upside. Plus, I like promoting Vanessa.
00:55:28
Speaker
end a age and mage and it can get pretty tight to get a third unit to level 10. So that's why I like yeah Ford and Kyle. Like when I play Erica route especially and I really want to promote Vanessa, um I like using Kyle or Ford so that I don't have to give exp to Franz. Not like that. I don't like him. i Yeah, that is there's other units I want to give exp to. Yeah, no, that that is nice. It is definitely a pro. All right. Especially when you're not getting a giving F from any of that units. True. Not allowed. No. Next up is Tana, our next flyer. ah She was placed into pretty good with 55% of the vote, which I agree with.
00:56:11
Speaker
Oh, the comments mostly focused on she's a flyer and flyers can pretty much always do something um worse than Vanessa with opinions ranging on whether that means we deploy both or don't bother with Tana. And a lot of focus on Tana's training arc ah being kind of annoying. Those are all definitely like factors. I feel like for a lot of v eight teams, the extra flyers aren't a huge ask, but it depends on your team comp. I think there's a little bit of a double standard with Tana's training arc and Vanessa's training arc. Yeah, I mean like, okay, Tana joins and on both routes, I feel like you do a lot of much training arc against monsters who just suck in every single sense. That's what I'm thinking. Like when I train her on Erica route, she just comes to creeping darkness and kills the crappy reinforcements at the top left.
00:57:11
Speaker
Yeah. Whereas like we, we mentioned earlier with Vanessa that, um, you know, she has like 50 to 60 hits like for like four damage on like one of these ax bros or something. Yeah. Like to me, like Tana's training arc is less painful to me because we have the, like the big monster route. I prefer on Erica route, by the way. That's why I'm talking about Erica route. Yeah, makes sense. Like a trainer on this route map where it doesn't even feel like grinding because it's a route map. So somebody's got to kill those monsters anyway. Yeah, if someone's going if someone's got to kill them, it might as well be the flyer. Yeah. And unlike the early game, Tana's EXP is very not competed for. Vanessa's already promoted. Garak is either already promoted or maybe you're getting him a level or two on this map.
00:58:09
Speaker
ah Like, who needs XP at this point? I mean, everybody likes XP, but like, no one's in desperate need of it anymore. I don't know, Marissa's really begging for it. True, Marissa. ah That being said, she is worse than Vanessa. I just don't think it's because of the training arc. yeah For me, it's more like Vanessa gets to do stuff longer because her training arc is sooner. She gets to be ahead of Tana when Tana joins um and will probably continue to be so long as you're like using both of them.
00:58:43
Speaker
It's also, ah it's also just the fact that like, you know, there's a lot of like, flyer stuff that can be done in early FE8, which is chapters that tall, something does not exist for. Yes. Yeah, that too. I was thinking even if you don't train Tana, you still deploy her on some maps. Yeah, you do. um Like chapter nine, Erica route, she do the rescue drop, drop or grab the village. Chapter 10, she can go recruit in as ah easier than Erica can. Even in like, so I used to run my 0% run. And like, even in the late game, like 0% growth, Tana could still kill Moguls. This is not to say Tana's bases are crazy, it's to say late game. Yeah, I'll just say that. But sometimes you need to kill one. So if Tana can do it on a pair of wings, that's nice. Yeah, that makes sense.
00:59:33
Speaker
and argument Joining in the same chapter, we have our next trainee, Amelia. ah Placed not so good, 50% of the vote. Comments mostly said, fun to use, but not great. Some debate over whether he's better or worse than Ewan, with most arguments for her being better than Ewan revolving around CAV access. I feel like this has been torched to death, so I don't have anything else to
01:00:00
Speaker
say yeah okay no the one thing i would have to say is that we have so many other potential calves and it takes our world to get there yeah that's the thing we have by the time she joins we have a paladin and three calves and for a lot of the a lot of the calf jobs can also be done by a flyer we've got two of those
01:00:26
Speaker
It is a good class for her to get. I think she's the most annoying trainee to train because she doesn't have access to accurate to. So like training her involves like setting up a kill on an enemy, which means you've got to get them to like to health. Or box an archer or something. Yeah, I mean, maybe that's part of me. That's why Knight Amelia is so popular, because like Your own your only other comparison for Knight is Gilliam, who has a really bad opening showing, as we've like mentioned before. And then you have like 14 billion calves otherwise. So I always make her night when I use her. It's just like a little more novel. Yeah, honestly, I think that's the big reason why that's so popular. I mean, that's definitely why pirate Ross and shaman you and are more popular. So I mean, same logic could apply there. But like the prospect of um debating
01:01:20
Speaker
If Amelia is better because Cav access or like you wins better because of XYZ feels so granular. That's what I mean. It's so granular that like it sounds it just sounds exhausting. I'm like, well, it's also like which ah which unit we agreed is terrible is less. Yeah. like Which one do we think is like ah point zero one percent less bad? who's involved in it. So yeah, I mean, it sounds like we all agree about Amelia. ah Yes, including the comments.
Innes, Tethys, & Marisa: Niche Uses and Challenges
01:01:51
Speaker
Next up is in as he went into just okay with 48% of the vote. Yeah, comments noted he gets basically uncontested access to any special bows like the long bow, that he isn't an unfortunate class, but that enemy phase isn't everything player phase does still exist. And
01:02:14
Speaker
And this is like hard because I feel like his like rating drops like changes significantly based on route. But like assuming his best route. I mean he gets like you can do some nice stuff like his faces are good. Which is like why it's awkward to put them in like feels awkward to put him in just okay. I guess he'd be higher up in that rate. I know I feel like just okay is like a good spot for him though. No, I think it is. It just feels awkward because his bases are decent. Yeah, it feels bad. It does feel bad. His stats are good, but... I would say the main thing that he gets is in Erika route, sometimes Gargoyles can be a bit of a pain. and He can help with that.
01:02:54
Speaker
I will say, enemy phase is not everything, but it does matter a lot. Because like making good use of a two-range lock unit isn't just finding him someone to attack on player phase, but like it's finding an attack where he's not left in range of another enemy. And sometimes that's tricky. So yeah, I agree with just, okay, I really don't like this dude in Ephraim Route, though. Oh, in Ephraim Route, he's in Chapter 15. I don't think he has a ton to do. Well, the thing that he gets to do there is that he gets to like, um, like die while, uh, solid runs across the desert with, uh, Erica in his allies gets to protect Erica's best stand. Yeah. All right.
01:03:39
Speaker
Next up is Seth5, aka Garrick, oh um voted into really good with 62% of the vote. Comments noted, he's got banger stats he can promote instantly for ones who range with axes. ah Some arguments for Ranger over Hero, and a lot of people think he's hot. And I agree, he's a good looking dude. I wasn't expecting that part. I have him in pretty good myself, so I cannot stand. Um, I haven't been pretty good, but I get this one because this is a unit like you do your first playthrough of sacred stones. You get Garak and you feel like you feel like a god has joined your army. Like he just hand axes things for the rest of the game and it's fine. I feel like a lot of units in FV8, not like, not that all of them need trainee arcs, but that a lot of them like
01:04:27
Speaker
Benefit from like some extra levels from bases, but Garrett just comes in like ready. You don't have anything His only weakness beyond his move is this is um is his speed. Yeah. Yeah He does really want to hit a couple speed levels or you can give him a wing But I usually like that's why I actually like to keep him in mercenary for like one chapter. and try to get him a couple of levels and, you know, hopefully get a speed level. Yeah, I mean, it's from here, which is nice with the with like the creeping darkness moment, like you have time for your for these one range units to get combat and actually get. um I like hero over Ranger. I could see Ranger if you're using him in more of like a filler capacity.
01:05:14
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. um Because then you get some rescue utility. um Can he be picked up in Ranger? In Hero, it's really hard to pick him up. i feel like I feel like we did both know this at one point, Lizard, with the but the promotions video, but now it has completely left my brain. I think i think the reason I think that i think we changed it so that Ranger could be rescued more easily. That that sounds like something we would do, yes. um But I could be wrong about that, I'd have to check. But yeah, I haven't been pretty good ah just because I do think that move situation is unfortunate ah when there are like good combat units that can move. Like we got like 7 Kormag, right? Yeah. ah But he's good. I understand the really good placement. Yeah, I mean, I'd have him like right between those tiers, I feel like.
01:06:13
Speaker
Yeah, I will say I am talking specifically Eric. Ephraim already is not as good. Yeah. ee Oh, yeah. No, 100 percent. Next up is Tethys voted really good. Seventy nine percent of the vote. So pretty, I mean, not unanimous, but very heavily voted here. Yeah, very comments were dancer 10 out of 10, but that her movement can be a little limiting in a game where a lot of the good units are on horses, ah which I think is true. Yeah, thats that's I think I think sometimes people will talk about like dancers being like, I mean, I've said this before, like at worst, a second copy of your best unit. But this doesn't actually get to dance for Seth that often. Yeah. I feel like it's like I feel like the. I don't think there's really any discussion on dancers being useful anymore in the fandom, but they're like was at a time that argument that they weren't.
01:07:11
Speaker
And I think that argument is like not inherently wrong, but kind of ah simplistic because the versatility with a dancer isn't just, oh, they're like another use of your best unit. It's like, oh, they're another use of just anything you need at the time that's useful. Well, and can also. It's like different than two sets, right? Cause it's like, yeah the way I would think of it is like, she could give Seth plus five move on turn one, essentially, right? yeah Or like, too soft and often better. Cause you sometimes don't need two sets, but it would be cool to have a set that can move five more spaces. Yeah. for yeah you can be like
01:07:53
Speaker
yeah Or like, she could be like your second warper, right? Like if you only have one warper, great. Now you have two. Yep. Well, it's it's also like, it's like you can get like an extra plus five moves, Seth, and then also do the extra warper and like the extra flyer used or something. Yeah. Just a really flexible unit. Yeah. And I think the flexibility is a big factor and why they're always so useful. Yeah. Just combat unit again. and In those routes, there are slower units with good combat that she will get to dance for more often. Like, yeah she might not get to dance for Seth all the time, but she gets to dance for Garak and Dusul. She does, she does.
01:08:34
Speaker
um It's interesting because like I feel like most of the discussions that I'm around where Tefis is mentioned is in comparison to like not with units within Fe8 but other dancers in the series where she's ranked like quite low so it's kind of so I agree that she's like you know really good in Fe8 but it's just quite funny to me being like oh this is a very different context to the one that I normally talk about Tefis in Yeah. one though The one thing I like about Tethys more than some other dancers is she has pretty good availability. She does. In Erika route. That's true. ah Which is not always a given. Sometimes you don't get a dancer for a while. Yeah. All right. Next up we got Marissa in not so good 59% of the vote. ah My favorite comment on this one said, ah yes, the secret fourth trainee. Yep.
01:09:29
Speaker
oh god This does a really unfortunate ah join situation in stats joins what five chapters after Joshua with worse bases and potentially on Erica out Remember. Oh, you're right. It's even more on Ephraim. Yeah. Yeah ah she and then with ah what with worse stats worse sword rank hence the shamshir because you can't use a killing edge of base. Oh, it's tragic. It's so funny. Oh And she this is a unit that confuses me because if she had good growths, I would be like, OK, you're supposed to go to the tower. Yeah, but she doesn't even have good growths. Listen, listen. I love Marissa. In my heart, she's really good. She's got a cool outfit. I'll give her that. That's what I'm saying. She's in the fashion emblem tier, which is the only tier that I subscribe to. She's S tier, but like, oh,
01:10:25
Speaker
It's just really funny to me that like she has like this nickname of like being like the Crimson Flash. yeah Everyone's like meant to be like afraid of her and shit, and she's been like training with like swords since she was a kid. like if I've read like all her supports. Her training used to apa used to include like but in like sleeping like between like sword blades and like making sure not to move too much and cut herself on them. Also, Marisa. i i i don't I just don't get the D swords. That's what I don't get the most. The D swords is baffling to me. And if she could use a killing edge, it would be so much easier to train her. Oh, yeah. Because in her current situation, she does not have good strength. So.
01:11:11
Speaker
She cannot like get kills for herself with an iron sword or even sometimes with a shamshir crit. yep And she doesn't double with a steel sword because she gets weighed down. If she could use a killing edge, it would be fantastic for her. Yeah, yeah I just I just I don't get it. I just I don't. There's no reason for it. ah okay i've Okay, I've heard this multiple times from different people and I don't know if it's just the same person who like spread like some unknown like singular entity who like said it once and then it's like kind of like spread to everyone else. I've heard multiple people say that they think that Marissa is a social experiment in like how much people will be willing to like justify using a unit just because it's a girl.
01:11:56
Speaker
Okay. If this was like a modern game, I'd be one thing. I refuse to believe they were considering that in 2008 on the GBA. I think, I think people like her is like, I don't know. She looks cool. She doesn't look like it. Cause more I like using Joshua too. He's got a cool match. Just look cool. They're just cool characters. She's just wish purple. I like purple purple. It's a really nice purple too. It's like, it's like this like nice, like pinkish purple. It's very nice.
01:12:29
Speaker
All right. Onto the next. We have Lara shell in just okay with 41% of the vote. Um, most people commenting on her poor joint situation. Um, or if they are Lara shell defenders focusing on the horse for higher move and rescue utility. It's essentially honest. It pains me. Lara shell is not so. Yeah. It's a six move horse because magical horses get screwed over. For some reason, I guess. that's So rude. That is. yeah It's a bad horse. Don't don't clown the horse clown on the game. And like, man, if she were a little higher level, the promotion is good. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Like if you could get her to promotion, it's great. But it's seven levels. She has to get on just staffing.
01:13:19
Speaker
rough absolutely rough yeah i just i just don't get like okay i get like her not like she doesn't have to literally start at like level 10 with a guiding ring but like three level three yeah we would like not even six like five anything i feel like even if she if she joined like level eight right even then i might look at that and be like Ah, two levels just based on the staff experience. I don't want to do that. So like, yeah, you know, seven. I mean, I, I feel like the reason it's supposed to be like a, like a funny haha joke, right? Like RHL has appeared all these times and been like, ah, yes, let us.
01:14:02
Speaker
defeat the evil monsters for I am the the great Lara shell and you get her and she can't even attack like it's funny right yeah but it does make her hard to use I and like I guess that's like like part of the point um where it's like Like, oh, she joins low level because she turns out like pretty solid, but she does have good growths. Yeah. It's just like looking at these growths are actually really good. She has like 50 magic, 45 speed.
Defense, Fashion, & Dazla's Mixed Reviews
01:14:33
Speaker
Her defense is bad, but who cares? Yeah. Yeah. and like No, she turns out pretty you solid. It's just the investment is so annoying. Yeah. So I'm going to go not so good. Say even though the horse, the horse is not enough.
01:14:51
Speaker
I would like I'd like right on the cusp of not so good versus just OK. It's probably not so good, though. It did makes just makes me sad. It is just makes me so sad. I did when we but did my ah hair ranking, though, I did give her the top hair style. The hair is good, though. Yeah. and I mean, she's she's very high on the fashion emblem tier. Yeah. All right. Next up, though, we have ah one of large sales compatriots. Dazla, in just okay with 64% of the vote.
01:15:25
Speaker
Yeah. those Comments generally saying disappointing for a pre-promote. Uh, some people prefer a trained Ross and some don't think it's worth training Ross. Uh, I didn't know this, but, uh, the comments pointed out, uh, that he has bad growths, notably the exact same growths as Fe seven bar trade. Wait, all of his groups are the same as but every growth. It's exactly the same. What? but That's hilarious. That's so funny. of all the dots I don't want to hear anything from. Alright, I'm gonna defend Dazla a little bit though, for two reasons. One, while Dazla might have the same growths as Bartre, and they may not be great growths, you know who has worse growths, sadly?
01:16:11
Speaker
Ross. I don't get the trainee growth thing. I don't get it. I ask why. Dazla has the same strength, higher HP, higher speed, and higher defense growths. Why? Why? Comedy, that's why. The other thing I'll also say in his defense is birthday is not really bad because of his growths. Yeah, he's back on his bases. Yeah, it also actually has serviceable basis. He's not as good as some of the other pre-promotes, but he could do some stuff. He could fight gargoyles in village of silence or Pegasus Knights in Chapter 15. I'm sure he doesn't double them, but it's OK if he kills them in two rounds, right? I mean, yeah i mean it's not like he's slowing you down. Well, I mean, they're both route maps, actually. So, yeah, who cares? See, I think just OK is right, but I think I'm ah ah like a little bit more of an optimistic just OK. Yes, same. Yeah.
01:17:02
Speaker
um it he like Honestly, like he his bases are like ah solid enough for what they are. They're not like amazing or like great, but they're like fine. They're certainly serviceable. I think it doesn't help that he comes with a battle axe, which if I remember correctly, I think has a pretty bad hit. Yeah, that's like that's like his thing as an ally. Um, where he, that's why he, I think, I think cause otherwise he would just kill most of the monsters around them. I want to say. Yeah. I actually think he gets to leave like a decent impression cause like he kind of does kill all the monsters around him. Oh yeah. But I mean, like if you had like an actual weapon, I think he'd be killing just Gary. Yeah. Yeah. The battle X has 60 hit. Yeah. That's rough. Yeah. And he's not like winning any awards for skill.
01:17:52
Speaker
All right. So yeah, so we're all just okay on this guy. I am. Yeah, I'm pretty serviceable with that. Cool. Next up, uh, one of my favorite units and the first unit that, uh, or no, I thought Ford should have gone up the second unit I'm disagreeing with because I think he's too low.
Saleh & Ewan: Combat Skills and Class Options
01:18:10
Speaker
Um, Saleh went into pretty good with 53% of the vote. Um, comments pointed out pent but worse, which is still pretty good. um yeah and good combat and access to siege tomes um and staff. You said that it was that you it was based on best route, right? Best route. Then yes, I would also put him in really good, because Erika route. If it was like an average of the routes or Ephraim route, then he's pretty good. Yeah. But Erika route Salah is quite good. Yeah, I mean, I like I've never used him and I
01:18:45
Speaker
wouldn't think to put him in really good but like i I look it over and it's like I mean like what is there really to like he doesn't really have any like glaring issues like his combat is really solid for a while and you get him like fairly early in Erika my blazing hot take I think Erika Rath Saleh is as good maybe a little better than Pent Because i mean okay he's around longer. He's around i don't like he's around like pence's just not in the game for that long. Yeah, I mean, he's not in the game that long. And also um movement stays in that game. Not exist for a very, yeah very, very long time. Yeah. So I can get some unique stuff he does. He can get siege tomes for egg map.
01:19:37
Speaker
It's not totally unique. Other units can do that, too. But he does it for free of the units that are easy to get to warp. He has the best magic. And it's relevant for the final boss skip. um It's not consistent that he gets there, though. He needs to have 20 magic. I believe he might need an energy ring for that. if Yeah, the number that number is 20. Yeah. Yeah. And I think his growth is like not such that that is guaranteed. Or I mean, it's never guaranteed, but yeah, he's got he's got a 30 percent magic growth. He might not hit that. That is. Yeah, that's a bit rough. ah He'll probably hit it with one energy ring, though. Yeah. I think it's more realistic to get a more up on Erica route. That's part of why I don't like him as much on F because he's not around for as long. Yeah, it's probably not going to hit war.
01:20:27
Speaker
I'm really good on Erika map to be good. Erika route, good combat, um good on the desert map. Oh, yeah, home access for egg map and warps really good in the late game and he can use it. I will say the fact that he's still reaching pretty good in Ephraim route, despite the whole getting along to 15 thing is honestly said does say a good bit about him. Yeah. Which is good, I really like him. He's one of my favorite characters, too. That being said, he's like my bottom of really good. Yeah, um like he just makes it an Erica route for me.
01:21:03
Speaker
ah Next up, we have a less good mage. You win. Oh, yes, notably less good mage. I voted into not so good with 47% of the vote. ah Comments noted his somewhat unique class access because he can go summoner um or druid and that he is a little less annoying to train because he has accurate to range, which I think is true. Yeah. But it's he joined so late for a training. Yes, he does know it's so.
01:21:37
Speaker
Honestly for him, it's like what if I just copy pasted everything I said for Emilia and then like switched out the names? Like 90% of it's just the same. The only thing that like I kind of want to talk about is that like I don't think summoner is a big deal for him. One, because I don't think you ever need to. Okay. I mean, I can think of exactly, okay. This isn't even vanilla though, but like there's exactly, there's exactly one time where I was like when playing FEA. Oh my God. Oh, I want two summoners. And that's when I literally set it so that everyone had zero speed, base and growth. Okay. Yeah. Then I could see two summoners being used. Yeah, but that's not a vanilla setting. So I, so I agree with you. Um, like I honestly, I don't know if I was going to trade like, do you even, is summoner even the class he wants to go?
01:22:28
Speaker
I don't really. I mean, it's not like a bad class. Well, it's like the thing with summoner is it's like if you're going to put the effort into you and why am I going? That's what I mean. Like because summoner isn't about the reason I like summoner for Noel is because like he joins you promote him. He has then he's a summoner. But like if I'm going to like train a year. I don't know. I might just go mage night because. Yeah, because I'm going to get that. You can call that out of mage. Yeah. Things themselves. Hmm. But yeah, it sounds like we basically agree on this guy. um I don't need to belabor the point. I think it's pretty similar to Emilia. Yes, I agree. Cormag voted into really good with 67 percent of the vote. Yeah, it makes sense. This guy's better in F than Erica, mainly due to join time. Yeah, he joins earlier in Ephraim route. Some people pointed out in Erica route. um It's annoying that you have to wait for him.
01:23:24
Speaker
on his joint map because you can beat that map in a couple of turns, but he doesn't show up until like. What turn turn five or turn seven, I think. Yeah, it's a while. Which is like mildly annoying, I guess, if you like really care about turns, but I feel like most people do full recruitment and that it doesn't really matter. So, yeah, and Ephraim is really good. He probably wants a speed wing. Yes. just because he's like a little fringe doubling a lot of enemies. But I feel like unless Seth is in desperate need, it's not too hard for him to get that speed wing. Yeah, I don't think it's like, I mean, like I like set this is like I said this is hard to beat, but like, I mean, comics doing pretty good. And like like he said a lot there the speed wing most of the time, I feel. Yeah, it's just like it's just a way of guaranteeing that he does have the speed. Yeah.
01:24:13
Speaker
Like it's like some like I remember one of my playthroughs I like Seth was like minus three on speed and I was like, oh ah He needs a wing But most of the time that doesn't happen next up is Renak I don't have a whole lot to say about Renak. He gets desert items. He can open chests without a lockpick but Chest keys Money is an illusion in FE8. The only thing, the only time I can think of like money actually like vaguely mattering for some, like the chest key part, like mattering for someone, right? Is because you can't go back to the world map after you've like saved in the level. That's true. If you forget to buy your chest keys. Yeah, you forget to buy your chest keys. Then you deploy Renak. I will say Renak's stats are like, they're not good, but they're not like memed here either.
01:25:04
Speaker
Yeah, that they are. they You can actually do like some combat in a pinch.
Renak, Dussel, & Garak: Utility and Roles
01:25:08
Speaker
I'm fine with just OK, like primarily off of desert item credit. um it It's like a warping boots, right? Like it's a big deal. Yeah, like it isums. I feel like I feel like I would just put it like right next to Colm. I feel like very similar lead out the two. Maybe call him like one higher if you're going to count like his early stuff over him, which I don't like i think is reasonable. You do get some nice stuff with Colm. Yeah. Um, but like they're they're just not the, the niches filled with both. Yeah. I think comb being better for the early stuff is worth more than like whatever combat you're going to get out of for NAC, but yeah, they're pretty similar. Yeah. Next up is Dusul. Uh, this one's pretty funny. This is the only unit where the vote was a tie. Oh, really? Uh, really good and pretty good. Those have exactly 44% of the vote. Does the vote like tell you like exactly how many people voted for it or just like nos just shows me the percentages.
01:26:03
Speaker
Okay, ah for a second, and I thought that you meant like it was the exact same number of people, which would have been really funny to me. Oh no, that would be crazy. Yeah, that'd be wild, right? Oh my god. That would be so crazy. This is Seth 6. Oh my god. Comments noted. um I think they're correct about ah everything but the Seth 6. He has really fantastic combat on Ephraim route. yeah He does whatever Seth is doing if it doesn't require flying. And he's great for Ghost Ship, which is a pretty hard map. Yep. So for me, he's pretty good. ah But I think he should be in the same. I think he should be in the same tier as Gary. Yeah. Because I mean, like in Ephraim route, doesn't he basically set sort of the same yeah role that some like Derek those met in our come out. That's the way I think of them. I'm like, if you're playing Erica route like. Garyk is your nice combat pre promote on a lower move and in Ephraim route, it's Dussel. Mm hmm.
01:27:01
Speaker
He has pretty incredible bulk. He can struggle to double a little more than Garek can. ah Like he's more likely to need that wing, I feel like. Yes, I feel the same. His starting weapon makes it really good though. So like him actually, like like he has an actual shot at being able to get to Garm. Yes, that's true. Garek getting to Garm is an ordeal. Dusul can do it no problem. Yeah. And Eryk are out less exciting because he joins in 15. But yeah, I'm pretty good in Ephraim route. I think he's just as good as Garak is on Erika route. Yeah, I could see either for this one. Yeah. I i have less experience with Ephraim routes, so I don't know as much to say, but like I think the Garak comparison is pretty accurate. Yeah, so I don't know. Like it's interesting. I wonder, do you give Dusil even a little more credit?
01:27:53
Speaker
because Garak does not have a Phantom Ship that he's helping you out in. Yeah, I feel like Dusul does more for you than Phantom Ship than Garak does on the Outcome Out map. Phantom Ship, I know how it works by now, but I feel like for lots of people, is like, oh no, what on earth do I do? Yeah, like I feel like Dusul actually makes Phantom Ship for like most players so much easier. Whereas Garak is nice to use on a lot of Erika route maps, but does he really make many of them that much easier? Like if you didn't have Garak, do any of those maps become a lot harder? No.
01:28:39
Speaker
Yeah. Cause I'm like, he doesn't even like, he's not boss killing either. It's going to be Seth. Yeah. See, I don't know. Maybe I like to use a little better. It's close though. Yeah. i He also has like the extra move for what that's worth. Not that it's exactly a whole lot. It's one tile. That's true. Can't it was doesn't have to use a promotion item. Which is not a huge deal because Garak comes with his, but like, but it would be nice if we could use that on Joshua and still have hero Garak, right? That's true. I mean, that's true, but it's like, that's the kind of logic where I'm like, can I factor that into the unit analysis really? I mean, I think we're pretty much splitting gears here. Like, I think they're... No, I mean, we are. It's just like, that's like the logic where I'm like, that is not on Garak at that point.
01:29:27
Speaker
Next up we have Knoll. Knoll was voted into chess. Okay, can first? My guess is that he's probably just been put in just okay? Yeah, he has, with 52% of the vote, um which I think is correct. um Comments note that Summoner is great for casual play, even if it's not the most important and optimized play, and that he gets practically a free promotion on join with the Master Seal on Chapter 15 that he starts right next to. Yeah, or in Ephraim routes, doesn't he start with gliding wing in his inventory? Maybe. I don't... maybe? I actually don't know. Yeah. I generally agree with the comments on summoner, although I will note it still does stuff in optimized play too. Yeah, it does.
Knoll, Murr, & Cyrene: Late Game Impact
01:30:17
Speaker
I think it's better in casual play for sure, but it does like, you use it on egg map, there's like, there's some funny rescue stuff you can do with it. Yup.
01:30:27
Speaker
Mm-hmm. Um, I think people mostly ignored nulls combat, which I think is combat' so but it's not very good. so Yeah He gets creates something. All right. He's bad. It's just unfortunate He can staff but not very well. He gets east aims, I think Yeah, I believe so I want to say on both. the Yeah, it's like It's there. I mean, like he can certainly heal somebody if you're really that desperate. but that's So I mean, I think summoner you're basically rating the summoner class. How good is the summoner after Chapter 15? I think just OK is about right. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I think there's stuff you can do with it. Like if you want to play really safe and you like don't want to do any math, I'm like summoner can kind of facilitate that.
01:31:16
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, okay. So in Zero Speed Fe8, Sumner did something like somewhat relevant. On chapter 15, in that I literally had to like, you know, break all the weapon usages of like that berserker, like the one-two weapon range usages of that berserker that's standing there because no one could survive around and come out with it because you would get crit and you'd die. And if you got crit twice... Yeah. So yeah, I mean, I think the comments were basically right on this one. Um, next up was Murr. I made a whole video about this one. Did people call her Seth seven? Yeah. Or is that seven Murr went into really good with 60% of the vote.
01:32:01
Speaker
Um, comments were like, uh, she gets 50 tactical nukes. Uh, flying access is nice. Needs just a little bit of training to get going, but not too much. Uh, and some people noted her bad bases. I will say I get where the people with bad bases are coming from. Um, but just't way because the stone, she always has the stone. yeah I was going to say you have to count like she's never without the stone. yeah And that's just the stone doesn't like make her bases. Good, but I think it makes them non-problematic. Like, it's pretty easy to feed her kills. Yeah. Just, like, don't leave her in range. like Just don't leave her and write like as a level four unit ah in range of a warrior with a silver axe. Yeah. Yes. I would argue that she's more like 30 nukes than 50.
01:32:56
Speaker
ah because you're gonna spend some of those training, some enemies she needs to double to kill. Yeah. She can kill all the monsters, but so can half your army. Effective damage against monsters is like not really hard to come by at this point. Mind though, her effective damage against monsters is triple effective, so that is actually something. That's true. Oh, and it is relevant against the two bosses that I really like her for, which are Morva and or no, it's not relevant against Leon, but it's relevant against Morva. It's not against Morva. Yeah.
01:33:33
Speaker
um The thing to me, though, I know you put her in. go ahead You say I know you put her in just OK for the video, or at least like that was like where you were heading. I still probably lead her up to pretty good. But I would be unbothered by pretty good. If she went into pretty good, I would. Yeah, I'm like. yeah It's like, yeah. Because I think what she does is good, right? Like she can kill a bunch of stuff. ah It's just that it's not terribly unique. You have a lot of units that can kill stuff often with one to rain. That's true. Often with better move and for and that like exist for the rest of the game. Right. Yes.
01:34:15
Speaker
That's true, yeah, I see that. But I would be fine with pretty good. I go just okay, but pretty good is justifiable to be.
01:34:24
Speaker
Yeah, I think I've learned just okay as well. He's just really not around, fully functioning for very long. Really good just okay. I mean, definitely doing the most out of that, dear. He's like the kind of just okay, like it's kind of like Athos, right? like Like you put yeah in CTM, but it's not because I don't want you to like, it's not because you don't use them. Right. Like, of course you use Athos. It's just it's one chapter. Right. And it's also and in this case, you know, it's also a phosphor. You do have to train, a but you have to train it. You have to train us lightly. Well, it's Athos, but you have to train and like Athos is better than all of your units at everything. Murr is not better than all of your units at everything. Yeah, that's true. Yeah.
01:35:08
Speaker
um Although she does get more chapters, so, you know, trade off. Yeah, I do appreciate the extra like time you get with myrrh. Yeah, but that's not really. Yeah, I'm not going to like go into this until here, since I like did the video on this, but I think her design is actually fantastic. You know, it's great. It's great. Oh, no, I agree on that. And I think that's part of it. The unit feels fantastic. Alright, that brings us to our final unit. Last but not least, Cyreen. What a note to end on. Cyreen. I was gonna say, are we sure it's not least? I feel like i feel like you could say least. She was voted into just okay with 62% of the vote. Comments noted that she can kill eggs and that she has worse bases than Seth in chapter 1.
01:35:59
Speaker
That's so sad. Why would they do that? What were they doing? I feel like that says more about Seth. Yes, that's a little better than Sireen, because the thing is, Sireen's bases are good enough to kill weaker monsters. That's true. I just. She's like she's just like a weird unit in general to me, it's like it feels like. It just feels weird, she exists in the sense that it's like Murf feels like the natural late game character, and then it's like, oh, yeah, I have this other character that nobody really likes or cares about, but sure exists. And I will say, yeah I know I have like Murr and Cyrene in the same just okay, ah but this is ah kind of like the nature of having four categories. Yeah. Murr is like at the very top of just okay to be, whereas Cyrene's pretty close to the bottom of just okay.
01:36:51
Speaker
Yeah, she can kill eggs in Chapter 18. She could do a little rescuing. She can kill shitty monsters. And you have a lot of deployment, so you might as well bring her to do those things. You know, it's just like she's only around for like four chapters and it's just like you. I mean, the stuff he's doing is nice, but she's not the only one doing it at that point, especially it's just that like the not so good, not so good for me is for units that like basically do nothing. Yeah. And I agree with that, especially for this game, because I feel like there's like a very a very specific group of units that do nothing. Yeah, like not so good. Unfortunately, the trainees, Marissa and Gilliam. Yes. Oh, and we put we put Erica down there, but yeah. Was that hit? Were there any more not so good? I don't think so. poor thea Yeah, I want so much better for her.
01:37:50
Speaker
oh Oh, we said la or I said Lara shell. Oh, I also said Lara shell ended on Lara shell. I forget where I put her. I think I put her in just OK out of pity. All right,
Audience Reflections & Farewell
01:38:04
Speaker
well, that's the entire ah the entire list. I have to say I was impressed that. ah The comments were in agreement with me for most units. And I think there were only two. No, only one since I since I begrudgingly bumped Ephraim to pretty good. ah Only one that was different than my placement by two. Yeah, I mean, I was I thought when I was filling them out, I thought like most of the time that they like. Were pretty were like one like on the same tier as where I was outside of like the Pacific instances of like Ford Ephraim, Ford, maybe Gary.
01:38:51
Speaker
Ford was so tragic. Ford was so, so tragic. Doomed to be memed on forever. Maybe he'll be good in the remake in 20 years. True. True. Very true. We just got to wait for Fire Emblem to sacred our stones or something. No, no, why not? He gets that as a purse. He gets that as a personal skill from the start.
01:39:22
Speaker
Yeah. For a tough tier. It's fording time. All right. Well, that is all of Sacred Stone's cast. ah Thank you all for coming on. Akara, is there anything you would like to plug? um
01:39:42
Speaker
perhaps Perhaps your YouTube channel? Oh yeah, you YouTube channel. Yes, I have a YouTube channel. Maybe maybe my philosophy. I play Fire Emblem. Mostly focusing on Fire Emblem fan games. That'll be both ROM hacks and stuff that's made in Lex Taliones. But sometimes I do other things as well. Like, I mentioned Zero Speed FE8 a couple of times, ah which I made recap videos of. That was pretty fun. So yeah, if you're interested, please do check out the channel. Yes, please do. But yeah, thank you both for coming on. And to everyone that listened, thanks for hanging out till the end and hope you have a lovely rest of your month.
01:40:27
Speaker
As always, a big thank you to Mike Echoes on Patreon, and a shoutout to my skinks, Aron Geddon, Cosplay Sylveon, Doopey, Emma, AikiPumiCabra, LonelyVoxel, LucySev, Morgwulf, RedMageMorgan, StarsToArt, The NoodleDoodler, UpscaleFurryTrash, VanWest, and Wingman.