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Pixelated Harmony Ep 2 - Frank Klepacki
13 Plays3 months ago
In this month's episode of Pixelated Harmony: The Voices Behind Video Game Music, I sit down with legendary composer, Frank Klepacki. Frank is known for his heavy hitting rift in Command and Conquer, Star Wars Empire at War and a ton more! Frank has been creating video game music since the NES! Frank stays busy by touring with The Family Stone and his band The Tiberian Sons. Website: https://www.frankklepacki.com/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@FrankKlepackiOfficialTwitter: https://x.com/FrankKlepacki Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/frank_klepacki/ Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/FrankKlepacki Pixelated Harmony YouTube: https://youtube.com/@Pixelated-Harmony Twitter: https://twitter.com/smitty2447
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Transcript
Introduction of Frank Klepacki
00:00:08
Speaker
of Pixelated Harmony, the voices behind video game music. I'm your host, Ryan Smith, and I'm excited to jump into this interview with our next guest, composer, producer, and sound designer with over 30 years of experience working on game titles like Dune Awakening, The Lion King, Blade Runner, and of course, Command & Conquer.
Childhood and Musical Influences
00:00:30
Speaker
Please help me welcome in Frank kopacky Frank, thank you so much for joining us. Welcome in. How you doing, my friend? I'm doing well. Thanks. Appreciate it
00:00:41
Speaker
Absolutely. Absolutely. And of course, we were just talking beforehand. ah You know, Frank is or has been basically a Las Vegas native.
00:00:52
Speaker
i Been out here since you were three. Yeah. You know, I've been out here for 20 years. We both kind of made our pathway from Illinois over here. So, you know, it's it's nice. And there's a ton of people. I feel like Las Vegas somehow is like ah like a little like mini Illinois. There's so many people from Illinois that are out here.
00:01:12
Speaker
Yeah, you know Las Vegas is sort of a melting pot for a lot of places, but you're right. There's a lot of people like from the Midwest and back East that have kind of migrated over here. I've i've met a number of people, not only from you know Illinois, Chicago area, but also like a lot of people from Ohio too, oddly enough, I've met here.
00:01:29
Speaker
Yes, no, I don't know how many ohio State fans ah that I am friends with out here. It's it's annoying. yeah But anyway, let's let's get into it again. Thank you so much for coming on and and just taking the time to sit down with us.
00:01:45
Speaker
I want to go back, obviously, just kind of from where your your comeuppance came from being out here in Las Vegas. I know that you were drumming professionally at 11.
00:01:56
Speaker
ah Kind of walk us through how that came about, how you got into music and just that passion. Yeah, you know, um the spark kind of has to start somewhere. And for me, I mean, my parents were both musicians professionally. So, ah you know, they're from Chicago. They moved you know to Las Vegas, you know, when I was super young, like you said. And so um ive I've only ever known being around that.
00:02:21
Speaker
um You know, they always had bands going on and, you know, they were performing around casinos in Vegas. And so that was just sort of a normal part of life for me. Like, you know, And they used to tell me, like as a little kid, that you know I assumed that everybody's parents just did stuff like that. you know So I didn't realize until later, you know that was more of a special scenario. But um but yeah, um I got the bug early to want to try to you know learn an instrument from that.
00:02:50
Speaker
And you know it took me a minute to kind of figure out that drums was going to be my starting point, because I tried guitar, bass, you know and then I was like, well, this is kind of really hard. you know As an eight-year-old at the time, I'm just like trying to you know figure this out. And these instruments are overwhelming, and they're really big, you know because I'm still a kid. and so i was just like all right well drums is probably easier right you just have to beat the crap out of those how hard that could that be so um so my parents were like all right well listen if you're serious you know we'll we'll you know for christmas we'll get you a drum kit but you have to take lessons for a year you know that's the deal like after that if you want to give up great but you have to do it for a year that's that's that's the bargain all right okay so that's how hard that'd be fine
00:03:30
Speaker
So I did that and i and I ended up really enjoying it. I ended up really taking to it. And that became you know something I became passionate about at at a young age. So um with that, a few years later, you know now I'm 11 and my parents were in a bind one time. It was a New Year's Eve ah gig that they had and they ah you know, had an issue, their drummer, you know, dropped out or had a double booking or something like that. and they're like, who are we going to get? It's a major holiday. Everybody's booked. And they're like, well, why don't we give Frank a try? so
00:04:04
Speaker
And I, you know, i was already familiar with the material. Of course, I listened to him practice all the time. So I jumped in and, you know, rehearsed with them, got got the show down and... Yeah, i played ah I played five hours for my first New Year's Eve gig and got paid for it.
00:04:19
Speaker
So that was, hey, that was my first pro gig. That is amazing. Yeah, yeah. So that's that's how I got started in music. I started as a drummer, first and foremost. um And, you know, I just quickly, like...
00:04:35
Speaker
started climbing the stairs of the next goal that I wanted to hit. So as a drummer, first of all, I was like, okay, I'm really like, um i learned a lot of music and now I want to find out what's the most challenging thing to pursue. You know, like what drummers should I be listening to? And I got really into rock music and heavy metal music at that time.
00:04:56
Speaker
i wanted to, you know, learn from drummers like Neil Peart and Stuart Copeland and Charlie Benante, you know, from Anthrax and stuff like that. And And so, you know, just ah very diverse sounding drummers, you know, all completely different styles. John Bonham, of course, you know, all of the greats. And so I started absorbing all of that.
00:05:13
Speaker
And then a little bit later, I got into funk music, like because that was a whole other genre that, you know, groove was such ah a big part of. And I was like, wow, I was like, this is like also amazing. And, you know, how do i dive into that? And I discovered Sly and the Family Stone, which is you know my favorite band. and And so when I saw their Woodstock performance on television, on you know that classic concert, um that really just threw a light bulb above my head. And I said, oh my god, that's what I want to do.
00:05:45
Speaker
know that That's what I knew. And then from that point on, i was always pursuing something that would make me feel like that. You know, like that ah kind of music, that kind of energy, that that hybridization of those those styles of music that made that so special.
00:06:01
Speaker
and And that's what I was kind of chasing ever since. But I've always been a diverse musician in that I've, you know, liked multiple styles and genres of music. But, you know, funk just happens to be my favorite, you know, and and rock and metal being, you know, right behind that. and course, I developed a love for electronic music after that, but I really started getting into original bands and as a teenager, like I said, trying to pursue that feeling. And that led me to wanting to be a composer because every time I tried to come up with an idea for a song in a practice, they would look at me like, i have no idea what you're saying.
00:06:35
Speaker
and And I was just like, okay, I don't speak their language. That's the problem here. There's a barrier that I need to overcome. So how do I do that? Well, maybe I should learn another instrument, right?
00:06:46
Speaker
So then I started learning keyboards so I could figure out what key, what notes, what chords. Then I started learning guitar a little bit. you know And I was you know older, I could grasp it a little bit better and you know started figuring out ways to come up with riffs and chords. And so then then I started being able to communicate these ideas and then I was able to contribute and I felt good about that.
00:07:07
Speaker
Well, then, of course, um the more I practiced, the better I got. i started using a friend of mine's four track recorder and recording multiple layers of ideas I had to the write a whole song by myself.
00:07:21
Speaker
I was just like, wow, that's awesome. I could just do this, you know, and. So then that got the the gears ticking about being a composer or at least being a songwriter. um And it wasn't until um towards the end of high school that, you know, i also had a passion
Journey into Video Game Audio
00:07:37
Speaker
for video games. I was a gamer, um you know, playing computer games and console. I grew up with the old Atari, you know, and then onto the Nintendo days and stuff. And So then I heard about Westwood Studios.
00:07:50
Speaker
um My cousin was the ah vice president, Lewis Castle. And um so I was looking for a summer job ah between, you know, my final year of high school. And so he's like, hey, well, you know, we might have a tester position open. You know, it's like kind of the, you know, minimum wage thing. But, you know, if you want to just have a ah gig, you know, so so they you know interviewed me and had me come in and I just, you know, was a tester there for the summer. But that was amazing.
00:08:16
Speaker
the beginning of opening my eyes to video game development. Then I could actually meet people that were making the games and kind of see the behind the scenes of how they're putting these things together, the art and the design and the programming and of course the audio.
00:08:31
Speaker
And um it was very intriguing to me to have conversations with all these guys and just kind of learn a bit about the process and, you know, and and just be wowed by their work and know how these things are put together. So I wasn't the best tester, admittedly, because I was so distracted. um so So I wasn't invited back as a tester.
00:08:55
Speaker
but um But, you know, it was just, you know, it was it was nice to have that experience because I got to meet, you know, a lot of people and and get an idea of what video game development is. And so I then, after I was getting ready to graduate high school, I approached the audio director, ah his name was Paul, and I said, hey man, um if I can ah be of any assistance to you, you know, if you need an intern or an assistant or someone to help in the audio department, something yeah but I'd be interested in that because, you know, I'm a,
00:09:23
Speaker
composing music myself and, you know, been a professional musician and I tinkered with sound on the, you know, computers and stuff. So I have some idea about it. And so, um, he's like, well, he's like, that's an interesting idea. So let's, um, you know, have you try out some of our programs, see how you take to it. If you can, you know, get the gist of it and, you know, we'll take it from there. So kind of was on a trial period basis for a few months. And, um, after, uh, passing that, that trial period, he offered me a full-time job and the rest of was history.
00:09:52
Speaker
that is That is amazing. And just that, you know, it's it's interesting that you say, too, about um i keep seeing how just the evolution of music and and how it's kind of grown with technology and as artists, how artists have...
00:10:12
Speaker
you know, been so adaptable enough to take something that's physical and then adapt it to no longer now an analog medium, but a digital medium and being able to adapt that. And then your other loves for, you know, video games, like you said, I, I've got to ask, did you ever play, um, the, uh, uh, oh my goodness. Why am I spacing it?
00:10:33
Speaker
Space quest, the space quest series. Oh, yeah. ah Yeah, absolutely. I played all those Sierra games back then. you know, I played the King's Quest, Police Quest, Space Quest. ah Yeah, all of that stuff.
00:10:47
Speaker
I love it. that is larry He has a leisure suit, Larry. You can't go wrong with it. And of course, unless you were sleeping a rock, you probably heard of Command & Conqueror as well.
00:11:00
Speaker
And I'm a huge RTS fan. Obviously, this is a classic RTS, one the OG RTSs. What, you know, just being involved within that process.
Creating Command & Conquer Soundtrack
00:11:13
Speaker
I know people have got to be dying to know what did that process look like? What were your inspirations? Because you do have a lot of there's a lot of driving and and just something that was, I almost want to say transcendent in video games.
00:11:27
Speaker
You didn't have music like that being composed for video games. Yeah, you know, that's ah that's an interesting point you bring up. bring up and And it wasn't something that I gave much thought to really at the time. um i knew that we were doing something fun and special. I mean, I think the whole team kind of had a sense of that, actually, because um when we started, you know, getting that game together and getting those, you know, first, you know, ah playable games,
00:11:55
Speaker
levels and missions and stuff um it it started to feel really fun and and special so that was um something that we kind of had a sense about but we had no idea it would become as popular as it did and certainly when i started working on the music for it yes it was taking advantage of technology that was the next level for video games which i was excited about um up until that point we had relied on midi scores with MIDI playback through sound cards and and chips that were included with game consoles.
00:12:27
Speaker
And lot of it was FM synthesis based, sometimes an occasional sample playback channel. But now we had the capability of streaming WAV files back. you know Even though we had to down sample them into like 22K mono, it was still at least a representation of the recording of the song the way that we would intend it to sound. And so that's what was really ah new and exciting for me at that time. We had done it with one other game right before that, which was um Legend of Chirandia 3. And...
00:12:59
Speaker
and um And so it was like right on the the heels of that, that Command & Conquer was also taking advantage of that technology. And so, yeah, as far as inspirations go, that started with a meeting, that a kickoff meeting we had with myself, the president of Westwood, and who is heading up CNC, and then also our audio director, Paul. and We all sat in in Paul's office and we all basically brought ideas of music to the table of what do we think would fit this kind of game given the subject matter.
00:13:34
Speaker
and um so we started kicking around just and and listening to CDs, you know like one after another, you know like, um yeah okay, so what about this idea? And it would be like you know a soundtrack.
00:13:47
Speaker
ah What about this idea? It'd be like a rock metal band. and This idea be more electronic. This idea be more, you know something more hip hop or edgy, you know because we were looking for stuff that would have more of a contemporary flavor to it, you know something that that echoed the times of of what music was able to communicate, but how does that fit into this modern military near future setting that's borderline science fiction?
00:14:15
Speaker
And um so, yeah, that was the interesting ah thing to discuss because we really didn't know what would work well unless we kind of put our heads together and and and I had the opportunity to kind of try some things. And I was encouraged to do that. They were like, you know what, don't think about limitations. Just try a bunch of stuff based on what we talked about and ah we'll see what works, you know? And that was kind of the the idea going in.
00:14:40
Speaker
This is also indirectly why Command & Conquer soundtrack is so diverse because I tried all of these different things. They put it all into the game to see what people would respond to and everybody kind of liked the the variety, oddly enough. So instead of zoning in on a particular genre or a particular style, they just left it all in.
00:15:05
Speaker
yeah Yeah, yeah. No, well and I think that's really interesting too because I feel like a lot of times people try to, you know, put viewers, listeners, whatever into a box.
00:15:19
Speaker
And it's like, you know what People are eclectic. People like all kinds of different things. And if that's something, and obviously it was something that resonated with people and and and people, you know That's something the music is as iconic as the game itself.
00:15:35
Speaker
And that says something. and And I feel like we say that a lot in in games nowadays. And that's always been something, especially since the introduction of just... you know, just more produce produce produced music for video games and to the point now where music is being used as a maant mechanic within video games. ah The evolution has been, you know, just...
00:16:02
Speaker
mind-blowing how it's just kind of come along as technology and and everything has moved along as well and i think you made a really interesting point and something that i want to say around the time of this game this is uh what mid 90s um yeah we had we had what desert storm and things like that uh that were also politically going on I'm just wondering, did any of that stuff have any kind of impact on a game like this? Or is that something that just kind of, you know, is like, Hey, that's something that's going on there.
00:16:33
Speaker
ah We've got this going on. We're not touching it. um It probably did. um i mean, I, I can't speak to the you know grand vision of the designers as much because you know that wasn't really my territory. But just from being there and kind of getting a sense of you know what things were being derived from, I think, you know of course, a lot of that had to play into a bit of the influence. But what I do know is that um there were some magazines and things that were um around at that time. I think i think one one one of them was called like Popular Mechanics or...
00:17:05
Speaker
Yes, so yeah absolutely. yeah i remember And it was it was like, you know, a projection of, you know, futuristic things that may yet come or that were being developed or tried out or, you know, and who knew if they were coming to fruition. But they were taking concepts like that and saying, let's pretend all of this is true.
00:17:22
Speaker
Let's pretend all of this did come to fruition and did happen. And what would the effects of that be? And the abuse of power with that stuff. And and all of that, you know, so, and then combine that with the fact that we've got this new mineral that's, you know, foreign that, you know, everybody's fighting over and et cetera, et cetera. Cause you know, that's, that's basically what, what people fight over in the end of the day is power of some sort of control of something. Yeah.
00:17:46
Speaker
And, and you did have things too, like Starcraft, Starcraft two, and things of that nature as well. So I feel like, you know, and And again, not to not to speak on on any of that stuff.
00:17:59
Speaker
um But, you know, that that stuff, I feel like had less of an impact on on games and just how people saw that that stuff and whatnot. So um I totally understand that. But what is your i guess what is your reactions and feelings been just, you know, how much.
00:18:21
Speaker
the music of this game, you know, means to people and and just how much it it just kind of like to me, it just kind of changed the game of music in games.
00:18:35
Speaker
Well, thanks. um Yeah, you know, ah it's something, like I said, I didn't give much thought to at the time. And even when the game came out and started to gain traction and popularity, you know, we were getting fan mail about the music and stuff and people were asking, you know, for soundtracks and whatnot. and And I thought, well, that's that's kind of fun. I'm sure it's just, you know, a few diehards out there. ah You know, like, that's a nice nice thing to hear.
00:18:59
Speaker
i didn't think it was anywhere near as... is um widely received as it was like it just didn't dawn on me because i'm used to the traditional outlets of how you receive music you know you you see you find bands you find movie soundtracks you know those are the big deal to everybody how could video game music possibly ah mean that much to somebody on on an equal level of that you know um and particularly anything that I had done at that time because it was so new. I was just like, you know, I don't understand how this would be ah more popular besides, you know, just a handful of people.
00:19:35
Speaker
and But of course, I was greatly mistaken. and It wasn't until the sequel, Red Alert, came out that it really blew the doors off in terms of the response and the the ah overwhelming response, I should say, not only to the game, but to the soundtrack, too. that really you know Then I started getting like nominated for awards and stuff, and I was just like, oh, my gosh, this is so much bigger than I think it is. I can't believe this. you know like so it was really just um an eye-opening um sort of moment and and i've i was very flattered by that of course you know the fact that anything i could have done ah for you know for a fun game that i was just having fun creating ah could resonate that much with people and still does to this day ah you know we can only ever be grateful that um
00:20:27
Speaker
that many people around the world decided to choose that as their jam, you know? Yeah. And is that kind of like the point where you're like, you know, I'm going to, I'm going to stick within this genre or has it been more of a like, Hey, I'm, you know, if something comes up, I'm going to do this, but I'm just kind of, you know, floating around doing whatever. And obviously that's something that you do,
Westwood Studios Experience
00:20:50
Speaker
but I mean, you've worked on a ton of just iconic games, and I feel like that's not by accident.
00:21:00
Speaker
Well, it's I was fortunate enough, like I said, to um to integrate into you Westwood Studios in particular at that time. um The fact that I got the opportunity to come on board as a composer, you know full-time composer, um i got to you know be a part of all of those great games that we were able to do. And it was such a great culture, i felt, at that company. Everybody had great camaraderie, ah you know had a ah very like family work vibe to it. like you know
00:21:31
Speaker
ah that that's something that gets tossed around a lot when people like their job. But I mean, it really did feel like that. It really feel like felt like we were all you know part of something special and we all acknowledged that and we enjoyed hanging out together even outside of the office and and playing games. And it was just, ah like i said, a great culture. So when you're immersed in that,
00:21:50
Speaker
And um you know it just helps feed the creative machine of your contributions. So you know getting to work on games like you know like the first RTS even, which was Dune 2, that came before Command & Conquer and really was you know the catalyst for us you know doing that, doing CNC, because it was Westwood's opportunity to take that concept and do an original IP with it. That was kind of the whole point.
00:22:16
Speaker
um But then, you know, getting to work on Blade Runner and and The Lion King for a Super Nintendo, you know, platformer game. And then we did, you know, C&C Renegade, which was a first person shooter version. And then we did, you know, ah the the other Dune games, you know, the Dune 2000, Emperor Battle for Dune, you know, Monopoly. I mean, you know, it was like the first internet version of Monopoly where you could play online with people. So, you know, and then of course the ah Lands of Lore series. i worked on either Beholder 2 even back in the day. Like there's so much, so much history there. I've literally worked on at least one game on every console that has come out. Yeah.
00:22:57
Speaker
yeah That is an amazing.
Audio Direction for Star Wars Games
00:23:00
Speaker
Starting with the and NES. First game I worked on was on the original and NES. It was a Dragon Strike. It was a top-down, like, dragon shooter. that was kind of fun to do that, you know. But, yeah, and then moving beyond that, you know, I got to, you know, become audio director at Petroglyph after, you know, Westwood was consolidated into Electronic Arts. And so then first game that we worked on at Petroglyph was Star Wars Empire at War. And I couldn't have been...
00:23:25
Speaker
more happy about that because Star Wars is my favorite IP of all time. You know, it's my favorite movies. And I knew all of the sounds, all of the voices, all of the music like the back of my hand. Like you couldn't have asked for a better person to jump in, you know, as as a head of audio for that.
00:23:41
Speaker
um So once I got into that, um I was just a kid in a candy store for for so many years because we worked on that and the follow up forces of corruption. So four years of Star Wars, I was I was in heaven. Yeah, you cannot. I mean, that that is like literally a a dream come true, working on something that you're very familiar with. Well, and let me ask, too, did you do you feel like that was that was beneficial for you? Or do you feel like there were some areas that you wish that you were a little less familiar with?
00:24:13
Speaker
Like, what was that experience like? um Not really. So um the experience was like basically. Okay, we're doing Star Wars. I know exactly what goes where.
00:24:25
Speaker
So none of that was an issue at all. um What was more interesting in terms of a challenge was that I had to come up with new a lot of new sounds.
00:24:37
Speaker
Right. For for ah vehicles that don't necessarily exist in canon, like they were from Expanded Universe or we had to come up with some you know other vehicles creatively ourselves um to add to the arsenal of of things you have available. Right.
00:24:53
Speaker
So um um'm like, okay, well, what are those things supposed to sound like? You know, do they have the same guns on them or do we invent a new kind of gun? Or, you know, we had, i remember we came up with a TIE fighter tank, you know, which didn't exist before. i'm like, what does fighter? TIE fighter tanks sound like it's on treads, it doesn't fly. And TIE fighters are known for that roar. So, and okay, well maybe we can use the same kind of blaster sounds, but we'll add a tread to it. And then I'll figure out a way to make the engine kind of sound like a little bit of a roar, but just subtle, you know, or something, you know, i was just trying to come up with different ideas to add to the, the, um,
00:25:29
Speaker
the mix of of the audio palette that fans are familiar with. And really the whole point was to blend in, not to stand out. Like yeah as a Star Wars fan myself, I'm like, okay, if this is taking place during a time period that I'm familiar with, which it does, then I want the the beats of that to feel like it's from the films. So I very much concentrated on that. But anything outside of that,
00:25:53
Speaker
It was a little more fair game for me to have some fun with. So like space battles, for example, are a little bit more neutral. You know, there's unless you're fighting over a very specific planet and you want to enact the a Battle of Endor or something.
00:26:07
Speaker
That's one thing. But I was able to write new themes in the style of John Williams that were more neutral for space battles or for even for land battles, you know different worlds we haven't seen yet um and situations like that. so So it was fun to contribute alongside of the existing materials that we had that we could use from the films we had permission to use ah from Lucasfilm.
00:26:31
Speaker
uh it was just a matter of blending it together and making it seamless so um you know it wasn't i could have easily like you know tried to let my ego go a little bit oh yeah i'm gonna make sure people know it's me on this but that was not all i was like no it's better if people don't know it's me it's better if they just feel like this is a true star wars uh experience and anything new should just blend in i You know, I absolutely love that because that is something, especially as an artist working on a material that you're so you're really familiar with. There is that that almost like you you don't have to have an ego about this. You don't have to be afraid of this or anything like that. This is something that you can dip into something that you've been a part of and like.
00:27:18
Speaker
make it feel i love how you said that just a subtleness of it and it feeling like hey this belongs this doesn't seem like whoa this is jarring thing that comes out of nowhere that has this brand that i'm familiar with that feels nothing like the rest of that universe uh i love the fact that you're able to just kind of settle into that and not only that so you're not only working on the music but the fact that you're working on the actual sound design going in creating ah you know the the sounds for this new vehicle that nobody's ever heard of um i i really feel like it's a unique perspective uh to be able to come you know come down and and and come through that uh in in terms of that is that something that you kind of
00:28:04
Speaker
you know, was like, you know, let me let me let me really get a grip and and get a hold and and and really get into this audio in terms of that, where you could have just been like, hey, you know,
00:28:15
Speaker
maybe somebody else works on the sound design. I'm just going to work on the music. Yeah. I mean, I could have easily just went that route. um But yeah, like I said, it was, it was cool for me to kind of, you know, experiment with that and and, and be able to add to that palette because I'm so familiar with it. I was completely confident, you know, from the get go that that would not be an issue for me.
00:28:37
Speaker
I studied Ben Burt's sound design ah since I was a kid. i mean, unknowingly, like I've, I've subconsciously prepared myself for this. gig of my life. you know like It was one of those things where I was just so enthralled with the behind the scenes. How did they do that? How did he get the sound for RGD2? How did he get the sound for Chewbacca and lightsabers and blah, blah, blah. so I knew all of this going in. like I knew exactly how he did everything from his interviews and you know, and and all of the different ah things that he field recorded and put together himself and ideas that he'd gotten. and It was something that I was ah very at home ah knowing that. So that helped inform my decisions too, like knowing what sources he derived from so I can derive from some similar sources to get some other sounds that will complement that, you know, or whatever the case may be. um
00:29:25
Speaker
But there is a certain sound to everything. It's very organic. It feels like it's, you know, um ah very unique ah and I wanted to make sure that what I contributed felt like it belonged in it while still contributing something new.
00:29:40
Speaker
ah Another example, when we did the Forces of Corruption, which was the expansion for that, there was a unit we had, the the Witches of Dathomir, and they have these lightsaber whips.
00:29:51
Speaker
And I'm like, okay, how do we make that sound like that? I know what a lightsaber sounds like, know what a whip sounds like, how you combine them together? to you know make them believable. And so I kind of you know figured out a ah clever way to do that by um taking the the hum of the lightsaber, running it through like a vocoder and then adding a whip into that so that it becomes you know one kindbi combined thing that's resonating through the same filter and gives that effect of, okay, this is a lightsaber, but it's got a crack to it. so Yeah.
00:30:29
Speaker
That was kind of fun to do some things like that. Yeah, that is, that is, i've I've got to add. So, you know, the games that you work on, do you play them or are you not? I know you said that you're a gamer and and obviously you're busy.
00:30:42
Speaker
Do you get time to play the games, like sit down and and kind of jump into them? Yeah, so fortunately for me, like, yeah, I play them a lot during development. Yes. um Because, you know, you have to test everything. You have to test your work. So at the very least, you're doing that much.
00:30:57
Speaker
um But, you know, sometimes I'll find myself getting into it and I'm like oh, I got to finish this level. Yeah.
00:31:04
Speaker
So, um you know, so it's fun. and And actually they do have company like ah designated times of day sometimes where they're like, hey we've got, you know, X amount of this game done and we'd like to have everybody play it just to give their feedback, you know, kind of thing. So we do have that occasionally too. I've been fortunate to work at ah designated companies, you know, like with Westwood and with Petroglyph where, you know,
00:31:28
Speaker
we It's 9 to 5, Monday through Friday. ah So I'm part of the whole development process from start to finish. A lot of contractors, if you're contracting on on Audio for Games, you don't really get that luxury.
00:31:41
Speaker
a lot of times they bring you in towards the end of the project ah when most of the stuff is done. And then that's kind of understandable because then now they know exactly what they need as far as a grocery list of...
00:31:53
Speaker
you know, audio or music, whatever. So, but then you have a limited time to work on it. So maybe you don't have as much time to play it. Uh, you might be able to get a sense. They might forward a bill to you, or if it's, you know, like hush, hush, they'll just send you a video of gameplay or something like that. So you just, you know work with the materials that that you're given and and how much access you're given and you can make your decisions based on those kinds of things but i've been fortunate enough to like i said be part of development for the majority of the games i've worked on there's only been you know a handful of games where i've just been more of a you know contractor on the outside and they just kind of give me limited info or videos to kind of gauge to that on so
00:32:33
Speaker
I feel like that is the, a lot of folks that I've spoken with, that's the experience that i hear more about. I feel like it's, you don't, it's not very often that you see the same composers or or same musicians working on the same projects, um mainly because the industry has changed so much.
00:32:55
Speaker
um You know, they it it's kind of crazy to see you don't have that experience You know, like you were saying, that that almost feels like a ah I don't want to say family sound cliche and like, you know, a family, but really that's what it feels like. You know, it's like your work family and like, you know you guys all all work on this thing together and
Collaboration and Teamwork in Game Development
00:33:14
Speaker
whatnot. And it's experience that ah like like you're saying, I feel that not many people get to experience. So ah definitely lucky in that respect. Yeah, yeah. I mean, and i really i really like that aspect of it too. you know you you feel When you feel like you're part of a team and it's a regular ongoing thing, then you know you you really can see like all of the the pieces coming together.
00:33:36
Speaker
ah That's kind of the most rewarding part of it for me, honestly, is is you know you do your piece of the puzzle and then when you see it integrated and working the way it's supposed to, you're like, ah yeah, we got it. you know or or Sometimes you can say, oh, that's how that actually looks. I need to change something, you know, and then you make some tweaks and um and ah yeah, so it's it's cool to see those things really come together. it it makes makes it feel fulfilling, you know, that um when the game actually does come out that, you know, you know, you did your best to.
00:34:11
Speaker
you know make that uh your part of it the best it can be that it integrated well with everything else and as long as you're happy with how it works and how it functions and what the gameplay experience is communicating to the player that's that's the end goal yeah absolutely and and i feel like i'd be remiss if i didn't talk about the fact that you don't just compose music for video games you're all over the place Film, television, ah you know, touring.
Work in TV and Film
00:34:37
Speaker
ah Tell us a little bit. I mean, some of the some of the shows, America's Got Talent, Top Gear, Pawn Stars, a ton of UFC. What's it like? What's your experience? And, you know, just tell us kind of the difference from working on video games to working on more of a TV film production ah to ah you know, all that. Just just lay it on us.
00:35:00
Speaker
Sure, sure. So um basically a lot of the TV show work um is a lot of sync licensing, actually. um that's That's become sort of the the bigger deal um nowadays when it comes to that format because ah that's where more money is, honestly. I mean, it used to be back in the day that if you were an artist and you put out albums, you know that was generating some good income.
00:35:25
Speaker
uh you know getting signed to record labels and stuff was like the big pipe dream back in the day ah nowadays that's not so much the case because um everybody sort of has access to digital distribution and streaming in terms of getting your stuff on those platforms it's very it's a lot simpler than it you know than it used to be yeah That being the case, I mean, you still gotta market yourself because you're just gonna be lost in a sea of everybody else doing the same thing.
00:35:53
Speaker
You could almost say the same thing about video games today too, unfortunately. i mean, there's so many games that come out people don't even know about because there's you know a lack of marketing behind it, but so many people have the i option to be able to get their stuff out on these game platforms. so yeah But back to the music thing,
00:36:12
Speaker
I think licensing is where the money is now because ah you know whether it's commercials, television shows, film, if you have music that you've already done and you can get it licensed through you know a partner you know or direct ah through you know whoever's in charge of putting the music together for these shows and stuff, that's where you can make some money. You don't make it off of streaming. I mean, i always think it's hilarious. I get you know the annual ah Spotify year wrapped thing, you know, and I'm looking at this thing like, oh, great. I had over, you know, however million streams and i can buy a couple of cups of coffee with that.
00:36:52
Speaker
That's all. You're in $5. Like what?
00:36:56
Speaker
um i want Yeah. So that whole thing is ridiculous and needs reform in the worst way. But, um, but, but I digress. Uh, anyhow, um, similarly, like you can, it's still lucrative to get hired as a composer, you know, to do original content, you know, for film and for television.
00:37:16
Speaker
Um, I was hired to do, you know, some original content for UFC and as well as licensing content and, you know, some short film work. I haven't really done a large film yet. Um,
00:37:27
Speaker
And that's just because I haven't you know met the right person or gotten the right opportunity. But one day I'm sure I will. It's just it's not been really a priority for me because video games is something that's such a longevity career for me that that's what I still keep getting the most calls for. So naturally, that's what I still keep doing.
00:37:45
Speaker
um you know Most recently, I got to work on some other games that were really fun. you know Tempest Rising had just come out. That's another you know really good RTS. I think that homage is the genre in that era of RTS, I think, quite well.
00:38:00
Speaker
um And I also got to do some work on Stormgate, you know which featured some of the devs from ah and the old StarCraft team and stuff like that. and um And then with a Dune Awakening, that was actually sort of licensed thing where they took my old Dune music and put it in their jukebox.
00:38:16
Speaker
so So they had already kind of done their game, but they said, hey, you know can we you know get a hold of the original ah you know older Dune music you did and we can put that, integrate that into the game. So they kind of worked that out, which was fun.
00:38:31
Speaker
um But anyhow, yeah. um And then as far as like the the touring stuff goes, um occasionally I will do you know my own video game concerts ah doing the music of C&C. And um it's ah you know you'll you'll see some of that stuff on YouTube, ah Frank Lipacki and the Tiberian Sons. It's the band that performs with me when we do those.
00:38:53
Speaker
And um those are a blast. ah we've We've had some some great shows that we've done and hope to do more in the future. So we just look for the right opportunities that make the most sense um logistically and all of that.
00:39:05
Speaker
But um and then we so when we do those shows, um it's great to to have the energy of how those sound live, because yeah I had to kind of rethink ah how to arrange those for that setting for those, you know, for those players that you know we have within within the group and how do we designate it who plays what. So I switch playing guitar and keyboards most of the show.
00:39:30
Speaker
um And then ah Tony, who's also, ah who plays guitar and keyboards in the show. We we both alternate those instruments primarily. And then one song I'll get on the drums and do do a little feature there. you know Another song Tony will switch and play bass and then the bass player plays guitar. And so you know we do a lot of ah swapping around. ah It's nice to have multi-talented people in the band um you know And then even their drummer will play keyboards while I'm playing the drums.
00:39:55
Speaker
it's it's ah It's a lot of good good stuff going around there. and And it's fun to realize those songs. I've always dreamt about doing that ah from a long time ago. And I just didn't know what the right situation situation situation would be to do that.
00:40:07
Speaker
And finally, you know that situation was presented. We played MAGFest and then we played a convention in ah Czech Republic. And we've had some other offers on the table since. And ah just you know looking forward to the next thing.
00:40:19
Speaker
That's one thing that I do for touring. Another thing is I am also the full-time drummer for the Family Stone. ah So Sly and the Family Stone, like I mentioned before, being my favorite band growing up and really getting me into funk and and loving that music. um I was fortunate in the late 90s to befriend the original sax player for Family Stone, which is Jerry Martini.
00:40:46
Speaker
and um we were sort of like just email buddies in the beginning and after that um after about 10 years of our friendship he you know said hey you know we we've got some changes in the group going on we need a new drummer would you like to you know be the drummer i'm like oh my god yeah of course you know so uh i've been you know playing with them ever since that was around 2008. um so yeah um talk about dreams come true that's another one for me yeah because um and like i told you earlier you know pointed at the television screen saying hey i'm watching woodstock family stone this is what i want to do 2019 we get invited to play the uh 50th anniversary of the woodstock concert and so i'm literally playing with the family stone at the original site of woodstock in 2019 so it i mean amazing i had goosebumps on that show and it was just like oof it's crazy um
00:41:41
Speaker
So that was awesome. i love playing with him every single time. um And yeah, so that's another you know another group group that I tour with ah primarily as well. Another group that I tour with once in a while is um Tina Guo.
00:41:56
Speaker
ah She is the cellist for Hans Zimmer's show. She's done a lot of of his tours and and and performs on a lot of his soundtracks as well. and um And but she's an artist in her own right and and and one of the best cellists, I think, ever.
00:42:12
Speaker
um I've gotten to work with her on original material as well, producing some tracks for her, ah co-writing some stuff together. so that's always been fun. We've been working together about 10 years um and we have a fall tour coming up.
00:42:26
Speaker
um as well so we're going to be doing the ah full metal cruise which was announced um in germany and and then we've got some dates following that um that that will be probably announced in the near future so that's uh that's been another completely different genre of music to perform as well uh as a drummer and um and but also like i said it's been fun to to co-create some things with her as well so So yeah, i mix it up.
Solo Projects and Community Engagement
00:42:53
Speaker
And if that's not enough, if I don't have enough on my plate,
00:42:57
Speaker
um I also put out my own solo albums. ah So usually I try to put out an album about once a year on average. um I have a Patreon page. So for anyone who's interested, who hears this um and wants to ah check that out, ah feel free to go on Patreon under my name, Frank Klepacki.
00:43:16
Speaker
And I put out a lot of videos that go way more in depth about what you and I have been talking about, actually, like all of the behind the scenes of of the Command & Conquer stuff. I literally have a whole video docu-series on there, song by song.
00:43:32
Speaker
ah what went into that, what what I was thinking, what my approach was, what instruments i was using, what the mindset of the time was, um all of that. And I kind of really dive into as much detail as possible based on whatever specific song somebody wants to know more about.
00:43:49
Speaker
um So I've been using it primarily for that. but also to kind of involve the community into what my next albums are, my solo albums are. yeah I did an album called Initiative, which was strictly based on what my ah Patreon members were suggesting to me in terms of genres of music to include on it.
00:44:08
Speaker
So song by song, I took everybody's suggestions and made a whole album out of it. Oh, that is amazing. And then some for some of the ah you know higher tier members, I'll let them even name the tracks.
00:44:20
Speaker
So I like, hey, you know what but give me some song titles and I'll include that. you know And of course, I credit everybody you know ah in the thank yous and everything like that. So that's been a fun way to kind of really bring in that community ah much more personable into what I do.
00:44:36
Speaker
um So I put out those albums. I just did ah one last year called Greetings from 1986, which was a synthwave album. So I focus on some genre stuff sometimes.
00:44:46
Speaker
I now have a funk album that's coming out this year. i have a project called Face the Funk, which is my sort of, you know, ah funk band that I put together. it's like a 10 piece band, five horns. And it's all like all homage is that old school funk sound that I love so much.
00:45:02
Speaker
yeah And so that's going to be coming out hopefully in a couple of months here. um I've been ah finalizing that, got the masters together and and getting ready to go into production. So, so yeah, so that's, that's in a nutshell, everything that's going on for me right now. You're not busy at all, but you're not busy at all, Frank. What are you talking about?
00:45:24
Speaker
That is, and I know you are. I love the fact that you that you've got all that stuff ah just going on and working. um i will make sure I'm going to put all those links in the description so that you guys can go and find that stuff.
00:45:38
Speaker
But if people want to find you on the socials and and just to make sure that they can stay in touch, where are the best places for them to go? Yeah, so um say there's my website, which is franklipaki.com. I'm also on Instagram ah and Facebook and X, so um you can find me on all of those.
00:45:57
Speaker
um And ah yeah, my artist pages on those platforms, ah they're all pretty consistent with you know the same same content, so you can, whatever your preference is.
00:46:08
Speaker
ah Those are the ones I stick with. Instagram seems to be ah gaining some more traction lately, but um there's a lot of, lot of them that are still on the Facebook too. So, you know that's where I'm at. I love it again, Frank, thank you so much for taking the time to sit down with us, get behind the scenes a little bit with you and let us know what you have going on in the future.
00:46:29
Speaker
Thank you, sir. So much. I hope you have an amazing day and all that good stuff. yeah thank you Thanks for the conversation. was pleasure. Absolutely, Frank. Again, don't forget guys, I will have all those links. You can find us on the social and all that good stuff. This was Pixelated Harmony. We'll see you guys next time.