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How Supply Chains Can Be Differentiators with Jaison Augustine
100 Plays2 years ago
In this episode, Jaison Augustin, EVP & Business Unit Head - Shipping & Logistics at WNS Global Services, joins Host Brian Glick, CEO of Chain.io, to discuss:
- What’s changed in the shipping industry over the past 30 years
- The importance of having the right people in the room for your transformation plan
- Why lengthy paper trails can cause major problems for supply chain pros
- The best practices large companies should follow when digitizing operations
- Why industry-wide standardization has been hard to accomplish
- How WNS helps shippers and forwarders stay ahead of the technology curve
Jaison serves as the EVP and Business Unit Head of Shipping and Logistics for WNS Global Services, a leading provider of global Business Process Management (BPM) solutions. Over his 30 years in the supply chain industry, he has specialized in business development, offshoring process transitions, and 6-sigma methodologies to support supply chain transformations.
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Transcript
CEO Priorities: Customer Interaction vs. Tech Reviews
00:00:04
Speaker
I think the CEOs of smaller companies are so hyper focused on growth.
00:00:10
Speaker
and they realize that only so many hours in a day, do they want to review functional design documents for the new technology solution that's being built in-house? Or do they want to go sit in front of a customer and expand their market share, right? As long as you know what outcomes you want to drive from your technology assets and process digitization plans, you know, get the right people in the room who will do it for you.
Introduction of Industry Expert: Jason Augustine
00:00:37
Speaker
Welcome to Supply Chain Connections. As always, I'm your host, Brian Glick, CEO and founder at Chain.io. Today, we've got Jason Augustine from WNS on the show. Jason is a longtime industry insider who has worked from a number of different perspectives, both at carriers, doing process automation and into emerging technology.
00:00:59
Speaker
We're going to have a really interesting conversation. And yes, as it is the hot topic, we will be talking about generative AI and chat GPT. So stay tuned for the opinions of some people that have been doing this a while. And now on to the show.
Jason's Role and Industry Background
00:01:17
Speaker
Jason, welcome to the show. Hey, thanks, Brian. Looking forward to this chat.
00:01:24
Speaker
Awesome, so why don't we just get started with wanting to introduce yourself and a little bit about your background.
00:01:31
Speaker
Sure. I am executive vice president and business unit leader for the shipping and logistics business at WNS. We are a business process management company. I have completed 17 years at WNS, and I set up this business unit from scratch. My background is almost entirely in the shipping industry. I used to work for container shipping companies in the past.
00:01:58
Speaker
including American President Lyons, CP ships and CSAV. So all I have done is work within this industry or around this industry. Awesome. So over that kind of period, I think you've gotten to see things from different vantage points, right? So, you know, inside of a carrier, you know, working for a service provider, what's evolved in that time? How's the conversation changed?
Impact of Global Trade and Tech on Shipping
00:02:25
Speaker
Yeah, great question. I think about this very often from the time I walked into APL's offices in the south of India in my hometown of Cochin. Just to set some context, in the early 90s when I joined, the US GDP was 5.9 trillion and the imports were about 390 billion, the exports were about 300 billion.
00:02:50
Speaker
Fast forward 30 years later, the GDP is 25 trillion and import export figures are 3 trillion odd and exports are 2 trillion odd. The changes I have seen is obviously the huge growth in international trade and globalization.
00:03:09
Speaker
and how companies have evolved and grappled with dealing with that kind of growth and evolution through the use of technology, which is where I spend most of my career and focus. The challenges somewhat have remained same, but the complexity in the environment has grown.
00:03:27
Speaker
30 years ago, you could assemble a laptop pretty much in one factory and locally sourced parts and supplies. Today, that has become this multi-tiered supplier network with multiples of sub-assemblies with a global sourcing model, which has really directly played into the complexity of the environment.
00:03:51
Speaker
And then the regulations that have grown around it with social causes, making sure that, you know, sources are not so, you know, procured from either, you know, child labor, you know, kind of situations or environmentally conscious parts and supplies. All of that has really caused a lot of challenges in the environment. Meanwhile, companies in the industry have tried to use technology the best way they could.
Revolutionary Tech in Shipping: Successes and Failures
00:04:21
Speaker
And I could literally tell stories about how EDI was going to change the world. Although EDI was invented in the late 60s and became popular in the early 70s, industry started using it in the 90s. And before they started deploying EDI extensively, the internet came. And they said, oh, you know what? Wait a minute. We can ride on the internet bandwagon, and that's going to solve a lot of the problems.
00:04:47
Speaker
All kinds of new standards came up. You and I spoke about XML becoming a big deal. They said, wait a minute, we don't even need to manually update this data. The Internet of Things will have all these physical inventory and equipment talk to each other and solve the problem. Blockchain became a big buzzword a few years ago.
00:05:08
Speaker
and all of these robotic process automation. And now, of course, that GPT is going to bring all of these technologies together and solve it for us once and for all. So that's my vantage point, Brian. We could jump into what I think about how this is going to materially impact our lives and the industry.
Generative AI's Potential and Limitations in Shipping
00:05:29
Speaker
But it's been a fascinating point.
00:05:31
Speaker
Before we go there, I do want to ask you very specifically about chat cheap tea and generative AI, not because it's the buzzword and I've been on two panels this week and had to answer questions on it and both of them. But before we get there, I want to contextualize it with what WNS does.
00:05:49
Speaker
because it's very very pertinent to your business what you know kind of automation and those types of things but can you give everyone a little bit of context because you're probably the biggest company in the industry that a consumer would have never heard of.
00:06:05
Speaker
Yes, thanks for that. So WNS, you know, we run and transform business operations for our global customers. So as the head of the shipping and logistics business unit, we serve my business unit serves service providers,
00:06:24
Speaker
in the shipping and logistics
WNS's Role in Transforming Shipping Operations
00:06:25
Speaker
industry. Anybody who moves or helps move cargo from point A to point B, which includes the container shipping companies, the freight forwarders, the NVOCCs, all the trucking companies, express companies, and everybody else in between, railroads. And we take pieces of
00:06:44
Speaker
organizations that these companies traditionally ran in-house and use our process expertise, technology and digital tools and analytics to transform and impact business outcomes.
00:06:58
Speaker
Awesome. And I would imagine, you know, also inside of that, and this probably has shifted over the years was, you know, as a lot of people, right?
Chat GPT's Role in Automating Shipping Tasks
00:07:05
Speaker
Also supporting those business processes. So, you know, if you look at what chat GPT can do, and I literally, before we got on this, we're looking at a product release and I asked chat GPT to write my LinkedIn post for the product release. And honestly, it was better than what I would have written myself.
00:07:22
Speaker
you know, it has some value in some specific areas. I mean, how do you predict it, you know, where it will be helpful and where maybe it might be a little overhyped? So you're right. All of these tools are going to be helpful in the context of our business. We are always conscious of staying ahead of the technology curve. So we are participating in the deployment of technology rather than being impacted by it in a negative way.
00:07:49
Speaker
You know, I don't think anybody has a precise answer what it is going to do. I like what Charlie Munger said recently, said it's not going to cure cancer, right? I mean, everybody uses it, sees the language models that can help you generate content and articles and writings. That seems like a very obvious, but how is that going to impact
00:08:13
Speaker
the complex business environments in which we are trying to solve problems. Bringing it back to the industry, the single biggest problem that we look at is the huge paper trail and information trail that accompanies every piece of cargo that moves.
00:08:34
Speaker
For an international shipment, you have to deal with 30 original documents, about 30 to 40 different entities from ports to terminals, to customs, to suppliers, to trucking companies and warehouses, different parties, shipper, consignee, notify party banks, insurance companies.
00:08:55
Speaker
and managing that entire information trail without commonly accepted standards globally and the act of the complexity of different countries and how they operate and so on and so forth. How the chat GPT or generative AI tool is fed all this complex data sets.
00:09:17
Speaker
to then come up with near 100% reliable output that you can bank on and depend on, seems like it's a little while away. So maybe you can use it in pockets that may be helpful. For example, a booking request comes in for a trucking company or a shipping company via email.
00:09:39
Speaker
which chat gpt seems like it's well suited to read that extract the relevant information using its algorithms and feed it into the system without a human having to do it and then an amendment to that request comes and it can make the connections and make those amendments.
00:09:55
Speaker
I think that's where companies like WNS with its knowledge of the industry and the process is going to be almost an integral step to ensuring that these technologies can be deployed so that their power can be harnessed in areas that are most impactful.
Combining Chat GPT and RPA for Logistics Solutions
00:10:13
Speaker
So we are actually building use cases right now, just like we did a few years ago when RPA was going to do all of these things.
00:10:22
Speaker
maybe chat gpt needs to have a private meeting with rpa you know it's kind of crazy right i mean before you get a one technology to fully you know flourish and do well something else comes in so i believe the answer lies in the power of generative ai
00:10:39
Speaker
working with some sort of a low-code, no-code solution that can quickly create these solutions that can solve specific problems. And it has to be done with the expertise of industry specialists like WNS.
Value of Industry Expertise in Tech Solutions
00:10:55
Speaker
Yeah, and that brings up kind of an ongoing debate in this industry about inside disruption and outside disruption.
00:11:03
Speaker
and what the role is of, say, generalist technology companies versus companies like Chain.io or WNS where we have kind of really deep knowledge. And some people might argue that that burdens us with, we can't see past where we've been. And others would argue that what you were just saying about having to deal with 30 original documents and having to understand all of this context and
00:11:28
Speaker
regulatory really makes this an industry that is hard to disrupt from the outside. Wondering kind of where you fall in that argument or where you see the balance there.
Challenges of Internal Tech Development in Large Enterprises
00:11:39
Speaker
Obviously I have a biased opinion here. So, you know, full, you know, full disclosure here. I don't understand why nobody else finds this industry sexy. You know, I believe this is the coolest thing ever and everything that we deal with,
00:11:54
Speaker
Well, I'll take that back to some degree. Covid brought us into the limelight, right? Everybody said, oh, there is such a thing as supply chain. And when I hit that buy button on Amazon, you know, I mean, all the stuff happens. And because there are supply chain delays and disruptions in China or Vietnam or somewhere else, I'm not able to get my furniture on time. Right. So there is some visibility there.
00:12:22
Speaker
I believe there are so many unique aspects to this industry. It requires specialists. It is just like every other field. I mean, if I have a problem with my shoulder, I'm not going to a general orthopedic surgeon. I want to go to a shoulder surgeon because he's just far more adept. He's got a lot more experience as dealing with that piece of the anatomy. Likewise, I think companies like Jane.io and WNS
00:12:50
Speaker
is a good example where we are in this business. Our customers want to integrate with ERP systems like cargo wise or very specific solution sets. By the time a generalist IT company comes and figures out those connections and nuances, we already have ready-made solutions that are ready to go plug and play. So I think we have a tremendous advantage
00:13:15
Speaker
over the general solutions providers, we can still take technologies that are available to tailor that to our specific industry requirements. But I cannot imagine the industry getting solutions at the pace at which companies like Chain.io and WNS are able to provide. We had a company the other day we were working with who was not necessarily, I say their staff were not necessarily industry insiders and
00:13:44
Speaker
They were talking about doing similar stuff to what you guys do. And they wanted us to map a buyer field to a ship to field. And my team just, I mean, it got a little almost heated because we're not going to do that because, you know, the buyer is not necessarily who receives the physical product, right? The buyer might be Walmart Bentonville and the product might be going to Walmart Los Angeles. And, you know, then we started explaining to them, well, you also have to understand that
00:14:12
Speaker
you know, on something like a DDP, Incoterms, the shipment might not even be going to the same entity that's purchasing the product if they're, you know, doing a port handover or a direct delivery to their customer. And that thousand foot hole that sits behind every word that's on every one of those 30 documents, it's actually kind of to your first point, the thing that keeps me interested. When I got into this business,
00:14:39
Speaker
three years ago, now 24 years ago, almost said, I'm going to do this for three months and I'm going to find something more interesting. I have yet to find a thing that's more interesting. So if you have any ideas though, I'd be looking for it still. I'm too long gone, Brian, to some degree, but you're absolutely right. Every field,
00:15:00
Speaker
has its own complexity. I mean, just to expand your example, the bill to party. I mean, you know, a bill of lading has five or six different entities and each of them plays a very specialized role, right? It's not just a name and address, you know, it has
00:15:16
Speaker
severe implications to where the cargo is going, so it has operational impact. It also has severe implications on who's going to pay for it and therefore the revenue recognition and where the monies are going to come from. And these are things that are intuitive to industry practitioners like us.
00:15:38
Speaker
By the time you train somebody else to understand that, the nuances, you know, I think that's going to be a far more tedious journey. And I would expand, you know, it's not just a generalist versus a specialized company like Chain.io and WNS. It is also sometimes
00:15:56
Speaker
I think the divisions within our potential and existing customer organizations sometimes overestimate their own abilities to do things in house.
00:16:09
Speaker
It's a natural tendency to say, hey, I can not digitize or build this technology solution in-house versus going to a partner. I believe the best practice is for these companies to focus on expanding their customer base and creating solutions in the physical movement of cargo and supply chain solutions and so on and so forth, and leave the digitization effort
00:16:37
Speaker
and automation of tasks and getting most out of their technology investments with the right partners that they bring in from the outside. So you work with a lot of very large customers who probably, in my experience, are maybe the most guilty of having, let's say, some extra ego in IT that may not necessarily be earned ego.
Agility Challenges in Large Companies
00:17:00
Speaker
But when I talk to smaller companies,
00:17:02
Speaker
you know they sometimes i think are intimidated that the resources of these bigger companies have i think that the bigger companies are way ahead of.
00:17:12
Speaker
and often further than they really are. I was just wondering kind of your thoughts on, you know, without naming names, obviously, but like, are the big companies way ahead? Are they doing all the AI and you know, everything's automated and nobody works all day and it's beautiful or, you know, kind of what's the reality in large enterprise? Someday I will write a book where I'll name names. No, you won't. No, you won't. So when Brexit happened, a very big company,
00:17:40
Speaker
$100 billion in revenue. You would imagine they saw Brexit coming for many years and it required all of this new documentation and paperwork and customs clearance across the UK border. They were completely unprepared and the ask from WNS, because we were their partners, was to hire 700 people to start doing customs documentation work
00:18:08
Speaker
which was never a requirement till a day ago. That just astounded me that there was absolutely no preparedness for something that was brewing for quite a while.
00:18:22
Speaker
So to answer your question, sometimes the largest companies, given their list of priorities that they are focused on, are not always the quickest. Some companies are better than the others. But so I think it's a question of not so much about size. It's about being nimble, being open-minded about where the best solutions can come from.
00:18:45
Speaker
And to give them the benefit of the doubt, there's also a tricky situation for some of these companies with all kinds of ransomware and those kinds of challenges. And nobody wants to be on the wrong side of the equation if there were some sort of a breach in their systems that brings the companies to a grinding halt and say, who made the decision to partner with XYZ, which opened up the vulnerability
00:19:14
Speaker
The answer is there's nobody out there taking four-hour lunch breaks because everything is working smoothly. I don't think there's a single company out there. But it's a tricky web of complex decision making. But there is strong resistance to always partnering with an outside company because they always try to see if they can do it in-house first. Yeah, I think there's also
00:19:39
Speaker
You know, having worked both big and small, you know, I think about back to the, literally the first day of Chennai, there were three of us sitting in one room. What you were just saying about, nobody wants to be the person who made the decision that ended up with us getting hacked or nobody wants to, you know, rock the boat too much, you know, because their job is stable and the company makes a hundred billion dollars this year.
00:20:04
Speaker
me adding an extra half a million dollars to that isn't going to actually move the needle all that much. And so it gives a real opportunity for the smaller companies to do responsible risk taking. There's a safety sometimes in the fact that you know that if in a small company, you're probably not going to get
00:20:27
Speaker
Like a person who's never met you is going to decide to fire you because of that decision, right? You're working directly with leadership. You're all making the decision together. You're all in the boat together. And you know, you're all hopefully paddling in the same direction, but it does allow for a lot of agility that as the companies get bigger, it's very, very hard to maintain that. So.
Resistance to Standardization in the Industry
00:20:47
Speaker
Yeah, and I think the CEOs of smaller companies are so hyper-focused on growth. And they realize that only so many hours in a day, do they want to review functional design documents for the new technology solution that's being built in-house? Or do they want to go sit in front of a customer and expand their market share? As long as you know what outcomes you want to drive from your technology assets and process digitization plans,
00:21:16
Speaker
you know, get the right people in the room who will do it for you. You're right. So I think there is a little bit of a dichotomy there. And I think the other thing that you and I recognize really well is this industry is stubbornly resistant to agreeing to common standards, right? I mean, you know, you guys give us this life altering ability to interconnect complex systems environments using your technology.
00:21:41
Speaker
almost like a USB-C port from one system to the other. So for the foreseeable future in our lifetimes, I think that is not going to significantly change. So we have to work with
00:21:57
Speaker
individual organizations and sub segments and help them as much as possible get the best out of their digital initiatives and technology investments and hopefully create a competitive advantage for them in the eyes of their customers. I mean that's really what we are trying to do here till the industry comes and adopts some sort of common standards but it's a hard thing to do.
00:22:21
Speaker
given the global nature of the business and complex regulations and economies and countries that they have to deal with. So as you might imagine, I've given that standards question a lot of thought over the years. You know, it's kind of the core of our thing, but kind of if you look at industries that do genuinely have common standards and operating practices.
Innovation vs. Standardization in Supply Chains
00:22:43
Speaker
So, you know, I think Sabre and the airlines who are swift in banking,
00:22:47
Speaker
Is that a goal for this industry? I guess not even just is it attainable, is it something we should be trying to attain? What do you think about? Is that a path for this business? So going again, you know, I always date myself, it's too late for that. When GT Nexus, intra were formed in the mid 90s, I believe, or late 90s, Max Hopper, the founder of Saber was on the board of GT Nexus.
00:23:14
Speaker
Right? The intention was very clear saying, hey, what the GDS systems accomplished for the airlines, what is it, 45 years ago or, you know, something, let's do the same for the shipping industry. But obviously that did not come to pass. The shipping lines themselves kind of sabotaged themselves and did not materialize. I think it continues to be some sort of a goal. Now, DCSA has come up and the shipping lines have now signed up to 2030.
00:23:44
Speaker
Ask the year that they will now completely accept a digital bill of lading. Now call me a skeptic. It seems like it's easier to sign up to a seven or nine year horizon where something is going to happen rather than put an immediate date because it's beyond the
00:24:03
Speaker
tenure of all more CEOs who are signing up to these pledges at this point in time. I think some bit of it will happen, Brian, as it gets easier. But I don't think the interoperability that banks have to send money to each other and continue to build on that are the kind of common platforms that airlines operate in. I think we are still a far cry from that.
00:24:28
Speaker
And also, it's a different modes of transportation and the global nature of our business makes it unique in some ways. And I don't think it's a priority of the CEOs, but they believe this chaos and ability to manage the chaos better than the competitor is really their advantage. Yeah. And, you know, when I talk to the shippers themselves and everyone ultimately gets paid by the shipper, as does the team at the Journal of Commerce likes to remind us every year at TPM.
00:24:56
Speaker
you know, they see their supply chains as differentiators now. So, you know, where I think there might've been an aspiration in the seventies, eighties, nineties, you know, if you look at automotive to say, okay, well, we're all going to sort of do this supply chain thing together because it doesn't really matter. It's like an electrical grid. It's just the thing that we're all going to turn on.
00:25:18
Speaker
Nobody thinks that way anymore. One automotive company's ability to get a product to market faster matters now. And certainly Walmart and Target and Amazon don't want to run the same supply chain. So my belief is that the standardization
00:25:37
Speaker
stifles innovation, because once it happens, it's codified, right? Like you look at something like airline ticketing, there's a lot of innovation in airlines and hard products, soft product, all of these things, but it's not in the ticketing process because it's set in stone now, right? And it will be forever. I think it's really important for us to remember that we do now provide a differentiating service collectively to the shippers. And that in that world, you do want to have things be different
00:26:07
Speaker
and standards kill that. That's why we're just not big believers in standards for everything, right? Certain things like, God, invoicing should be standard. There's no reason that invoicing isn't standardized, but the overall supply chain
00:26:20
Speaker
That to me is not the goal for that. I think there are too many moving parts there and it requires expertise to navigate through that complexity. Even if you were to accept that some of these emerging technologies are going to be game changers, I'm old enough to
00:26:41
Speaker
Remember how many of these technologies were presented to us as life changing and some of them did, you know, I mean, you know, there's so many technologies that did change lives, but the complexity kept on growing. So then we're kind of running as fast as you can to pretty much stay an interesting snippet of analysis. One of the big shipping companies released their quarterly results.
00:27:05
Speaker
And if you look at the technology innovation that they have implemented in their lifetime, it's quite huge. They've adopted all the modern technologies, but their productivity per employee seems to have actually degraded.
00:27:21
Speaker
So it's kind of strange. You would imagine, you know, this doomsday scenario that technology is going to replace the human being and everything is going to be run by robots. It doesn't seem so. I mean, it may be certain tasks are automated, but more complex tasks got added on the side that requires more human beings. Right. And it's a paradoxical situation.
00:27:44
Speaker
You know, in any given case, you know, content writers are under threat now, right? Maybe that saying, hey, you know, your LinkedIn post, if you had an assistant do that, or if you were spending hours doing that in the past, now that's kind of automated. But doesn't mean you're going to have a four hour work week because, you know, you're spending more time doing more value added things and the environment is getting more complex. I think that's really my view of it. I think human beings are
00:28:11
Speaker
going to be absolutely critical in fact more important. The more complex the technology gets, the more powerful the technology gets. I think it unleashes the creativity of the human mind of how some of these technologies can be deployed more effectively. To further that point, 10 years ago, I didn't even have the LinkedIn post to write in the first place.
00:28:38
Speaker
You're right. Right? So if you're thinking about the things I had to do at the beginning of my career, as I show up, I had to do the shipment and I had to go home, right? And now I have to manage social media and I've, you know, all these other things. So yeah, the world just, the demand side seems to increase to match the supply side when it comes to people's
Malcolm: Enhancing Logistics with Automation
00:28:58
Speaker
time. We never seem to crack that nut.
00:29:00
Speaker
We're running up on time here, but explain what Malcolm is and explain kind of where that fits into WNS and where it fits into the industry because I think it's a really interesting.
00:29:12
Speaker
application of technology. Tell me a little bit more about that. So the problem statement that Malcolm tries to address is what I touched upon earlier, the complexity of all the paperwork that comes into managing a shipment. If you look at the shipment lifecycle and the parallel information lifecycle, so Malcolm had to pick a point where we could begin and then we always knew Malcolm was going to be
00:29:38
Speaker
much more broader end-to-end solutions. It was positioned as a freight automation platform, and we started our first use case on the LTL side, where this velocity, when the truck pulls in into the terminal every evening at 4pm, it has an hour or two before all that information is captured.
00:30:00
Speaker
and it can connect the next truck that needs to take it to its final destination, and all the billing work can be accurately managed. So we began there, we deployed, we had four or five deployments, very successful. And now we are saying, hang on, if Malcolm can digitize the bill of lading using AI and it gets better, all the rules that you mentioned, it learns over time, and then it needs to be connected to different
00:30:28
Speaker
ERP systems and that's where Chain.io comes in because we said, hey, do we want to build the pipes or can we go to a company that already has that ready made and we can just slap it into Malcolm and boom, suddenly we become much more powerful than what we originally could have done by ourselves. So that's where our partnership comes in.
00:30:48
Speaker
Now what Malcolm is doing is expanding it to all the different interfaces that come into a shipping or logistics company. Recently, I was at a conference where the CEO of Werner Enterprises said they get a million emails a month.
00:31:06
Speaker
Now, what are these emails? It's a booking request. It's a rate inquiry. It's a dispute. It's an invoice query. It is a service inquiry. It could be an amendment request. It's a shipping. All kinds of documents are coming through that. It needs to be directed through a workflow to the right streams within the organization. And then everybody wants to manage a customer interface using Salesforce. We believe Malcom can be this traffic cop
00:31:36
Speaker
directing all this traffic, which comes in millions of interactions, predominantly email and chat, and then direct it to the right workflow, manage the customer interface, or Salesforce seems to have garnered a big market share from a CRM point of view. I think this is where our use cases for chat GPT and low-code, no-code solutions are also being tested.
00:32:03
Speaker
So at the end of the day, you don't want to compete with the ERP systems out there. You don't want to compete with CRM systems. We believe we bring in the process expertise and the plugin solutions to channelize all this information flow far more effectively than a company is trying to do it themselves. Again, there's so many adjacencies between what we do at Chain.io and what you guys are doing with Malcolm.
00:32:29
Speaker
It's always really interesting to put our minds together on that stuff, but that traffic cop analogy and that coordination piece is so critical.
WNS and Chain.io's Collaboration in Supply Chains
00:32:39
Speaker
We see so many times where the balls just get dropped in between processes and the salesperson sells something and operations doesn't deliver it or we do it, we never bill for it. All of those things, it is so, so important. Where can people find out more? Where can they find you and the company online?
00:32:56
Speaker
I'm on LinkedIn, go to WNS.com. Otherwise, hit me up on LinkedIn at Jason Augustine. Jason is spelled with an I. And we'll put that in the show notes. Yeah, absolutely. We love to have a conversation. We are passionate about this industry. And this is all we lie awake and dream about at night. Well, I feel like you and I could do another three hours, but this is probably a good spot to wrap. So thank you so much for being on the show.
00:33:26
Speaker
Thanks Brian, this was good. Thanks so much Jason for such an insightful episode. Again, I wish we could have gone another couple hours there and we'll probably have to get Jason back on. As he mentioned, we'll get the links into the show notes for his LinkedIn and WNS as a whole. Be sure to check out the channel blog. We've got a lot of great content coming out.
00:33:51
Speaker
including some updates on what's going on in the CO2 emissions tracking space, both in the US and Europe and how technology can be applied to that problem. So check us out and I will look forward to talking to you next time on supply chain connections.