Transcript
Killian Ginnity: Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to the Not A Pundit podcast. But sure, you already know that. I'm delighted to be joined, as ever, by Conor Glennon and Nathan Byrne. My name is Killing Unity. Gentlemen, how are we doing?
Conor Glennon: We are winning football matches, boys. As a nation, we are actually not losing for once. It is great to be back when we have a win to talk about. Not even one, we've got two.
Conor Glennon: How are you, Nate?
Killian Ginnity: scared. It's so different.
Nate: I mean, it was only Bulgaria, but yeah, it's better than losing, I'll give you that. Yeah, I'm all good, how are you getting?
Killian Ginnity: I am fan Dabadozi. i don't mind yeah I don't mind an i international break, but for you gentlemen, it's even better because the international break is now over.
Conor Glennon: That good?
Killian Ginnity: um But yes, we have had two wins. Jaimyr has arrived now. Nate, as you did say, it's only Bulgaria. This is not Bulgaria of Berbatov and Petrov and the other Petrov.
Killian Ginnity: This is a a less classy, less recognizable Bulgaria team. But we're also a less classy and less recognizable Ireland team.
Conor Glennon: like
Killian Ginnity: So we we will take that in take these things in context. um Two two one wins, Nate, think. um na Less than convincing performances, but we seem to be able to get results now from bad games.
Nate: Yeah, like, i think you hit the nail on the head there with two not very convincing wins. You know, we we gave away a goal early in both them, like, from very sloppy defending.
Nate: um Yeah, it was good to get back into the game, but how much of that actually comes down to that bit of talent that we have rather than, you know, a team performance. and That's my worry now is, like, are we just relying on them individuals and when that bit that opponent gets a tiny bit better can we get back into that game don't know i don't know
Killian Ginnity: Conor, what did you make of Haimier now? Like, this we did say beforehand that this was kind of, not make or break for him, but definitely ah the that matches that he needed to put a stamp on because, like, there's no excuses left anymore. This is now his team. He's around long enough. He's had his impact.
Killian Ginnity: If and what that may be, we we didn't know. it seems to be grand. Yeah.
Conor Glennon: Yeah, like, I mean, look, if if if you're him, you're going to say that's that that's the best we could have done is is is getting two two games, two wins. You know, it definitely calms the noise around them. You know, I think the FAI needed that both from an optics perspective based off, you know, interviews that have gone on ah over the last week or so and, you know, off the back of the...
Conor Glennon: controversy around the the women's management setup so I think the FAI will really welcome that I think Nate's right look it's it's it's Bulgaria but the thing we have to remember lads and I think this is what I would be saying if I was Heimer if in terms when the FAI come asking questions inevitably at some point we haven't won two games in a row since 2022 you know On paper, he's but of one of our most successful managers of late.
Conor Glennon: Was it that convincing? No. I think you summed it up well in in the fact that the worry for me is those early goals. you know Like Nate said, it's subpar opposition.
Conor Glennon: It's great to see his scoring goals and also strikers scoring goals is is something that is new to this team. And I know that sounds like I'm trying to be funny, but it's just a fact. um So there's positives and negatives. um do i Am I on the Heimer Express?
Conor Glennon: No. um But you can't fault him at the same time. you know my my my curiosity is more around the You know, we're still seeing John O'Shea talking to the media, not as much as as previous, but i maybe I'm just being pessimistic and I should give the guys flowers.
Nate: Right.
Conor Glennon: But to be honest, it feels like we could add any manager and beating that Bulgaria team.
Killian Ginnity: um obviously the other man that hadn' we had had a conversation about beforehand was Matt Daugherty and he did get a goal commentator curse ah do you think that he's proven us wrong do you think that he has ah silenced doubters after coming back into squad or is it just a goal that masked bad performances and yet another Matt Daugherty ishness
Nate: Not a chance. Not a chance as he silenced us, like, proving us wrong. It was a goal against the very, very poor Bulgaria side that somehow still gave us a run for our money in some regard.
Nate: um You know, like, he scored a goal, and I'm seeing articles written during the week. and Matt Doherty's career revival. What revival? um I'm sure if I saw an article like that. What revival?
Nate: No.
Killian Ginnity: Do you not think he's like messy the way everyone was talking about him before?
Nate: No.
Conor Glennon: and
Nate: The way everyone speaks about him, yeah, but his performances don't match up. No, listen, he's going to go back to the same substandard player that we're used to in in the games coming up. and Personally, I think the big thing that I take out of this is we got our World Cup qualifying ah teams, I believe it was Denmark, Portugal and Armenia. and that's The worrying thing for me is if I was a betting man, I am sometimes, is I'd bet on Heimer to get the sack after after that. You know what I mean? like That's where we currently are. is
Nate: We're going to struggle to beat these sides. We're going to look really poor and trying to qualify for a World Cup. And we're not going to get over the line.
Killian Ginnity: But do think we can get some results? Like, I think if we have a campaign where there's one or two things to kind of get behind that, like, it might be enough to for him to keep the job or at least build on for another tournament.
Conor Glennon: ah See, that's that's where I have a problem with this. you know and you know Looking at that group, so we've like Nate said, we've got Armenia, Hungary and Portugal. like the The most Ireland thing in the world is we get results against Portugal and we make a balls of it against Armenia or Hungary.
Conor Glennon: Look, don't get me wrong, one of the greatest football experiences of my life was being in the crowd when Shane Long scored against Germany. and you know We've had those nights against France when Glenn Whelan scored. you know like There's enough of these moments that are why you want to be a football fan.
Conor Glennon: But at the end of the day, that does nothing for us. We need a manager that gets consistent results, not just gives us big nights out. you know and this That's the thing with the Heimer conversation.
Conor Glennon: management tenure that the way he came in was so poor based off the whole temporary management with John O'Shea that it took all the good out of it and i think and I think all of us said at the time or at least thought at the time that there's ah there's an 80% chance that whoever came in the door is going to go at that period that Nate's saying you know like we' we' we're not going to qualify for that World Cup I don't want to be pessimistic about it I really hope we do obviously but ah
Conor Glennon: I'd be amazed if Heimer is kept on past that. Amazed.
Nate: can Can I ask you two guys a question quick? is Has he filled you with any confidence since coming in? Because he hasn't with me. it's like from From what I'm seeing, there's no clear plan for the FAI on how we're going to rebuild this and get to a World Cup.
Nate: And I can't lie, the manager just hasn't filled me with any confidence.
Conor Glennon: Well, I think he's done ah poor job... promotionally which seems kind of i suppose against everything we were saying initially when he was meeting with fan groups and he was putting himself out there being seen at the league of ireland but it it now feels like to me that he just kind of is ticking the boxes of what he thinks we want to see as opposed to actually like you said there's no clear plan we you know i've said before i don't care if we don't have a style of football as long as we're winning games so i can't say much but you know we
Conor Glennon: if I don't know if any of us us could describe, if someone said, how does Heimer's team play football? I don't really know what to tell you, like.
Killian Ginnity: I wouldn't say he's kind of filled fill me with confidence, but difference between him and Stephen Kenny is we're now able to grind out a result when we need to grind out a result. And I think, if nothing else, that's a step in the right direction.
Killian Ginnity: Yeah, we may not have a particular ah footballing identity right now, but... we also don't know what our team is. We're still, look at the squads that bit were being selected and that's where I'd have more issues with Heimer at the minute, is there is still that kind of lack of balance between the last generation and the next.
Killian Ginnity: Like, Doherty Brady i still like relying on these players that we realistically should have already moved on from or at least have a better idea of moving on from.
Killian Ginnity: ah Yes, I know Festi's around ah for the right back slot, um but he's now playing out of Turkey, which is less than ideal, but and he wasn't in the squad.
Nate: But, like, on that subject, though, like, are we just kicking the can down the road, like, waiting for a golden generation? like ah you
Conor Glennon: But like how can we expect a golden generation, though, we're not training one up, you know?
Nate: Like, where where is the, like, active... Like, where where are we being active to try and get players that we're producing in this country to a better place? Like, because i can't lie, I was so disappointed seeing Festi go to Turkey.
Nate: To me, that's a step back. What...
Conor Glennon: And we said it at the time, like i mean I don't know what his agent's getting in terms of a fee, but the thinking behind that is beyond me. ah it like I just do not understand it both for his... It's not even financially massive for him. I just don't understand
Killian Ginnity: There's not a whole lot the f FAI or the Irish setup can do about that. Once the bird has flown from the nest, well, they're gen theyre what happens, happens. and and like Say if we want to think Irish-connected clubs that maybe they should be going to Celtic. When's the last time Celtic had an Irish player worth playing?
Killian Ginnity: Or actually give chances to an Irish player? Like Rocco Vata, who finally made made his breakthrough this season and god has got his call-up.
Conor Glennon: Thank you.
Killian Ginnity: languished in the B teams and the U teams of Celtic. So where our leagues aren't at a stage of being able to accommodate players of Festi's calibre. So we can't really complain when they go to maybe teams that we don't necessarily want them to.
Killian Ginnity: But as long as they're playing at a high level and are making enough that keeps them as good as footballers, so I don't care.
Conor Glennon: ah like i mean i just I think for his own growth, you know I think if he was a little bit older, that move is more acceptable. you know it Kind of allah sparte moscow megidi vibes you know like a I just think at the point of his career that he's in right now, I just don't know if it is the move that's most beneficial for him. and and and you know i it I'm almost laughing at myself here that I'm being so pessimistic about an Ireland team that's just won two games in a row. like i I feel like shaking myself, but it just it's so meh.
Conor Glennon: like That's a team we should be beating, you know?
Nate: Yeah, I think personally, it's one thing I'm going to realise is in Irish football, there is like a conflict of interest. It's like you either want to see the League of Ireland do well or you want to see the international team do well.
Nate: Because, yeah, we want to see all these good players playing in the League of Ireland. But the the reality of the fact is there should be European setups, like set up in Ireland now to get these players out at a young age is to into top tier training facilities because that's what's needed to to compete in the international stage.
Nate: And they're just not getting that. We've got Mason Media waiting until he's 18 to go over to the Premier League. Like, as good as Mason is, and he's a top player, and he broke that record last night, is 18 might be a bit too late.
Nate: Like, that that that's the reality. He's going to be going in against players that have been in that set-up since they're 14. Like, I just,
Conor Glennon: you look at You look at guys like Trent who've been at Liverpool for 20 years, like I know we'll touch on him later on, but you know we can't replicate that.
Nate: i
Nate: like the
Killian Ginnity: Thank you.
Nate: did our players in the League of Ireland need to be going out to your Romas to whatever league it is in Europe at a really young age like that
Conor Glennon: even but even But that's where your turkeys I'm fine with. If they get out there sooner, you know even if they send them up to mold, you know what I mean? like like ah Get them out just into European systems.
Conor Glennon: i don't ah And I know this is going to drive people mad, making it sound like, yeah, it's going to make them say, oh, you don't give a crap about the League of Ireland.
Nate: it's going to wind up the League of Ireland fans
Conor Glennon: You just want everyone gone. I don't. I just want what's best. like What's going to bring more investment to the League of Ireland if we have better international players? And yes, we'll lose some generational talents that could have ripped it up in the League of Ireland. But if that helps Irish football as a whole over a longer period of time, I'm here for that.
Killian Ginnity: But how do you that? We don't have an FAI that is kind we don't have an f fa that is kind of um in situ long enough or ah stable enough at the minute to go out to the likes of these other FAs, be it like the the governing body of France or Germany or Spain, to be able to kind of go, hey, let's make build bridges.
Killian Ginnity: Well, we've seen as of recently that they might not be there for in the year or two that might actually take.
Nate: I...
Killian Ginnity: So are you dependent on I don't know, Irish ambassadors, it depended on some Irish millionaires or billionaires trying to invest in clubs. Like the fact that Jake O'Brien was so good over in Lyon, that should be an enough.
Killian Ginnity: And if the teams aren't calling, well, then maybe the league just isn't there yet. And we just have to wait another couple of years.
Nate: i
Conor Glennon: i i' I'm sorry to hop across, you know, but just the thing for me is I don't ah don't care if the if the C-suite people aren't going to be there in two years' time. Like, do it now.
Conor Glennon: It can be something that the next guy picks up the next girl picks up. You know, it's it's just because the the state of our... you know organization as an f FAI seems to be short-term a lot of the time.
Conor Glennon: doesn't mean we can't plan long-term. We just have to make that handover when it inevitably happens as seamless as it can be. And we have to, have to, have to have those conversations.
Conor Glennon: Almost like clubs have feeder clubs all over Europe, we need to start doing that.
Nate: if If I was the FAI president right now, I'd be going out to your Bayern Munich, whoever it is, whatever top tier academies are out in Europe and trying to strike up deals with them. I'd be like, get your scouts over here when these players are young.
Nate: You get first dibs on them. Like literally, you get first dibs on whoever whoever you want. That's how I would do it. is You get these scouts over, you facilitate them and you get these stars like discovered at a really young age.
Conor Glennon: and but they'll tell To be fair to them, playing devil's advocate here, they'll argue, well, we have the milk cup, that's what it's for. you know Our domestic talent is seen by international teams. You know you get the likes of Barcelona, your Inter Milan, multiple clubs in every league coming over to play in that, and they'll say that's doing their job, and you know it's up to the players from there. But it's...
Conor Glennon: yeah
Nate: hey That's working out well for them, isn't
Killian Ginnity: two Two things on that, though, like we don't have an FAI board that has the clout to get the meetings right now. Yeah, we might get some, we might get beyond the UEFA boards or get in them kind of ones.
Conor Glennon: no no
Nate: ah
Killian Ginnity: We're not there where that we can just not rock up to Bayern Munich and kind of go here, like here let's let's set up feeder system.
Nate: it?
Killian Ginnity: And two, there's the other other risk, which is if we send these guys over young and they're good enough, well, then maybe they'll start playing for Germany or for Spain when if they get the chance.
Nate: I think if you...
Killian Ginnity: We're already seeing it with Paul Niebel, who is like the breakout in the Bundesliga. He is going to get... He's playing for the Germany under-21s. We've seen it with Anil Simo Garcia-McNolte.
Killian Ginnity: and we've We've seen it with um john John Patrick Finn. Like... he He played underage for Spain, I think, at one stage and when he was coming through Barcelona. Like, there is a give and take when it comes to these kind of ideas.
Nate: But what's what's the alternative? like is it just, you know, we've got to stay in situ and just wait and for for like a crop of players that are good enough to make it at the later stage? like i don I don't see what the other option is.
Killian Ginnity: I'm not not saying that you you don't do a form of it, but we just have to be willing and ah knowledgeable enough to go into this with your eyes open, kind of going, there is a trade-off here. We may be happy with this, but we may not be happy with that. And if we are going to open these a tracks to getting these transfers, I think we should still implement the 18 rule because that's how we're going to lift the league.
Killian Ginnity: Yeah.
Conor Glennon: The Brexit rule, you mean?
Killian Ginnity: Kind of, yeah. Like to try and at least keep the youngsters in the league for as long as possible, because if they're talented enough, our league isn't there to accommodate them. But if we can at least have the league at a level that can push other young players to come through where they might go, oh, hey, its we're strong enough to be here.
Killian Ginnity: That will raise the overall standard league rather than just finding another way for them to leave us younger.
Conor Glennon: Speaking of players who've moved abroad and in that kind of generational talent, though, we've been talking about, and i I don't want to say that, ah generational talent, for whom about to say, is probably a bit too much.
Killian Ginnity: We're not talking about Pele, but like, doing well.
Conor Glennon: But yeah but for for our standards, I don't know, did you guys see the the comments from Eamon Dunphy on Finnazzas?
Killian Ginnity: no
Conor Glennon: So, like, he he basically said, he came out and said, and I'm kind of paraphrasing here, but he said, there's a media love in around Finizaz.
Nate: The
Conor Glennon: I'm not buying into it. He's overhyped. And I don't know if that's just Eamon trying to get some headlines and stay relevant, but I, you know, I saw a clip going around from one of the news stations that he's not overhyped. He's not even hyped right now. You know, like, we we haven't seen him enough to be in that position. And, like, I don't understand why someone like Eamon comes out And just throws that around.
Conor Glennon: like why like you know
Nate: i
Conor Glennon: From the press, we're seeing that the the likes of Crystal Palace are now looking at Finozac to bring him in. like should Should we not be helping him secure those moves and the as national press? you know national press
Nate: I mean, it depends how you take his comments. Do you take it as a jab at him or do you take it as a literal fact that for where Finnazzas currently is and what he's done, is he not considered overhyped to a certain extent?
Nate: Because like the media haven't stopped talking about him in the last two weeks.
Conor Glennon: He can't control that, though. That's the thing, you know.
Nate: No, no, no, but but that's what i mean. Do you see Eamon Dunphy's comment as an attack at Finnazaz, or do you see it as...
Conor Glennon: ah yeah i it It's funny you say that, because i didn't really think of it like that. like the way ah The way I read it was was he's going down the Ronaldo's a card kind of vibe.
Killian Ginnity: Eamon likes to be a contrarian.
Nate: Where I saw a bit as, like, we are overhyping him, like, hold the horses, like, let's not get too, know, over the top.
Conor Glennon: And let's call a spade a spade. weveve We've done it plenty of time before, so he he does have the ammo to bring out five, six, seven players that we've done this before. But it's in it's interesting interesting you frame it like that. I really didn't think of it like that.
Killian Ginnity: Well, the other thing with Finn is, like, he had a good international break. Like, I wouldn't say he's arrived, but he he's
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: proven worthy of of being in contention.
Conor Glennon: Well, I put it this way.
Killian Ginnity: He's had a decent season with Middlesbrough.
Conor Glennon: He's put his name in the next team sheet for sure. Absolutely. Absolutely.
Killian Ginnity: So like, I wouldn't get behind any kind of hype train, but I think we need to kind of, like, you don't have to be comparing him to Messi or a ball of shit.
Killian Ginnity: There is an in-between kind of recognizing something good and kind of going, okay,
Conor Glennon: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Killian Ginnity: He hasn't arrived yet, but he's pretty, pretty damn good. um And I think that's a nice, healthy place to be. Like, he's not the only player breaking through. What did you think of Rocco Vata? i don't I don't know if it's enough to kind of justify a next call up if the team for the club form isn't there, but it was good to see him get the breakthrough.
Conor Glennon: Yeah, I think you're completely right. like i mean it's it's it's There's not enough evidence to go off, but I think he performed well. I'll put it this way. There's nothing putting him straight in that next team, but there's nothing also not.
Conor Glennon: yeah There's nothing going, oh God, we can't put him in the next one. it was He performed at the level that was expected, and I hope he gets more opportunities.
Nate: Oh, by the way, just a quick one. Why did Jake O'Brien not start that first game in Bulgaria?
Killian Ginnity: ridiculous.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Nate: Like, what the
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: Like, the lad has made his name this season, reinvented himself as a massive right back. Why not just do that? No, give it to Matt Doherty.
Nate: It's actually hilarious. Like, how like he does did he not start that game? I have no idea.
Conor Glennon: But these are the kind of things that when, you know, going back to the top of the show and when you're saying, you know, where do we stand on Heimer? When you're making decisions like that, it's hard to fall in behind his way.
Conor Glennon: You know, it's it's kind like, it's so, it's painfully obvious, like,
Killian Ginnity: But I know he got his goal in this position, um but it kind of did worry me seeing him move Matt Doherty to left back and Matt Doherty doing okay at left back for the first game because I was a bit like, is this what we're going to see now going forward instead of just like...
Conor Glennon: i'm not I'm not trying to say a game in Dunphy, but like a broken clock is right twice. like That's all this was. He was in the right place the right time and managed to deliver. And yes, did we need it? Absolutely. But like that's not going to happen again and again.
Killian Ginnity: See, my... My worry is more so that like they get complacent. kindny on Oh, well, if Brady's not there, well, we'll just stick in Matt again. And suddenly Matt Doherty's getting a call up instead of chasing the likes of a Dennis Sirkin, which I've never brought up before, or bringing through like maybe like a Theo Ademola who came through a palace.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: Like kind of given, like do you get complacent and given these chances or chasing these players that we should be chasing?
Nate: Thank you.
Conor Glennon: Well, historically historically, Ireland, that's what they do. you know like we We go to what we know. We pick the old boys club. We don't venture outside into the unknown. and i Look, a lot of the old guard are still there.
Conor Glennon: you know Like we said, is it poor though is it a poor decision that John O'Shea is still in the system? Because that is how that can happen. Because, you know let's say, Heimer's not used to having Daugherty... for years John O'Shea is and i look I'm not I'm not trying to be some Cristobal Mystic Mac but like I it wouldn't surprise me if we see Matt Doherty consistently in an orange jersey jersey going forward
Nate: I did find it weird that we switched from a one-striker system to a two-striker system from game to game.
Killian Ginnity: you
Nate: Like, that to me was weird. Like, surely he ought to have...
Conor Glennon: is he just is he just testing things
Nate: Yeah, but like, are we past his point to test him? Like, surely he knows what he wants to do with this team. You know what I mean?
Conor Glennon: Yeah, like i mean i do think that you know looking ah the resources that we have, you know, it was great to see Ferguson get a goal again. He played, he played well. I think his interview was strong afterwards. He acknowledged where we are, you know, Troy Parrott was, I don't want to run in the show, but you know what i mean? he He was comfortable. he was playing a lot of the games, was channel or large a lot of our football was channeling through him. You know, we've got good options so up top and I understand in ways that,
Conor Glennon: he he probably doesn't know himself what works best, you know?
Nate: I was really impressed with Parrott over both games.
Killian Ginnity: yeah
Nate: I think he's had some turnaround this season.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Nate: and I think the way I read the two strikers in the second game, i I think it was a way to fit in Ferguson. I really do.
Conor Glennon: Well, probably. Yeah, and like we've said it before, you know, that Ferguson is the bums on seats guy.
Nate: I think...
Conor Glennon: He is what's bringing people into the stadium.
Nate: I think on form, you go Parrott every day the week right now. Like, genuinely.
Killian Ginnity: The only thing is with the two up top is at least as a plan B. Like I was happy to see another formation being tested out.
Conor Glennon: Is it though? but like Or is it Needs Most?
Killian Ginnity: I don't know. Like, I was... i was ah to I was just happy that it wasn't the one formation every time trying to square players into round holes and, like, not making it work. At least he adapted to what was available to him. And, yeah, maybe it was trying to squeeze in Ferguson.
Killian Ginnity: Worked.
Conor Glennon: ah I don't know about you.
Killian Ginnity: So...
Conor Glennon: like ah For me, you know I think to cap off all of the this international break, the standout player in that team across the two games was parrot for me. i think it's pretty If you were to kind of give a man of the international break from an arm perspective, it's hard to see past them.
Nate: Surely he's on the move this summer again.
Conor Glennon: Well, what's his contract like? easy like I know he was...
Nate: I'm not sure, but his numbers this year are really impressive.
Killian Ginnity: He's only there.
Nate: Like, his his numbers are so impressive this season.
Killian Ginnity: But yeah, no, like he, I, I, I,
Nate: And I know you can go Eredivisie this and Eredivisie that, but, you know, he's he's performing in a and what I would consider an upper echelon European League.
Conor Glennon: Still a hard league.
Nate: So, to me, like, I reckon he's going to have Serie A clubs looking at least.
Conor Glennon: Yeah, i would say so.
Killian Ginnity: and i know I know what you're saying about the Eredivisie, but like if he was getting these numbers in the championship, we'd all be losing our shit. So ah absolutely, ah like it's it's definitely worth um something. I just hope he doesn't fall into the trap of going back to England.
Killian Ginnity: Stay on the continent.
Conor Glennon: Yeah, stay away. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Killian Ginnity: like
Conor Glennon: I mean, it'll be hard.
Killian Ginnity: As you say, go to Serie A, go to Liga, go to La Liga, go to somewhere where...
Conor Glennon: The money will talk and in in in the UK. That's the problem. That's his best chance at ah getting a big bag.
Nate: The thing is...
Conor Glennon: But like i think you just I think you're completely right. like Look, it he knows he's going to get selected for Ireland as long as he's performing well. So he doesn't have to be in the UK.
Killian Ginnity: Well, this was what I was impressed with him afterwards was the like fact that he acknowledged that he's playing well, playing confidently, and what that's done to his game.
Conor Glennon: And he has to remember that, you know?
Killian Ginnity: and i And I think i think he would i think because he had he had the hype train when Mourinho was there and hyping him up, and it was like, oh, what's going to be?
Conor Glennon: Hmm.
Killian Ginnity: And then he was the failed wonder kid. I think he... you would at least hope has the appreciation of kind of going, listen, just go and play where your game is going to be best rather than trying to get to the shiny lights.
Conor Glennon: that should That shows such fortitude, though. you know like ah And there's mental resilience that he's shown there. like ah Aside from the numbers that he's putting up, to, let's face it, 50-50, that could have ended his career, both from an optics perspective and his own head.
Killian Ginnity: Look at Aaron Connolly.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: Aaron Connolly is as like, he's now somebody that should go abroad and do a Troy Parrot on it.
Conor Glennon: Yeah. Yeah. yeah
Nate: To be honest, like I don't see many clubs that will even... like I think it'll be hard to tempt him away unless like it's a top Serie A club, to be honest. purity just He's in the Air Divisies competing for titles.
Nate: Let's have it. He's second in the league.
Conor Glennon: do we do do we Do we think he, like, i don't want to insult him, but can he perform at that level of a top Serie A club?
Nate: Playing European football.
Nate: I mean, like, he's scoring goals on European level, like, do you know what mean? He's giving Ajax a run for the money for the league, like, and it's not like he's just in that PSV squad, he's the main man, pretty much.
Nate: So, to me, like...
Killian Ginnity: I think the fact that European leagues are not quite as physical allows him to play his game. And I don't know, Nate, is there any league that would muscle him out? I don't think so.
Killian Ginnity: Other than like England, Scotland.
Nate: Oh, yeah...
Nate: Yeah, maybe, possibly. Like, I don't know. what what do you think a Celtic could tempt
Conor Glennon: I was just about to say i hope he stays away from the UK. Because I think Celtic's too safe. And i I think also being Irish, there comes a lot of pressure with that, that he doesn't need.
Killian Ginnity: but Well, look at Ida. Celtic, yeah, he's gotten some form, but it hasn't remade his career.
Nate: the
Nate: I think we were all a bit iffy about that move, though.
Conor Glennon: he he also he He also played decently, but...
Nate: I think we were all a bit iffy about the Ida move, like, You know, he's he's a good player. Is he a main man type player? I don't think so.
Killian Ginnity: Well, see, that's that's the worry. is like If you can't be the main man at Celtic... you can't be the main man anywhere. Because like it's not like it's the highest level of football um in terms of international stage.
Killian Ginnity: So you're not going to stake your claim to get over Evan Ferguson, who, regardless of form, is a Premier League level player. To try and get around him, it's not going to do you any favours.
Killian Ginnity: Banging in 20 goals a season in any upper league in Europe will. It will put you in contention for that. um And if Jemir does what I am hoping, praying for, i have a voodoo doll of him doing, is looking for that granny rural market, it's going to do you no favours.
Killian Ginnity: If you do get like ah a Nebel, who I know is attacking midfielder, who is performing at the upper end of the Bundesliga, it's suddenly, you fall down the ranks.
Nate: The thing rule thing, though, is like you can look at the market once and then for years and years it's not going to change. So, like, either go and get these players or you don't.
Nate: You know what mean? Like, go speak to them now. Like, it's not like something new players are just going to magic out of nowhere. You know what I mean?
Killian Ginnity: Oh yeah, 100%. But like, there is one you can get a little bit later, like look at Smoddocks. Sometimes the form will just hit and you get get a player like that in. and Sometimes just down to ah like the manager that's in it, like Stephen Kenny came in saying League of Ireland, League of Ireland and didn't really do that.
Killian Ginnity: Then there's the other thing as well. ah Look at Stephen Kenny with Casey McAteer. none of us saw that coming and then suddenly he was here and he's one of our guys so you would hope that there's things happening behind the scenes
Nate: Yeah, I just think Home Run.
Conor Glennon: do do do do any of you two just before we go on like obviously we're not winning we're not getting first place in that group for the world cup but do you think we ah even have a chance at coming second and getting into a playoff based on what you've seen i'm like i am the exact same so you're saying there's a chance
Nate: No, not a chance.
Killian Ginnity: I think there's a chance, but I don't think it'll be...
Nate: Hungary will batter us and there's a chance that Armenia even beat us.
Killian Ginnity: Yeah, like...
Nate: like you know what i mean?
Conor Glennon: I'm calling it now we get a draw against Portugal.
Nate: Like lads, we have to be here now literally going like any club in the world or like any nation in the world can generally be outside a game of football. Like I'm not even realising San Marino to make a win.
Conor Glennon: yeah
Nate: i'm like
Killian Ginnity: and
Nate: i'm not I'm not saying that for of like to be funny. It's like that's what these players are. They're so hit and miss that, you know, if you go over on the wrong day to San Marino, they might turn you over.
Killian Ginnity: Hungary lost 6-1 on aggregate to Turkey. So...
Conor Glennon: We'd lose by more.
Killian Ginnity: No, I don't think so. ah But I yeah i hate i think the thing with Turkey is they have...
Nate: Ah.
Killian Ginnity: ah Wait, Hungary, I should say, is um they have a loss in them. Like, it's not like a Portugal where you're kind of going, oh we might...
Conor Glennon: but we Well, we like we should beat... Well, actually, no, we shouldn't. That's just me being...
Killian Ginnity: No, no, but i think they're they're the kind of team that we can ground ground out a draw or two in. And I think on goal difference, we might be competitive, which is a horrible position to be in, but where where we might just eek through.
Killian Ginnity: um There is a playoff position though, isn't there?
Conor Glennon: yeah that's and that's what i'm saying do you think we have a do you think we have a chance at that if we finish second yeah second place gets a playoff
Killian Ginnity: but like
Nate: Second place.
Killian Ginnity: So like, I think, yeah, I think it'll be ugly.
Conor Glennon: that has to be our goal you know
Killian Ginnity: yeah Yeah, being realistic. And I think getting a goal difference one. So if we can kind of shore up the defense a little bit more than it is right now, i e get rid of 33-year-old Matt Messi, we might be able to shore
Nate: And starting a Premier League right back.
Killian Ginnity: ah And if we can just move on from that, shore up our defense, keep the scorters low, we might eek through on goal difference. so
Conor Glennon: We're mine can hope.
Killian Ginnity: I don't know.
Nate: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: A man can hope. when when When they're conceding six goals to Turkey, they they might concede six to Portugal.
Nate: yeah We can hope and pray.
Killian Ginnity: And if we can keep the ah scores down, we might just eke our way through.
Conor Glennon: Supporting Ireland is honestly like supporting Newcastle not too long ago, where you go into every single game going, we could win, we could lose 6-0. I don't know.
Killian Ginnity: So it's like supporting Man United now.
Conor Glennon: Nice. you did i You volleyball punched that perfectly.
Nate: That's it.
Conor Glennon: I teed it up.
Nate: The youth go into games with Ireland going, we can win.
Conor Glennon: I knew you'd see it.
Nate: I'm not there. i can assure you that.
Killian Ginnity: Ah, young man, you need a little bit more hope. But one one man who has been hoping since he was a young man has been Trent Alexander-Arnold. And, gentlemen, it seems that he has finally gotten his move.
Killian Ginnity: Conor, Madrid is calling.
Conor Glennon: Yep, 220 grand a week, five-year deal. you know i've I've been saying this for as long as these rumours have been going.
Killian Ginnity: Will he still be number 66?
Conor Glennon: i Who knows? um you know I've been saying this for as long as these rumours have been around. and For me, i think it's ah it's I understand the move. um you know He's been at Liverpool for 20 years and he's 26.
Conor Glennon: twenty six He's won everything you can win. um i know the locals aren't going to like it. ah you know They're going to look at the likes. Compare him to Gerrard. Say he's a turncoat.
Conor Glennon: I totally understand it. i you know I think if Klopp was still there, he may have carried on for another year, but I think regardless, he was going to move. I think it's also beneficial for the England team. You look at the likes of of Bellingham going into that England team. you know Plenty of players have said when you walk in, having come off the plane, been in a Madrid training centre, there's respect there. It elevates the group. It elevates not just the players, the coaching staff, and it gives and so excitement to the fans. Financially, look, it doesn't Madrid isn't going to do anything for him that another club couldn't do but i I think it's a great move for him um and I think it's a great move for the national team
Killian Ginnity: What was your thoughts and reactions, Nate?
Nate: I was just on Twitter laughing at all the Liverpool fans having meltdowns. It was actually quite quite an amusing day, I must say. Yeah, i I'd be annoyed if I was a Liverpool fan.
Nate: I'd be like, how do we do it?
Conor Glennon: but would you get it though like I know you'd be annoyed but would you get it
Nate: um no not really um i'd be annoyed that the club let his contract run down personally like you know what i mean like if we're speaking about trends maybe not this season but of seasons of late like we're talking ah an 80 90 million pound player going out the door for free so of course i'd be livid about that um
Conor Glennon: Well, yeah, that's a whole other thing, yeah.
Nate: ah Do I think currently they're going to have a huge hole to fill? No. think Connor Bradley can step up now.
Conor Glennon: I wonder who comes in to support him, though.
Nate: a
Conor Glennon: You know, because the because when you when you look at the Trent-sized hole that was left at Wembley, you know, arguably no Trent, no Bradley cost them the Carabao Cup.
Nate: Probably just some another youth player, to be honest. like
Conor Glennon: And I'm not just bringing that up to bring up the fact that Newcastle won it, but like I think we we kind of saw what could happen if, you know, Trent goes and Bradley gets injured.
Nate: Yeah, like I think the big thing is like how can Bradley push on from this now? like It's all well and good being the second player in the list and like you know coming in and taking your chances, but when you're relied when you're relied on for 45 games a season, it becomes it becomes a bit different.
Conor Glennon: Being the number one different gravy.
Nate: and Listen, I think Bradley has the quality. I think the big thing, though, is... like just making sure he pushes on. But...
Conor Glennon: you think you can push her on, Killian?
Nate: for
Killian Ginnity: I think he can. i I'd just be worried about putting so much pressure and forcing him to go through as many games at that age. Like we've seen so many players start that young, become first teamers and peter out early.
Killian Ginnity: um i think there's kind of been a, in the last couple of years, some of the bigger teams, just not quite the duty of care for the longer term career with these players. And that maybe that's just down to how they're playing.
Killian Ginnity: like they're a lot more Some those players are lot more physical than they used to be, ah like sprint-wise and all that kind of stuff. But I think he could do it. i think I think the move is bad for Trent.
Conor Glennon: Bye.
Killian Ginnity: i think if you look at it as a kind of a like-for-like comparison, um defenders that should or did play as attacking midfielders as well with... where so ah David Alaba.
Killian Ginnity: Alaba went from being a player you talked about at Bayern to being another player. And Trent is going to be the same. Now, you might say that it's going to cover up some of his defensive ah lack of capabilities um on a weekly basis because it might be four or five games in the La Liga season and where it's going to really challenge him.
Killian Ginnity: But where he will be nailed to the cross on that is in the Champions League quarter semis and finals which Madrid will be getting to and ah he's not Danny Carvajal he's not going to have that local connection for them to kind of give him the time one or two reasonable mistakes at that level suddenly your stock goes down and you're not going to have that kind of boyhood connection to be able to say oh well he's one of ours like I think he really needs to look at Michael Owen and kind of going oh he followed that track yeah for different reasons it kind of went off but there's now no affiliation same as Steve McManaman like these are players have done the exact same thing and the club do not have that same ah affinity for and he's just given it up for what a couple of trophies
Nate: Yeah.
Conor Glennon: kind Can we all appreciate how exciting it is that we will hear him try speak Spanish?
Nate: I...
Conor Glennon: It will be fantastic. The clips will be golden.
Killian Ginnity: It's just this.
Nate: Like, if if I put myself in issues, I don't really understand the move. Clearly...
Conor Glennon: i I just think it's so, i'm I'm so on the other side of this, boys.
Nate: here the
Nate: i Yeah, maybe, but put it in your shoes. You're fan. Say you're from Newcastle. You come through Newcastle. You win so many trophies.
Nate: You're still young. You have a real chance to cement yourself as an upper echelon club legend. Literally.
Conor Glennon: But if you if if if you also think about it, though, from the like there's probably three clubs in the world you can't really say no to, of which Madrid is firmly one of them.
Killian Ginnity: Thank you.
Conor Glennon: you know That experience, you know how many players do you hear ex-players say their biggest regret in their career is not going abroad? Just to test themselves.
Killian Ginnity: I think that was also different though when the money was different. Like when you were coming from a stage of all you had after your career was memories.
Conor Glennon: Yeah, you want better memories.
Killian Ginnity: I get it.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: Yeah, but like when you are a local player with your local team that you've been with for 20 years, winning a Premier League with them for the first time in their history.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Conor Glennon: Probably second time though now. Like, I mean, you know, and he's he's won the Champions League with them.
Killian Ginnity: See, this the thing.
Conor Glennon: He's won everything. Like, what else is there to do? Like, you're just repeating it yourself.
Killian Ginnity: to bring your club through that transitionary period. Like for him to ah stick with the club now when arguably it could have went either way. And if he stayed on with them, it would absolutely cement him.
Killian Ginnity: And the thing is realistically, he he stayed two or three more years and got another title or two, absolutely cemented. And then he's 30 and then he'd still be getting the move.
Conor Glennon: See, I don't think Liverpool fans work like that. Like, I get your logic, and I think any, or not any other club, but many other clubs, that would be the case. But Liverpool fans are different, man. You leave at all, they're like, okay, you're dead to us.
Conor Glennon: Whenever.
Killian Ginnity: ah the didn but They didn't with Gerard, and Gerard left for LA Galaxy.
Conor Glennon: I think that was, that's different, you know.
Nate: Yeah, well, that's different. That's a 35-year-old Gerrard leaving for the MLS, you know what I mean?
Killian Ginnity: But like, there was also... Okay, like, take Torres. There wasn't the same kind of ah lack of love after he left. Robbie Fowler, there wasn't that same lack of love after he left.
Nate: i
Killian Ginnity: Pepe Reina, no lack of love after he left.
Nate: I think...
Conor Glennon: It's dwindled though.
Nate: taking The thing, specifically with Torres, though, I think it's because he went on and done so bad.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Nate: think that plays a big part into it. I think if he went on...
Killian Ginnity: But or soa Suarez, it was Suarez, Coutinho. We can go through a a load of players.
Nate: Yeah, but the thing is...
Killian Ginnity: Mascherano, Alonso.
Nate: The thing is, Trent's now going to a team that's realistically going to be trying to knock his boyhood globe out competitions. you knows I can see it becoming very toxic very quickly and in in the way of how Liverpool fans see him.
Nate: you know there' They're two teams that always go deep in the Champions League, so they're going to meet each other.
Conor Glennon: but the way But we are approaching this, boys, as like, you know, with the way we're talking about what the Liverpool fans expect, this isn't the GAA.
Nate: you know what mean?
Conor Glennon: you You know, you shouldn't just have to play for the parish that you happen to be born in, you know?
Nate: See, I i think, i like, I personally think when I weigh it up is, like, how I felt about Rashford is, like, it's this it's a scouts lad playing for Liverpool who grew up idolising Liverpool.
Nate: Has come through at the age, like, he was, what, was 20 when he hit the hit the heights or whatever? It's, like, that's the ultimate story for, like, Liverpool fans, you know what I mean?
Killian Ginnity: like the way I think a really kind of good like for like comparison now would be, say, like, Kobe Maynou. In a couple of years' time, getting Man United back to winning Premier Leagues and Champions Leagues.
Killian Ginnity: And then before 30, at the height of his game, when he should be pushing on and keeping United at the top, moving off to Barcelona. You'd have a bit of a bitterness to it. And what are you giving it up for?
Conor Glennon: But i think in today's I think in today's football, though, like the one-man clubs, it's even rarer now than than it was before.
Killian Ginnity: To be another player?
Conor Glennon: And it was rarefied air back then.
Nate: but
Killian Ginnity: but but But it should be even easier now when the money is so egalitarian across the big leagues.
Conor Glennon: But I...
Nate: Yeah, and and these are the players that should be the one-man clubs, in my opinion. like like These are the ultimate stories, in my opinion, football. The guys from there, goes, wins the trophy.
Nate: Goes with multiple trophies, takes Liverpool back to the top where they were. You know, the the guy that brought them through leaves, you know, they're about win another league. Like, this is a story. And to me, to see it end quickly, can only relate with how I think the Liverpool fans feel. And it's like, why throw it away go over to Spain?
Nate: so go to spain You know what I mean?
Killian Ginnity: that's That's the big thing. he has He's going to throw away a legacy with Liverpool that would have, for generations, had had his family in high esteem.
Conor Glennon: I don't think he'll care, boys.
Killian Ginnity: Whereas now, now in 10 years' time, he'll be, oh yeah, he was good.
Nate: No, he clearly doesn't care. He clearly doesn't care, but there'll be thousands and thousands of Liverpool.
Conor Glennon: But why should why should he you know? Like, does it matter to him?
Nate: But like when when players get paid so much money, is is the not-next important thing then ah like legacy?
Conor Glennon: like
Nate: is Is that not next? like That's how I personally feel about it.
Conor Glennon: he'd He'll view it, though, he arguably, I'd say... but Look, the the peak of football is the European Cup, you know, the Champions League. I think he looks at that going, my chance of winning multiple Champions Leagues is not in Liverpool.
Conor Glennon: My best chance of doing that is at Real Madrid. And his legacy will be his trophies as opposed to his one-man club.
Nate: the thing at Liverpool, he is the man now when he joins Real Madrid, like, you're joining a sea of talent, like like, I think we've even seen it this year, it's like, Mbappe's gone to Madrid, and I can't lie, it's probably the year that I've heard the least about Mbappe, you know what I mean?
Conor Glennon: Yeah, fair.
Killian Ginnity: on
Nate: Like,
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: The other thing as well with Madrid is there's such a ah like magnifying glass on every player that... Liverpool have been very, very generous to some of the mistakes that Trent has done over the years.
Conor Glennon: Because he's a local boy.
Killian Ginnity: and um
Nate: Oh yeah, yeah, very true.
Killian Ginnity: Exactly. Because it's like, listen, we're just delighted to be here. And we're delighted that you're the one that's there with us. Madrid don't care.
Conor Glennon: Well, their media are no joke.
Killian Ginnity: Madrid too madrid in two years madrid in two years time, if they go, well, you're not good enough, off he goes.
Nate: And...
Nate: Madrid?
Killian Ginnity: And he'll never have that same affinity with Liverpool again.
Conor Glennon: He could go back.
Killian Ginnity: it is such...
Nate: No, it won't be the same.
Killian Ginnity: No, it'll never be the same.
Nate: It but won't be the same.
Killian Ginnity: Never be the same.
Nate: It's been tarnished now. It won't be the same. like he's He's walking tightrope now with that with the Madrid fans. They turn so quickly on you. And if they do, you don't get them back. Look at Garoppel.
Nate: look Look at everything he did for Real Madrid.
Killian Ginnity: Yeah.
Conor Glennon: Well, let's be fair to bro to the fact that he he took the pace a little bit.
Nate: No, no, no. the he tried He tried to get them back and then he said, fuck it. But...
Killian Ginnity: yeah Scoring an overhead kick in the Champions League final.
Nate: He never got it back.
Killian Ginnity: Three Champions League in a row.
Nate: He never got it back. And that's the thing now is he like he's generally could throw it all away, in my opinion, in terms of legacy.
Killian Ginnity: You're dead right, Nate. Dead right. Nate, before we finish up, I have to ask you about the news that came true about Jadon Sancho. ah Apparently, he... You can't pay anybody to take him.
Conor Glennon: for For context, that you know he has an obligation to buy a clause of £25 million, pounds but Chelsea can back out of that if they pay but and United £5 million. £25 the £5? mean...
Nate: I thought they are going to pay it though, aren't they? 25.
Conor Glennon: the twenty five or the five
Killian Ginnity: Yeah, that's the...
Conor Glennon: i mean
Killian Ginnity: I'm not sure what that what the money is, but they're paying to give Sancho back.
Conor Glennon: Yeah, it's 5 million to give them back. and twenty five to to So 25 million if they want to keep them in at squad.
Nate: Okay,
Conor Glennon: If they want to go we don't want that smoke. Off you go back to and United. did They still have to pay 5 million quid, which is in incredibly embarrassing for Sancho.
Killian Ginnity: Especially when you consider the wages they're after paying, and I'm sure there was probably a loan fee as well.
Nate: hey
Killian Ginnity: like That's an expensive experiment.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Killian Ginnity: This is Falcao 2.0.
Nate: Hey, we'll take the 5 million, I'll tell you that. But yeah, like, I'm devastated. We're just getting a shite player back, to be honest with you, lads.
Killian Ginnity: I want want to put this to you though, Nate, because I was talking to somebody in work and their suggestion was take the money from Chelsea, fling it at Sancho, just call a deal done, leave our club, just put a book into this bad move, accept the loss and move on.
Killian Ginnity: Would you be happy with that?
Nate: Yeah, but that would that'd be the easy way out. That would be like, oh go run off and find another club.
Conor Glennon: But also, lads, five million is...
Nate: i
Killian Ginnity: What?
Nate: Throw them back in the under-21s.
Conor Glennon: them but Five million's nothing to him. He's on 300 bags a week. like You'd need to be giving him at least payoff a year.
Killian Ginnity: Let's see.
Conor Glennon: He's got two years left of his deal, I think. you'd You'd at least need to pay off give him a year of a payoff to say, look, off you go.
Killian Ginnity: which I still think would be cheap when you consider how much you're getting per week. Even if you were to find a club to take on, which I don't think you would, you would be still paying a significant portion of his wages anyway.
Conor Glennon: At least thirty forty percent yeah.
Killian Ginnity: So just, it'd be a real statement of of intent from Radcliffe to kind of go, bad deals are bad deals and we're done with them now.
Nate: well
Killian Ginnity: Wipe our hands of the bad deal and move on.
Nate: I can tell you now he's probably going to be one of the biggest downgrade of salaries ever and and when he goes to his next goal but I can tell you that
Killian Ginnity: Oh, yeah.
Conor Glennon: he'll be straight to qatar or saudi he'll keep it that that money will just go up and up
Killian Ginnity: I think one of the worst ones wages wise was probably Jack Rodwell after leaving Sunderland because when he joined Sunderland, he was on, I think, 60 grand a week because he was a city. Bear of mind, this is like 2012, 2013.
Killian Ginnity: two thousand twelve to thirteen but We're still a reasonable amount of money.
Conor Glennon: a lot of money back then yeah a lot of money now jesus yeah
Killian Ginnity: um but Sunderland and their genius never put a relegation clause in his ah contract which is why during Sunderland until I died there was such a big thing about getting him gone and trying to kick him out the club and he just held in there held in there because he knew he wouldn't get the money again
Conor Glennon: Oh, Jesus.
Conor Glennon: Yeah.
Conor Glennon: Well, aren you would too. I don't knock that, you know.
Killian Ginnity: and he ended up having a short stint at Blackburn and now he's over in Australia and Australia have ah wage caps so ah that that would sting a bit like a Winston Bogart at Chelsea years ago i'm sure I'm sure he did but gentlemen we have made our episode we are there I'd like to thank Conor Glennon and Nathan Byrne as always
Nate: Hey. He made his money. He made his money.
Conor Glennon: Thank you, good sir.
Nate: Thank you.
Killian Ginnity: oh And we'll chat to you next week.
Conor Glennon: Bye-bye.
