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Extended Clip - Thomas Zilliacus: "Man Utd Still In Glazers Hands But Sir Jim Ratcliffe Actually Understands Football" (Ep. 412)
1.1k Plays2 years ago
After his failed bids to buy Manchester United and Inter Milan, Thomas Zilliacus shares his thoughts on the new Man Utd minority shareholder Sir Jim Ratcliffe as well as hits back at some in the media whom he believes have smeared him.
This is an extended clip from this week's extra free interview episode of The Italian Football Podcast. The full interview is available for free in full on Spotify, Apple Podcasts and Google podcasts.
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Transcript
00:00:02
Speaker
Welcome
Introduction and Welcome
00:00:03
Speaker
to the Italian football podcast.
Entry into Manchester United Bid
00:00:05
Speaker
How close were you to actually buying Manchester United? I wasn't very close simply because I came into the race so late that the rain group, the bank that was conducting the sale on behalf of the Glazers, apparently felt that there was no point in
Challenges in the Bidding Process
00:00:27
Speaker
in putting me on the same starting line as the other two main bidders, so Jim Ratcliffe and Sheikh Yazim. So I was never given access to the data room and I put in a framework bid and I said to Rain, I would like to proceed to get access to the data room so I can put in a much more detailed, exact bid.
00:00:51
Speaker
I wasn't given the access to the data room and as a result of that my bid was on a very general basis and as you know, I then withdrew in April when in my opinion the whole process became a bit of a farce where bidders were asked to just
00:01:10
Speaker
put in new bids, put in new bids all the time. And I said, look, I have put in a bid. I have asked for access to the data room. I haven't been given it. So if that is the case, then I will not proceed with yet another bid.
00:01:23
Speaker
I understand.
Current Ownership and Influence
00:01:26
Speaker
So you kind of answered my second question about why you pulled out of the race. However, I want to look a little bit forward now. Do you think Man United are now in good hands under the new part owner, Sir Jim Ratcliffe? And what's your perception on that entire takeover?
00:01:43
Speaker
Yeah. Well, it's a very good question because when you say, are they now in good hands, I would argue that they are still in the same hands, which is the glazers. They still own 75%. And so Jim Ratcliffe has 25%.
00:01:57
Speaker
My understanding is from what I have been reading in the media that he has been given, if not full authority, but at least the main authority as comes to the footballing side of things in running the team. That, I think, is positive news. He is, as far as I understand, a lifelong fan of the club.
00:02:18
Speaker
He lives in England, he understands football. So his ability to build the club and to help the club and to help in a way that the fans like is of course far superior to the Glazers who apparently never really took any big interest in the club and its well-being and just saw it as a very lucrative financial investment.
Interest in Football Investments
00:02:44
Speaker
Yeah, yeah.
00:02:45
Speaker
Other than Man United and Inter, have there been any other clubs who you've thought about buying in recent years and are you comfortable mentioning them by name and how far have you gone in those talks?
00:03:02
Speaker
Well, I've been contacted by a large number of clubs who have said, look, why don't you buy this club? Instead, it's a lot cheaper than Manchester United or Inter Milan, and it has a lot of potential. And my answer to all of these have been, thank you very much for contacting me.
00:03:17
Speaker
I'm not interested. The reason is that I am not one of those investors who want to buy a trophy asset, and I call it a trophy asset because a lot of the club owners are very, very wealthy people with, in my understanding, pretty limited understanding of football and backrunning football.
00:03:41
Speaker
It has become almost like a new fashion to buy a football club. It's, you know, on par with, you know, earlier days it was enough to buy a new super yacht or a fancy fleet of sport cars. Now it seems to be almost a fad to own a football club or a sport club.
00:03:58
Speaker
I have zero interest in that. I have been involved in football all my life, so for me, football is a lot of football. It's fascinating, but I don't need a trophy asset. I have been interested to get involved in big clubs simply because one of my companies, Champion Circle, has developed a package or a platform rather
00:04:21
Speaker
with eight different services, all aimed at providing for the fans very attractive services, but also at the same time services that the fans, because of the attractiveness of what they are being offered, will pay for.
00:04:38
Speaker
And we have done some marketing tests with some of the top clubs in the world. I can't tell their names because it's confidential, but some of the top clubs, some of the best names in the world. And we have achieved, with just one of the eight services, a revenue of over US$400 per annum,
00:05:01
Speaker
from those fans who participated and who were willing to pay for the services. So if you calculate it, Manchester United is claimed to have maybe up to a billion fans. So 400 times a billion is 400 billion. Inter Milan has maybe half of that, but that's still 200 billion. So I believe that with the big clubs and with the big global fan base, Champion Circle can generate
Personal Connections to Football Clubs
00:05:29
Speaker
very significant revenues. But that requires that it's a big club with a big global fan base because these global fans cannot go to the games. For them to even if you sit in Shanghai or in Lagos or somewhere, you can't even dream about going to Old Trafford or going to San Siro to see the game.
00:05:52
Speaker
But if we can offer services that enable those global fans to be involved in the club that they love and breathe and live 24-7 in a meaningful way,
00:06:03
Speaker
Then we give them something which they love. And at the same time, we generate significant revenues for the clubs. And that is the background. These are two clubs that I love. Manchester United and Inter. I've loved them since I was a teenager. And I want to participate in building them into the best clubs in the world, which, of course, they are very close to already. But they can become even better. And that is the
Criticism and Media Response
00:06:27
Speaker
background. And that's why I said no to the other clubs. Yeah, that makes sense.
00:06:32
Speaker
I want to talk a little bit about some reports that have been surfaced. We're going to get back to your ideas and what you want to do because they are very interesting and I want to pick your brain a little bit about that. But I want to touch back a little bit on recent reports in mainly British or English speaking mainstream media outlets who've reported you in a way that you're not very comfortable with.
00:06:57
Speaker
Has there been a particular report that you felt has been particularly egregious? Do you have any examples of what they said that you feel was not incorrect and that you want to set the record straight?
00:07:13
Speaker
Yeah. Well, look, thank you very much for giving me that opportunity. There is an old proverb, Arab proverb, which is in use in many European countries, which is that, you know, the dogs bark, but the caravan moves on. And that is something which I have gotten used to throughout my life. When you do things that are public, when you do things that are successful, then there's always people who are envious and who are jealous and who want to find
00:07:38
Speaker
also want to criticize even if there is no basis for it. And unfortunately, that has been the case also in my bids for these two clubs. So yes, there have been reports which, in my view, have been, you know,
00:07:53
Speaker
unnecessarily nasty. I have no problem with the journalist who poses critical questions. Actually, I welcome that. I think that's what the journalists should do. But when you make insinuations, when you make claims that simply are not true or are baseless, then I think it is not good journalism anymore.
00:08:13
Speaker
I don't want to go into naming too many, you know, examples, but I can say so much that there was one that perhaps in my view was the most, how should I say, unprofessional is my view on it. And that was an article in The Athletic, which I think it was headlined something like the nobody who bid for Manchester United or whatever. Well, with all due respect, I don't think I'm really a nobody.
00:08:39
Speaker
I might not be well-known to a 20-something-year-old journalist out of the UK, but I think I set my mark in business around the world for the last 40 years. That was an article which was really based on, like I said, insinuations.
00:08:59
Speaker
Things that just borderline to something where you could file a lawsuit for defamation, but not quite, I think, over the line. In any case, I don't want to spend my time on filing lawsuits against journalists who get pleasure from writing these kind of stories.
00:09:19
Speaker
Yeah, they are unnecessary. But life moves on. I think most people, they read it and then they forget about it in a few days. So one shouldn't get hooked up on them too much oneself either.
00:09:35
Speaker
I agree. I think that's a healthy way to look at it. But are there any particular examples that you would like to set the record straight that you feel were mischaracterized, if not defamed you?
Clarification on Financial Intentions
00:09:50
Speaker
Well, I think first of all, one of the things which I have been unhappy with is indeed the insinuations that I have not been serious with these bits.
00:10:01
Speaker
I am dead serious with these bids. But also, because I come from a very different angle than most other bidders, I think that, for example, the saying, oh, how can he bid? He doesn't have ex-billions. Well, I may not have ex-billions, and I actually have been very clear with the fact that when the press has called me a billionaire, I'm not a billionaire, but I have enough assets to be able to build consortiums that can
00:10:31
Speaker
table billions in offers. The world is full of money that is looking for investment opportunities and I have a pretty good track record in building successful businesses. So when I present the case of how I can make a club like Inter Milan or a club like Manchester United very profitable and through that build a club that is the number one club in the world, then investors become interested.
00:11:00
Speaker
And that is different from a multi-billionaire who wants to find a new trophy and therefore is willing to use his own money to buy a club. But like I said earlier, often with not too much understanding about how to run a football club and how to make it profitable. So those are the kind of claims that I don't like. There have, of course, been other things as well, which relating to, for example,
00:11:26
Speaker
the completely absurd stories in public about my challenges in Singapore. They are simply, I mean, absurd is the right word and I'd be happy to tell you a bit more about it if you want. But that's like out of a Kafka book almost, I can't understand it.