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Matt Hranek - The Collector's Collector
2.4k Plays2 years ago
A true renaissance man, Matt Hranek is just THAT guy. His books are on your coffee table, he’s the reason you may love a negroni while holding a tray of your uncooked steaks, he loves a lot of things, and is probably one of the best definitions of what this podcast is all about. From watches, to experiences, his sartorially inclined outfits and friend group, there’s nothing not to dig about this guy.
- Matt's Website - https://www.thewilliambrownproject.com/
- Matt's Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/wmbrownproject/?hl=en
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Transcript
Introduction to the Show and Guest
00:00:00
Speaker
We were in the middle of Scotland, and at one point, there was a group of us that kind of diverted off and spent a couple days in this hotel way, way, way up in the middle of nowhere. And at dinner, we all kind of converged. Dinner was about six of us. And without even discussing it, everyone had put on a tuxedo. What's going on, everybody? And welcome to Collector's Gene Radio. I'm your host, Cameron Steiner, and I'm joined by my co-host and brother, Ryan.
00:00:31
Speaker
This is all about diving into the nuances of collecting and ultimately finding out whether or not our guests have what we like to call the collector's gene. That's right. And as always, please subscribe and leave a review for us. It truly helps. We hope you enjoy the pod. Let's go.
Who is Matt Rannick?
00:00:53
Speaker
All right, so you want to talk about like a true Renaissance man. Matt Rannick is just that guy. His books are on your coffee table. He's the reason you may love a Negroni while holding a tray of your uncooked steaks. He loves a lot of things and is probably one of the best definitions of what this podcast is all about. From watches to experiences, his sartorially inclined outfits and friend group, there's nothing not to dig about this guy.
00:01:22
Speaker
Exactly. I mean, we chat about all those things that you just talked about. We talk about his W.M. Brown brand, tons more, including his new book on the groanies, which if you haven't ordered, you're wasting your time by not. He chats with us also about his very rakish gathering on the Bellman Royal Scotsman, and holy shit did that trip make us envious. There's a lot of talk about, and we will definitely have to bring him back on, but I kind of think it's best that we just let him chat so you can soak it in.
00:01:51
Speaker
This is Matt Rannick for Collectors Gene Radio. All right, Matt, as always, great pleasure to chat with you and thanks for joining us today on Collectors Gene. My pleasure. Sounds like fun.
00:02:05
Speaker
Yeah, so first off, I think I need to thank you for keeping us all sane during the quarantine here between the cocktail recipes and all
What are Matt's quarantine pastimes?
00:02:14
Speaker
the food recipes, the garlic clam bread. I think everything you've put out, we've made. So I can't fit into the tuxedo for my wedding in a couple months here, but let's just say garlic clam bread. That'll do it. That's all you need to hear. Yeah, well, thank you for that.
00:02:35
Speaker
It was a great exercise to occupy myself through that period and as well as putting on at least three kilos. It sounds easier. It sounds better in kilos, doesn't it, rather than like... I'm just going to use measurements that people don't know.
Matt's Influence and Style
00:02:54
Speaker
Yeah, three kilos. That's all I need to take off. No, I mean, to reiterate, Cameron, we're really excited to have you on because when we were chatting about
00:03:05
Speaker
what we wanted this podcast to look like in a sense. You were one of the first people that came to mind because if your books and social media presence are any indication, you are truly the nuanced man.
Why is collecting a thrill for Matt?
00:03:20
Speaker
Oh, come on. I had to pick a lane and I picked one that I felt the most comfortable with. It irritates most of my immediate family, but I appreciate your sentiments.
00:03:34
Speaker
Well, it definitely doesn't irritate us. And I think that there's a lot of categories that we'll chat about today. I mean, everything from cocktails, antiques, watches, and cars, of course, sartorial endeavors, and all these experiences that kind of are the makeup of you, of W.M. Brown Project, of Matt Renwick. But I think before we get started, I mean,
00:03:57
Speaker
I just wanted to establish, do you consider yourself a collector of any of those categories of any sorts, would you say? I have been collecting slash curating, and that's my way of saying I'm not a hoarder.
00:04:16
Speaker
or cultivating or, God, saving things from themselves for years. I always gravitated to the vintage finding, flea market, garage sale world, junk shop, antique shop, flea
The Art of Negotiation and Collecting
00:04:36
Speaker
market. I just always really loved navigating that. It was fun. I like the hunt. I like the bargain.
00:04:43
Speaker
And it just it just came very you know, it was naturally fun for me to do I think first and foremost I think yeah, I think in collecting the hunt for me as well as like that thing that I Don't want to say it gets sometimes underwhelming when you finally get it, but there's something so invigorating about wanting something and the chase of it I don't know if it's a competitive thing with me and
00:05:09
Speaker
But it's hard to describe. I think it taps in also to the kind of male DNA or at least the established DNA of hunter-gatherer provider. You know, that kind of, that hunting instinct is in there. And I think, you know, it at least kind of shaped in a modern world because, you know, we're not running out in...
00:05:34
Speaker
you know, killing, you know, our food with our canines and stuff like that. But, you know, some of us may. But I think that, you know, that's a really terrifically fun part of it. You know, eBay kind of killed a lot of that on some sense, but still even on eBay.
00:05:52
Speaker
it's still a fun, even on the digital formats of shopping, vintage goods and things, it's still fun when you can kind of figure out a way to navigate it and find that thing that nobody else did. So I agree with you on every level. It is about the hunt and that is the fun of it. And then for me, it's like, did I get a deal is the thing that really is the most exciting part. Right. I think I can
00:06:22
Speaker
Ryan and I can relate on this because we grew up in the same household, but we grew up in a household though where it wasn't about pushing somebody to get to a price where they couldn't go home and have bread on the table that night. It wasn't about that. It was about if you don't ask, you don't get.
00:06:41
Speaker
And I think through collecting, I've carried that mentality even on eBay. I mean, the hunt is amazing. But when you find that thing, you're like, holy shit, like this just is what I've been looking for. It just popped up like, what the hell? And you go and message that person. And one of two things happens, right? You get that instant gratification where you get a message right back and they're saying, hey, let's make a deal. Or two, they never answer you. And then it's sold because someone just buys it at that price.
00:07:10
Speaker
Right. I mean, I'll be very honest with you. If somebody doesn't know what they have, I'm not telling them what it is. And that was the kind of unspoken etiquette of the flea market in the garage sale. Like, I don't know, if you got a set of baccarat that you haven't realized this French crystal and you've got like three for $10 on it, I'm going to offer you five. Yeah. And if you go for that, great.
00:07:37
Speaker
I think it's buyer beware on both ends of the spectrum. I don't have a problem of really low balling people and I don't have a problem when I'm selling kind of sticking to my guns. That's the kind of great part of all of this that the digital interface is has.
00:07:52
Speaker
sort of got in the way of the used to be a great communication in the marketplace think about the medina think about. Great trading roots you know it was about the conversation in the dialogue in the communication as much as it was about. Selling stuff and that's what i really love my mom was a great garage sale i found any great haggler.
00:08:17
Speaker
And it was, I love the communication, the dialogue, the back and forth, the sparring. I don't know, I really
How Digital Platforms Impact Collecting
00:08:26
Speaker
enjoy that. And I think with the digital interface, it's lost the fun. And even, I think there's a generation much younger than me, hopefully much younger than you guys, that is like, they forgot, they don't know what that's like.
00:08:39
Speaker
You know, so you're set up in a flea market or something and you got, you know, $50 on an item, but you know you take 35, right? And you start the conversation. And if someone's like, hey, wow, that's great. How much is that? And you're like, yeah, it's 50 bucks. And they're like, okay, see you later. And I'm like, no, no, no, this is the conversation.
00:08:58
Speaker
You know? And that really was always the fun part. And I was, you know, I was never offended when somebody lowballed me. I was actually kind of, I always thought it was kind of funny. And I think that that dialogue, that communication is I think what made trade so great.
00:09:18
Speaker
Yeah, I don't get asked for advice often, probably because I'm 27. But when I do, my favorite piece of advice to give people is the worst someone ever is going to tell you is no. Right. And that couldn't be more true when it comes to collecting and negotiating and this idea of bartering for something that you want.
00:09:42
Speaker
Yeah, and you know, my dad used to say, you don't get anything if you don't ask for it, first of all, which is, you know, have served me well. But another thing is like, I always preference some things, like big purchases or, you know, things where you really get a low ball. I always will say, listen, I don't, please don't be insulted by this. I don't want to insult you, but this is what it's worth to me if you're willing to go there.
00:10:10
Speaker
And that kind of deflates the seriousness and the edginess of that conversation. You know, there's an art form to this stuff. And I studied it with some crazy good old timers and my mom and people I've navigated who are really good at selling and buying stuff.
Appreciation for Quality and Craftsmanship
00:10:29
Speaker
And I just think it's an absolute art form. Absolutely. It really is. It's funny when you were saying before about garage sales. That was the one thing we didn't have
00:10:39
Speaker
Cam and I growing up that I wish we did. It was like, for us, it was so weird. Like I used to like leave town, you know, for like a trip or sports or something and like come home and my dad, like my skateboard would be gone and my dad would just say, yeah, no, I gave it to the gardener. And I'm just like, what? Like, I missed the complete generation of being able to witness what that would be. Cause there were so many things growing up, like Cameron collected everything under the sun and then was always onto the next.
00:11:06
Speaker
was definitely a hoarder as a kid, but we never got the chance to just give that stuff away or even sell it to someone and see what that was like. Well, I thought it was interesting growing up because I watched my mom, and we grew up in Binghamton, New York, which was kind of a mini-metropolis. And on period, there was a lot of industry and money there, so there was a lot of people with money from IBM was there, GE. And there was a lot of great houses with great stuff. And I remember my mom just being so good.
00:11:35
Speaker
at negotiating and finding incredible stuff. And then all of a sudden like when my mom, you know, got money and didn't have to be scrappy, it just like everything came from a big box store. And I just was like, wait, where did all the good stuff go? You know, like, and because it really wasn't seen as antiquing as much as it was just like picking at garage sales, you know, but I actually still have
00:12:01
Speaker
a lot of houseware stuff that I remember buying with my mom when I was, you know, heading off to college that I still own as an adult because it was just great stuff and is great stuff and it's followed me through my life. And what I like about it is that, I mean, we talk about non-disposable, recyclable things and all that stuff, but that sort of ultimately was what it was.
00:12:23
Speaker
You don't need to go out and buy new stuff. If there's great stuff out there that people are willing to give away or sell reasonably inexpensively, you can go the very high end collectible route of, you know, I have a friend who spends tens of thousands of dollars on Danish furniture. But it's like for me, the joy was I wanted to find that one kind of exclusive little piece tucked in the back of a, you know, furniture supply store, like office supply store or something, you know.
00:12:50
Speaker
Yeah, I'm with you there. I mean, my fiance and I, we were out the other day and there's a store down the street from us. It's basically a vintage marketplace, but it's sectioned off into many stores that people pay rent to have these spaces and sell their vintage items.
00:13:09
Speaker
ranging from $5 all the way to $12,000 paintings. We had just stumbled upon this bread basket bowl essentially that once you bake a fresh loaf of bread, it would go into these baskets, these really long wood carved baskets.
00:13:30
Speaker
I just did a quick google search cuz i wasn't sure exactly what it was for and you can buy him online from pottery barn like brand new for fifty dollars or we could get this vintage one that was like beat up you know somebody's actually used it. For what it was and it's just it's those sort of things but i think segueing from from the vintage stuff. How do you go about mixing old and new.
00:13:56
Speaker
Of course you can collect right in both categories and things like watches and cars.
00:14:02
Speaker
But what about mixing old and new experiences?
Organizing Memorable Group Experiences
00:14:06
Speaker
I think it's important that we chat about that Belmont Royal Scotsman tribute you did, because that was a perfect combination of old and new. Can you tell us a little bit more about that experience, how it came about, and really what that was like? Well, I would say, first of all, philosophically, I look to the old world. I really appreciate that coming from immigrant European roots.
00:14:31
Speaker
I've always leaned in heavily with that around my life. I like modern things for my everyday life. I like modern kitchen equipment. I don't want to be stoking a wooden stove.
00:14:48
Speaker
I like modern toilets and modern stereo equipment and things like that. But like, I always, you know, when I go to Europe and I go and stay in hotels, I like the older school, older world hotels more than the kind of slick, modern, kind of 21st century versions of the thing.
00:15:06
Speaker
And I think, you know, an ideal world is when you can mix both of those things seamlessly together, even though I am, you know, I really am a modernist as well. Like my house is very, my house upstate is very modern, built by a modern architect, you know, who's Austrian, but we kind of fill it with period things that are old and period. But, you know, I'm, I got a brand, you know,
00:15:29
Speaker
new mille dishwashing machine i'm not messing around so like there are kind of rules that we follow with that. But you know that the belmont was the sort of the perfect world where you have this very old means of travel.
00:15:45
Speaker
and very glamorous at least in this period, which is a train that went through Scotland. Now it's sort of seen as leisure and holiday. They actually had a very difficult time kind of selling that product and they came to me and they were like, what would you do? I was like, first of all, I love trains. I love the romantic idea of trains.
00:16:06
Speaker
You have these amazing dining cars and let's bring back the kind of glamor of how we would imagine that period in time being by putting this collection of people together and kind of playing out, playing it out in real time because all the facilities are there with the train. And they were really excited about it and very generous and gave us the train for a couple of days and we just kind of filled it with what I call people of influence, not influencers. And in close friend and it was a great
00:16:36
Speaker
rather incredible like 72 hours. And again, it felt very old world and that appealed to a lot of us. But the good thing about that train versus the Oran Express, which I've had the pleasure of being on.
00:16:50
Speaker
Just gonna say you're giving me that vibes like a you need to do like a murder mystery dinner while you're on that Well, the thing about the Orient Express versus this Royal Scotsman is a Royal Scott I mean the Orient Express does not have in-room toilets and it does not have showers Like you do not want to be on that train for more than an overnight in my opinion Even though it's really one of the most glamorous
00:17:11
Speaker
group of train cars I've ever seen in my life. What was great about the Royal Scotsman is there was ensuite bathrooms with showers and nobody was waiting in the line in the morning to use the john. That made for a very luxurious element that I thought was very smart and modern with a very old-fashioned bit of transport. Nothing like a 2 AM trip to the bathroom with a line.
00:17:39
Speaker
No, no, no. Let's just talk about morning coffee in a line. No, thank you. If you could get that group together again, which I mean, I'm guessing you guys would, where would the next spot be? You know, we had actually had plans before the, I like to call it the situation.
00:18:01
Speaker
Belmont has another amazing property in Ravello, which is on the Italian coast, like in the Amalfi coast. And we were, since all those guys were gonna probably end up at PT, the big men's fashion fair, style fair in Florence, we were all gonna kind of converge on this very elegant old Italian hotel on the coast and kind of build out another one of those experiences, which I hope we still have the opportunity to do.
00:18:30
Speaker
It was such a great group of people that, a lot of these guys, that was the first time they met each other on that train and we all became intensely close and good friends and because of our, everyone was very like-minded and very chill and very easy-going and everybody loved to put on a tuxedo, so that's where the friendships were born.
00:18:54
Speaker
I love it. Well, you guys are making me look bad. I can't even get my buddies to commit to this Toronto fishing trip we've been talking about since it feels like the year of the flood, but it's not happening. So maybe I'll just have to put on a title. Are you guys going to go walleye or pike fishing? Yeah, like it was like one of those things where we, you know, all the guys like to fish and we'd always spoke about doing that.
00:19:17
Speaker
It's a weird time where some of my buddies have gotten married, some are having their first kids, and I'm hoping we didn't miss that window. But then when I looked at what you did, I'm like, no, it can happen. It's just about setting the right time and someone being that little bit more of the pusher of making it happen. Right. And I think what's fun about all those things is when you make an event of that, and that can be a fishing trip as well as a train trip or, I don't know,
00:19:47
Speaker
a weekend away in the mountains or whatever. I do think that we always like to make rituals out of events. Oddly enough, we were in the middle of Scotland and at one point there was a group of us that diverted off and spent a couple days in this hotel way, way, way up in the middle of nowhere.
00:20:10
Speaker
And at dinner, we all kind of converged. Dinner was about six of us. And without even discussing it, everyone had put on a tuxedo. And there were people, I promise you, there were people in the lobby. It's a really kind of like hiking, walking destination. And there were people basically just in wool socks at the dinner.
00:20:35
Speaker
And we all walked in with tuxedos and I don't know, I thought it was just kind of great. It was kind of quirky, timeless, something elegant about it and we turned a lot of heads that night. That's so good. Was something like that trip difficult to plan or did you come to all the
00:20:55
Speaker
I guess the group that you're with and say, hey, here's the plan. Here's the price or what we would need to make this happen. Who's in, who's not? Or was it a little more complicated? Was it more like, hey, who's in for this and then let's plan it?
00:21:12
Speaker
Well, I think it's like planning any party. You start with the guest list. You know, we knew that we knew Belmont was going to provide X amount and then, you know, people would have to kind of get themselves there and spend the first night there and all this other stuff. Right. So we started with the the the wish list guest list.
00:21:32
Speaker
And then we knew there was only X amount of cars with X amount of beds, so we kind of chiseled it off from there. And then we kind of fine-tuned it. It was sort of like building out the best dinner party, you know? And we knew that some people wouldn't mind bunking up, and some people would. And, you know, how do you create a balance of, you know, style and personality? And Yolanda and I really spent a lot of time doing that. Like, we spent many a morning, you know, with a call to Belmont, kind of hacking that all out.
00:22:02
Speaker
And it just came together seamlessly at the end with good planning and thoughtfulness and allowing to pivot when you need to pivot because eventually something's gonna go wrong. But we were lucky that nothing dramatic went wrong. Some people fell out of the guest list and to this day when I see those people, they were like,
00:22:23
Speaker
I mean, my friend Sid Mashburn was like, why the hell did I go to my daughter's graduation? It was like stuff like that. Sid Mashburn is like, I was shocked not to see him in the photos. Well, Sid was invited, but he, I mean, he did make the right choice. You should go to your daughter's graduation. But, you know, we'll get Sid on the next one. Awesome.
What's in Matt's Upcoming Book on Negronis?
00:22:47
Speaker
I think it's time that that we chat Negroni's here. What do you say?
00:22:52
Speaker
I'm always up for that. I actually almost made one before I got here and I realized I was like, I have a lot of stuff to do after this still. So yeah. No, I think it's I actually just finished a book on Negroni that will be out in May.
00:23:10
Speaker
Cannot say yeah i don't know if we could spoil it but we saw the cover of it and it's like it's better than a leonardo capiele capiello rather poster that's in every time restaurant but it's exactly what it makes you think of.
00:23:26
Speaker
Well, it's funny, I had no idea that that cover was even leaked on Amazon or wherever it is right now. That sort of happens without an author ever knowing. But what I love about working with Artisan is how incredibly thoughtful they are and allowing me to kind of armchair, art direct all this stuff. And there was definitely a philosophical and aesthetic point of view with this book that they basically offered me
00:23:56
Speaker
You know their stronghold in the publishing world is very very food and cookbook focused and after the success of the watchbook there they've said to me well what's next and i like i don't know what's next and i don't understand why you haven't pitched in a groaning book. And i'm like are you asking me to do in a groaning book.
00:24:14
Speaker
And they were like, yeah, you can do a Negroni book. And I was like, okay, that sounds good. And my approach to it was, first of all, as home bartenders, like, I'm sure you guys are as well as I am. Like, I leave the pro stuff to the pros, okay? Like, I don't need a smoke machine and a hat to create a smoky, you know, old smashing at the bar. You know, like, I want to make- Dry eyes.
00:24:37
Speaker
Right, like I don't need some funky dried garnish or some obscure bitters. I just want to build out an inventory of like X amount of drinks that I know I could make at home anytime. And that and when I had been out there looking at other books, so much of it was just filler and fluff. And I was like, does the world need like 36 Negroni recipes? Absolutely not. But we want it. Yeah. Are there
00:25:06
Speaker
12 to 15 excellent variations on the original? Yes, for sure. And that's where that came from. So it's sort of to the point and it doesn't divert dramatically off the path just because
00:25:23
Speaker
I just don't buy it half the time when somebody's adding too many ingredients is something that is absolutely perfect as it is, you know. Yeah, I mean, like I have some cookbooks here and we haven't touched a single recipe and it just because it requires so many special ingredients and most of the time when we're making a recipe of something, it's like, hey, we're going to go to the market down the street and we're going to find what we can find, but we're not expecting to find that. So let's just forget about that recipe.
00:25:50
Speaker
Yeah, I think the problem with a lot of, I mean, a lot of cookbooks is that. Right. But I guess I guess they have their place in the cookbook world. But it's nice that that artisan because you've mentioned in the past that they they kind of gave you a hard time at first about the watchbook.
Impact of Success on Future Projects
00:26:06
Speaker
But it seems like they they finally get it and they get what you're trying to do. And I think that leaves open a lot of awesome opportunities for you to create some great stuff for people like us.
00:26:20
Speaker
Well, I think the luck of all of that is the book.
00:26:23
Speaker
was terribly successful commercially, and of course, it's sort of like when you make a hit movie, they're like, where have you been? I've been making short films for a long time. But it does afford you the opportunity for people to know that they've taken a risk, it's proven successful, it's less of a risk now, so let's move forward with another project. And that's very lucky.
00:26:53
Speaker
And I feel very privileged to have that opportunity.
00:27:00
Speaker
I came out of that watchbook with a little bit of confidence knowing that maybe my instincts are correct. Maybe there is a good, the way I'm approaching this stuff, I'm not alone. Exactly. Those were reasonably good instincts and peppered with a lot of luck and a lot of really incredibly thoughtful, helpful people around you.
00:27:26
Speaker
Yeah. They're easily my favorite gift to give to people. And when people come over and they see your books on my coffee table, I definitely get a little bit more credibility of being someone decently cool. Wow, that's good. That is very true.
00:27:45
Speaker
It was really important to me coming out of the kind of magazine world and kind of media space to make objects that were physically attractive. I felt that, you know, as an object, you needed to gravitate to it even if you weren't interested in the subject. And Artisan understood that as well. And when we designed the book together, you know, they were really receptive to those kind of design collaboration ideas.
00:28:13
Speaker
and I think that is very helpful because, you know, there's often great books, great cookbooks, great card books that are filled with good content but they're really ugly. Oh yeah. Call me superficial but I just wanted it to look good, you know? No, it's important. I mean, it's a coffee table, a bookshelf, whether it's a gift,
00:28:38
Speaker
It's just kind of one of those instant gratification things when somebody opens, whether it's a man in his watch or a man in his car, and they're like, this is heavy duty. This is super, super neat. Yeah, I think the true test of that was revealed and answered last night. I was looking, and my girlfriend was like, oh, I was like, yeah, I'm prepping a little bit for tomorrow. And I was like, you've got to see the cover of his book that's coming out. And she looks, and she goes, oh my gosh, we need to get that. That needs to be here.
00:29:07
Speaker
the hardest person to please aesthetically. I've had no call in anything that's in this apartment I'm sitting in right now. I feel like I don't even belong here, but that will give me some street cred.
00:29:17
Speaker
That is so good. Yeah, so needless to say, we're excited about it. Well, I think also that, I mean, that, you know, the female demographic in terms of, you know, I've heard that from girlfriends, friends, wives, sisters of, you know, they gravitated to the car and watch book, even though they can give two shakes about cars and watches.
Travel Recommendations and Personal Style
00:29:39
Speaker
And again, that was a big part of this part of the strategy.
00:29:43
Speaker
Well, yeah, and I think, you know, what's funny is that when, um, a couple of years ago, when I went to Italy, I don't know, you might not remember, but I had reached out and asked some just recommendations of places to go and all sorts of stuff like that. And now my fiance is like, anytime we go on a trip, she's like, ask Matt where we should go in this, this, you know, European health side country.
00:30:04
Speaker
Well, it's funny, you know, I'm way more generous about that than my wife, you know, she's been in travel for so long and she always gets like, I wouldn't say offended, but she gets sometimes prickly when it's like absolute strangers that have never had any engagement whatsoever suddenly say like, well, what are your top 25 restaurants in Paris, right?
00:30:26
Speaker
And Yolanda's like, oh, what is the matter with these people? Don't they know the amount of time and experience? I said, Yolanda, you're talking about a population of people now that type something into a machine, their phone, a computer, whatever, ask it a question and it spews out piles of answers.
00:30:47
Speaker
And that's what they think you are, is that you are the Google search. 25, though, I mean. Yeah, but it's like, listen, I don't have a problem saying, if someone says, hey, I'm in Barcelona, where should I get a drink? Dude, if I'm sitting around with time on my hands and I'm sitting on the train or commuting or whatever and I get that DM,
00:31:09
Speaker
I always am like, oh, go to bar x. But, you know, I think it's a – you also have to be kind of realistic with what you ask for and how you ask for it and things like that. You know, obviously, you guys – you didn't piss me off, so I gave you an answer, probably.
00:31:25
Speaker
No, you definitely did. I mean, the funny is I have to tell this story because her and I crack up about it all the time. I asked you in Venice where I should go and you said Harry's bar, get the cheese sandwich, get a Bellini and sit there and eat some olives and enjoy an afternoon.
00:31:42
Speaker
And we had gotten to Venice and that was our first stop. We were starving and we didn't know what to expect with this cheese sandwich or anything like that. So we get into Harry's. We ordered the cheese sandwich and it's this tiny little thing, but it is so good.
00:31:57
Speaker
and they're unreal but I ate it in one bite and my fiance and I sat there and we just drank and ate endless bowls of olives for like an hour and a half because we were so hungry but we had to have the cheese sandwich so we just wanted to stay there and keep doing it and it was a blast. I mean the problem with Harry's and both Harry's is that I actually think their Italian food is incredibly mediocre. I think their drinks are extraordinary
00:32:24
Speaker
And their kind of little aper TV food is what it's all about and that damn cheese sandwiches. I just order them by By the dozens. So yeah, yeah, they're they're incredible What do you think it is about cocktails watches? cars, you know Incredible wardrobes that like what is it about that stuff that makes you personally tick and
00:32:48
Speaker
Because it's your vibe. It absolutely
Family Influence on Collecting
00:32:50
Speaker
is your vibe. And it's a lot of people's, but I mean, like, I'd be lying if I say you don't do those things right. Well, you know, first of all, it was my dad. You know, my father was a commercial artist, sign painter, pin striper, you know, he was in the kind of art graphic design world. And he had a very specific sense of style and he, you know,
00:33:14
Speaker
loved British sports cars and well-made things. And he used to shoot professional skeet and trap. And, you know, we had like had these handmade Belgian shotgun. I mean, it was always like stuff that was really well crafted. And that kind of really rubbed off on me. And, you know, he made an effort to point that kind of stuff out. And the other thing is like, you know, he was a guy that was in like Levi's and Red Wing boots and a Barracuda jacket to work.
00:33:44
Speaker
But on the weekends, he would wear a Harris Tweed blazer and a tie. He really enjoyed the process and the ritual of dressing. And he wasn't a grunt that had to wear a suit every day to a crappy office. He had a quite liberal
00:34:01
Speaker
in a very open-ended job, but really it was kind of a Levi's and Boots kind of job. So because he liked things like Harris Tweed, you know, that was his kind of weekend kit and stuff like that. So that like made an influence on me. And, you know, I think a lot of the, like my grandfather, my mother's side was, you know, there was a shoemaker and, you know, that stuff was really important to them. But it all kind of came back to craft.
00:34:24
Speaker
and well made things and buying things once and putting the effort into saving your money to buy like the best pair of shoes, the best version of that watch you could afford or car that you want and that really resonated with me and kind of carried on in my life. I love hearing that because Cameron and I and our older brother the same way, our mom's dad
00:34:50
Speaker
was the epitome of all of this. There's no one that any one of us, even our buddies who met him, did not want to be like him. Always dressed to the nines, was in the car business, was always driving cars that he should have been in the back seat in, that he'd always let us know, you're only cool when you're in the back seat of these. He just oozed cool, taught me how to play pool. It's like my favorite game in the world now and nothing will ever change.
00:35:17
Speaker
I really, really admire that you found that kind of with your dad too, because when you have a connection with someone that you look up to like that and that influences your taste for these kind of things, I think it's just a little bit more, obviously is more special, but you appreciate it just as much as you admire it, of course more. Yeah. And I know, you know, I grew up with
00:35:41
Speaker
you know, men in my life that I really admired. You know, there wasn't an antagonistic relationship. I wasn't abused or beaten. You know, it's like, you know, these I really admired and looked up to and wanted to emulate these characters and, you know, particularly my father. So I guess I, you know, I kind of lucked out that, you know, I became interested in sort of the same things.
00:36:05
Speaker
And I think my path deviated here and there, but as I became an older version of myself, it became more defined and refined and edited down. Yeah, I totally am bored with that. And I think that when it comes to collecting, I think that there's maybe two or three types of people depending on what you collect. I think when it comes to vintage things,
00:36:30
Speaker
As a young person growing up in this era of social media, I think you lose some of that experience of maybe getting into something vintage, unless you follow vintage watch pages, for example, or vintage cars. Those are two easy things to go vintage with.
00:36:49
Speaker
But when it comes to antiques and art and flea markets and all that sort of stuff, I really feel like that is something that unless you were brought up that way or ever experienced that from a young age, I think that's something that would be really difficult to latch onto now.
00:37:08
Speaker
Well, you know, I'm raising a daughter who now is 17, and even though she complains that we schleppered all these flea markets and crappy junk shops and stuff like that, you know, she has a really good eye for things. And I could see her gravitating to specific stylistic things and objects, you know, not unlike myself. And, you know, again, it becomes maybe it's a part of your DNA. I think particularly, and it's easy for her as a teenage girl to
00:37:38
Speaker
You know, it's obviously gravitating to kind of vintage clothing and, you know, what that means and like, you know, the, the find and the, and the affordability of that. And, uh, but, you know, I do a lot of fly fishing and obviously, you know, I have, I own a lot of barbers.
00:37:56
Speaker
And one of the holy grail barbers is the spay coat, the half cut fly fishing coat. And they're terribly hard to find now and very, very expensive when you find them. And Clara was spending some time in Rome and there was a kind of cool little thrift, like secondhand clothing store scene in Rome. And she walks out with one of these spay coats and I was like,
00:38:22
Speaker
I actually have two of them, which is rare, but I have two of them. It was my size, it was an amazing condition, and she absolutely paid pennies on the dollar for it. I was like, oh my god. She was like, dad.
00:38:39
Speaker
This one is mine. You don't come near it. You don't add it to your collection. You don't get to borrow it. And I was like, all right, you own that. OK, I get it. I get it. But like she obviously was listening to me and she obviously was paying attention to how I was looking at stuff and what I was searching for and why I was buying the versions of that thing. And again, that's that kind of osmosis that happens
00:39:05
Speaker
You know being pulled in tow with a bunch of 90 parents couple of 90 parents who are obsessed with stuff you know. Yeah i think that the longer that you look at something that you want to purchase or that you want to find. The quickness of like your eye to find that gets so you know.
00:39:24
Speaker
is so refined and like I get all these, you know, like eBay notifications and auction notifications and all these things of what I'm looking for and it'll be like 200 results for this, but I can zoom through it because my eye can just pick up at this point on what exactly it is that I'm looking for.
00:39:41
Speaker
Yeah, it's funny, you know, you're using an example that is so of your generation, right? You're like, I can go to the A-base scroll. You know, to me, I always equate it to like mushroom hunting. I don't know if you've ever gone mushroom hunting, but like, you go, the first time you go mushroom hunting with like a total pro, which again, like, good mushroom hunting are secret spots, just like any good thrift store, you know, it's like the same.
00:40:05
Speaker
So you get out in the woods and say, and this happened to me the first time I went looking for chanterelles and I was in Oregon. And the guy was like, well this, I said, okay, I know what a chanterelle is, but how do I find them? And he's like, oh, look, they're right there. And you're like, where? I can't see anything. Like, what are you talking about on this pine needle forest bed? And then all of a sudden you see one.
00:40:28
Speaker
And then all of a sudden, your eye is trained, and you're like, oh my god, they're absolutely everywhere. And here's a better version of that, and da da da da da. And I think that is sort of what happened when I was going to the Salvation Army as a kid. I was looking for a very specific Pendleton wool flannel shirt, or I was looking for World War II military jackets, or whatever. And I could just scan the store and be like, boop, boop, boop, boop.
00:40:55
Speaker
there they are or i would do that we are sweet like up i could go through the rack and pick out every single every really. Do i miss do i miss the the identification and i can again that's about kind of training your eye and being good at it and being in more over like.
Developing a Collector's Eye
00:41:12
Speaker
Kind of knowing what you like.
00:41:14
Speaker
more than anything. I actually was cleaning out my quote unquote barber closet today because I had to take a picture of one and I was just like, Oh God, it's like, what am I doing? You know, I don't, I don't own a shop, but I also don't want to get rid of, you know,
00:41:31
Speaker
No, there's certain things that you got to hold on to and back to using a trained eye to find something. My favorite stores are antique stores and just like zooming through eBay, I can zoom through an antique store if I'm looking for a piece of baccarat or I'm looking for a piece of Lalique or any sort of thing specific that I know I'm looking for.
00:41:58
Speaker
pick things out, and I think if you do things like that enough, and you enjoy it, it really becomes second nature. Yeah, and when I did this little road trip from Florida to New York and back, or New York to Florida and back, you'd see on the side of the road, largest flea market indoor space in Georgia, 25,000 square feet. I was like, I can get through that in six minutes.
00:42:27
Speaker
Yeah, like I know exactly what the kind of period and the groupings that I'm looking for.
00:42:34
Speaker
And, you know, they're always, you know, when you kind of walk into this place, you know, people are like, hey, how y'all doing? You're like, oh, I'm great, I'm great. You know, and they're like, oh, you get the lay of the land and y'all end up, I always head right, I always go right, you know. And then all of a sudden like in 10 minutes, we're out and they're always like, well, that was quick. I was like, yes it was, on to the next one, you know. Like, yeah, I got past the 1500 rocking chairs that I didn't need.
00:42:58
Speaker
That's right, or exactly 3,000 wooden bowls and green depression glass, you know, it's like, yeah. So, yeah, and I think that you, yeah, you just, you get a refined eye, you get a specific point
Phases and Saturation in Collecting
00:43:13
Speaker
of view. And then, you know, but you hit saturation points too, like, at one point I was, this is years and years ago, I was so obsessed with taxidermy, and I was just buying piles of, you know, taxidermy.
00:43:27
Speaker
And then when we did this trip through the south, there was so much taxidery and I said, I turned to Yolanda, it was like, aren't you glad that phase is over? And she was like, I'm really glad that. Back to the Campari ashtrays.
00:43:41
Speaker
Yeah. Well, that's a problem too. She puts a short leash on me when I'm in Europe and I find them like, you know, I'm like, no, but this one has this gold rim with the stamp is different on the back. She's like, man, it looks like every other one. I was like, okay, I'm, but I'm not leaving it behind. I'm not, it's coming with you. Never leave a fallen man behind. No, no, no. But yeah, I think that, um, I've definitely gone through waves and phases of stuff that I concentrated on. And then, um,
00:44:10
Speaker
you kind of move on to the next thing. And then there's times where I've just been exhausted by it and just said, okay, let's just pump the brakes here.
00:44:18
Speaker
you know, figure something else out, you know. Yeah, back to taxidermy. Yeah, exactly. Well, Matt, we've reached that point where I think we're ready to do what we call the collector's gene. And it's basically a rundown of topics based upon your personal collections. It could be cars, watches, antiques, anything sartorially inclined. And whether the answer sparks a personal
00:44:46
Speaker
answer or story of someone else that you'd like to share, we're leaving it up to you. Does that sound good? Yeah. Sounds great. All right. So.
00:44:55
Speaker
The one that got away, what's the one thing that you missed out on that it's keeping you up at night, or maybe it did for a while? Okay, that is very easy. It was a mid-sized rose gold Rolex that was one of the most, it was early 1960s mid-size, and it was in a flea market here in New York where there were actually pre-internet and Watch Madness was actually a great place with great dealers for watches.
00:45:25
Speaker
And I remember it was 5,000 bucks, which I could never even imagine finding that watch for the time. But, you know, now for nothing, it was a big chunk of change for Yolanda and I at the time. And we were building our house upstate and I said to her, she was like, Matt, that's the most beautiful watch. I said, I know, I know, it's very special watch. And I said, but we could either have flushing toilets or we could have that watch.
00:45:49
Speaker
And as smart young adults, we chose flushing toilets and that watch slipped through our fingers and I have to, I'll be honest with you, I've been looking for that ever since.
00:46:01
Speaker
Was it a Datejust or a Date? It was a date mid-size Rose gold, which were primarily... There were a lot of them in the South American and Latin market for some reason. It was a kind of style of the time that people really liked. But I have been hard-pressed to find that one for sure.
00:46:25
Speaker
Yeah, anything in pink gold now and at, you know, good condition, great price. It's just, it's too hard to come by. Yeah.
Current Collecting Interests and Aspirations
00:46:33
Speaker
How about the, uh, the opposite of that, the on deck circle with anything you have your eye on next? You know, I always, I really love, uh, I love Fornicetti and like Italian modernism. You know, I travel a lot to Europe now and you know, I have friends in Rome and there was that,
00:46:51
Speaker
part of like Italian modernism in decorative arts that I always really liked. And it's funny, you see a lot of it was brought into America, but it's much more harder to find and very, very highly collectible. And I love the sense of humor in the stuff. So I'm always kind of like a little bit on the DL kind of scoping that stuff out. All right, well, we'll try and edit that part out for you then.
00:47:17
Speaker
What about the unobtainable? You can't have because it's too expensive or it's in a museum and maybe we'll talk privately about getting a group to go steal it. What would that be? I guess I would lean into the art world with that. There's a modern painter named Alex Katz that I always really liked and there was a very early on, there was an online art e-com.
00:47:42
Speaker
And every once in a while, like one of these paintings would come up and I'd be like, oh my God, it's like I thought we need to buy that. And they would always slip through my fingers and stuff. And then I have a friend that has an house cats. It's a portrait of her actually. And it's just so great. And it's just so thoughtful. And I love that whole period of art. And I had the pleasure of meeting him years and years ago.
00:48:04
Speaker
So, I would say that unattainable thing is probably in the art world, in the painting world, and someone like Alex Katz is a painting I would someday love to own.
00:48:18
Speaker
Awesome. This is the page one rewrite, so if you could collect anything besides all of your current collections, what would it be and why? And you quite possibly just answered it, but we'll ask it anyway. No, I think if I would just collect more cars, I would just collect cars, more cars, and I would just put the Jay Leno, a heretic version of Jay Leno Garage together. He's the man, isn't he? Yeah, it's unbelievable, yeah.
00:48:49
Speaker
Well, on that note, who's the goat? Who do you look up to most in the collecting world? This guy, Doug, that has done all the picking and collecting for Ralph Lauren over the years. I mean, he is the OG. I mean, he is someone with such impeccable taste and understanding well ahead of the curve of what people are collecting from
00:49:16
Speaker
you know, western objects to, you know, English gentry. And not only with small objects and decorative arts and watches and jewelry, he was also really kind of the man in the vintage world for clothing and stuff like that as well. And obviously he was hired by the right person, Ralph Lauren. Yeah, definitely. Hopefully Ralph leaves him that Bugatti or something. I think Doug's done pretty good for himself. I don't know of a Bugatti level, but I'm sure they're pretty good.
00:49:47
Speaker
I know the answer to this one, but the chaser, the sale, the hunt, more of the ownership.
The Joy of the Hunt in Collecting
00:49:52
Speaker
It's the hunt. It's the hunt. It really don't. I don't need bragging rights for much. Yeah. Closing it out. Do you feel like you were born with the collectors, Gene? You know, I'm sure we talked about DNA. Like my mom
00:50:10
Speaker
You know, right down to like dumpster diving and garbage picking, you know, like that is still part of my everyday life. Like the amount of like crap that I pull off the street here in Brooklyn and come home with it.
00:50:24
Speaker
At one point the backyard was just filled with webers that people were throwing out and I was like, look at all these webers. I mean that comes from some place and I think, yeah, I would say it's some in one of those chromosomes.
00:50:42
Speaker
Love it.
Conclusion and Gratitude
00:50:43
Speaker
Well, Matt, thanks so much for joining us. It's always a pleasure to chat with you. And there's so much to learn about you and all that you're working on. And we just appreciate you taking the time. It was my pleasure. And you know, I'm available when I'm not, you know, catch me on the fly when I'm not picking up the next obsessed object.
00:51:06
Speaker
All right, Dio, we'll ask you for 40 restaurants in France. Yeah, for all you listeners out there, do not do that. You heard it here first, guys. All right, that does it for this episode. Thanks for listening, everybody. This has been Collector's Gene Radio, signing off.