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Nos Audietis, Episode 306: Just win, baby
66 Plays6 years ago
While there were definitely moments of brilliance for the Seattle Sounders, their First Round encounter with FC Dallas was more about simply moving on in the MLS Playoffs. Jeremiah and Aaron discuss how blowing leads is probably not a repeatable path to success, but they do marvel at how well the Sounders seem to have mastered the art of doing just that and still managing to pull out a victory.
In order to squeeze in an episode before Wednesday’s Western Conference semifinals while Jeremiah is in Washington, D.C., this a shorter episode than normal. Hope you don’t mind.
This week's music: Perry Como - "Seattle", "RVIVR - "Ocean Song", Woody Guthrie - "Roll On Columbia", "Your Journey Begins" - OurMusicBox (Jay Man) (CC BY 4.0)
Thanks to James Woollard, Sounders Public Address Announcer, for doing our sponsor reads. You can follow him on Twitter at @BritVoxUS - if you’re looking for a British Voice to advertise your business or non-profit, please reach out to him.
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Transcript
Sponsor Introduction: Full Pool Wines
00:00:00
Speaker
This episode of No Sadietes is sponsored by Full Pool Wines, a Seattle-based wine seller who recently released their first book, 36 Bottles of Wine. The ethos of the book, a highly curated look at wine categories that provide exceptional value right now, should be familiar to full pool readers. But there's loads of fresh content, and since it's not trying to sell any wine through the book, there's a bit more of a sass factor.
00:00:21
Speaker
And there's food! Lots of it! Fullpool's unique writing style is applied to recipes like leftover Thanksgiving, turkey, schmaltz-a-ball soup, and pregnancy nachos. This book can be purchased through Sasquatch Books.
Seattle Sounders Match Excitement
00:00:32
Speaker
Hey, this is Christian Roldan. And Jordan Morris from the Seattle Sounders Football Club. And you're listening to... There's no study at this. Fuck! Hey, Ocean! Let's go! Morris runs right by him and sticks in and slots them for a roll! Fantastic for George Morris!
00:00:55
Speaker
Here's Morris! Morris! Think of an ant! What do tigers dream of? They take a little tiger's hand. A blue with skies you've ever seen are in Seattle. And the hill's the greenest green in Seattle.
00:01:24
Speaker
like a beautiful child growing up. Welcome back to another No Suddy at This, sponsored by Fullpool Wines. This is episode 306 and we're recording on Monday, October 21st.
Playoff Thriller: Seattle Sounders vs. FC Dallas
00:01:36
Speaker
I am your host, Jeremiah Shan. As usual, I'm doing by my co-host, Aaron Campo.
00:01:40
Speaker
Hopefully, everyone has had a chance to catch their breath after what has to be one of the most entertaining matches in MLS playoff history with last year's second leg against the Portland Timbers being one of the few matches that possibly surpassed it. The match featured seven goals, an MLS record of 48 shots, and saw the Sounders blow leads of 2-0 and 3-2 before pulling out the overtime victory on the back of Jordan Morris' first professional hat-trick. It was not the most convincing Sounders win, but it very much fit the narrative of how this season has gone so far.
00:02:09
Speaker
So I'll start with a question to you, Aaron, as I usually do. Do you think this game did anything to dissuade you at all of what you think the team, think in general of this team or what you think they're capable of doing this year?
00:02:23
Speaker
I don't think that it did. I think it's really hard to have any real takeaways from this game, but I think that that's just kind of been the story of the season, is that it's really hard. Yeah. Every game you go, I don't know that this really changed anything for me. And then you look at the next one. Yeah, pretty much. And I mean, I feel like it's not necessarily with a team that has this much talent and a team that is, you know, this veteran of a team.
00:02:49
Speaker
I don't think that it's a great sign that their identity is increasingly becoming finding ways to win games that maybe they shouldn't win, because they should be beating teams like FC Dallas and home in the playoffs. But they're finding ways to win, right? So maybe that's not the ideal outcome that you want for this team, but they won, they got through, and they've done that pretty consistently over the course of the season.
Sounders' Defensive Struggles
00:03:16
Speaker
I mean, I think I said, you know, after they scored the first goal, that it felt like a game that really had a chance to get out of hand. And then I think I followed that up with, you know, but they've had a lot of those games this year, and it didn't happen. And then after they scored the second one, I said, well, shit, maybe this will be the one. But obviously, it did not turn out that way.
00:03:40
Speaker
I mean, it's frustrating because I think we know how talented they are. I think we know how good they can be. And they show that in flashes. But it's not a great sign that they're the veteran team playing at home with a two goal lead and they're
00:03:57
Speaker
they're letting a very young FC Dallas team that is nowhere near as talented back into the game like that. But there were a lot of good things to take away from the game. So it's not all bad. It's hard for me to ever feel super confident in this team, I guess, is the takeaway that I think they're good. I think they're capable of beating anyone, including LAFC, because LAFC has not been a world beater the last month or so. But
00:04:27
Speaker
I also think that it's entirely possible to lose to anyone any time out. They're just a very weird team that's that's kind of hard to peg. I mean, that is the thing is that I think what in some ways that we saw was this team is we saw both the the potential of this team when they put it all together. And we also saw
00:04:47
Speaker
how things can go, how easily things can go off the rails. I mean, I thought through 37 minutes or so, like really, basically up until Dallas scored their goal, I thought the Sounders were very much in control of the game. If you had asked me at minute 37, who I thought was more likely to score the next goal, I think I would have said the Sounders. Dallas was controlling possession, but they really weren't doing much with it. And the Sounders
00:05:14
Speaker
didn't have the ball a ton, but every time they got it, they were out on the break. They're out in transition. They were driving at goal. They didn't create a ton of great chances after Morris's goal, but they were putting themselves into dangerous positions and they were close to creating chances.
00:05:34
Speaker
And, and I thought that was all very encouraging. I thought the game was going just about as well as they could have planned. Uh, I don't think they came into this game expecting to have a lot of possession and they were probably more than happy to let Dallas have the ball because they probably saw what they, what was happening. The first 37 minutes, which was Dallas really wasn't defending them.
00:05:58
Speaker
It was giving up tons of space on the counter, and the Sounders were exploiting it. I thought that they looked great. Then after Dallas' goal, which really came from nothing, it was a cross that two different center backs had a chance to clear. Kim Ki-hee first misplayed it pretty badly. Then it took a bad bounce.
00:06:19
Speaker
I don't necessarily blame Roman Torres a lot for the way he played it, but credit to Reggie Cannon, who was able to control it, scored the goal. And then from there on, up until, you know, close to the 70 minute markers or so, they were really the dominant team. And especially in the second half, Dallas had their boot on the center's throat. I mean, it was pretty bad. Like that was about as bad as we've seen the center's look.
00:06:49
Speaker
And yet they weren't generating a ton of chances until they get this corner. Matt Hedges basically out jumps Gustav Svensson and he scores. And then I thought from then on, like the Sounders didn't look great, but I think they at least, you know, the goal that they got was reasonably well deserved, even if it was kind of a weird goal. And then of course they then fall asleep on a corner kick,
00:07:20
Speaker
him key, he completely leaves his man. I've seen some people get kind of on Stephen Fry for not doing better on that, on that shock, but I don't know that he really, you know, could have done much to stop it. And, uh, and then we know how it went from there, but I, you know, the 37 minutes, I thought they, you know, if that's the team that they, they play like against RSL, they're in great shape. If they play like the team that they were for the next 40 minutes, they're in a lot of trouble.
00:07:48
Speaker
Yeah. And I think that the thing that's so strange about it is that you expect that from a team like FC Dallas, for example, who is very young, who is still trying to figure out their identity as a team. You don't expect that from a team like the Sounders that has so many veteran players that have been playing together for so long.
Mid-Game Performance Concerns
00:08:11
Speaker
This is a group that's largely been together for three or four years now. And with obviously some changes. But a lot of these players have been playing together for a while. And at times, they've looked like they had never met. So it's a little strange. It's definitely, to me, a big concern how often this team seems to come out flat after halftime.
00:08:38
Speaker
And I think saying that they were flat after halftime in this game is kind of understating things. But ultimately, they are a very talented team. Ultimately, I was really impressed with the fitness that they showed down the stretch in this game. I would have liked to see subs a little quicker.
00:08:58
Speaker
That's kind of a funny thing too, though, because I was with you very much. I mean, through 110 minutes or whatever, the sounders had still had two subs. And it was starting to get to the point where you had to wonder what the plan was. And I guess the plan was maybe to pull Jordan, who was clearly tiring, but understandably,
00:09:22
Speaker
I think Schmetzer wanted to get as much to see if he could figure out a way to get that goal. Yeah. I mean, I think it's a tricky one because ultimately Jordan is the guy that ended up scoring the winner. And he just out competed everyone to score the winner. And so it's hard to second guess leaving him in, but
00:09:45
Speaker
They were clearly struggling in a lot of places. I mean, there were there were guys that just could not run. And so it felt very much to me like a coach that wanted to stick with his guys and trust his guys and.
00:09:59
Speaker
I don't know if that was the right time to go with that approach, but in the end, it worked out fine. And I guess the initial point is that they didn't have a lot left in the tank at the end of that game, but they looked like they had more left in the tank than Dallas did. And I think a lot of that can explain to a great extent why they were able to find the late Cole.
00:10:22
Speaker
I don't know, man. I think that the biggest concern I have coming out of that game is definitely
Player Spotlight: Kim Ki-hee's Future
00:10:28
Speaker
Kim Ki-hee. That was as bad as we have ever seen him look. Yeah, he did not look good in that game. And it was not just the two goals that I think you can kind of reasonably put on him. He just had it. He struggled.
00:10:40
Speaker
He did. And I think increasingly it kind of seems like maybe he's the odd man out next year, which I think if you look back to how well he performed last year and for a lot of this season, that's kind of hard to believe, but it's, I mean, Roman Torres has, I think looked very good since he got back. Yeah. I mean, at this point, it's hard to imagine the Sounders getting rid of Torres. Like if they can bring him back at a reasonable number,
00:11:09
Speaker
It's hard, like, as tempting as it was, I think, to kind of write him off after the suspension, I kind of think that's a big mistake at this point. Like, you almost have to bring him back, even if it's only on a one-year contract. You got to, like, I don't think that they have a... Like, I'd feel much comfortable going into next season with Torres and Ariaga than Kim and Ariaga, I think.
00:11:34
Speaker
Yeah. And I think especially if you believe Roman Torres' version of events, and I really don't think there's any reason not to, it seems like not bringing him back, assuming he's willing to accept a reasonable contract, and I think he probably is. Not bringing him back seems almost punitive, and I just don't see the point really at this stage. And I think he and Ariaga are a good pairing. I think they complement each other well.
00:12:00
Speaker
At least in theory, I don't think we've actually seen them play together. That's true. But yeah, I mean, I think Kim is a concern for me. His performances seem to have started dropping off around the time we started hearing rumors that he might be looking to move. Yeah. And I mean, I started dropping when he no longer had Torres or Marshall to play next to him.
00:12:26
Speaker
Right. I mean, and that that's obviously a huge factor, right? But it playing with Torres, he's looked pretty bad a couple of times. So, yeah.
00:12:35
Speaker
I don't know. It's, I hate to read too much into that, but I just kind of feels like this is, we're kind of seeing the end of Kim Ki-hee in Seattle, which is a bummer because I like them. Yeah, I like them. And I think if you go into next season with, theoretically, if Kim and Torres were your starting centerbacks next season, that's not a horrible... No.
00:12:57
Speaker
pairing it's a I think it could be a very good pairing but I don't really see a way they can bring back all three center backs and ariaga clearly is the the like Maybe the key cog of that I mean, I guess they suppose they could bring back all three. I just don't think that is particularly likely especially at this point, I think you can probably go out and get a kim kihi comparable type of talent especially with that kind of money and
00:13:25
Speaker
And maybe one that's going to work a little bit better than Kim Ki-hee and just in terms of who they're capable of playing with effectively. Right, right. I mean, I think that that's kind of the big thing we saw with Kim and Ariaga is that they just don't complement each other that well.
00:13:41
Speaker
Right. They're both very good center backs, but I think like Ariaga to me has a really high upside. And I don't think it's at all hyperbole to say that by the end of next season, I think there's a very good chance he's considered one of the best center backs in MLS.
00:13:58
Speaker
No, he absolutely has a skill set to do it. There are a lot of people, I don't want to say a lot, but there are some vocal folks in this understand base that do not seem to be buying his potential. But to me, that just seems crazy. I mean, I think his struggles can largely
Victor Rodriguez's Role and Fitness
00:14:14
Speaker
be explained by the fact that he's been kind of put into a difficult situation, just in terms of not really having familiarity with his center back partners and having lots of
00:14:25
Speaker
rotation and changes and struggles. I don't know, he looks like the real deal to me. He looks like a great signing. Hopefully, we'll see him on Wednesday. I would be very happy to see Torres and Ariaga starting on Wednesday. I suppose if there's another... I would think you can count that as potentially a reason
00:14:47
Speaker
for hope that there's a better performance. The other one, and I don't know, I still don't know if I want to see him start, but I kind of feel like you may as well start him in this one. But Rodriguez was really good against Dallas. He didn't have a goal or an assist, but he was a really big part of everything dangerous the Sounders did. He, you know, his shot
00:15:16
Speaker
He probably should have scored on the chance that resulted in Rui Diaz's shopping cleared off the line, but he was just in dangerous spots. He just barely missed a shot wide from kind of the edge of the penalty area. He allowed the Sounders to play much more effectively against the Dallas Press.
00:15:38
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, it's tough because whoopi stop, how good he can be. And it's almost like at this point, you've got to roll the dice and just hope he can stay healthy and play. But at the same time, I feel like assuming that you've got to play LAFC or even the galaxy, frankly, I mean, the galaxy, you're going to score goals, even if they have to come up here and play. Um, you want to do all that you can to make sure, you know, that he's capable of playing in that game.
00:16:03
Speaker
I don't know, man. He just makes the team so much better. Like you said, he, he, he just, I feel like he almost kind of have to go for it. I'm with you unless they know for a fact that he just, his fitness just isn't there. Sure. I guess that's the big variable is that there's a chance that it's not about keeping him healthy as much as it is just a like bowing to the reality that he might not be 90 or 120 minutes fit.
00:16:28
Speaker
Uh, I guess that's a good question though. Would you rather get 70 minutes out of them as a starter or 40, you know, 50 minutes of them as, uh, potentially as a reserve? It's that's always such a tricky question. Um, because if the game goes the way that you would expect it or the way that you would hope for it to go, right? Like if you've got a game plan that you feel comfortable with that involves Jovan Jones and Jordan Morris playing on the wings and you come out and get a goal or two. Um, and it's.
00:16:56
Speaker
you're creating chances, then it's hell, you might not even need to play them at all, right? And I think, I mean, the Sounders have shown that they're capable of scoring goals with those guys on the field. I think Jovan Jones, we've been extremely hard on him, or I have at least. Yeah, I think we've both been pretty hard on him. And go ahead, I'll let you say it.
00:17:17
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I think he's been outstanding the last couple of games. I think he's getting a better feel for what they're looking for in that right midfield role. The fact that he's staying on the right and allowing Jordan to stay on the left, I think is huge as well.
00:17:33
Speaker
Um, so, you know, I think that it's tempting to say, Hey, we're going to go with that. We're going to try to, to save Victor. Um, but you know, RSL is not a bad team. Uh, wax to the Sounders earlier this season. Um, and they were, they were the better team. I think you get the timbers too. They were. Yeah, they definitely were. So I don't know. I just, uh, I think you, I kind of think you have to go for it. I honestly really do. I think that.
00:18:03
Speaker
If you get yourself into a situation where you're not putting out the strongest possible lineup and end up going down a goal, yeah, you don't want to be in that situation. So that's not to say that it's a terrible decision not to start him. Again, if he's capable of starting, but I think you've just got to go for it if you can.
00:18:26
Speaker
Yeah, I'm inclined to agree with you. I do. I guess there's the other variable is that he played a significant chunk. I mean, he played 43 minutes and I don't know how that, like he, I always hear that playing something like 45 minutes is akin to a training session. And in terms of like the, the wear and tear that players go through. And I don't know how an overtime game like that changes things. I would imagine it's,
00:18:56
Speaker
It's more stressful. But on the other hand, there's another, you know, they have another break in their two breaks, technically. Right. So I don't know how that how like, I would like, that's just kind of a thinking out loud situation where I don't know how that affects his availability for for Wednesday, if that makes him, you know, if it makes him any less likely to be able to play a bunch. You know, the other
00:19:22
Speaker
The other element I wanted to touch on from that game is, is I, I looked this up and over their last, I think it's the last 11 games, the sounders have blown eight different leads and that's in spread out over five games.
Sounders' Resilience: Winning Despite Adversity
00:19:38
Speaker
So I guess, or maybe it must've been over six games, but in any case, they've blown a bunch of leads. They've gone three, oh, and two though, in those games, they've,
00:19:51
Speaker
you know, including this last one. And then all three of those wins, they blew two goal leads, which is a crazy thing for a team to do with any kind of regularity is to blow a two goal lead. But that they came back and won all three of those games is kind of amazing. And I don't know if that's
00:20:16
Speaker
I don't know if that's a positive or a negative that they've managed to go 3-0 in games where they've blown leads. On the course of the whole season, they dropped a total of six points from games that they've led at some point.
00:20:36
Speaker
But they claimed nine points in games that they trailed at some point. So like on the net of those situations, they were plus three. I don't know what that really tells us about this team, other than they're kind of a volatile, hard to understand team. But I guess it shows this ability to win in ways that we don't think of as repeatable, and yet they keep doing it.
00:21:04
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I don't think that...
00:21:09
Speaker
I would not bet on them, their ability to sustain that over the course of this. No, I wouldn't either. I don't, you know, I don't think it's predictive necessarily, but I think it does underscore that they have a lot of talent that they're not going to fall apart at, you know, at a hint of adversity, which is nice. I mean, the playoffs, the playoffs are do or die. And, um, so having a team that's mentally tough enough to be able to bounce back from things is good. Um,
00:21:37
Speaker
But I think too, it just kind of underscores the nature of how this team is at this point. They're not great defensively, but they can score a lot of goals. They compete very hard. They win a lot of duels. They have enough veteran presence that they are not going to fall apart, like we just talked about.
00:22:01
Speaker
I mean, I think that it's just kind of the nature of the beast that is this team. They're like a worse version of the 2014 team where they're going to get into a lot of running gun games. And, you know, sometimes in those games, you're going to give up big leads. If I remember, in 2014, they ended up... They didn't blow a bunch of leads, but they did come from behind a bunch. Yeah. I mean, they did not have a great defense that year. And I mean, there was definitely...
00:22:31
Speaker
that season, that was a lot of the talk about the way the season was going is like, Oh, if we just had the defense we've had in the past, this team would be incredible. So, you know, grass is always greener and whatnot. But, um,
00:22:43
Speaker
I mean, I feel this team has a lot of talent. There are things about the way they perform in games that are kind of inexplicable to me that I've just kind of given up trying to figure out. But I think that they're clearly a more talented team than RSL. I think that they should win that game if they play the way that they're capable of playing, but that's been the big if all year pretty much.
00:23:10
Speaker
Yep, it is. And that's kind of a good place, I think, to leave this. You know, the sounder is going to play RSL on Wednesday. That's going to be at CenturyLink Field. We've been asked to get this out there as much as possible, but the plan is for it to be a 705 sharp kickoff. So don't get there. Don't see 705 and think you're going to show up at 730.
00:23:36
Speaker
And I guess we didn't really find much time to talk about Jordan Morris, but I feel like that's been covered pretty well. The kid is on an amazing tear. It's been a lot of fun to watch. Do you have anything you wanted to add about Jordan Morris? He is arguably the best American player in MLS right now. And I think he's pretty clearly the best attacking player in MLS right now. That's a pretty good bounce back from losing all of last season and most of the season four to injury. So we're pretty lucky to have him. And that contract looks very good.
00:24:05
Speaker
It looks really good and I think that the Sounders can probably count on him. Like I don't think anything, like I wouldn't expect anyone in Europe to offer a huge transfer fee this next offseason, but I think he sets up very nicely going into next year. And if he follows up this year with an even better season, I think that could open some serious doors for him.
00:24:35
Speaker
Yeah, especially because he seems to be more fully integrated into the national team.
Jordan Morris: A Comeback Story
00:24:40
Speaker
Um, I mean, if he's going to turn heads, that's where he's, where it's going to happen. And, um, he, he seems like a pretty gun questioned starter at this point for the national team. So, um, I think, I think he's got a real chance and you know, if the fit happens, uh, our loss, but good for him, he's earned it. Yep.
00:24:56
Speaker
All right, well, that's probably a good place to call it. I'm Jeremiah Shan. I guess I should always, we shouldn't, we didn't have a break, so I, oh, well, there'll be the one at the beginning. Anyway, thanks for our sponsor, Focal Wines. We decided not to do questions this week. Hopefully that's okay. I'm recording this from DC at 12.25 local time, so.
00:25:19
Speaker
We didn't want to go too much longer than we're already going. And I'm just lazy. Yeah, that's okay. But anyway, I'm Jeremiah Shan, signing off for Aaron Campo. This is No Study at This. And remember, you'll never yell alone. Green Douglas, where were the waters cut through? Down to wild mountains and tangents you flew. Canadian Northwest to the ocean so blue. It's roll on, Columbia roll on.
00:25:49
Speaker
Roll on, Columbia Roll on. Roll on, Columbia Roll on. Your power is turning our darkness to dawn. Roll on, Columbia Roll on. We love you. Let's win another one!