Transcript
Speaker: One of the things that I'd really like to see is more focus also on the embodied nature impacts of materials.
Speaker: Welcome back to Infrastructure Connections. How can we increase the demand for low carbon and no carbon technologies? That's what we're learning today when speaking with Monica Richter.
Speaker: Monica is the Senior Manager of Low Carbon Futures and Business Engagement Manager for Climate Change for the World Wildlife Fund Australia. She's also Project Director for the Materials and Embodied Carbon Leaders Alliance.
Speaker: Prior to that, she held roles at the Australian Conservation Foundation, Greenpeace, and the Australian Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade. She's a leader helping accelerate the uptake of new technologies toward a zero carbon future.
Speaker: Well, Monica, welcome to the show. Thank you. Thanks for the invitation. You bet. You've been involved in sustainability for a very long time. How did that journey start for you and what inspired you to get involved in this work?
Speaker: Well, I guess, you know, I did a lot of outdoor camping when I was a kid. So I got to appreciate the value of being in nature. was a girl guide as well.
Speaker: And then I did an economics degree in Queensland Uni and went to Work in Canberra, worked for the federal government for 10 years and became, i guess, started to question, well, what am I going to do for the rest of my life? I didn't want to be a public servant for the rest of my life. And I enrolled in a master's degree in social ecology, ah looking at the relationship between spirituality and economics.
Speaker: And, you know, I guess I landed in the corporate. The corporation as activist was my um master's thesis, you know what role does does business play in making the world a better place?
Speaker: That's what I thought was interesting about your background. You've got the triumvirate, you've got corporate work, government work and nonprofit work. How has that worked in your advantage to have been able to sit sit at each of the seats at the table and understand what each party is thinking?
Speaker: um So I have a different kind of roles. I've been at WWF now for 13 years. WWF, you know, our our role, our reason for living is for people to live in harmony with nature. So, you know, that's a very big global um organisation, global goal that we have. And I guess I see my role at a higher level is, know, how to reduce the ecological footprint of the industries that we have. You know, so we're moving from very much that extractive economy and paradigm to a regenerative economy and paradigm, you know, doing a lot of thinking around how to reduce our planetary boundaries, you know how to bring planetary boundaries thinking into the work
Speaker: that we are doing and in kind of the most recently thinking about how do we bring climate and nature together. So the specific work I've been doing around the built environment on supply chains, know, thinking about reducing the footprint of building materials, industrial decarbonisation with a very deep focus on greening, steel supply chains, you know, it really means that I can work collaboratively across those industry supply chains. So so i have you know have great privilege of working in an area that I feel really passionate about, working with terrific people who are equally passionate in this area and you'd really trying to push the boundary of our thinking in um not just the industry engagement piece, but also the importance of you know the role of government and the advocacy role that they play. in helping to shape and provide incentives to drive emission reductions and circularity, nature positivity further.
Speaker: The World Wildlife Fund just released their report, Nature is a Foundation of the Net Zero Economy. um Tell us you about your findings in that report. So we did this report focused primarily on the Western Australian government,
Speaker: We had heard that so the government there is looking at, you know, and first of all, how does it think beyond just being an extractive economy?
Speaker: ah How does it think about what other legacy opportunities there are and whether there are you know serious ways to attract private capital, international capital for investment in the conservation estate of Western Australia?
Speaker: And the findings of the report are pretty clear. Firstly, that you know nature, if if if we want to achieve what the government wants to achieve here, which is you know attracting funding into investment ah for the conservation state, and if we want to set up industry in wa as best practice, global best practice, where nature protection, repair and restoration is fundamental to doing business, nature needs to be included and embedded in all the decision-making processes as a core pillar of the WA economy.
Speaker: And secondly, that this transition towards decarbonisation, you net zero, must provide, you know, it it provides a major opportunity to deliver both, you know, the economic outcomes around prosperity, economic prosperity, but also it has to be able to deliver those nature outcomes as well. You know, the Australian government's committed to halting and reversing nature loss by 2030 and then full recovery, which is what nature positive is by 2050. So we've got to get the first steps right over the next ah five, six years towards halting and reversing nature loss. So it's if we focus on
Speaker: attracting investment, putting in place the policies, the principles, the vision, the targets for appearing and restoring nature through you large-scale conservation, both on public land, so the land that's managed by the the government, but also on private land.
Speaker: Working so closely with commercial entities, how do you convince them that this is in their best interest as well? If you go to China these days, you'll see electric cars, motor scooters, all clean. So they've managed to achieve multiple benefits through the cleaning of the air and you know silent streets and you know really building into large scale decarbonisation opportunities.
Speaker: What I think people in Australia don't appreciate is that China is moving at such a fast pace. And if we want to continue to be a provider of choice of products to China, know, like iron ore and then we need to be thinking about how to keep up with China.
Speaker: So China, for example, has an ecological environmental code And they have, it's a very clear code, not just around decarbonisation, but also around nature verification. So any enterprise that has, 100,000 um hundred thousand kilotons of CO2 per year, they are obliged to calculate and disclose their product level carbon footprints. And they also have to disclose what their nature footprint is.
Speaker: So they are going to be looking for materials and raw materials that have a disclosure requirement, that have a not just a disclosure requirement, but that are able to capture what their data, their nature data is. And if we want to be able to compete in the international marketplace, then we need to be able to know what what that footprint is. So it becomes, know, nature becomes not just this nice environmental add on, but it's fundamental to us continuing to engage with our major trading partners.
Speaker: I was in Shenzhen just a few months ago, and I saw all of the electric vehicles and electric motorbikes there. The city was totally silent. You could hear birds singing, and you could see just how fast the development is happening there. it was amazing to see it and then come back home, and it's quite sleepy here. So it's definitely a competitive issue to be a part of that advancement.
Speaker: um You're also ah part of Mekla. You helped to form Mekla. um Tell us about what MECLA is and what it hopes to achieve. our heart is the sharing of knowledge and information across different parts of the supply chain to drive those levers of change. So, you know, if manufacturers want to invest in low carbon materials, they're going to have to invest in the innovation. They've got capex that they need to invest in for their plant. And then unlikely to do it unless there's a demand side signal. So, you know, really setting up the infrastructure for how you consistently provide demand side signals is important. We had a demand side working group that was very active for a long time.
Speaker: time, we engage deeply with government agencies, you various transport and um transport and infrastructure bodies right across the different jurisdictions in Australia.
Speaker: And then we did a deep dive into the materials space. So we had working groups on steel, concrete, aluminium, engineered timber, other materials and assemblies and the residential working groups. So trying to address the specific problems and challenges in those working groups. We did a range of spotlight events and did some, you produced some materials. So for example, the low carbon concrete guide, we're now in our second version of that. It was put together by a whole range of volunteers from right across the cement and concrete supply chain.
Speaker: And the as a result of really good work that they did, i mean, that's collaboration, absolute collaboration in action. ah They managed to get yeah New South Wales government, South Australian government, Victoria, WA, ACT,
Speaker: all using you know the definition of low carbon concrete, providing guidance to local councils and other procurement agencies on how to go about procuring low carbon concrete and then the back end being the really deep technical detail for the different ah methods for assessing um concrete.
Speaker: So I understand you have a new report? Yes, well, we've just launched another report. It's called Homes and Habitats, Opportunities for the Built Environment and Infrastructure to Reverse Nature Decline. And we you know took the information from you this was a definitely collaborative effort a labor of love to look at the extent of clearing of land use in Queensland particularly around the built environment and although it is only one percent of all hectares cleared it affects the majority of the
Speaker: ecosystems in Queensland, up to 78% of those ecosystems because of the ecosystems along the coast where the people are, where the richest ecological value is. So it was really demonstrating that we have cleared a lot of land. the built environment infrastructure is responsible for clearing a lot of that of that land.
Speaker: However, it's not you know all a bad news story that if we look to protect ah the majority of those ecosystems and look at you know restoring 30%. So, you know, 30 by 30 is really important. Why is it 30%? Because the ecological ecologists tell us that if you can keep up to 30% or more of ecosystem, you have a greater chance of restoring it to keep the ecosystem intact. If you start clearing more than 30%, then you can lose the ecosystem altogether.
Speaker: So, you know, the analysis was pretty clear that we could do both passive restoration on a lot of those ecosystems, but also active restoration. And we would be able to retain the integrity of a lot of those ecosystems in Southeast Queensland. Now, there's no surprises, you know, Southeast Queensland is where a lot of the ecosystems have been reduced. So we need to be thinking about how we manage those well.
Speaker: and particularly at a time when we're talking about the rollout of of housing, um there are a number of urban exemptions that apply to some of those ecosystems. And if we do clear more of those areas, then those habitats will be completely irreplaceable, which would be very unfortunate for us. and I think what we learned through COVID is how important nature is around us. um So, you know, our recommendations are very clear that we should be, know, this is not about housing versus the environment. It's about how well we do
Speaker: we do the housing. So we really need to be thinking about the mitigation hierarchy, you know avoiding clearing where we can, know, minimizing that just destruction, you know, offsetting where we can and then regenerating, but also how we do density, know, build along transit corridors, be deliberate in the way that our planning decisions are made so that we do density really, really well. Of course, nature positive design is a fundamental part of that.
Speaker: process and there's some fantastic materials and tools available. So there's really no excuses for doing that. So i guess the key message that we have developed out of this particular report is to stop clearing those irreplaceable features and we need to be collaborating and looking at how we do um housing better. And I think it has connections both to you know the federal um department and environment minister. you know The Environmental Protection and Biodiversity Act is equally applicable here, how we preserve ah these large, precious ecosystems, but also the role that planning plays in being able to to do that. And hopefully you know we can, through our advocacy, ah look to leverage the good work of this report and build out more expectations for housing to be done done well.
Speaker: What's the next step for this report from the advocacycy advocacy point? Would that be legislation or reaching out to councils and developers and getting their involvement? I think it's a combination of things. So we are drafting some letters um to go to various ministers in Queensland and also to the federal federal environment minister seeking a a meeting to talk about our findings and you know hopefully to be looking at repeating this research. So the the data that we had access to is only up to 2017.
Speaker: The next sort of data will be released next year. So we want to do this again because, you know, we sort think that there'll be more. irreplaceable habitats that may have been lost, but also thinking to the future, you know, how how do we think about urban planning development with a sort of climate lens to it as well and what that future risk might be.
Speaker: One of the things that I'd really like to see is more focus also on the embodied nature impacts of materials. Now, you know that was way out of scope for this work, but I do think, you know, so tying this report together and the report that that we talked about for WA, i think there is a really important opportunity for us to get a handle of what those embodied nature impacts are and what we can do about it, you know, particularly because we are such an extractive economy and if we want to be competing in the in the international marketplace, we need to understand that in more detail. detail, but we've also got the opportunity to attract, again, you know international capital to invest in high integrity environmental markets. And there is a lot more work to do to structure what what those markets might look like for us and those projects might look like for us.
Speaker: What do you think our infrastructure listeners can do to help the World Wildlife Fund in these initiatives? I think education is the key, sort but a better understanding of what the, know, how to go about
Speaker: nature-positive infrastructure development, I think, is certainly something that more engineers are engaging with.
Speaker: So it comes back to that nature-positive um design, doesn't it? you know And I think that you know that education piece is important. um Definitely collaborating. And you know certainly one of the things we learned through MECLA is you know don't be afraid to ask. If you get a specification project, then you know is there a way to deviate from that, to have a better nature outcome? And and as we build out our muscle,
Speaker: ah to understand these issues better. And as we work with, you know, Treasury departments to understand the benefit-cost analysis of investing in nature up front, you know, maybe there are ways that we can kind of um coalesce to bring bring all of this this together. And we have to be stewards, obviously, to stewards for our to...
Speaker: um benefit to to collaborate together on this. If your listeners are looking for a place to have some impact and develop further education and an understanding of of a whole range of these issues, then going onto the MECLA website, signing up to the newsletter, becoming ah a um paying member, and really participating and and rolling up your sleeves and helping to pull these thought leadership pieces together is a really vital way to help develop your knowledge and understanding and being able to influence change right across Australia.
Speaker: I admire your optimism. I'm going to read a quote that you said. You said, this is a very exciting time to be alive. We're the first generation to be able to look into his history's past and learn from our mistakes and see into the future of what we're we're creating. And I thought that's so optimistic because that is really what it feels like right now, that we're finally at the point where we're shedding the past but we're and we're creating the future and we get to be a part of that creation.
Speaker: What do you tell young people about the future that we're creating? I can't not be honest that things are going to get more difficult before they get easier and that we need to work together and that they need to build their resilience muscle, you know, make sure they have really good friends around them, make sure they're doing work that they are deeply passionate about and looking to to make a difference, look after their mental health, get good sleep, you know, good nutrition,
Speaker: and to find their place in in in the world around us. I think that that's the thing that you know will keep us all all going through this time.
Speaker: What's one thing that you would recommend to people listening when it comes to it either sourcing or procuring low carbon products and creating that demand? think persistence in asking is the key.
Speaker: That's one of the key lessons that I certainly have learnt out of my time working intimately with the Mecla members is an observing what people have said that don't take no for an answer. Go and ask, go and find and be ah persistent in in asking because eventually it will turn around.
Speaker: That's great. Well, really appreciate you being on the show. It sounds like really exciting work. Thank you so much, Seth. Thanks for the invitation.
Speaker: And thank you for listening to another episode of Infrastructure Connections. Please take a moment to follow us wherever you get your podcasts, and we want to know your thoughts. Leave a comment down below to let us know what you think.
Speaker: Stay tuned for the next episode of Infrastructure Connections.
