Transcript
Karen Seinor: Hello and welcome to episode 28. Now we're in our series on permaculture so this is part three and we're talking about walking the zones. Now when you create a permaculture plan for your property for your space we look at the home as zone zero.
Karen Seinor: now normally there are there's zero one two three four and five of course me being me i've added a sixth one and i'll talk about that sort of at the end of the our chat today so zone zero is your home End.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. I mean, that's pretty uncomplicated, isn't it? It's the house. It's the residence that you live in. Now zone one. is the area that's closest to your house and it's a very very important zone.
Karen Seinor: And for me, what I initially had was I had um a couple of raised garden beds very close. to the end of the veranda. and Later, I changed that.
Karen Seinor: And then I swapped it back. All part of the learning, right? So you have your herbs, your... um your greens you know the things that you use a lot of so your silverbeet your spinach you know, parsley and and that sort of thing. um And my...
Karen Seinor: I had a originally I had a. a worm farm as well. and my chickens were all in zone one so that was all really close to the house. Now.
Karen Seinor: Um, Also compost. So basically, I was just stepping off the veranda and those things were all there. So there was no effort. And that's the beauty of it. There's no effort to access those things. So zone one is important. It's all the things that you access on a regular basis and you position things so that you're not going out of your way.
Karen Seinor: All right. So that's zone 1. And you want to look at your place. look at when you get out of your car. For example,
Karen Seinor: Which way do you walk to the house? like um For me often I'll walk through the side gate around the back so I'm actually walking past where I now have my herbs and greens located. again. So I can see things that are ready and
Karen Seinor: Yeah, it's it's uncomplicated. um So everything's flat and it's easy. So it supports me in. in that goal of aging in place.
Karen Seinor: the longevity. of this home for me as a woman of a certain age. I love that term. I think it's really cool. and And I don't really care about age, but...
Karen Seinor: Yeah, it sounds fun. Sounds mysterious. and Okay, so zone two. Zone 2. is let me Just see what I've... put here.
Karen Seinor: um Well, Zone 2 actually is my orchard. I couldn't find it. but um So... yeah zone two is the orchard let me just pause this and I'll double check I should trust myself better of course it's the orchard so that's actually on that.
Karen Seinor: top section the the sort of flattish kind of area and moving up towards Delaney Street on that. that kind of bank there. So up there i've got lemon mulberry tree i've got a couple of cherries i've got um what i thought was a dwarf pair because that's what it was called it was called the 1875.
Karen Seinor: conference. dwarf pear and I thought I was getting a pear tree. No. It's actually a quince but because back in 1875, that's what they used to call quinces.
Karen Seinor: It's Pierce. Go figure. Either that or Diggers has made a big boo -boo. But I'm pretty sure that's what it used to be. so And I'm i'm looking that at, and i so I've spoken previously in the last episode about blueberries ah being up on that bank as well and how they can manage.
Karen Seinor: the the shade. that is for throughout winter it takes up half of that bank And half of that that flatter area.
Karen Seinor: between zone one. and the bank zone. three. um Yeah. The zone two, sorry. Yeah, the Orchard Zone too.
Karen Seinor: I'm confusing myself. Because I'm not looking at my plan, you see. I like to have a look at things So please do look at the video presentation. I don't i don't have that. floating around.
Karen Seinor: um It's up on the website. so Yeah, so... Berries, a very good thing. now We don't need those really close to the house because they're seasonal. It's not an everyday thing.
Karen Seinor: So it's fine for us to actually go and access those things. And the bees, my beehives are actually... in that area as well. sit on the flat area before the bank.
Karen Seinor: So... the berries still haven't been added to the bank that will come I've still got them here in pots and things. um because at the moment that bank is still a wild place. and I've got some lavenders up there.
Karen Seinor: and lots of grass growing underneath those fruit trees. One of the things that I've discovered since um being here for a couple of years is that the fruit fly does get into the quinces.
Karen Seinor: and I have to be quick with the mulberry tree so that I beat the birds. Now what I've done this year is i've I've cut that mulberry tree back really hard. and I'll probably knit it.
Karen Seinor: But one of the issues is that it's growing on a pretty steep slope. And I've got to be careful when I'm reaching out to collect. the mulberry so i really need to see if i can get the grandkids to come and visit when they're um about to ripen so that they can collect them for me they're a little bit more agile and and quite happy to hang off branches and and um so on Yeah. But they're quite nice. um
Karen Seinor: And really, I got the mulberry because of a beautiful... childhood memory, to be honest with you. um they're bloody humongous trees they grow really really large so not ideal for a small garden but that position up there it does work and it can sort of be the overstory, the canopy.
Karen Seinor: and the understory can be those blueberries and and I've also got bramble berries and Passion fruit. that are growing around my water tank.
Karen Seinor: Because I've got a great big water tank on the morning sun side, on the eastern side of the house. There's no windows looking out to that. the windows are just north and south. And... um Yeah so I can walk out there that's still really close to the house. I can walk out there, it's on flat ground and I can just stand there with a cup of coffee and pick bramble berries and...
Karen Seinor: stand there and eat them while I'm sort of looking at the sky and listening to the chickens and and all that sort of thing. and Yeah, the passion fruit. Oh my gosh, those passion flute fruit flowers are... absolutely sensational they are so divine Hmm.
Karen Seinor: I've actually planted another passion fruit just this spring. because my understanding is that they only last about five years. So I want to make sure that I don't go without Passion Fruit because they're really great. I love them.
Karen Seinor: I love using them on in desserts and things like that. But also you can... you know scoop out the the insides or the pips and the sweetness and put it in ice cube trays freeze it and then once they're frozen pop them into a plastic container and keep them in the freezer so you have them all year round super good super good um Yeah, so...
Karen Seinor: That's zone two. Now zone 3. Interesting one. That's where Originally, That was on that lower level.
Karen Seinor: It's like two sleepers down from the flat area where that the house is sitting on. And that's where I put my raised garden beds. And I selected those. Originally, I was going to use wicking beds. And then I was like, yeah, no, I don't want to have to redo this because.
Karen Seinor: the wicking beds are using IBCs, those big plastic things, and I thought they're going to degrade in a couple of years. I don't want to have to do that all over again. So I went with... um The raised garden beds out of Colourbond. I actually chose the same colour as the house because that was my girly matchy -matchy thing.
Karen Seinor: in Hindsight. it probably would have been a better choice. to just go for normal corrugated iron to deflect the heat. Because in the summer, it can, you know, the... the dark color because of my place's um monument it's not black but it's Pretty dark.
Karen Seinor: um it it holds the heat so whereas the sort of silvery colour. you know, Zinc alone ones sort of reflect the heat a bit but the opposite.
Karen Seinor: in the winter. So. Hmm. Depends on the season you're growing, right? depends on the season you're growing and really Uh...
Karen Seinor: I get a bit more serious about growing in the winter. and summer is a bit more play. nice fun things. as I've mentioned previously. So... Originally, Zone 3 was for the crops.
Karen Seinor: and it was located there Now, after I had that trip and broke that bone in my foot. I realised I couldn't do that step down. It was it. very difficult for me to do that and I thought okay this is a great opportunity to rework.
Karen Seinor: my system. to ensure that If something happens, I can still access what's important. So my son, God love him.
Karen Seinor: in the heat of summer. in January. um end of December, early January, he... um
Karen Seinor: muscled up and basically moved all of those for me. Up. onto the flat area around the house so where i come in the side gate so it's zone one basically very close to the house in the flat area so that means that no matter what even if I was on crutches, I can actually access that because I'm not having to do a step down.
Karen Seinor: And what I've done with Zone 3... is I've turned that into a meadow. So it's a bee garden. And at the moment I've got Queen Anne's Lace. ah There's just a huge amount of borage. There's alfalfa, very great for making tea.
Karen Seinor: um When I first... turned it into a bee garden I put a lot of chamomile down I spent quite a bit of money to do that And that was not a good plan. it The chickens got in there. Those girls love chamomile.
Karen Seinor: and they just absolutely hammered it. So there's only a few bits of... chamomile in amongst it. um And I've got heaps of strawberries in there. They've just run wild. So that's quite wonderful because there's lots of beautiful flowers and also the fruit. And I can wander through there and just pick them.
Karen Seinor: um and That's quite fun, but it keeps keeps the weeds down as well. And I've got some zinnias in there and and... and quite a few things lemon balm Um...
Karen Seinor: I've put some... bits of that um Old style corn, not sweet corn, but the stuff that the Native American Indians used to use. Is it maize?
Karen Seinor: It's a beautiful colour with popcorn corn. I think. It's like... green and brown and red. It's got all these beautiful colors. So i I grow some of that every year. I think because it's so beautiful.
Karen Seinor: and I use it as part of my ritual for Um, wheel of the year actually. Beautiful stuff. um What else? Yeah, so I've got some herbs down there, but... Mostly it's for the bees, the flowers for the bees.
Karen Seinor: Okay, so that was a change. And that's one of the things with permaculture. You create your system and then... as life is happening and you discover more things you can just make an adjustment even um I forget what they're called now, but it's a love it's it's got a special name.
Karen Seinor: Uh... fundamentally, I... planted some gorgeous little Gosh, what are they called? The little orange fruits, they're citrus fruits.
Karen Seinor: Anyway, I thought that I'd love to grow some of those. I've but ah got two of them and I put herbs around them and I put them out here. on the Hodge Street. side. on the grass between um the two sets of Retaining walls.
Karen Seinor: End. I thought that would look pretty. which is very lovely but you know what it was an absolute pain because that's my walkthrough from the driveway.
Karen Seinor: Up. between. these two zones and it's nice and easy it's also easy to mow because i've got grass there um So in the end I pulled those out and I popped them in some barrels.
Karen Seinor: and um Last season I picked those gorgeous little fruits and I put them in brandy. And they are gorgeous. And they make a great gift. You know, you dip. half of it. get down out of the brandy dip half into dark chocolate and set it aside to dry and then you can package it up and oh my gosh it's a rock and roll christmas um Gift for sure.
Karen Seinor: so it's it's That's got a special name. i can't remember what it is now because it's quite a it's about I don't know. um, six years ago. that I did that.
Karen Seinor: and uh... gosh i'm so annoyed that i can't remember what the name of that fruit is but anyway or the system So that's zone three. Now...
Karen Seinor: Zone 4 is an interesting one. That is... the space outside of my border. outside of my fence line.
Karen Seinor: And. So it's my nature strip. and it is the medium strip. that goes up the middle of Delaney Street. So I'm on a crossroads.
Karen Seinor: and If I look diagonally across the crossroads, there's a median strip in the middle of Delaney Street up on the top end which takes you all the way up into the bush.
Karen Seinor: So the bush is actually zone five. And the beauty. of that. is that we can connect. So this garden can stay connected to a natural environment.
Karen Seinor: and What I've... been doing. so this year. actually is i've been planting uh native shrubs on my nature strip.
Karen Seinor: And putting. you know mulch and all that sort of stuff on top One reason obviously is it's part of my permaculture plan to connect. with Zone 5, the natural bush, so that there can be this this wonderful um connection. The birds, like, for example, the blue rings, if I have enough spikey sort of...
Karen Seinor: um natives on my nature strip. then they will be safe that is a great environment for them to come in and be able to axis Um,
Karen Seinor: you know the bottle brush and all that sort of stuff and I get a lot of birds here it's actually beautiful. your morning coffee here in the spring is absolutely entertaining.
Karen Seinor: Rosellas you name it, they hang upside down, they misbehave. it's It's so beautiful. um
Karen Seinor: I've got a friend who hasn't been here for a while. She's moved away, but um she knows all the birds. and She goes, oh, yeah, that's a thatta thatta. And that's a thatta. I'm not so good at that, but I just love their antics and and appreciate their presence here. It just feels. alive and for me of course what I'm doing is I'm noticing what's going on from a symbolic perspective because that's what I get off on. um you know.
Karen Seinor: Three birds flying across the sky. Three of swords, that sort of stuff. Um, Yeah, so... my crops have actually come up.
Karen Seinor: into this different zone. and So zone four. is quite special. And, you know, that might be your nature strip as well. Now, one of the challenges that I have in connecting my zone four.
Karen Seinor: Um, to like my place zone three up the median strip which is zone four up into the bush which is zone five is that I've got Hold straight.
Karen Seinor: So i'm on I'm on the corner of Hodge and Delaney. and the median strip is across Hodge Street. So. My little birdies have got to be able to be safe.
Karen Seinor: to cross the road. And those little ones. at It's too far for them. So I get bigger birds, not the tiny wrens.
Karen Seinor: one of my neighbors Um, Well, a couple of my neighbors, actually. um A couple who live diagonally opposite. and up a little bit.
Karen Seinor: um on Delaney. they have been planting natives on that median strip out the front of their place. And somebody who lives further up Delaney has also done the same thing. So it's like there seems to be this this group think. It must be people of a similar... um frequency you know we're all hanging out here together and this lovely couple who live.
Karen Seinor: also on Hodge Street. and just next door to that couple they are currently um basically tilling the soil on their nature strip and they are going to plant natives there as well to do the same thing. So...
Karen Seinor: I'm very excited about that. I think that's a wonderful thing. And of course. Hodge Street goes all the way to the golf course, the Albury Golf Course. So, you know, if everybody did that, we'd create this beautiful...
Karen Seinor: Um. safe. space maybe not so safe for us driving on the road because we do get a few kangaroos and stuff here but um Yeah.
Karen Seinor: A wildlife corridor, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah. Um, So... Let's talk about zone six, which is what. I...
Karen Seinor: have added into my system. And that is not the norm. And I call this i call this Zone 6 the inner landscape. Now, as a therapist,
Karen Seinor: and reader of cards, the psychic, healing person. That inner landscape is super, super important to me. And it's put whats part of my vision. I've spoken about the vision I had for this place, even though it was a big... big shiny vision. I was a bit scared to put it out there. um Yeah.
Karen Seinor: I actually think about this place as a goddess's garden. End. that it is a place where we can truly connect with that. that deep feminine energy, the nurturing positive feminine energy.
Karen Seinor: and um
Karen Seinor: You know, when I Excuse me, I'm just going to cough. I'm going to pause this because I'm going to cough. Yeah, so... One of the things that's been... really important to me is that when I first started doing this permaculture course oi I kind of...
Karen Seinor: I was a bit of a perfectionist really. I was a workaholic to be honest and I didn't really understand that at the time. I was a little burnt out from um working very hard for a very long time. I'd made it to here. That was a big goal for me. And it wasn't the easiest thing on the planet to do as a single woman, self -employed, you know. um It.
Karen Seinor: it was ah ah an achievement for me. and It was important for me to create this sacred space. Because that's what I've done in my work as well.
Karen Seinor: So somehow or another I had to create this sacred space for myself and I knew that that all had to do with slowing down. Now, interestingly enough, when I was um doing my permaculture course. I actually got really ill.
Karen Seinor: in the winter time and I got so sick that I couldn't go to school for a couple of weeks. And so I was home. not able to go in. And that meant I had no energy. I would sit on the back veranda.
Karen Seinor: with a rug over my knees and Hot tea. And I'd look out at the garden and I'd go, well... If I don't get better... This could be it.
Karen Seinor: And I came to a place where I was able to be happy. with exactly how it is. and I shifted my mind from, oh my God, this is a list of things to do, a big task list. do this do this do this and just got into this place of deep appreciation. so I kind of had to be stopped in a way.
Karen Seinor: to really move into this in a like inner landscape even though intellectually I had planned it and um had intentionally created it.
Karen Seinor: I needed to move into it. And I had to get sick to do that. So... I suggest that you actually just slide in and don't get sick, you know, do it do it smarter than me, right? So it's all about slowing down.
Karen Seinor: Breathing a little slower, breathing a tiny bit deeper, not too much. and creating places to watch nature and to just be. with it. Yeah.
Karen Seinor: um And I mean, permaculture. in itself. moves us to a place where we can observe nature doing her thing.
Karen Seinor: We can see it happening before our very eyes when we slow down and just you know get into it. Like without pushing, without...
Karen Seinor: um forcing anything to happen quickly. And that's part of the gig. You know, it's like those trees that I planted on that grassy section between the two retaining walls out the front and on the south side.
Karen Seinor: I was. I was pushing. a little too hard if i'd waited perhaps perhaps if i'd waited and been slow and really considered it a little more deeply.
Karen Seinor: then perhaps I would. not have done that. But I've learned that I have to actually just slow right down. and allow the seasons to show me.
Karen Seinor: what needs to happen. It's like the chamomile in the bee garden. it's beautiful it's great i had made some divine solstice tea with it um But... It's not hardy enough.
Karen Seinor: for the environment. It requires too much work, shall we say. So. What this is really about, this zone six, the inner landscape, is it allows us, it supports us to remember.
Karen Seinor: Who we are. And you know what I mean by that. We need to remember. But we also need to... Put our members, our arms and our legs back on. We need to put ourselves back together. And that's kind of what I mean by remembering.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. And it's so it's about our mental and emotional well -being, which is another reason that we're not going for perfection. Even if you are a little bit... quirky And you want everything to be matchy matchy.
Karen Seinor: And I totally get that. I totally understand. um it's often not the best, it's not the most efficient way to be. um creating.
Karen Seinor: Sometimes it's those ad hoc things. um Yeah, so... and And one of the things is that when you, like, for example,
Karen Seinor: I had a friend bring me a beautiful bedhead. pay degree. and it's leaning up against the fence behind the shed at the moment it's been there for probably 18 months i know i'm going to use it for something And I'm not exactly sure where yet, but it's there. and when the exact right thing comes up or use it.
Karen Seinor: Now that's a bit bitsy, a little bit messy, but it can also be a little arty too. So it's all about where you put your head, right? Yeah. So. Creativity.
Karen Seinor: can flow when you slow. Yeah. Okay, so...
Karen Seinor: Yeah, now the other thing I just wanted to touch on was seed saving. That's a really important thing. two. um
Karen Seinor: In a suburban situation like this Saving seeds is not necessarily going to be ideal. And what I mean by that, one of the things that we learned. um in our permaculture course, which was amazing.
Karen Seinor: Uh, is that... For example, pumpkins. If I grow four different kinds of pumpkins here there's going to be cross pollination. And so we're not going to get the true pumpkin. It will lose some of its strengths and things. And in if I save...
Karen Seinor: um seeds from that you know the second generation the third generation it gets all weird and warbly But what's very interesting... is All these different plants that we grow in our veggie gardens, they need to have be, different plants need a different distance.
Karen Seinor: from another variety of that same plant otherwise cross -pollination will happen and we lose the heirloom quality the purity of the seed And we can end up with... you know veggies that don't actually work.
Karen Seinor: So... To some degree. seed saving is not that easy in a suburban area and to be honest with you I I am. buying seeds from a couple of different heirloom places. Diggers is one of them. There's also a couple of other ones. There's a local one, Happy Valley Seeds.
Karen Seinor: um which is in my region and there is another one that I can't remember the name of right now but there's a few different options so if you're suburban like me that might be something for you. Also, there's a Seed Savers Club and you can...
Karen Seinor: Join that. Save seeds. Um, And you can get seeds from them as well. It's quite educational, nice people. ah if your schedule works with when they do their meetings and things.
Karen Seinor: And seeds are life. Yep. So... And if you try if you buy seeds from Bunnings. they those plants are it's very unlikely that they and you collect the seeds it's very unlikely that they'll grow the following day.
Karen Seinor: And watch the date. That that has an impact too. Seed saving is a whole art. um I've got a big... Excel spreadsheet somewhere in my notes.
Karen Seinor: that tells you the distance. ah that. You have to be away from. another variety to stop that cross -pollination so if you do live in a really rural area you can actually match up with other people go on i'll grow this one and if you grow that one and if you're far enough away you can then just share and i mean there's a lot of uh food sharing that's going on now and we want that to happen.
Karen Seinor: it's through food that we can actually build community. So. Yeah. So this is us talking about walking the zones and I've thrown a few other things in there, the seed savers and whatnot, a few little funny weird stories. And yeah.
Karen Seinor: I will come back to you with another episode. in the not too distant future. Thanks so much for hanging in here with me. Ciao for now.
