Transcript
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Tom Evans: and to think they said it would never happen. Welcome to The Last Hour, a podcast all about cricket on Merseyside and occasionally beyond. I'm Tom Evans of Merseyside Cricket Online, and for the last few years I've been travelling around the region covering cricket matches for my website and for Liverpool Echo.
Tom Evans: What started with polite inquiries, one person, grew into a crescendo, two people, so I could hold back the tide of public opinion no longer and have started a podcast. The one thing I don't want is for this to just be me reading out loud the same kind of things I publish online anyway.
Tom Evans: Writing and podcasting are different kinds of platform, good for capturing different things. And what want to capture here is more of the flavour and the personality of Club Cricket and its culture on Merseyside. I can't promise how this is going to go, but the one thing I can promise is that this podcast will never take itself or cricket too seriously.
Tom Evans: Now, I know what you're thinking. You're thinking that guy who hangs around outside the changing rooms after the games, he's definitely charismatic enough to do a podcast all by himself. And it's honestly very sweet of you to think that, but you're wrong.
Tom Evans: So it's my pleasure to introduce my co-host, Jamie Bowman. Jamie, how are you?
Jamie Bowman : Hi, Tom. good to make Good to see you. Good to hear you.
Tom Evans: Yeah, yeah. um Looking forward to this.
Jamie Bowman : Very much so.
Tom Evans: a
Jamie Bowman : I was one of those people clamouring for it.
Tom Evans: You were part of the clamour.
Jamie Bowman : I was. I was. I can't wait.
Tom Evans: Well, The Last Hour is called The Last Hour because it's our favourite part of a time cricket match of it.
Karl: Thank you.
Tom Evans: A real wacky show where anything can go, to quote the theme tune to CITV's Funhouse. The other thing about the last hour in a cricket match is that it rarely lasts exactly an hour, and that's something else that we'll have in common with this podcast.
Tom Evans: ah Any podcast lives and dies by the quality of its guests, and I'm delighted to welcome our first guest. ah He's had a 12-year career in first-class cricket with Lancashire, in which he scored 3,572 runs a part the 2011 County Championship win with 888 runs,
Tom Evans: with two hundreds twenty two fifty s and of course played a key part and the twenty eleven ch county championship went with eight hundred and eighty eight runs More locally, he's been a mainstay at Leeds since 2008 and had a season at Formby in 2018.
Tom Evans: and His time at Leeds, he of course won the Liverpool competition title in 2016. He is of course Carl Brown. Carl, thank you very much for coming on.
Karl: No problem, thanks for having me, Tom.
Tom Evans: Nice one. um You wintering well?
Karl: and You could say that. and Yeah, just just about ready, I think, for a bit of warmer weather and and some cricket, definitely.
Jamie Bowman : you like winterette Do you like winter nets, Carl, or is it something that gets on your nerves?
Tom Evans: Nice ones.
Karl: No, I absolutely hate winter nets. and I can hold minds if I say that I haven't been to any yet.
Jamie Bowman : Good man.
Karl: and Yeah, so, yeah, that probably tells you everything you need to know about my thoughts on winter nets. But, yeah, I will be having to drag myself to the nets at some stage, I suppose, but not just yet.
Jamie Bowman : so remarkable It's all muscle memory now, Carl, all muscle memory.
Tom Evans: To be fair, think those credentials I read out earlier yeah yeah gives gives you a pass from going to internet, I guess, doesn't it
Karl: and ah Yeah, I mean, I'll use any excuse, to be honest.
Tom Evans: it?
Karl: Yeah, I like riding a bike.
Jamie Bowman : yeah Good man. Well, thanks for joining us.
Karl: No problem. Thanks for having me
Tom Evans: Cheers. I guess ah locally, um the big news, obviously, it's still and're about six or eight weeks away from the start of the season, Liverpool competition. and But Northern have, of of of ah course, been in action in the European Cricket League, which is a relatively new competition, a T10 competition, and it's for winners of...
Tom Evans: national competitions in ah in various European countries, obviously by winning the national T20 last year, Northern qualified for it. They were the first Liverpool competition side to to qualify for it. And as such, it's been streamed to, I think, three or 4,000 people at times um on on YouTube over the past week. Did you catch much of it, Jamie?
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, and I have to say I enjoyed it. Just the sheer novelty of seeing players you know ah from the Liverpool competition on the screen is is something that is hard to resist, really.
Jamie Bowman : But no, I thought some of the cricket was great. Some of the needle was very enjoyable as well. And some of the commentary as well. I'm never never going to get the phrase Maximo out of my head, don't think.
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Tom Evans: Yeah, I think but rather than just saying Maximo when there was a six, he was going a bit further than i He was trying to actually rebrand the six as the Maximo. I'm not sure I'm completely on board with that.
Tom Evans: um When he was reading the batter's stats out at the end of an innings, he'd say, oh, he scored four fours and five Maximos.
Jamie Bowman : Okay.
Tom Evans: No, say what you like. Get excited when there's been a six. Say what you like. don't Don't try and call it a Maximo. That's not what it's called. There's already a name for it. But yeah, it's it's good to hear some ah so enthusiasm, I guess. And ah as as ah as a competition, as a concept, I really liked it. um Did you catch much of it, Cal?
Karl: um I didn't, to be honest. I saw little bits of it.
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Karl: I know from various WhatsApp groups, you know, things were being put in there. and So, yeah, I think some of the lads watched it. and I, yeah, I saw very little of it, if I'm being honest. But um I think it's, yeah, great exposure for Northern as a club and and the comp as well to be playing on a European stage. So I think, yeah, great to see.
Tom Evans: Very much so. Yeah, sort of people who are kind of household names to us as local cricket reporters are sort of becoming more so to so people around the the wider cricket world, which which can only be good.
Tom Evans: um what What do you make of T10 as a format, Kyle? Do you think it's it's it's a bit too bit too short or you are you a fan of the the shorter formats?
Karl: um Yeah, that's an interesting one. um I think for me, it's probably a little bit too short. and i mean, I'm somebody that when the 100 came in was but sort of saying, why why is it not just a T20 comp?
Karl: And I think, to be honest, I still probably hold that view. Having seen the 100 for a for whatever however many years it's been going now, ah think T20 feels about right.
Karl: and
Tom Evans: Mm-hmm.
Karl: in terms of it being short enough and for it to be, yeah I think short enough for it to be you ah format that is challenging in a different way. But also I think there is still a lot of skill involved, whereas I think T10 sometimes can probably come down to a little bit too much luck at times.
Tom Evans: Yeah, at T20, there is sort of time for... ah The cliche that's used ebb and flow, isn't it? and There is ah there's time for a bit of that in T20. Players have been playing it for long enough now that I guess that if they have a bad power play, they know what they need to do in order to recover. and it's just It's so compressed, isn't it?
Karl: Yeah,
Karl: I totally agree. I think 10-over cricket, you're obviously just literally swinging at every ball. so
Tom Evans: Mm-hmm.
Karl: i think T20 cricket for bowlers is is tough enough as it is, but then think you're you're making it almost impossible with 10-over cricket.
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Jamie Bowman : There were some um horrific figures, weren't there? I mean, I did feel sorry for some of the bowlers in that. I mean, when you're scoring 150 10 overs, work for the bowlers, isn't it? <unk>s hard hard work for the bowlers isn't it
Karl: Yeah, I think, well, what chance have you got, especially when teams have have still got 10 wickets? I mean, if you're going to play a 10-over game, then why not half the wickets as well? And then you're probably bringing in some sort of tactical element with the bat into play as well, whereas ah but as it stands, you literally just swing off your feet and see what happens, I think, when you've got 10 wickets.
Tom Evans: That's a good point, because you're very unlikely to get bowled out in a 10-over game, aren't you?
Jamie Bowman : But of course, yeah. yeah
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Karl: Yeah, I think there's yeah very little chance of that that happening. yeah
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : I mean, what was extraordinary about that final as well was
Jamie Bowman : Northern played, almost played a T8, didn't they? Because it was because of those first two overs.
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : um
Tom Evans: E8, I guess.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, perhaps we should perhaps we should speak about the final because it was pretty extraordinary, wasn't it?
Tom Evans: which
Tom Evans: Northern narrowly lost. Hon Church, as Jamie said, Northern barely scored a run off the first three overs and still managed to put on 150 odd. Liam Gray and Alex Vincent, the Aussie all-rounder, both batted very well, very destructively.
Tom Evans: And then Hornchurch, mainly thanks to Pakistani all-rounder Mohamed Erfan, chased it down off the penultimate ball. um So was very, very dramatic. And I guess that's what they were going for. You know, they got the they got the drama they wanted and the the two strongest teams in the group really really going at each other. And it was ah it was a really good spectacle.
Tom Evans: good Good for the game as a whole, you have to say.
Jamie Bowman : And there were a couple of, you know, faces we remember from the comp as well, wasn't there? We we we saw a Cobain there, didn't And a Gavin Griffiths.
Tom Evans: Yeah, Gavin Griffiths is a Hornchurch player these days. He was playing for the league last year. Cobain was a short-term signing just for just for just for this tournament. And i guess, you know, they, as we all do, know what you can do. And um he sort of he showed a bit in that final. I think he was overshadowed by Irfan, but he still got 20-odd off 11 balls or something, you know, which, you know, if you're able to do that, then there's a and so plenty of opportunities. um
Jamie Bowman : fair play to Northern though, because they didn't bring in any players like that, did they?
Jamie Bowman : They they they very much picked from their their stock of players, um despite and you know they were they were hampered with an injury to James Cole as well, weren't they?
Jamie Bowman : So fair play to them, they really gave Hornchurch a game.
Tom Evans: Yeah, yeah, it's definitely definitely very close and it showed the the strength of the squad that they were able to do that. The the the two new players in the northern side were genuine signings who were going to be playing for them in the league this summer and they were both like-for-like replacements for to two lads in the top order who'd left. So um I think it showed James was speaking to me before the tournament and he said that was the way they wanted to do things. you know They didn't want to go down the road um of bringing in players, especially for the tournament and you know there were you know basically one ball or two balls going differently away from away from winning that final and going back for the championship week. But it wasn't to me this time, but a great experience and great exposure for the club.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, brilliant. Well done, Norvan.
Tom Evans: Yeah. um Less well done to England, who were terrible. I think most people expected them to be bad in the Champions Trophy, but I don't think doesnt we expected them to be this bad, did we?
Jamie Bowman : Well, you know, i think the Australia game was crucial, wasn't it? they Perhaps they weren't that bad in that game. I mean, if they'd won that game, everything would have been different.
Jamie Bowman : But, you know, and when when you rack up a score like that against the Aussies, you you hope the bowlers back it up. But, yeah, it was hugely disappointing. And I think, you know, we're going to see ah see a few, well, we've already seen ah the captain stand down, Joss Butler, you know, of these parts occasionally.
Jamie Bowman : and And, yeah, we're going to see quite a lot of change, I think. And, yeah, what you what do you think, Carl? Did you get to see much of the tournament?
Karl: I think, as you said, obviously it's disappointing. and But I think with obviously Josh stepping down now, it sort of feels like a yeah they so it feels like
Tom Evans: very much.
Karl: ah good time for them to to reset and and try and build towards something. something new, I guess. and I don't think that they're not short of talent, are they? That's one thing I think we we can definitely say, that the talent is there. I think they just need to sort of find that that sort of identity as a team and then I think build their confidence because to me, I think it just looks like there is literally no confidence at the moment.
Karl: and And that will happen sort of with the with the results that they've had. But I think it's yeahs it's just at a point now where a clean they need a clean slate, a fresh start.
Karl: Obviously, a new captain is going to be coming in and hopefully then they can kick on and ah move forward with it. But like say, I can still see them doing well in the near future just because of the talent that they've got available.
Tom Evans: Yeah, it says it's it's finding, it's sort of getting that talent together in a team. I think it's, you know, as it turned out, that the South Africa game was a bit of a but of a walkover. but ah I think partly because England were already eliminated, it must be very hard to sort of get yourself up for that kind of game. But it if someone had stuck around with Joe Root against Afghanistan, for example, then England would have chased that total down.
Tom Evans: without much trouble, but because it was only Joe Root on his own, as soon as he'd gone, you know, that there there was nobody else there who can sort of... I don't get the impression there's anybody else there who can bat for 40 overs while scoring at a fast enough rate, you know.
Karl: Yeah, I'd have to agree with that. But yeah, I mean, for me, it's it's very easy when something like that happens to to sort of tear everything apart. But ah in my opinion, I don't think they're too they're too far away with the with the personnel they've got.
Tom Evans: Mm-hmm.
Karl: and Yeah, they possibly just need a little bit of a different approach.
Tom Evans: I have a question.
Karl: Yeah. And a lot of things can change after a couple of wins. The confidence comes back and you're probably looking at a very different ah very different team then. But I think, yeah, over the of the obviously the Champions Trophy, that's just a team very low on confidence. And hopefully in in a sort of a bit less of a pressurised situation, they can sort of find their way through it and, and yeah, find their way back to some form.
Jamie Bowman : Carl, you must have, I mean, obviously you played a lot of 50 over cricket for for Lancashire.
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Jamie Bowman : how how do you How do you feel about that that format? It's kind of been sidelined a bit in the in the English County game. I mean, you think do you think it'll ever make a comeback?
Jamie Bowman : Or I mean, what what do you think going to happen to the 50 over game?
Karl: and Yeah, that's ah it's a difficult one to assess. I think ah
Karl: ah do i do like the format.
Tom Evans: Yes.
Karl: and I think it presents different challenges.
Tom Evans: Yes.
Karl: and And obviously, with the be as long as there's a 50-over World Cup, then you know why wouldn't there be a reason you know not to play play it?
Jamie Bowman : Yeah. Yeah.
Karl: i think I think they missed a trick a few years back when when they brought in the Pro 40 league. and I could be wrong, but I remember playing against the likes of um Holland, Scotland, within that competition as well.
Jamie Bowman : yeah yeah
Karl: I thought that was actually really good. and Playing the 40 over format, I felt, almost helped. and condense the game a little bit So I think that almost helped when people moved up to international cricket as well.
Tom Evans: It's not a problem.
Karl: and That's just my opinion, but I felt there was no sort of reason to change that. I think yeah if there's going to be a 50-over World Cup, then great. But I really liked it as a 40-over competition and and then that obviously got changed.
Karl: And now it really has been put on the back burner because...
Jamie Bowman : Mm-hmm.
Karl: ah it's sort of playing second, third fiddle to other competitions so it's disappointing but I think and as as we've seen with the 100 over the last sort of few months and the franchises being sold etc it has brought a lot of money into the game so what's the right thing to do?
Tom Evans: you.
Karl: i mean obviously money's important because it allows you to do different things and and grow the game etc but
Karl: what is the best thing what is the best thing to to create a best you know your best England team.
Jamie Bowman : I suppose.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah.
Karl: and um I'm not sure by putting 50 over comp on on the back burner is the the right way to go.
Jamie Bowman : I suppose one of the positives has been the way Lancashire have introduced a lot of young local players into into the squad, haven't they?
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Jamie Bowman : and And they've sort brought them through the that format, the the Royal London Cup. And you've seen you've seen, you know, boy, lads, you know, you probably know yourself, you know, have come through and and played.
Jamie Bowman : it's it's it's It's given ah an opportunity to to to some younger players, isn't it?
Karl: Yeah, it has. It's given a lot of exposure to younger players. and I think and that is probably the one positive that that's come from it.
Karl: I can't think of too many more.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah. No, no. no no
Tom Evans: No.
Karl: That's just being brutally honest. and But I think any any competition that allows younger players to... to have exposure to professional cricket is good. and I think the gap between county second-eleven cricket and first-team cricket has got a hell of a lot bigger over over the last few years with counties um having smaller squads, I think.
Karl: So to give younger players that exposure at that higher level, Yeah, I think that that can only be a positive thing for for younger players and developing younger players, I think.
Karl: But the competition as a whole is is definitely devalued and because yeah a lot of the a lot of the players are playing in the 100, aren't they?
Karl: So they're not even available.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah. Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Tom Evans: the The calendar hasn't been settled for a long time, now has it?
Jamie Bowman : Yeah.
Tom Evans: I mean, if you look at, you know, looking at the long-term perspective, you know, England were bound to get worse. worse than they were in 2015 to 2019 when they were comfortably, in my opinion, the best one-day side in the world, um culminating in that World Cup win, which wasn't comfortable as it turned out. But for the four years before that, they'd been playing outstanding 50 over cricket and they had, you know, you wouldn't say there was a weak link in that side.
Tom Evans: but A team is always going to get worse from that, from that position. that's That's just natural because, you know players retire. Owen Morgan's captaincy was so crucial to it, you know. Um,
Tom Evans: the the bowling in the middle overs of you know the likes of Liam Plunkett, for example, are crucial to that World Cup win. um If the personnel aren't available, then he can't always replace them with with new players.
Tom Evans: It's more about having to sort of change the system so to adapt to the the talent that there is, I guess. But... we don't seem to be able to settle on a calendar, you know, even even before the 100. Like you said, like you alluded to before, Carl, they were changing the length the of the one-day games from between 40 and 50 overs.
Tom Evans: And, you know, there was this seems to have certainly since the blast started, or since the T20 Cup, as it was, started in 2003, there seems to have been this kind of struggle between the different formats, trying to cram them all into the few months of sunshine we get in this country. And...
Tom Evans: I honestly don't know that there is an answer that will satisfy everybody, that will satisfy the county championship purists and the people who want to see England winning one-day World Cups and the counties themselves who want the income from the blast and the ECB who wants to push their new format.
Tom Evans: it's it's It's a question I don't think that has got an answer that's perfect for everybody. I think it's a question of finding the find the least bad way of doing it almost.
Karl: Yeah, I think yeah the schedule's been all over the all over the place, as you said, for for a good few years. and ah think probably the only way that you you can sort of get to any sort of solution that's that's probably ah good one for it, for for the players, I guess, especially, is that
Tom Evans: Thank
Karl: It's probably just to reduce county championship cricket, but I know that the that conversation's, I think, been been had before. It's been reduced a little bit and then, yeah, it's so difficult.
Karl: But I think, yeah, that the championship for me, I think where they're almost playing games into sort of October at the back end now. It's it's it's a little bit ridiculous, but...
Karl: Yeah, I don't see a way of it becoming better unless we probably lose a few more championship games, but that's probably going to upset quite a few people.
Tom Evans: Yes.
Jamie Bowman : Thank you.
Tom Evans: Yeah, yeah. and Particularly a lot of the, you know, a lot of the members who, you know, that's the model that the counties have, isn't it? That they're funded and they're supported by the members who are, you know, I don't want you know, not sort stereotyping people here, but they tend to be older, they tend to be more sort of small C conservative and want want their county championship to be the main focus. Yeah.
Karl: yeah and and that Yeah, and it's obviously the way it's been for years and and sort of the traditional way of county cricket.
Jamie Bowman : Thank you.
Karl: But I think if we look look to the future and and obviously, you know, kids growing up these days watching 100 and and that you know that that will change eventually. ah ah You know, there's going to come a point where the Championship probably...
Karl: has a big question mark over it because there's very few people, I think, that watch it already and then going forward, that number isn't going to be getting any bigger, I don't think.
Tom Evans: No, it would be a shame. Speaking of the Championship, firm obviously Lancashire are out in ah Dubai at the moment on what's become their traditional pre-season ah excursion. um Obviously a disappointing year on the pitch for for the Red Rose last year and luck to bounce looking to bounce straight back to Division 1 at the first opportunity. And i think given the way they've recruited and the way they've retained players, they've probably got a good shout, haven't they?
Karl: Yeah, I think you you know you'd like to think so. I think and it's happened a few times in the past where they've dropped down to Division 1 and bounced straight back. So I don't see that being any different this year. I think they ah should have the quality and within that squad to...
Karl: to come straight back up. um yeah Obviously, there's been quite a lot of recruitment. Obviously, with Jimmy being available, you know a lot that should be a massive plus as well.
Karl: So...
Jamie Bowman : that Did that surprise you, Carl? Did it surprise you, him coming back?
Karl: and No, not at all. I think you know a lot of the things Jimmy's said in the media have have been around him carrying on playing.
Tom Evans: old
Karl: Yeah. So it didn't come as ah as a surprise at all, to be honest. start i think I think the most surprising thing is that, what, is he now 42?
Karl: That he's able to to still make that decision that he wants to carry on playing. I think it's amazing, really. But no, not surprise at all.
Jamie Bowman : Hmm.
Karl: I think it's quite clear that he's still got the hunger to play. um I just hope that his body can can continue to go with him. Yeah.
Tom Evans: Yeah, he's in the 100 draft as well, hasn't he? It'll be an interesting one to see if he gets picked up there.
Karl: Yeah, I mean, i would ah I'd be surprised if he does get picked up because I don't think he's played any short format cricket fur for a long, long time. Yeah, I mean...
Tom Evans: No, I think he played...
Jamie Bowman : yeah The attention that would bring, though, wouldn't it, to the to the to the to the tournament, I think, would be yeah priceless, wouldn't it?
Karl: yeah i mean it
Jamie Bowman : I think people would, just for publicity, I think it might might happen. I don't know. It's the sort of thing they'll they'll love to so promote, isn't it?
Karl: yeah um Yeah, I think obviously it would be bring publicity. ah But for me, you would probably want to see some sort of performances in that format of cricket to back up picking him, to be honest.
Jamie Bowman : yeah
Jamie Bowman : Carl, one of the few bright spots for Lancashire last year was Matty Hurst. I mean, do you know Matty well, obviously? but He played for Lee as well. i mean, could tell tell us a bit little bit about him.
Karl: Yeah, really pleased for Hurst. I think, obviously, I know him really well. he He moved to Lee when I was captain a few years ago. and And straight away, you could see that the talent he had.
Karl: um He was i came in, he was a very confident lad. I think he was just somebody that was looking for for opportunities and that is part of the reason he...
Karl: He moved to so Lee and he, yeah, he just got better and better. I think with the gloves and with the bat and it's it no surprise that he's gone on and and done what he's done.
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Jamie Bowman : Mm-hmm.
Karl: He could see that the talent straight away. Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, I think he's still only 20, isn't he? And he's played, you know, he's played in Australia now. He's played for the Lions. he's is it's it's It's quite a meteoric rise, really, for, as you say, for someone who who joined League just a few years ago. and And I suppose shows what is achievable for, you know, young players looking to improve in the comp, isn't it?
Karl: Yeah, and again, I think it's just another sort of feather in the cap of the comp as well because it you know the comp continues to so bring through these players that that are going on and and signing professional contracts. So I think, yeah, with Hurst, he's gone that little bit further. He's obviously played for the Lions. He's played in the Big Bash.
Karl: I just hope that there isn't too much expectation put on him because as you say, he still is very young. He's still developing as a player. So um I just hope that he's allowed to just play without too much pressure on on his performances because I'm sure if if that if they do allow that to happen, I think the performances will come on the back of it. But with him being so young, there will still be inconsistencies, I'm sure. But I think I just would like to to sort of see him, yeah, without any pressure on him, just go out and play. and
Karl: And that is when Thursday is at his best, I think.
Jamie Bowman : well
Jamie Bowman : Where do you think his best position is in the in the line-up then? Do you see him as a keeper-batsman down there the order or playing up three or four? Yeah. you know three or four
Karl: I genuinely think he's capable of both. and ah you know I think he's more than capable of of batting in the top four,
Jamie Bowman : yeah
Karl: um but also dropping back into the middle order if if that's where they they see him fitting. If he he's got the gloves and he wants to put his feet up for a little bit after keeping for a long time, I don't see that being an issue.
Tom Evans: Thank you.
Karl: I think... yeah have full confidence in him playing well in what whatever position he he sees. He or the coaches see himself in.
Jamie Bowman : Fantastic.
Tom Evans: There certainly is a lot of opportunities for young cricketers these days. I remember Tom Hartley saying something similar that even though he's a couple of years older than Matty Hurst, but he's still played the kind of the number of professional games that you sort of have to be into your mid to late 20s to have played um you know before there were all these opportunities of franchise leagues around the world and all the different short form competitions. um is Is it something that you sort of you wish your career had come a few years later that you'd have those kind of opportunities?
Tom Evans: Or did you feel like you got the benefit from being able to sort of take your time over going into the professional game?
Karl: and Good question. I think I'd be...
Jamie Bowman : Hmm.
Karl: I'd probably lying to say that I wouldn wouldn't have loved to have played in competitions like the 100 and things like that. I definitely would. um But, yeah, what what can you do? I mean, my career happened when it happened. um
Tom Evans: Mm-hmm.
Karl: I'm proud of it and I'm really um'm I'm really proud of the things we achieved and whilst I was playing with Lanks. I think those are the things that stay with you, the things you achieve as a team. And to win the Championship and the T20 Blast as well, I think I look back with with immense pride at those two things.
Karl: I think on a personal note, yes, it would have been nice to play in in other competitions that are around at the moment. But unfortunately for me, that just wasn't the case.
Tom Evans: I forgot to mention the T20 blast when I was reeling off your ah your list of achievements at the start, so I'm but glad you mentioned it now anyway.
Jamie Bowman : Thank you.
Jamie Bowman : if
Tom Evans: So ah speaking of Lee, obviously the club we've been at for very long time now and like you said, the former captain, um under new leadership this year, aren't they? Matty McKinnon's taken over as captain.
Tom Evans: Are you looking forward to to working under Matty?
Karl: Yeah, definitely. um I'm obviously very good mates with Matty first and foremost.
Tom Evans: Mm-hmm.
Karl: and i know what he brings to the team and as a player and and as a captain. I think he's he's going to bring even more.
Karl: I think he's he's already been really good over the winter in terms of getting the lads together, whether that is... um for a few beers or just to watch football or whatever. I think those things he's already started doing. And i think those things play a key role in sort of a team spirit kind of way. and So he's already ticked that box, I think.
Karl: And then obviously we know that his performances on the pitch are very good. And as a captain, I think, I've got no no concerns whatsoever. I think he'll be great. I think he'll do a really good on the really good job on the field as well.
Jamie Bowman : He was a fine, fine player, wasn't he, Matty?
Tom Evans: Thank you for your question.
Jamie Bowman : You know, as a pro, wasn't he? First-class game. I mean, he could still be playing, couldn't he, really?
Karl: Yeah, definitely. I'm surprised he didn't get more of an opportunity, especially with the bat. I think when when you look at what he's done in the comp over the last few years with the bat in particular,
Karl: and yeah I'm surprised he didn't get more of a crack with the bat because and you know from from what I've seen, some of the innings I've seen in play have have been ridiculous over the last few years.
Jamie Bowman : Mm-hmm.
Tom Evans: ah You've recruited quite well over the winter, haven't you? I know Luke Prescott um the is ah is in the Lancashire youth set-up, isn't he? The young batter from the Red Triangle has has arrived. um he's when he he was out with injury a lot of last season, but still managed to put up some some incredible numbers in Division 1. And are you looking forward to seeing what he can do in the Prem?
Karl: Yeah, Luke's a player that I really like. I think he's somebody that we sort of identified as somebody that could be a really good fit for us. and you know And having had a chat with him, he was definitely on the same wavelength. So it was a bit it was quite a natural fit, I think.
Karl: and And yeah it's an area we we needed to strengthen. And obviously with Luke's numbers, when he did come back from injury last year, i think if he can recreate some of that form in the summer, I think we've got a really good player on our hands.
Karl: but I think we ah we we didn't replace Sam Dorsey. When he left, he was obviously a really good player for us. And hopefully Luke is going to come in and and do that job, a similar job for us.
Tom Evans: and stuff. And um yeah, you're looking forward to the to the start of the season. What's your availability going to be like this season? Because last year you were sort of a bit of a school holiday specialist, weren't you? so if You played for the middle part of the summer and when you were around, you know, lee Lee's results really picked up.
Jamie Bowman : Thank you.
Tom Evans: You were in a really good nick yourself, weren't you?
Karl: Yeah, I think i mean it's going to be similar for for me with you know for work reasons. and i I think I generally play 13-14 of the league games.
Tom Evans: Mm-hmm.
Karl: I would love to play the whole season. I still really enjoy playing. and But yeah, it's probably going to be a similar scenario. I'll play as much as I can, but and it will revolve around school holidays ah a little bit.
Karl: Yeah.
Karl: And yeah, that like I said, I'd love to play the full season, but I just can't because of because of work at the moment.
Tom Evans: There is lot of people who in the world. They in the world. They are in the world. They in the world.
Jamie Bowman : Who do you see as the yeah you know the it the usual contenders this year?
Tom Evans: They are in the They are in the They are in the world.
Jamie Bowman : you know is it is it Is it going to be your Norvans, your Ormskirks?
Tom Evans: They in the world. They are in the world. They are in the world.
Jamie Bowman : How do you see the league panning out this year, Carl?
Tom Evans: They are the world. They are in the world.
Karl: i would be very surprised if it isn't. I think... I think for me, Joramskirk are a team that just consistently play at a high level and ask a lot of questions of of each and every team.
Karl: And I think they're definitely going to be up there again.
Tom Evans: Okay.
Karl: I think they're too good not to be. Northern, again, too good not to be up there, I don't think. and Looks like they, as I think was mentioned earlier, they've lost a couple, but but looks like they've replaced those with a couple of ah good players. So, yeah, Northern will definitely be up there as well. um Yeah, a death yeah i mean i can't I've got to be honest, and I think Northern and Armskirk will be we'll be right up there again.
Tom Evans: I'm certainly not going to not going to do predictions this year because last year, Carl, I don't know if you remember this, but I predicted Lee would have a good chance of winning the league last year.
Jamie Bowman : it would
Jamie Bowman : The kiss of death.
Tom Evans: um it was my map My prediction lasted about two weeks, I think, before I was starting to revise it.
Karl: Yeah.
Karl: Yeah, it didn didn't go that well, that one, did it?
Tom Evans: But... and I think I possibly um underestimated the impact of all the slow left armours on what was mostly right-handed top order.
Tom Evans: And, you know, it Matty, as good as he is, um being available all year, which was what I was sort of pinning a lot of it on, that Matty, um having recently, you know, not been playing county anymore, was going to be available more than he'd been.
Karl: Yeah.
Tom Evans: And um it didn't work out, I guess, did it? But, you know, you've still got strong players there. you still got a good You're still capable of beating anybody on your day, aren't you?
Karl: Yeah, definitely. um i mean, we we're we're very ambitious as ah as a club and as a team. I mean, our goal is is to win the league again. We won it in 2016 and we absolutely want to be winning the league again. i think but it's also important to be be realistic as well. um You know, it's a very, very tough league and to...
Karl: to To finish above Northern and Ormskirk is a big ask at this moment in time, but we we're trying to build towards that and we will be obviously trying our best this year to spring a surprise if we can, but we know that that's going to be a difficult task.
Tom Evans: So,
Jamie Bowman : Obviously, Lee's in Greater Manchester and you you play in the Liverpool competition. I've often wondered, do do you sort of feel a bit like the outsiders sometimes? Do you feel a bit like, you know, not part of the the that the group and, you know, sort of operating on the outside a bit?
Karl: I think sort of, yeah, but I think we quite like that. um You know, we don't mind that. we you we we really We really like playing in the comp because the standard is is so good.
Tom Evans: good
Karl: We like challenging ourselves against and the teams within the comp. So, yeah, we we're we're a little bit outside Liverpool, yeah, but we yeah but we don't mind travelling because we know...
Karl: um We're going to get good cricket. We're going to play on good ground. yeah we we We really like playing in the comp.
Tom Evans: good oh Thank you. Thank you for all that. um Right, should move on to our our regular features now? Because... i'm
Jamie Bowman : Why not? Regular features. This is the first time we've done it, Tom.
Tom Evans: Well, they're going to be what will become regular features, i we we hope, unless it goes really badly. um The first one ah is something that we're going to call Dressing Room 101.
Tom Evans: Now, this at any similarity to a TV show starring Frank Skinner is completely coincidental. um This is we're going to ask our guests every – going to say every week, but every time we do a podcast to come up with something about – playing, watching, loving cricket that winds them up, that really grinds their gears.
Tom Evans: um And Jamie and myself are going to assess whether the their choice, their nomination ah is annoying enough to to be allowed entry into into dressing room 101. So, Cal, what have you got for us?
Karl: and The pressure's on here. I'm hoping this is not terrible. ah i've written ah've written a cook well I've written three things down, and and they are they start my bugbears a little bit, I guess.
Tom Evans: sure it won't be.
Tom Evans: yeah Why not? Yeah, go for it. Give us your three chances then.
Tom Evans: That's what we want, yeah.
Karl: So the number one thing I've written down, and it really winds me up, is... Tiny changing rooms. and
Tom Evans: Okay.
Karl: So everybody rocks up with a massive bag.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah.
Karl: And when you turn up with your massive bag and get into a changing room with other massive bags, and it's really small, it just frustrates the hell out me because you're just clambering over bags, falling over bags.
Karl: and So, yeah, small changing rooms every time it gets me.
Tom Evans: people Are you a player that likes his own space then? Do you like to sort of have your, job do you have your bit of the changing rooms at Lee and you're like, no no one else is allowed within, you know, within a certain, there's a bit where your bag goes and no one else is allowed to touch it? Or is it just kind of first come, first serve?
Karl: I mean, that that no, you've explained it pretty well there. I mean, I sit in the corner. The changing rooms are not massive at Lee, don't get me wrong, but there's enough room there. So I try and park myself in the corner, create a little bit of space. So and yeah if I do need five minutes to myself, I can just go and have a sit down.
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : you You're lucky, Carl, in the thirds, we often get, we're in a shipping container or something like that.
Tom Evans: Is that the whole team or just you, Jamie?
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, the quad, I don't know, the quadrangle at Northern, where there's about four changing rooms all in a, like a, like a, it's very interesting, but, uh,
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, yeah. I think Carl's got a point. As as ah ah someone who likes to just chip their bag open and just put all their kits all over the floor, I've got sympathy there.
Tom Evans: Yeah. Yeah. um'm ah um I'm willing to... I've been in a few tiny changing rooms in my time and I think the flip side to that is when you're used to a tiny one, your own club, and then you go away to a ground with better facilities and you feel like you're in the Ritz when you've just got a bit of space to call your own and know root room to sit down and you're not having to share.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah.
Karl: Yeah, totally agree with that.
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Karl: yeah
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : It's great when you end up at one of the, you know, if you play on a Sunday and you end up playing on the main ground at like Colwyn Bay or or Liverpool and you're in the main changing rooms, you know, as a third team, but that's very exciting, isn't it? you get You get to experience what the pros do, just briefly.
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Tom Evans: So much so that I bet you go straight back ah straight back there after you go out to bat.
Jamie Bowman : if i just I just come for the bath.
Karl: yeah
Tom Evans: i don't have any...
Jamie Bowman : i
Tom Evans: ah as if As a first bugbear, I think that's ah that's a good one. I don't have any objections to so allowing that into into dressing room 101, so...
Tom Evans: There we go. but That's the noise that you hear when when when something gets in.
Jamie Bowman : What else have you got, Carl?
Karl: ah At least that's one over the line, right? these these These two might not make it. ah My other one is and sight screens. So for a similar reason to the changing rooms, it just kills me every time sight screens are having to be moved.
Karl: and Game stops for people walking behind sight screens. We obviously have a lot of left-arm spinners in the league. They're going to bowl over and round.
Tom Evans: And I love you.
Karl: I don't know how much time we're losing a season moving screens, but it must be a long, long time.
Jamie Bowman : And i you have to move them yourself now. you can't You can't ask anyone else to do them, can you, now when you're playing club cricket?
Karl: Yeah, and that is yeah that's a pain in the backside. i'll yeah if ah if If the screens are being moved every other ball, then you'll probably find me hiding it in that corner in a changing room somewhere.
Tom Evans: Do you end up um putting your best sight screen mover long on or long off just to cut down on the time? you know put put Put your strongest guy down there, and then there's less messing around.
Tom Evans: They can just one-handed.
Karl: I think, yeah, things like that usually get worked out on edge. So, we'll we'll yeah, the young lads will probably get moved.
Tom Evans: Yeah, yeah.
Jamie Bowman : ah you Are you a fussy batter when you're out there, though?
Karl: ah
Jamie Bowman : do you do do you have to have the the sight screen just so?
Karl: and no Not massively, no. I mean, as long as it's it's in a reasonable place, you know, I'm not not too fussed about it being absolutely bang on.
Jamie Bowman : Because some are, aren't they? some bad some it with some you know You have to get
Karl: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : the ruler out and everything but
Karl: Yeah, and not that is sort of something I'll go on to with the last one. and so
Jamie Bowman : go on
Karl: Something that annoys me about batters is the next one.
Tom Evans: Well, that I think the trouble with this one for me is you've gone a little bit too wide. I think if it was just people walking behind sight screens, fine. If it was sight screens that are too small or that...
Karl: Yeah.
Tom Evans: What hear is when they stick out into the pitch and you have the boundary rope sort has to come in a bit and go around the sight screen.
Karl: Yeah.
Tom Evans: It's... that never ceases to amaze me that they haven't come up with the sight screen technology to avoid so surviv that happening. But I digress. I just think sight screens have got to be moved.
Tom Evans: yeah Like, if if they were wide enough to not have to be moved, then it would cut down on the spectator space, wouldn't it?
Karl: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : yeah
Karl: Yeah.
Tom Evans: I guess.
Karl: I think it's fair enough. It's just something that really winds me up.
Tom Evans: we all wanted to hear the no noise as well, didn't we? So...
Tom Evans: So that one's a no, I'm afraid. what What's what's ah submission number three?
Karl: Fair enough. So the last one is um batters taking guard every over or every few balls. So I...
Jamie Bowman : He's done it already.
Tom Evans: but No, absolutely. Yeah.
Karl: Yeah, so I generally feel that first slip and ah to listen to that middle please, middle again, middle like for like 30 times if somebody's in for a while, that's one that gets on my nerves as well.
Tom Evans: Okay.
Tom Evans: Do you find it's more likely to be the ones that have played at a higher level that do that?
Karl: I don't think so. I think it's quite random, to be honest.
Tom Evans: No.
Karl: I think it's, yeah.
Tom Evans: Because in general, time-wasting, or not time-wasting deliberately, but things that take time out of the game, at the you know the hack the higher up you go, the more players do it.
Karl: Yeah.
Karl: Yeah.
Tom Evans: you know At the third 11 level, you'll find you know people... coming out to bat and, you know, they'll they'll take maybe take guard once when they get there and then but they'll that'll be good at that end until for the whole their innings.
Karl: Yeah.
Karl: yeah
Tom Evans: And then, you know, I think batters in particular, if theyre if it's their living, if it's their job, they're bound to be more fussy, aren't they, I think?
Karl: I don't know. I think it's just, you know, a lot of bats. Some bats are superstitious. And ah i yeah I can stand at first slip and I can see the mark that they've made 24 times or whatever it is.
Tom Evans: Yeah, and if you can see it, I definitely can. Yeah.
Karl: And they know they know that it's going to be middle stump or leg stump or whatever they're asking for. They they know before they're asking it. So why are you asking again?
Jamie Bowman : it seemed to be it's a few years ago it seemed to become very much part of the setup didn't it part of your process almost to get you in that kind of you know the jonathan trot kind of frame of mind yeah you know
Karl: Yeah. So I think, yeah, people, pick people it's part maybe some part of some people's routine, but I just think, yeah, get rid of it.
Jamie Bowman : yeah
Tom Evans: Fair enough. Would you set a limit? Would you say once per innings? after After that, the umpire is allowed to to lie to you and so say that you're middle when you're on off and the umpire is allowed to start messing with you.
Karl: yeah ah yeah I'd go with that definitely yeah
Jamie Bowman : want to
Tom Evans: Okay, yeah, I'm fully on board with that.
Jamie Bowman : um'm i'm I'm really on board with this one. I like this one.
Tom Evans: Good stuff. So, yeah, just to confirm...
Tom Evans: I'm sure we all like hearing that noise of the ball hitting hitting Michael Clarke's stump as well, even after nearly 20 years. Very good. So you're 2-1.
Tom Evans: Two in, one one not there, Carl. So that's a good start.
Karl: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : good start.
Tom Evans: You happy with that?
Jamie Bowman : Strong start.
Karl: ah yeah I'll take that, yeah. Happy with that.
Tom Evans: Nice one. um The next, hopefully, regular feature we've got, um and if anyone's got a better name for this, my my DMs are open, um Stump the Hosts.
Tom Evans: So we want our guests to come up with a trivia question. can be local, domestic, international, whatever, cricket trivia question, and put it to the hosts, to myself and Jamie. And will I'll keep my hands in vision, if you like, so you know I'm not cheating and Googling or i accessing any of the the many wisdoms to my right.
Tom Evans: um And, you know, there'd be no fun in it if we were cheating anyway. So, ah yeah, just to to see if we can, see if you can see if you can fox us.
Karl: Right. OK. Again, apologies if this is terrible.
Tom Evans: Go for it.
Karl: but But what I've done is I've i've picked i've picked three players from the Premier Division and I've written down the stats over the last three years.
Karl: So runs and wickets.
Tom Evans: ah Okay.
Karl: And my question to you is, can you guess the players from those stats?
Tom Evans: and
Jamie Bowman : Oh, that's that's very, that's good.
Karl: Right.
Tom Evans: I'm okay. Yeah, excellent. Go for it.
Karl: Right, so just to give you... it Well, I've gone for a batter, bowler and an all-rounder.
Tom Evans: And these are all players who've played in the Prem for all of the last three years.
Karl: the Prem for the last few years. ah Yeah, they're all so still playing, yeah. so
Tom Evans: Okay. Okay.
Karl: Right, so number one. I'll start in 2022.
Karl: Scored 762 runs and took two wickets. In he scored runs and took twenty two wickets and in twenty twenty four he scored five hundred and ninety two runs and took six wickets
Tom Evans: Okay, the wickets are really confusing me here.
Jamie Bowman : Not many though.
Tom Evans: I feel like that that's that's the batter, obviously.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, not many.
Karl: yes
Tom Evans: Bowls a bit. He scored a lot of runs in 2022, which everyone did. um So 700 nod, but just two wickets in 2022.
Karl: yeah
Tom Evans: and then 500 and between 6 and 22 wickets in the last two years.
Tom Evans: Jamie?
Jamie Bowman : My first guest was McGladdery, but um I don't think he doesn't bowl at all, does he?
Tom Evans: He doesn't bowl. ah and he and time
Jamie Bowman : Does he? No.
Tom Evans: and twenty two i'm twenty three
Jamie Bowman : Right, right.
Karl: you're not stumped already are you lads
Jamie Bowman : No, no, this is good.
Tom Evans: like we
Jamie Bowman : This is hard, isn't
Tom Evans: got a limited time here at that I decide how long the podcast goes on for.
Karl: Fair enough.
Jamie Bowman : it? we're goingnna We're going to just edit this, aren't we? So it makes us look good, so.
Tom Evans: Yeah, should we do that? and so Right, that there were four that got 1,000 in 2022, so they're out. So it's not McLadderie, Laker, Turner or Crawley.
Tom Evans: The next five, I think, were... I think your Dan Beavers, your Ben Walkdens,
Tom Evans: um they all got 900 nods, so they're too high in 2022. Just because that was such a run-heavy year. That that was such a good year for the batters.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, it was a sunny year, wasn't it?
Tom Evans: Yeah. That makes me wonder if your bowls seem up.
Tom Evans: They're taking so few wickets that year. Then i'm having a bit about bit more luck with the bowl.
Karl: I'll give you a bit of a clue. Your ball's off spin.
Tom Evans: Has he been with the one club all this time?
Karl: No.
Jamie Bowman : Oh.
Tom Evans: Andrew Clark.
Karl: Incorrect.
Jamie Bowman : Oh. ah thought that was a bit...
Karl: But you you're quite warm you're quite warm with that guess, though.
Tom Evans: Jamie, your guess.
Jamie Bowman : Oh, no. No, I thought that was a good shout. I can't think. He says we're warm with that one. So, same club. Yeah.
Tom Evans: Dwight Clark was injured for most of 2023.
Tom Evans: Same club now or same club then?
Karl: and I think he's been he's been at the same club for the last few years.
Tom Evans: Okay.
Jamie Bowman : ah um I am stumped mate.
Tom Evans: Zencaster does give you the option of and automatically removing long pauses. so Go going to have to tell us.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah.
Tom Evans: Go on.
Karl: It's Mark Rowland.
Tom Evans: Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Sorry. Sorry, Mark.
Tom Evans: Yeah. Good. Okay. You're going to keep...
Karl: Right, do you want to number two?
Tom Evans: Yes. Yes. Go on. Okay.
Karl: Right. and So these stats are very, very similar each year.
Tom Evans: okay
Karl: 2022 he scored 343 runs and took wickets twenty twenty three he scored three hundred and six runs and took thirty two wickets
Jamie Bowman : i mean
Karl: twenty twenty
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Karl: or
Jamie Bowman : consistent
Karl: three hundred and seven runs and thirty five wickets
Tom Evans: I'm thinking those are Liam Gray type numbers. I'm not giving Liam Gray as my answer, but
Tom Evans: very consistent.
Jamie Bowman : yeah consistent performer um I'm thinking that's middle order
Tom Evans: um Consistent performer.
Tom Evans: Obviously, bat Bat's high up, but his bowling is... Well, he's been opening lately.
Jamie Bowman : Oh.
Tom Evans: But...
Tom Evans: So it's 300 runs, 30 wickets every year.
Karl: yeah
Tom Evans: think it's not enough runs for Gray.
Tom Evans: But 30-odd wickets, you're a very good bowler.
Tom Evans: aren't you?
Karl: he is a very good bowler
Tom Evans: To get the bowling to take that many wickets across season.
Tom Evans: You're a good bowler.
Tom Evans: Any advance on Liam Gray, Jamie?
Jamie Bowman : no sorry mate yeah um
Karl: you're in the You're in the right ballpark with the type of player.
Tom Evans: So it's not him. Great. Thanks.
Jamie Bowman : yeah
Tom Evans: ah
Jamie Bowman : we need to we need yeah yeah just do this for an hour
Tom Evans: This is good. we we we should just make this segment this every week, I think.
Tom Evans: Yeah. I think people might prefer that.
Jamie Bowman : yeah
Tom Evans: um
Karl: And this person has played at the one club.
Tom Evans: One club man as well. Okay.
Karl: Yeah.
Tom Evans: Let's see all rounders then. um i'm thinking I'm thinking a seamer because the very good spinners don't take 30 wickets a season. They take... 50, 60 more the season.
Tom Evans: Carl's nodding. The listeners can't see that Carl is currently nodding.
Tom Evans: Which is another giveaway. Even with the clues, we're not getting these. So it's seen bowling. all It's not Walkden because he scored more runs, a lot more runs than that. it's And he wasn't in the prem for one of those years. It's not...
Tom Evans: So one club man. Seamer.
Jamie Bowman : Come on, Tom.
Tom Evans: Good Seamer.
Jamie Bowman : Great, great, great TV.
Karl: Very, very, very, very, very good fielder as well.
Tom Evans: Outfielder or our close catcher?
Karl: Outfielder.
Tom Evans: I'm playing for time.
Tom Evans: i'm I'm done. um' um' I'm stumped, Jamie.
Jamie Bowman : and Okay, that's both of us then.
Karl: ah
Karl: The answer is Adam Shawlcross.
Tom Evans: Okay, yeah, your team mate of course, yeah.
Jamie Bowman : oh you got that you got
Tom Evans: I think Finn last year when I spoke to him after a game where Adam had done well said he was one of the most underrated cricketers around and we've we've once again underrated him.
Karl: Yeah, absolutely.
Tom Evans: um
Jamie Bowman : that
Tom Evans: Shall we try and regain some pride with the last one?
Karl: Right then, last one. 2022, 58 wickets, 214 runs. 2023, 45 wickets, 55 runs. 2024, 38 wickets 151 two hundred and fourteen runs twenty twenty three forty five wickets fifty five runs twenty twenty four thirty eight wickets and a hundred and fifty one runs
Tom Evans: um
Tom Evans: What were the wickets numbers again?
Karl: 58, 45, 38. Yep. forty five thirty eight
Tom Evans: going to say this is a spinner again because I know...
Jamie Bowman : you
Tom Evans: umm
Tom Evans: Matty Keogh took 58 wickets last year and no one had done that no Seema had done that for years it'd it'd been long time since Seema done that so I'm so 58 wickets in 2022
Karl: yeah
Jamie Bowman : Dotters? No.
Tom Evans: Dots is
Tom Evans: possible was he in the no he wasn't in the Prem in 22 Rainford only went up in 22
Jamie Bowman : Uh oh. I wasn't in verb.
Tom Evans: and
Tom Evans: one One club again? One club?
Karl: and Yes.
Tom Evans: should have called it Humiliate the hosts, this should have been called If you win, you have to present the podcast next week, Carl.
Karl: um i umm I'm absolutely buzzing with this, lads. Oh.
Tom Evans: Did we mention that?
Tom Evans: um What did you say, Jamie?
Jamie Bowman : I was thinking Firth at Southport, but no.
Karl: Are you going with that answer?
Tom Evans: Now, that implies it's not Firth at Southport, but
Jamie Bowman : No.
Tom Evans: Bobby Winsor.
Tom Evans: What do you think?
Karl: That's incorrect. Jamie, are you sticking with that?
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, go on then.
Karl: It's correct. Well done, mate.
Tom Evans: oh
Tom Evans: Well done, Jamie. You got one. I got nothing.
Karl: LAUGHTER
Tom Evans: I shall hang my head in shame until I get the chance to redeem myself next time we invite someone else on who's less cruel than Cal Brown.
Jamie Bowman : I'm chuffed with that. at
Tom Evans: And in all seriousness, that was great. That's exactly the sort of thing that we're looking for. um So, ah yeah, thank you very much. And thank you for coming on. um I think that's we've we've we've we've gone um plenty long enough. um in terms of time. So thank you again for coming on, Carl.
Karl: No problem.
Jamie Bowman : Yeah, thanks, Cal.
Karl: Thanks for having me. enjoyed it. I look forward to ah to listening to future episodes as well.
Tom Evans: Yeah.
Jamie Bowman : like
Tom Evans: ah
Tom Evans: Yeah, yeah. I look forward to making them. um Cheers, Jamie. Thank you for listening, everybody. um You can follow us on x.com, formerly Twitter, on Last Hour Pod, ah where we'll be posting updates about future episodes. um Any suggestions for guests, if you want to nominate yourself as a future guest, any ideas for content or how we can improve the pod, please do get in touch. Like I say, you probably all know how to get in touch with me by now, but the DMs will be open on that Twitter account. So,
Tom Evans: um Thank you very much for listening and we're looking forward to having you next time. Cheers. Bye-bye.
Karl: Cheers, lads. Thanks very much.
Jamie Bowman : Cheers, guys.
