Transcript
Speaker: We had some Garth Brooks. We did. We had, did we have anything else? Some lovely pictures. Lovely pictures? Yeah.
Speaker: We're ready to rock and roll. You do this every time. And it's not It just makes it more authentic. You would think that's what i would realize. He cuts out anything we need him to cut out, though. You know what i mean? Yeah.
Speaker: But I think we're pretty all right. We're not offensive Not offensive. yes My lord.
Speaker: Welcome to the Jeff and Sam Show. I am Jeff. And I'm Sam. Samantha. That's me. How are you? I'm well. How are you? I'm so good. Yeah, you had a really good day. I had like an incredible day, but welcome to the Jeff and Sam Show. Okay, so we're a true crime, we're history, we're comedy.
Speaker: You can find us on the social medias. You can email us. It's all in our notes. It is. And we have like a thing. There's a link and it's a tree and you click it and it sends you to things. There you go That's the gist.
Speaker: What are you drinking, Jeffrey? Girl, i am drinking a slice. Grape. Oh, I love that for you. It's like the old school. I love that. yeah I like that company. Cheers, Quiz. I am drinking a Surfside Strawberry Lemonade Vodka because you know me. You're welcome. Cheers, Quiz.
Speaker: And I love that company for you. That was a hold your belly. oh Oh, no. It's going to fizz over.
Speaker: ah Yeah, it was a good day today. It was like such a good day today. Mind, body, spiritu santo. Just the spirit part, not the saint part. Yeah, let's be ah lesb honest. Let's be real. Yeah, I went to work out, okay?
Speaker: And then I had a massage from two. A massage. A massage. from With your really deep handsy man? Named Shen, girl. And then I had, um I need to back away from that thing. It's giving me orange vibes. It means I'm too loud and too excited.
Speaker: I can't control this, okay? Then I had the massage from two to three, 30. hurt An hour and a half massage? He hurt my legs. I cannot stand people touching me for any length of time.
Speaker: i love a massage, and I love, like, I don't go to just any massage therapist. You go to the torture chamber. This man is so good. When I screamed, he was like, I'll go down. It's fine.
Speaker: I didn't really scream, it was more like a jump off the table kind of thing. And it was my IT bands and my calves. Not the calves. those things were big. I told them to be careful. keep Keep them protected. Yeah. And so I come home and took a nap.
Speaker: And then had therapy for what is my last time with this therapist because she's quitting her job. She's moving on. She's moving on with her life. You know, which is funny because when I started this therapy thing a year ago, I was like, only want to do it for a year.
Speaker: And if I, you know, I'll keep going. I'm not going to limit it to just a year, but like, let's do one year. Because going into the wintertime, willll always get like super anxious, you know. Stressy, depressy. Not depressed, like anxious.
Speaker: And so ah this was the one year mark. Wow. And it ended. And she is just incredible. And, you know, she's incredible. and Do you have tools in your toolbox? Girl, I got so many tools in my toolbox. That's called Samantha.
Speaker: That's the biggest tool in the toolbox I have. for me. Because you make me so happy. Oh, he's so gay. And Alan and Ashley and Kim and Keith and Landon, and we're going to spend time with them.
Speaker: I'm so excited. So I've got the tools. ah But yeah, I really liked her. It was a good fit for a therapist. And you know that if you don't find a therapist that you enjoy, there's a million more out there. So you go to the next one, right? I got super lucky right off the bat because she's phenomenal. and She's your inner woman? You know, and she said one time, she was like, no, that's me. She said, ah I'm your biggest cheerleader. And that was at the beginning of our therapy. And I was like,
Speaker: Oh, okay. i like the way you put that. You know what i mean? Yeah. I'm your biggest cheerleader. but Because she wants you to do well. I love that. Yeah. I love that. So that was my day.
Speaker: good. Mind, body, soul. You did the damn thing. I did it. i did it. It was awesome. Loved every bit of it. Except for the screaming part on the massage table. The rest was great.
Speaker: I don't really know how to respond to that because that's just is not not my style. Not for me. You're not a massage kind of girl? No. Don't touch me. That's fair. And I won't pay someone to do it because I won't enjoy it. like I've gotten maybe two massages in my life.
Speaker: One was a couples massage. Oh, God, it was just like, and you're supposed to just be relaxed. you hear us just then? We're like so broken. back I don't know. Like i I cannot relax when there's people touching me, let alone strangers. And I know that I'm paying for this. Like I chose to go to this, but it doesn't, I i can't get it right in my brain. yeah So it's one of those things where like the whole time I'm like, I can't, I can't. They're like, you need to just relax. it Oh, you're so tense. I'm like, no shit, lady. It's because you're touching me. You're touching me. and So I found Shin, and I will not go back to another massage therapist. Like, I know him. He knows me.
Speaker: It's just great. He is the most professional. And honestly, when he goes deep, I was sore for like two days afterwards.
Speaker: You know what I mean? Like yep my back fat. My back fat was like so sore. For everyone's reference, Jeff doesn't have a millimeter or an ounce or a quarter of an ounce of fat. Lightning's gonna strike you right now because I'm pinching my back fat. Oh my god, it's skin. That is skin that you're pinching. It's sore, i can tell. My skin is sore.
Speaker: Back fat my ass. um Even your ass isn't fat. hot as a rock. It really is. Like, break your hand kinda hot. You know what, I'm gonna tag um Blue Dolphin Charters into this because I want to put this out into the universe that I want to thank them because on the 23rd of August, one of our coworkers, who is an active duty magical human being that we get the privilege and honor of working with. Just the best.
Speaker: Is ah the best. And ah but he was going to Hawaii for his birthday. He's in his early 20s. Happy birthday. Yes, happy birthday. If you ever listen to this, I don't know, but you're awesome. and we love you.
Speaker: We kind of sent him on a Blue Dolphins charter for his birthday. Kind of? Kind of. Like, he did the damn thing. He sent pictures this morning. And just so you guys know, at Blue Dolphin, like, he fucking loved every minute of it.
Speaker: Loved. I don't know if they'll ever hear this. People listening in Hawaii, if somebody knows them. Share it. Share it. Tell them we said thank you. i mean... Then, yeah, we'll tag him. The guy had so much fun, and he sent pictures, and it was down it was on the island of Kauai, down the Nepali coast.
Speaker: Which, again, i still have not been to Hawaii, but those pictures that he sent... are indescribable and they look AI generated. And I've seen a billion pictures from Hawaii, but like, it's just different. Like seeing that. Yeah. Especially the rainbow. oh I snuck a phone call into them on Friday, and I was like, hey, this guy that's coming, I'm not going to say his name because know and everybody wants to be named.
Speaker: ah Tina and i kind of like did this cruise for him because it is his birthday. So can you guys like give him a shout out for the birthday? And they're like, we will hook him up.
Speaker: And they did. We heard it. So anyway, thank you. That was great for him. He's an amazing human, and he deserves it. He does. He does What about you What's going on
Speaker: on? Brittany and I were laughing. um You know, I'm still in the process of moving back into my townhouse. And in the
Speaker: almost decade that I've owned the house. I think I've only lived there for maybe a year, maybe a little bit more. So now I'm moving back in with the intention of staying there for a while. You know, I'm not travel nursing anymore. i'm not, you know, i'm I'm in a totally different place in life. And but so i have been figuring out how how to make it a home, you know? So I've got all these plans. And I guess the first step of that was getting like real furniture. Cause I've always been semi-minimalist because I did so much moving around and like, I was pretty nomadic for so long that like, I didn't have a whole bunch. I had a bed, but I had like a plain wire bed frame, no headboard, like just very minimalist.
Speaker: Um, so I pulled the trigger and I bought I think Brittany called it like a whole bed, like not, not the mattress, but like it's got the thing that the mattress goes on it's got a headboard and you know, it's got like cubbies and shelves and stuff. And then i also got a like living room thingy-mabobber that my TV will go on and it's got shelves and it's,
Speaker: like to put stuff on and it's like, I don't know. I'm like, I'm settling. How do you feel about that? I'm settling. It's, it's kind of nice, but it's also kind of like making me itch, but also they deliver these packages and like you, I get the UPS, uh, USPS and like FedEx delivery updates. Right. So I get the updates that are like, Oh, your package is out for delivery. And then it tells you like the weight of the package. And so for the bed frame bed thing, um,
Speaker: I think it's called a frame. Is it called a frame? Okay. I don't know. I called it a frame, but was like, no, that's a whole ass bed. So I don't know. I don't know. I've only ever had a wire frame. So I, um, they said, Oh, 60 pounds. So I wake up and I'm, I've been working a lot. So like I'm in between shifts and I'm like staying there cause it's a lot closer to work. And so I get the update that it's like, Oh yeah, your package is delivered 60 pounds. I look outside and I'm like, Hmm, there's two boxes.
Speaker: So one of the boxes was 60 pounds and I like flippy flopped it and moved into the house. And then the second box I went to pick it up and I was like, o nope, that's not budging. It was a solid like damn near 200 pounds. I was like, okay. So bless Kelsey. She came down and she was like, oh, easy. So we cut the box open right there and just like pulled each of the pieces out and like just that's how we moved the stuff into the house. like There you go.
Speaker: So I'm assuming going to have to do the same thing for this TV entertainment center stand bucket thing. i don't know what it's called. There's a whole vibe that goes with travel nursing that is so fucking liberating, right? Because I moved from Alabama. I had worked in Georgia.
Speaker: And I moved from Alabama to Oregon with everything I owned in my Nissan Sentra. Literally everything. And I showed up in Oregon and moved into a furnished house. yeah Then I went to Seattle and then I went to New York and West Virginia and Hawaii. And yeah when I moved here,
Speaker: I bought all of this furniture, the two beds for both the rooms, the living room, the TV staff, all it yeah the table. And I damn near had a panic attack because it meant I was stuck. you still You're here. I was like, oh, shit, I'm stuck in this location. I've got furniture. It can't fit in my Subaru anymore. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah. It's a thing. It's a thing. So, yeah, it's um it's weird, but it's... it's It's nice-ish. yeahre I'm okay with it. Once more with feeling.
Speaker: oh I'm okay. It's nice-ish. It's good. It'll be good. It'll be nice to, to you know, because i going back in there this over the past couple months, right, and like realizing like the location is fantastic and it's, I bought it for a reason. It's a really great house and like I've put so much money into updating it and renovating it and that kind of stuff. So it's like, I'm excited to actually live there. You know, I'm excited for you. I'm excited to come over there and see it. It's going to be great. Yeah. We're going to move the pod studio in there and we're going to start the next stages of our,
Speaker: A little business venture here. our situation Situation. Of our situationship. We have a situationship with microphones. We have They hate us, they love us. True. They hate us and then they love us. True.
Speaker: So, yeah, that's it. Just working and... So, yeah, today it was a busy day at work and, you know... Yeah. I've established that this team does Mondays harder than any other place.
Speaker: Like... And it's objectively I would be able to confidently say that this team... Monday vibe.
Speaker: Totally different. Like, our team Monday, like, Mondays everywhere are horrible. We know this. Every year. So, in an emergency department, any nurse, any doctor will tell you on Mondays you're going to get your ass handed to you. 90% of the time, sure, there's going to be a random Tuesday or Friday or Sunday that's going to be just, like, packed and bam, bam, bam. But, like, Monday, usually...
Speaker: Busiest day in the ER. Yeah. Yeah. And so, and yeah, so we work on blocks. So like we, our team works every other Monday, but I've done enough working with all of the teams to confidently say that this team's Mondays, hands down, always, without a doubt, the worst.
Speaker: Oh, wow. I mean, not the worst that I've ever experienced. Like, it's, you know, it's still relative. relative yeah But it's the worst out of all of the. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker: Okay. What is that? There's like a. Is your thing? it's like It's like the sound of something plugging in and out. This is our life. It's an iPhone. It's not like, it's nothing here. No, but it's like when you plug in your iPad. Yeah.
Speaker: But do you have anything plugged in? Maybe, probably, I don't know. But it's nothing that's going to affect this record. And they probably can't hear it, so we're just talking about something they can't hear. That's what we do sometimes.
Speaker: Okay, did we hit all the bucket list topics of nothings that we like to... i think so. shoot the shit about? I think so. We shot the shit? We shot the shit. For the Norwegian people listening, I just want you guys to know. Why are you rubbing the thing like that? It's like an evil, like, you know, an evil rub. Like, I said to Sam before we recorded, i said, Sam, are you klar?
Speaker: And she said, tak. not talk And to the people that don't speak Norwegian, I said to Sam in Norwegian, are you ready?
Speaker: And there was no hesitation when she said, yes, thank you. Yeah, and I knew what you were saying. It was quite good. Thank you. Yeah. I'm working on it. You did very well. Thank you. Shall we flip a coin? Let's flip a coin. All right. Get the show on the road.
Speaker: Tell me when. When.
Speaker: Yeah. Is that a griffin? A hippogriff? A flying grenade? Let it be a flying grenade, please. Well, it is. It be apropos of our lives.
Speaker: Estados Unidos Mexicanos. it's Yes. It could be a flying grenade. So love you sal I'm going to be the one. You're going to be the flying grenade. Okay. Okay.
Speaker: One more time. Okay.
Speaker: Flying grenade. Boom, bam, bam, bam, boom. Okay. The other night at work. oh okay yeah I don't know. The other night at work, I was working, and let me just tell you this.
Speaker: I don't know if I was working. i don't know. Somehow we end up at work sometimes without each other, and people are like, they They associate us with each other. Yeah. Well, I mean, understandably. And Sal, who we love, said, this was at the end of our 12-hour shift.
Speaker: And Sal looked at me, and because you weren't there, Sal said, are you Sam? And I was like, meaning, are you Sam tonight? Is that why you're working? And I swear to God, i looked at him. I was so tired. And I was like, no, I'm Jeff. Like, I could not comprehend what what he was asking, so my response was dead. I'm like, no, I'm Jeff. Have you not? Hi. Yeah, it's me. It's me. It's me.
Speaker: Sal? It's me, Sal? Okay. Well, on that note, go ahead. Okay. Share your tale.
Speaker: ah Okay. so That was good, Sam. going to share my tail. so I'm to take us out of the south tonight.
Speaker: The southern United States, right? You do like that. But I'm going to go to the south of a boot called Italy. Oh, I love Italy. It's my favorite boot.
Speaker: And there's a chance you may like know this story or know some stuff about it. like Are we still in the boot or are we in Sicily? We're in Sicily. My peoples. So in the quiet Sicilian town of El Camo, where the shadow of tradition loomed heavier than the mountain winds, girls were taught to obey, not to choose.
Speaker: Honor was worth more than justice, and a woman's fate was sealed not by her will, but by her family's name. And yet from this world of silence rose a single voice, and that is the voice of Franca Viola, the woman I'm going to tell you about today.
Speaker: Have you heard of her? I haven't. ah I'm so excited about this. Okay. need to figure out what my family name is, because it's either that Viola? or Yeah, it's either that or – no, that's my Portuguese name.
Speaker: Verzi. No, Verzi. Well, um and ah okay, my sources that I used, um an article by WAVE-network.org, and WAVE stands for Women Against Violence Europe by Valentina Canepa.
Speaker: And it's a feminist network that promotes human rights of women. An article by HistoryandWomen.com, by Morelos Potzer, Wikipedia.
Speaker: And, of course, an article by... Medium. Yes, by Olga Angelucci. Angelucci. Yeah. And episode 234 of Case File, and a podcast called Case File, called Franca Viola.
Speaker: You know he's anonymous, that host. Nobody knows whos he knows who he is. Yeah. Huh. It's an Australian. Yeah, because I used case files for one of my possessions.
Speaker: Well, he is anonymous. So i'm not going to say the titles of any of the articles because that will tell you the whole story, and I don't want to do that. Don't tell me. But trigger warning, there is like a mention of sexual assault, okay? Okay.
Speaker: um In Sicily, there was a romantic practice called la fuitina, and young couples in love would secretly run away from home together. They would return in a few days, hand in hand, demonstrating to the world that they had been intimate.
Speaker: Of course, the girl's reputation would be in tatters, and the only way to repair it was to have the couple repair the damage by marrying. And this is a practice dubbed matrimonio riparatore.
Speaker: I'm not Italian. That's very Spanish review. Wait, matrimonio reparatore. I did it with my fingers. like You did, that makes it Italian. Yes, reparation marriage. That was English.
Speaker: Thanks for qualifying that. For poor families who could not afford dowries for their daughters, the practice was encouraged by the parents. But not all that shines is gold, because the practice could also be used for more nefarious purposes.
Speaker: Girls could find themselves unwilling victims, rejected suitors or unwanted admirers would kidnap the object of their affection and then rape her. In this way, he would get the girl and then rely on reparation marriage to protect him from prosecution.
Speaker: How could this be? According to Article 544 of the Italian Criminal Code, code sexual violence was considered an offense against morals, not against the person.
Speaker: That is so wild to me. Any girl who suffered the disgrace of losing her virginity had like little choice. She either they submitted to the reparation marriage to restore her honor. Or she lived with the shame.
Speaker: Yeah, and the honor of her family depended on this too. Or she faced the future as a shunned spinster labeled a tarnished slut and would be forever to blame for the violence that she had endured.
Speaker: The culture of the Fuitina had reparative marriage goes back for centuries. This is nothing new. So this is an example, okay. Serafina Lococo, at age 15, was ready to marry the man of her dreams.
Speaker: He was a 20-year-old neighbor named Perio Santoro. They eloped, they had a fuitina. Mind you, this is southern Italy. si Sicily, you know exactly, which is a little bit different than Italy, right?
Speaker: We are indeed. Yes. It's a whole other culture. Right. So compared to northern Italy, a woman's worth is tied to her chasteness. Virgin marriages means pure and worthy.
Speaker: And it's not, if not, this was shameful or dishonored, no Sicilian man would marry a dishonored woman. This, of course, meant that she should marry Pietro, but her dad didn't like that idea. And because dad isn't on board, God, there's not a marriage.
Speaker: But dad eventually gave in and allowed it because the family name was on the line. Serafina's dishonor would be undone or restored by the reparative marriage. So that's how it works.
Speaker: About 12 months later, another man named Filippo Melodia, 23 years old, saw the most beautiful girl he had seen in his life, and her name was Franca Viola. She was a stunning girl. She was 15 years old, and apparently that's how it went back then. You can't change the way things were.
Speaker: Franca wanted to finish school and travel the world. Her family was a poor farming family. In contrast, Filippo came from a very privileged family.
Speaker: He drove an Alfa Romeo. He had tons of money. Filippo was the nephew of the boss of the Sicilian mafia called La Cosa Nostra.
Speaker: So all of this is setting up for this man doesn't take no for an answer. This man has never been told no in his life. Is disgusting yeah and does not take no. And his uncle owns the town and he drives an Alfa Romeo, smokes his cigarettes. He is the boss or so he thinks.
Speaker: So Franco believed that Filippo was okay and she would consider marrying him. But Franco's father Bernardo did not approve of Filippo. He heard the stories of Filippo terrorizing local people.
Speaker: families and speeding through narrow streets, flashing guns. He also knew that the local police were watching Filippo. Eventually, Filippo came to the Viola household to introduce himself, and he announced his plans to marry Franca.
Speaker: Bernardo, her father, being not and not easily intimidated, said that he preferred his daughter to marry a man who would take care of her. But Bernardo, right.
Speaker: It's an Italian mafia. Yeah. Oh, not against the family. But Bernardo was considering it with one exception and one exception only.
Speaker: They had to get to know each other. And see that, so that's the way they do it, right? Months go by and Franca realizes that he's not for her. Filippo's a shitbag. He's a shitbag, he ain't for her.
Speaker: He was arrogant and ah she did not like his connections to the mafia or the fact that he was probably behind like all the motorcycles that were being stolen. he She knew that in Alcamo, like that was a thing.
Speaker: So the next time Filippo visited Viola household, he was met by Bernardo, and Bernardo told him that he had failed the test. And for the rest of 64, they didn't hear a word from Filippo.
Speaker: A lot of cost La Cosa Nostra had been arrested, including Filippo's uncle, and there was a new cop in town. So the rest of the Cosa Nostra was keeping a low profile.
Speaker: But Filippo returned. No. And he wanted Franca now more than ever. And in May of 65, Filippo met Bernardo in town, and he told Bernardo of his feelings and how he really wanted to marry Franca even more now than ever.
Speaker: Bernardo said, basically, it was a no before, and it's a no now. He said, fuck all the way off. Basically, he did. And he knew that Filippo was responsible
Speaker: Oh, I just skipped a paragraph, can't do that. Almost just gave a lot away. On May 28th, Bernardo's warehouse where he kept all of his farming tools was on fire. no He was given the message that the fire was, quote, a warning.
Speaker: Just two months later, about 500 vines were destroyed on Bernardo's farm. And then Bernardo came home to see sheep and cattle grazing on the rest of his farm. The Viola family had nothing now.
Speaker: That was their livelihood. He knew that Filippo was responsible for this, but there was literally no proof. At the same time, Franca had become so scared she hardly left the house.
Speaker: At 7 a.m. m on December 26, 1965, Filippo and 11 of his friends made their move. well They went to the Viola house, close enough to the house, where they saw Bernardo leave.
Speaker: Gunshots were fired into the air to let the neighbors know not to fuck with them. They rushed the house, and when they saw Franca, they pinned her down. She initially got away, but they chased her up the stairs and dragged her back down the stairs and out the front door.
Speaker: Her little brother, Mariano, wasn't gonna let go of his sister's leg though, even when he was hit over the head over and over again. Vida, Franca's mom, rushed outside, but she was also hit in the head and fell to the ground.
Speaker: More gunshots were fired and the men had successfully kidnapped Franca and her little brother, Mariano. Bernardo came home immediately and he reported this to the cops, but the mafia's nephew, that's who this is. yeah Everyone knew that this was Filippo, but nobody would help, and well and because of this, nobody would help Bernardo with the investigation.
Speaker: But like I said, there was a new cop in town named Lorenzo Camilleri. He was not fucking around, so he immediately started the search. Filippo told Franco that after he was finished with her, she wouldn't be able to marry any other man.
Speaker: to which she shouted she did not love him. Mariano, the eight-year-old brother, was eventually pried from his sister and sent kind of back to Alcamo, where his family found him, and he went back home, so he was safe. ok Franco was essentially being held hostage by Filippo.
Speaker: For six days, he starved her until she was extremely weak, and when she was at her weakest on the seventh day, Filippo raped her. ah What a small, small, tiny man, you know?
Speaker: what ah Show up with 11 of your mafia buddies. And on her seventh day when she's the weakest, you rape And like premeditated, like you intentionally starved her and made her weak because you, again, are such a man.
Speaker: but enabled by the law because what he knew was that the rule was when an unmarried girl loses her virginity, even in the case of rape, that unmarried girl, unmarried girl, Franca in this case, would become dishonored. And her family would become dishonored. And her only choice marry him. Right.
Speaker: And to become honorable again, she would eventually have to marry him through the matrimonio reparatore. Now, it's common sense that this kind of thing is legal.
Speaker: Yeah, it's like it's like accepted. But Filippo, and he knew that Article 544 of the Criminal Code read that the crimes of a kidnap and rape would be extinguished by the marriage between the victim and her rapist.
Speaker: Even if the rapist is a minor, that doesn't matter. Right? Right. In January, Filippo moved Franca back to his sister's house in Alcamo. His family, the Melodia family, were now working with the Viola family to negotiate Franca's marriage to Filippo.
Speaker: And the two families were closing in on an agreement on a wedding date, while Franca is being held hostage. On January 6th, 1966, the police closed in on Franco's sister's house. They demanded for them to release Franca.
Speaker: Filippo comes out on the second story with a gun and with Franca. Franca shouted, don't shoot. Filippo ended up releasing Franca and she ran to her dead. Filippo was arrested and then he asked for a cigarette.
Speaker: Before going away with the cops, Filippo looked at Franca anticipating that she was gonna be his wife. and ah regain her honor and the honor of her family. As Franco was walking out, she slowed down and she looked at Filippo and she told him, quote, I will never marry you.
Speaker: Goodbye. And Filippo's smile disappeared. Franca mial yeah fraca meanwhile was with her family and she was really worried about this possible marriage that her dad had promised to Filippo's family.
Speaker: Bernardo told Franca that it was just a ruse and that this was not the intention. oh Bernardo had no intention of trying to marry Franca off to Filippo, but because of this, they faced serious backlash.
Speaker: There would be a pack a price for not pay not marrying Filippo, and life became grim for the Viola family in the months leading up to Filippo's trial for kidnapping and rape.
Speaker: Because she was still shunned. Yes, unless Franca agrees to marry him. Their farm had already been destructed or destroyed, so money was tight. Bernardo was desperate to find work, but nobody would hire him. I imagine it was the fact that not only was it his daughter a dishonored woman, it was also that she was dishonored and the other family was the mafia. yeah Franca became very reclusive, and Franca and her family were guarded by round-the-clock police. they were like All the police were guarding her because they knew the potential for danger.
Speaker: And it's all because of that one new blood, you know, like, because otherwise there would have not been, yeahp you know. Meanwhile, the trial is starting in December of 1966. Franca and her parents arrive at the Trapani Courthouse under under armored protection. About 500 spectators were in the courthouse.
Speaker: Most of the people were supporters of Filippo Melodia. Of course. In fact, the courtroom was hostile to the Viola family. do you know what this reminds me of?
Speaker: The movie mar Malena. Oh, yeah. That was set in Sicily. Yeah. And the courtroom thing is no joke. It's a spectacle. It is a spectacle.
Speaker: We got our faults, our Sicilians. I didn't say it was a fault. I mean, I just said it was a spectacle. I'm placing no judgment because I'm from a very religious part of this country myself. all availablable All 12 of the defendants were present, including Filippo.
Speaker: Filippo claimed that he and Franca had arranged the Fuitina together in order to... Like force the marriage. Yeah, put this in plug. Filippo had claimed that they didn't just have sex once, that they had sex several times, including during their two-year courtship, or the courtship from two years ago. Filippo's defense team requested to physically examine Franca to prove that she had lost her virgin virginity many months prior.
Speaker: Oh. Yeah. And how does one do that? Because just medically speaking, that's not a thing. Spectacle. Spectacle. Prosecution objected, and Filippo also claimed that Franca is the one that planned the kidnapping.
Speaker: And to support all of this, the defense called a neighbor named Anna to the stand. Oh, fuck off. She witnessed the standoff between Filippo and the cops, and she testified that she never heard Franca scream, and then she testified that Franca yelled, quote, don't shoot. Of fucking course she did. She didn't want to die.
Speaker: You know what I mean? Well, I mean, it you know, that gives you the importance of context. Oh my God, yeah. like Which just takes conng context away from all of this in the courtroom. Entirely. Because yes, she is telling the truth. She heard those things, but you have to look at why, you know? right And felip ah Franca's parents testified that, yes, Franca and Filippo were indeed engaged at one time, but they were engaged only to get to know each other. They also testified to the intimidation and destruction that Filippo waged.
Speaker: They were all kind of harsh on Franca, like all this shit was her fault, total blame to the victim, and they pressed her about why she hadn't gone with tradition with the tradition of marrying Filippo to restore her own honor and social standing. That was, seriously, like they couldn't understand why she didn't do it. Well, and that's the thing though, especially in the sixties is it's, it's
Speaker: the family name. It's like in Asian cultures, you know, it's
Speaker: Oh, exactly. I just sneeze. But, but that's what it was. That's, and, and, and you know, you, we make jokes about, you know, the old Nona's and all that kind of stuff. It's, it's,
Speaker: There's something deep rooted in Italian genetics that is, makes the cultural norm, like if if it's not followed, it's the.
Speaker: yeah Yeah, no, it's just like this. This is a prime example. Yeah. So they were hard on her and they were like, why didn't you just do it? Like any other person would have done it. Because your family would have been fine. we wouldn't be going through the spectacle like you. And it's. Filippo's family would have rebuilt the farm. Yeah. You know? Yeah.
Speaker: Franca simply replied, quote, I am not the property of anyone. Honor is lost by those who do certain things, not those who suffer them. Franca stayed away from the courthouse after that. Reporters and the photographers were all too much for her.
Speaker: She did not leave the house. Her dad, Bernardo, he did not miss a day of court. On December 17, 1966, the verdict was read. What do you think it is? You want to dare to take a guess?
Speaker: Not guilty. And what is great about this is that the local community as a whole had started to rally around Franca. Her case was a turning point in the social history of Sicily.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah. That is shocking, especially because it's in the 60s. Yes, and the court was resoundingly in favor of Franca Viola. Fuck off. Yes. That is the most majestic turn.
Speaker: So the court gave Filippo Melodia 11 years for kidnapping and rape, and the other 11 men also received sentences. The courtroom was stunned. quiet ah ah Quietness fell over the room, and an Italian newspaper called La Stampa reported, quote, and with Filippo Melodia, this lesson will be listened to by many other Sicilians who, like it or not, will now have to know that something new is stirring in our countryside.
Speaker: Well, and I mean, it's such... it's it the The verdict itself is stunning, right? But then you add to it that he is this figurehead of the mafia.
Speaker: You know, he is... The nephew. You know, like and that's the thing. You know, like, he's a, it's the mafia. So not only did they make this thing ah against some random sh schmo, it's like, ooh.
Speaker: oo Kind of cringe. Yes. Like, oh my God, all of you are just now on the chopping block. Watch Yeah. Yeah. But Justice had spoken, and for the first time, on the side of a woman.
Speaker: For the very first time. As the courtroom was emptying, Filippo's father said he wasn't worried at all. Of course not. He was positive that the wedding would happen. but He suggested that the wedding could be easily arranged so quickly, and he didn't really understand why Bernardo was so against it.
Speaker: Like, the nerve. But the like he really genuinely didn't understand. Like, again for centuries, this is how shit worked. It's in the blood.
Speaker: Change causes friction. Okay. Yeah. I'm so uncomfortable. Yeah. Filippo's lawyers filed for an appeal, and they were just a little successful. He got one year shaved off of his sentence. Ah.
Speaker: So it was dark and early on the morning of December 1968, December 1968, when 20-year-old Franca Viola was walking slowly down the aisle between the chapel's pews.
Speaker: Flowers were everywhere and stood out against her white satin and lace dress, and you could see her beautiful smile radiating under her veil. At the end of her the aisle waiting on her was 25-year-old Giuseppe Ruisi.
Speaker: Giuseppe and Franca had known each other for a long time, and before the trial they were reacquainted in 1966, and their relationship grew from there. The families had kept it a secret.
Speaker: After the trial, they got engaged. after the trial they got engaged He's like, this is my fucking girl. Yes. This is it. She stood up. oh Yes.
Speaker: And when Giuseppe got the marriage license, he also had to get a firearms license to protect them. Oh. It's the mob, the mafia. You ain't, like, it is what it is, you know? um...
Speaker: so um In recognition of her heroic challenging of the system, Italian Presidente Sarragoat sent them a wedding present.
Speaker: Pope Paul VI also publicly expressed his appreciation of Franca Viola's courage and his solidarity with the couple, inviting them to a private audience with him. Nothing, nothing in this world to a person of Catholic faith, I don't know, says i validate this, or it says that you are validating. It's okay. The Pope said, am validating you, girl.
Speaker: You know? i mean, hot dog. I got chills. Yes. They're multiplying. I love this story. It's got bad in it, but god damn, it's got good in it too. What a, yeah.
Speaker: Franca Viola's defiance lit a spark that burned for decades. It took 15 years for Italy to abolish to abolish the marriage redemption law. In 1981, Article 544 was finally repealed.
Speaker: And in 1996, sexual violence was legally redefined, no longer a crime against morality, but a crime against the person. and this is from Medium article by Olga Angelucci. She said, quote, what began as the courage of a single girl became a national awakening.
Speaker: Franca Viola never sought fame. She married the man that she chose to marry. She raised two children, and she lived quietly in her hometown where she still lives today.
Speaker: But in the eyes of millions, she remained a symbol of dignity and resistance. The woman who refused to let shame define her life. Her act was simple, but it was revolutionary. She said no.
Speaker: And in that one word, she gave voice to generations of women who had been told that they could not speak. Franca's story is not just history, it's a mirror. It reflects how far we've come and how fragile freedom can be.
Speaker: Because every time a woman dares to say no, every time she refuses to bow to violence or silence, her voice joins Franca's echoing through time, reminding us that real honor lies in courage.
Speaker: And that is the story of Franca Viola, the woman who said no. We were just talking about this at work yesterday and I cannot for the life of me remember who I was talking with.
Speaker: But it was that no is a sentence, right? Period. You know? Yeah. um But also, I want to just kind of give a shout out to Franka's dad, Bernardo, because the reality is, is that her family very well could have been like, shut up, sit down, like this is tradition.
Speaker: Like, yes, he might be a shitbag, but one, he's mafia. Two, Like this is what it is. And the only way for us to recover is for you to say yes to this, right? And Bernardo didn't do that.
Speaker: And like- In the face of La Cosa Nostra. Yeah. Like, and that also, like her strength unmatched, but his as well, even after losing the farm, losing everything that was his livelihood, like.
Speaker: And then Giuseppe. Way to just be there, my man. You you were looking um at me when I said and she's walking down the aisle. Well, I knew it wasn't Filippo, but I was like, but this is just a tear in. So I was like, second. But like the fact that they had the secret stuff going on. They hid that shit. Because you know what? like that's you know That's how a dad, that's how a family should be, right? And it's nice to see and hear that.
Speaker: And she is celebrated. i mean, she is like a true... Revolutionary. Revolutionary. She's a hero. You can see her on YouTube. She doesn't like the spotlight, but she has gone to a couple of things here and there.
Speaker: But like, she never wanted... She changed the face Italian, Sicilian role. Only by chance, right? Only because it happened to her. and she was And strong enough to say no. That was the key. She was strong. And she had that family. And she had the family.
Speaker: And Giuseppe. And Giuseppe. And Giuseppe. Giuseppe. Oh, okay. Well, fuck you, Filippo. I thought you would like that one. i do like that one. It hits me deep in my olive oil, you know? Yeah. um Well, all right. So we'll take a turn.
Speaker: i like that. That's what we do. it's not It's not the craziest turn, though. You know, it's not like, oh you know? But ah we're gonna pop back to America. America. America. What was that sound? That was like a growl that you made. That was impressive. You're welcome. ah We're gonna pop back to like the mid-1800s, okay? 1800s, the early 1900s. Saw a period of impressive growth and expansion.
Speaker: Civil wars wrapping up. The country begins to rebuild and expand, right? Across the landscapes of labor, industry, economy, the social and political and cultural fronts, many amazing things were accomplished during this period of time.
Speaker: Slavery was abolished, yay. yeah Federal troops were actually removed from the South. Andrew Carnegie and John D. Rockefeller, we know those names, right? Made the names for themselves and created lasting empires.
Speaker: The West became a new frontier to settle. Labor unions and reforms took root and the new frontier brought about sad things like the near extinction of the American bison, the mistreatment of the indigenous populations,
Speaker: weird things like Elmer McCurdy's body was embalmed and then taken on tour with the carnival. Um, and also i've heard that. I've heard about that.
Speaker: And also, people ah began importing camels to use because desert travel. So they import all these camels, and then they abandon the experiment. um And then next thing you know, there's all these feral U.S. s Army camels roaming about. And the most recent one...
Speaker: Of course there are. What the fuck? There's one named Topsy. Oh, shut up. Topsy the camel? Yeah. Died in 1936. Don't worry about the bison. They come back. Just this year, did you see the man that was like thrown into the air because he was trying to get a picture of the bison? Dumbass. That motherfucker is big. Stand away from that thing and take the picture. And also, listen, they're traumatized, motherfucker. Yeah. But yeah. Okay. So the last feral camel goes away. Like the last sighting was in 1941. Okay. That's like semi-recent. Okay. Yeah.
Speaker: So. what year? So they started importing them in like the early or 1860s. Okay. And 1941 is when the last feral camel was officially like.
Speaker: G.I. ge i Joe. No. What was the camel's name? Topsy. G.I. Topsy. Join the army. Yeah. It's so stupid. ah Anyway, um other like badass and legendary things, ah the development of women's clubs to promote arts and cultural um and like that kind of stuff. You know, women start working. they They, yes, they're known in this time period as like working in saloons and as prostitutes and that kind of thing, but they're making money, you know. Della Burke.
Speaker: um You know, you've got ah inspirational stories of cowboys and lawmen who create this entire genre of movies and songs and stories that shaped so many childhoods, okay? Childhoods, is that a word? Childhoods, childhoods?
Speaker: I know if that's a word. It's our word. Okay, I don't know if that's a word. Childhoods. And then factually, um one quarter of cowboys were actually men of color who had initially been brought west um by ranchers as slaves to do manual labor. But then when slavery was abolished, they were like, you know what? Fuck yeah. I'm going to stay out here. I'm going to do my own damn thing as a free man. And I'm going to work. And they were cowboys. Okay? m And also... The Pony Express only ever lost one male sack during their time of operation, in case you were wondering, which is a really big deal. It's pretty great. Okay.
Speaker: So, you know, obviously there's also some horrific atrocities that were committed. Slavery was abolished, but then Jim Crow laws paved the way for racial segregation. Native Americans are brutalized, displaced, and massacred. And for all the glory, advancement, excitement, and improvements, it cannot be forgotten at what and whose expense they came.
Speaker: All of that being said, we're not talking about any of that today, except for one part. Okay. And one part you're not expecting. What do you think we're going about? I have no idea. Like, I really don't know. Okay.
Speaker: One of the keys to the U.S. becoming a global power was during this time, its ability to connect trade markets. It was possible because of the introduction and expansion of the railroad system.
Speaker: However, before the Iron Road emerged and the country was connected, the crossing of unsettled country was fraught with danger and lawlessness.
Speaker: Any idea what we're going talking about?
Speaker: No. No. brigands and bandits and outlaws. Oh yes, okay, okay, okay. Made it easy to understand why it was called the Wild West. Yeah. And I love the Wild West. I have like 10 things going through my head right now. I love, I love cowboy story. You know, like my dad, good old school, the man loves a country western. Dad, my dad too. Listen, there is nothing better than like just sitting there watching and like it's the only thing He'll fall asleep during anything, okay? But you put on a good Western, and he'll actually stay awake for like a solid 10 minutes before falling asleep. Same dad. My dad is the exact same. Listen, the Duke, big fan, big fan.
Speaker: um so and And just so everyone is tracking, the entire time I was writing this story, it was like Toby Keith. Should been a cowboy. It's just like on rerun yeah in my brain holes. yeah Every part of it. And like if I would stop typing, it would pause and then it would start back up. like Full, just on rerun. um So we know the big names, yeah? Famous and infamous. Wild Bill Hickok was a lawman and an ambidextrous sharpshooter.
Speaker: Around 1865-ish, Wild Bill became a legend during a fight in Springfield, Missouri. with his single-shot kill of gambler Davis Tutte. After the famous and very brief, we're going to call it a gunfight, but I don't think that that counts because...
Speaker: It wasn't a gun fight. It was like a one draw. Done, right? um It was the first ever documented quick draw fight. He was then elected sheriff and did a bang-up job of protecting Abilene, Kansas, from the lawless cowboys.
Speaker: Additional famous lawmen and all that kind of stuff include Wyatt Earp, one of my personal favorites, Buffalo Bill, and not that, like, Silence of the Lambs skin wearing. He takes the lotion. Exactly. But the actual Buffalo Bill. Kit Carson, Bill Pickett, Annie Oakley, Tuberchio Vasquez. Okay?
Speaker: The infamous outlaws are in no other way, can I say this, but they're loved. Like, we don't... We love them, you know? And it's because the whole thing's...
Speaker: You know, it's it's a story to us. We didn't live it. um They inspired, again, generations. There's something romantic and nostalgic about a ruthless and fearless cowboy that has made the home in our hearts, right?
Speaker: Men like John Henry, Doc Holliday, who was dentist-turned-gambler and gunslinger who was a close friend of Wyatt Earp. And although Doc had received the death sentence of consumption, which is...
Speaker: beylo um The esteemed doctor continued living a full life for as long as he could. He was known for being level-headed and trying in most circumstances to prevent violence and death. So he was kind of part of the gambler, gunslinger, cowboy, like outlaw vibe, but he would try and reason with people and be like, let's not kill each other.
Speaker: Did it work? Really never. But he tried. um He was known ah best for his involvement in the gunfight at the OK Corral, in which he fought side by side with his friend and lawman, Wyatt Earp, to avenge the murderers of Earp's brothers.
Speaker: More of these loved bad boys and girls include Billy the Kid, Jesse James, Butch Cassidy, Black Bart, and Frank McClary, which is the Sundance Kid. Can I just tell you, i have been into the house where Jesse James was shot and killed.
Speaker: That is in St. Joseph, Missouri. yep i used to live an hour north of there. Dead came up and i was with Dead and we went into the house where Jesse James was killed. Oh, I love that.
Speaker: It's just, ah it's you know, it's like sits and I don't like, if my dad hadn't raised me on John Wayne and all that kind of stuff, like I probably wouldn't feel all of it, but like doing this story, there is just so much magic happening. um Some of the lesser known men and women heroes and villains, which we have to call them villains, right? Because they're Lawless, but I don't consider them villains.
Speaker: um Are in some ways even more lovable than the ones with tails that are on screen, etc. And one of these is Miss Rose Elizabeth Dunn, a.k.a.
Speaker: the Desert Rose or the Rose of Cimarron. I have no idea who this is. Enlighten me. have no idea. I just love her. i fucking love her.
Speaker: Born September 5th, 1878 in Winfield, Kansas. Rose was maybe one of ten children. Again, records weren't the best, so it was like there were either seven of them or there were ten. Can't really confirm. Regardless, she was born into a poorer family, which, again, not uncommon for frontier families.
Speaker: um Her parents, William H. Dunn and Sarah C. Brenner. um Most of the children were men, or or boys.
Speaker: Men. They grew into men. um So, Sarah was the only, or Rose was the only female child. William died when Rose was still a child.
Speaker: Despite being poor, Rose received a formal education at a convent in Wichita, which is unheard of. Like, she's from broke-ass family in middle of fucking nowhere, child of billions of kids, and somehow they managed to send her there, okay?
Speaker: Hell yeah.
Speaker: she was and is universally described as a striking beauty with a kind demeanor yet frequently referred to as fiery and something to watch out for oh yeah Like, don't you? Hell yeah. right Like, yes, please describe me that way.
Speaker: We can cut the striking beauty. but Growing up with many brothers, Rose learned to quote, ride, rope, and shoot. love this. On horseback.
Speaker: It didn't take long for her to be better than pretty much all of the men of the time on horseback. Okay, so young girl goes to a convent, gets a formal education. she is wildly intelligent and just above her class in terms of actual knowledge and intelligence level. And then she's got the the the hands-on experience that her brothers were like, nah, fuck that, Rose. We're going to teach you how to be.
Speaker: And so she became, like, legendary horseback rider, amazing sharpshooter, and, like, an absolute professional with a Winchester rifle. Okay?
Speaker: Better than the boys. Better than the boys. Like Ginger Rogers. She did everything backwards and in heels. And in heels. Unlike Fred Astaire. She didn't do a whole bunch of heels. That's fair. She earned her nickname because she was known for riding her horse hard across the sandbars of the Cimarron River.
Speaker: By the time she was 12, her older brothers had already become This is a quote. Minor outlaws, which I would love to know what the actual definition of a minor outlaw is, right? They didn't give much detail on that.
Speaker: And they started their own gang known as the Dunn Brothers. They operated a ranch just outside Ingalls, Oklahoma that became a popular hotspot for other outlaws to visit.
Speaker: Although she had received her, again, unusual for her socioeconomic status, formal education, her exposure to the criminal activities of her brothers was very formative for young Rose. After Sarah's marriage to Dr. Call, the family reco relocated into Ingalls proper.
Speaker: At the time, Ingalls was known as a refuge for fugitives and lawless men evading the U.S. s Marshals. At the ripe old age of 14, her brothers... i was going to say 20.
Speaker: 14. Damn. Her brothers, you know, had started bringing some of their friends around. She visited them on their ranch, and so she was introduced to a number of outlaws. okay Minor outlaws.
Speaker: Minor outlaws. These ones were not so minor. One of these men was George Bitter Creek Newcomb. I bet you my dad would love this story.
Speaker: a former member of the Dalton gang, in 1893, Newcomb joined the Doolin gang and terrorized Indian territory in Oklahoma for years. They robbed banks, trains, stagecoaches, all throughout Arkansas, Oklahoma, and Kansas.
Speaker: After their meeting, Rose Dunn and George Newcomb fell fast in love and became romantically involved. Again, kind of like, this is answer, know, like, yes, she's 14, 15, like, That sounds creepy, but at the time he was 20, like, that was it, right? That was normal. um The only girl in a large family, Rose had grown used to caring for her brothers and had developed a strong maternal instinct. She looked after the guys from the Doolin Wild Bunch, which is what the gang was called, and they adored her. They protected her. They kind of, like, took her in. They were like look at our ah look at our little Rose.
Speaker: Because her man and his buddies were wanted men, and they were not minor outlaws. They were major. they Major outlaws. Major outlaws. ah Rose would make supply runs for the gang and bring them news. Her new family home was located right near the saloon that was known as a hangout for the Doolin boys. So Ingalls, it's a refuge for these outlaws, and the Doolin gang was kind of like, this was their primary hotspot.
Speaker: And the family home was like, right there, here's the saloon. Okay. Wild West town, so it's like seven buildings. Yeah. Okay. Dirt road, seven buildings. Road.
Speaker: It's just dirt. Dirt trail. Dirt. um During an epic gunfight, which is counted as one of the last Wild West shootouts ever to happen, in September 1893, U.S. Marshals attempted to apprehend several several of the Doolin gang.
Speaker: Rose stepped up to help her lover. The marshals had surrounded George Ransom's saloon and demanded the outlaws surrender. Bill Doolin simply replied replied with, go to hell and started shooting.
Speaker: The ensuing battle sent the townspeople fleeing in all directions, trying to escape the barrage of gunfire and violence. Just bullets flying everywhere, okay? Rose had heard this start and reportedly retreated into the Pierce Hotel when hell broke loose.
Speaker: In the battle that left nine dead or dying, and the town covered in blood and riddled with bullet holes, Rose wasn't going to sit back. Right? Right. that's not Rose. going to tell you about a girl that's just sitting there. That's not Rose. Yeah. Right? She is a gunslinger herself. She is... The badassiest of all. the badassiest, right? Yeah. And it's her mans. Yeah. And her, like, adoptive family. Like, she had no problem with her blood family. They were still close. But this was the family she had chosen, yeah?
Speaker: So Rose climbs out the second story window of the hotel where she had been observing. She braves the flying bullets, runs through the chaos to bring a new gun to her man, Newcomb.
Speaker: She's wrapped in two belts of ammunition. She turns the rifle that she's carrying and loaded on the marshals to provide cover for Bitter Creek, Newcomb, as he reloads his revolvers.
Speaker: This distraction allowed enough time for the gang to run. all flee and kind of get gone. Three outlaws were wounded. One was captured. Most survived to fight another day. There were a lot of deaths in terms of like the marshals and it was a really, really bad hit for them.
Speaker: Okay, so again, Rose. Not a little like precious wildflower. She's fucking Desert Rose. She and the wounded men hide out, and Rose helps nurse them back to health for about two months. And then after they recovered, Rose says goodbye to her quaint and respectable family, and she dives fully into the nomadic lifestyle of an outlaw.
Speaker: In the following years, she performed all sorts of tasks for the gang. She was on the run, living rough, so... um multiple men, Doolin included, and Newcomb, they all like refine her shooting capabilities and her abilities, which were already top-notch. But they make her a force to be reckoned with, more so than already was.
Speaker: um She was a key supporting member in the gang. Her unassuming appearance, delicate nature, and youth allowed her to go undetected as a member of the band of rugged outlaws. She carried messages between gang members who were in different locations.
Speaker: She cooked, she cleaned, and she served as a lookout when the gang went raiding. Sometimes, history is questionable on this, okay? We'll keep it questionable. um She did actually participate, drawing her guns, and that kind of thing, as more of a scare tactic. It's not reported that she ever actually took anyone's life in any of these things. And she was never officially linked to the crimes and never identified herself as a full-fledged member of the crew. But her presence was undoubtedly crucial to the gang's longevity.
Speaker: By mid-1895, Bitter Creek Newcomb had $5,000 1895. That's a okay? He had dead alive, his head.
Speaker: that's a lot of fucking money okay he had it ah a reward dead or alive on his head So when he and one of his outlaw buddies came to visit Rose, because at this point she had moved back in to her family's home, and they had been visiting her for a while, no issues. That's $200,000 in today's money.
Speaker: Yeah. Her brothers seized the opportunity to claim the reward and killed both men as they dismounted out front of the Dunn house. For some unknown and undocumented reason, the Dunn brothers...
Speaker: previously bandits of their own, had disbanded their outlaw gang years before and turned to bounty hunting. George Bittercreek Newcomb was shot and killed by the outlaw-turned-lawmen, brothers of his love.
Speaker: Rumors flew in the outlaw world that Rose had set up George, and she adamantly denied any involvement. Her brothers confirmed that she had nothing to do with the ambush that killed the man, and she had no idea what they were planning.
Speaker: Unfortunately, it wasn't easy to escape the accusations. So in 1897, Rose Dunn changed the game. She married the respectable Oklahoma politician, Charles Noble, and together with two of Rose's brothers, the couple moved to New Mexico for a fresh start.
Speaker: She lived the rest of her life away from outlaws, gunfights, and death. Charles died in 1930, and in 1946, Rose married Richard Fleming. The couple moved out to Washington State.
Speaker: They had previously known each other as teenagers when they met at a square dance in Ingalls. Rose Dunn lived to the age of 76, and she so died as a respected lady in June of 1955. Interestingly, the name Rose of Cimarron first became known to the public in 1915 when it was printed in a book named Oklahoma Outlaws.
Speaker: Respected lawman Bill Tillman had helped the newspaper man collect tales from the 1890s. The book was sold alongside showings of the silent movie entitled Passing of the Oklahoma Outlaws.
Speaker: It wasn't until 1952 that the true identity of the Rose of Cimarron was revealed. The story of the fearless Rose walking through gunfire to give the wounded Bitter Creek a weapon was captivating. People fell in love with her.
Speaker: It was retold in many books and for years, like four decades. But reportedly, the tellers of those stories didn't want to reveal her identity because she had taken herself out of that life and become this respectable member of the community. So they didn't to embarrass her.
Speaker: So for fear of embarrassing her, they valiantly tried to keep her name for the story until snot-nosed stickier... face and where it doesn't belong kind of guy published right so um people for a long time debated whether rose dunn was actually the rose of simran after her death richard fleming said that he knew that she had been called the rose of simran and that she was a quote true friend of the outlaws but said that she was never actually a sweetheart to any and never romantically involved and the stories were exaggerated
Speaker: So this throws into question this whole magnificent story that she braved a gunfight and she handed this Winchester rifle to her lover and everyone's damn. Moreover, the newspaper articles actually didn't mention any females present in or around the town during the gunfight.
Speaker: Not a one. she like Yeah, I mean, but they didn't do that because it was a woman. So that's that was what some people were arguing. they were like, well, nobody documented it.
Speaker: Okay, so there existed an 1873 Winchester rifle engraved with a plaque that said Rose of Simmerin in the stock and a note from 1895 signed and stamped by U.S. Marshal E.D. Nix, author Glenn Shirley, the butthead,
Speaker: tried to dispute the timeline of the rifle in the note, claiming that it was received around the death of Bitter Creek and that the brothers had, like, handed it over as some part of, like, a trade or something. So he was like, no, no, no. It had nothing to do with a gunfight. That doesn't mean shit.
Speaker: Fuck you, Glenn. Can't be a woman. The note directly contradicts that. Again, it is signed by U.S. marshal and dated, and it has been validated from 1895.
Speaker: It states that the rifle was picked up on Ingalls Street and was identified as the weapon Rose had taken to George Bitter Creek Newcomb during the fight, witnessed by none other than U.S. Marshal E.D. Nix. Okay? So what are you saying? The fucking marshal's lying? Yeah. Get out of here.
Speaker: Additionally, Bill Tillman, the 1890s U.S. Marshal and Lawman, his own wife stated that she knew Rose Dunn and said that her husband hadn't made up any of the story of Rose of Ingalls. She did say, though, that some of the other stories that were floating around about her were inaccurate, but the one of her saving Newcomb was accurate.
Speaker: After much debate, it was concluded that Rose Dunn was, in fact, Rose of Cimmern from the Ingalls gunfight. Her name had not been mentioned by newspapers for the same reason Tillman and the ozz others had not released her name until years later.
Speaker: At the time of the fight, Rose was a young lady and daughter of the respected Dr. W.R. Call. The newspapers didn't want to slander the name of a member of such a prominent family.
Speaker: Rose's widower, widower Richard, later reported that all of the stories about the Rose of Cimarron, quote, caused my wife a great deal of embarrassment. She managed to move beyond the tales and the memories. She started a new and very different life for herself. She died happily far, far away from the Rose of Cimarron and all she was for the outlaws she had once loved.
Speaker: Damn, that was good. Good job. I have a whole vibe right now because the rabbit hole I went down for the Desert Rose. so expect more Wild West. Sounds so good. I just love it. I have some Wild West stories in my, uh, repertoire queue. Uh-huh. Yeah. We gotta make sure we don't do the same ones.
Speaker: I might just leave those to you cause that's your jam. I love it. You got that vibe going on right now. Yeah. but You got the vibe. i do indeed. Uh, what else?
Speaker: i You know what? Two stories about strong women. Right? That is it. That's what we did today. but apart from that, nothing else in common.
Speaker: ah Mine had the mafia. Yours had the outlaws. Indeed. Not, I mean, kind kind of. Distant relatives, maybe? In a little wild way.
Speaker: I think that might be a stretch. Yeah, I'm stretching. That's it. I'm stretching. But don't stretch too hard. You're to to have shin and massage things back into place. yeah God, that was great. That was so good.
Speaker: You having a moment? Having a moment. Good for you. I'm glad that you see, you know what? Yin and yang here. Yin and yang. That's what we are um Should we end it?
Speaker: Should we close this sucker down? Da. Da. A du klar? Ja, tak. Okay. Remember, everybody, you can find us on our social medias, email us whatever you want Rate us, review Rate us, review us. Five stars.
Speaker: Five stars. And only that we are here for a good time. Not a long time. Bye-bye.
