Transcript
Speaker: Hello and welcome to What Makes You Tick. This is an interview podcast where I, Ryan Watson, speak to actors, writers, filmmakers and a range of other artists from the northeast of England and sometimes beyond about what they do, how they make it work and the media that inspires them to do that work.
Speaker: On the show this month, I have Len Daniels. Len is a writer and actor. She's been a member of the Actors Forge for the last two years. She has a theatre background. She's appeared as an actor in the now released Atlas Films production, A Malevolent World, and a student film called Writer's Cut. She's been an extra in real, legit Hollywood productions like The Hunger Games and The Walking Dead. She's also been providing behind-the-camera production support to Rob Carr during the most recent turn at the Actors Forge, which was focused on screen acting.
Speaker: Len, welcome to the show. Thank you for having me. Yeah. um How are you doing? We were saying before recording that it was a late one because of the work you've been doing with Rob. Yes. um Normally class ends at like nine. now we like have been ending at like nine thirty. Get there early because we started exactly like we started at five. Oh, wow. So it's had in like a good hour and a half altogether.
Speaker: Yes. So it's been amazing. And I love every second of all of that. Yeah, it seems it seems quite fun. Is it four days a week you've been doing it? Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday. Yep, four days and Saturdays and all day things. Saturday's a long one. Wow. um how How have you been finding it it? has been freaking fantastic. Rob is amazing at what he does. like The way he sees that camera lens and all that stuff is, I don't know how he does it. And He's taught me very well and I hope everything that he's taught me I can translate to my own work, which if that ever does happen, but I just love working with Rob. What sort of experience do you have with the actual filmmaking side before you were working with Rob? Oh gosh, um so back in America I did an internship on The Walking Dead under the camera department.
Speaker: And I was also internship for script supervisor as well. I'd done production assistant, which you guys call runners over here over there.
Speaker: um But literally, I've just mostly done background or stand in or photo double work. OK. So with Rob, it's been sort of a lot more closely working on some of the the camera stuff and the Exactly. Cause when you're an intern under the camera, it's literally, um, running and for the walking dead, it was grabbing magazine. Um, cause they used film. So I had to lug huge, um, film around on a hot summer day. So I got a good workout from that. Wow.
Speaker: Making sure that the, um, they had what they needed. Um, so they have like their carts and stuff and each camera, uh,
Speaker: person because we had we were a three camera it's a one camera show but it's using three cameras and they each had their own carts that had specific things so we had to make sure that that's out and we had to unload the trucks like we were the first ones in unloading the trucks at every set that we were in I loved him when we weren't at a set and we were actually in studio because AC um and then we were the last to leave because we had to loaded back into the truck if we were not on the soundstage.
Speaker: um So that was mine, but I started on stage. So I mean, the first question I normally ask is, can you tell us about your, your background, how you came to, to acting, writing, et cetera? Like, so where, where did it start? I've always been a writer. I think I've written, ah as soon as I could remember talking, I was telling stories. I love telling stories to my family. um I learned how to write. I hated physically writing because I had the most sloppiest handwriting. So my teacher taught me how to type and I love typing. So I used to be on the computer typing these stories and then reading it out to my friends and family members. And then I got better at writing. So then I would, instead of studying, like listening in class, I would be in my notebooks writing stories and novels and
Speaker: stuff And then when I went to university, I learned how to do playwriting and script writing. And I started writing plays and scripts. And um I got started in theater mostly because I was going to be an English major. And we were studying Shakespeare and we were doing Hamlet. And my teacher was like, well, we're reading Hamlet. Why don't you go audition for the theater department? Because they're doing Hamlet and you're loving this. So I auditioned and I got cast.
Speaker: um as like the ambassador of England or something like that and I fell in love with it and I haven't stopped being part of it and I also did improv as well at uni and I love doing that because I just I don't know it just helps create my imagination even more so i feel like The English thing and then me doing improv got me to join the theater department and I haven't. And I dropped my English major to be a theater major.
Speaker: And I learned my specialty in theater was um playwriting, acting, stage managing and lights. Our university is literally like you have to be a well-rounded. They taught you everything you can. Like we learned costuming, makeup, sounds.
Speaker: I suck at sound. I will not get into makeup because it's a complicated subject on that one. And costuming, I just, I did deal with costumes, but I hated it. um Those who do costumes for theater and film, they are amazing. And I admire them. I can't stand doing it. But I did love when I, when we had to do load-ins, which means that you put the set up, set up.
Speaker: I always instantly went to the lighting department and hung up lights because I loved going on the catwalk and hanging lights and all of that stuff. I guess, how, how do you go then from, from doing that at university then to what, what happens between then doing something like your internship on the walking dead? I was looking for a job in between and I went to the career services at my university and they saw that i was a theater major and I was like, Hey, how about you look at this on Facebook? It's a, um, does the background work? And so I signed up for background. Um, yeah The first background thing I ever did was as Tyler Perry TV show.
Speaker: I think it was called For Better or For Worse. And that was off of Bill Mornayalli. I can never pronounce that the name, but it was under Bill. And it was because someone in the career services at my university introduced me to this on Facebook.
Speaker: And then The second thing I ever signed up for was to be a hand double on The Walking Dead. i didn't say it was for The Walking Dead. never even heard of The Walking Dead.
Speaker: I didn't know what the show was. I, cause I'm like zombie things freak me out. The only zombie stuff I like was willing, I've willingly watched is warm bodies and zombie land.
Speaker: Cause they're come, they make fun of the genre. I feel like, um but I signed up and they like, we need a picture of your hand. And I was like, okay, here's a picture of my hand. And I'm on The Walking Dead set that knowing what it is. And so they put me in her costume and I walk on and pick up,
Speaker: some pills for the blonde chick. I think her name is Andrea. I don't watch. i feel bad. You know, I watched the first series and I've never watched any more of it. So it's been a lot. She's in the first series. I mean, it was so it was 2011 or something when I watched it as well. Yeah. So um apparently whoever was her stand in, I guess, I don't know what the story is. So they I got an email asking, hey, do you want to go stand in? And I'm like, I'm a broke college student.
Speaker: Yes. So I um came in the next day as a stand-in and the fellow stand-ins, I'm like, what is a stand-in? And they're like, oh, we'll teach you everything. And they literally taught me everything you needed to know on that day. For those who don't know, there's a difference between stand-in photo-double and stunts. Stand-ins are generally you um match the coloring of clothing that the actor wears. You have to be a similar height and similar skin tone and have the same hair type as the actor.
Speaker: because of lighting and camera reasons. And what you do is that you watch the rehearsal of the actors, or you do the um rehearsals for the actors, for the camera and the lighting. That way the actors can do other stuff, like learn their lines, deal with hair and makeup, or they might be doing something on second unit or something. You look like you have a question. So so it's you're there when the actors are off somewhere else, but while the shot's getting set up. So you're the person that the shot is set up around. Yes. While the actor's doing rehearsing or other shots or something.
Speaker: Exactly. um So you you'd hear the term first team, which is the actors, and second team, which is us. And second team, we'd hear so they scream, second team. So we'd instantly have to come up there and do the blocking or the movements is another word, but blocking is a standard term that they use.
Speaker: And we follow and do all that for the camera. And we have to hit our marks, which I don't know if you were there the day that we were teaching marking, of hitting your marks. But hitting your marks is very important because of how lighting hits you and how camera hits you. So that's another reason why you have second team there is to help that. I was also her photo double. And what that means is that they would put her they would put a wig on me because she had locks. At that time, I didn't have locks. I had an afro or I straightened my hair at that time. I don't remember.
Speaker: And they would put her, ah they had a second wig and they put a wig on me to have the locks. um And then I would get to wear her costume. And i can tell you in season three, a lot of it, if you don't see her, face that's pretty much my body some of season four i don't think in season five I was used that much but yeah so it was it's a fun experience so a lot of times if you ever watch a movie or tv show sometimes if it's an actor's back to the audience it may not be the actual outcome back it could be a photo double or it might be their stand-in that's doing it because the actor
Speaker: whatever reason, because sometimes the actor might be doing something else that you don't know. And there is a pay difference between being a photo double and a stand-in. If you wear the costumes, you get paid more. And the stunts, they literally do all of the fun stuff and they get paid thousands to do that. One of the people that I worked with on The Walking Dead, he's a stunt coordinator right now. He does stunts for big Hollywood movies. And I love that for him because he was fantastic and that's what he wanted to do.
Speaker: so I don't know if I can give him a shout out. I don't even know if he cared enough if he remembers me because I don't think anyone remembers me from The Walking Dead. so i'm sure I'm sure they do. You know, this is that last last night at the Forge. You were like, oh, I'm a nobody. I won't have anything to talk about. and you've just told us a story about how you were in The Walking Dead and quite, quite, quite strongly involved. mean, I just, I don't know. And so, yeah, because of that. And then since I was doing second in team, I was like, well, I'm at university.
Speaker: can I do my like internship? Like, cause I needed credits. was like, can i do an internship for the walking dad? It's like, my professors is like, yes, but they wouldn't let me do what I actually was being paid for. So I actually had to do something else, which is why I got to do the camera internship and, um, script supervisor. And I chose script supervisor.
Speaker: Cause I felt like that was the closest to writing and, um, stage management, which is something I love doing is stage management. um Because I didn't, i ah the first AD would probably have been the closest to it, but that would have been being a production assistant intern. And didn't want to be, I love production assistants. I love doing it, but I decided to be a camera intern because I'm like, I can, and feel like, because in theater, a lot of the things kind of match, but don't match. Like sound and theater and film are completely different things. Same with lighting is completely different things.
Speaker: I was like, I did lighting in theater. Let me see what it's like. And so I did the opposite of that. So I did camera intern. You were a script supervisor. So what what what does that involve on a ah show like The Walking Dead? um Script supervisor is, they keep up with continuity. They keep up with making sure that the actors say the lines exactly right. And they're also a part of helping editors keep up. So um when you have um the clapper thingy, if you ever watched a behind the scenes movie and you have someone that says, Scene five, act three, take two. And then they hit the clappers.
Speaker: The slate is what it's called or clappers. It's whatever. um They coordinate with that so the editors can make sure that because all of that does with the the clapper or the slate is to make sure that the editors know.
Speaker: for editing, for sound and also visual stuff or special effects stuff. And the script supervisor does that. And they work kind of closely with the director because they're like looking at that and they're like, Ooh, that's, it's good. That's the take that she should do instead of that one. And they make sure that, for example, actors have a habit of forgetting which hand they use. Cause they're so focused on the acting that they don't realize that originally I picked up the remote with my left hand. And then in the second take, I picked it up with my right hand. So then the script supervisor would be the one that notices like actually on the first take, you picked it up with your left hand and to keep up with that type stuff.
Speaker: And also with the hair and notice that type stuff. And if you ever watch TV shows and movies, there is a lot of continuity issues and it's not based off, it could be because like the script supervisor did notice that and call it out. But sometimes directors is like, I like that shot a lot better. So it's not that important anymore, which respect because sometimes that shot might have been 10 times better than the one that followed the continuity as someone who studied directing as well. Because again, my university made us make sure that we were well-rounded in the department. Is it intimidating, and I guess, if an actor's said a line slightly wrong or used a different hand to the last take? like who do yeah i'm I'm assuming you don't go up to Andrew Lincoln himself and say, you need to do that the other way. She definitely did, several times.
Speaker: really? Yeah. Yes. but What is it? both like ah Andrew was like, hey, Andrew, um rest in peace. um You picked up, you you did do that. And they were so nice. It's not like, the fun thing is like, all of these actors were so extremely nice about it. And receptionist was like, oh, thank you. And they would always thank that her for it. So,
Speaker: um actors are nice about it. Like majority of them have been nice about it. And some directors, some of them don't. was like, who cares about that? I've seen directors say that in some shoots. i'm not going to say it was The Walking Dead, for example, but other movies that I've seen and TV shows that I've been part of. The directors are like, who cares about that? just But no, they know that and they expect that script supervisor is going to say, hey, um Ryan, the line is, I told you so, not whatever, you know, and the actor would be receptive of that. It's like, yeah thank you so much.
Speaker: And I feel like every now and then I'm talking to someone and I get into my own insecurities where I'm like, I'm like, if I were in that position, why would anybody want to listen to me? But it's like, that is people's job. They're used to doing these things. Yeah. That's literally what you're trained to do. And you have to like, you have to be assertive. And with that type of position, stage management and script supervisors, you are, they are assertive people, but they're also very kind people. And to do those jobs, you literally have to be on your toes because as a stage manager you're literally in control of that show um you're running rehearsals and you're running the production because right after all of the rehearsals are over you're doing the show the director's no longer there they leave to go to the next project and so now you're in charge of making sure that everything runs smoothly and if you ever go to like newcastle theater and seen like the musicals or the plays there
Speaker: it looks so freaking fantastic because the stage manager is doing a dang good job of making sure that everything runs smoothly, making sure that the show starts at 7.30, if it's supposed to start 7.30, making sure that actors are in their places, making sure that the props are where they need to be, et cetera. And you can't be a passive person. i mean, I'm a passive person, but you can be passive, but you still have to be assertive, I guess.
Speaker: There's a fine line between being And I've been in an actor where I've had a rude stage manager and you're invisible, but you still have to. It's I don't know. Yeah, it sounds like a really interesting one. I mean, like because I kind of get what you're saying. It's like there's definitely work situations I've been in where while I feel like I'm a bit more of a passive person, you come into certain situations where you have to be more assertive. Yeah.
Speaker: I guess it just, it just, I don't know. and It's just so far from a world that that I ever thought, like I can comprehend. I'm like, this is like huge skill stuff. No, it's crazy though, because sometimes while like in the classes, for example, this, the six weeks that I've been working with Rob um and Rob is so level and calm and like, I've never heard him go a high decimal of speaking.
Speaker: And so sometimes the class can get loud. And I feel bad every time I have to tell people quiet because I don't like doing it. It makes me uncomfortable myself. But I know i have to do it because if I let them continue talking, we're not going to get stuff done.
Speaker: So and even rob like if Rob has to say quiet and no one hears, I have to then I will step in. So, hey, quiet, guys. We're trying to film. There's one point in the class where um we were doing the line reading type stuff.
Speaker: and we were asking, which one do you guys think it is? And the class, there were people who were joining in participating, but a lot of the other people were talking about things outside of the class. And I literally stepped in and I felt so bad about it. it was like, hey guys if you're not discussing what we're talking about, can you please not talk?
Speaker: And then Rob looked at me, he's like, thank you And I'm like, I'm and my god like My face what was red, and i was just like, ah. And he's like, do not... And was just like, because I don't like having to be assertive, but I know that that's the job.
Speaker: As somebody in the class, it's sort of like... You don't look at someone doing that and go, what are they doing? You're like, actually, yeah, they've got a point. We probably need a show. I felt like such a bitch when I did was just like, oh, God, they're going to hate me. because It was a class that I...
Speaker: I don't want to say the class, but yeah, I was just like, I feel like such a bitch. Oh, God. It is hard to do. I think Rob did when ah when I spoke to him on on the podcast. I think he he said something similar as well. like There's all these like extra little skills that you just have to to bring out in those situations.
Speaker: As of right now, I haven't been focused on anything but doing all of the behind-the-scenes stuff. I need to get back into writing. So how how long were you on The Walking Dead for? You said you were on season three and four, so that sounds like a decent definitely know season three and four for sure. Season five, I'm pretty sure I was on that one.
Speaker: No, season three, four and five, because I remember going to the wrap parties for that. um Season six, halfway, um I kind of, it was a weird thing because she wasn't on it that much. I was a broke person, so I needed money. So I left, but I still was like, if the person who took my place needed to leave, let me know. And now it can be her stand in, if you will.
Speaker: Um, and I would sometimes appear and help out around there. And then she started appearing at 10 times more after I left. And I was a little frustrated about that, but that was on mine because whatever.
Speaker: um and I kind of didn't, and then I just focused on doing background because I'm going to be straight up honest. And I don't know if this is appropriate to say, but as a black American, it is really hard to find stand in work over in America because,
Speaker: especially as a dark skinned black woman, um, because a lot of Hollywood typically shows women of color, but there are of a lighter complexion. And so it's harder. was ah It can be a lot harder for me.
Speaker: And a lot of the ones that are, are stand-ins they're established and they've gotten it. And so I wasn't finding a lot of work as a stand-in side to do more background, which is a lot more frustrating because, but it is what it is. Um,
Speaker: And yeah, sorry about to bring up race. No, that's that's okay. that's fine um So did you do the extra the the background? Sorry, do we say extra on background?
Speaker: So I'm willing to say something because I didn't know this when I first started is they don't it's not nice to say extra because it sounds really like your furniture like and so they say background artists or supporting artists is what you guys call it over here because you're an artist.
Speaker: um If you say extra, that kind of has a negative connotation to it. I know there's some extras or background who does who doesn't care. I mean, I don't care. It's either or. But a lot of people prefer background because it sounds more professional and it sounds better, I guess. Yeah, so that makes sense. I mean, it feels respectful um to say a a background or supporting. I think this might not even be the first time I've been recorded having this explained to me. You know, now you're saying it. I think I've had this explained to me before.
Speaker: ah But yes yeah, so did you start that stuff? So well that after you'd left The Walking Dead, or did you start doing that stuff alongside it? ah Alongside it. So if I wasn't doing The Walking Dead, I was doing background work. For example, um I did this movie called The Deaf.
Speaker: um when I wasn't doing it like because we were on a hiatus. No, it wasn't the hiatus. It was when the group split up or something like that. And so when the group split up, people were having their own specific episode. So I wasn't needed.
Speaker: And so the people who I worked with for the background for that, because background, and the people who cast background also are casting, supporting um the stand-ins and photo devils. They're like, hey, you're not being used on The Walking Dead. Can we put you on another project? I'm like,
Speaker: yes, yes, please. So they put me on the duff and ah me and the person who was a stand in for Glenn, we both did that project together. And it was such an amazing thing. I was like, in my mid 20s playing a high schooler.
Speaker: um and I actually did get featured in that I'm like in the first five seconds of I don't know, because I haven't seen the film. I don't typically watch any of the stuff that I've been in I just realized that.
Speaker: Except The Hunger Games, but you i am you can't see me in The Hunger Games. And that's specifically, i learned um a long time ago as background that the less that you are seen, the more times that they can bring you back. um Because if they see you all the time, for example, hey, they saw me at the supermarket in this frame.
Speaker: they're definitely not going to put me in the hospital scene, are they? So you can be multiple, almost like multiple background characters if you're not really seen that much. Exactly. So i always tried to be the farthest away. So then when the production system is like, did we see it? It's like, nope, I was all the way back there, blur that you can't see. um So that's one thing I always learned. And I also learned that if I was going to do background work, I was going to make sure that they were the smaller background. If it was anything more than 20 people, I don't feel comfortable doing it. The last...
Speaker: background scene I did was more than 20 people. And that reminded me why I didn't want to do it, which again, I was playing a high schooler and I was in my thirties, my mid thirt, like doing, playing high schooler. And I was like, they think I'm a high schooler in my thirties. Maybe as an actress, I can get away with playing a college student.
Speaker: I mean, that's, that seems normal, doesn't it? That seems normal, you know? Yeah. I always think of Tom Wellen in Smallville. He was like 20 odd or something. like he started It was a freshman. He was ah playing a freshman and he was 25 years old. And to be truthfully honest, I do know some people who were look like that are freshmen that look like they were 25 years old. And me when I was a freshman, which is 14, 15, um, for the, for you guys to translate that.
Speaker: Um, I look like I was 10. ten So I don't know. i'd like I like, always thought, i always thought like, like as, as a child, I was like American teenagers look so old, but then I eventually realized they're all in their twenties. But now you're telling me that some American teenagers do look that old. And this is a, ah yes. it's yeah confusing It is confusing too. Cause like me, for example, I am in my thirties. And if I go back to America to do some background work and it's a high school thing, I think I'd still be cast as a teenager, which I think it's amazing for my, my confidence. Um, but it's like, cause I don't know how to describe it. Cause you have like some teenagers, like I told you, I, when I was, I was 16 driving a car and I could still like, like, I remember I went to a restaurant and they tried to offer me the kids menu. how wow I was just like, thank you. um but then there was like people who were like literally my age and they were like,
Speaker: able to like, if we they could have like, they were able to order a drink because they look like they were old enough to drink because in America you have to be 21. And even if you are 21, we still ID for liquor license reasons. And, but yeah, so when I was working on the walking dead, my boyfriend at the time, he was younger than me and he should have been ID, but he never got ID because he looked like he was like in his thirties. And every time we went out, I would instantly get ID'd and he would never get ID'd. And so there's that whole thing where there's people who look like they're older than they are. And yet they're younger, you know, like in Dan's um episode, he's talking about how he gets cast as a a dad type role because he looks older than he is, which Dan is a handsome young man. And he does look like, you know, um i wouldn't cast him as a dad. I would cast him as a daddy. No, I'm just joking.
Speaker: Hopefully that bails his confidence up. Yeah. If he ah if he listens. Are you sure he supports you? No, he does. He does. He's told me he's told me he listens to to some episodes.
Speaker: Yeah, no, but that's so funny. It's like, I mean, it's part of it just that we have like expectations of what people look like because of they're on camera. so Oh, yes. so we think we think Dan's older than he is because we see the most attractive 40-year-olds as main characters. So we think that they all look 10 years younger. Oh, hegs, yes. Because if you think of a very brilliant show called Beverly Hills 90210, that was very popular. My voice squeaked. That very popular in the 90s. Those actors were in their 20s and one of them was in their 30s playing, you know, and um that's literally what you associate. But then you watch this Canadian TV show called Degrassi, where they literally cast people that were the actual age of like they were playing their actual age. And it's such a contrast when you look at the actors of Degrassi compared to the actors of Beverly Hills. And you can be like, but they look like them. And so that's, but I'm okay with that the reason why Hollywood does that is because of child labor laws, because you have to think about if I cast this 16 year old to play the 16 year old, I have to make sure that they're in school, that um they can only work a certain amount of hours during the school year. They, I think they're only allowed to work eight hours on that 100th. during the summer that can work, I think, I can't, I don't remember, because I remember having to deal with it with the um Carl actor for The Walking Dead, because he was a kid um when the show started, and fun fact is that majority of the Carl actors, photo doubles, and stand-in were women.
Speaker: There were a few kids that also did it, but majority of them were women, because, and they were, like, you know, obviously, like, women that were, like, five feet, so if you are a woman, and you are really short, you can be a stand-in photo double for children actors because they have to adhere to child labour laws.
Speaker: I don't know how it is in the UK for child labour laws, but I'm pretty sure it might be the same. I think so. I mean, I only know vague stories from like Harry Potter where they say some similar things, but yeah, I imagine it's pretty similar.
Speaker: Yeah, so, but that's always been a blast to do. Yeah, I guess I feel like, I was going to say before you said that, it's the thing with animated characters as well, isn't it? They'll often get a woman to play a young, like a boy, child.
Speaker: Barth Simpson is played by a ah woman, Timmy Turner from Fairly Oddparents. Timmy Turner, Timmy Turner, I forgot. There are exceptions, like, Phineas and Ferb, Phineas was played, because Vincent...
Speaker: He started off, he was a kid when he first started. His voice, and if you watch like the first season of Phoenix and Ferb to like the newest season, you can hear the change. It's so subtle, though, that you don't really realize that, that is his voice changed, but it's still... i love Phoenix and Ferb, so it's one of my favorite cartoons. it one I think my um my sister was a lot younger than me, and she used to watch it, and you know when you're like, my sister's stuff's stupid, but then you kind of start getting getting quite into it actually.
Speaker: I mean, I was in my 20s watching it, so... I mean, I feel like I was probably 17, which is the age when when you say this stuff's stupid. I think in my 20s, I would have loved it. ah Same with a Adventure Time. They use the same voice actor through that, but it's not very common. And the reason why is because men' voices do um drop.
Speaker: Yeah, and that's ah that's the thing with our Adventure Time, isn't it? As time goes on, you hear his voice changing. But they also age him too, I think, in Adventure Time. so I love that they did that for Adventure Time. Yeah, no, I remember that always seemed like a like a cool way of going with it. um i think Actually, I was reading they're doing a new Adventure Time show and they've had to recast him because it's set earlier on. so I don't know. um I didn't finish it and I'm sad because I watch it when I'm playing video games. so Yeah, it feels like a very well-playing video game. like all of like I love ad Adventure Time, but I've never been able to find it anywhere properly to watch watch it all the way through. I can't tell you how I watch it, so... I feel like that is i feel like that is how most people watch it. I watch it legally. don't know. I watch it on HBO o Max.
Speaker: Oh, okay. Oh, okay. Okay. But I don't know if it's on HBO Max in the UK or not. It might be. I don't know. Maybe it is. Yeah, so I'll just end it there. Okay. I still watch my American shows. Okay, so before getting you ah before getting you arrested. I do legally, okay?
Speaker: I know, I know. I'm not doubting that. I'm not doubting that. So how long how long does this this go on for them with that extra stuff? Why did you did you did you move on by choice or did it just come to an end?
Speaker: I don't, I moved. Oh, okay. Right. That's like the, show like literally before, like the last project I worked on was the hate you give.
Speaker: Um, and that was an amazing thing. I enjoyed working with those people. Um, and then I moved to the UK and I did background work here. I've done three background work since I moved here. And I'd love to do more background because I love doing background. Even if I ever become like a famous person, which I don't want it, like my goal is not to be famous. My goal is just to get my work out there. But even if I become like on the level of like Brad Pitt, I still would probably do background work just for the heck of it. Cause it's fun to just hang out back there and get to know people and learn their stories of why. Cause I know that there's like this, there's this couple that quit their job
Speaker: bought a U-Haul, not a U-Haul, sorry, a um RV. And they literally, that's all they did was background work. Cause you get paid, you get fed and it's like 12 hours straight. And the pay is pretty decent. If you know, if you're doing it like religiously and you can retire off of that.
Speaker: um um mean, you can make a decent amount of money off of that. And they were the loveliest couple ever. And I think I ran into a couple here that did the same thing. Cause I did Smoggy Queens.
Speaker: um last which unfortunately i'm not seeing whatsoever in that episode either and that again it is what it is um it was a fun experience i mean you're right though it sounds like quite a nice life you get paid you get fed and you get to hang out on a bunch of cool shows and sometimes the actors would literally come and talk to you because i did um a project that had jamie fox and um the dude from star the black dude from star wars uh finn was his name John Boyega?
Speaker: Yes, that one. um They came out and talked to us. um It was freezing cold that day because it was in November and we were at a strip club or something like that. So we had to dress like strippers and we're half naked and we're freezing. And Jamie Foxx is like, why are these backgrounds?
Speaker: Like, can you get some heaters on these backgrounds? They're freezing. And he was like, they were so nice to us. And I did another thing with um Sir Anthony Hopkins and he would come to us and ask questions and say, do you guys want your picture taken? Which we're told that we're not allowed to ask to get our picture taken. We're told we're not allowed to talk to the actors. We're told we're not even allowed to look at them.
Speaker: They don't like just, you're here for this. And if they come to us, that's a different story. And I like, it's so cool. So I know that if I ever am on that level, I would literally probably do the same because it's a nice experience when an actor comes up to, he's like, Hey guys, how are you today? And he would sit with us at lunch and, you know, um same with on the duff. They would did that. And on the walking dead, um, a lot of them would sit with the crew and all that stuff. Um, I got to know a few of the actors, um,
Speaker: And I got invited to the baby shower of one of the actors. But unfortunately, it happened at the same time of my cousin's wedding. And my cousin got pissed. She's like, why didn't you go to the baby shower? I was like, it's your wedding.
Speaker: And was just like, I'm sorry. They could have named their child after you. know That actress is extremely successful. And um she's one of the nicest people I ever met.
Speaker: Like ah everybody on The Walking Dead was really nice from my experience. Wow. It sounds like a really cool experience. So then since moving over here, you've done some background work. You've been involved with the Forge. Yes. I guess I'm quite curious about, obviously it seems like quite a different experience to all these sort of large scale things, the Forges. Can you just talk a bit about how how, like the difference between the two sort of experiences? I will say this, that in America, I didn't want to be an actor. Like I had zero desire of being an actor. And then I took a voiceover acting class in America and I realized, oh, I do actually miss acting. So then When I knew I was moving to the UK, the first thing I did was type in adult acting classes and the Actors' Forge popped up. And so I signed up and instantly I've just been involved in the Forge. And when Dan said that, hey, you can do your own stuff and write your own stuff, I'm like, I can use my own writing. And so I've been using my own writing for a majority of the stuff that we've been doing. Um, and I've been just trying to figure out how to do things over here. Cause I don't know how to do anything over here. I mean, I didn't know how to do things over there either, but I just stumbled my way into things. And so hopefully I'm stumbling my way into things over here, like doing the two background things, three background things that I did is because of the forge told me, Hey, they're looking for background for this. And I'm like, Oh, cool. Or, um,
Speaker: I'm signed up for some background stuff, but I don't always get to do it because there's not a lot of stuff that's being filmed in the Northeast, which is unfortunate. Yeah, that's the the hard part. Because I come from Atlanta, where everything is being being filmed in Atlanta to Northeast where there's nothing. Yeah, that must be quite a big a big contrast.
Speaker: It is as much. and so I'm literally just trying to figure out how to do this as an actual actor, because as much as I love doing background, I'd actually like to be on the stage, like on the stage and on the and in front of the camera behind the camera or even front of it and I don't know how to do that and I'm still learning and Dan is doing a good job trying to help us do all of that stuff my goal as an actor is literally to be a supporting art like to be the supporting character because you know you have like the main actor like I'd like to be the best friends type character I don't want to star I want just to be the best friend and I think that's because that's what I did in background work is that I got like if I'm
Speaker: not seen enough, I get picked, I get called on more. So if I become that supporting best friend, they're calling me on more projects where I can be more available or something. But then again, I'd love to be in like a lead. Like I told my husband is like, how cool would it be if they let me be on Emberdale? Like, let me like have this random American come in there for some strange reason. and My goal is to be on Waterloo Road. I like that show.
Speaker: i it reminds me of Degrassi in some way. And I grew up watching Degrassi. So I want to be let me come on Waterloo Road as an English teacher, please. And let them make fun of me because it's like an American teaching English.
Speaker: It writes itself. Come on now. That feels achievable. I mean, it feels like you're also right in your episode of Waterloo Road as well. exactly ah I wanted to ask about, um so, you know, writing your own material for the Actors Forge. like that's i I mean, I've wrote one sketch that I've performed at at the Forge. And like how do you feel about, sort ah have you found it useful and so in terms of helping you refine something you've written, like having it performed? Hex, yeah. The fun thing is, is that when I act it, I can't actually see what's wrong with it. So that's the only negative is that I'm in it. like the scene that me and you did, um which is hilarious, is that I literally wrote that on the train coming back from an acting class.
Speaker: um TLC's Red District song played. And I was like, what's a funny scene that I can make? A wife trying to s seduce her uninterested husband. That is fun. And then you ended up agreeing to do the scene. And I'm just like, how can I break Ryan and make him break character? And you refused to break character. And that's what made it even more fun. is because I got outlandish because I was trying to break you and you were just this stone coast and stone faced and it worked perfectly well. I wish we did get to film it because I think it would have been hilarious and people would have loved it. And I did write a 10 minute scene for something and and I had it acted out and
Speaker: i I did a stage reading in front of you guys and I got to hear the feedback and what worked and what didn't work. And every time Dan lets me do any of my writing, he I always go to him and ask him what works and what doesn't work or ask other people what works and what doesn't work. And they would literally say, well, what didn't work was this or what did work was this. And that 10 minute scene, I made it 10 minutes. I didn't like it as a 10 minute scene. It's a three minute scene that I'm hoping that I can do for a showcase.
Speaker: But yeah, so I love it because I can hear the feedback live and in person because then I can hear the laughs. but If it's a comedy scene, I can hear the laughs that I can get that I'm is like, did I get the laugh that I wanted to to get? Yes. Oh, that got a laugh. I wasn't expecting that to get a laugh.
Speaker: Okay. um Especially because my scene partners literally rise up to the occasion. um For Saturday, me and Liam are doing a scene that I wrote. I don't know.
Speaker: um I was like, don't know if you saw it. well No, you didn't see it because you're not in that. It was in the Saturday. I performed it for a Saturday morning class, but now I'm in the advanced class. And I got so much laughs because it's so hippy, dippy, funny. When we performed it for the class, it was getting the laughs. And then some of them, I might change it so that I can still get the laughs, but I might keep it in and It's literally just based off of what I hear from it Because as an actor, I'm hearing that. But when you're filming it, though, it's completely different because you can't hear the laughs, even though you want to.
Speaker: And so now I have to literally, when I put it out there, rely on my friends and family on Instagram because I post um majority of my acting stuff on Instagram.
Speaker: And they're like, oh, yeah, that was hilarious. Oh, no. Like, my sister will literally tell me Nay, nay, that didn't work. No, that's not good. And I love that. That's always very useful, useful to have because you don't always trust your family because you're kind of like, well, they might tell me I'm doing I'm doing good, even even if I'm not. Oh, God, no, my twin sister would literally tell me. Like I sent her a clip that I did with somebody and my sister was like, this ain't it. You were looking at the lines. You didn't, you weren't connected. You were just not there. And I'm just like, okay, thank you. And my other friend, Jonathan would literally tell me the same thing. He's like, Ooh, I like that one. He's like, nah, that's not, not working. Like I told my friends, it's like, let's just be honest. If my stuff is crap, please tell me. And they will literally tell me that. It just feels very light. A true friend is someone who you can trust to give you constructive criticism. Yeah.
Speaker: And my husband definitely gives me constructive criticism. And I have to give a shout out to him because he helps me do a lot of the funny a lot of the funny lines comes from him. I'm going to give him credit for that. like um I have a line that says, the head is three bloody fucking bloody feet away from the fucking body line. And I didn't write that. My husband wrote that. um he write He literally, like every time I write something, he's the first person who reads it. And he's the first person who says,
Speaker: yeah, no, I don't like that. Or, okay, that could work if you just change it just like that. And so he's the first person who, and he's very supportive of all of this. And I deeply appreciate him because if I didn't have that, I would probably still working, living in America, working at at a customer service job, hating life. Yes, that's ah that sounds good then. That sounds good.
Speaker: ah Do you have any plans to write anything? Are you working on anything longer? Or are you ah you quite um happy with the shorter scenes that you've been doing? I have written a long movie. ah When I was at uni, we wrote a... I love this teacher because I thought it was a great idea. Because a lot of times in my creative writing classes, we were told to write short scene um short um short scenes, um short stories, etc.
Speaker: And those are fun to do, but I was always a novelist. Like I'd be writing novel scenes. So writing short scenes always were off for me. Now I can write short scenes like nothing. But for my screenwriting class, my teacher was like, for this whole um class, you're writing a whole screenplay and you'll have the class you'll be reading up, like sending out to your fellow classmates and they'll be reading it out. And I loved every second of it because for this one, what I wrote for that one, I still want to produce that and get that done because I think it's a story that needs to be told, is how they reacted to things. So I would write something down and they reacted. And they're like, ooh. And the fun thing about this one is that they hated my protagonist so much. And so that changed the ending. Because of how much they hated my protagonist, that affected how I wrote the ending. And so when they read the ending, they're like, yes, justice.
Speaker: And I was like, and it's so sad because I didn't know that my protagonist was going to be hated. And it's okay that my protagonist is going to be hated. And it sucks because the protagonist was based off the guy I was dating at the time because...
Speaker: and And made me take an evaluation. It's like, why did they hate my protagonist? And yeah, and then he read the ending and he hated the ending because he knew it was based off of him. And I'd love to get that film, but it is um an interracial couple, a black woman with a white guy and they go into a town that is majority black with white people that are in it. And it is a segregated town. And this couple coming in interferes with that type of segregation. And so it does some things and you got to learn the history of why it is, the to help how the town became as it is and things exploring all of that. And it's about racism. It's about power and a lot of things. And I would love to get that written and direct. Like I wouldn't star in that one. I don't want to, but I would love to have that. I would love to direct that one and get that filmed.
Speaker: And um I also wrote a short scene for someone that was in the Saturday morning class. um I wrote a scene for him specifically that I am trying to get that one filmed because I think it was a really cool scene and I want to get that. But one thing I have don't have is motivation. And I don't like I admire those who do things it like, oh, I want to start a podcast. I started a podcast. I would love to be like that and do it myself, but I don't know how to do that. So I literally just have a million different short stories or novels written and they're just literally in my
Speaker: on my laptop, not doing anything. And he's scared. You see, but this is, this is so funny though, because I'm listening to you and I'm like, damn, that's so motivated. I wish I could be motivated.
Speaker: i mean I've been, I've spent the last three months working on an audio drama. um that um um My plan is to eventually like hire out a recording studio for a day. I get a bunch of people to to record it with me. But I'm just like, I feel like my writing end process has taken such a long time and I wanted to be done with it like three months ago. ah And so I feel like it's kind of important to know that like, maybe we shouldn't look at other people and go, they're so motivated. Maybe we should just, just because honestly, I've been like like, man, I wish I could i wish i could write and and be as ah
Speaker: ah I don't know how to say it Like as, as open to constructive criticism as you are, cause I'm so scared of ever showing anyone anything. Cause I'm like, if someone says they don't like my protagonist, I'm going to go in a corner and have a meltdown.
Speaker: Sometimes you write protagonists that is not going to be liked. Sometimes you will have a, like I, now I've realized that it's sometimes I write novels where my narrator isn't ah like unreliable. Like it's going to be unliked. And I sometimes do it on purpose. And sometimes, Like it just happens because you can't help it. And it is what it is. And I love doing that as a writer. Um, but my thing is I do write the stuff and I do show it to people. My thing is how do I get it off of the showing it to filming it? Like I want to start my own podcast. I'm just too scared to do it. Cause I'm like, no one's going to want to listen to what I have to say. No one cares. Or same with my, like, I would love to put on 10 minute show, like, um, uh,
Speaker: I would love to put on one of the plays that I wrote and have it shown to people. Cause I wrote a play about two former best friends that get locked in the bathroom. How were they, why are they former best friends? And you would get to explore that.
Speaker: I wrote that and I would love to produce that and get that on its feet. But my fear is that no one's going to come out and see it. I'm going to buy this theater,
Speaker: And no one's going to come out to see it. So I don't do it because of the fear of that. And Dan keeps telling me, just do it. Like, and I'm like, I hear you, but I don't have the confidence to do that.
Speaker: um Yeah, like... I think it's quite a hard one because I'm like, i I kind of decided early on, like, I just can't do this podcast for, like, numbers. um And it were like, it's sort of like, what what am I getting out ah of doing this podcast, even if nobody listens to it? And for me, it's like as somebody who I struggle quite a bit to say in, like, the Forge sessions and stuff, I struggle quite a bit to get really into things with people. Yeah. But I'm like, this is this is like creating a format that gives me the opportunity to ask these things about about people. So like I feel like often the the way to do it is to not approach it as, are people going to come and see this? Or are people going to enjoy this? And sort of work out in yourself like what you're getting from putting in on a play or starting a podcast or recording something. What that's doing for you separately to whether anyone enjoys or even pays any attention to it. It's like find something you can get out of it.
Speaker: yourself. Does that make sense? Oh, it totally makes sense. And I love that you said that because it's giving me the more confidence that need. Because people tell me that I come off as very confident and I'm like, I have the lowest confidence of a person that you ever meet. I have very low self-esteem. I suffer from depression.
Speaker: I like people's like, you have such positive energy. And I'm just like, oh, yay, because I have to make sure that I show positivity because if someone out there is going through a depressive state, I don't want my negative energy to ruin that. And as a person who used to have the worst depression ever to some points of very bad mental health issues where I've actually been in a mental health facility, which is another story, um i wait my goal in life is to make sure that I just exude positive energy from now on because I don't want anyone ever to feel anything negative that I've ever done and and impacted them.
Speaker: so I just am trying to work on the confidence part. So I just write the stuff. I just need to now just do something with it. um I am writing a scene about my experience with my mental health struggles um that I might decide to put in the showcase. I might write a whole play for it and put it on or film it myself with my um iPhone SE and have my husband holding it and ask someone from the forge, hey, do you want to be in the scene for me? And we just put it on youtube or tiktok or whatever modern thing is popular i don't know what's popular anymore i'm a lame person who doesn't keep up with up-to-date stuff i don't know i don't know either i don't know either i mean the only social media i have is instagram and that is very private that i literally like have to know who you are it's add you um and even and i still might not even add you i'm desperate i'm desperate to delete instagram but need it i need it for the podcast
Speaker: So the only reason why i have Instagram is because people that I know and love and care about use Instagram. And sometimes that's the way that they communicate with me. And that's another way for them to stay up to date to what I'm doing with my life. Because a lot of the people that I used to talk to, they're like, wait, you moved to England?
Speaker: And I'm like, yeah. And they're like, what? And I'm like, yeah. and they're like, oh my God, that's amazing. Because no one believed when I told them I was going to do it. And I'm like, yeah, I'm moving to England. They're like, no, you're not. And I'm like,
Speaker: Yes, I am. And I did it. So and I don't regret moving because I don't regret anything in my life. And I love every second. And I will say that aside from two negative experiences, it's been the greatest experiences that I've had living in the Northeast.
Speaker: That's that's good to know. Not the negative experiences, obviously, but that's that's good to know. I mean, I've been here for almost two years in August. There'll be in August. There'll be two years that I've officially lived in England. And I've only had two negative experiences. So, and I thought it'd be a little bit worse than that, but everyone has been so nice, inclusive. And I love that. I just love that. And I love that Dan lets me be as weird as I can with my writing. For example, the scene that I got to do with you, let do the girl version of, um what is that show called that I just finished watching? ah
Speaker: With the four boys that are best friends and they're crude and rude. Are they Inbetweeners? The Inbetweeners. I feel like mine was like a, like, I love, and I love that show. i thought Inbetweeners was a fantastic show. I don't think it would do well in America. um They, I think, no, that's why. They tried to do an American Inbetweeners. It did not work out.
Speaker: And um he lets me write like Inbetweener type stuff and for female versions, because we females can be just as crude and disgusting as men. And we do talk about penises and dicks and Am I allowed to say that? I mean, if yeah. I mean, obviously I never talk about these things. ah But we definitely talk about that type stuff. So why shouldn't we like be all prim and prime and say, oh, yes, that man. No, we'd be like, ooh, he's sexy. I wonder if he, you know, so I love writing that type stuff. And Dan lets me do it. and
Speaker: He also lets me explore things that tackles racism because, again, I am a Black American and I do live in another country. And he lets me like write stuff that explores that type of stuff because racism is everywhere in this world. so And I know people don't want to talk about it, but it should be talked about.
Speaker: I think this is it. I think it totally should be talked about. And I think it's really, i think it's a really good way of, I don't know if I'm going to clumsily explain this, but something that I've always found really useful is like, like fiction helps me to understand other people's point of view.
Speaker: because the point of fiction is you're putting yourself in somebody else's shoes and i feel like that's always been something that's been that i've found really important in understanding as far as i do ah issues of racism and sexism and things is is watching a piece of fiction and part of watching or reading a piece of fiction is that you kind of become the main character to a certain extent. And so you're empathizing with somebody as if it's as if it's you. And as ah a black woman who is interracially, I'm married to a white guy.
Speaker: um It's something that it's in my writing a lot because that's pretty much all I know is dating outside of my race. I have dated people of my same race, but majority of my relationship. And my writing explores that and the tensions that I've gotten from people in my community, along with outside of my community who are like,
Speaker: wait, so you can't date like a black guy or why are you like, and people. And so it's fun to write about it and to even discuss it because the media would show you, especially in America, i will love to say this.
Speaker: I have lived like, I love watching the UK media because I love seeing a dark skin, black woman on the freaking with married to a white guy And that is just not like seen as weird in America. it, you have like a ah dark skinned black woman, they may or may not be with a white guy. And the majority times, if you see interracial, it's typically someone of a lighter complexion with a white person, um which does happen. it is common, but it's just, for some strange reason, America has their hangups on interracial dating. um
Speaker: And it's weird, but here in the UK, it's lovely to see um that someone of my complexion, it's so normalized and, I now feel like the things that I write won't be like a scandal anymore because it's like, well, that's what we do. We know that people date or that people have two dads or people have two moms or that people look are in a poly relationship or that there's a person who is a dude that is dating a dude, but then falls in love with the women that is so normalized now. But originally when I wrote some stuff like that, it was, but they're gay. So how are they dating a woman? And I'm just like, stop being so close-minded, you know? Um, but it is, and I love it. And it has been fun to explore all of that. And I don't know. And i love that because i love reading. I read tons, um, which is why I would love to do my own podcast about books and movies, um, which I'm just going to fucking do it and just find someone who could be my podcast host.
Speaker: Um, who likes movies more because I'm not a movie person. I'm a book person. I watch TV shows. I need someone who's a movie buff who can go into that. But anyway, um and I love reading like The Hunger Games is a prime example of my frustration with The Hunger Games is that like in the movie, I wish Katniss was of Native American because in the book she is more described with darker skin like she is a Native person.
Speaker: And it would have showed that different structure because in the book, she is described as looking like someone from the scene, which is a darker skin, and that her mother marries below her because of the husband that she chooses because her mother has fairer skin, blonde hair, blue eyes. And that's why Prynne has the brown blonde hair, blue eyes, and that how society would treat them. And I wish that the Hunger Games movie kind of followed that, but they didn't.
Speaker: It was still freaking brilliant and i still loved it It is an interesting example, though, because like i read I did read The Hunger Games after, I think it was after the first two films, and sometimes um sometimes I'm bad at reading descriptions. Ever since I was a child, I've always struggled with like taking descriptions in when I read. So you just go straight to the dialogue. but Well, no, don't go straight to the dialogue. I mean, specifically descriptions of people, but it means that when there's a film already out, like whatever it's however it's describing someone, like
Speaker: I'm like, oh, this is Jennifer Lawrence. ah So yes like it's it's just, I mean, I feel like everyone has their certain bits that they glaze over. And for me, it's always been description. It's going to be fun because if you read one of my novels, I literally am describing like how everyone looks. But I also have like my protagonist in this. She literally tells people, hey, I'm talking to you. This is the description part. If this bores you, I'm going to say this, and then you can start right here because this is where the action So I literally have written that for people like you.
Speaker: I mean, i do I still find it important to actually read that stuff. But, you know, I never realized that Harry Potter had blue eyes in the films and you were meant to have green eyes. Oh, God, yes. And that was the whole contention is because he's supposed to have eyes like his mother. The reason behind that is because they tried to do that, but the context that they put on Dan irritated him, so they couldn't do it. Yeah, I think I did know that, which, I mean, I guess he was 10 years old or something. I mean, you know, i but that probably is a big ask. I mean, i am, cause I love reading and I do watch things that some things are based off of. um
Speaker: I separate the mediums. Like I literally like don't look at them as the same thing because otherwise I wouldn't enjoy it. Cause everyone hates on the Percy Jackson movie. I think it was a fantastic movie.
Speaker: If it's, if you're comparing it to the book, it's a shit but ah movie if you're basing it off of that. But the movie was actually pretty dang good. I thought it was amazing. It's what made me read the books in the first place.
Speaker: um Because I'm hugely into the Percy Jackson book series. I've read every single one. I'm up to date. If you know anything about Percy Jackson, I don't know if you know anything about that. I saw the stage play last year. That is my experience of Percy Jackson. I love the stage play. It was so freaking fantastic. um But yeah, so people literally have that mindset that if it's a book based off of a movie, that has to be 100% accurate. And as a writer myself, I can see that argument. And there's sometimes where I'm like, literally like, yeah, I care that. if I'm going to like my, my I described my character as a dark skinned black woman, please cast a fucking dark skinned black woman. Yeah. um
Speaker: For specific reasons, because that's how my, like, that's literally what my protagonist talks about is that the society doesn't like her because she's dark skin and that that people like the world treats her differently because of that. So obviously it's important, but ah some of like the things that I've written, I don't really care if like they decide to change one of my actors. I did say that he was black in the thing and they decide, oh, we're going to change him to white.
Speaker: OK, I'm questioning why. But if the actor is 10 times better because of a different skin tone, then I'm OK with that because I would rather it be based off of talent than accuracy, I guess. Which as an actor, like I said, as a writer and actor, I think of that type of stuff because I refuse to go. like i will always go for roles that are outside of my type.
Speaker: I will go for roles that are meant for men. i will go for roles that are meant for white women. I will go for roles for anything because it's going to be funner for me. Because like I said, I am a woman who will say, like talk about, ooh, that lady has some nice tits on her. i will say lines like that. I have no issue doing that. um And so I think that sometimes as an actor, and we do need to go outside. And sometimes if a book says he was a gunslinging, ah misogynistic man. And then all a sudden you see this black woman with huge shit saying, ooh, I could still be a misogynistic ass gunslinging woman. Come on now. I think, though, there's there's an extent to which it's like, that' that's interesting, though, you know, if a character's intended as this sort of gunslinging
Speaker: Typical man. Like, it's actually quite interesting to have that that character played played differently. Like, where, I don't know, it's like, it's like that there's certain, say, female roles where it's like, you should change this woman to a man. Where that's just that just seems bad and wrong.
Speaker: No, because sometimes, like I said, like I love like writing men who are in touch with their inner fibbid side, if you will. Yeah. Who loves getting their nails painted, who will literally like, ooh, I just love, let's talk about the new episode of Love Island. Cause like, I know a lot of straight men who watch Love Island. Cause obviously they started cause their girlfriends started making them watch it and now they're obsessed with it. I'm always gonna pick up Love Island cause my best friend told me to watch it and now I'm watching the American version of it.
Speaker: Um, And so like writing men who was like, Oh, I just watched the think the latest episode of Gilmore Girls. And Oh my God, worry is insane for loving for choosing Jess over D type thing. And sometimes men do have those discussions where they're like watching the so-and-called female shows. And some, like if I wrote this character that looks like it's a female character, but what does it look like if a man does that? Ooh, that looks even more interesting. Oh, I love that. um a good, example I love saying is the show called Legion, which is, um, it was on a long time ago and Audrey Plaza, the character she plays in that was originally meant for a man and she auditioned for it, got it. And they didn't change the lines. They kept the lines the same. And she's saying all of these crude things about women. And it's so fucking fantastic watching. And I'm like, that's, she's my inspiration for that because if she can do it, I can definitely do that. I can say some
Speaker: stuff And same for men, that men can be like, ooh, I just got my nails painted, so I'm just going to not play a little bit of footy with you guys until my nails are dry. There's nothing wrong with that. I guess, yeah. When put like that, that ah they i guess I guess it's almost like a different thing, whereas it's like the the thing that seems wrong to me is to take a female character and to replace it with a male character,
Speaker: Because the male male's like a stronger character or or something like that, I guess. But but when you talk about it like that, that is, that is again, interesting. interesting it it's if it's It's how you do it. Yeah, like traits that are like typically associated with being feminine traits, amit a man portraying them. that is That is interesting. That is interesting and Like I said, the world is getting more and more like open to that type stuff where more men are like, I know a lot of straight men who love getting their nails done. And back when I was a teenager, you used to be caught a metrosexual for doing that because I knew men that were straight that liked it, but it was more feminine. So they thought they had to make a term for a metrosexual. Now it's just literally common that. a man will go to the salon with their, feet like, with their, one like, their partners and be like, okay, I want my nails to have alternating colors or I want to just, can you put a design on my head? There's nothing wrong with that. I love that. And as a person needs getting their nails done, it is what it is. I mean, i don't do nails, but i like a face mask. I like, I like a bath bomb, you know?
Speaker: Exactly. and I could easily write a scene where both of us are literally, like, what like watching some, like, watching Bridgerton with the face mask on and talking about how, like,
Speaker: how did How come she's not? she like Why is Anthony being so stupid? you know Right now, it would literally be seen as normal. If we wrote this like 20 years ago, i don't know if it would have been it would have been out there a little bit. Yeah, I forgot that metrosexual were a thing.
Speaker: ah like Like, man, you know, you know the world has its problems, but it's also come a long way example in some respects. and Yeah. um Okay, right. Well, I have kept you for more than an hour. I like to end just by asking ah just by asking about a film or TV show or book um that that you particularly like and would like to talk about for a minute.
Speaker: A book or TV? Can we talk about a video game? Yeah, video game. Mm-hmm. I am obsessed with this game called Blood on the Clock Tower. It's literally on my second screen right now. I'm seeing if anybody I love playing with is online right now. It is a social deduction game. It is, if you can think of traitors or werewolf or mafia, it's that plus 10 times where you actually get to do awesome things. It is freaking fantastic. I'm obsessed with it. I literally spent so much money to go to a con and so that I can play this in person with real life people because the put in Newcastle, they have a group, but I unfortunately can't make it to it. Are you looking it up right now? I am, yes.
Speaker: Love of the Clock Towers is a social seduction game where you are a townsfolk and your goal is to find that the demon. As a townsfolk, you get special roles like fortune teller. which tells you if someone is the demon or not the demon. But there is someone who could look like the demon even though they're not the demon. And even when you're dead, you still get to do things. You can still talk to people. Unlike Werewolf, when you're dead, you're dead.
Speaker: You're dead. So what is it? It's a board game. It is not. It's yes-ish, but online it's not. like You can actually play it online. um That's how I play is online. Um, and it, there's a board game, like it's not a board game necessary, but it has like characters that you draw out and it will tell you if you are a character, like there's three different types of characters. You can be the townsfolk, the minion or the demon.
Speaker: Um, and you draw it from a bag and it'll tell you which one you are. I suck as playing evil. Um, but I'm obsessed with it. Instead of learning my lines, instead of writing, I am playing blood on the clock tower.
Speaker: I'm obsessed with it. And I have made a nice community with people I love playing with. And if I can get more people to play it, I would invite people to my house from the forge and be like, Hey, let's play this game.
Speaker: um But I don't think anyone's willing to drive all the way down to where I live to play. You should make it happen. You should make it happen. full knowledgeable when the clock tower I want to have a games night so bad. Like I have a whole thing of games and it's just literally me and my husband. And we're just like, was like, No one's going to want to come all the way down here to have a games night with me, but I would love to have a games night. Like, I love playing games. I have video games up the butt. I have a PlayStation 5, an Xbox, a Switch.
Speaker: I have board games. I play computer games. I am not a gamer. But I like playing video games. and I mean, I don't know. I feel like it kind of sounds like you are a gamer.
Speaker: No, but like in my head, I think of people who play like Call of Duty or stuff like that. I am literally playing The Sims or I'm playing like Spider-Man or... ah They're the good games though. They're the good games. I've never played like I've never played quality. I don't even I'm scared of playing anything online. I only like to play single player games. No like this one Blood on the Clock Tower. It is actually very inclusive and very nice and the people that you play with and if you're brand new and never heard of this game people will teach you how to play. I'm one of those people who love showing people how to play this game. I love like playing and It is so fun. And I will put you in. i will let like, I will, Ryan, I will have you play with me and my friends.
Speaker: Okay. Okay. Make it happen. um Yes. But um I think that's probably all we've got time for. um Yeah. umm So I always end by just saying, can you tell people where they can find you? And if there's anything you'd like to plug? I don't know if anyone can find me. Because like I said, I like to be private with my life. So I will not plug myself on Instagram because that is for friends and family, unfortunately. Sorry, people, if you want to find me. Um, I mean, if you're on the Actors Forge, they usually repost the stuff that I post and then people from Actors Forge are typically always at or people I know. But, um, uh, I would like to plug, have nothing, um, aside from the fact that I'm going to, um, be doing a short, uh, filming for a short film soon and I just need crew, actors, um, and anyone who wants to help me do that, that would be awesome. Um,
Speaker: Other than that, I am just trying to get the confidence to do it. And that sounds like a good plug. When are you planning to film that? As soon as people want to tell me that they're available. Okay, okay, well.
Speaker: I don't work, and all I do is play video games all day. So I have the free time of the world until I can find a job. So I am open to whenever people are willing to help me. So I want to do this short film really badly. So if you have equipment and crew and all of that, please get to me. I would love the help. Okay. Get involved, people. Get involved. um Okay. Well, thank you ah for talking to me. I've really enjoyed this. And yes, I shall see later. See ya.
Speaker: What Makes You Tick is hosted, produced, and edited by me, Ryan Watson. Thank you to Adam Sams for the theme music and to Craig Pearson for the show logo. Thanks again to Len for speaking to me for this episode. The next episode of What Makes You Tick will be available on Wednesday, the 2nd of September.
Speaker: Thanks for listening.
