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Archie MacLaren – Part 2 – with Giles Wilcock
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In Part 2, Giles Wilcock and Tom Ford discuss various aspects of Archie MacLaren's personality and cricket career, including his style as a batsman, his relationship with professional cricketers, his attributes as a captain, and his association with Pelham Warner and C.B. Fry.
DONATE: You can buy Tom Ford a coffee! Every donation helps with production and inspires Tom to keep the podcast going. You can donate from a little as $5. Visit: buymeacoffee.com/GoldenAgeOfCricket
ABOUT GILES WILCOCK: From Yorkshire, Giles has been writing on and off for around 12 years now. He started the Old Ebor blog (now on Substack) seven years ago, but had written a few things before that too. He has written three books — a biography of George Macaulay, a history of the Original English Lady Cricketers and a non-cricket book about an 1832 murder — with a fourth in the works.
CREDITS: Presenter & Producer: Tom Ford
All music used in podcast comes from the University of California Santa Barbara’s remarkable collection of wax cylinder’s from the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries, which are free to download and use. You can donate to the upkeep of these recordings via their website.
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Transcript
00:00:01
Speaker
In the good old summertime.
Opening: McLaren's Batting Style and Reputation
00:00:08
Speaker
So let's actually talk about McLaren, the batsman. You've written an article, and which again, I would point my listeners to it's titled the excuses begin to run thin McLaren as batsman and captain. So how would you describe McLaren as a batsman? Was he attacking? Was he defensive? And do you think he complied simply with what an amateur batsman should be like? Well,
00:00:38
Speaker
His style was very much, this is how you are taught to bat in a public school. And it it was all about style. um The main shots that he was famous for were drives and a hook shot. And it's the one that Neville Cardus repeatedly talked about. He was always talking about it. Whenever he played a hook shot, he always compared it to McLaren. He said that he didn't hook the ball. He dismissed it from his presence.
00:01:05
Speaker
um which is quite a way to put it. yeah's ah It's a beautiful phrase, like so much of Cardus, but in terms of like building up McLaren perhaps better than he was, yes, it's quite ridiculous. And you can see, because there's quite a few photographs and that George Beldam took for the um Great Batsman book in 1905, and he took a lot of McLaren. You do get a sense, if you kind of line them up, you get a sense of,
00:01:35
Speaker
the way that he played and it's very extravagant sort of a drive with a massive follow through um yeah a modern cricketer might say we looked a bit stiff and to be honest there were people who wrote about him kind of while he was still playing that weren't convinced that he was this great stylist um he said he was a bit kind of cramped and always shoveling the ball on the leg side and stuff like that so it wasn't a unanimous opinion that he was this glorious gorgeous looking back batsman um but he he did attack that was his main his main approach um He could defend and he he could play a very different game if he had to do, but that wouldn't have been his kind of default way of playing.
Amateur Expectations vs. Professional Work
00:02:28
Speaker
I think as well, um not just McLaren, but all of the leading amateurs, they almost had to play in a certain way. um If he had played the way that professionals played, where he was cautious and he didn't take risks, he wouldn't have had the reputation that he had and he wouldn't have probably got as far as he could because he just didn't play like that.
00:02:53
Speaker
And it was almost the case that the amateurs like McLaren, like Jackson, their job was to go out there and look good. They were to play all the shots. They were to entertain the crowds while the professionals, it was their job to do the dirty work. So when it was a horrible pitch, they were the ones that had to stay there. They had to block. They other the ones that to score ones and twos.
00:03:12
Speaker
um And then the amateurs could come in get all the glory. But the the strange thing about McLaren, because he did have a reputation of being able to play on on bad wickets, but his his record doesn't quite back that up because he had an incredible record in Australia, um but not so much in England. And if you compare him to...
00:03:34
Speaker
other players, his average doesn't stand out. um There is an argument that and conditions at Old Trafford were always hard for batting, which which is true. But then you've got Johnny Tillsley in the same team who was a professional and his records much better than McLaren's. But obviously, although he's got a good reputation, he never had that the glory of McLaren because he was a professional.
00:03:59
Speaker
um And so I think hiss his reputation was doing a lot of work. But then at the same time, um people did rate him very highly. As I said earlier, Sidney Barnes said he was a very good batter.
00:04:11
Speaker
Sidney Barnes changed his mind quite a few times about who was the best he'd ever bowled to. But he did say at one point and that McLaren was one of the best he'd ever bowled to. But then you've got... the times when he was genuinely made a massive impression. So the most obvious one is the 424 against Somerset.
00:04:29
Speaker
um And that's what made him famous. And as you said, it's still a record for an English cricketer.
Inconsistencies in McLaren's Cricket Record
00:04:35
Speaker
But the Somerset attack was... I think calling it threadbare would be generous. There were there were people bowling who did not normally bowl and there was a 17-year-old that was a keeper of the attack. And it was ah it was a very, very weak side and it was a very small ground and very flat conditions.
00:04:55
Speaker
You've still got to score them, but it wasn't exactly a a difficult attack. And his other really famous innings was in 1903. um It was for the gentlemen against the players and he scored 168 not out. and His team had followed on and he and CB Fry scored a partnership of just over 300, I think it was.
00:05:23
Speaker
um and kind of saved the game. And if you look at that, not only was it very flat conditions, but Sidney Barnes was actually part of the player's attack and he'd gone off injured after bowling one over in the second innings. And when McLaren came in, and Fry and Ranji had already had a massive stand. So it's kind of like the the bowling was broken. And then he just came in and played these amazing shots. and But that's what got remembered. It was kind of supposed to be one of the greatest partnerships of the golden age, this...
00:05:52
Speaker
partnership between McLaren and Fry, but it was against a kind of decimated attack that had already been bowling all day. um I think as well that he liked, as a batter, he liked everything in his favour.
McLaren's Challenges with Modern Bowling Techniques
00:06:06
Speaker
um but The most obvious one is that he was, for some reason, he absolutely hated the googly. He thought it was unethical. He thought it was unfair. And he argued that it prevented batsmen from playing the shots. It was almost like, how can I play my amazing drives if I don't know which way the ball is going to turn? So he was always opposed to the googly. And he carried this on long after everybody else had said, yeah, it's ah it's a great thing is the googly.
00:06:35
Speaker
um Then there's another story. It's another Cardiff story. So how true it is is another question. But he was supposedly batting against Australia and the Australian captain, Joe Darling, had packed the leg side against him.
00:06:48
Speaker
And supposedly McCarran went to Darling and said, look, Why are you doing this? How can I play my famous hook shot when you've got all these fielders in the way? And Darling said, well, you can't tell me where to put my field.
00:07:00
Speaker
And then some McLaren just started hitting. Carlos doesn't really say, but I think the implication is he hits into the offside where there's all the space. And then Darling changed his mind and he he spreads the field. And then McLaren says to him, that's fine. Now we can get on with the game. It's like, no, you're not doing that. I have got to be able to play my shots.
00:07:19
Speaker
The other one that says a lot about him was in the 1905 Ashes, because in the first test, um England had struggled in the first innings against the fast bowler Tibby Cotter.
00:07:33
Speaker
And they'd managed to get a first innings lead, but every group all the English players were a little bit, this Cotter is a bit quick. And again, according to Cardus, so we have to take with pinch of salt, McLaren was seen walking up and down in the pavilion going, Cotter, how bloody Cotter him.
Memorable Matches: Aggression and Shifting Momentum
00:07:51
Speaker
just ive And the England captain, Jackson, put him into open with the explicit instruction of hit the bowlers off the length. And McLaren kind of went berserk for a couple of hours and he was just scoring really, really quickly. and He calmed down a bit afterwards and And it it made Darlingus completely on the defensive.
00:08:11
Speaker
um But then, during that... Warwick Armstrong to slow things down, he started bowling leg theory. So he was bowling his leg breaks outside leg stump and McLaren didn't like it at all. And he just he kicked them away. wouldn't have anything to do with them. And when he was at the other end, he was just kind of just leaning on his bat handle. I think someone said he was sitting on his bat handle.
00:08:33
Speaker
He was just absolutely disapproving. So it had to be just how he wanted it. um And if it wasn't, he could be a little bit grumpy. But I think the thing about McLaren and his reputation, that innings in 1905, he scored 140, but it was his only test century in England.
00:08:52
Speaker
He never made another one. He'd never made one before. So the reputation and the reality didn't really match up. Yeah, and he he seemed to have a particular love of the Sydney cricket ground, um both test and first-class matches he he played there, which, again, is interesting. It's not traditionally a batsman's pitch. um Thank you for that quite brilliant analysis. it's There's a lot to think about with his with his batting. um Your view of the Somerset bowlers from 1895 when he scored his quadruple century made me laugh because I'm sure –
00:09:31
Speaker
That analysis is not what Archie McLaren would have said of the bowlers. He probably would have said they were top class um and used it when he spoke about his famous 424 for many decades. and Back to the Beldum photographs, Giles, I'm glad you brought those up because...
00:09:51
Speaker
Of all the photos in the Beldham book from 1905, I actually really adore those of Archie McLaren. I feel like there's a great variety in the photos, but to your specific point about how you see him driving and and pulling, so many of those shots of him driving, you can ascertain how much of an attacking batsman he was because there's a slight blur and a curve of the bat which speaks to the you know stop photography that bildham was employing so these weren't just staged photos where they were holding the bat in position he was actually hitting a ball now it wasn't during a match but still
00:10:37
Speaker
these batsmen were attempting to recreate what they would have done. And with with McLaren, you can you get a sense of the force with which he's hitting the ball because of the curve of the bat, which to me is fascinating. And that's why I get a lot from the Beldham photographs of McLaren. You don't get that blur or curve with some of the more famous photos like of Trumper.
Tensions at Lord's and the MCC
00:11:04
Speaker
Let's return to his supposed chip on his shoulder um when it comes to his amateur status, ah basically because of his education and he doesn't quite have enough money when compared to the other amateurs that he's playing with and against.
00:11:21
Speaker
What was McLaren's relationship like with the MCC and the general cricket establishment? Did he acquiesce with the status quo or was he capable of ruffling a few feathers at Lord's?
00:11:38
Speaker
He was quite insecure around loads. He used to say that and he felt he would get six of the best if he used the wrong door.
00:11:49
Speaker
So he was always a little bit uncertain around it. um And I think what what he used to do, because he was aware that he couldn't live like a lot of the MCC members and the MCC committees, and he almost used to overcompensate and come across as really high-handed. And that didn't go down well at Lord's. The the main figure that he clashed with would have been Lord Hawk.
00:12:17
Speaker
And the the two never really saw eye to eye. And The two flashpoints came about um overseas tours. And in those days, um until 1903 or four, all tours by England cricketers to Australia were privately organised.
00:12:38
Speaker
And there was there was a growing movement that, well, actually, should be the MCC that's responsible for these. And when McLaren took a team out in ninety one or two he he did get a little bit of criticism, including from Hawke, saying that, well, no, it shouldn't be you taking these and teams out. It should be the MCC.
00:12:58
Speaker
And that's why on on his tour, he didn't have Wilfred Rhodes or George Hurst on the team because Lord Hawke effectively said, no, you're not going.
00:13:09
Speaker
um And then when the 1903 or four tour happened, the Melbourne Cricket Club had originally asked McLaren to bring out a team, but he couldn't get the players that he wanted. And so that's when they went to the MCC at Lawns saying, can you bring out a team? And the MCC very deliberately said,
00:13:33
Speaker
um went straight past McLaren and went to ask Pelham Warner, who was very much their yes man. and His face fitted perfectly. And so McLaren not really lost the captaincy because it didn't quite work like that, but he was very publicly snubbed by the MCC, which he didn't like.
00:13:55
Speaker
And that that slightly messy relationship with Lord Hawk, it meant that because Lord Hawk was quite often a selector um of the test team, it meant for a quite fraught relationship um and it caused quite a few problems over the years. But it wasn't just um with England that there was ah a bit of a tension when McLaren was at was still captain of Lancashire and they went to Lourdes to play Middlesex.
McLaren's Relationships and Team Dynamics
00:14:32
Speaker
And the first day, there was a little bit of play, but it was basically washed out. And they came back the next day to start again and the pitch was waterlogged. So the umpire said, right, that there won't be any play. The the crowd weren't very happy and they came onto the pitch to protest a little bit and then they all went away.
00:14:53
Speaker
um The MCC offered some, I think, like free passes to say, come back tomorrow. It's fine. We'll we'll make it up to you. And the third day came and McLaren refused to play. He made a statement to the press saying that the pitch had been deliberately torn up and um the wicket couldn't be put right. So I'm not playing under these conditions.
00:15:16
Speaker
Now, he got no right to do that. It was the umpires who made the call. um But they seem to have just kind of gone along with McLaren. He's probably berated them somewhere until they've agreed.
00:15:28
Speaker
And everybody was up in arms that the Middlesex people were furious. The MCC were furious. um Pelham Warner was very critical in the press. Surprise, surprise. But that just that says everything about his attitude to Lord. It was it's I am not going to be cowed by you. um I'm not going to take it.
00:15:52
Speaker
It's quite admirable, really. But again, we're thinking and viewing this from a century later. We've already discussed his quite interesting, unusual relationship with the other amateurs in which he played and associated. But what was his relationship that we know of with the professionals, especially as captain, like, did he, did he look down on them or was he quite agreeable? What do we know about McLaren's relationship with professional cricketers?
00:16:22
Speaker
To be honest, there's not an awful lot um that we do know because he never really spoke about them. And just because of the way that things were back then, none of the professionals really said much about him, not even in later years.
00:16:40
Speaker
The only one who did talk about him a little bit was Sidney Barnes. um For example, he said that because McLaren had kind of backed him to play for England, he felt when he was playing for Lancashire that he owed it to McLaren.
00:16:56
Speaker
um But the the two of them don't seem to have got on that well. um I think my favourite line, which probably was never said, um and it's one of those that no matter how hard you look, you can't actually find where it was originally said or who was claiming it happened. But the story is that when Barnes was in Australia with McLaren's team in one zero two At some point on the journey, it depends which version you read, they were caught in a rough sea and were all really kind of bit worried by it, feeling seasick. And McLaren supposedly said, at least if we go down, that bugger barns will go down with us. So they didn't get along that well.
00:17:41
Speaker
But in terms of the others, it it is hard to say. He wasn't... The worst. In fact, in in some ways, he seems to have been a little a little bit more accepting of professionals than most in that he would listen to their opinions um on the field. He wouldn't let them do what they wanted, but he would listen. um He would certainly have looked down on them.
00:18:02
Speaker
um he He wasn't that far ahead of his time. He would have looked down them as from my for social reasons. um But a lot of the professionals did respect him just because he was clearly very knowledgeable.
00:18:17
Speaker
And there's a few of the Lancashire players from the 1920s when he was coach for the second time. and And they spoke about him a little bit and they said he was brusque and he could be a bit aloof, like like everybody said.
00:18:34
Speaker
but that once he sort of relaxed a little bit, he was never jolly and friendly, but he was a bit more approachable. And all of them said about his tactical knowledge and also his his coaching ability to improve them. And he's not one of those and players that...
00:18:55
Speaker
There are stories about how badly he treated professionals or anything like that, that there might be few little hints. um The obvious one aim comes from Joe Darling, actually, in something he wrote about how he didn't like the way the amateurs, the amateur captains spoke to the professionals.
00:19:17
Speaker
But that's not definitely about McLaren and it's more likely to be about um Stanley Jackson, who he's got a few things to say about and the way that he treated his professionals. ah there's It's not really clear cut. There's not really um much evidence for either side of it, to be honest, just that he was respected and fairly respectful.
00:19:45
Speaker
that That Darling comment in particular I find quite insightful and also, as you say, just as telling as what you think he's saying about Stanley Jackson because Darling captained Ash's series against both of them so he was probably in a good position to make that call.
00:20:04
Speaker
Good friends.
00:20:25
Speaker
Giles, let's sort of sum up his captaincy overall. This is Archie McLaren we're speaking of, of course, because you've written extensively about him as a captain. And in particular, you did a deep dive into the 1902 Ashes series and sort of a re-evaluation of how he led the team. So in a nutshell, what sort of captain was McLaren, both as a tactician, but also as a leader of men?
00:20:55
Speaker
As a tactician, he was very good. um He was excellent at setting fields. he was He was one of those captains like um and Joe Darling and like Harry Trott, who had started to realise that a captain could really make a difference by...
00:21:14
Speaker
where they put the fielders. there There were only so many things you could do as a captain back then because you couldn't declare except in certain circumstances for most of the eighteen ninety s and Bowling changes, especially in England, I think it was slightly different in Australia, but in England, it was very much a case that you had your two main bowlers, whatever the team was, you put them on and they bowled until they dropped and change bowling wasn't really a thing. It was just giving them a bit of a rest.
00:21:45
Speaker
And for example, when McLaren was captain of of Lancashire, if you look at the at the bowling figures each season, like there were two bowlers that did all the work. It was Arthur Mould and Johnny Briggs. They just took all the wickets. It was put them on and just let them do the thing.
00:22:02
Speaker
But where he shone was in field placings. And there's there's quite a few examples, including in the 1902 Ashes, where he's kind of got a wicket just by placing a fielder in just the right place.
00:22:14
Speaker
Where he was less effective was um how he dealt with people. He was a bit too fond of just saying what he thought.
00:22:26
Speaker
If he thought that player wasn't very good, he would quite happily say, well, they're not very good. um He would even criticise the selectors in the press for the the players that they'd sent him. And think when you look at the players that you had,
00:22:44
Speaker
And you look at his results as captain. And then you look at another captain like Stanley Jackson or Pellum Warner, who had pretty much the same players and the results that they had against Australia. You start to ask, do the tactics make up for the fact that the players didn't really like playing for him? um But he he did do...
00:23:08
Speaker
some things that were ahead of his time. So, for example, he's like shuffling batting orders around. Now, the the kind of cricket establishment didn't like that. The thought of, oh, no, you don't do that. You leave the batting order as they are. But he was quite happy to to change things around. um He did start to, especially for the 1902 Ashes, he did start to shuffle bowlers around a lot more. It wasn't just put your best two bowls on. He changed the attack. He tried shake things up. um The problem was that when he was captain, it was all a bit joyless. It was a bit miserable. It was just, we've just got to win. That's all that matters.
00:23:47
Speaker
And he was quite autocratic. that It was what he thought, and that was all that mattered. He wouldn't always listen to advice. um And it's even if his plan wasn't working, he would stick to it, which caused some um slight problems. So he was he was a he was a good captain and a terrible manager, I think is the best way to describe him.
00:24:17
Speaker
And that's a perfect segue into the next question because I'd love to hear your thoughts um again about this 1903-04 conundrum over who was going to captain the MCC side to Australia. um There's a couple of lovely cartoons from this period where – Fry, Warner and McLaren are sort of lined up against a wall like school children and someone's trying to choose who's going to be the best. And I think the press had a field day. And what's interesting is that we actually have quotes or at least thoughts from both Warner and Fry, what they thought about McLaren as a captain. um
00:25:01
Speaker
Warner ah considered McLaren just too negative to be a good captain.
Criticisms and Contrasts with Contemporaries
00:25:06
Speaker
And Fry described him as, quote, iron and joyless. Under him, you entered every game bowed down with the Herculean labor of a cricket match against Australia. You went in a trance to your doom.
00:25:21
Speaker
It's ah pure hyperbole from Fry, but it's typical CB Fry. i mean, do you think these assessments are fair or does it speak more to this really difficult relationship between the three men?
00:25:38
Speaker
I think that it's mainly for the for those two in particular, it was a massive personality ca clash. um So for example, Fry, he wrote a lot about McLaren as captain and he wrote a huge amount about the 1902 Ashes. But my favourite thing about Fry is that the things he wrote about, he wasn't there for. yeah He's entirely made it up. Like he talks about the selection meeting for the fourth test. He wasn't there. He's talking about the advice he gave. He wasn't there. um And I think what he likes to do kind of...
00:26:18
Speaker
put the blame on to McLaren for the 1902 Ashes and kind of overlooked the fact that he was terrible in it and he got dropped. So I think there's a little bit of that going on there. And the other thing is that Fry and McLaren were temperamentally very different.
00:26:36
Speaker
And they were they were so different in the background and the way they thought about cricket and the way they thought about ah life in general that they were never going to agree on what you should be like as as an amateur captain. But the problem is that that Fry himself was...
00:26:55
Speaker
frankly, an appalling captain. So I think when he's criticising McLaren's captaincy, he's overlooking the fact that, yes, he won the Triangular Tournament in 1912, but in the circumstances, that wasn't a great achievement because he was like up against, for various reasons, two very weak teams. And some of the things that he did as captain over the years were just...
00:27:20
Speaker
bizarre. though They made no sense whatsoever. ah But even even Fry had to admit that McLaren was good because um I can't remember when he said it, but he said that when you played against a team led by McLaren, you felt like you were playing against a brain. that there was There was something that was leading. It wasn't just a random collection of players. There was an intelligence guiding everything that they did. um In terms of Warner,
00:27:46
Speaker
um they just, they were basically at war. They just did not like each other. um think Warner liked to make sure that everybody knew that he was a very successful captain and Warner's great talent was promoting Pelham Warner.
00:28:08
Speaker
And he he had a, he had a good record as captain. And that his style was very different. there was There was no kind of tactical vision which McLaren had with one. It was more a case of let the players do it. It's up to them. So, for example, when Warner became captain in 1903
00:28:34
Speaker
apart from upsetting a lot of Australian officials and just generally making himself unpopular, he tended to let his players just get on with it. So, for example, Wilford Rhodes would sort out his own fields. And when it was Bernard Bozenkett, when he won the fourth test, it was just a case of, o let's give the ball to him and see what happens. There was no there was no deep scheme behind it in the way there might be four players um McLaren, um I think for both of them as well, Fry was a strange man. I think he's the only way to describe him. And Warner was quite, quite chirpy, quite optimistic. And he liked to get on with it. He did get on very well with everybody. um
00:29:23
Speaker
He liked to make people happy. Whereas McLaren was more likely to say what he thought. He wouldn't dress it up. He was a pessimist. and He was always talking about his bad look and how terrible things were and how this team's awful. And so you've got that clash So I think when you're taking the view of what they thought of McLaren's captaincy, they're coming at the idea of what a captain should do, what a captain should be from a completely different direction.
00:29:55
Speaker
And i think McLaren, in some ways, was quite modern in outlook in that he saw the result as everything.
00:30:07
Speaker
And it kind of coincided with the time when test matches became huge. They'd always been quite big, but round about the turn of the century, they became massive. And all the players that played in them talked about the pressure of facing Australia and the pressure of the public expectations and the newspapers made a a big deal of everything.
Modern vs. Traditional Views in Cricket
00:30:26
Speaker
And And McLaren, even if he didn't succeed very much, he did tap into that idea that, no, it's it's about the result. It's about getting a win. These are huge matches. These are massively important. And Warner and Fry wouldn't have agreed with that. They were a bit more old-fashioned amateur. It's about how you play. It's about having fun.
00:30:47
Speaker
So it's just a completely different perspective. um And I think it was that it was that pessimism that affected how a lot of people thought about him. And I think you you could argue that for a captain, it's not a good look if you're always thinking the worst is going to happen. you're always cursing your look and you're cursing the selectors.
00:31:10
Speaker
But I don't think either of those two were in much of a position to criticise And it's interesting with that 1903-04 tour, which the MCC or England do win the series, captained by Pelham Warner, Plum Warner.
00:31:27
Speaker
Warner then ah writes, is it the book How We Won Back the Ashes, which... I think became a, you know, quite a famous cricket book, a bestseller, and probably just had that.
00:31:39
Speaker
He was holding that almost over McLaren and to an extent Fry. ah He would have had that nice feather in his cap. um And that book is still used by historians. I'm sure you know well, Giles Warner's memoirs from that very important tour.