Transcript
Alec: It's all content, every bit of it.
How To Enjoy: OK, so we're we're live.
Alec: Welcome.
How To Enjoy: We've been live for about five seconds now.
Alec: Oh, that's fun. Okay. Hey, everybody. Welcome all.
Alec: How's everyone's week been? Please let us know. That is a targeted question to specifically everybody, but also to you, Ali, how are you doing?
How To Enjoy: I'm doing well, getting over ah fun sickness.
Alec: Hmm.
How To Enjoy: Yeah that's the most of it.
Alec: My apologies, but it's fun. So I mean, I mean, does that mean it's been like video game, you know?
How To Enjoy: Oh that's dripping sarcasm.
Alec: Okay. I mean, I don't know. I had a really, really good time playing Paper Mario when I was like 100 degree fever one time when I was a kid. And somehow I managed to pleasantly remember that.
Alec: But you know what? We'll save that for some some other day. I mean, have you been playing, dude?
How To Enjoy: uh, I, uh, know, last week we talked about final fantasy 11.
Alec: right? It's kind of...
How To Enjoy: So I went ahead and picked it up again. And, uh, it was, it's been interesting.
Alec: You scoundrel! You started it?
How To Enjoy: Yeah. I mean, I have to, I have to figure out how it's all changed since, you know, at least as far as the interface and everything.
Alec: Dang, okay, okay. that's That's maybe more my problem than yours. That's yeah, that's OK.
Alec: I got to get on that. I'm getting on that. I apologize.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: I'm going to I'm going to hit. What is the land called? It's a origin 14. What is is a vanity deal called it?
How To Enjoy: than a deal.
Alec: OK. Look how good I am.
How To Enjoy: it's it's It's interesting. it's definitely You can tell that the play style has aged. Very much so.
Alec: It is a product of its time.
How To Enjoy: it's
Alec: Something I read constantly. Yeah.
How To Enjoy: My biggest complaint is that I haven't found a way to adjust the camera the way I want it to
Alec: Oh, yeah.
How To Enjoy: like turn
Alec: like, is there a dynamic way to do it? Like in 14, the cameras.
How To Enjoy: like turn kind of kind of I also don't like that you can't jump
Alec: Oh, it's it's amazing. You can make that game first person. You can go right up close and personal and whenever like talking to people in the cities or you can go like far away so you can make sure like you're actually playing the game and having some tactical awareness.
Alec: Yeah. But 11 doesn't have any of that. No.
Alec: I don't like that you can't circumvent Play Online, dude. Are you kidding me? Play Online was a service in 2000 that was meant to basically like get all of your money from strategy guides. was supposed to be your all -in -one portal to like strategy guide content digitally. It was actually kind of ahead of the time. They're trying to take it away from walkthroughs and capitalize on that. was gonna be your your online hub for FF11.
Alec: It was part of Square's Millennium event, and it still blows my mind to this day how much Square content got announced in one day.
Alec: I I don't know.
How To Enjoy: but but But think about you know play online kind of was ahead of its time.
Alec: It was, but now it's still here.
How To Enjoy: It was it was it was social media for gamers wouldn its with its five download files that you have to unzip.
Alec: It's still here.
Alec: It's taking me all day to install this game. Okay, I'm sorry. My VPN doesn't like it.
Alec: Yes, exactly.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: Yeah, it's okay.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: So right off the bat, we just want to say the the first test of do you want to play this game is not just like buying it, it's do you have all day to spend on your day off to just hit install to wait to to take away the internet connection from your episode of succession that you're watching with your fiance?
Alec: If you're me.
How To Enjoy: I mean, the day that I installed it, i I spent two hours just getting to where I could like kind of sign in.
Alec: Yeah, it's it's
Alec: Yeah.
Alec: The, so I've done all the updates.
How To Enjoy: And then the game had to do an update that took another hour and 15 minutes.
Alec: I've installed the the five zip files. I've opened it. I'm fiddling with by online, but it made me like connect my square subscription, which is kind of like this. It's a, it's a retroactive solution to make today's stuff fit with yesterday's nonsense.
Alec: And it blows my bonkers. How much?
How To Enjoy: You think you've done all the updates.
Alec: so
How To Enjoy: if you haven't If you haven't actually logged into the game yet, you have not done all the updates.
Alec: So, okay, okay. So you having said that on the other side of the line, how much time have you actually spent in Vanna Deal?
Alec: It's like 10 minutes just kicking the tires.
How To Enjoy: I've got three, four hours.
Alec: Oh, okay.
How To Enjoy: Not a lot.
Alec: Cool. Okay. Are you still, how, how is it traveling alone? I know that you still, so the way that I understand that they've made the game is you still need a party.
Alec: You still need to function non independently, but they have a lot of like NPCs to sort of mimic the feel of like an m MMO is retainer.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, I reached the, uh, I reached level five.
Alec: Is it retainers that they're called?
How To Enjoy: Yeah, something like that.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: I reached level five and they introduced it.
Alec: Retainer system.
How To Enjoy: And then I was like, okay.
Alec: I am so excited for some of the story beats and some of the story moments. Like, I don't know if you're one of those guys that's ladies all we don't know what all those guys, all the people. If you're someone out there who was just wondering what kind of psychos still fiddle around with play online and the year of our Lord 2024. It's, it's, it's us. And you know what?
Alec: I actually there's a kind of a weirdly big trend right now of like people revisiting like dead MMOs. I think there's like this really powerful mix of nostalgia, because MMOs don't really change. And they're just so incredibly big, they're ah There's no other way to describe it. they They're ginormous. They're unfathomable for at least the the time and in which their art was developed and their assets were rendered. MMOs are always going to be at the the biggest push of the hardware of the time. And you have people like revisiting in 2024, just making whole videos. I got to find this guy's channel, but I mean, there's a guy that's that's made his entire YouTube bagel off of just revisiting these these things.
How To Enjoy: Sorry, did you say bagel?
Alec: He's making his bagel, dude. What, do you just bagel, have a bagel tree over there? You gotta make bagels. You gotta make money for bagels, especially if you're me. bagel.
Alec: Yeah, but I mean, so like, like, ah okay,
How To Enjoy: But it's kind of an interesting thing when you think about it though because Uh, people complain about development cycles per games. Sometimes kingdom hearts three being famously long,
How To Enjoy: would point out that I played, I played, uh, I played final fantasy 11 in 2003, 2004.
Alec: Oh, it's no longer than all the rest.
How To Enjoy: Here it is. We're 20 years later and we've got 16.
Alec: Evergreen content, man, we we it's actually kind of interesting that like there's only been like five numerical entries to in one of them is another MMO. It's kind of a mini franchise within that franchise.
How To Enjoy: Yes, but ah I I would argue that 14 is a much better m MMO.
Alec: I don't think anybody in the world would take the other side of that argument no no question there it's but the here's here's the thing about our our show whatever the heck this this nonsense is what it's not always about being the best i think that that's something that we You know, I think I'm going to loosely quote Heidegger, but like he basically said that if you're always doing every single thing you can to maximize the potential of every single moment, you're never actually going to be living at all. And yeah, you you can pay, you know, that that you can do all the numerical summations and say, like, this gives me like X amount of endorphins per second. So this is the best game. But like, truthfully, man, a person you're at, you're missing the forest for the trees, like,
Alec: There's so much to appreciate in a dead m MMO like FF11 from you know the the characters and the just it just like the experience, man. Just chilling out with your MMO homies. you know there's There's assets and music to be heard. There's Hironobu Sakaguchi's soundtrack. There's their version of what a 2000s conception of what the future of gaming was going to be. This was the imagination of some of the biggest people working in Japan, all trying to make the most groundbreaking game of all time. And they really did it for a little bit. I i know several people that had their lives ruined by the excellence of Final Fantasy 11.
Alec: My boss at Game Over, I'm not gonna say his name, but he he had to seek medical attention. A family member of mine has had to seek medical attention. In fact, maybe the entire reason I justify my hobby is because I had so many people in my circle lose it to to just, you know, the the the addictive cycle that is m MMOs. But gosh darn it, if they aren't where some of the best most profound, most bold, like, execution of art and technology exists, then like, I don't know what is.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, I've known a few people who have similar similar stories.
Alec: Oh, I bet
Alec: Mm hmm.
How To Enjoy: One of my friends, a lot out, will not touch an MMO.
Alec: Great people, awesome people. Absolutely.
How To Enjoy: 100 % because of the way it monopolized her life.
Alec: I completely understand.
How To Enjoy: To the point that she was like writing guides for raids, for World of Warcraft raids.
Alec: it's
Alec: Jeez. So she was, uh, how many years of her life do you think that, that took up before like, was it during the good world of Warcraft years?
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: At least.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: Okay. And there's at least that was pretty great time.
How To Enjoy: I'm not real. I'm not real sure. We reconnected a couple of years ago. And I was like, hey, you should play Final Fantasy 14 with me. And she was like, no.
Alec: looked at you like you're coming at her with a plague blanket. Oh my god, yeah.
How To Enjoy: Yes.
Alec: Nice. To some people it is, you know, that one of the people that I mentioned is now a sommelier making six figures. he he had, it's not it's not the fault of video games is is one thing to also remember for being awesome and being amazing.
Alec: I think I think the the player needs to always never forget that there's the choices that the games gives you and there's the choices you give yourself, like making sure to stay hydrated, stay, stay hygiened, you know, bathe and take care of yourself. Video games stop being awesome when they come at the cost of those things like, you know, any other amazing hobby could. But I i think there is like any good thing about potential for abuse, but
Alec: I don't know if this is worth saying, but it's a pretty remarkable thing in overall, in the grand scheme of things, relatively victimless.
Alec: like like I know people that can recover from video game addiction far better than they can, addiction's addiction. I do not need to be explained this.
How To Enjoy: Yes.
Alec: but it does not have the adverse dangerous effects of say, like shooting heroin or, you know, uh, eating there, there's all sorts of things that you could trivialize and I'm not here to do that. I think, I think it just comes up when, when you talk MMOs, at least with me, I mean, I was raised in a very, very anti video games, anti MMO.
Alec: kind of household like video games were never restricted from me but they were they are there was always this air of chastisement there was always this air of like this is not a productive way to spend your time there was it was an idiot box maybe I'm showing my years here but
How To Enjoy: Well,
How To Enjoy: well maybe we should just add a disclaimer here and say, we love our video games. We love our nerd culture stuff.
How To Enjoy: Please make sure that you're taking breaks from that to take care of yourself and your your your life.
Alec: Absolutely.
How To Enjoy: And if you're a convention goer speaking as a convention goer, please remember to take a bath between days.
Alec: Please remember, there's nothing wrong with having a stick of deodorant in the car. No one's ever lost their rent money because they had an extra stick of deodorant. You will definitely encourage your chances of social opportunities opening up. That's a promise. We we need deodorant sponsorship.
Alec: Deodorant companies hit us up.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, I could go for that.
Alec: That's that's I'm comfortable with. I don't want anything to be played against me in any bad points, but a good reputable grassroots, non unethical, only cool people owned deodorant company hit us up and give us a lot of money.
How To Enjoy: eight
Alec: Thank you.
How To Enjoy: So, but you know, we're talking about we're talking about Final Fantasy.
Alec: Yes, we are.
How To Enjoy: And, you know, we we reconnected really because of Final Fantasy 14.
Alec: I honestly don't think of it.
How To Enjoy: But.
Alec: Like, like we definitely did. You're so right. But yeah, you're right, man. We really did. It definitely brought us closer as friends, like as life people, you know, spirits.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: Yeah, man. Give so much time.
Alec: I would. Yeah, he would just be running in circles around me just like talking and catching up and getting prototype for this podcast together and all these things.
How To Enjoy: ha
How To Enjoy: Yeah, but I mean, the reason I messaged you in the first place when I messaged you is because I saw you were playing the game that I play and I was just like, hey, I could play that with you.
Alec: Yeah, just just one kid to another is being like, hey, you got a nice ball, you want to play ball? mr You know, it's the human beauty of socializing and just, you know, and that that is the thing.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: It's it's such a good place to just chill out. You know, I love Halo so much, if you had told me that Halo, like I could just chill out in a Halo, like a world made by Halo people, ah ah and then give me destiny, I would have lost my mind with those sky boxes.
Alec: But I lived in such an anti -MMO household, like, but I would change if I could.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: But, sorry, we were talking about Final Fantasy, yes.
How To Enjoy: Well, and I mean, you know, when we talked about Final Fantasy, we're talking about Final Fantasy 14 and Final Fantasy 11 and how there's 20 years between, you know, 11 and 16. But there's how many games in that franchise as a whole now, not just mainline.
Alec: it's It's something I think about all the time if I'm if i'm being real. like so i will you know We run this show and we take our video game opinion seriously. I think maybe we're a bit intense with our scrutiny of the medium, but we love to to just soak it up. you know and us i'll I'll play all these games that my like coworkers aren't playing and I'll talk to them about it.
Alec: and they're Like I know people play these games, you know, I know people are playing things other than Fortnite and, you know, like Grand Theft Auto. But it's a I really don't know what the future of something like Final Fantasy is going to be.
Alec: You know, it's it's my film professor once told me like you can track the the air of Hollywood and what it desires out of their films by like the Rocky franchise. You can see the first one is this pulpy gritty intense film. The second one is kind of like an eight early 80s like kind of cash grab of a sequel where it's pretty safe. It's just sort of the inverse of the plot of the first one.
Alec: with maybe, you know, an additional side character, you know, making the main character learn something new. Three, kind of a further classification of the 80s of, you know,
Alec: whatever for we don't we don't got to say much about that the bigger the better the baddest of the 80s the late 80s the eighty Terminator films you know the last action hero the the Schwarzenegger you know relentlessness that was going on and then you have the or a horrible 90s one that was so telling of where the film and then the the Rocky Balboa reboot to kick off all the other reboots I go into that so specifically because I think you can say the exact same thing about Final Fantasy.
Alec: It had such a clumsy sequel on the n NES with Final Fantasy 2. It had such a groundbreaking original title. It had a coming back to form with the third.
Alec: It had an incredibly, you know. It's it's tough to pin down the identity of something like Final Fantasy. You know, it's it's a franchise, yes.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: But what is a franchise, you know?
How To Enjoy: and It's actually like with Final Fantasy is kind of interesting because you can almost like categorize them into into sub series, right?
How To Enjoy: You've got that's not even that's not even that's not even the the easiest.
Alec: Absolutely. I mean, 2D3D Air is the easiest categorization right off the bat, but like let's let's dig deeper. Let's dig deeper.
How To Enjoy: It's like you have the the n NES one to And then but those are very rudimentary games.
Alec: You have all the way up to four. on the even there's a four There was a prototype that got released, it's now in the hands of preservationists, but there's a a leaked in NES prototype for Final Fantasy IV. I think it just shows the opening.
How To Enjoy: You mentioned two, and yes, it's it's it's a thing.
Alec: Three has this really hardcore, it has a couple hardcore scenes, but it's i've I've played all of one, I've played all of three, I've played some of two. Two is certainly dark.
How To Enjoy: well
Alec: it's It's certainly a a content shift. Like there's specific characters and specific, protect know, people with actual, you know, descriptions, I guess, not easy even exactly characterizations, but the the beginnings of some something, someone like Cecil was in the prototype grounds with someone like theory on and Final Fantasy two.
How To Enjoy: Right, but, and and you kind of you kind of get the, ah what i what I was going with is the, you know, those those n NES games, those are the the laying the groundwork for what was to come later.
Alec: Isn't he's in the larva stage.
How To Enjoy: Then you have four through six, which is really building on this idea of the the rich narrative in in really spectacular ways.
Alec: Mm hmm. Well, well.
How To Enjoy: Well, there's, I mean, there's good narrative in the others, but
Alec: Five is is a pretty narrative list. It absolutely has a narrative. It has actions. It has consequences. It has something to say, I guess, about environmentalism. But I think I think four.
Alec: I mean, three is the sequel. Five is equal to three. Like six is a sequel for. But i you're not wrong. I hear what you're saying. But like they're always kind of narrative focused, aren't they? Like.
How To Enjoy: to a certain degree, but I think that's when they really like those three games are when they really kind of found what was going to work.
Alec: Four plays and I played it said I played it in the this year. I'm very caught up and and familiar with four. Four plays like a soap opera in like a really awesome way. It's like what if soap operas were just really, really cool and you can just chill out a little bit, go to the moon, have a couple of like really like the opening of Final Fantasy four is is an absolute triumph. ah it's It's one of the best vertical slices I've ever seen. It is so good. I sat my fiance down with it in my room, gave her the PS Vita, which had the PSP copy of Final Fantasy IV complete edition. And I just let her check it out and the opening blew her mind. Let me tell you like it's
Alec: that you can absolutely tell it it loses its steam pretty quickly. Unfortunately, it does not become bad. But I'd say after the the picking up of your third party member, it kind of settles down.
Alec: But I don't know if you did this on purpose or if you realize it, but we kind of just categorize them based on systems just now. And I want to make sure we don't do that, or at least we acknowledge that potential.
How To Enjoy: Well, we're we're But there that there's something to say because you know you have to talk about what the what the system capabilities are.
Alec: But that There is something to say about that.
Alec: You accidentally make a profound point. like that It is what the system could could allow. you know
How To Enjoy: But they did lay the groundwork for telling these these huge, huge stories in in those three games, especially when you talk about Final Fantasy VI, which we've talked about before.
How To Enjoy: So then you go into the next set, which really goes up until, I would argue, Final Fantasy XII.
Alec: Most that's me.
How To Enjoy: which is that kind of a golden age for the for the franchise.
Alec: Oh.
How To Enjoy: And this is when everybody talks about, when they talk about these games, yeah, they mentioned six, but it's those games that they talk about.
Alec: So what we have here is our first split in opinion between you and me, my friend, because here's the thing.
How To Enjoy: yeah
Alec: We're we're people, we're people, we're tribal, we're we like teams and we are all team Final Fantasy. Most people don't know this. I say this as someone who I think Final Fantasy 10 is my favorite.
Alec: 10 is not directed by Hironobu Sakaguchi. Hironobu Sakaguchi faced a lot of scrutiny within his company at Square for the failure of the Final Fantasy Spirits within movie. Because of this, they did it at practice in Japan. I don't know the name of it, but he was paid a salary, put in a room and told to never be creative again. He was neutered essentially. And the only way he could break out was if he did, he he broke away from the
Alec: the the teat of capitalism and he started it of their version of it and he he broke he got his own company he says okay i'm gonna be the boss if you guys don't want me to follow so some of the best like you categorized non -sakaguchi games with sakaguchi games and i think that that is something at least important to mention too i think it's an important thing to bring up just in in general because Hironobu Sakaguchi made two of the best games that I've ever played in my entire life. He made Lost Odyssey, which made such a profound impact. It's my game of the year 2023, for sure. It's at least when I played it. But that game changed a lot of how I view everything in my life. And it's it was a game I was playing when I first started seeing my fiance, and it was
Alec: so immediate to her that she understood the gravity, the importance, the the maturity in tone, the depth of characters. And I had so much to say about each thing that was happening because it's here in Nobu Sakaguchi game. He did exactly what he wanted. He got some of the best music I've ever heard out of Nobuo Uematsu.
Alec: And it just ah the boss, the the final theme to the lost the lost Odyssey and Blue Dragon are both some of the greatest things I've ever heard. I played them for my metal loving exes. I played them for my, you know, orchestra loving friends. it It's I don't know. It's something you can put on in like any environment and everyone's going to be down with it. But.
Alec: What I'm trying to say is that Final Fantasy, if it's a brand, if it's only following and based on who has the legal name of Final Fantasy, then I mean, we're just going to be like Metal Gear fans and we're going to have to deal with Metal Gear Survive being pimped out by Konami.
Alec: But I guess the difference is Final Fantasy 10 is much better in all of the subsequent Final Fantasies are much, much, much better than, you know, Metal Gear Survive.
Alec: But just to put as an example, I think it's important
How To Enjoy: Incidentally, they're all better than the spirits within as well.
Alec: Incidentally, that is true is a very good incidental. But like, I think it's important that franchises are not who makes games. People make games, people with ideas to communicate with but that are laying the groundwork for a conversation that they have invisibly across time and space with the player.
Alec: And I think we just got to remember that.
How To Enjoy: Well, and, and that's something there's, that's something to take into consideration, especially when, uh, whenever we get into the conversation about spiritual successors and, that's, that's a really important topic.
Alec: Yes. Goodness gracious, because Blue Dragon, yes.
How To Enjoy: But when we're talking about, yeah, but when we're just talking about, you know, a franchise, a line of games, final fantasy 12 was kind of the end of the, uh, you know, the honeymoon phase for the American audience with final fantasy.
Alec: Can we can we call a spade a spade and just say that everybody's favorite final fantasy is always going to is the newest final fantasy is always the most hated final fantasy.
Alec: like I guarantee you whatever 17 ends up being people are gonna be like, you know, 16 is actually pretty cool. That's what people have been saying since literally FF 12, I think is when sorry, sorry, sorry. I think FF 12 is the biggest case of it, because 12 is an excellent video game.
Alec: The gamma system works. It doesn't progress amazingly in the first version of the game. The Zodiac edition of that game is phenomenal. But growing up, that was uncool. I remember my brother sitting me down and like turning on. I was like, FF10 is so amazing. It's so good. I just beat it. Like I want to play another PS2 Final Fantasy RPG. Give me 12 because I couldn't play 11 because that was that was the devil stuff. And I always couldn't afford the monthly subscriptions is my excuse.
Alec: But 12 is so I can't tell you how how how frowned upon 12 was at the time. That is something to to note about the like 2000s to 2010s zeitgeist. And then 13 came out rivaling Lost Odyssey and everybody got a PlayStation 3 so they could play 13.
How To Enjoy: Well, so so here's here's another thing that I i think you accidentally stumbled on.
Alec: And then 14 is a whole story into itself.
How To Enjoy: Video game franchises and the fandoms around them are kind of like the Star Wars fan community.
Alec: Oh.
How To Enjoy: Whatever is the most recent thing is inevitably the thing that everybody hates because it's not like what came before.
Alec: That.
How To Enjoy: Final Fantasy 16 is a is a good game.
Alec: Yup.
How To Enjoy: Final Fantasy 15. is not even though they kind of both do the same thing but 13 13 is really not it is really not a great game so so here's the thing it it is a lot of art a lot of yes and that's my biggest problem with 13 is the
Alec: Is. but I think I think 15 is actually pretty cool, man. I think it's pretty cool. That's just one man.
Alec: I love 13. It's, it's a great, it's a, here's Tim Rogers says it pretty well. It's a lot of art, loosely connected with a lot, with a flimsy narrative, but the pulse lacy and the foul C in the, yeah, it's it's got clumsy
How To Enjoy: narrative.
How To Enjoy: um ah here's thing. And this is what you'll notice happened after 12. And 12 is the first one that kind of started doing it. But it really just became more and more for each one after that. And that is it transitioned from a turn -based, I don't want to say traditional RPG style.
Alec: it It invented traditional, but you know what I mean?
How To Enjoy: to, yeah, but it it transitioned from a more traditional style to a more action style.
Alec: Like Dragon Quest did, but like sort of did.
How To Enjoy: So the the fandom around the franchise that it always stood there and enjoyed this particular type of game is like, no, we don't like this.
How To Enjoy: We've changed too much.
Alec: Are you saying like the kingdom heartsification of Final Fantasy, the action RPG, Tetsuya Nomura years?
How To Enjoy: Every,
How To Enjoy: yeah. but
Alec: Yeah, so that's Tetsuya Nomura, another instance of people making games.
How To Enjoy: But that right. But when you look at other longtime franchises like, you know, Mega Man, Mario, Sonic, there's a lot of examples there.
Alec: Yes.
How To Enjoy: Legend of Zelda, even Resident Evil. We've we've talked about this. ah ah Assassin's Creed, these these franchises that have been around for so long, they can be great until they're not.
Alec: They, they, that's, that's the exact, thats that's it.
How To Enjoy: And then they get great again.
Alec: That's it. That's literally it. That is the, I've, I've spent so many years thinking about like, like brand identity and brand confidence and, and like, what is it mascot, you know, and, and all these deep questions about like, like what the, what the heck are we doing here with these names?
Alec: You know, why do we follow these names? Why don't we, why don't they put, you know, directed by X on the front, like did they do with movies? You know, why don't they, Do that with game designers. Why do I have to go to Moby games like a like a flimsy hacker in a weird Mr. Robot deleted scene, you know, like I should know exactly who's making my game. First off, but that's a different point. The point I think you're making is like.
Alec: when like what happens to these things when they have to do they have these these franchises with video games have a very interesting relationship with technology for instance how many franchises lost all of their steam when they hit the third dimension earthworm jim became an instant joke prince of persia became an instant joke sonic Get the heck out of here, Sonic. Mario's in town, okay? And yes, some of these things would stumble. Some of these things would just knock it out of the park. Mario absolutely laid the foundation. and Mario was so good.
Alec: I didn't care about PlayStation for like the first six years of my life. Didn't even care. Dreamcast died and I didn't even blink because Mario was that good. Okay. i didn' I'm just telling you, I didn't have to look elsewhere for my meals. Okay. Mario kept me warm, fed. It was the it was a hearth of pleasantries.
Alec: But and think about Mario, like Mario is this umbrella of brand confidence. It's almost a promise. It's almost like we can guarantee you when you buy a Mario game, you are getting this phenomenal, phenomenal, exquisitely crafted, carefully presented, safe brand of, you know, comfort of of whatever, you know? Like Resident Evil had maybe one of the most
Alec: interesting reboots and, uh, you know, identity. It had the most interesting teen years. Is that fair to say? It had some angsty teen years when it went down the five and six rabbit hole, a little bit, you know, it, it, something we've talked about privately is those games are so bad to you.
How To Enjoy: Oh.
Alec: You actually kind of criticized with all due respect, the resident evil reboots. And I was like, dude, those are like entirely different, like, games like they're the totally different engine because you didn't know how good seven was and how good therefore the reboot of two and three were and to you it seemed like a very lame attempt if I may whereas that because that does happen people see those clumsy flimsy attempts and they're just like yeah right I don't care you know Cool Dead Rising's got a new remake whatever you know let's
How To Enjoy: Well, five and six were in my opinion so bad that I didn't want to play any more games in the franchise.
Alec: yeah I understand. I really, really pushed myself to finish six. It has a pretty cool ending, I guess. No, it doesn't. I wish it was better.
How To Enjoy: But that that brings us to, like I mean, since we're talking about Resident Evil, then, you know, obviously we can talk about Capcom here.
How To Enjoy: And we can talk about Mega Man. It's the same thing when it went into 3D.
Alec: Oh, goodness, yes.
How To Enjoy: I mean, Mega Man Legends was good, but you want to talk about the 3D Mega Man X games.
Alec: I love i actually really.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: Capcom has a history of learning the wrong lessons from this from the success of previous games.
Alec: Yeah, Capcom definitely particularly fumbled the 2010s. They fumbled the late 90s. They they they they understand how to milk a franchise, I think.
Alec: I think they were very bold and innovative in the early days. We had so many charming
How To Enjoy: Capcom Milks franchises? What? Never heard that before.
Alec: Capcom used to come out with so many IP was frickin ridiculous. They were pitting like corporations against each other. SNK versus Capcom didn't just happen like that. Capcom versus x like all of those incredible fighting game combinations that came out of the fever dream of a 90s Dorito eating, you know,
Alec: me basically but like you know it's I don't know what happened to their gumption where did their gumption go they used to make cannon spike you know they used to make haunting grounds you know they used to make they used to make like cool stuff they used to make oni mo well i guess they're making onimusha again but
How To Enjoy: Yeah, but it isn't going to be good.
Alec: Took him too long.
How To Enjoy: and
Alec: Also, they made one of the best like teams of all time only to shut it down after three games that were not and c incredible, like Delivers.
Alec: Thanks IGN for your review of God Hand. It's done a lot for the revival of God Hand. But yeah, Clover Studios. And then like now now we've reached a point where if we're reviving the whole dang studio, what in the heck is going on, man?
Alec: like So so ah let's think about that.
How To Enjoy: Well,
Alec: If we if I may, can I position this like a certain way? like They brought back Clover Studios.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, go for it.
Alec: They brought back Hideki Kamiya. I think Koji Garashi's still gone. but What is a franchise? Is it the people? Is it the fandom? I mean, you'll get the sonic movies and all those sonic fans are so, so happy meeting one of them like to see they're like what is such a a a ah silly, but let's be real, a rich history of potential places to take their film franchise with no limitations in sight. Those films are fun and exciting. They're sincere enough to the source material. There's a bunch of, you know, Leonardo DiCaprio grabbing
Alec: His imaginary friend pointing at the TV screen moments, you know, there's there's all those and we're also seeing that at a time when like it's it's maybe it's a deliverance on the promise because What happens with something like Assassin's Creed where it's like an an an over deliverance.
Alec: There's just too much Assassin's Creed. It's too saturated with you with mediocrity
How To Enjoy: Well, Assassin's Creed has the same issue as, we'll say, Call of Duty.
Alec: But it
How To Enjoy: Assassin's Creed didn't need to be an annual franchise.
Alec: really didn't know.
How To Enjoy: Assassin's Creed didn't need to be an annual franchise, and because of that, it got watered down to the point that they, I mean, it's it was a soft reboot by doing Origins, but then they leaned too heavily into the RPG elements,
Alec: Especially when they.
Alec: Yes.
How To Enjoy: especially when you look at Valhalla and well and I mean it lost it lost its Assassin's Creed feel it was you were playing a Viking game that just happened to be called Assassin's Creed and the ties to the the overarching world just felt tenuous at best and Assassin's Creed Mirage was a
Alec: You know what stinks is all of the ones I want to play the most I haven't played continue.
Alec: Yep. It was flimsy. it Yeah. And go ahead.
How To Enjoy: has been a great return to return to form. I haven't completed it yet, but I've been playing it it intermittently. And it's it's quite good.
How To Enjoy: But it still comes down to the, I mean, there's what, 20 games now?
Alec: You know,
Alec: There's there's a plethora and they used to all have this sort of shared universe trilogy story through Desmond Miles. That was never even I thought it was it was an incredible framing device.
Alec: But it didn't really go anywhere as far as a bigger story. I maybe need to read
How To Enjoy: everybody Everybody criticized the the Desmond Miles present day stuff. And this is a kindtra controversial opinion, but I actually kind of liked it.
Alec: Man, where did we land on that as as a society? what What's the verdict? I don't think it's that bad.
How To Enjoy: What disappointed me was the, yeah, and the but what disappointed me was the the overall conclusion to the story that was started with Desmond Miles wasn't even finished.
Alec: I love it. I loved the frame i love a good framing device. Animus is cool.
How To Enjoy: in the in the games, they finished it in the comic books.
Alec: Yeah, and I don't want to get into spoilers, but I was not satisfied with any of the endings or any of the like the plot cliffhangers that they would leave. It just it was all it it reeked of flimsy, flimsy, flimsy framing. But what's really cool is that, see, the thing is, I want to I want to value their writing or their world building. I don't know how much I can really do that, like.
Alec: They're they're kind of given an amazing like framing of just our own history.
Alec: Like, yeah, like Renaissance. What if you were just the coolest guy during the Renaissance era, you know, killing people and like making political moves with Leonardo da Vinci and like, you know, the Medici's it.
How To Enjoy: Well, and I will point out that you know the that movie that came out is considered you know, official story. This is it's true to it's yeah, it's part of the part of the canon there.
Alec: Oh, is it.
How To Enjoy: So the fact that they were able to successfully carry it over into a, you know, a separate story that is a movie and maintain it in continuity speaks to how strong their framing devices now we can talk about the quality of the movie.
Alec: Man.
Alec: That is something we gotta talk about.
How To Enjoy: It was It was middling at best, but you know that's that's just that's just what it is. It's just like the Resident Evil movies. They're not great, but what Assassin's Creed...
Alec: Nope, they're but they are amazingly bad, though. Let's just make sure we're making that clear. Okay. They are amazing bad movies. They're great bad movies.
How To Enjoy: But they don't fit into the continuity.
Alec: And the first one is actually pretty great.
How To Enjoy: They don't fit into the continuity. Whereas Assassin's Creed successfully did that.
Alec: No, they really don't.
Alec: But how how hard first off, how hard is that?
How To Enjoy: And.
Alec: Not very hard. But yeah, it bothers me that that's not that's How hard is it for just your company to communicate with the company? Like the Ratchet and Clank movie, the video game, the movie that, you know, Russian nesting dolls of a French of a of an IP right there.
How To Enjoy: yeah Yeah, but those are all made by Sony, right?
Alec: True.
How To Enjoy: The the games and the movie.
Alec: Well, them and. Yes, by.
How To Enjoy: That's it's a little bit different. It's a little bit different with the Assassin's Creed franchise.
Alec: What is it, like? It's on the.
How To Enjoy: i think that ah I think it was well done as far as that aspect goes. Now, Assassin's Creed has the same problem as Mega Man, though.
How To Enjoy: At least for a while, they were learning the wrong lessons from their success.
Alec: What were the wrong lessons specifically?
How To Enjoy: Well, with Assassin's Creed,
Alec: Not that I doubt. I don't agree.
How To Enjoy: they decided that, you know, people liked the, you know, the the RPG elements of the originals. And so they leaned into it and leaned into it more and leaned into it more. I'm sorry, but if I jump off of, if I jump off of, you know, the top of a building, and I land on this dude with a, you know, hidden blade, and I stick him in the back of the neck, I don't care how many hit points he has, that dude's not getting back up.
Alec: Man, I.
Alec: so and i think we get into a bigger con con conversation of how to spend your time because assassin's creed might take 40 hours but you doesn't really need to does it does it really need to take up that much of your time for it to be that good i mean there's a six -hour game called undertale that i've played and i have thought about it every day of my life i've listened to the soundtrack all year i
How To Enjoy: which which by the way is not part of a franchise
Alec: Give it to my friends. It is not a franchise. Well, you don't know it. Delta ruins definitely not on cannon.
How To Enjoy: yet
Alec: What I'm really trying to say, though, is. We're, you have this promise. This company tells you they have a cool game and a cool experience and they give you this promise, right? It's this little ball. You hold it in your hand and it's a cool thing.
Alec: You have it and you put it in your brain and it's, it's just, you dream about it.
How To Enjoy: Which, by the way, is not part of a franchise.
Alec: You fixate it on it. You imagine it. Your little imagination grows like running wild and then they have to deliver on that. And the way they deliver on that is so mediocre at Ubisoft.
Alec: It's so grubby. It's so clumsily paced. I know so many people that love Assassin's Creed IV, and I just thought the opening of that game was some of the worst, most hand -holding, frustrating thing ever.
Alec: And I wanna like, for I'm gonna try again, but I'm somebody who played in a row, one, two, Brotherhood Revelations, three,
How To Enjoy: I'm one of the people that,
Alec: three liberations, three DLC. like i For a while, I was writing them pretty hard.
How To Enjoy: did you finish four?
Alec: I didn't even get into four, if I'm being honest.
How To Enjoy: Okay.
How To Enjoy: Um, I resisted four because I wasn't into the naval combat. I wasn't into, you know, but.
Alec: I did like the threes naval combat.
How To Enjoy: for when I got to the end and I realized the story that they were telling and that's what that's what I think made it great is that the story they told it was at one point in the game like everything clicks into place and it's just like whoa
Alec: I do not doubt it's a good story.
Alec: But but let's same thing, if I'm being honest, without spoiling anything, same thing happens with Undertale. It has this incredible moment. It has about 15 of these incredible moments, same with Outer Wilds, that make you just explode with how it ties everything together. like There's times when you think you understand all of the story and it's going one way for so long and at the last second, they twist your perception just a little bit and they know that they're doing it.
Alec: So i'm I'm saying this as somebody saying not a problem no problem with the game, but they clumsily, you you talk about the frustrating RPG mechanics. Does Assassin's Creed need to be an RPG?
Alec: like i don't I think that's something that they do to elongate, to make you feel like you're second to second just doing you know ah busy work, basically.
How To Enjoy: No.
Alec: And what's frustrating is you have something like FF14, which is so upfront with its busy work. It's so upfront saying, here's all these like relatively consequentialist lists of no consequence questing. It does not waste your time in pretending that like some of these things are are really going to really do much. They all have their reason.
Alec: and they all have the motivation and that's all that they really need to have and then they give it to you and then it's done. It's very short, it's very quick, but everything doesn't it feel, everything feels drawn out in an Assassin's Creed game.
Alec: It feels like they're just stretching out the promise so thin until it's a pizza dough and there's just the thinnest threads remaining and it's just, that's what Assassin's Creed games feel like to me.
How To Enjoy: Well,
How To Enjoy: let's talk about that for a second, because that's ah ah that's an interesting premise.
Alec: ah Stretching out ah and diluting of the promise.
How To Enjoy: And it's something that really is applicable to RPG players like us, right?
Alec: Mm hmm.
How To Enjoy: How many times have you described a game and you're talking to someone and you say, you're going to sink 100 hours into that game?
Alec: Mm hmm.
How To Enjoy: You, you've said that to me, that was part of what you said to me about a Persona 5.
Alec: Persona, persona, and it it earns those hundred hours, I will say. I truthfully believe that it paces itself remarkably, although I don't think it needs to be 100 hours.
How To Enjoy: And that's fine. But that's, that's fine. But I want you to think about what you just said about Assassin's Creed.
Alec: Mm hmm.
How To Enjoy: Does it need to be 40 hours? No, probably not. However, when when a new game comes out, what's one of the things that that's every single review?
How To Enjoy: Oh, you'll spend this many hours on it. Star Wars Jedi Survivor came out last year.
Alec: Every time.
How To Enjoy: People complained that it was only like 12 hours long. And I'm like, it didn't need to be any longer. It told a great story. In those 12 hours, it was clean.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: It was concise. There wasn't anything more to be said for what they were telling. Yeah, they left it open for a sequel.
Alec: Dude.
How To Enjoy: but it doesn't the The amount of time that I put into a game doesn't necessarily make it ah better. another yeah Another great example, and you have yet to play this, shame on you, you know Edith Finch.
Alec: Time is no reflection of of of enjoyment. Absolutely.
How To Enjoy: What remains of Edith Finch?
Alec: Oh, okay. I was waiting to hear how bad I needed to feel about not playing something that I should feel pretty bad about because it's only like two hours.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: To your point though.
How To Enjoy: And I've played through it, I've played through it multiple times because it is impactful every time.
Alec: Yeah. Like it's, it's just good, short and sweet.
Alec: That's actually quite a good. that you're selling me on it. So yeah we're we're agreeing when nobody's on the other side of this argument that like, you need to deliver the promise that's in front of you. And if you in the gameplay can be compelling. I there's so many things I learned about the Assassin's Creed games. Like I know in more in Odyssey. i and No, no, no, no. Maybe it is Mirage. Mirage is the new one.
Alec: It's it's one of the ones of the sand. Anyway, you'll you'll be in the sand and you'll just hallucinate all these things like locusts and rain and just islands and you'll hear voices. It's very eternal darkness.
Alec: e And I think that's awesome. It makes me want to play it. You know, I
How To Enjoy: Yeah, I think that's a, I think that's Mirage.
Alec: Thank you. Okay, well, it's it's one of the ones I haven't played for sure. And also all those games sort of run together. I mean, I think what you realize is that you're not really benefiting when you make all of these games have the same clumsy convergence of a brand identity. I think that's a limitation. I think that is not an argument you can often make.
Alec: when in the case of our, you know, brand hungry tribalist times, ah ah our nature, nature, but Assassin's Creed, I think is actually weakening their brand by not just being like, here's an amazing Viking game.
How To Enjoy: well
Alec: Here's an amazing Spartan game. Here's an amazing Middle Eastern game. Like, does it have to be a Prince of Persia or an Assassin's Creed to feature like a Middle Eastern character?
How To Enjoy: here's my big thing when it comes to Assassin's Creed as a whole you look back at
How To Enjoy: Assassin's Creed 1 and people don't like Altair and I'm like, I think he was the best one. But that's because you got to see his personal growth very, very, very well.
Alec: I,
How To Enjoy: The same thing was true for Ezio. The first Assassin's Creed protagonist that I did not like was, I'm just going to call him Connor.
Alec: Connor. Yeah.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, I didn't like him.
Alec: raha toate on Yeah. ra gate I love him.
How To Enjoy: And then and the
Alec: He's cool. He got a lot of murder in his heart.
How To Enjoy: Well, yes. But when you look at like even the story, like there's so many plot holes, like no one ever talks about the big one.
Alec: Oh, yeah.
How To Enjoy: You know, he goes to Achilles house when he first is like, Hey, hey, hey, train me. Hey, hey, hey, train me. And Achilles is every time he's just like, No, no, no.
How To Enjoy: And then finally, Achilles is like, Okay, fine. they go downstairs and it's been like 30 seconds and Achilles is like, okay, so you know, if you do this, you're going to have to kill your dad. And I'm like, how does Achilles know that that's his dad?
Alec: Yeah. Yeah, that is one of those just. Oh, I can't spoil it. I can't. Yes, that's it's ah ah a frustrating piece of story design.
Alec: And it's very presumptive is various presumptive of like, it's it's disrespectful to the character for one. But yeah, like, yeah, but complete agreements.
How To Enjoy: So yeah, well, And now here's the thing though, when we're talking about Assassin's Creed, we're talking about Final Fantasy. We're talking about these games, even Resident Evil, that have these huge overarching narratives and big story and, you know, of these longer -running franchises don't. Or not a clear one. I'm looking at you, Legend of Zelda. You know, Mega Man doesn't have
How To Enjoy: technically any major overarching story. Yes, they've kind of shoehorned it all into a singular timeline. a legend of Zelda. But, you know, Mega Man, the story seems incidental. Mario, the story is especially incidental. Sonic, the story doesn't matter.
Alec: think it's because i think I think when a game gives you, first off, let's just be real, what video games are is a transmutation of someone else's like vision and giving you an an ability to play in their imagination. I think that's maybe the broadest and lamest, most desensitized way to describe what a video game promises. But when they make a Mario game, they're they're not saying, here's a red -hatted plumber in blue overalls who's always gonna not get the girl, really.
Alec: What they're telling you is you're going to run around, you're going to jump around, you're going to be in a competently designed, very, very thoughtfully put together playground and there you're going to have fun.
Alec: It's a promise of fun. When you pick up a Half -Life game, you know that whatever technology is at your disposal, it is at the forefront of technology itself.
Alec: It's a promise of exceptionalism, you know, like
How To Enjoy: I mean, maybe 20 years ago.
Alec: Well, Half -Life doesn't have bad games. It just has no games, you know, but that's what I'm saying.
How To Enjoy: Exactly.
Alec: It doesn't, but they would rather, think about that though, they would rather not release mediocrity than just, you know, cop out with whatever flimsy, weak ending to a tril - and I have zero respect for Gabe Newell.
Alec: Uh, not in a time of, uh, his his yacht obsession with having ah ah multiple, multiple yachts. I don't know if you're familiar with this. and all of the money he has made scamming people with his legal gambling loophole through CSGO. We're not going to talk about that, though we're going to keep it non -political. I just want to say that he at least had the the artistic decency to not muddy a franchise, and I respect that. Think about Pokemon. Pokemon is the number one IP in the world, dethroning Mickey Mouse.
Alec: I mean, with that was like, what, only like 30 years, it came out February 27 1996, and has sold, you know, hundreds of millions of copies, it's become the most recognizable brand in the world. And they invent new characters all the time and make movies about old characters all the time. And It's sort of like the dilution of this promise. I came into Pokemon at the, you know, at the first generation, really, but third is when I really got it. And there was, at the time, there was just like this incredible promise of what a Pokemon game is gonna be. It's gonna be new, innovative, these creature's items are gonna blow your mind. It was pixel art perfection. It was good, compelling, you know, young protagonist, just adventure, you know? And over time, it feels like that promise is,
Alec: It's gotten so safe, it's deluded into nothingness almost. you know they're They're just artificially withholding, releasing a fully fledged Pokemon game in the vein of like ah ah just just milking a franchise.
Alec: we are but So let's let's talk about the thing that really drives art is capitalism. I mean, we can't not talk about that.
How To Enjoy: 20
Alec: To a degree, I'm not here to just to dismantle anything, but it's, these are financial decisions.
How To Enjoy: years ago. Maybe, um want to say it was like 2002. I was at an anime convention and I was listening to a panel and it was the cast of Dragon Ball Z.
How To Enjoy: The people that are
Alec: Mm -hmm.
How To Enjoy: you know do most at the time did most of the Funimation dubs. It was pretty much the same group of people.
Alec: Yeah, I was.
How To Enjoy: And they were talking about Dragon Ball Z and the question that was asked of them was, you know, you guys did Fruits Basket, which for anybody who hasn't seen Fruits Basket, it's absolutely amazing.
Alec: It's a very tender, romantic, yeah.
How To Enjoy: It's heart -wrenching, tender Yeah, just it's a very good show. How do you how do you balance playing, you know, these characters on Dragon Ball Z?
How To Enjoy: That's all. ah And then the very, the very gentle heartfelt characters on Fruits Basket. And their answer was, you know, we love Dragon Ball Z.
How To Enjoy: It's because of the money that we make from Dragon Ball Z that we're able to do the artistic stuff.
Alec: things like fruits basket. Yeah, absolutely.
How To Enjoy: like for its basket.
Alec: This is what funds all the other crazy adventures. This is what keeps the lights on. Yeah, this is what gets us to so that is to be stated. There's so much to be said of that in gaming.
How To Enjoy: so
Alec: I mean, rock yeah, Rockstar's whole venture ah business capitalist idea is just like, let's just make the best thing in the world something that like CD Projekt has started to even do. like Let's make one phenomenal experience, one phenomenal game. And we just won't make any other games for a while. Just let that kind of ride.
Alec: And that's that's brand confidence. That's how you that's how you instill perfection into a franchise is just leaving it alone. I love the earthbound games. I love the mother franchise. I love each and every one of them so very dearly that I might as well be buried with them. In fact, if I'm not. My ghost will be very upset.
Alec: But like you don't make an Earthbound 4. Don't try. Don't even think about it. Undertale is Earthbound 4. Leave it alone. You want a title that'll give you the safety of familiarity. And that's wrong. That's that's dishonest to what these IPs are. Because what these IPs are is they're they're ideas by people. They're intellectual properties by people, not corporations. Corporations end up with them.
Alec: But people make this stuff, you know, like some of the most underpaid and hardest working people in the world. But yeah, I mean, think about like Minecraft.
Alec: That's that's in the top five, least according to this here Wikipedia video game franchises, and it's a single game. No, we are not counting season one and two story.
How To Enjoy: Oh,
Alec: Don't you dare.
How To Enjoy: oh but don't forget Minecraft Dungeons and Minecraft Legends. And there was Minecraft World. I mean, they've attempted to make, to recreate that success in other, it's, and but I mean, that's that's a valid point.
Alec: Yeah, Yeah, but like, let let's be Let's be real. Ain't no homie, ain't nobody playing that, you know?
How To Enjoy: it's It's a valid point, but here's the thing though.
Alec: Oh my gosh. Nobody's watching the Cleveland show.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, a CD Projekt Red is a great example. But they are a small studio, thankfully. They manage to continue paying the bills. But at the end of the day, those games continue to sell, whereas you have these larger studios, say Nintendo.
How To Enjoy: you know You're talking about Pokemon, um and I get it. But because Pokemon sells so well, it lets them do the more experimental stuff that they do.
Alec: Yes.
Alec: Yeah, well, and let's not let's remember Game Freak makes
Alec: They are the ones that get to, you know, they get to fund all their little side ventures like Giga Wrecker alt and I don't know, that's the only like cool guy hidden gem name I know by those people.
How To Enjoy: Well, I mean, those, those cash cows are what allowed them to do the, and that goes for, I mean, well, it could go for Ubisoft.
Alec: But but yeah. They they definitely yes.
How To Enjoy: I don't.
Alec: Little town hero is the other cool.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: but you know, we talked about Capcom, Resident Evil, Mega Man, you know, whatever else, whatever else that Capcom makes these days, but the fact that they have those, those cash cows are the reason that they can, you know, put clovers back together.
Alec: The soundtrack by Toby Fox.
Alec: Oh, yeah. So.
How To Enjoy: and make Okami too.
Alec: Think about what an engine is. you know it's Think about like the res so the new Dead Rising. First off, Dead Rising was one of my favorite games of all time. I was in the top 1 ,000. OK, I'm not going to lie. Top 1 ,500. But let's be cool about that. give me the Give me the numbers. I need to find those numbers. You know what I mean? and
Alec: Uh, I was, you know, I was tough, like 1500 when I played Dead Rising. I was very, very good at it. I knew where all the things were. I was really good at all this stuff, but, uh, that was a hard game to turn into a franchise. And they they did their best with it. And it looked like we were never, ever, ever, ever going to get another Dead Rising game. I mean, this is somebody who watched three happen, two off the record, you know, two off the record is cool. Three is cool.
Alec: Four is not that cool, actually, but it's Christmas game and I miss it every year. Still never played it. It's to co -op. We should hit that up next year. What I'm trying to say, though, is Dead Rising was a dead franchise because of Resident Evil's success, because of Resident Evil's engine.
How To Enjoy: I mean, isn't that by definition when it's a zombie game?
Alec: Ali, you've got to do stand up. I'm telling you. yeah Try it once in your life. No, but like, honestly, it's that is something that is you can you want to talk about, you know, one project funding another. You it does not take, you know, a Redditor and 100 pieces of string and thumbtacks and pictures and a wall does not take that much to to ah ah Pepe Silvia. The results from Resident Evil Engine into Dead Rising's framework. They got a new Dead Rising game with a new, like, are we going to see a Lost Planet game come out? Like the Onimusha engine, or sorry, the Onimusha game's going to be using the Resident Evil engine. Could the new Okami game somehow use a tweaked version of their Resident Evil engine? I don't know. That is so interesting to me. Because if we can get an engine down, I hope none of our games become too samey.
Alec: You know, I don't want every game to run on the same like five engines, but I also don't want to see an industry bankrupt themselves.
How To Enjoy: I mean.
Alec: Like I think like a billion dollar, um not that much, but a lot of money went into making Halo's engine and they only used it for infinite.
Alec: know that were some games that used like, there's like, you know, that famous Stubbs the Zombie used the Halo engine. That was, you know, part of their whole marketing scheme for that game.
Alec: It's maybe the game's only claim to fame, if I'm being honest, besides it's like, 50s destroy humans aesthetic.
How To Enjoy: Now, when I'm talking about the engine, I'm talking about play style.
Alec: Having...
How To Enjoy: want to be clear on that.
Alec: Yes. Aesthetics have almost nothing to do with engine.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: Yes, yes, yes, yes.
How To Enjoy: But that all that being said,
Alec: Gameplay. I'm just getting lost in the weeds over here.
How To Enjoy: that being said like
How To Enjoy: all the being samey, you're right. But then we're also in a world where you know mobile gaming has taken such ah ah has taken such a large share of the market.
How To Enjoy: and it's a growing share of the market.
Alec: Not just mobile gaming, gambling, but we'll talk about that some other time.
How To Enjoy: and if you can it well yeah But if you if you take one format and all you got to do is put a new skin on it and market it as a new game and people are eating it up,
Alec: Have you heard about the ... You're talking about like an asset knockoff, essentially. Have you heard about the the Nintendo Switch, clunkified, non -official, non -sanctioned, Blacksmith Wukong?
Alec: thing.
How To Enjoy: No.
Alec: It's essentially all those things you consider the Holyoverse games doing to, you know, like good games like near automata that actually like pioneer character action games and then just have it, you know, bastardized in the form of like, you know, mobile gotcha one someone can see you do all the homework and just copy it and make it look like they did it themselves.
Alec: And that's a disappointing reality.
How To Enjoy: Right.
Alec: It's one thing when it's like they're making really cheap Mega Man sequels, no offense. Not even Mega Man, like Double Dragon. They made a lot of cheap Double Dragon sequels. you know
How To Enjoy: And the Mega Man sequels have been cheap.
Alec: don't want to be mean. This is how to enjoy. it But you... I don't even know if I can make a bigger point than I've already been making, but you you lose you lose the force for the trees when you... Yeah.
How To Enjoy: Exactly. And when the idea is everything is a knockoff of something else and people are buying it and people are buying into it, yeah, so Dead Rising is using, you know, Evil's engine, and Onimusha's going to, and this, and this, and this, and then all the games start seeming the same. but Well, we're still buying it.
Alec: And the truth is, I think that's a far, I think, I don't think that future is that bleak because what we really have is we have a competent engine that's versatile. I don't think there's anything wrong with a highly versatile, highly modular part that can be used in very many situations.
Alec: I consider myself a Swiss army man of a person.
How To Enjoy: I agree.
Alec: You put me on a football team. You put me in a nerd's circle. I'm loving everyone there. I'm high five until I die.
How To Enjoy: It is Renaissance man.
Alec: Well,
Alec: I don't think that it's a bad like, I think I think when we see like the Fortnite engine.
Alec: first off, I hate it, but,
How To Enjoy: Ha ha ha.
Alec: That's a game basically pimping out. That's that's it's is Fortnite just the new unreal? You know, it used to be like you had to make games like Gears of War, like I know there was Unreal Tournament, but like Gears of War basically is is a, you know, it's it's a promise of what that engine can take, can do.
Alec: And there's a lot of different ways that you can use the, it's at the Unreal Engine 3, right? Is that what Gears of War is built on?
How To Enjoy: I I'm not sure so don't don't quote me on that one
Alec: It is Unreal Engine 3. It's the physics and video engine in Unreal Engine 3. So it uses a modified version of Unreal Engine 3, the first four installments, too. I just looked it up. So we were mostly right. the The point that I'm making is that used to be what you had to do to sell somebody on what a game is capable of. Now you just have to throw like a Party City dumpster of media properties at them until they're just, again, Leonardo da Vinci just pointing at the screen like, oh, it's John Wick. It's John Wick and he's he's he's flossing. Dad, he's flossing. You know, daddy, look, Santa can floss too.
Alec: You got John Wick and Pikachu and Goku too.
How To Enjoy: Hmm, hmm.
Alec: And it's what it turns into is the lamest forums I would stumble across. If you think those things are cool, you have officially confessed to just being, I don't know, like if you like the Fortnite games, like cool.
Alec: But if you're doing it just so you can have all of the skins that don't translate to any real thing, a Dude, don't get me wrong. I've spent 99 cents on a horse skin and in Elder Scrolls 4. I've du've done that craziness. But I don't spend hours and hours and hours of my life you know kind of beholden to it. I'm going to say the word beholden to be nice. Beholden to a game design that is essentially predatory. And it it it predatorizes on your on your media consumption. And I think that's what the worst is. ah ah It almost makes you sad to be a fan of these things.
Alec: it's It makes you sad. It makes me sad, at least. you know It makes me sad. I think these properties are better. I think when you make something as beautiful as something like Earthbound, you know you need to make sure that it's handled appropriately in Super Smash Bros. And it is. The music's amazing. The the stages are lovingly put together.
Alec: Shigesato Itoi, creator of the Earthbound games, has made sure that like the mother franchise has been lovingly taken care of. I
Alec: having said that. I mean, I don't know you have things like if we're still talking about like franchises and franchise fatigue. You have like these weird, we're kinda talking about tech demos, like Dynasty Warriors, Gran Turismo, what are these?
Alec: These are franchises based solely on the same promise with a technological execution that gets closer and closer to reality with every installment.
Alec: Gran Turismo promises you know a realistic driving simulator. Dynasty Warriors promises that when you press X for 13 times in a row, you've killed 1 ,000 people, you know?
How To Enjoy: That's also to say his Dynasty Warriors is very far from realistic.
Alec: is
Alec: But it's the first game, well, I think the first game is actually like a 2D fighter, because it's like a weird port of a not Dynasty Warriors game. But the first real Dynasty Warriors game, you had like 50 people on screen, you know? And now you have hundreds with complex and varying AI, like it's, they're they're turning it into like an actual kind of character action series. And and in some respects, like this newest Dynasty Warriors looks interestingly fresh.
Alec: I'm the most interested I've maybe ever been in a Dynasty Warriors, aside from getting it on my Vita when I had just got my Vita.
How To Enjoy: I mean it's a pretty low bar.
Alec: Well, listen, you know what, so is you know Star Ocean, but hey, someone's someone's got to kick those tires.
How To Enjoy: Shut your mouth.
Alec: Look, I'm sorry, we don't have Star Ocean isn't cool. to I like it.
How To Enjoy: Not, not.
Alec: I know it's amazing. I live till the end of time.
How To Enjoy: Yeah. And that was, that was the last good one.
Alec: I love.
Alec: Yeah, well, see, I don't I know because I I didn't play it very much and if I haven't played it very much. I don't there are people who spent their time differently than I did. But I don't know.
Alec: It took a lot of time to get every emblem in Sonic Adventure 2. So I just know that that's how I spent some of my time.
How To Enjoy: So, ah I mean,
Alec: some of the mistakes made.
How To Enjoy: To bring this all full full circle, Fantasy is a special case in my mind when it comes to franchises because while some of the things they've done have been missteps, for the most part, they've stayed true to the promise of this grand adventure story and you know beautiful,
How To Enjoy: for you know whatever timeframe it was made beautiful by that standard, environments and you know storytelling and everything.
Alec: fantastical yeah or science fictional.
How To Enjoy: But most importantly, every Final Fantasy game has not been afraid of taking chances.
Alec: Absolutely.
How To Enjoy: And some of them have failed. I absolutely hate the junction system in Final Fantasy VIII. It's awful.
Alec: Yeah, they learned the wrong lessons from the summon cutscenes. And cut scenes and ah ah everybody in the world knows that that's played that game.
How To Enjoy: Yeah, well.
Alec: Or those two games, but like, you were souring on like, yo, I love the sphere.
How To Enjoy: But then, you know, the sphere grant another example.
Alec: What are we doing about you?
How To Enjoy: I hate it.
How To Enjoy: We.
Alec: How does it feel to be just wrong?
How To Enjoy: yeah
Alec: I love you, buddy. man. I'm totally with you on that like I I I I have had to argue for the sphere quite a bit recently there was a co -worker I had that is going through it and He's like, I don't like sphere gri and I was like, no no, no No, you can you can like make Yuna a black mage with like three spheres and he's like, yeah, but I don't have to like think about that and it's like What are we
How To Enjoy: But.
How To Enjoy: Well, see, what they've accomplished is A, creating conversation, but B, they took a chance, and here it is 20, what, 20, no, yeah, 20 years later.
Alec: We making decisions?
Alec: yes they have oh with final fantasy 10 that's like it's closer to 25 years man that's 2002 trust me and if i'm wrong here here's here's the best part if i'm wrong i will get crucified by the internet
How To Enjoy: We are still talking about it.
How To Enjoy: Maybe. I thought it was 2004 for some reason.
Alec: so they are the ultimate the litmus test of my correct to.
How To Enjoy: But, you know, and then you take a look at Final Fantasy 12. They took another, they risk by turning it into more action RPG oriented. It's closer to the MMO format, but.
Alec: twelve. Twelve isn't even and go go ahead, sorry, I just hate that characterization of twelve by people.
How To Enjoy: Well, but it's it's closer to the MMO format. It is risk that they took.
Alec: it's is like I said with the Rocky franchise kind of metaphor 13 is just the safest most like colorful game with like making you make as few decisions as possible and just looking pretty because that was just sort of the the the design philosophy of games at the time.
How To Enjoy: 13 took a risk by really not giving you much of an open world until very late in the game. and
How To Enjoy: so yeah mean at At the end of the day, the point is, though, that You know, they've taken risks and they've maintained it as this this piece of art that they're working on.
How To Enjoy: And that each time they make a new one, they're presenting something new for the art, for the art of it.
Alec: I think, yes.
How To Enjoy: And I think that's what keeps Final Fantasy relevant. Mario does that. Zelda does that. You tell me Resident Evil is doing that.
Alec: Absolutely.
How To Enjoy: But now Sonic.
Alec: Sonic's getting real good right now, actually. Sonic's maybe the best he's been in a long time. Shadow X Generations game was phenomenal. Sonic Generations is already on its own, pretty good.
Alec: a fantastic celebration of what Sonic is and can be with, uh, some varying, like, I mean, you know, it's, it's at the end of the day, it's still pretty okay.
How To Enjoy: Right.
How To Enjoy: It's still a platformer, but that's the thing.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: Sonic has also done. has also done that. Talk about Sonic Colors, let's talk about Sonic Unleashed.
Alec: Yeah. But Sonic games. I love Sonic Unleashed.
How To Enjoy: We can talk about the weirdly boring Sonic 2006, so that's somehow felt slow.
Alec: You know, it's funny. is So I will say when we talk about some of the arguments we made earlier, Sonic games is bad as they are. They're never long. They're never long. They're there. They top out at like 12 hours. You know, frontiers is a bit of a special case because they're sort of responding with the Halo infinite methodology of game design of just put them in weird, strange place with a lot of somewhat familiar elements that are also loosely conjoined into some, you know, game experience.
How To Enjoy: With no clear direction where to go.
Alec: with no clear direction. It's it's a bottle episode of the video game. awesome But I don't think Sonic's ever failed at its promise of being like a character that you can feel like you know, like Sonic to an unconfident little kid out there is like their best friend hero. You know what I mean? like Mario might be like a comfort, but Sonic makes you like, you know, you want to like, make some Sonic fan art, you want to like, you know, run with your hands behind your back because of Sonic, you know, Sonic, Sonic has always delivered this cringe though, it may be really, you know, clumsy promise, Sonic is maybe the definition of loving something for its edges, not its curves.
How To Enjoy: Right.
Alec: You know, Sonic is not Mario. It's very safe and very, you know, carefully curated for as many people as once. Sonic is for a specific targeted demographic, most of whom are on one side of puberty.
Alec: And, we'll use Sonic to carry it to the other side of puberty. That's kind of what Sonic is. Uh, he's like, it's like your pre -teen to teen best friend.
How To Enjoy: Well, and now you're, you're, you're, you're making my point for me.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: Sonic, Dragon Quest, Final Fantasy, Resident Evil, Zelda, Mario, Mega Man.
Alec: to wrap it up. Yeah.
How To Enjoy: All of these, all of these have done one thing and they've done it well. And that is they take risks.
Alec: Make a promise.
How To Enjoy: They take a risk to fulfill, as you're saying, the promise.
Alec: Mm hmm.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: And sometimes they do it badly. There's definitely examples of games in each of those franchises that weren't really up to par.
Alec: Do Dragon Quest and get cool to like the third one? Let's be real.
How To Enjoy: right But what is it that they do that makes it last? And what is it that sets Assassin's Creed as something different?
How To Enjoy: Assassin's Creed isn't really taking the risks, and it's not and it's not
Alec: It's not.
How To Enjoy: maintaining that art form. It's just we're going to throw out another cookie cutter game.
Alec: Even if the game is good, it's it's like they take they take these steps, but they do it so care. Like when Shadow the Hedgehog came out, say what you will about Shadow the Hedgehog, and I will. But Shadow the Hedgehog was not safe. It was Shadow's yeah shadows back. He's saying swears. He's slinging a gun. He's got Knuckles saying swears too. You know, ah ah you know the hooligans be running together over here.
Alec: and But like brands didn't all it wasn't always about being safe. In fact, it was about being edgy. So maybe what we're seeing is just some sort of like socialized commercial response, you know, like it's all driven economically.
Alec: That's really who makes these decisions.
How To Enjoy: it is it is all driven economically but going back to but what's going back to the both oh of course but you can't say that it's one or the other because there's a market for both the fact that assassins creed continues to sell and consent continues to have a
Alec: It's what is selling edge. For conformity.
Alec: You got to pick a lane, you really do.
How To Enjoy: a new game every year, or every other year proves that conformity and sticking to a very specific formula still sells.
Alec: man i don't know if you know this this
How To Enjoy: But does it it make it to the test of time?
Alec: I do agree because you could replace the Hydra head of ah ah Assassin's Creed of Things, you know, Fortnite, honestly. Fortnite is conforming to a bunch of, you know, gambling induced microtransaction base, free to play, you know, manipulative bullcrap. You know, it's yeah say what you will, but it's it's aesthetics. It's
How To Enjoy: It's not art it's
Alec: i The game design is not being tweaked in any meaningful way. I know they add game modes for you to, you know, wear your skins. So I guess, I don't know, in that way, it's kind of cool to see Fortnite as like, you know, if e -sports are meant to be a translation of that with which you cannot do with your body, which is what sports are, it's doing something with your body. It's I'm, you know, making dunks or I'm throwing basketballs or I'm like, you know,
Alec: catching a touchdown or these are things you do with your body and things you struggle with if your body is you know anything other than what other people need like if you want to be a competitive basketball player you have to adhere to some level of like the height demands that it requires or you're an anomaly like it is possible for sure, I'm never saying there's not an eddy the ego out there. But ah just generally speaking, we got to be honest about what sports are there. They're, they're benefited for so for their what is the rules? And what is the genetic predisposition to adhere to those rules? What video games are amazing at is being this great equalizer of we're all just some goobers with you know, you know, button punchers, you know, the the adaptive controllers are going a long way to make sure that everybody
Alec: is able to just game you know uh have you heard of the there's this amazing youtuber you know i want to call him amazing i've seen one video and i enjoyed it but uh his editing seems pretty good but he's like the handy capable gamer his name is uh he recently had a pretty bad accident and i will get his youtube name and i'll put it in the comments but this guy just came out like in the past like two months and has been making just awesome videos. And he's been actually spreading a lot of awareness for what the it's like to game with you know something of a disability. lost his hand and he has been talking about all these like you know colleges that have helped him out with developing all 3D printed technology to assist in in these things. it's I just am basically saying, I think what games should be remembered for being is like
Alec: the great equalizer, you know, it it shouldn't be where somebody spends more money is better, or or has more options. Unfortunately, that might always happen.
Alec: But I, I'd like to think that games are something of the great equalizer.
How To Enjoy: It'll always happen.
Alec: Maybe maybe that's foolhardy of me though.
How To Enjoy: Oh, I agree.
How To Enjoy: I just like it when my games try to do something a little bit different and it's not the same thing over and over again.
Alec: By the way, the guy's name is Champutee and he at least gets three points from me for that name alone.
How To Enjoy: Champion, t that's pretty good.
Alec: Champutee, but he has 3 .9 million views and he's making a lot of people aware on the, like, I think the future is getting everybody in the same gaming conversation. Heck yeah. Like
How To Enjoy: I
Alec: I just I hope people Understand you know when something gives you a choice between hating and hating harder, you also never forget. Have a third choice, which is just to not hate at all. and Sometimes the only way to win is not to play. and i think that's I think I'm winning Fortnite by not playing it, I'll be honest.
Alec: I'm not trying to act holier than that. I've played Fortnite. I've danced around. but Before it was big, I actually checked out Fortnite because I'm the type of weirdo that actually watched the E3 trailer and got excited about it.
Alec: I worked at GameStop when it came out.
How To Enjoy: i played it
Alec: like I know I'm not ignorant. What I am is trying to tell people that Through capitalism, something can very easily be the all -in -one solution to none of the things you're looking for, but all of the things they're telling you that you want.
Alec: I don't think people really want to play Fortnite. I really, truthfully don't. I think people want to play a game with their friends, and I think they will do any game that is relatively able to give them a clumsy enough amalgamation of what that experience might look like in their heads.
How To Enjoy: I played it.
Alec: And you know what, if that includes, you know, Mr. John Master Chief Spartan, Halo, Gamer 133, 117, you know, sitting shotgun next to, you know, Drake in the end.
Alec: I don't know. I don't think so. I think that's a pretty crass, artless, you know, capitalist being shoved down your throat expression of artistic intent.
How To Enjoy: It's,
Alec: I don't think that that's art.
How To Enjoy: I think Fortnite is opportunist.
Alec: And
How To Enjoy: And I think that in the long run, it'll show that, you know, these these franchises that we've been talking about, most of them I think are going to continue.
How To Enjoy: I think,
Alec: I mean, we just saw Onimusha, we saw Kami and Onimusha and it get revived in the same breath. Like I don't, that nothing is safe, man. Nothing. We have Tetsuya Mizuguchi is making Tetris and Tetris sequels. Maybe like what's, what's going on? I don't know. It's all up in the air.
How To Enjoy: And there's a roguelike semi -narrative poker game.
Alec: Yeah, and it's phenomenal and it is actually a better implementation of game design than anything Epic Games has done right now the besides give me a bunch of free games on my wallet.
How To Enjoy: Well, then it should really be showing that there's some hope as far as maybe some bringing something new to these franchises.
How To Enjoy: Even Assassin's Creed, Shadow coming out soon, is doing something that the franchise hasn't done before.
Alec: Mm hmm.
How To Enjoy: And that is, no.
Alec: Like going Eastern.
How To Enjoy: You have two choices, two characters to choose from, and they have separate narratives.
Alec: Oh. You know, oh, really, that actually is kind of interesting, man, like, you know I don't know if we've talked about this before in the show or even in privately,
Alec: Like, Assassin's Creed started off as Prince of Persia, Cole and Assassins. It was an offshoot of another franchise, which shows how, you know, absorbed into brand names, you know, yeah Ubisoft is. They don't think it's it's almost like they're cheaply telling you they can't do these games without the brand name.
Alec: But I think they can. I think I think I would be I would like this game so much more if they if I would like the Assassin's Creed Odyssey game so much more if they just called it big Spartan game. The epic quest of helmet, you know, I could I would smoke that so hard. I would love that drink it up, but They're they're just kind of they're just they're kind of insult. They're kind of pandering. It's kind of insulting to the intelligence, which is funny for a game that is supposed to appreciate your intelligence and your recognition of historical figures. You're supposed to understand that Leonardo da Vinci may have been homosexual when you're dealing with him in Assassin's Creed, too. Like you're supposed to know that, like, you know, he's got like ah ah mechanisms for like a tank like and that's why you drive like the world's first tank. It's I don't know.
Alec: yeah It's something that shouldn't pander and it particularly does, it seems like. It's maybe in the worst position to pander and it freaking does, but like.
How To Enjoy: But I think, I think, I think that Shadow is going to be finally bringing something new to the franchise. and You know, more choice.
Alec: What do I think this is the litmus test.
How To Enjoy: I think you're right. And I think, I think it's, I think it stems from a realization that people really don't want the cookie cutter game.
Alec: I think this, yeah, this is the question.
How To Enjoy: There needs to be something new brought in.
Alec: No.
How To Enjoy: And that's what these franchises have done well and that's what keeps them relevant. And why so many others have just fallen away.
Alec: You know, I think one day I think we're going to have a year without a call of duty. I really think that there's only so much you can drive a train into something like we haven't even taught. We didn't talk about the Halo franchise. There's I know we're we're wrapping up, but like we didn't really talk about so much. But I think in a way we addressed just about everything, you know, that's it's about.
Alec: It's about what society really wants. It's about how you vote with your wallets. And it's about, you know, how aware you are with your power. you don't have to play anything you don't want to I we talked about addiction in the beginning part of this podcast, without even addressing the simple fact that like only play with you're having fun with challenge yourself appropriately.
How To Enjoy: And which includes Fortnite if that's what you're, if you're, that's what you're into.
Alec: Absolutely. I think you will grow and I think it is a matter of time before you sincerely find yourself no longer interested in the aesthetics like maybe you don't maybe I'm wrong and I'll stick my reputation on it. But I do think that I think I think people more need more than just ah ah fashion is incredibly important fashion is cyclical but I don't think i just I don't think that video games are are fashionable in that way. But like I said, I think you can look at the future of the Assassin's Creed franchise and kind of tell us which one of us is going to end up being more right. I think Assassin's Creed is doomed because
Alec: you know, it needs to we need to be respected, we need to be not pandered to we are, we are discerning players, there are people that like, genuinely get so much out of video games, that they follow us for goodness sake, you know, what the heck are we we didn't get no degrees, we're just a bunch of guys that see it going a particular way and don't totally like that.
Alec: And I think we're trying to say something about it. And I think we're also expressing what the Zeitgeist is at this time, because we are seeing so much change so quickly. And it's all so counter, you know, we're getting like these big adventures with so much going into non microtransaction games from EA themselves with their Haze Light games studio.
Alec: And then in the same the same company is just pimping out FIFA points after FIFA points.
How To Enjoy: and, you know, copy paste Madden game every year.
Alec: And.
Alec: Yeah, and you know what? Maybe if everybody had like a lot of money, we would see people people vote on better. But I actually think Fortnite, we're talking about economic solutions. I'm going to leave everybody with one last thought. Is Fortnite just the game you play because it's free?
Alec: Is that where we are? I mean, if it is, that's okay. I have been there.
Alec: I have been there unable to play for Xbox live, playing Halo one over and over again.
Alec: Like I've been there, you know, with nothing but a 40 for warmth, but, just want to make sure that people realize that that's what's happening. Like, and you don't have to keep getting V bucks, you know, its to feel good or to the the gun skin and and counter strike, like buy a game.
How To Enjoy: Well, I want to add to that. If you look at the top lists of just about every everything, like right now, today, what's the most downloaded game on Steam, on PlayStation, on Xbox, I'm willing to bet that it was a free game.
Alec: Doritos Crash Course, and Doritos, du Cars of Destruction or something Doritos had some cool games released on it for free on Xbox Live.
Alec: Yeah, but anyway, hang on, I need to know what the name of this game is.
How To Enjoy: yeah
Alec: Doritos Crash Course and
Alec: Yeah, Dash of Destruction. Okay, I was right. Cool.
Alec: See, that's the way that I like marketing in video games.
How To Enjoy: Yeah.
Alec: Make a whole stupid game.
How To Enjoy: a Check's quest.
Alec: It didn't make me think about Doritos. Chex Quest. Yes, give me a boomer shooter. Give me a Doom like with just some Quest crap, you know? There's, if we haven't talked about like Pepsi Man or like Cool Spot.
Alec: I mean, like corporations and mascots have some pretty amazing, you know, I think capitalism also gives us every bit of the Final Fantasy that we love.
Alec: But we again, capitalism is nothing if not just one big framework for the game of of socializing, you know?
How To Enjoy: that's true That's true.
Alec: But yeah, I think I think we've done our work here today. I don't even think we need to keep this last part in if we don't want to. I'm rambling nonsense.
How To Enjoy: yeah It's not nonsense.
Alec: Yeah.
How To Enjoy: It's just, you know, it's a, it's a topic for another episode that we already have planned.
Alec: Unfocused.
Alec: I think it is. And let's leave it there. I'm your host, Alec, Leon Delon, and this is your other host.
Alec: And we'll find out what to call you. We're going to develop a relationship, you and I. Parasocially, not don't show up to my house. But I don't know. Leave a comment. Have good vibes. Tell someone to play a game that you really care about. And you might not get here's the thing. People are not always where you need them to be at the time you need them to be there. Sometimes you're the the the instigator of change. You may not ever see them play the game, but maybe just maybe you'll be a memory in a voice in their head. I love you all and I'll catch you later.
How To Enjoy: Thank you for visiting and we'll talk to you next week.
