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Preventable Circus Accidents in the Industry "Smirkus" - Circuspreneur Podcast
30 Plays1 month ago
#Circussmirkus #YouthCircus #CircusCamp #Circusaccident
Contact Senator Blumenthal's office and urge him to support the SafeArt/SafeCircus Act:
https://www.blumenthal.senate.gov/contact/write-to-senator-blumenthal
In this episode of the Circuspreneur Podcast, host Shenea Stiletto dives into a serious topic: preventable accidents in the circus industry. While the circus is known for its thrills and daring feats, behind the scenes, safety is a constant concern. Many accidents that make headlines could have been avoided with the right precautions. In this episode, Shenea Stiletto will explore the culture that leads to circus accidents, and why the need for increased safety and regulations within the industry is urgent.
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Transcript
Introduction and Incident Overview
00:00:03
Circuspreneur Podcast
This is Shanae Stiletto. Hi everyone. this is a solo episode of the Circuspreneur podcast where I am going to be discussing the recent incident at Circus Marcus, the youth circus that everyone knows.
00:00:23
Circuspreneur Podcast
it is insanely popular. in the circus world. And I know so many performers that started out in Circus Mercus and it led to them having professional careers for companies like Cirque du Soleil and, you know, um all over the world.
Circus Marcus Reputation and Safety Concerns
00:00:42
Circuspreneur Podcast
And i you know, I often, because i at this point, haven't heard, I would say anything overtly negative about Circus Marcus um over the over the years.
00:00:55
Circuspreneur Podcast
And I regularly i ah invite parents to send their children to Circus Marcus, to Circus Marcus camp and as a lead up to them becoming a professional and, you know, getting their feet wet and you can go on tour the company. It's so, it's so, it's it's a really great model.
00:01:16
Circuspreneur Podcast
And um they're the ones that were, that were doing it from, from, from long ago. And, ah you know, they have a, they have a great model. Again, I can't say that I have heard overtly negative things about Circus Marcus umt until right now.
00:01:34
Circuspreneur Podcast
um If you haven't, heard there was a really tragic accident that happened with a very young performer. um And he was, i yeah you know, horrifically injured.
00:01:48
Circuspreneur Podcast
um There are reports again that he will be making a full recovery. But um from the injuries that I have seen that he has sustained, that is a very long road to whatever that might mean.
00:02:02
Circuspreneur Podcast
um i definitely wish his family
Accountability and Culture Issues
00:02:05
Circuspreneur Podcast
well. And from what I have heard and from folks that are bringing this incident to my, um you know, to me, to be aware of, um it's sounding a lot like most of the incidents that I speak on about on the podcast.
00:02:22
Circuspreneur Podcast
And it's very upsetting. It's very upsetting to be discussing this with folks um that, you know, have um close personal um connections to this incident um and that things were not handled well.
00:02:43
Circuspreneur Podcast
um You can go online. It's all over the news. And there are some ah Instagram posts that have been very informative about the rigging situation at Circus Marcus for this particular tour and that parents and children were bringing this to the attention of the coordinator at Circus Marcus that they did not feel safe with this rigor. They felt like the rigor was underqualified and just simply didn't know what they were doing.
00:03:12
Circuspreneur Podcast
And their complaints were ushered away. as I often talk about on the podcast and how we react in a lot of circus spaces and the challenges that that presents, which led to a very tragic accident that was probably 99% avoidable.
00:03:34
Circuspreneur Podcast
And I, again, come back to folks where again, i don't need, you know, ah you know the parents are in uproar they they should be i would be um they've finally you know they've canceled i believe um shows and uh we'll see if they continue with the rest of the tour but again it's not just even about removing that one person that was incredibly underqualified who unfortunately i have to say this as well wouldn't remove himself
00:04:06
Circuspreneur Podcast
And, you know, and and I've also seen that too in these situations in circus where that person is that underqualified, but has been put there in a very coveted position or even just in a position that they're just not great in and they and they're indignant about it.
00:04:23
Circuspreneur Podcast
They won't leave. They won't leave. You couldn't get anybody to get them out. And I've, you know, again, on the podcast, spoken about situations over the years that I have been privy to or that everybody knows about.
00:04:37
Circuspreneur Podcast
And there's been situations where, you know, this person is leading to several injuries and so many accidents in a show. And it takes so many of the performers getting injured before that person is finally let go.
00:04:51
Circuspreneur Podcast
and you know, there was different things happening within these situations. Some of them are contract language that makes it difficult, but a lot of it is that the company wants to protect themselves and it doesn't look good on them if they've got to take um responsibility um for you know these accidents or liabilities of someone who is underqualified that they put in some type of position.
00:05:16
Circuspreneur Podcast
And they'll do anything to show that it wasn't necessarily their fault because that brings the lawsuits and that brings the um the legal responsibilities and that opens up the space for folks to um get compensated and to hold these spaces accountable um you know lawfully, which and I see that happening with this situation with Circus Marcus.
00:05:42
Circuspreneur Podcast
um that And this is unfortunate, right? Because this is a really... um from what I understand and from what I know, from folks that are kind of coming in and out, um an environment that is um has a good reputation in terms of of supporting children's growth and development in circus.
00:05:58
Circuspreneur Podcast
Now, again, Have I been privy to everything behind the scenes in the circus market space? No, I have not. But I still will speak on what I do know. And that's been quite a while.
00:06:11
Circuspreneur Podcast
um But intricate, intimate knowledge on a daily basis for operating? No, I don't. um I don't know if they've been having issues like this for a very long time. i do know, again, from what I've been told by folks that have been connected to it from ah for for a certain amount of time right now that people have been saying things and have been unhappy.
00:06:30
Circuspreneur Podcast
And so that that that brings me a lot of pause and cause, um or cause a consternation, I would say, because, you know, again, when you're in environments, especially specifically with children,
00:06:43
Circuspreneur Podcast
And folks have these types of concerns. And i think the thing is that I want to talk to people about and show them is that this children this situation is with children, but the situations that I'm usually talking to you about are with adults that are treated like children, right?
Impact of Anxiety and Dismissal of Safety Concerns
00:07:01
Circuspreneur Podcast
You know, people can say, oh, it's kids and kids get nervous and scared. And who knows, maybe there was so much anxiety created within this situation And the performer, you know, again, you're feeling it, you have like a heightened sense of them of of awareness that something isn't going right. And that can also make you not perform the way that you would normally perform. I'm not saying that this happened in this situation. I'm just giving you an example of people. I've seen that happen with people. They're so afraid of what they're doing that then they don't do their jobs like they know how to do them because they're so worried about the unqualified people and about the position that they've been put in. Now, from what I understand on social media, again,
00:07:39
Circuspreneur Podcast
you can find some very descriptive um posts out there um um ah and um about what happened and what they felt was the actual um the problem that led to this really tragic accident. And I'm just not going to go into all the details. So I'm just going to allow folks to, um you know, to kind of um seek that out in,
00:08:03
Circuspreneur Podcast
whatever way, shape or form that they would like to, but it's public. And so it's, again, it's, these are things that are readily available. And, um, and then the other things that I'm speaking out about are only things that I've been told by people that are directly connected to that, to this situation. uh, and so I will divulge and speak on for as much as I know.
00:08:23
Circuspreneur Podcast
um because again, i don't want to misspeak, but again, i don't, I want to come back to the and the situation and and the experiences of adults are usually the ones, excuse me, coming back and saying these things and these situations um that go wrong and um how it's it never seems to change.
00:08:50
Circuspreneur Podcast
And that, you know, you're a professional in a space and you're saying, i don't think that person's qualified. I don't like how they're doing my rigging. I don't like how they're um they're coordinating ah my act or what I'm doing. I don't feel safe with them.
00:09:07
Circuspreneur Podcast
And again, professionals who have a lot of experience are saying things like this in circus spaces, like this person is making me feel uncomfortable. like don't I don't i don't and don't want to work with this person. And it's more than one person um that is usually saying it in these environments in circus.
00:09:26
Circuspreneur Podcast
and nothing will be done. And then a tragic accident will happen. And many of the times, and I was speaking to um some some some some circus people recently about this thing as well, of like when these really bad accidents hit the media and how few details everybody gets.
00:09:45
Circuspreneur Podcast
And so it just seems like this like really big sensationalized accident that kind of came out of nowhere. And all we have to do is do these one or two things and it's going to fix it moving forward. And what we were talking about is how, you know, the public or even those of us in the industry don't usually get to hear the behind the scenes take of all the things that led to that incident.
Handling of Incidents and Exploitation Issues
00:10:07
Circuspreneur Podcast
You know, ah was that person not given enough stage time? Were they a backup? Were they a temporary replacement? Were they called at the last minute? um how long it has it been How long had it been since they'd done the show?
00:10:20
Circuspreneur Podcast
Were they new? Or were they in the show for quite some time and they'd been having disagreement with staff and they didn't feel listened to or heard and they felt like they couldn't quit the show because they really needed the job?
00:10:31
Circuspreneur Podcast
um you know Was that person, was the environment conducive to the show that day? Was it cold in there? Was it warm? Had this person been sick previously? um Had management just shifted over? Had the touring schedule just shifted? Did something on the tour happen prior to that? These are all the these are all the things that we don't normally get to hear enough of.
00:10:55
Circuspreneur Podcast
um because it's not just about like a safety concern sometimes. It's like there's so many levels and layers. Many of the times I have to say there's so many things that affect your performer in getting to the stage that we're normally asking for things to change. And they don't change and you still have to do your job anyway.
00:11:14
Circuspreneur Podcast
But again, that comes back to Do we feel heard um as participants in this industry? And I think this is a very sad lesson for um for these children that are in this environment in terms of how the parents and how everyone involved handles this situation.
00:11:36
Circuspreneur Podcast
Because the unfortunate thing is, is that this um this is not unique um as as as a career professional, a situation happening like that?
00:11:46
Circuspreneur Podcast
And do we want to prepare our youth in circus to um experience situations like this and then have them continue as if nothing is wrong or um you know, again, normalizing how this situation is going to be handled, how this situation is going to be handled is the most important thing. It also is the very important of how it's handled for Circus Marcus moving forward. And I say this to anyone that comes to me when they're in a difficult situation and they're trying to do you know I'm not going to just necessarily call it damage control, but they're like, what is our best holistic way forward?
00:12:22
Circuspreneur Podcast
And I always tell them you have several options here and um it's all about how you handle it and how you how you recoup this situation. But I also want to come back and talk about how the other disconcerting thing is in this industry is that you can handle it very, very poorly and still just...
00:12:41
Circuspreneur Podcast
Rest on your history, your past accomplishments. And people have very short memories in this industry. And you could have handled something really poorly. There was a situation that happened um just the other year. i won't go into details about it.
00:12:54
Circuspreneur Podcast
But I was told by a lot of people about what happened and how terribly they felt and how terribly the situation was handled and nothing happened. No one was reported to the authorities.
00:13:06
Circuspreneur Podcast
There was no place for them to report to. um People felt really, you know, really like not listened to. um And, and it doesn't matter.
00:13:18
Circuspreneur Podcast
i mean, it matter, it matters to me, it matters to people that is that, that remember some people's memories are not that short. But the unfortunate thing is that these people can just recoup, recover, and that people will still seek them out because they feel like an opportunity is attached to that.
00:13:33
Circuspreneur Podcast
And, you know, i was just speaking about, you know, how we chase, you know, these opportunities so strongly in the circus environment, in the entertainment industry. You know, I was speaking about how that leads to so much exploitation and abuse because we teach each other um that it's okay for these situations to continue to happen as long as someone's going to pay you or going to make you feel famous or going to make you feel important or special.
00:13:59
Circuspreneur Podcast
I'm not saying that this is about stopping doing what you're doing. You've seen me do a lot of circus for a lot of years and I still do it. even in spite of of of of of seeing so many things that i I do not agree with and I think are wrong.
00:14:14
Circuspreneur Podcast
um But that's where solutions and policy comes in. And that's why I'm advocating in the way that I'm advocating, because I don't want to just stay on the sidelines and hold it, wring my hands and say, I just don't know what to do all the time. What do we all do?
00:14:29
Circuspreneur Podcast
Like we have no power here, which is what I hear all the time. you actually do have power. you know, everyone has a lot of power. It just depends on how much you want to wield it um and how much we're all willing to take on in these in these situations.
00:14:45
Circuspreneur Podcast
And if folks are willing to report, you know, i was speaking with folks again, involved in the Circus Marcus situation. And again, I said, you know, did you guys feel like you had any other place to go to report your concerns? And they said, no.
00:14:59
Circuspreneur Podcast
We kept going to management. We kept going to the company. um That's where we should be going. Right. And it's like and that's why I have been pushing for safe art and safe circus, which would be a branch of division by the U.S. Center for Safe Sports. This is a perfect example of this. however tragic and horrific. And again, I hope that this little young performer recovers fully and continues to do circus.
00:15:22
Circuspreneur Podcast
um At first, I hope that he just has a full recovery to be just like a normal person in his life and feels good. And then I hope that if he chooses and decides to, and that feels like it's best for his life moving forward, that he can do that because he is so young.
00:15:37
Circuspreneur Podcast
He's just getting started and nobody should go through that um at any point in their career, let alone when you're just getting your wings. um as ah as ah as a little like baby aerialist.
00:15:48
Circuspreneur Podcast
But again, the parents and the folks involved, everyone and included, um feels like there was no outside entity for them to go to, to hold this company accountable.
Resistance to Safety Initiatives and Advocacy
00:16:00
Circuspreneur Podcast
And again, this comes back to policy. This is why we need an entity where you can report all kinds of misconduct and abuses especially in the youth-centered spaces, in social circuses, nonprofit circuses, after-school circus programs, circus camps, and then also folks that are taking kids from circus studios and having them go out and do shows and performances. There needs to be something like that. And I'm sorry, but the the hard part is, and I don't know if I've told this story very much on the podcast, but the woman that created the statute for the U.S. Center for Safe Sports,
00:16:39
Circuspreneur Podcast
I know her, I've been working with her now and speaking to her and getting advice from her and mentorship for quite some time now. She's been very helpful. and And she's had some ideas that we should pursue in circus that circus people and advocates did not want to pursue.
00:16:53
Circuspreneur Podcast
um You know, just to let everybody know that. And she's like just this brilliant, brilliant person um ah and for for for doing what she's done with SafeSport, you know, or in and around this work.
00:17:06
Circuspreneur Podcast
and She told me that when she was very first trying to get SafeSport introduced, Safe Sport has been around now for like, what, about like seven or eight years. But she was trying for almost 10 years prior to it getting introduced to get Safe Sport created.
00:17:20
Circuspreneur Podcast
And she said that she was going around to camps, like art camps and performance spaces and, you know, sports camps and things like that and circus camps. And she said, I went to circus camps. I went to youth circus spaces.
00:17:33
Circuspreneur Podcast
And none of them wanted to be a part of this um this this bill. They didn't support it. They thought that I was going to ruin their their they their businesses and the way that they orchestrated their camps and the way that they ran things.
00:17:49
Circuspreneur Podcast
And she's like, you know, it's it's it's really interesting for me to tell you this. She's like, because then now all these years later, you're the one pursuing safe sport to be you know something that affects the arts and circus." She's like, and I went to those people and you know and the thing is, you know something really horrific had to happen, like you know what happened within USA Gymnastics and Dr. Larry Nassar took them all 40 years to do something about it. But then when they needed a solution, who did they go to? They went to the person that had been offering the solution for like years at that point.
00:18:21
Circuspreneur Podcast
And they were desperate at that point. And they said, wow, what have you got? She's like, I've been sitting here for a long time. She's a lawyer. She's a former Olympian. And these people, nobody would listen to her.
00:18:34
Circuspreneur Podcast
wild to me. um So for me, at this point in time, I think this is a very strong call for advocacy, for folks to call your representatives and say, we support safe sport, safe sport, expanding their jurisdiction into safe art and safe circus.
00:18:53
Circuspreneur Podcast
And under that umbrella would be safe dance, safe cheer. You know, we'd like... building it out, obviously, if you've never heard me speak about um this expansion of safe sport that I've had for a very long time, um because I've worked on the amendments to the bill and to the law.
00:19:10
Circuspreneur Podcast
And I'm speaking with those people a lot. And they've told me that so many different performing arts spaces have been coming to them um for so long, and they don't have jurisdiction over them. and They say they're coming to us like you're coming to us, ah telling us about including circus in these spaces. And so It's very obvious um you know that we shouldn't, again, continue to allow these things to be that OSHA came in and investigated and then the company was fined or though the business was fined a fee and then they were able to just create some kind of solution in-house until the next accident happens or they cleared out one or two people.
00:19:51
Circuspreneur Podcast
And the system just continues on
Complacency and Lack of Accountability
00:19:53
Circuspreneur Podcast
forward. Right. And they're like, we should we, okay, we dismiss those people. um But I imagine within Smircus at this point, it's probably become a part of the culture of things happening in a certain way.
00:20:07
Circuspreneur Podcast
um And I would say this as well to the parents and the people that are maybe involved that are not as upset. That brings me pause. I've been in a lot of environments like that as a survivor of Fusey Gymnastics and around a lot of ah environments that involve children and things like that.
00:20:24
Circuspreneur Podcast
I've been around a lot of that where they're so reticent to make the situation um accountable on the level that it should be.
00:20:36
Circuspreneur Podcast
Let's minimize, let's just move forward and um get people in there that are better qualified, which I'm not saying that this needs to like decimate a model.
00:20:46
Circuspreneur Podcast
I think that they obviously need to go within and there needs to be a lot of people held accountable for this happening is not just one or two people in an environment like that, um that are making things bad, unfortunately.
00:20:57
Circuspreneur Podcast
you know, um and I, like I said, usually there's a lot of little cuts within an environment like that. And then this is just something that ends up being like a really huge symptom of a deeper problem. I'm not going to say that that's necessarily in this situation, but from my experiences at this point now of hearing the same stories over and over again in these environments um that are all very similar, i would probably say that that's Maybe what's going on here. um Again, not to demonize everybody involved because that is ah completely unfair.
00:21:35
Circuspreneur Podcast
But we should never get to this point, especially when people are being so vocal. and And I think, again, this comes back to the fact that so many of these spaces know that they're not accountable to anybody.
00:21:47
Circuspreneur Podcast
You know, i mean, if any of those parents or any of the people involved that hold these different titles, what were they going to do? I guess go to the police and say, you know, where we feel very unsafe or they go to the EEOC.
00:22:01
Circuspreneur Podcast
and they file a complaint if their child is a legitimate like employee during this this this this experience. if you know But I mean, again, that doesn't change anything in the moment.
00:22:14
Circuspreneur Podcast
It doesn't change anything necessarily in the moment of where can we report this and and get some eyes and ears on this immediately where they know that, okay,
00:22:26
Circuspreneur Podcast
oh, wow, we're going to file a report. We're going to do um one of those things. And you know, that's going to hopefully get this on record um in some way. Or the other thing that I would say with situations like this is everybody stand down.
00:22:43
Circuspreneur Podcast
Like, thank you. My child is no longer going to be participating in this environment. They're off the tour until you guys figure this out. And that is the pressure that we experience in these environments as entertainers and performers, where everyone just doesn't want the show to end. Oh, everybody spent so much money. And oh, oh God, how is this going to make everybody look? How is this going make my career look?
00:23:08
Circuspreneur Podcast
You know, even the situation I was talking about the ah the other year that happened, what what what what could have been done there is an absolute outright boycott. In that moment, no one else is performing until this is taken care of.
00:23:24
Circuspreneur Podcast
And we're all happy and we all agree on that. Just like with this situation here, if everybody was making all these complaints and things, and again, I'm not blaming anybody for continuing to pursue this. I know how it feels.
00:23:37
Circuspreneur Podcast
Believe me, I understand it. I get it. And um again, me even advocating, no amount of me advocating is sometimes seems to, you know, to get folks and even folks that are coming to me for advice and they don't take it And I think, wow, okay. Like what advice are you taking? Because I don't, I don't understand what action you're, you're, you're taking.
00:23:58
Circuspreneur Podcast
Because to me, I see a lot of inaction um in these environments.
Ensuring Children's Safety in Circus Environments
00:24:02
Circuspreneur Podcast
And then I look up and like, wow, the same exact experience is going to be happening this next time around with the same people involved. How about that? I'm sure they've got it handled. It's going to be way different.
00:24:11
Circuspreneur Podcast
Right. um And so I think we're all tired of that. um For me, what takes a turn is anything that's involving kids or children. And that's what a lot of these policies that I'm discussing are for, because they will protect a lineage of children getting into the business and supporting them. And then they will have actual rights once they step into being a professional so that those you know benefits are not just around children, but that they'll benefit you at both sides on both sides of your career as a professional and um and as someone that's an amateur that's just getting started.
00:24:45
Circuspreneur Podcast
um whichever environment you're you're you're in. It's not just about being a high functioning professional performer. But again, for me, the important thing would have been this person is highly unqualified.
00:24:56
Circuspreneur Podcast
Not one other child is going up there int until we get this solved. um If the tour is going to lose money, if we're going to lose access to things that were going on and happening, so be it, right?
00:25:10
Circuspreneur Podcast
um So be it. Maybe a disaster and a tragedy could have been avoided. um had um had that occurred. And again, this is not making anybody bad. um you know They were trying to keep up with the demands that have been placed on them.
00:25:26
Circuspreneur Podcast
And um again, we get in very tricky situations doing this kind of job because this environment is very challenging and very demanding and very hard. And sometimes at the very end, you want to trust the people in charge and know that they have your child's best interest in mind, right?
00:25:44
Circuspreneur Podcast
I mean, that's what they're there for. And so I think that, again, moving forward with radical approaches, which I don't think these are radical approaches, but it's obvious and it's been obvious to me and other folks out there that are advocating and believe in policy that we need to have better um checks and balances in place in our circus environments in all areas, whether it's labor rights, workers protections, union rights, um protections for hobbyists, you know protections for amateurs, um you know all across the board that we need to work towards these three policies.
00:26:24
Circuspreneur Podcast
The Circus Arts Category Recognition Bill, the Safe Arts Safe Circus Act, and the Circus Workers Act. You can even call it the Circus Workers Protections Act, whatever you want to call it. But those are, again, the three bills that I am currently pursuing with the Circus Arts Guilds of America.
00:26:41
Circuspreneur Podcast
And it just pains me to hear these really awful incidences where people feel so traumatized um in these circus environments.
00:26:52
Circuspreneur Podcast
And these are environments that we all want to be in. We all want things to work and go well. You know, but there are outdated models in place that need to shift and need to change.
00:27:04
Circuspreneur Podcast
And, um you know, I think that's the hard part with a lot of these these spaces. Some of these spaces have great and big names attached to them, but they're not good environments and they haven't been for a long time.
00:27:16
Circuspreneur Podcast
and they get to continue to operate because they've been around for so long. And people, the network is working. They have a lot of support. you know They're able to garner a lot of attention and a lot of support and a lot of popularity. And so people don't want to see these environments go down.
00:27:34
Circuspreneur Podcast
And some of them are just so you know not keeping up with the times. And it's unfortunate because you know, folks will still seek these environments out because of the name.
00:27:48
Circuspreneur Podcast
And again, I'm not saying this with Smirkus because like I said, I regularly tell, you know, gymnastics parents and all sorts of parents that ask me and they they really want their children to, um they want to know where to pivot them towards.
00:28:01
Circuspreneur Podcast
And, um you know, I say like obviously which um which environments, you know, there's a lot of circus camps out there. There's a lot of new circuses out there, um you know, that could, You know, obviously operate what is whatever is best for your child. I always tell them, go investigate that environment and see if that is best for your child. Don't just go blindly into anything, which I would imagine and hope that everybody understands that that's also what I'm saying. When I give recommendations or I or i say things to folks, it's also based upon upon the decisions that we make when we go into an environment and we intuitively feel what it's like for our child or for whoever we're trying to encourage into that environment or
Need for Systematic Changes in Safety Tracking
00:28:43
Circuspreneur Podcast
situation. and we're sussing it out. But we also deserve to have databases that keep track of these environments where we know about incidents that have happened. We know about small reports that have happened. We know about folks that are getting background checks.
00:28:56
Circuspreneur Podcast
We know about people that are certified. And I don't know if this rigor was a union rigor or a non-union rigor. You know, I have to say at this point, too, there's been a lot of consternation around these union riggers being, you know, um pumped out by IATSE that performers, high-level performers, have been very unhappy about and feel like they don't have, um you know, a lot of say in these union riggers being hired in shows um and that the union riggers, these are things that I've been told directly by people that are experiencing these things, by the way. So this is allegedly.
00:29:30
Circuspreneur Podcast
but they are being they're saying, allegedly, that they don't feel like they're coming out very qualified. And that's a problem. And the problem there too, is that there is no other union, the voice for an artist, that will be the union voice or be the supportive voice that negotiates against those issues.
00:29:49
Circuspreneur Podcast
It's just the private companies hiring them, bringing them on still continuously. um And so where is the voice of the folks within that that can say, hey, this is getting concerning. How many reports are we having you know in this particular situation where things are you know not going well and this type of rigor is there? Now, like I'm saying, this could have easily been a non-union rigor that also, too, didn didn't have great certification because we're not keeping track of anything like that.
00:30:19
Circuspreneur Podcast
We don't, you know, that that again, all these myths in this industry that people are so certified and so, um so highly skilled, unfortunately, that's not true. It's not true.
00:30:30
Circuspreneur Podcast
um And we don't have enough systems in place to track these things on a federal level or even on a state and local level where they are specifically, you know, um I'm talking about specifically categorized for circus arts.
00:30:45
Circuspreneur Podcast
And that means so much more than this, you know, very general, broad definition of what you think a rigor is or anything like that. I'm really, you know, for all of us that have been around for a very long time, there is so much more that goes into it than, you know, they do have this like, you know, certified title from,
00:31:01
Circuspreneur Podcast
from such and such. We need to build out better systems of regulation that increase the health and safety of our environment. So I know this was actually a pretty long episode.
00:31:12
Circuspreneur Podcast
ah lost my my microphone. Sorry, it's my new mic and it's she's having issues. So forgive me, but um she does look fabulous. she's you know She's white and gold. She matches my background.
00:31:25
Circuspreneur Podcast
But um you know I felt a lot of a lot of ways about about this incident. And, um you know, I hope that there's more conversations and discussions that move this forward and that there are more advocates run into brought into this conversation um about real solutions moving forward um instead of circus is so dangerous and should kids be doing circus and things of that nature? It's like, we we know how things can be better and be and be safe, right? Because those are kind of the standard conversations that you end up hearing. And it's like, again, it's about having children involved in circus, but in like what way, right? And again, the old systems of things, the way that they do not work. And to me, this comes back to a culture shift.
00:32:11
Circuspreneur Podcast
And I spoke about this in one of my most recent episodes on the Circus Entrepreneur podcast, about the cultural shift that needs to happen within circus. Just like we have to have, we had to have a culture shift within gymnastics, right? um And how you, how you look at things when they go wrong, how you naturally um well, it's natural to that environment. It's not natural, but how you naturally react in those environments that is not conducive to a new set of you know um even regulations that are in place. right We were discussing on one of the last episodes and I've been discussing with advocates of you put out a survey and then people lie on the survey you know and you're trying to get honest feedback from the and industry, but then people you know will just check a box and say, I'm happy, I'm happy, I'm happy, everything is great.
00:33:00
Circuspreneur Podcast
And then they're like, great. We surveyed, you know, 300 artists. And they all said they were very happy with this new thing that we were trying out. Everyone's happy. And, you know, you'll find out and talk to folks, which I know people don't like me saying this, but we have to speak honest to get these things to change.
00:33:16
Circuspreneur Podcast
And all of us can be guilty of that, I believe, where then you find yourself, um you know, not responding, you know, negatively on something because you don't want to be singled out as that person. and You know, you don't want them to put, you know, things together, um even if it's supposed to be anonymous.
00:33:32
Circuspreneur Podcast
But, and that's again, a challenge of, you know, we were discussing about how you can get social workers, you can get folks that are, you know, accessible in mental health, you can get all the trainers, but you know, if people don't feel like they can lean into those things, no one's going to sign up because they think, oh, maybe I'm going to re-report it if I sign up too much for this.
Mental Health Stigma and Insufficient Safety Changes
00:33:50
Circuspreneur Podcast
No one's going to want to go and take a leave. They're going to be afraid like, ah, and don't want to take too much leave because people are going to see me as as not doing well. um you know If I'm having ah an off day or anything like that, you don't. And that is that is that is a culture shift.
00:34:04
Circuspreneur Podcast
And that is very challenging to get outside of that groupthink and that brainwashing. And that is something very much that we need to do in these environments, you know especially when it involves children um and circus and um and the regulations that I feel we need to start implementing and we should be implementing um in and around these spaces, but it can't just be these small cherry picked solutions that you see where now, now we've put mats, but only in that company. Now that company has mats in that situation.
00:34:34
Circuspreneur Podcast
And now, oh, let's, oh, let's change that. Now we have that little cherry picked solution. um You know, that's like incremental change. And what we need is just a complete, a complete, a complete shift.
00:34:46
Circuspreneur Podcast
And, you know, for those of you that, or for those that are you know, in these spaces where you're the owner, you're the producer, you're the director, you're in this very, you know, you're the investor, you know, for me, again, it comes back to you being willing ah for these um environments to change because whoever is wielding all the power, that's how much these environments at this point in time change. And I feel like Again, those are the folks that should be in the room advocating for increased and better policies. And it shouldn't just be about what is going to be the best to protect our own business.
00:35:21
Circuspreneur Podcast
And I'm not saying that you deserve to have your business exploited. Again, I will say it's not about just going around trying to exploit all these businesses saying that they're doing all these crazy things and bad things wrong. But we're definitely saying that there needs to be a certain level of accountability and that there are outmoded ways of doing things and that you should be speaking up for those things just as strongly as the people that end up being affected and end up being the ones that get into the accidents and lose their careers or have to sue um or that are going to be the most vulnerable because they're the ones risking their lives or risking their
00:35:53
Circuspreneur Podcast
um you know risking their careers um by going out and doing something that isn't an environment where they're not being protected properly. So I hope you guys enjoyed this solo episode of the Circuspreneur podcast. I'm your host, Shanae Stiletto.
00:36:07
Circuspreneur Podcast
Thank you guys so much again for tuning in um to the podcast. Please like and subscribe and comment. um you know, again, and as always, send me your thoughts about the episode and send me your thoughts about local and, you know, current international um circus events.
00:36:24
Circuspreneur Podcast
um And this is, again, how I learn and how I make conscious choice and decision about what I share. And, um you know, again, preserving anybody's anonymity.
00:36:37
Circuspreneur Podcast
You see, I always try to you know, preserve people's anonymity as much as
Preserving Anonymity in Incident Reporting
00:36:42
Circuspreneur Podcast
possible. i only sometimes give like certain little titles just so that people understand maybe whose almost voice it is. But even if in in that situation, um it would seem too close and you would feel too vulnerable. I get that.
00:36:54
Circuspreneur Podcast
um No one wants their, their, their, themselves or their child or or their jobs or anything like that to be negatively affected because they needed to share something that was honest about a situation because they hopefully, and I think that everybody's coming from a good place, want to help and make sure that these situations never happen again.
00:37:16
Circuspreneur Podcast
and I think, again, coming back to if we want these situations to never happen again, we need to move very differently um on a state, local, and federal level for the circus arts in America and abroad and beyond, everywhere in circus.