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Mercy Komar - The Cyber Diva
123 Plays1 year ago
In this episode, we chat with Mercy Komar, an insurance veteran with over 50 years of experience who's earned the nickname "The Cyber Diva" for her cyber insurance expertise. Mercy shares how she first got into the industry right out of high school as a claims clerk, facing challenges as one of the only young women in her office at the time. She recounts her journey into cyber insurance, selling her first policy in 2017, and becoming one of the first 100 people globally to earn the Cyber Insurance Academy certification.
Mercy provides advice for attracting more young talent into the insurance industry, emphasizing the importance of mentors and showing the lucrative opportunities available. We discuss the value of women in sales roles and how the industry is changing with hungry, tech-savvy agents. Mercy also shares tips on how she convinces skeptical clients about the need for cyber coverage, focusing first on selling crime insurance and telling local business' stories. She gives practical advice for new agents on learning cyber insurance and stresses keeping explanations simple rather than overwhelming clients with too much technical jargon.
Overall, it's a fascinating conversation with a leading expert on how the insurance industry is evolving in the digital age and what the future looks like for cyber insurance careers. Tune in to hear Mercy's wit and wisdom!
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Transcript
Confession of a Recording Mishap
00:00:15
Speaker
I got to confess that we just heard like two really amazing stories. It was awesome. It was perfect. And we decided to try new software this time and didn't hit record. Now your name is going to be Ace as punishment. It is Ace.
00:00:43
Speaker
So I don't think, I don't think we'll be able to replicate it, but it's live. It was live. See that it was, it was live. Yeah. Um, we'll probably not be able to replicate it, but we'll give it a shot.
Introducing Mercy: The Unique Content Creator in Insurance
00:00:57
Speaker
Uh,
00:00:59
Speaker
Just so that everybody knows who you are, Mercy, Andrew Correll put you on my radar. And I always thought, man, how did I not know who Mercy was after I saw all your content? Because I love it, and I look forward to when you post. And I want you to post more, because there's a lot of really nerdy stuff on my feed. And then just stuff that's just, I don't know why people are posting that kind of stuff. And yours is like a little bright spot on the feed.
00:01:28
Speaker
But just kind of tell everybody who you are, your story, how you got into insurance. I know you've already told this. So you've got, you've gotten a practice rep. So this time should be
Mercy's Journey into Insurance
00:01:36
Speaker
perfect. Yeah.
00:01:37
Speaker
Well, I got in right out of high school. I've been in it since the three years, starting in August, and I just started as a death claim clerk at Prudential. Somebody comes in with a $250 policy that their grandparents passed away. In 1971, there was still a lot of those out of there, and I was the one who got to write the checks.
00:02:00
Speaker
And I was in an office with 40 men and naive as could be. I thought married men only hit on 18 year old girls on general hospital, you know, but that was happening on a daily basis. So the office manager called me in one day and she said, I got two rules for you.
00:02:20
Speaker
So the first one is, you don't shit where you meet. Do you understand that, mother wet? Yeah, I think so. And she said, second rule, let's just do you buy a shawl. And I went, what the heck is that about? So anyway, I went through the rest of my insurance life. And yes, I did not mess with the property and casualty agencies. I never dated with the PNC industry.
00:02:41
Speaker
Uh, the life industry, uh, Halston, Gilly Dallian, but we're not going to make these things. Let's, let's just say they're a vice presidents in New York city that don't want to, don't want to see me on LinkedIn. But yeah, I, um, had a long.
00:03:01
Speaker
Many years in the industry I bought into an agency and over the years I've done all the jobs there are except for accounting and I bought agencies and sold agencies and we sold to a bank, which was unfortunate and the bank didn't do well and sold to a national brokerage. Then you know what they do, they just come in and basically consolidate everything.
00:03:25
Speaker
Walked in one morning and said, you're out of here. And I said, fine.
Learning Cyber Insurance: Seminars & Courses
00:03:28
Speaker
And I knew the guys here at El Calvin Jones and walked in the door and they said, take it off us. And, you know, basically went back, started some scratch over again, like you've done eight and, uh, just said, okay, here we go. Luckily I had enough money in the bank and everything. It didn't bother me at all. Cause I'm a hundred percent commission.
00:03:48
Speaker
And one day, it must have been about seven years ago, I'd go out and do some call calling. And there was a woman who had a tour dye shop. And she said, I have a problem. The company won't pay my claim. And I didn't know much about cyber. I'd heard about it, taken some classes.
00:04:09
Speaker
But I didn't really know anything about it. And I said, well, let me check. Well, turns out, unfortunately, the story was that they were doing work through the Department of Defense, through Caterpillar and they got shut down and they lost their business because they had an addicted daughter and she sold the passwords, which happens now and is happening more and more, by the way. I think if you've looked lately on a lot of the posts on LinkedIn and some of the webinars are talking more about how much, how, uh,
00:04:38
Speaker
Many clubs are used for internal security. In fact, I'm writing an article for the PIA of Indiana about of October. And that's what it was. It was internal security. It had nothing to do with anybody from the outside. So they lost their business. But in the meantime, I'm starting to learn about cyber and the bosses saying, good, you do seminars. You teach everybody.
00:04:59
Speaker
And that is kind of interesting because I didn't know anything myself. So I took some portions and asked me about CYRM when we were online one day, and I told them how to access that. And then I took MLIS and then the Cyber Academy, Insurance Academy, which is fabulous stuff. And there's a couple more out there. Chubb has a great one through Carnegie Knowing.
00:05:22
Speaker
If you've got time and the money to do that, well then there's another one through the RPOU. Yeah, you could take two. So there are a lot of people out there getting some designations now and getting some good strong background, but it's tough. So Ryan and I, you know, we've been doing this a little while and it still comes down to convincing people that they need the coverage.
00:05:46
Speaker
Although that's getting a little bit easier, but with the pricing and all the different changes, I got one today, literally it says, you know, here's our conditional renewal and we're telling you right now your premium's going up 100%.
Challenges in the Insurance Market
00:06:05
Speaker
Those are always fun to draw towards desk. Yeah. So we're going to drop that one next week. Yeah. July 4th. Yeah. Well, let me get some rest first before I call them. Funny thing was I was just there this week because it comes up September 4th. So I just got out on the rest of the Renault and we know it's going up on the rest of the Renault too. So it's just.
00:06:29
Speaker
What are those things that we have to deal with? And that's what you're going to deal with, you know, with the hard market. This is my, I think my fourth hard market, at least my third hard market over the years. And basically it all ends up the same. You've got to work with the clients and talk to them and make them understand what's happening. And it's not easy.
00:06:52
Speaker
But you got to be honest with them and say, here's what it is. And this is why it is what it is. And guess what? You're reading about Florida. You're reading about State Farm in California. This isn't going to get any better for anybody. And I think we're about to see more of them go down lawyer. And I heard this week travelers. Really?
00:07:13
Speaker
I heard choppers may shut down for personal lines. No way. You hear, uh, Chubb is, yeah. I mean, Chubb is starting to pull out of Florida. Like you can't get Chubb personal lines in Florida. I, you know, I speak to personal lines agents in Florida a lot and, um, you know, he's this, you know, this agent is scrambling, scrambling because there's nobody that will write anything. I mean, there's,
00:07:38
Speaker
Pure tried, pure tried, and then now they're completely out. Um, and so it's like, you just have citizens. Well, you know, people are talking about the premiums up here being so high. Yeah. The lawn, this is not high. Um, but.
00:07:58
Speaker
It's all perspective. It's all in your perspective.
Educating New Agents in Cyber Insurance
00:08:00
Speaker
Mercy, I thought you brought up a good point about the education piece. You know, I always get, especially young agents that are just getting into the mix. I mean, you know, young as in they're green, like they're just getting into insurance. And they're always asking me like, Ryan, like, where can I go to learn
00:08:22
Speaker
insurance, like where can I go to learn how to sell it? And, you know, frankly, when I asked those questions, the insurance guys that were teaching me were like, well, you just got to sell and you just got to learn by fire, which has to a degree has a thing. But, you know, what would you, uh, what would you suggest to anybody green out there?
00:08:43
Speaker
that is trying to learn about cyber insurance because it is starting to become a leading coverage for a lot of businesses and it started to be coverage that new agents might get into. Where would you suggest they go to start gaining knowledge on learning how to sell it? You know what, first of all,
00:09:05
Speaker
you're going to have to turn to some of your companies. First of all, if I'm going to, I, I tell people pick four. Okay. Don't try and deal with every insurance company in the world for cyber. You can't pick four. Um, and if you've got four, get their brochures, get all their information and get their webinars that they want you to go to for their product. Cause you do want to know their product. But I think what I took that the cyber academy, the cyber insurance academy course,
00:09:35
Speaker
because it taught me securities information that I didn't know before and that I didn't understand. I think that was really worthwhile to me. I think it was hard. It was very hard for me. It takes
Recommended Learning Resources for Cyber Insurance
00:09:49
Speaker
a good 60 hours to pass it. Amazing, easy 60 hours because parts of it are writing to them.
00:09:57
Speaker
And giving them, they'll give you an assignment and tell you that say, this is so-and-so, and this is what he does. It's like going back to high school, you know? Oh, yeah. And describe to us the following steps that he has taken. And I'm going, whoa.
00:10:14
Speaker
This is tough. I'm, I'm 69 years old. I have some seven, one renewals that are looking a little more appetizing right now, but it's, it's really good. Very good. And the MLIS was very good because it's, um, it's kind of open book. Um, and maybe take, you check tests on it, but it's all open book, but it gives you some good basics too. So that you have a, let's do it army.
00:10:44
Speaker
have a good insight. Now I'm a CIC and I started CIC back in the day and I've always taken their upgrades and their ruble classes and their ruble classes they have several that are concentrates on cyber and there are some great people that have some really good cyber knowledge that
00:11:07
Speaker
get into the weeds, really into the weeds, like the, oh, there's one, what we were talking about information technology versus operational technology.
00:11:20
Speaker
in factories and things like that. So yeah, you can get into some more good reads with some of these people that really have knowledge. So it's a lot of fun. I like it. I liked the fact that I got into it when nobody else knew anything about it. And I think you just keep reading everything you can read and keep an update. I have literally bindums
00:11:47
Speaker
Stuff comes in every day. I print it out and they stick it in a binder marked cyber. And I've got four cyber binders right now. And then it's things to get old, throw out the old stuff and say, now I don't know why anymore. That was two years ago. Nope. Those figures aren't any good anymore. So it's wild. When did you sell your first cyber policy in that story? 2017.
00:12:12
Speaker
2017. And that was one, it was great American and they only had five coverages. There wasn't, yeah, I mean, it was just, it was strep, there was nothing on it. Mercy, I got to do a check, but I think I might've beaten you on this. I got a check. Really? No, I sold AIG cyber policy, it was like 250 bucks, five questions long, but I got, it might've been 2017, but I got a check.
00:12:38
Speaker
Okay. Yeah. I promise you, I had no idea what I was selling, but it was, I'm sure I did lower. I mean, all I knew was, Hey, there's some liability coverage. Jason can case something gets loose. Why am I? I mean, that's only what we do about, um, if, if my information gets loose on somebody who's going to get ticked, you know, we didn't care about first party anything. Yeah. Nobody knew about that. Nobody cared about that. No.
00:13:08
Speaker
It's all in the crime section. Everybody wants the crime coverage. That's fine with me because that's the easiest thing to sell is the crime coverage. Oh yeah. I talked to a guy, it was last week, he's a broker out in London and he told me that he sold his first cyber policy in 98.
00:13:33
Speaker
What? He said it wasn't the first, but it was like top 100 first policies ever sold. He should get a plaque for that. He should get a plaque for that. He should sell land in the Everglades or something like that too.
00:13:55
Speaker
It's expanding all the time and changing. And you know, Ryan, we started with that CMMC stuff. Yeah. And that's all. That's all. Who knows what's happening. What is going on with that? Because I was talking to an agency
00:14:12
Speaker
the other day and we do compliance work and so we've done a few CMMC compliance frameworks in the past and help companies become CMMC compliant. And I was talking to an agency and they were like, have you made anybody CMMC compliant? I said, yes. And they started laughing at me. And they're like, no, you haven't. And so I don't know if you can provide color to that, but I don't know what's going on with that.
00:14:39
Speaker
They've changed everything again from what I understand. I just spoke with somebody a couple of weeks ago and he said it's just like up in the air. They just keep changing everything all the time and nobody really knows. They had a man email me the day I spoke at a
00:14:57
Speaker
webinars for the National Institute of Student Detailers last week, and the man sent me an email today and he's from Portland, Oregon, and he said, I'm trying to get ready for the Department of Defense. Who can you refer me to? I'm going, I don't even know what the last one's for anymore.
00:15:13
Speaker
Yeah. They don't even know if we're asking anymore. Yeah. I think that's it. I think that's what the whole problem is. They just don't know how to defend themselves and they don't know what to do. So I think you just keep some of them side for insurance. Cross our fingers. Just put them side for insurance. Don't worry about it. Yours is a cobbler's money. Okay. Just buy it all. Yeah. Just take 10 million. It's got to be plenty.
00:15:44
Speaker
out. Oh dear. But it is good. I'm glad that you did ACE here is getting into the business and then he's getting into the podcasting. That's me. When are you going to start yours? And I said, I'm just, I just haven't done it yet on, on, but I've got an idea for one. And, uh, I actually got a website set up
00:16:08
Speaker
But I haven't gone ahead and done it yet because I just been too busy. And yeah, but I've got all kinds of people listed with, I want to have one. So you guys are on my list now. So let's go. I tend to do things. Cause I, I.
00:16:23
Speaker
I tend to just, I have to tell myself to do it or I'm just going to overthink it. And then when I do it, people are like, well, well shoot, if Abe can do it, then surely I can. So I'm sure there'll be a lot of podcasts that start after this. Yeah, that's right. I saw Abe's podcast and he can do that. You know, that's actually an interesting thing just about life in general. You know, there's so many things that you want to do, like just constantly week after week and
00:16:52
Speaker
Sometimes like there's just like the one, two, one or two things that you've always wanted to create and you're like, Oh, I've always wanted to build that, or I always wanted to make that happen. But, you know, I don't want, I don't know exactly what I'm doing. I don't have a clear picture. And sometimes the best thing to do is just start, just start going. Yeah. Just walk. Just start at it and see what happens. I love the phrase, just walk, like just go. Yeah. Just walk. Um, a,
00:17:22
Speaker
I never used to say that I wished I was younger, but to tell you the truth, now with the LinkedIn and with cyber and things and the way we can sell insurance now, I wish I was your anxious because it is, seriously, it is so, so, I don't want to say it's easier, it's never been easy, but it is so much more,
00:17:50
Speaker
There's so much more available to you and so many more people that are willing to help. When I was young, there was no help. There was a young female in the insurance industry that I'm sure there wasn't a lot of people. Oh, there wasn't anyone to talk to. The first person I ever heard that did a was Roger Sitkins.
00:18:11
Speaker
And Roger's fairly old now. So Roger was giving advice and things he was selling to independent agents back then. But there were no women in my area. There was one woman and his husband had died in left-own agency. But other than that, there were no women who were in the business. And I just kind of stepped out from a clerical position and said, I can afford
00:18:35
Speaker
At that point in time, I could afford to go 100% commission. And a gentleman saw me and said, at 100% commission, you know, go sell something. I have nothing to lose. And that's how I started, just throwing myself out at it. And I had enough knowledge from being a CSR.
00:18:58
Speaker
Okay. But I had technology behind me. I am not a good salesperson. I am a horrible salesperson. If you sit me down next to Ryan and put the
Women's Role in Insurance
00:19:08
Speaker
two of us against each other, he can out stall me any day of the week. I don't know. My advantage is up a cute little old lady and people trust me more than they'll trust him. They'll trust you way more than they'll trust me. They're, they're going to look at me and talk and they're like, there's something off about this guy.
00:19:26
Speaker
That sounds too good. Being serious now, women have a great advantage over men. I was just about to say that. They do. And they don't take that advantage in sales because they are more trusted, especially in insurance and financial services. People will trust a woman first.
00:19:48
Speaker
I always, I've had that opinion for I would say like four years now because I saw a man and woman tandem selling insurance and they were crushing it like absolutely. And I felt the silver roll. It was the female in the mix. The guy was just along for the ride almost.
00:20:10
Speaker
And I've still firmly, firmly believe in it. I think women, shout out to all the women out there that could potentially be listening to this because you should be getting in some type of client facing role in insurance who will absolutely dominate.
00:20:26
Speaker
Absolutely. Women have controlled the insurance industry for years. They just haven't made money from it. And one of the wisest men I ever knew was Peter Lewis from Progressive Insurance. Peter's been dead a while now. But Peter recognized that to sell insurance
00:20:49
Speaker
The agency owners weren't selling substandard auto. It was the woman sitting in the offices that sold substandard auto. So Peter would go out and find himself the handsomest sealed men he could possibly find. And he put them in the most gorgeous seats. And one of the most progressive men came in the front door. There was business being given to them left and right. Now, is that sexist? Yes, it is. OK. But that was reality. And Peter understood it.
00:21:18
Speaker
OK, that's how he bought progressives. And when the insurance women in Cleveland would have a party or any kind of a meeting, Peter would say, what do you need? He bought the currency. So Peter needs for everything because he knew that is what built progressive insurance.
00:21:37
Speaker
I mean, do you take what's being dealt to you and at that's your hand, you use it. And he did me did a beautiful job of it and built a beautiful insurance company now run by a woman. So that just goes to show you.
00:21:51
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, now that we're on the topic of women in the industry, I mean, I know we mentioned Lacey Rex earlier. So you and Lacey are two influential women in the cyber insurance world and insurance world in general, but cyber insurance specifically. Do you know of any other women out there that are making- Oh, there's a lot of women in cyber insurance. I spent about an hour on the phone with
00:22:22
Speaker
Margaret Hyenas, who is the head of Beasley's underwriting cyber in the United States. Nice lady, Judy Selby of the Kennedys.
00:22:33
Speaker
who is doing a lot of work in cyber. There are dozens of women, I can give you names off that you can contact, that really are walking cyber because they've dug into it. And they know that it's a topic that they can
00:22:52
Speaker
sink their teeth into that not everybody's into either. Yeah, I know two just came to mind. Emily Short and Emily Silk, Emily Squared at Baldwin vs. Partners. I call them Emily Squared, but they're making some big movement over there. Yeah, there's a lot of them out there. There are. Now that we're thinking about it, it is true. That's pretty fascinating.
00:23:19
Speaker
You'll see what we ought to do is get 120 of us together, form six insurance agencies. We'd blow you guys out of the water. We take over the world. Yeah. Unfortunately, you're probably right, but I'm a competitive guy in nature. And so, you know, you would take that challenge. You wouldn't choose.
00:23:44
Speaker
There we go, the guy is our guys. We got any guys that work there. Yeah, we got two. In the back office. Oh, it's a lot of fun. You guys are having a good time though, aren't you? I mean, ain't, ain't, isn't this a good business for you?
00:24:08
Speaker
I absolutely love it and there's been so many like awesome people in this kind of niche and everybody seems to be very like what you said very just eager to help
00:24:25
Speaker
And I think there's something kind of unique about cyber because so many agents have been slow to adopt it. And when I have calls with agents all the time, I'm having to show them like, hey, you need to be presenting proposals to every single one of your clients. And I think that because people are so interested in it,
00:24:49
Speaker
but still haven't necessarily adopted it. There's also a lot of content getting put out. And I think, you know, just, I feel very fortunate and blessed that people, because I didn't necessarily start in cyber insurance, I kind of started, honestly, as SaaS companies on the independent agency channel. And I just feel fortunate I got pushed into cyber or directed that way, because
00:25:16
Speaker
You know, I look at people right now, especially like with the hard market, uh, just for other lines right now and people telling me, you know, it is just the hardest market that they've seen in their entire career. I, you know, and we'll have that in cyber, but, um, just overall, I just feel blessed to be, to be, you know, in, in this, this niche. Yeah. Um, I, you know, we have entered somewhat of a soft market in cyber, but.
00:25:43
Speaker
Um, I, I would, to piggyback off of that, I think cyber insurance is, I mean, insurance business in general is exciting. I, you know, people always mercy. This might be similar to your story or not, but you know, um, people always, when you talk to, um, you go to a bar or wherever you're at a gathering in some manner and they're like, Oh, what do you do? And you say, Oh, well, I'm an insurance agent or, you know, somehow insurance comes out or cybersecurity comes out and people were like, uh, next topic.
00:26:13
Speaker
I get, but frankly, but Frank, you know, if you are in the business, it's like opening up the hood of a car. Like you just get enamored by the intricacies of it. And, uh, there's so many different ways you can go and specialize in niche, right? Absolutely. There is. Once you get into the business, if we can get people into the business and that's, that's what my podcast is going to be called. It's going to be insurance in section.
00:26:38
Speaker
Yes, it is. And we have to convince people that it's so relevant. And honestly, you can make a fortune in this business if you do it right and you treat people well. Because people are looking for someone to trust. I think we've lost a lot of that in this world. And people are looking for someone they can trust and turn to and say,
00:27:08
Speaker
Help me. And people will also turn to you and ask you about things you know nothing about and say, look, I've got them free away from me for that. I don't know anything about investments. Let me send you to somebody else for investments. I'll deal with your insurance. I'll send you to somebody else for that.
00:27:26
Speaker
Because they need somebody that they can trust. And if you can come into the business, and I think the independent agency system is a way to do it. Yes. If we can break that system open door and get them to teach people correctly and get them to gear.
00:27:43
Speaker
new agents because they don't always, they use the old metropolitan method. Here, come in kids, here's your phone book, write a bunch of your friends and if you don't make it too bad, okay, you can't do that anymore to people. They want a life, okay, they want a good solid living and if you give them the opportunity and you hire the right people,
00:28:07
Speaker
they can make a good living and be happy and do a good job. And we need more of those kind of people. And they're out there. It's just finding money and bringing them in. How do you suggest that we do that? Because I've been thinking about that a lot recently. I feel like I'm definitely, as somebody who would probably be a little bit younger, I've
00:28:31
Speaker
It was honestly pure accident. And that's kind of everybody's story that I talked to, except for a few like random people that went to college for risk management and insurance. And I'm like, Oh, exactly. Yeah. How do, how do we, how do we attract people and cut through the noise? Cause it seems like you really have to get them in, in like this, these pivotal years when they're somewhat younger before they kind of get entrenched in their own career.
00:28:59
Speaker
I think LinkedIn is a good way of helping us do that. I really think that we should be able to use that more. It's hard to, you need to have the young people sit down with other people your age like the two of you and say, here, this is an example of somebody who's doing well and how they did it. And this is an example to swallow, okay?
00:29:28
Speaker
you know you there are so many people in our industry making fabulous amounts of money and having a good life and they're happy and they're helping other people and if you can show people that it and it's them okay it's got to be them it's just like anything else
00:29:48
Speaker
I couldn't sell cars unless it was Mercedes. I can sell Mercedes. Okay. But ask me to sell a Ford and I could never do it. I'd say, nah, that's not me. You don't want this car. That would be me. Mercedes dealer. Yeah. So that's what we have to do. We just got to find the right people and we've got to make them understand what a wonderful business it is. I mean, that's a wonderful business. How would I have ever met the two of you? I know. Right.
00:30:19
Speaker
I mean, seriously, I have met people in the last year in India, England, Germany, over in the Middle East, people I'd have never thought of meeting before with LinkedIn and in the insurance industry in cyber and talking back and forth and people saying, can you talk to this one about this? Yeah, I can.
00:30:42
Speaker
You know, and it doesn't always involve them making money. That's the other thing. We don't do this just to make money. Okay. I don't, I, I teach, I teach a lot and I do it because we have to have somebody coming behind this. I need somebody behind me.
00:31:01
Speaker
It's going to take over all these accounts trying to find somebody. That's hard. They sit back and get me. What are you doing? No, no, that's not for me. Okay. So it just signing the right ones. It's hard.
00:31:19
Speaker
Yeah, I think, you know, it kind of falls on each and every one of us to kind of change the perspective of what the industry looks like, right? I feel like, you know, I've had this conversation a lot frequently with people about
00:31:35
Speaker
Um, someone I've, I've sensed or feel like I've sensed a change of guard in the industry, especially around the cyber world. You know, I'm speaking to a lot of, um, people that are starting up new agencies that are cyber related first, and then they're going to expand out to other lines. And they're a completely different, uh, agent than what people would assume as like your typical, like, Hey, I'm going to work.
00:32:00
Speaker
You know, three days a week, play golf, you know, sit back on my laurels, right? Like that's, I feel like that's people's perspective of an agent. These agents are hungry. Like they want knowledge. They want to learn. They're like, I am trying to solve a really intrinsic problem for my potential customers and current customers.
00:32:22
Speaker
And it's like they're all hands on deck type of people. And so I definitely sense a change in the dynamics of the industry, but now it takes us to be like, okay, to the younger generations. This is what it looks like. It's not, you know, you're not sitting back and.
00:32:38
Speaker
Uh, just listen, it isn't golfing. Yeah. It's not, it's not the golfing. And if it is golfing and let me tell you something, that's where you make your money is going after the clients while they're out golfing. Yeah. That's true. Seriously. So if there's plenty of opportunities out there and there's opportunities to start new agencies, there's opportunities and you know, people don't like cyber.
00:33:03
Speaker
But there's plenty other things out there. Look at the gentleman, Chris, that's the flood dealer. Who thought anybody would make a living out of selling flood insurance? Never would have thought something like that, but it's there and it's necessary.
00:33:19
Speaker
That's one thing that I always think about too. And one thing that's really unique about this industry is that there is a niche for almost anything that you're passionate about. And if you have a passion about something, there's something in insurance for you that you could probably make a fantastic career out of.
Mercy's Teaching Experiences
00:33:37
Speaker
Tell me more about the teaching that you do. Who are you teaching with and what are some of the courses that you're teaching? I teach for the, I have been teaching CISR, the certified insurance service work for several years for the National Academy. I'm going to start teaching commercial lines multiple day two, which is crime, cyber, and umbrella.
00:34:03
Speaker
starting next year. So I'll be teaching that. That is intense course. It's intense. Well, and then I've done some individual cyber courses. I've got a one hour personal soccer, which by the way, that's another big market.
00:34:21
Speaker
all of these personal lines client agents that are out there that are in the insurance pups as I call them okay they're pushing with they sell insurance for you know personal lines write the cyber for personal lines for heaven's sake oh my god oh my word on every homeowner's policy tack it on um
00:34:41
Speaker
Yeah, I've been doing a lot of that. I teach for the Greater Cincinnati Insurance Bureau. I've written a couple classes myself. They file them, and then I teach them. So it's just something I started doing years ago. I should have started a lot earlier. I was a little lax again. And in fact, I never even wanted to teach CIC. And I got a call last year.
00:35:08
Speaker
Jay Williams from the National Alliance called me and said, why aren't you teaching CIC? So when nobody ever asked me, he says, you're teaching CIC. I said, oh, she. So they'd be training me and they're tough.
00:35:24
Speaker
I can't, I'm used to doing things kind of on the fly like this when I teach. I can't do that in CS. So it's a little tough. Those are long days. Long days. Aren't we taking some of the courses already?
00:35:43
Speaker
I have, I need, I need to finish up. When you, when you start, when you start a new business, it, it kind of got pushed to the back burner, but it also, it also.
00:35:58
Speaker
You know, I'd gotten past some of the... I'd gotten past commercial casualty, commercial multi-line, and I was starting to get into commercial property, I believe was the next one that was scheduled to take, and I was not looking forward to that. For some reason, property is like the bane of my existence. I just... I can't wrap my head around it. Auto is that for me.
00:36:23
Speaker
auto is just like, especially when I got my agency license, I like knew I was going to fail the auto section, so I just focused on everything.
00:36:35
Speaker
commercial auto, I don't like the way they teach it. Okay. But that's, that's, yeah, it's, it's, it's not that hard. Sometimes we make things harder than they are because we want to put the hours in. Okay. I just coached a woman today. She's taking her state licensing course.
00:36:53
Speaker
To pay a sustained license in course, you've got to put in 40 hours. You alone junk till 40 hours, you'll never use again about aviation and ocean marine. If you're sitting in Ohio, the chances that you like aviation and ocean marine are like this much, okay?
00:37:10
Speaker
And workers call, we don't sell workers. They do a whole 30 questions on it. And she's looking at me like, what do I do? And I said, well, get all the same stuff, get the workers call up. Here's the way it usually breaks out. But yeah, it's too much. You've got to have the time. Yeah, do it the easy way. Teach people the simple way. Stop making it so hard. But we got to do it too hard to learn. You know, yeah.
00:37:39
Speaker
Now, and it gives me a ton of respect for people like it, like, like you, for example, I, I see the letters behind your name and I'm like, holy crap. She went through, she went through a lot to get those. Like it's not easy. It's not like a purple heart. I see took five years. Well, um,
00:38:03
Speaker
And, you know, back when I took it, it was 92 to 97. It was probably 150 people in Iran, 20 of which were women. By the time I got to 97, the room was about half a million. And now you take those classes and it's more women than men because a lot of the staff people now are beginning to realize that that's a good course. It's a good solid course for everybody to take.
00:38:32
Speaker
that they should have it. And I wish the national brokers would push it, but they will not. The national brokers don't really, the national brokers want to teach their culture to the employees rather than teach them a rounded
00:38:57
Speaker
version of insurance, I guess is what I want to say. And if you've ever worked for a national broker, you understand what I'm talking about.
00:39:06
Speaker
Yeah, there it's different there. So, but it's the MLIS, I mean, the last three did not take me too long. They were lots too difficult, except for the cyber academy. And I love those guys over there. Boy, that stuff. But that makes it worth it, right? Like you are one of the few that's been able to.
00:39:29
Speaker
I was one of the first 100 in the world that had that. It took them a while to get their first 100, but now that people have seen that course, they're really starting to pick up a lot of people getting trained on it. That's good. I think we're getting enough cyber people now, so let's just keep this quiet amongst us.
00:39:54
Speaker
Let's start this now. It's actually not that great of an industry. You don't want to worry about cyber. You don't want to get involved in cyber. Go sell property in Florida. Go sell property in Florida. Enjoy.
00:40:20
Speaker
Yeah, awesome.
Overcoming Objections to Cyber Insurance
00:40:22
Speaker
Well, just kind of wrapping up here, and I love podcast episodes like these where we're just, you know, talking shop and getting to know you a little bit better. What are some of the things that, you know, as, and I want to be able to point, you know, the agents that I'm talking to on a daily basis, point them to this, you know, what are some of the ways that you're able to, when you're having conversations with,
00:40:50
Speaker
maybe blue collar industries or just business owners that they're just like, cyber insurance is not relevant to me, or maybe they're price sensitive to cyber. What are some of the conversations that you're having and how are you kind of overcoming those objections to get people to see the value in it?
00:41:12
Speaker
Most of the people nowadays, and I think wine will tell you the same, it's not that people don't see the value in it anymore.
00:41:20
Speaker
Five years ago, they were like, nah, it's not gonna happen to me. They understand it morning, okay? They understand that it can happen. The best thing you can do is get your existing clients to let you tell their stories. And if it's somebody, you know, if it's local people, use their names. You know, you know so-and-so Smith that owns such-and-such company, call him and ask him what happened.
00:41:51
Speaker
because, and if they'll give you permission to do that, most of them will.
00:41:55
Speaker
then you can say, look, your buddy so-and-so has already had this problem. And it's usually the claim end, it's usually the crime end that you can sell it with. Business email compromise, they got in the door and there's fraud going on. I have handled more fraud. In fact, I've never had any ransom. All of my claims have been fraud. Funds transfer fraud, social engineering, no ransom claims.
00:42:24
Speaker
I'm in Northeast Ohio. It's small industries. It's SMBs, really small industries. They're not going to ransom them. They just want to end the door, grab some money, and run. And that's what they're doing big time. So sell the crime portion of it. And then explain the rest later. I don't go in and try and do the national worker routine of, hey, look at us. We're wonderful. Look at all the 15 coverages we're going to give you here.
00:42:54
Speaker
and try and some people get overwhelmed you know if you know if it's it's existing clients a reason okay you could basically just pull up pull them up and say look you know so and so well let's nip this in the bud right now yeah it's gonna cost you $3,500 but i'm sorry you need this okay if it's not an existing client you still you start with the client section
00:43:18
Speaker
and explain to them what's happening in the crime and sell it that way. Then when you go back out with the policy, go also all the advantages. You sell the crime and you sell the breach response. That's how I do it. Crime and breach response.
00:43:35
Speaker
And don't try and get too fancy. The less fancy you get and don't use fancy names. Don't, you know, what makes me crazy? All the names they call everything. Oh my goodness. I think that's really good advice. Keep it simple, stupid. That's the best way to do it. And then if they want, they're going to take it. And if they don't want it, they will. Okay. Just keep them.
00:44:03
Speaker
keep reminding them about it and eventually something's going to happen. I mean, I'm sitting teaching a six hour sober course in Cincinnati and I come home with a letter from my dermatologist saying, they got all your health information.
00:44:21
Speaker
Back in August, one of our desk people, a Felfshard email scam, a phishing scam, and they got into our system and ran it for six months before we knew it. Now, I've got this here, but yeah, they got all my health information. They told me that, okay?
00:44:38
Speaker
and
00:45:04
Speaker
So they needed that cyber coverage. But that's my story and I'm sticking to it.
00:45:12
Speaker
The Cyber Devote. The Cyber Devote. I'm going to point people to that little snippet right there.
Future Podcast Collaborations
00:45:21
Speaker
I'll take it out of the podcast and save it because I think that is the key. And I've told people this too, similar things. I deal more nationally, so sometimes it's hard to get local stories, but if it's local, it's even more powerful.
00:45:40
Speaker
But yeah, just, just telling them about what's happening to other people. And it's that cyber crime. That's the key that I think everybody can, can, can understand and grab that concept compared to some of the other things like ransomware and data. Yeah. They understand their checkbook and they understand their bank account. Okay. And if you tell them people can get in your bank account, that's all they need to know. Okay. That's, that's important to them. So. Yep.
00:46:09
Speaker
Awesome. Well, I would, I would love to do this again another time. Um, cause I think we, we all gel pretty well and are cut from the same cloth. So, um, just appreciate you coming on and chatting with us and looking forward to getting this out there so that more people know more about mercy, the cyber diva. And yeah, thanks for coming on.
00:46:30
Speaker
And we can, and we can do this again and we'll have to talk about bringing people into the industry. Yes. Let's think, let's think about that and do another one strictly on that and make up some, some, um, some ideas and things. So how to get people in and, uh, tell them insurance is sexy and it is sexy. Yeah. Let's do that for your show. That would be great. Okay. Awesome. Thanks much for having me on. Thanks guys. Thanks Marcy.