Transcript
Speaker: It's not four pages of notes over here. I love it. It is. I was writing out what was happening as I was watching, if that makes sense, and so I've just highlighted a couple things. That's good, because I honestly, I've seen it so many times, but I still get the plot.
Speaker: What's up? Ghosts and Ghouls. It's MoG and Kitty. We will be talking about Nosferatu and yes, Nosferatu is an amazing film. Is my standpoint. Would you agree?
Speaker: Yeah, I would agree. Good. So we're going into this positive. We're on agreement. Good. As much as I love and I don't... I want the drama. As much as I don't want to fight with you, I want there to be a film where we are like, you're wrong. Well, I'm sure at some point there will be a film like that. I mean, there's... our list so far is over 200 long. Oh yeah, yeah.
Speaker: At least one, statistically. To give you a little more insight into the behind the scenes of this podcast shenanigans, we have Google Docs on Google Docs and we have a spreadsheet.
Speaker: of all the films, every horror film that like we there's various horror films that one of us has seen and you turns out we've both seen them so yeah we'll have to see what we'll do then um and neither one of us has seen it's it's um and then because i love data i'm there like sorting it out and i oh
Speaker: You're a data freak. I am. See the thing is, and if anyone from my job listens to this, this is parody and not true, I was having a day at work where I was so very drained and I was like, hey,
Speaker: it's a spreadsheet no one's gonna know if they like walking up through my room and see me on my computer on a spreadsheet it's just gonna look like any old spreadsheet I do that like that's pretty much
Speaker: the whole day that I do. So yeah, I was there, sought an invitation at work. But like, honestly, for like 10 minutes, I promise I do work hard. But yes, that was a fact. Thank you very much. Yeah, I approve of you counting test tubes. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I
Speaker: It's a liver. So yes, we will be talking about Nosferatu, the 1922 version, and a heads up that we will obviously be spoiling it. We will be talking about the whole film. All of it. All of it. Start to finish and also
Speaker: Oh, and also, what happened after the film was made? Ooh, because the end is not the end. Sizzle, sizzle. I'm excited to find this out. But also, we just wanted to say, like, I guess, if you are someone who is not into horror, use us. Yeah.
Speaker: we'll tell you all you need to know yeah yeah and then and then i don't know i'm someone who just who watches films even though i know the entire plot like i don't spoilers aren't really spoilers to me like yeah i'll they'll be in the back of my head someone i would have forgotten the spoiler and still watch the film yeah yeah so if we if we tell you the whole plot and you hate horror and you think actually maybe that's not too scary hey give it a go yeah give it a watch give it a try i think this one in particular
Speaker: isn't scary in a way of horror films.
Speaker: especially horror today yeah yeah it's I mean like it's a film from 1922 yeah this is a film that is over a hundred years old now oh wow it is isn't it yeah yeah there's centenary yeah I watched it on the centenary because of course I did I love this film okay so my relationship with this film I guess if that's how I'm gonna start this
Speaker: I think we should all just mention, it is a silent film. It is a silent film, yes. I almost, yeah, I guess that is something to mention. Yeah. Because I, I, like I said, I watch a lot of old films, I kind of would take that as a given.
Speaker: I guess a lot of people don't know when, kind of, sound came in. Yeah, because by the 30s there's sound. Yeah. So I guess it is surprising. It was wartime, that sound. Did that surprise you? No, it's, no, I don't think so, because I have seen silent films for, or like I've watched my grandfather a few silence. So it's not like a new phenomenon, if you will, to me. But what are you expecting, sound?
Speaker: I don't think I was. Because of the date it was, I automatically assumed it was going to be. Yeah, because I watch old films a lot and I think during lockdown
Speaker: i watched we made a cinema in the house i had a lockdown with my parents shout out to them best um best lockdown buddies ever like 100 percent had would not have locked down with anyone other than them i've never met your parents but i love them there um it was just this beautiful thing where we were able to be extremely direct and sometimes be like
Speaker: get out of here, I need space. I love that I could have that with my parents because obviously the same lockdown with my parents, a lot of people's gut reaction is, oh my goodness, or you must have been through it. I'm like, nah, my parents are sick. It was great. We made a little cinema room in the office room.
Speaker: We're only very blessed to have a big house because of the job. But we watched a bunch of old films with a projector and that was really nice. So we watched films like Casablanca and all Brief Encounter, The Train One.
Speaker: that's just the train one. We watch a bunch of old black and white films. And so I am very used to old films. It's one of those things that I sometimes will be talking to people like older than me. And then I'll be talking about like, like brief encounter possibly if that is the name of this film. And they're like, how old are you? I'm like, oh yeah, but like,
Speaker: It's a good film. So good on a projector as well. It just feels more of a cinema feel. So my relationship with Nosferatu.
Speaker: is it is on the list of 101 films to see before you die. It would be interesting to get you to go through the list at some point to see how many you have seen already, just as is. But you have seen Nosferatu now, and that is the first film on the list. Oh, no, it isn't. It's the third one. You lied. I lied. It's the third one. What is the first one? Cabinet of Dr. Caligari.
Speaker: which is very, I've seen, it's very good. I have actually seen, back to the list, 69 of 101. Are you gonna watch any more from that list? And I cannot watch any more, but I have to stop there for absolutely no reason at all.
Speaker: That happened completely by accident. That was not planned. I swear on my life. But cabinet of doctors. I know that one is on my list to watch. 1919. Yeah. Nosferatu I watched when I was on hold to the doctors. I'm ill a lot of the time.
Speaker: and I was on hold for a very long time and essentially like there's this thing where the doctors um you phone up and then you're
Speaker: put on hold because you have to phone in the morning to get an appointment on that day. You can't make an appointment in advance. So I had this week where I would phone at 8am and then by the time I got off hold all the appointments were gone. Yeah, that's happened multiple times to me too.
Speaker: found the NHS please please um and it was the third day and i was on hold and this film is an hour 25 it's an hour 25 yeah and i thought well while i'm on hold
Speaker: I'll watch Nosferatu because it's an old film so it'll probably be slow let's be real about old films and it's also a silent film so it's not like I'm gonna have to be listed into the lines and
Speaker: And yeah, and I thought I was going to have to turn it off halfway through because I'd get off hold and I didn't. I was on hold the whole time for the whole film. So that was nice. At least I watched the film on one go. But now it's one of those things where Nosferatu is linked in my mind to being ill, which is on theme for the film. It is.
Speaker: that is very unseen and like to the other week i don't know how husky my voice is sounding but i am slightly ill i've got a bit of a sore throat um and when i was at my kind of peak of the ill i watched nosferatu in
Speaker: anticipation of this podcast but also because it is such a comfort film it is I like horror movies that are spooky I don't necessarily like slashers yeah I think I definitely prefer to spook to the jump essentially yeah yeah I like the atmosphere on it and this film is dripping in atmosphere
Speaker: And that's the thing, I wouldn't necessarily class it as a scary film, but it's definitely a horror film.
Speaker: It is so spooky. It is so graphic. Yeah. And the way, because it is a silent film and it's, that's why I think it's so excellent as well, because it portrays this Gothic imagery and the Gothic themes through it. But without talking, it just, it still shows it. You can see it in the faces of the actors and especially the music school. Oh, that music. The music.
Speaker: Oh my goodness, I will listen to that music if I'm at work and most of the time I'm listening to podcasts half the time I'm doing work that I'm not meant to be doing but if I need to get something done, fill music and in particular
Speaker: the Nosferatu score is... poor. It's beautiful. So good. So good. And the way they used music and musical themes and the way like the major and minor like
Speaker: scaling and stuff with the scores to portray certain emotions as well, I think was an excellent touch and boost. Yeah, yeah. It's one of those things where, and again, we're talking about technicalities and I guess kind of knowing your limits is one of the thing about old films. You know, we, if you listened to the previous episode, we totally didn't film, record this on the same day.
Speaker: If you listened to the previous episode we talked about the
Speaker: they couldn't do special effects so it's that practical element and it's the being technical in a way to get around things and I think the music is an excellent example of that because you don't have dialogue. No but as well the way they portrayed alongside the music because it's silent and with the time it's black and white so the way they portrayed like the shadows and the
Speaker: difference between night and day as well, I thought was even cooler. Yeah. Um, so do you want to,
Speaker: should i go through the film or do you want to go through the film? i was thinking did you want to give the overview? okay so we know what we're talking about hey it's a film yes if you've ever read dracula have you actually read dracula? yes i have i've read dracula too i think it was very stupid i loved it but i had to i spent so much of a book
Speaker: not enjoying reading it because I was expecting this dramatic masterpiece because that's what Dracula seems like now. When you think vampire you think Dracula.
Speaker: um the hype yes it's the hype is so real yeah it's it's the most um yeah he's the most famous vampire yeah um and almost all vampire things you will watch will have reference to yes candracula yes um which is very interesting because um well we'll get onto that um
Speaker: So I spent so much of the book not enjoying it until I realized that it's just a book. Yeah. You do just have to read it like you'd read any book. And then I started to see the fun in it because there's bits that is so... Oh my gosh, Abraham. Come on. I'm not going to call it Brown. Abraham, you idiot. Mina. No, no, not Mina. Lucy. Mina's friend, Lucy.
Speaker: I'm sorry whoever broke your heart, Abraham. I'm sorry whatever girls called you lame. Who put you down? But like, dude, the bit where Lucy says to Mina, we don't deserve strong men. God in heaven.
Speaker: And then you start seeing the fun in it because it's just like, lose a little boy. I don't know what Abraham looked like, but come on, Bram. I don't know what Bram Stoker looked like at all, but I just know he was a dweeb. From reading Dracula, you know he was a dweeb.
Speaker: Especially in that one line alone. Oh my goodness. And the fact that Lucy gets proposed to you three times in one day is hilarious. And you don't think you're gonna go into Dracula and get that. And I think that's why I wasn't enjoying it at all because I was expecting, you know, Dracula.
Speaker: and then you just get this like girl Lucy being like oh my gosh I love men and they love me so much because I'm so pretty and and I just I just can't decide which man I love more because all men are wonderful but but all women are frivolous and we don't do anything it's like okay what yeah um so Nosferatu is essentially the plot of Dracula
Speaker: it is there's um except it's not Dracula it's Orlock yes count Orlock count love the name ah so good and it's um i feel like i keep doing sizzle but it's
Speaker: Yes, the names are interesting. So yes, Count Orlok is looking to move to Lisburg, is it? I think so. It's in 18... 1858 or something like that. 1812. I don't think it's the earliest 12. These are the things that we should have... Yeah, I think it's like 1863.
Speaker: It's in the 1800s. We know that for certain. And he's looking to move to a new town. He's looking to move to a new town. I think it is Lizborg, but I don't know. And essentially, Hutter has to go and travel out, talk to him, and then he can move. Don't quite know why he have to do that.
Speaker: I think he was, from what I could see on the scene with the table and his wife, Ellen, that picture falls out. Hutter was showing Count Dork the different houses to see if he was interested in
Speaker: coming to get that house that was my yes i just am more thinking i've never moved house and had someone come to me and say um hello kitty we represent um
Speaker: the great accounting firm of Zooplar and we would like to show you these houses in these neighbourhoods. Usually you go to the place you want to move and you get something there but obviously you need Hutter to go to Orlock to then come back. Yeah. It's just something that I never quite noticed about Dracula, the plot. Yeah. Why does he go to him? I think
Speaker: I don't know, but there was a thing... Again, Bram, come on. Yeah. But slight possible plot holes aside, he... Hutter goes to Count Orlok and is showing him these houses and then Orlok sees Hutter's wife called... Ellen. Ellen. And is enamored and...
Speaker: And then, yes, and then... I think that's what makes him decide, yes, I will get that house. Yeah. Spookiness happens, and Orlok comes to Lisborg, and... He traps Hutter in his mansion. Yes. And so it's at that point, I think, where Hutter really does seem to get scared. Yes. And then he's like, oh no, I've got to get back. I need to go back to Allen.
Speaker: And then somehow they both make it back on time. I think unbeknownst to each other that they basically arrived within minutes of each other just by different routes. One by sea, one by land. And then you have this Count Orlok trying to get Ellen and it's Professor Who's the Van Helsing character?
Speaker: There's a professor. Yeah, there's a professor and he studies the plants. Yes. Which I really loved that. And they mentioned this one particular, I think it's a fungus, which is also mentioned in The Last of Us.
Speaker: Yeah, I'm at the very start Because it where it's yeah the feeds the feeding virus. Yeah but it and then um Just to give a brief overview overview. Um Yes, uh, Ellen thinks Hutter is dead and then or lock is trying to get Ellen and then she
Speaker: he gets killed yes yes he dies eventually he dies and the day is saved by the cocks crow yes yes well by the sunlight oh did you did you not pick up on it i thought it was the sunlight yeah but there was this thing it's the saying of he must stay until he will it was when the cocks crow
Speaker: then he will die. So that's when the Cox Crow in the morning as the wake up, but it's after, um, the whole Ellen thing. Yes. Which causes that particular Cox Crow morning, which is when the sun gets him.
Speaker: And you're supposed to be the expert! I know, but hey, look, there's a thing. Every day's a learning day. It is. Every day is a day of school. We are here learning. I do have thoughts on that whole Alan thing. Oh yes. Yeah. Oh yes. But yes, and then all luck dies and all is made right with the world. But did she die?
Speaker: I actually don't. Because the doctor showed up afterwards, and he didn't go into the room after he stayed, took his hat off, as in in morning. I think she does. Yeah. And Hutter seems to be distraught. Classic old film.
Speaker: It ends. Yeah. And this is another thing that I love about old... Yeah, at least you... They don't tie things up. No. They're like, okay, and that's where we're at.
Speaker: and it's just as beautiful. I love it when films like leave you wondering about things. It's just like okay yeah that's over now. Yeah. Excellent. We love it. Yeah she does die. Yeah. I'm pretty certain and I've seen it multiple times but this is the thing like I am not
Speaker: I'm watching it for the vibes yeah it does have good vibes it has excellent vibes I like this time but I watched it most recently oh my goodness I had the fairy lights I had the candles I was like draped in my blanket it was it was excellent and I was just chopping veg for dinner yeah and again the difference it's beautiful yes so
Speaker: do we want to talk specifics of the films that we the bits of the films because I also did take notes when I as I was watching it this time round so essentially my my notes are music is so good yeah that's one of my
Speaker: notes is music. Good music. Yeah. Also, the font. Yes, it was beautiful. It was beautiful. But, and I've seen this multiple times, and I had forgotten, every time I watch it, it looks like his name's Butter.
Speaker: Yes. Because it's the way of the old hitches. We love our protagonist butter. I'm not sure if there was a spelling. Ooh. Like not spell, a grammatical error towards the last quarter where I think it was like to who in where I think it should have been who to or something it should have been those two words should have been the other way around. But I'm dyslexic so I don't know.
Speaker: I didn't even notice it, so I don't know. But going back on that thought as well, because I know with a lot of films that have words written on it as well, they go through it so quickly, and with my selects and stuff, I can't read as quick as it's displayed.
Speaker: and it's frustrating and stuff but the length of time that the writing is up on the screen is perfect and I quite liked the font as well because fonts have an effect on how you read different things. I found that font was a good font especially as well for her. Because it's a gothic font, everything in this film. But it's a readable gothic font. Yes, apart from the fact that I thought his name was butter.
Speaker: But I love that. I personally love our protagonist, Butter. He's great. Yes. One of my first points as I was watching this film is the fact that they have different love languages. Hutter and Alan. He is very much into gift -giving. She is very much into
Speaker: gothic morbid statements and i love that for them he basically he gives her flowers um but he sees he's walking around he gives her flowers and she i love her yeah she looks at them and is like how could you have killed these these beautiful things it's like he's giving that's nice yeah
Speaker: That's a thoughtful man who's given you flowers, but I love her. I love how spooky and gothic she is. I love it. Yeah, especially at the start, on that flower scene, the music, it's very jolly and it gives me Charlie Chaplin vibes. Yes. Yeah. And then slowly as
Speaker: Count Orlok gets introduced to the music, it changes a bit. But then every single time Count Orlok is shown on screen, there's always a change in music. The music's always more eerie. And I think that adds to the joy of it as well. Yeah, it definitely shows the progression into the Gothic. Yeah. And because it would be a real slog
Speaker: if it started there. You know what I mean? You're exactly right with the kind of Charlie Chaplin -esque. It takes you into it. It takes you on a journey. Yes. So as we kind of go into the film, I love the old mosquito trick. Hutter is an idiot.
Speaker: very much so hotter is the biggest buffoon who has ever because yeah he wrote he wrote a letter to Ellen and he's like and I was bit by a mosquito with two bites very close together I was like what
Speaker: It's so clearly not a mosquito. Yeah, especially the events of that night as well. Oh, I'm in a spooky castle with a creep of a host. Who is... Who sucked on my thumb. Yeah, I cut my thumb with a little knife while I was eating food and a little drop of blood was drawn and then a lot comes over and sucks his thumb. Like, come on, he's sucking his thumb. Yeah. That's... I...
Speaker: We've known each other many years. Yes. And I don't know if I would be comfortable if I accidentally cut my farm and you just went, hold on a second, and just started sucking my farm. Yeah, I wouldn't. Yeah, if it was the other way around, I don't think I'd be comfortable with that either.
Speaker: I mean, depending how much it hurt, because it does help. It is a thing that it does help. Yeah, it's like if I cut my thumb, or like, when I cut my finger or something, then I will, like, give it a little suck or something. Just, er, because your sliver's also antiseptic. Mm -hmm. We love it. Yeah. Scientific. Science facts.
Speaker: but somebody else? yeah like if you.. if that happens.. if we were in those.. in that position. i mean maybe if it's life threatening. yeah. if we were in that position and i sliced over my thumb and you raced across the room because he is.. oh yeah he was fast. he is like i got to get that. and you raced across the room to suck my thumb. i'd probably say something like hey magus chill i got that.
Speaker: yeah that's something I could just do don't don't worry about it don't worry babe I'm good but yeah so that's an already yeah what an idiot hotter
Speaker: And it's specified with that, it's a specified drop of blood. And he's like that. And then he has those mosquitoes. And it's like, you are dumb. Do they look like mosquito bites to you? And also like, gross and dangerous. It's the 1920s.
Speaker: Well, that's when the film was done. It's the 1800s. But even more, it's like... I guess, I guess you're already... Yeah. It's so hard to... But the theme of the plague comes into the film. Yeah. So you're thinking, excuse me, you've got to be a bit... It's one of those things where I'm like, were they just getting messed up 24 -7 so you almost couldn't stress?
Speaker: yeah you get a mosquito bite and you're like hey man maybe this has sealed my fate but yeah you just got to keep moving because it's the 1800s and this is how we move yeah and and my 12 of my cousins died of smallpox yesterday kind of thing um so maybe maybe that's why he's so chill about it but i feel like i'd be like this is the 1800s this is death for me
Speaker: Yeah. Even if it is just a mosquito. But, yes. Well it can be the death of you now. Yeah. Yeah. That's fun some more. Yeah. Yeah. So yes. Hunter is an idiot. Also I love that every time he wakes up it's like, it's proper 1920s acting. Yeah. It's silent film acting.
Speaker: you know, they're playing to the back of the audience. This is like, he's yawning, he's stretching. Yeah, it's like exaggerated movements. Yes. Yeah. To show, because they can't tell. So they show to tell. And I, so the next kind of point that I made was the fact that Orlok is saying, your wife has a lovely throat.
Speaker: Yes. So your wife has a lovely neck. Neck. Neck. Sorry, not neck, not throat. I, um, again. Red flag. Hutter.
Speaker: don't sample out. Or you can say thank you. Yeah. But you could tell he was freaked out with that sense because he did grasp for that photo of his wife and then quickly put his things back into his bag and be like, no, you're not seeing my wife. Yeah. And this is the issue with all Dracula incarnations. He's selling
Speaker: his next door. He's selling him a house next door. Yeah, this house in this town is right next door to Hutter.
Speaker: And it's even specifically, he's literally saying, oh yeah, visible from your house. It's like... They could see each other through their bedroom windows. And you're really gonna let a pervert, he's just exposed himself. Maybe he's a weird man who's lived by himself in a mansion in a different country.
Speaker: Maybe that's the cultural difference. Maybe that's what Hart is thinking. Maybe he's thinking cultural differences. And I can't like be shutting myself down from him. But I still wouldn't... Plus the revenue from selling because this is a mansion next door. But it's still like you can't have... I think people are picky enough with their neighbours as is. Oh yes.
Speaker: You don't want this guy as a neighbour. No. And he has the power to not make him his neighbour. Yeah. Because he's the one selling him his house. Yeah, he's the one selling the house. Because, oh no, we've just found a different buyer or something. Or we're knocking the house down. Or, do you know what, actually, this one's way better. Yeah. Sell him a different house. In a different town. Far away from you. Or, you know, just down the road is better. But in fact, he's like, ah, geez, this is such an uncomfortable weekend. Anyway, now time to go home where he's my neighbour. Yeah.
Speaker: and where I shall live uncomfortably with him for the rest of my life. Dude, it's... Your wife has a lovely neck. Yeah. Or... We love it. We love it. Yes. Well, I kind of didn't take notes for a while, so do you have anything leading on from there? Or... Do you? One thing I also would like to say is...
Speaker: that's what makes all up keen on moving yeah that's now you could visibly see that was the seal of the deal essentially was him seeing ellen's neck and it's um it's a feature that i think is lacking from house buying nowadays you can't buy us well yes um i'm glad about that yeah hot neighbors yeah
Speaker: Where are they? You don't see them anymore. Well, I want to know that before buying a house. I want to know which one has the hot neighbor. Orlok's managed to go, oh, that house has a hot neighbor. I'm going there. If I'm house hunting, I would like my estate agent to be like, oh, and here's just a folder of all the neighbors.
Speaker: or like, here's a folder of the neighbour's selfies and here's also a folder of the neighbour's wife's selfies. It's an important part. You want to know who your neighbours are as well. Yeah, I want to know if they have sexy necks. Yeah. Very important. Or at least here's to Ork, and maybe me too. I only want to move house if my neighbour's wife has a sexy neck.
Speaker: Hey, each to their own. Yeah. Everyone has their own thing. Yeah. But no, if we take a step back to the tavern. Oh, yes. Yeah. Because on Hutter's way to Count Org, he stops off at this tavern. Where he's in the bar bit and mentions he's on his way to Count Org. There's also a sudden change in music. The bartender goes, no, you've
Speaker: It's too dangerous, but he mentions a werewolf. But I think it's a hyena. Yes. In Germany. Or not Germany, Transylvania. It's a German film in Transylvania.
Speaker: No clue. But yes, hyenas aren't from there. No matter where it is. No, but there is a hyena. It's a cute hyena. Oh, it was adorable. Best part of a film. It's like a nature documentary. But you could
Speaker: visibly whether that was an excuse or not for him not to travel further on up to a counterlock or not but they could still visibly see everyone was like no you can't go there something's up with him and that place it's too dangerous
Speaker: But then he stays the night at the tavern so he's not travelling by night because of the werewolf, which he laughs off. And he finds this notebook on the supernatural, not this notebook, it's this book on the supernatural. Like the tavern's wife or something. It's like when you go to hotels there's normally a Bible in the drawer. Well this had a supernatural book in the drawer. Gorgeous. We love it. We want it. Everywhere it should be.
Speaker: I kind of got more of the idea that it was put there specifically. Yeah. Because he was talking about moving on. Going up, yeah. So it's this idea of him trying to be like, look. Scaring him off further. Like, look, hey, give him hints. And in this book it mentions Nosferatu. And he reads it and he
Speaker: jollily jokes it off oh yeah he laughs at it being like ha ha ha no and then which i think is also a bit of a foreshadow essentially or an oxymoron because he later reads it again some of it when he's at oryx manor laughs it off more
Speaker: And then after he starts, after he gets locked in the manor whilst Ork tries to go to Alan, he looks at it again and is like, oh wait, maybe this kind of fits this guy.
Speaker: yeah yeah it's um again he's the world's biggest idiot and it takes him a very long time to realize that he is there he is kind of like huh this is not quite adding up in the way that you want it to um we were having a discussion about um the word Nosferatu yes
Speaker: and what it means. Yes. Like the translation. In my head, I immediately thought, noz, as in wash for night. Fair as maybe German fear. I don't know if you can tell, but we've got a Welshie here. Yes. One of us is pot Welsh. And fair as in, to me, sounds German for fear, or a German saying fear.
Speaker: And then two as in Spanish for your. Yeah. So your night fear or your fear of the night. You're so multicultural. You're like Welsh, German, Spanish. Let's make a word. It's very, yeah, it's very multicultural. My thank you. So my belief of what Nosferatu means is like night fear or fear of the night.
Speaker: And now you're Googling. Well, because I am Googling it. You are Googling. So no one knows. No one knows. No one knows. So the name Nosferatu has been presented as an archaic Romanian word. Romanian? Romanian. Romanian, sorry. Pronunciations with Romanian word.
Speaker: Oh yeah, because it's Romani people, Romanian, yes. That always, always me where there's, yeah, different. Synonymous with vampire. So it's synonymous. It was largely popularized by Western fiction, such as Dracula, because I think in Dracula, they call him a Nosferatu as well. Once of the suggested etymologies,
Speaker: of the term is it is derived from the Romanian nesuferet so n -e -s -u -f -e -r -i -t it's like nesuferet offensive nesufreit that's how i'm pronounced
Speaker: Oh, it's got an E. Oh, it's got an E before the F. After the F and before the R. It is kind of like F -E -R -I -T, offensive or troublesome. So it's kind of similar to that word. And yeah, the etymology is undetermined. So European vampire is what Nosferatu means.
Speaker: yeah so that's that's annoying i wanted it to have a set meaning um but that is what it is yeah it just means it is wouldn't it just is an old word for vampire i like my oh i love it it is like i said it's very fit all over the place it's so like all over the place just like yeah we love it yeah
Speaker: yes so um so what i was going to say yes something that i love in this film and in the Dracula myth in general is there's parts of the Dracula myth that is so cute like the idea that he can't sleep unless he's got his dirt yes
Speaker: That's adorable. Yeah, and it's something that carries on. You're a divergent. Oh, yeah. I need to have my dirt. It's like your comfort blanket or your comfort something, yeah. That's like, yeah. It's like, oh, but there's dirt where we're going. No, no, but it's not my dirt. Yeah, it has to be yours from your homeland. Yeah, I need my dirt or I can't sleep.
Speaker: yeah i don't know if you've watched um what we do in the shadows oh i have seen a film but not the tv show okay well i know i haven't seen the film but i've seen the show in the show as well with the vampires they do they lose their date and so they send
Speaker: they're familiar of to all these young judges to get dude from their countries to bring back to where they are. That's that's yeah I just I just love that I just love that he has to and also later in the film they say it's dirt in which they were buried yeah which makes me wonder in this world how dead do you have to die to be a vampire?
Speaker: Did Orlok die? Was he a man who died and was buried? Because he looks so... he looks so... not human.
Speaker: yeah especially his movements as well are like uh you know like a corpse that's been out for a while i can't remember the name oh um rigamortis rigamortis yeah he looks like he's in slight rigamortis with his movements and it's it's it's the fingers yeah it's the arms right by him and his eyes and he's like
Speaker: it's all very not human. I love it because I think vampires are so interesting. I think vampires are... it's like what I said about the idea of the, and again last episode, spooky children with different cultures, vampires in different cultures globally and also through history.
Speaker: Here, this is a not human monster and he is not sexy.
Speaker: No. Hey, I mean... To some people, mate, but to us. Whatever the guest you go in. Whatever the guest you go in. Yeah. But he is, whereas then you get to film an interview with a vampire and you have Brad Pitt. Yeah. And it's so, you know, Robert Pattinson is in Twilight. Yeah, more modern vampires. They tend to be these... Sexy. Yeah. Alluring.
Speaker: it's interesting to see where... someone who's not yeah and like this vampire being so not human yeah and I think so stiff in movement yeah compared to most vampire
Speaker: Showings which are they're quite fluid and loose with their movements and they're very Classy, it's not like elegant, but it's that word of like They glide places where yeah, he is very rigid. He is uncomfortable He's got to stick up his ass. He does. Yeah in the yes like if it is the ground in which they were buried
Speaker: then was he a human? It's interesting. And I also thought it was very cute when later on in the film he's carrying the coffin. I don't know why but just the way he, I like how I'm saying like he looks hideous, he's a monster and then I'm like look how cute he is. But no it's like he was carrying it with like
Speaker: comfort and pride and it's also just so easy yeah and like taking care of it like like somebody just walking into the sea with a surfboard yeah he's just like this is my coffin um i'm a like extremely old vampire i've killed many people this is my coffin i love it i love him um yes um i in terms of notes in particular scenes
Speaker: I'm pretty much done apart from the end. So if you have specific scenes you wanted to talk about. And I'm just gonna... No, I think... While you look. You think... No, I'm at the same place. Yeah. I... So. The shot with the shadow.
Speaker: I wanna talk gothic shots in this film. There's that bit where he's feeding off Hutter, this isn't quite the end, but he's feeding off Hutter and the door opens. And he's in the doorway. That shot. There's so many, we've said that this isn't a scary film, but I think - That it has an eerie eye to it. There are moments that are scary. I'm not gonna sleep well, but ooh.
Speaker: that's not happy. The shot with him in the doorway, the way that he like, the way it's shaped around him is almost claustrophobic. I almost got the idea
Speaker: that he is as old as that building. Yeah. They've grown together. They are one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Because I think in the book as well it mentions about his shadows as if all the shadows that are work for him or around him or he is one with all shadows. It's wonderful and going off of shadows.
Speaker: one of the most iconic shots in the film.
Speaker: is him walking up the stairs and it's the shot of the shadow. You don't have him walking up the stairs. You don't see him, it's the shadow walking. And that sequence is beautiful. It's amazing. And the shape of his shadow and the way it curves. It curves as well. It's amazing.
Speaker: And like I said, the technicalities of doing something like that in the 1920s is so impressive of you don't need CGI. No. This film didn't need it at all. No. There's, I think, one technical bit about the boat and there's the overlay of the boat and
Speaker: and Orlock and you can see both of them. It's like it's like an overlay. Yeah. I can't quite remember what exactly but it's essentially that and this was at a time when you couldn't do an overlay. Essentially they had to film it on the same. On the same film? Yeah. Yeah. It was like double exposure.
Speaker: So I guess that's the only special effects. Yeah. There's also, I think, a bit of stop motion to make things go faster. Yeah, there is as well, not just to make things go faster, but to emphasise a movement or an appearance of Count Orlok where he's at the gate and he's at the door. And it, in stop motion, slowly opens and it reveals him standing there.
Speaker: yes all the doors open by themselves it's all this yeah that's the only specific like special effects in this film it's amazing the other thing that i think is very scary is the shot of him feeding yeah he does it with
Speaker: because he's creepy he's got two front yeah it's like kind of like pronounced rat teeth yes but you know like your bunny teeth inside yeah you're I think they're incisors oh I thought those were the incisors no it is your canine oh yeah there's the inside maulers canines incisors yeah I know my teeth you know your teeth I don't apparently
Speaker: He's got sharp insides as opposed to canines. When you think vampire teeth, you think canines. But he's got, yeah, like you're saying, like rat teeth. But it's the shot of him feeding, and he's so much in the shadow, but you can just see him. That shot is scary. I felt scared.
Speaker: it's not a scary film but that shot and again for it to be a film from the 1920s and you know I've seen a lot of horror and to see that shot and still get that little kind of chill up your spine excellent yeah I paused chopping food I was like
Speaker: And hey, if you can pause chopping the veg like that is... And it was a red bell pepper, man. I loved that. You were distracted then, yeah. And yet it gets you. It's... It's so good. It's so good. I'm sorry if you can hear Rosalie and I've got notes in various places and I'm just trying to keep track of them. Yeah. And I have ripped out pieces of paper as my note. Yeah. I... So...
Speaker: So there's that. There's... You sounded like you wanted to talk about the Ellen. Talk about Ellen to me. Ellen? Ooh, I love to hire a facade. Oh my goodness. The ringlets. The proper sausage ringlets. Gorgeous. I love that she's a goth on a beach. Yeah. She goes to the beach each night to wait for her husband to see him coming over the horizon.
Speaker: But that's not how he's travelling back. That's how Nosfer too is travelling back. Yeah. It's as well always as if she's drawn to his presence and him drawing near. But I also think they went for a walk just before he left. That's the last place she saw him. Yeah.
Speaker: This beach has graves? I think so. That's not good. Sad moves. Yeah. But I love it. Yeah. As a goth who loves the beach. Just perfect. I want to find this German goth beach. Yeah. Wearing her black dress at the beach. Ah. Beautiful. You love Ellen. Yeah. But what about the end? Because that was the bit that you sounded like you had thoughts.
Speaker: Yeah, I did. So after Hatta gets back, and Elay wants to read this book, he wants her not to, but she does it anyway. Because, you know, she's an amazing golf person, and this book would have it after Elay... You would be right, creepy book. I want to read... Yeah, you have a creepy book. I'm drawn to it. Stop giving me flowers, I want creepy books.
Speaker: she reads about Nosferatu and in the line it says it's a woman that has to be a woman without sin and then the cocks crow to signify morning. But the fact that it has to be a woman without sin
Speaker: which is also still a theme that comes up to today with purity. And you obviously are led to believe that a woman without sin, she's a virgin. Yeah. But that's not all sin means. Yes. It could be anything. Yes.
Speaker: But that's the implication. She has virginal purity of heart and spirit. But she has to give herself freely as well. There's things like the whole sacrifice thing. So she sacrificed herself. Amazing. But I don't know, I just hate in films where it's like
Speaker: Where it's like specifies like woman without sin and purity and things like that as if it's only those women who can do this thing.
Speaker: I think it's, yeah, I love, that's another reason why I love Ellen, the fact that she does choose to do this thing. Oh yeah, I love that she chooses to do it. She is so like, right, this is all that's got to be done. She, without even truly knowing everything, she sacrifices herself to save the whole time, essentially. Yeah.
Speaker: And she sends her husband away so he's not there to witness. Yeah. But yeah, it is just dated, old, yes. Only the fairest maiden can do this and whatever. It's very, yeah.
Speaker: I mean, like I said, Bram Stoker was a dweeb. I'm sure he was very much on board with that decision. Yeah. I, speaking of Bram, this is what I've been hinting, and I am now just starting to think maybe this would have been best at the start. Hey. I'm excited. You live and you learn. This is the thrilling time. You've mentioned Bram a few times.
Speaker: you may have noticed that the names are different it's Orlock as opposed to Dracula yeah and it's Hutter as opposed to Harker and it's Ellen as opposed to Mina and it's whatever Van Helsen's name is as opposed to Van Helsen and that is because this film is illegal oh so this film
Speaker: was made in 1922. And we've been talking a lot about Mac, about Count Orlock and the physicality of that performance. So I did just want to say the actor who plays Count Orlock is Max Schreck. It's spelled with a C -H.
Speaker: but take the C out, it's Schreck. So yeah, Max Schreck, please count or lock. We love Max Schreck. And it is German expressionist cinema. And yes, the director is, I don't know German pronunciations, Murnau.
Speaker: M -U -R -N -A -E. Yeah, Luna. Luna now is how I would read that. So the thing with Nosferatu is it's often called like the first occult classic film. Yeah. The cabinet of Dr. Kalagari is
Speaker: predates it, but this is one of the first like gothic, I've said gothic so much. But it is, that's what it is. But it's like, the cabinet of Dr. Caligari doesn't have the same weight that Nosferatu does. And director F .W. Manau stole it. So,
Speaker: Who do you see that from? Well, from Bram Stoker. Oh, okay, I got you. They didn't get permission to make this film. They just did it. And that's why all the names are different. Oh, it's like how when you make a logo, there has to be a minimum of like five differences. Yes. For it to be legal. Yes. So this film is a ripoff.
Speaker: Oh. This film is a complete rip -off and now I did this before as well. This is his MO. This is not his first defence. He did a film of Jekyll and Hyde. Yeah. Called The Head of Janice or Yannis. You know the Roman god with the two faces, Jekyll and Hyde.
Speaker: I haven't seen the head of Yannis. But yes, this is what Manau does, apparently. Or at least this is what he did twice. We don't want to paint him with a brush like that. But it was dumb without any communication with the Stoker estate. Bram Stoker had already died. Bram Stoker died before 1922. And really interestingly, no one cared about Dracula.
Speaker: Dracula was not an instant classic at all. It was released before its time. Like Vincent van Gogh. At the time he wasn't so much, but now he is. Yeah, I guess.
Speaker: I don't like Bram Stoker, so I don't want to put him in the same boat as him. But yes, I do definitely agree with you on that front. How do you spell obituary? O -B -U. Yes. I want to find Bram Stoker's official obituary because it's interesting
Speaker: because, um, no, like essentially like to vote. Okay. So this is from his official obituary to those who bothered to read credit titles of films. Um, no, this is not what I'm looking for. Sorry. I'm, I should have, I should have got this ready. Um, essentially, um,
Speaker: people didn't care about Dracula in the same way that they do now, like Dracula is a big name. I can't find it but in his obituary it's mentioned but it's mentioned in a list of his other books because he wrote other books as well. It's kind of like Bram Stoker the author of blah blah blah and Dracula has died.
Speaker: yeah whereas now it's more author of Dracula and blah blah blah yes and you probably wouldn't even mention the blah blah blah because it's Dracula it stands alone as it is in its entirety yeah and so Bram had died 1922 March
Speaker: Sif, if you want to celebrate the birthday of Nosferatu. The 101st birthday, coming up soon. Yes, he, F .W. Murnau, did this film. And then, onto the scene, comes our lady Florence Stoker.
Speaker: his wife. So this is Bram's widow and she is at this point extremely poor because Bram wasn't a famous author and a lot of his money's gone and she hears about this film Nosferatu and how it is literally Dracula and says no
Speaker: and sues them, takes them to court in a way that no one had ever done. Copyright wasn't really a thing. And especially international copyright. So Bram Stoker is Irish, but he might... I can never remember if he was living in America.
Speaker: but essentially yeah, German film company. This is an international copyright dispute. It had literally never been done. So she took them to court for this infringement and the fallout of this case was not a massive payout of money but
Speaker: a solidification of the copyright so any sales now would make money and go straight to her and for the destruction of all copies of Nosferatu because it was an illegal film yeah
Speaker: we love a petty bitch she was like nope i don't want your money i just don't want that film to exist and it was destroyed every copy that they could get their hands on was destroyed at this point many years had gone by so um
Speaker: it had been circulating, so they weren't able to get every copy. Yeah, it's like now with social media, it's posted, there's going to be copies of it. Yeah, it is exactly that. So that's why we are still able to watch Nosferatu. But if it had gone Florence's way, the film would be dead. And that's why Nosferatu is called the film that would not die.
Speaker: It's so good. It's so good. I think I have a bigger appreciation for it as well, knowing that it found its way. And because all publicity is good publicity, now everyone's saying, what's this about Dracula?
Speaker: Oh, I'm going to read this book. Yeah. And that is why we know about Dracula now. If Manal did not do this, didn't try to be a sneaky little boy, then we wouldn't, we wouldn't have Dracula.
Speaker: And we wouldn't have vampires as we know it. Well, vampires existed before Dracula. Oh yeah, but a lot of vampire -based - It is a lot based in Dracula because it made it so famous. So it would be interesting to see how they would have made them.
Speaker: yeah like what other like law they would have gone off of and cultures to instead yeah it is because of this so essentially yes then
Speaker: universal got the rights, universal like film company got the rights and a Broadway version was made and the stunning Bella Lugosi played Dracula in the Broadway version. I'm trying very hard not to salivate because
Speaker: In the research of this, I googled Bela Lugosi and I found a picture of him from when he was 30 and I literally had to stop recording because it floored me. A beautiful man.
Speaker: And when we talk about the 1931 Dracula, I will go in depth about Bela Lugosi. And honestly, I'm having to stop myself now. Well, yeah, for those who can't see, because it's an audio, Kitty's just got her hands on either side of her cheeks in awe just talking about him. And it's... Oh! He's a man. He's a man.
Speaker: But we'll leave that there. He played Dracula in the Broadway version and then when Universal made the 1931 Dracula, he reprised his role.
Speaker: And I think it is the Bela Lugosi version that makes Dracula. Like the Sesame Street, you know, the Count on Sesame Street, that's Bela Lugosi. That's... It's him. So much of the Dracula mythos comes from his version. So all of this happened because a German man wanted to make a film without paying anyone, and now, and then,
Speaker: We have this whole world now. Yeah. So it is extremely interested.
Speaker: yes so like not to be a like big -time feminist on maine but like as we said the book's good but it's not all that yeah the reason we have Dracula is because Florence yeah Florence Stoker was like um yeah like she she's like hey bitch where's my money yeah yeah
Speaker: I am a woman in the 1920s and I'm widowed so God knows I don't have good prospects. But yes. The thing about the film though, so that's the context of like where the film is coming from. There's bits of the film that is very uncomfortable. Shall we talk about the imagery? Okay.
Speaker: So Orlock, we've talked about how not human he looks. He kind of looks... And hey, this is 1920s Germany. So the thing about this film as well, it's very based in the plague.
Speaker: Yes, a lot of it is heavily mentioned about the plague and in one scene you see people carrying coffins through the village. And it was made in 1922. Which is... So in 1918 there was the Spanish flu. Yeah. So to make a film about the plague would have been extremely heavy.
Speaker: Well, it's like how now, post -pandemic, pandemic films are being made. Yes. It's actually really interesting watching it now, having experienced a pandemic. Yeah. The fact that... So the look of all luck, and no one's quite sure, because we can't talk to them now about this,
Speaker: whether this was intentional or just a visual choice that was purely neutral. But Orlok looks like an anti -Semitic poster. Yes. He has the hooked nose, he has the bushy eyebrows, he has the long fingers, the hunched back.
Speaker: the you know well he's bald so not even a receding hairline but he looks how Jewish people are portrayed in anti -semitic posters of the time in Germany in the in the 20s so you have a air quotes Jewish man stowing away on a boat with rats bringing a plague yeah
Speaker: and the fact that this was made in the 1920s in Germany on the horizon we have a lot of anti -semitism coming it's really interesting again
Speaker: No one knows if this was a choice. V, and I'm struggling to remember his name, the man who sends Hutter, his box, Knox. Yes. Yes. The Renfield character. He also looks extremely of a, like a Jewish stereotype.
Speaker: yes with again the bushy eyebrows the um large nose um and and the fact that he's poring over his money and he's he's he's laughing and he's very kind of maniacal and he was reading a text in at the start of the film that is of demonic symbols yes as well i forgot about that yeah yeah
Speaker: So that kind of... Yes. So it's very kind of... The film has been called anti -Semitic a lot. Again, how much of it was intentional. The fact that he's coming across... He's stowing away on a boat is in the original text. Yeah.
Speaker: Bram Stoker was anti -Semitic as well, though. So, again, how much of... We know Bram didn't agree to this film, but from what I can gather of a man, I think he would have been very on board with this film. But the actor who plays Knox was Jewish. So...
Speaker: And I mean, how much of it in the time could you say no to a film because of morals and that? Yeah. There's also, you know, like, there's people talking about that nowadays. Like, I know there's discussions where black actors have said I didn't want to play like a racist stereotype, but those are the only roles I was given. Those are the only choices. Yeah. And you've
Speaker: that was the best decision they could have for their choice. Yeah, because they wanted to pay the rent. Even if they didn't want to have that role necessarily to portray that harmful stereotype. But if that was the only way they could pay rent or something. Yeah, if those are the roles that are going, then you have to kind of make that choice.
Speaker: So I don't know if this Jewish actor is like, yes, this is a film and I am choosing to do this film because I do not see this as a harmful Jewish stereotype because I do not see that this character is specifically Jewish. Or if this is a Jewish actor saying,
Speaker: God, I hate that I'm playing another racist Jewish portrayal, but I want to, you know, I want to do film. Yeah. And we also don't know what Monow's intentions were, but I think it is again, very important to recognize. Yeah. And especially like I've said it multiple times, but the fact that this is 1920s Germany.
Speaker: is very interesting. Because the context of Germany between the world wars is such an interesting headspace. Because they lost a war.
Speaker: And then they get punished. And if anyone's done history GCSE, the thing that you always say is that the punishment went too far. Because it punished them to the point where you couldn't not be angry. And then that anger is where you always have to say the second World War came from.
Speaker: yeah it boiled up yes it fueled yes the psychology of germany between the world wars is is incredibly interesting and it's insane yeah and that's why german expressionist cinema
Speaker: is so interesting because there's so much culture and media that Germany made between the wars that is a time capsule of those feelings. I just think, I think that's another really interesting thing and I think it adds, it adds to the Nosferatu film.
Speaker: up to you whether you think that's a this is added and it feels more grounded and real or this is added a uncomfortable thing that i now do not want to watch this film it's that kind of thing of like yeah is the possible racist overtones of this film enough to strike it off the list for you kind of idea i don't know i think i still i still want to watch it
Speaker: I've watched it four times. Yeah, I did enjoy it, but I think whilst watching it you've also got to recognise that fact and don't be ignorant or ignore that fact. If that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, 100%. I definitely, I think it's... Yeah, and I portrayals of... I mean, this is...
Speaker: looking at the time this is not the point in time to bring up this discussion but the portrayal of Jewish people in media is extremely interesting because it's that whole issue of is it a religion or is it a ethnicity is so interesting and I think that that's a kind of question that isn't only really present in Judaism you don't get that as much Christianity isn't an ethnicity no but
Speaker: due to the persecution throughout the, like I said, it's not a conversation to get into now. And it's also not necessarily a conversation that I think we are at all. That we are capable of having with our limited knowledge as well. And also with the two of us, I think this is definitely a conversation that I would want more
Speaker: points of view and varied, shall I say, points of view. I think it would be interesting to, you know, at least have something else. But yes, so I'm not going to get into that.
Speaker: But it does make it much more of an interesting film to me. So I guess that's all I really have to say about Nosferatu. I came out swinging. This was my first pick. And I wanted this to be my first pick because it's the first occult horror film. Well right from the get -go you said this film basically.
Speaker: Yeah, because I think this film perfectly encapsulates my feelings of there's a film that you can enjoy and then there's a film that you can enjoy with context and it's more. Yeah. Yeah. So, um, I guess the question is, um, do you think it has improved it in your mind?
Speaker: I think it's given me another level of love for it, if that makes sense, with the whole origin of how the film came to be. I think in my mind it definitely makes it heightened.
Speaker: I think, because again, when I first watched it I was on hold. I probably didn't give it the amount of weight that I feel I should have. I think it definitely gives it so much more. And I love it. Yes. And it's definitely one I will be rewatching. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker: this is a completely different episode because this is a completely different film but there is Nosferatu for Vampire 1979 and it's a German film as well and it is essentially the copyright in a sense ended in 1979 for Dracula in the sense of I don't quite know how copyrights work but it becomes a lot more open after a point
Speaker: Yeah, it's like if you've done a crime and it's not found out until after a certain length of time, then you can't be charged for that crime. But that's like low. Yeah. Yeah. So essentially, in 1979, Dracula's copyright became more open. So a German filmmaker made the film Nosferatu the Vampire.
Speaker: And it's a remake, kind of, of the 1922 Nosferatu. But with a lot more Dracula added in. And they don't bother to change the names because they don't have to. And that's really interesting in terms of comparisons. So, at some point... We shall have to do that.
Speaker: Yes. Yeah. And again obviously dibs. Yeah. Because I again... Yeah, it's your film. And lots to talk about. Yeah. But that's Nosferatu. Yeah. And that's why I love Nosferatu. So, would you like to tell our dear listeners what the next film will be? Yes. Well, the next film is...
Speaker: Death Becomes Her, featuring the brilliant Meryl Streep. God love her. Yeah. And it's a pretty stacked cast. Oh yeah, the cast. It is Meryl Streep, but I cannot really bear with names, but like everyone in that cast. Yeah, especially the top three. Yeah. And this other person, which I will be talking about the cast in the episode. Uh -huh. Yeah.
Speaker: So yes, we will be watching Death Becomes Her next, I'm talking about that. And Mog will be hosting that. So again, if you hate these dulcet tones,
Speaker: You'll be getting more from me next week. Yes. So yeah, that's all we have to say about Nosferatu. And I guess, until next time, keep it blood curdling.
