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Ep. 144 Nina Mata on her debut picture NEW, family and writing for celebrities
32 Plays15 days ago
In this episode, I chat with the insightful Nina Mata—author of A Place for Fire and The Legend of the Hummingbird. We dive into her journey as a writer, debut children's book NEW, the cultural roots that inspire her stories, and how nature, family, and heritage intertwine in her work. Nina shares her thoughts on crafting stories that celebrate resilience, belonging, and the magic found in everyday moments. This conversation is rich with warmth, wisdom, and the power of storytelling.
📚 A Place for Fire and The Legend of the Hummingbird are available wherever books are sold!
Follow Nina Mata:
📸 Instagram: @nina.mata
🐦 Twitter/X: @NinaMataWrites
🌐 Website: www.ninamata.com
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Transcript
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:00
Gary Gray
Awesome. All set?
00:00:02
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:00:03
Gary Gray
Yes. All right. Welcome back, everyone, to another episode of It's Personal. As always, I am super excited for my guest today. um She sent me a book.
00:00:15
Gary Gray
and And you know what? I'm going gloat a little bit. I am super happy for that.
00:00:18
Niña Mata
Oh.
00:00:19
Gary Gray
A beautiful book. I'm going to let her talk about it, but before anything, I'm just super excited for my guest today. um i have been following for a while now, and um definitely someone that I think has done amazing work in the education world for children, the work that she does, um and just continues to do those things. So going to let her introduce herself, and i have a few questions for her. So please.
00:00:45
Niña Mata
Oh, okay.
Nina Mata's Career Journey
00:00:47
Niña Mata
hi my name is Nina Mata and I am a children's book author illustrator and I love doing what I do. This is, it's 2025 and this is my official author era.
00:01:03
Niña Mata
So I have two books, yeah, that came out that I have written. um and illustrated myself. I have been an illustrator for, I think I started in 2010.
00:01:16
Niña Mata
And I don't, I didn't get my first picture book until 2018, 2017.
00:01:17
Gary Gray
wow
00:01:23
Niña Mata
twenty eighteen twenty seventeen And ah ever since then, it's just been a rollercoaster ride. And now I like, I have worked with so many amazing authors that I find myself inspired and wanting to write things on my own now.
00:01:40
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:01:41
Gary Gray
I love that. ah love that.
00:01:42
Gary Gray
And what a journey.
00:01:42
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:01:42
Niña Mata
Yeah. Oh.
00:01:42
Gary Gray
I have so many questions about your journey, um but I always ask this question because I think it's very important.
00:01:45
Niña Mata
Well,
00:01:48
Gary Gray
um Tell me about little you, little Nanya. What did that look like growing up?
Childhood and Family Influence
00:01:56
Niña Mata
ah well I guess it looked like a lot of things. I was as an only child and my mom was a teacher.
00:02:01
Gary Gray
Hmm.
00:02:06
Niña Mata
ah she's She was a teacher for 40 years. And my dad actually was not around when I was born. He was working abroad in Saudi Arabia.
00:02:19
Niña Mata
And from what I gather, it was something about like electrical work for something. He did that for like a whole decade.
00:02:31
Niña Mata
And so i he would come for vacation like every, maybe every seven months.
00:02:31
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:02:37
Niña Mata
So I barely knew him. I didn't know him until, didn't get to know him until I was six. And when my mom sponsored us here to the States and i found myself with him ah lot, trying, getting to know this new place and my dad and our new situation. i mean, in the Philippines, I had tons of cousins. There was at least 12 that I was really close to.
00:03:07
Niña Mata
And i didn't know what an only child felt like until I got here. And it was very lonely. it was like such a big contrast from having lots of family to having just me, my mom, my dad. and you know, it was a was a hard transition.
00:03:28
Niña Mata
was...
00:03:30
Niña Mata
being and you you know, when you're a kid and you get thrown into a school and and it's a new environment and it's a new place, but then, you know, what happens when you're a kid?
00:03:41
Niña Mata
You want your mom and dad with you, but then you can't. It's a school.
00:03:44
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:03:45
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:03:46
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:03:46
Niña Mata
Or I think there was a lot of anxiety going to school because I'm like, okay, from nine to three, I'm going to be on my own trying to dodge bullies, dodge people laughing at me and just like, oh, because of my accent or the way I look or, you know, and it was hard.
00:04:08
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:04:09
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:04:09
Niña Mata
It was really hard at first.
00:04:11
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:04:12
Gary Gray
How did you discover art or just like being creative, the things that you love to do now? Like did that come early on was there something that kind of grew on you as you got older?
00:04:26
Niña Mata
it it was ah It was early on, for sure. My whole family is actually very, very creative. My grandmother is an amazing artist. And um I grew up with my cousin, Rebecca.
00:04:41
Niña Mata
um And we and mine when we would go over to my grandmother's house. She would just you know throw crayons at us. And um there was this chalkboard with, um and and we had a whole bunch of chalk and we would just draw.
00:04:57
Niña Mata
And i mentioned my cousin because she was my main, we were very competitive with each other. She was like a year older than me and she could draw.
00:05:09
Niña Mata
and so I always wanted to one-up her. And so if she drew house, I would try to make a 3D house. It would just start off that way.
00:05:21
Gary Gray
a Wow.
00:05:21
Niña Mata
and And then when I got here, the drawing became something that was was one of the only things that I was able to bring back from the Philippines.
00:05:35
Niña Mata
you know like um and it reminded me of home and it that it became a hum to me and just like, um kind of like a saving grace, just like my safe space.
00:05:46
Gary Gray
Hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:05:48
Niña Mata
And, you know, when you're, we just keep drawing, just keep getting better at it. And my dad would always like became my main, um, competitor or like he just tried to push me to be a little bit better.
00:06:02
Niña Mata
And he was really good.
00:06:03
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:06:03
Niña Mata
He was a very good landscape artist. So he would try to teach me how to draw trees and um palm trees and mountains and yeah.
00:06:14
Gary Gray
I love that because oftentimes i hear from artists know, you know If it doesn't run in the family, family can see not see that as something that you know can become a profession.
00:06:30
Gary Gray
um it is often looked at as just like a passion project or a hobby versus a form of income, right?
00:06:30
Niña Mata
Right.
00:06:31
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:06:35
Niña Mata
but and then and
00:06:39
Gary Gray
So um i think it's really cool to hear that like it started with like grandma and shout out to grandmas and grand and granddads.
00:06:40
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:06:46
Niña Mata
yeah Yeah.
00:06:48
Gary Gray
like they
00:06:48
Niña Mata
like Well, yeah.
00:06:49
Gary Gray
yeah
00:06:50
Niña Mata
i mean, my my family, they're really good and they're really good artists and creative, but you're right. Nobody ever did anything with it. I think I was the only one that actually Um, or my generation did, cause my, I have family, my cousins are graphic designers. And, um, I think the generations before so did see it as that, where it was like, it's just a hobby and it's just something that you're good at personally, but it's like, you can't make a career out of it.
00:07:21
Niña Mata
No way.
00:07:22
Gary Gray
Yeah. And it's so interesting. I think it's a good segue into like one of the questions I have here is like you, you have been able to make a living out of it. And because of that, you've been able to work with such powerful voices in the literary world, in the celebrity world.
00:07:36
Niña Mata
Yes.
00:07:41
Gary Gray
And I'm trying to think, like how was the creative process different when you stepped into the role of both author and illustrator for new Because that could be a little bit different when you're writing a book for somebody else, or sorry, illustrating a book for somebody else versus doing it for you.
00:07:56
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:08:00
Gary Gray
And your ownership is the words and the illustrations as well.
Author and Illustrator Roles
00:08:07
Niña Mata
Yeah, oh, I love that question. um Yeah, was it was, it's different. It is like night and day, because when you went as an illustrator, my job is to add what isn't being said on on the text necessarily, and it is somebody else's story, somebody else's idea, and versus where I am the author and illustrator.
00:08:37
Niña Mata
these are, this is all me. And don't know, I've always thought ah when, when I was an illustrator, I always tell people that I feel like a DJ where like, it's like the, you know, like I'm behind the scenes and then somebody else is, you know, like the MC and let them have the shine.
00:08:41
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:08:55
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:08:57
Niña Mata
And I just, you know,
00:08:58
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:08:59
Niña Mata
I just, I like that. But um when I became an author, it's like now I have to talk to people. And now people want to hear what I have to say.
00:09:12
Niña Mata
And I'm such a, you know, like my friends don't believe me when I say an introvert, but I really am. I'm so shy.
00:09:19
Gary Gray
Same.
00:09:20
Niña Mata
I have social anxiety.
00:09:20
Gary Gray
Me too.
00:09:22
Niña Mata
And now I'm being asked to to talk a lot.
00:09:29
Niña Mata
And just the process of creating are period, when when it comes to your work, there's a lot of pressure. I think I put a lot of pressure on myself when I when i made new, um just in the process of making new.
00:09:45
Niña Mata
um
00:09:45
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:09:46
Niña Mata
I think there was like, you know not only was it, it's my first time um writing and drawing my own picture book,
00:09:57
Niña Mata
It was also the first time that I'm telling the story and I'm being very vulnerable. So I was, there's a lot of um anxiety and pressure that came with doing it.
00:10:05
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:10:11
Niña Mata
Yeah. And even when the book, it was like, I didn't know I would be so vulnerable feeling like, like, you know, like just scared, like what if somebody made fun of it and it's like second grade all over again?
00:10:11
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:10:23
Gary Gray
yeah
00:10:26
Gary Gray
Yeah, yeah. And you do put yourself in a...
00:10:28
Niña Mata
yeah
00:10:30
Gary Gray
When it's your words, you put yourself in a different space as to the illustrations because like someone is taking those words and they are...
00:10:33
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
00:10:44
Gary Gray
And we do. like Even as a teacher, we're analyzing them. like We're analyzing them to figure out.
00:10:47
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm. Right.
00:10:49
Gary Gray
you know We're inferring about things. We're making predictions.
00:10:52
Niña Mata
Right. Mm-hmm.
00:10:54
Gary Gray
um We're trying to comprehend like your story. So as an author, you are you know sitting back and you're wondering, like what are these people thinking?
00:10:58
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:11:03
Niña Mata
Yeah. Yeah. What are they really thinking? Oh my God.
00:11:07
Gary Gray
who but
00:11:08
Niña Mata
but
00:11:08
Gary Gray
But with that, I mean, and I mentioned this to you before, like what a beautiful job that you did. I think that it is...
00:11:14
Niña Mata
Oh, thank you.
00:11:15
Gary Gray
so lyrical and I think you, as always, do such a phenomenal job with bringing your words to life on the page through your illustrations. um And I think I am so excited to see even more of that um because of what you've done.
00:11:31
Gary Gray
So shout outs to you.
00:11:33
Gary Gray
Congratulations to you.
00:11:34
Niña Mata
Oh, thank you.
00:11:35
Niña Mata
Thank you so
00:11:35
Gary Gray
um You did such a such a phenomenal job. And It's so universal. Like new comes in so many different forms, so many different sizes.
00:11:46
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:11:47
Gary Gray
Like that can relate to everybody and not even just kids, but adults as well.
00:11:51
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:11:53
Gary Gray
We are constantly starting new things and having that feeling of just like anxiety and pressure of something new.
00:11:54
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:11:59
Niña Mata
Right.
00:12:00
Gary Gray
So I think it's such a great concept, um but you for you to package it in a way that represents like who you are and your identity
00:12:00
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:12:08
Gary Gray
Such a phenomenal job. Such a phenomenal job.
00:12:10
Niña Mata
Oh, thank you.
00:12:11
Gary Gray
So, no, amazing.
00:12:12
Niña Mata
Yeah, I always, that the story actually came up because ah I went to, i don't know if you've ever heard of Kindling Words.
00:12:23
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:12:24
Gary Gray
Yep.
00:12:26
Niña Mata
And Vanessa Newton-Brantley, she was doing week keynote. And i was just inspired by her speech about when she was a child, she got bullied by a teacher.
00:12:33
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:12:39
Niña Mata
And it was something that was similar to mine. And I went upstairs to my hotel room, just like in tears, just so inspired by it.
00:12:46
Gary Gray
Hmm.
00:12:47
Niña Mata
And I wrote new in like literally 45 minutes.
00:12:51
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:12:52
Niña Mata
Cause it just, it just came pouring out. It just came pouring out. And just the duality of certain words, like, especially like new, like it could come with some positive meanings and then negative and just like how it has a conversation by itself.
00:13:01
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:13:12
Niña Mata
Like sometimes words like new has that conversation with itself.
00:13:13
Gary Gray
yeah
00:13:17
Niña Mata
And I wanted to share that thought.
00:13:17
Gary Gray
Yeah.
Book Inspiration and Approach
00:13:21
Niña Mata
Oh,
00:13:21
Gary Gray
I love that. I love, and shout out to like, I had her on the podcast a while ago and what an inspirational human being.
00:13:28
Gary Gray
Like she, what a gift, like what a gift she is truly to just the world in general.
00:13:28
Niña Mata
My goodness.
00:13:32
Niña Mata
I know. Right. Yeah.
00:13:37
Gary Gray
Like the biggest heart, um, cares so much about the work that she does and the stuff she puts out into the world.
00:13:37
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:13:39
Niña Mata
My goodness.
00:13:42
Niña Mata
Yes.
00:13:43
Gary Gray
But I, I love, I love that she inspired you to write the book.
00:13:47
Niña Mata
Oh, yeah.
00:13:48
Gary Gray
Um,
00:13:49
Niña Mata
She's inspired me from day one.
00:13:51
Gary Gray
shes She's that person.
00:13:53
Niña Mata
Yeah, she is.
00:13:53
Gary Gray
she's And i have never heard her do a keynote, but I have no doubt in my mind but that it was amazing.
00:13:56
Niña Mata
um
00:13:58
Niña Mata
yet one It was amazing. It was amazing.
00:14:01
Gary Gray
Yep.
00:14:01
Niña Mata
And you know, she always ends everything with a song and it's like, not only are you already crying, like ugly crying from her keynote, you're crying from her beautiful voice.
00:14:11
Gary Gray
Totally. Totally.
00:14:13
Niña Mata
ah
00:14:13
Gary Gray
Totally. i have but I have another question. The other question is also about the book. So I'm i'm wondering about just like what you did in regards to like the images and the landscapes and the idea of starting something new in a new environment.
00:14:31
Gary Gray
Like, can you talk a little bit about like what inspired you and how much of your own childhood is actually shaped in this story? It sounds like a lot of it is.
00:14:41
Gary Gray
um Yeah, yeah. yeah
00:14:41
Niña Mata
Yeah, it is.
00:14:44
Niña Mata
Yeah, most most of it, most of the pages are based on on my growing up in Queens. And so when we when we first moved here, you know, like,
00:14:53
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:14:58
Niña Mata
My parents and I didn't have much, so we lived at somebody's basement. and um And then so I added that in the beginning. And then I made sure to add Tupperware that was recycled, you know, from like, you know, um my parents would pack me like I don't know, full a full meal with like rice and um like stew, like a Filipino stew, menudo.
00:15:27
Gary Gray
e
00:15:27
Niña Mata
And it was in a packaged in a, what is it?
00:15:27
Gary Gray
a
00:15:32
Niña Mata
Like a butter, like a butter container.
00:15:33
Gary Gray
ah ha ahha i
00:15:37
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:15:37
Gary Gray
That is crazy. Wow. Wow. it's so funny i have It's so funny. I have the book here. So i want to show you one of my favorite spreads. It's okay.
00:15:45
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:15:45
Gary Gray
I have the book here. One of my favorite. I mean, I have lots of favorite spreads, but I'm going to show you the one that I really, really love.
00:15:48
Niña Mata
yeah
00:15:51
Gary Gray
And I just love how you play with perspective so well. And you do this in a lot of your books. I'm assuming it's intentional.
00:15:57
Niña Mata
Oh, yeah.
00:15:59
Gary Gray
but
00:15:59
Niña Mata
Yeah, yes.
00:16:00
Gary Gray
Yeah. So like, this is one of my favorite, favorite spreads. This one.
00:16:05
Niña Mata
Oh, yeah.
00:16:06
Gary Gray
It makes me so happy.
00:16:10
Niña Mata
Oh.
00:16:10
Gary Gray
It makes me so happy.
00:16:10
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:16:11
Gary Gray
And I think part of it is also just like the idea around, you know, um
00:16:19
Gary Gray
Oftentimes you look at books and they tend to... ah follow one type of pattern and it doesn't make your eyes or your brain like do anything other than just absorb what's there.
00:16:26
Niña Mata
me
00:16:31
Gary Gray
i think what you do a really good job of is you make, you almost play tricks on the person's eyes and you make, you almost force them to look at things differently.
00:16:31
Niña Mata
Right.
00:16:40
Gary Gray
You do that throughout all of your books. That's what's something I appreciate about you so much.
00:16:43
Niña Mata
thank you.
00:16:45
Gary Gray
That's just one page. There's a lot of pages that like. You,
00:16:48
Niña Mata
Oh, thank you. know i ah huh Yeah, no, good, good.
00:16:51
Gary Gray
you, you've, Go ahead. Sorry. Go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. you ah the other The other question that i'm thinking about is like, you also did this beautiful middle grade book um for like trailblazing, you know, Asian American women.
00:17:08
Gary Gray
And um again, I'm not surprised, but how do you balance the storytelling and...
00:17:11
Niña Mata
yeah
00:17:16
Gary Gray
you know, the like educational aspects in that way that still feels, you know, joyful, engaging and kid-centered.
00:17:26
Gary Gray
Because you did a phenomenal job with that one as well, but it's a very tight, a very different type of book, obviously.
00:17:29
Niña Mata
oh
00:17:32
Niña Mata
yeah yeah yes
00:17:33
Gary Gray
Right. So how did you, yeah. How did you balance the storytelling along with the education?
00:17:39
Niña Mata
So with Girls to the Front, 40 Asian-American women who blazed a trail, um i I love this show. Like, honestly, I'm going to just spill the tea. I just, i mean I love this show called Drunk History.
00:17:56
Niña Mata
yeah Have you ever watched that?
00:17:56
Gary Gray
Hmm. I have it
00:17:59
Niña Mata
It's on Comedy Central. If you haven't watched it, go watch it. It's funny. It's so funny. But then it's also educational. So its um it's like a whole bunch of um actors and they reenact a scene in history, but the person who's telling it is a little inebriated. So...
00:18:23
Gary Gray
I love that.
00:18:23
Niña Mata
They have to, they they end up telling the story in the most casual way.
00:18:30
Niña Mata
And that's how I wanted, it not drunk. I didn't want to tell story drunk, but like I wanted to tell it in the most casual conversational way because as a kid, hated history. I really did. I did not get it. i didn't know what the importance of learning our history was.
00:18:49
Niña Mata
um And no one bothered to tell me the importance of what it it was just like, you need to learn this to pass the class. And it was just, um just one of those things. And I just didn't understand that there's power behind knowing what our history is about.
00:19:04
Niña Mata
And there's also a lot of key lessons that, that we are missing out if we aren't learning about certain people's contributions to society.
00:19:18
Niña Mata
And
00:19:19
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:19:20
Niña Mata
when I became a mom that became more heightened for me, like for me to like, I grew up, you know, like not seeing that representation for my community a lot. And I didn't want my daughter, like, you know, having to search so hard, like I did looking for somebody to model or look up to.
00:19:48
Niña Mata
I wanted her to have and see these women who are doing all these things. And wanted her to see the the options and um and the opportunities that she could have for herself.
00:20:02
Niña Mata
Should she just like, just take the leap and just keep going and just find something that she loves and just do it. um and
00:20:10
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:20:13
Niña Mata
I kind of wrote the book in a way where she would understand it and then read it. And also little me, basically, because this is for the girl who did not like history.
00:20:24
Gary Gray
ah
00:20:24
Niña Mata
and
00:20:25
Niña Mata
i kind of wanted to tell that story in a way where it kind of hooks you and kind of, you know, like sticks and just kind of tell that story of how how they did it in the most conversational way possible.
00:20:31
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:20:40
Gary Gray
I love that. i love that. And I think it's so funny how authors... consistently write the books that they've wanted.
00:20:47
Niña Mata
Oh, yeah.
00:20:47
Gary Gray
And I think that is one of the things that drives a lot of authors, illustrators to do what they do.
00:20:52
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:20:54
Gary Gray
It's like, I didn't have it, so I'm going to create it. And that continues to drive them throughout their career.
00:20:57
Niña Mata
Right.
00:21:00
Gary Gray
So...
Motherhood and Creativity
00:21:01
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:21:01
Gary Gray
I think that's beautiful. And your daughter's going to going to, if not already, love that book. Like, what a gift that she's going to have when she...
00:21:08
Niña Mata
Yeah. Aw.
00:21:10
Gary Gray
Yeah. And and and that's a great segue to my next question is like, what is what are some of the things you love about being a mama?
00:21:11
Niña Mata
Thank you.
00:21:19
Niña Mata
Oh, what what do I love about... Oh my gosh. I mean, it's just fun. It's like it's like looking... It's like reliving your childhood, but then just kind of...
00:21:33
Niña Mata
um you know, like softly hugging the rough parts that um you wish somebody did for you.
00:21:46
Niña Mata
Does that make sense?
00:21:46
Gary Gray
Hmm, yes, it Mm-hmm.
00:21:47
Niña Mata
i don't know if that makes sense.
00:21:47
Gary Gray
yes it does it does
00:21:48
Niña Mata
Like you're trying to smooth out all the, like it's, yeah. Like I do not explain it. um But then it's also like watching her grow up is, is,
00:22:05
Niña Mata
so surreal sometimes and just like and just like it makes me have a better relationship with my own mother because I didn't understand
00:22:15
Gary Gray
Hmm.
00:22:18
Niña Mata
um you know, like again, she would come home and she would have no patience for me, but i get it now because adulting is tiring.
00:22:25
Gary Gray
Yes.
00:22:29
Niña Mata
so um with that knowledge, with that experience and um with my daughter, I make sure that I'm a little bit more patient with her and and understanding.
00:22:43
Gary Gray
Mm-hmm.
00:22:46
Niña Mata
And You know, my my parents, when we came here, they were on survival mode and all they did was work and just hustle and didn't really have time for me. And what I am loving about being a mom now is that i I'm grateful that I have this career where i can set my own schedule and I can actually spend time with my kid and...
00:23:15
Niña Mata
in a way that is also kind of healing my inner child.
00:23:19
Gary Gray
a
00:23:19
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:23:21
Gary Gray
I love that that.
00:23:21
Niña Mata
Right.
00:23:21
Gary Gray
That was such a beautiful answer.
00:23:24
Niña Mata
Yes.
00:23:26
Gary Gray
That is such a beautiful answer. I love all of that for you. And I mean, again, what a gift it is to have the opportunity to spend so much time with her as well.
00:23:26
Niña Mata
yeah
00:23:35
Niña Mata
yeah
00:23:35
Gary Gray
Because like, you know, oftentimes you, i mean, as a teacher, I see it so much in school where parents are constantly working and I get it. I totally understand it.
00:23:45
Niña Mata
Yeah, I get it. Yeah.
00:23:46
Gary Gray
Right. So i think that is amazing. You talk a little bit about Bob Ross and reading rainbow.
00:23:50
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:23:54
Gary Gray
You do.
00:23:54
Niña Mata
was going to wear my Bob Ross shirt today.
00:23:56
Gary Gray
You should have. You should have. And you talk so much about creating your own books. So what has stayed like consistent in your like creative practice?
00:24:07
Gary Gray
And what has like evolved over time? Because you have been illustrating for a while. You have been writing for a while. like What has stayed relatively the same? What are some things that he has evolved?
00:24:21
Niña Mata
Well, technically, the my emotions are still, you know, there's they're still there. the The playfulness is still there.
00:24:27
Gary Gray
um
00:24:30
Niña Mata
of What has changed? I mean, what has stayed consistent? Funny enough, I think
00:24:38
Niña Mata
um knowing when to pivot has stayed consistent for me.
00:24:42
Gary Gray
and
00:24:43
Niña Mata
From the beginning of my career to now, Um, when something feels when I've been doing the same thing over and over, and then it doesn't feel as exciting anymore.
00:24:55
Niña Mata
i know it's time to pivot. So I, i end up experimenting that is consistent. The playing, giving myself the space and time to also play with my art and and try to find new ways to have fun with it.
00:25:10
Gary Gray
he
00:25:14
Niña Mata
That has stayed consistent for sure.
00:25:16
Gary Gray
Wow, that powerful.
00:25:16
Niña Mata
And I think that is what keeps the my work um fresh. And that's, I think that's how, I don't know.
00:25:27
Niña Mata
yeah I guess that's how I've been doing this for a long time.
00:25:28
Gary Gray
and that's ah It's incredible. That's incredible. And I think that's such a great, you know, tip for any creator or any person who is trying to, you know, develop something like being able, I think play is very underrated.
00:25:46
Gary Gray
It's not done enough for adults, especially kids.
00:25:47
Niña Mata
Oh yeah. Yeah.
00:25:52
Gary Gray
um
00:25:52
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:25:53
Gary Gray
As a teacher, sometimes I am guilty as well as not allowing them enough play. I think that is where the best education happens is when kids are playing. I think
00:26:04
Niña Mata
Right.
00:26:04
Gary Gray
it is so important that you allow kids and yourself to just do and be, and instead of being in the mud all the time, right?
00:26:13
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:26:14
Gary Gray
And I love that that has stayed consistent for you, because that is really hard.
00:26:15
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:26:19
Gary Gray
That is really, really hard, right?
00:26:19
Niña Mata
Yeah. Yeah. But it's also like, it's natural because you know, like you do evolve whether or not you, you want to or not, you do end up the work changes for sure.
00:26:34
Niña Mata
But it flows better once you do accept that there is change and you recognize it.
00:26:39
Gary Gray
Agreed.
00:26:41
Niña Mata
And you're like, okay, let's let's have fun as we yeah.
00:26:41
Gary Gray
ah Agreed. Agreed. i agree. And I think it's it'st it it makes me think about some of the things that I've written and how you were able to write new. Like you had an idea and sometimes when you don't have those ideas,
00:27:00
Gary Gray
you could try to force things. And that's when it gets hard. When you're like trying to force something that's not there.
00:27:04
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:27:06
Gary Gray
You had an idea, it was sparked by something, could go and write it then.
00:27:06
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:27:10
Gary Gray
Versus trying to bring something out of thin air, which is like, it's like, it's impossible.
00:27:11
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:27:17
Niña Mata
Yeah, um I have like so many half finished manuscripts in my Dropbox that don't go anywhere because I am forcing it.
00:27:18
Gary Gray
It's so hard.
00:27:28
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:27:29
Gary Gray
Yeah, and that was one of the things i I learned early on, writing specifically to be published. Like when I first was writing, I was just writing for the enjoyment of writing, collecting ideas, collecting poems.
00:27:40
Niña Mata
me
00:27:43
Niña Mata
yeah
00:27:43
Gary Gray
And then when I got into publishing, the first book flew out of me, took a lot of editing and revising. And then the second one, I was forcing it. Like it wasn't coming from a place of like, my things are like family, right?
00:27:58
Gary Gray
home, identity, belonging.
00:28:01
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:28:01
Gary Gray
like And if it's not wrapped in those things, it doesn't feel good. It never feels good, right?
00:28:05
Niña Mata
Right, right.
00:28:06
Gary Gray
um So when you say that, like being able to just play, it's such a good reminder.
00:28:11
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:28:12
Gary Gray
It's such a good reminder.
00:28:13
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:28:14
Gary Gray
Yeah, I love that.
00:28:14
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:28:15
Gary Gray
So thank you. Thank you for sharing that. I'm going to put that in my pocket because selfishly, I always tell people this podcast is for people to listen to, but it's also for me well.
00:28:18
Niña Mata
and
00:28:24
Niña Mata
Oh, for me too.
00:28:25
Gary Gray
ah
00:28:28
Gary Gray
It's very healing. Very, very healing.
00:28:30
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:28:30
Gary Gray
So we have... editors who are, you know, an editor who is the same.
00:28:35
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:28:35
Gary Gray
And I'll talk about her just a little bit. So I didn't have her originally, um but I've had her for the last few. um i have a couple books coming out and she's been the the person for those, which I'm super excited about.
00:28:49
Gary Gray
um I think she, yeah, I might have spilled the beans a little bit, but that's okay.
00:28:49
Niña Mata
Oh my gosh. had no idea. Congratulations.
00:28:54
Gary Gray
She, she, one thing i love about her is number one is like, she, is so authentic in who she is.
00:29:02
Gary Gray
um and it sounds, for me, it sounds like home. When I speak to her and I talk to her, it feels like home, which is really nice.
00:29:02
Niña Mata
Mm-hmm.
00:29:09
Niña Mata
Mm.
00:29:10
Gary Gray
um And she's super honest about her feelings around manuscripts and thoughts around things.
00:29:11
Niña Mata
Mm.
00:29:14
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:29:17
Gary Gray
So I love that. um But how has it been working
00:29:18
Niña Mata
Mm.
Collaborations and Notable Projects
00:29:20
Gary Gray
with her?
00:29:20
Gary Gray
How long have you been working with her? um And what are some of the processes or steps that you guys go through as like, writer, illustrator and editor.
00:29:32
Niña Mata
Oh, gosh.
00:29:35
Niña Mata
Oh, Luana. I love her. she a So we started with I Promise, actually.
00:29:41
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:29:41
Niña Mata
um Yeah. i I mean, I've heard about her i um from Tamar Maze. and and then um once we started working on I Promise and that took off, she...
00:30:00
Niña Mata
We actually met during like ah like a celebration, for like just like a quiet lunch. and we ended up staying for an extra hour or two and just chit-chatting about nothing.
00:30:13
Gary Gray
Wow. Yeah.
00:30:15
Niña Mata
And, you know, like when you click with somebody, you just feel it. So it just, it's like you said, she she feels like home and she doesn't, um it's not,
00:30:29
Niña Mata
fake? Is that the right word for it It's not, um there's there's a level of authenticity with her where you end up trusting what she says and you're like, um okay, she's real.
00:30:32
Gary Gray
yeah
00:30:44
Niña Mata
She's like, she she will tell you how it is exactly, you know you know, like, and she doesn't mean to hurt feelings or anything like that.
00:30:45
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:30:49
Gary Gray
who who
00:30:55
Niña Mata
She she just wants to be honest with you. And I, you really appreciate that about her.
00:31:02
Gary Gray
yeah
00:31:04
Niña Mata
Yeah, she is very sincere.
00:31:04
Gary Gray
i
00:31:05
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:31:06
Gary Gray
She is and so authentic. And I, again, I've, I've had her for maybe, i want to say two and a half years or so, maybe.
00:31:16
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:31:17
Gary Gray
um Yeah.
00:31:18
Niña Mata
So we
00:31:23
Niña Mata
Maybe the same? Like four, four three or four years? Yeah.
00:31:27
Gary Gray
Yeah.
00:31:27
Niña Mata
She's amazing yeah
00:31:29
Gary Gray
Such, such an amazing human, such an amazing editor.
00:31:32
Niña Mata
yeah and an amazing editor yeah she really and she doesn't like um over correct she makes she asks questions that's what i like that she makes you think and then she makes you inspire to rewrite or rethink or relook at something it's not like oh change this completely change that it's it's um
00:31:33
Gary Gray
Yeah. yeah
00:31:41
Gary Gray
Yeah,
00:31:48
Gary Gray
yeah. yeah
00:31:57
Niña Mata
such a collaborative experience with her.
00:32:00
Gary Gray
and i can't And I can't finish the podcast without asking you, like, how is it working?
00:32:01
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:32:07
Gary Gray
I mean, you did iPro...
00:32:09
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:32:09
Gary Gray
I have to ask. but i have to ask the question. Like, how did that... Yeah, I don't even know how to ask the question, but how did that... What did that look like?
00:32:21
Gary Gray
um I see the picture in the back there. I'm just... I'm lost for words. I'm just lost for words.
00:32:30
Niña Mata
I see them every day.
00:32:32
Gary Gray
It's crazy. It's so crazy. It's so crazy.
00:32:34
Niña Mata
But yeah, I promise it was such a wonderful experience. um And i mean, it started off just the as an illustrator, you do when you when you get offered like a celebrity book, they most of the time it's um they do ask for like an art sample.
00:32:56
Niña Mata
And I don't know who I was up against. I don't know. But they they told me to illustrate one page. And um I did. And I just you know ah just through i threw in my honest self and just just drew what I felt like drawing.
00:33:14
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:33:15
Niña Mata
And that that that's how it started.
00:33:18
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:33:18
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:33:19
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:33:20
Niña Mata
yeah
00:33:21
Gary Gray
I think it's so interesting.
00:33:22
Niña Mata
and I really wouldn't when I heard when my agent called me like she's like, you got it. i was like, wait, what?
00:33:29
Gary Gray
That is a wild.
00:33:31
Niña Mata
Yeah. And it wasn't even colored.
00:33:32
Gary Gray
thought
00:33:32
Niña Mata
It was like in black and white, like a rough sketch. And i was like, for real?
00:33:38
Gary Gray
And what a testament to you just like leaning into like what you felt being your authentic self, not changing like who you are, though it is like, you know, a person who has, you know, lots going on in the world.
00:33:43
Niña Mata
Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah.
00:33:52
Gary Gray
Right.
00:33:52
Gary Gray
And I think that's so cool that you were like, well, I'm just, if they're asking for me, I'm going to give them me.
00:33:52
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:33:53
Niña Mata
All
00:33:58
Gary Gray
And if it works out, it works out. So I'm glad it worked out for you. Can you,
00:33:58
Niña Mata
right.
00:34:02
Niña Mata
Yeah. And it was also the message of the book. I put, I tucked away the person behind the book and I read the message of the book and it resonated with me so much that it, yes, it was LeBron James, but the message of the book was so important that I,
00:34:09
Gary Gray
and I love that. up
00:34:22
Niña Mata
And it and just like, it's everything that I stand for. So it just kind of it just kind of meshed together perfectly, actually.
00:34:27
Gary Gray
you
00:34:30
Gary Gray
I love that. i love that. ah love that. You know i had to ask.
00:34:38
Gary Gray
a Everyone asks.
00:34:38
Niña Mata
Everyone asks, even like school visits. That's the first question I get asked. Have you met LeBron?
00:34:46
Gary Gray
that i Yeah, I mean, yes, he is very lucky to have had you as an illustrator.
00:34:53
Niña Mata
oh
00:34:54
Gary Gray
Very lucky. Very, very lucky. Can we ask, and what to do what other aspirations you have if it's okay? Is there other things that you have coming out?
00:35:05
Gary Gray
What are some things you're thinking about for the future?
00:35:09
Niña Mata
um I do have a couple of things that that are coming out. I'm writing more. um Yeah.
00:35:17
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:35:19
Niña Mata
And i'm writing more and i am my My goal, one of my goals is to write a middle grade novel about a fantasy ah book about Filipino mythology and that meets modern world.
00:35:39
Gary Gray
wow
00:35:42
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:35:42
Gary Gray
Wow.
00:35:43
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:35:43
Gary Gray
That would be good. So good.
00:35:46
Gary Gray
Where can people find mean, have...
00:35:46
Niña Mata
Oh.
00:35:49
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:35:50
Gary Gray
where can people find
00:35:51
Niña Mata
How about you? Are you doing anything?
00:35:53
Gary Gray
i mean i have its oh Yes, I have a few that I can share. So I have the one that should be i should get a cover relatively soon um for the second book called Spending Time.
00:36:04
Niña Mata
Okay.
00:36:08
Gary Gray
And I'm just super excited about it. The second book in the two book contract that I had with I'm From.
00:36:16
Gary Gray
And it's just about it about me and my grandfather. And it's about the concept of time and how time is the only thing that we can't really control and how it can slowly
00:36:16
Niña Mata
All right.
00:36:26
Niña Mata
any
00:36:30
Gary Gray
and quickly disappear. um And it's, I think, one of those books where, you know, and makes me think about him. He's not with me anymore.
00:36:41
Gary Gray
But it also just think reminds me about how precious time is with the people that you love the most, because you just don't know.
00:36:46
Niña Mata
Right, right.
00:36:49
Gary Gray
yeah really just don't know.
00:36:50
Niña Mata
Oh my gosh.
00:36:51
Gary Gray
Yeah. So I'm super excited about it.
00:36:53
Niña Mata
That's beautiful.
00:36:55
Gary Gray
And then I have the my third book with um a new illustrator ah called Unlimited will be coming out. if think gets us twenty twenty s seven I think I mean, just like...
00:37:08
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:37:09
Gary Gray
and he's phenomenal i mean just like looking at the work that he does online and the excitement that he has for the book. Um, and that's all about like a sense of belonging and, you know, having no limits to like who you are.
00:37:28
Gary Gray
in sports and education and appearance and size and shape, et cetera.
00:37:30
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:37:35
Gary Gray
um and that's a book. It's so interesting because you talk about new and how you wrote new and how it just like kind of poured out of you.
00:37:40
Niña Mata
Yeah. yeah
00:37:42
Gary Gray
um This was a book that came, poured out of me way back in like 2020 during all the protests and all the stuff.
00:37:50
Niña Mata
Uh huh. Yes.
00:37:51
Gary Gray
Right. And I wrote it almost right after I'm from, and I kind of sat on it, wasn't sure about it And yeah,
00:37:52
Niña Mata
Yes.
00:37:57
Niña Mata
Thank you.
00:37:58
Gary Gray
I sent it to Luana and she's like, I get it. i understand. um so I'm super excited about that as well. So um yeah, i think I think the journey has been really, really cool. And I love talking to people like you because honestly, it allows me to Here are just fresh eyes on like the publishing world.
00:38:19
Gary Gray
And I continue to be inspired by people like you. So I appreciate your time so much.
00:38:24
Niña Mata
thank you and fair
00:38:28
Gary Gray
ah Where can people find you online? You are online, um but where are some places we can find you?
00:38:33
Niña Mata
yes um i'm usually on ig instagram at ninamata art i was gonna say dot com but just ninamata art it looks like tart
00:38:49
Gary Gray
awesome and let's shout out the new book the new book new has been out for maybe three three two weeks two weeks now
00:38:53
Niña Mata
yeah
00:38:58
Niña Mata
Yeah, two weeks, two weeks.
00:39:01
Gary Gray
two weeks or so.
00:39:01
Niña Mata
It's out.
00:39:02
Gary Gray
um But it's so interesting. like One of the things that I i did realize, but then i didn't realize until I looked again on your website, like you've done some phenomenal like just covers for people that I think some people probably don't know are also yours.
00:39:18
Gary Gray
like I knew that you had always done the stuff for, I'm forgetting what the series is, but the one for like Renee Watson, which I love.
00:39:26
Niña Mata
Yes.
00:39:28
Gary Gray
um You've also done... a few other ones for like the I can, read I have a lot of those in my classroom, actually, the I can read series as well.
00:39:35
Niña Mata
Oh, yay. Yes.
00:39:37
Gary Gray
um But I think some people don't know.
00:39:41
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:39:41
Gary Gray
I think they don't know, but like i you've done.
00:39:42
Niña Mata
Oh, yeah. When I do school visits, they, um and i I have, like, um some of the books that I've done, a lot of, there's a lot of, my God, I know that book.
00:39:51
Gary Gray
and
00:39:54
Gary Gray
Yes, yes, yes.
00:39:56
Niña Mata
Yeah. Yeah.
00:39:57
Gary Gray
But I'm i'm so excited.
00:39:57
Niña Mata
But that's how we are, though. I don't recognize people from faces. I'll recognize you through your your work.
00:40:04
Gary Gray
from the book.
00:40:06
Niña Mata
It's like, oh, I know you. I love your book.
00:40:08
Gary Gray
It's so true. it is so It's so true.
00:40:12
Niña Mata
Yeah.
00:40:13
Gary Gray
It's so true. I want to thank you so much for hanging out. We are connected now. We are people.
00:40:18
Niña Mata
Oh, yes.
00:40:19
Gary Gray
So let's let's hang out again.
00:40:21
Niña Mata
Please. i would love that.
00:40:21
Gary Gray
um i appreciate you so much.
00:40:24
Niña Mata
Yes. Oh, thank you so much for having me.
00:40:27
Gary Gray
Thank you.
00:40:27
Niña Mata
And I'm asleep now.
00:40:32
Gary Gray
all Alright, let me press... I'm gonna press...