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Jessica Berman
139 Plays1 year ago
This is Move The Needle with Rob Kaplan. Where we talk to people who lead, innovate, and inspire. Today on the Move The Needle, Rob talks with Jessica Berman, commissioner of the National Women's Soccer League who has really moved the needle for women in professional sports administration, and she's someone who's had no time to ease into her job.
Jessica Berman is the Commissioner of the National Women’s Soccer League where she oversees all operations of the league with a focus on supporting players on and off the pitch, working with NWSL clubs to continue building on the positive momentum of the league’s growing audience and collaborating with NWSL partners to create the most engaging and entertaining fan experience.
Berman has received a number of distinctions throughout her career in the sports industry. Most recently, she was named Sports Business Journal’s 2022 Best Hire following her first season at the helm of the NWSL.
Berman completed her undergraduate studies at the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor, Michigan, graduating with a degree in Sports Management and Communications. A Brooklyn, New York native, Berman resides in Larchmont, New York, with her two sons and two rescue dogs.
#jessicaberman #nationalwomenssoccerleague #NWSL #womeninsports #womenssoccer #commissioner #womenssoccercommissioner #soccercommissioner #womaninbusiness #players #sportscareer #sportsbusinessjournal #umichigan #sportsmanagement #womenssoccerworldcup #soccerworldcup #soccer2024 #soccerleague #uswomenssoccer #ussf #movetheneedlewithjessicaberman #movetheneedlewithbrobkaplan #samzeff #robkaplan #scottrichardson #ronelgolden
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Transcript
Sports Disciplinary Issues and Accountability
00:00:07
Speaker
This is Move the Needle with Rob Kaplan, where we talk to people who lead, innovate and inspire. You've had a couple of disciplinary issues, which I think pushed you to have to take some difficult stances with at least one or two of your owners.
Revelations of Abuse in Women's Soccer
00:00:24
Speaker
It came out in the fall of 2021 that players had been subject to emotional and sexual abuse. Today on Move the Needle, Rob talks to Jessica Berman, commissioner of the National Women's Soccer League, who has really moved the needle for women in professional
Jessica Berman's Career Aspirations and Brooklyn Roots
00:00:42
Speaker
sports administration. And she's someone who had no time to ease into a job.
00:00:46
Speaker
I first met Jessica Berman over a year ago. We were speaking together on a panel of sports executives. I was really fascinated by her background. I think it's probably the strangest goal for a teenager to have, but I wanted to work in sport management or sport leadership since I was a teenager, actually dating back to my days of growing up in Brooklyn, New York.
00:01:17
Speaker
How weird is that? Well, I take it you were in love sports, including soccer. I fell in love with sports for probably a non-traditional reason. I was obsessed with diversity as a kid. I grew up in Brooklyn, which is a melting pot of people from
00:01:41
Speaker
different backgrounds and went to public school, James Madison High School in Brooklyn and observed firsthand that sport was one of the few things in our social fabric that really unites communities and decided
00:02:00
Speaker
in my high school days that I wanted to be part of and work in an industry that had the power to change the world.
Legal Career and NHL Involvement
00:02:09
Speaker
And very quickly learned about Nelson Mandela and his philosophies on sport and diversity, equity and inclusion. And that's really been the motivator for me to want to pursue a career in sports. In 2002, Jessica went to work for the New York law firm, Proskauer Rose.
00:02:31
Speaker
clients was the National Hockey League. In 2004, the NHL had a player strike.
00:02:45
Speaker
Yes, we represented the NHL and in particular during the 2004-05 collective bargaining negotiations. And speaking of Gary Bettman, here he is now live in New York City. Let's go there now.
00:03:02
Speaker
in the world have treated the greatest fans in the world to a spectacular display of hockey, the greatest sport in the world. It is truly unfortunate that the Union's willingness to partner with us does not extend from international competition in the hockey arena to the collective bargaining arena.
00:03:24
Speaker
We are here today because union leadership refused for more than a year to make any kind of proposal whatsoever and during the same period rejected six separate NHL proposals that would have modernized our league's economic system as other professional sports have done.
00:03:46
Speaker
We represented the NHL and in particular during the 2004-05 collective bargaining negotiations where the league had to shut down for a whole season in order to revamp the economics of
00:04:04
Speaker
collective bargaining agreement to build a sustainable business and I was the lead associate on that matter. So then you eventually joined the NHL and then over a number of years you took a number of positions and broadened your role there. Talk a little bit about your time at the NHL and what you learned.
00:04:26
Speaker
I was there during a period of time starting in 2006 where the league really transcended from more of a niche sports property to a mainstream sports property and became one of the big four and really began to transcend culture in this country. I had the opportunity
Transition to NHL Business and CSR Initiatives
00:04:50
Speaker
to
00:04:51
Speaker
have a front row seat watching Gary Bettman and Bill Daley build the league through their various media deals, through expansion, through how sponsorship and working with non-endemic brands really created the relevance and reach for the league.
00:05:14
Speaker
and watch the organization scale from a couple of hundred people to triple that. In many ways, I feel like I went to commissioner bootcamp working for Henry and seeing how he led and how he really created the foundation and building blocks for the NHL. And after nine years, I approached Gary.
00:05:37
Speaker
and Bill to ask for the opportunity to really change careers and move onto the business side at the NHL. I was really ready for a new challenge and they gave me that opportunity. And talk a little bit about that new challenge. So I was in 2015 moved onto the business side to really
00:06:07
Speaker
begin to build the league's first ever strategic corporate social responsibility work. The league historically had community relations efforts and philanthropy
00:06:21
Speaker
but it wasn't strategically aligned with the league's business challenges. And as we learned watching how the NBA built NBA CARES and their social impact platform and the data around millennials and Gen Zs caring about cause, both from an employee as well as from the next generation of fan perspective,
00:06:48
Speaker
I saw and brought to senior leadership at the NHL an opportunity to recast the way we thought about community impact and leveraging the do good, do well model. In hindsight now, what's the most important thing you did to improve the impact of the league in this area? What's the most important lesson you learned? Yeah, it's a great question.
00:07:17
Speaker
Building what the league now leans on as its diversity, equity, inclusion work, which we built in a way to, to transcend all areas of the business, both internally and externally is the hockey is for everyone initiative, which is now woven into sponsorship packages. It's interwoven into storytelling.
00:07:42
Speaker
on their own denoperated platforms. It's interwoven into what media partners talk about. We know it's ignited a whole movement of activism from NHL players, which had never happened before.
00:08:14
Speaker
If you look at a hockey rink, obviously it's men. There's not an enormous amount of diversity among the players, although there's some. It's got its various characteristics. How did you translate that product into hockey as for everyone? With the theory that you could do good and do well, we know that the country is
00:08:39
Speaker
on its way to being majority, minority, there was a business imperative to think about not just player pipeline, but how the league hires, how the league creates a truly inclusive environment that's built on the values of the league, which are all about
00:08:59
Speaker
teamwork and hard work and humility. And those were values that transcend everything and ultimately need to translate to the kinds of consumers that we were attracting as a business. So it should be that when you go to a game, you look around and the demographics reflect the community where those games are being played.
00:09:24
Speaker
And if that's not the case, then you may find yourself on the wrong path to a long-term viable business because you have to be engaging across section of communities in order to reflect the communities where you play. Ultimately, these are community assets and we are all simply stewards of these community assets. So you have to really look at it from that perspective.
00:09:50
Speaker
So I gather much more involvement by teams in marketing to diverse groups getting involved in at-risk areas and their communities.
00:10:00
Speaker
in addition and doing a lot more to be part of the community. Yeah. Yeah. And that is from every angle that's looking at partnerships in the community with different influencers, both individuals as well as community organizations, thinking about partners who can help you to reach new audiences, thinking about
00:10:22
Speaker
media platforms where you might be able to share stories, highlights, telling the stories of our players, because actually, you know, the NHL has a more diverse player population, I think, than people think. Particularly if you run it through the lens of how global the NHL is. They have teams where people speak six to eight different languages.
00:10:48
Speaker
They have actual barriers in communication, yet they find a way to work as a team. And we really try to lean into that. That's their area of strength.
00:11:00
Speaker
I think diversity, equity, and inclusion is something that sports leadership across the leagues is thinking about, but it's something that almost every CEO in the country that I deal with is thinking about. So why is that? One of the big reasons is that demographics in the United States is changing and changing pretty dramatically. The fastest growing demographic groups in the United States
00:11:27
Speaker
are Hispanic citizens and black citizens. Not only do you need to think about diversity, equity, inclusion with your players, but it's a big issue with your senior executives, with your team, and most importantly, with your community.
Challenges as NWSL Commissioner
00:11:44
Speaker
If you're going to be a successful sports franchise today, you've got to serve the community. You've got to be representative of the community.
00:11:54
Speaker
And I think executives are realizing that if you are, are a team in a diverse community or region, you've got to do more to understand that diversity, represent that diversity. And I think that's a, that's a significant challenge that executives, uh, 20 years ago, didn't have to think about as much in April of 2022, you get the opportunity to become commissioner.
00:12:22
Speaker
of the National Women's Soccer League. Hard decision to move or it's what you had been waiting for? I guess both, if that makes sense. It was not on my radar.
00:12:33
Speaker
It would be unfair for me to suggest I was waiting for that opportunity in particular or this opportunity in particular. It was more like once I learned about the opportunity and it really wasn't until my final interview with the board that it all sort of clicked in my mind that this was really the perfect platform.
00:12:55
Speaker
that it became a no-brainer. And once I walked out of my final interview, I knew that if they made an offer to me that I would accept. Now, as commissioner, obviously there have been a number of challenges through this year. Why don't you talk about what's the biggest adjustment you had to make
00:13:16
Speaker
to becoming commissioner. And what's the biggest challenge you've had in your first year now? I'd say the biggest adjustment is being the decision maker. You know, I think I've always approached my career as if I was the decision maker in that I really always made recommendations to any of my bosses throughout my career, putting myself in their shoes and ensuring I was
00:13:46
Speaker
thinking holistically about all of the consequences and unintended consequences of any particular decision. But it really is different when the buck stops with you. And I don't think I really appreciated that, how different it actually feels when
00:14:05
Speaker
You know, there is no one behind me to lean on in terms of when things go wrong. You know, secondly, I would say just from like a day to day governance perspective, when you're essentially the CEO of a company, I report to 12 different people. That's a very different dynamic than having a boss in terms of really understanding and ensuring that you're
00:14:35
Speaker
executing on the strategic priorities and vision for the league. A lot of it is on a day-to-day basis in my discretion, but always wanting to make sure that I'm in sync with where the ownership group wants the league to go. So it's just a different process from a stakeholder management perspective. So imagine you spend a lot of time with each of the individual owners trying to understand, given collectively, as you say, that's who you report to.
00:15:05
Speaker
Yes, a lot of time. My job is very much to make sure that I have that input and insight so that I could guide our organization because I am also the CEO of the league office and I want to make sure that all the people who report directly or indirectly to me
00:15:27
Speaker
are feeling supported and are getting the benefit of feeling like they're executing on the right strategic priorities. I know in other sports, when I typically think of the commissioner, I think, yeah, they're responsible for all constituencies, but they're ultimately representing the owners. I know you've said in women's soccer, you are very focused on the compensation, equal pay,
00:15:55
Speaker
and upward mobility of your labor force, particularly women's soccer player. Why don't you talk about how women's soccer and your approach might be different than commissioners of other sports? This is really truly a mission driven or purpose driven job. You know, I feel very responsible for ensuring that we're building sustainable and viable business that has
00:16:24
Speaker
the revenue to support the growth of the league, which in turn will put us in a position to be able to pay our players more appropriate salaries.
00:16:39
Speaker
We're very careful about distinguishing between purpose-driven and charity. It's not charity. We don't want investors from an ownership perspective or brand perspective who are doing this for charity. Everyone should expect this to operate like a business. And the net result of that will be that players can get paid more. And we can do that in a sustainable way.
00:17:08
Speaker
I think that's just a different framework
NWSL Disciplinary Reforms and Accountability
00:17:10
Speaker
than any of the other leagues for which I've ever worked in that it is part of the ethos and the long range goals of what we are expected to deliver in that the sustainability of our business will result in
00:17:30
Speaker
are athletes getting paid the kind of money and compensation and be valued the way they should be. But that is one of the North Stars in this, which is, I think, quite unique relative to other sports properties.
00:18:07
Speaker
You've had a couple of disciplinary issues, which I think pushed you to have to take some difficult stances with at least one or two of your owners. You might want to just talk about what you dealt with there and how you handled it. Yeah, so it came out in the fall of 2021 that
00:18:28
Speaker
Players had been subject to emotional and sexual abuse in the league. There was a view that it was, that the abuse was caused not only by some isolated bad actors, but some systemic issues. And on the basis of that conclusion, the league and the player association agreed to jointly investigate
00:18:58
Speaker
essentially the entire history of the league. So the investigation dated back 10 years to the start of the league and included all teams. I'm an employment and labor lawyer by background. In my 20 years, I've never heard of investigation at this scale and scope. I knew that this was ongoing when I was interviewing and ultimately
00:19:25
Speaker
took the job. So I also knew that in order to be able to rehabilitate the league from a trust and credibility perspective, not just externally, but most importantly, internally with the players, that there was going to need to be not just transparency about the investigation and ultimately systemic reform, but to your question about discipline or what we refer to as corrective action.
00:19:52
Speaker
that there would need to be a moment in time where people and individuals and clubs were held accountable for bad decisions that were made. So once the investigation was released on December 14, we began the important process of analyzing who and what
00:20:17
Speaker
individual and club accountability is appropriate in the context of the findings of the investigation. And I gather you made some tough decisions. Yeah, we did. From an individual perspective, there were coaches who are banned for life. We have other coaches who we've offered an opportunity to rehabilitate with us and we've offered them education and training to be eligible for future employment.
00:20:46
Speaker
From a financial disciplinary perspective, we had fines ranging from $25,000 to $1.5 million. And I gather there are at least one or two owners that you're suggesting to them they sell their franchises. Well, there are two owners who independently concluded that they should sell their franchises and the league is supporting them in doing that. What
Financial and Ethical Ownership Criteria
00:21:14
Speaker
makes a great
00:21:16
Speaker
A few things come to mind. First being that they have the financial wherewithal to do this. It's not for the faint of heart in terms of the investment that's required. It's not just the purchase of the asset, but on a operational level, you have to invest real dollars to expect these assets to thrive.
00:21:46
Speaker
And so we want people who both have the money and are willing to invest it and see the opportunity for a return on their investment. We want people who look at this as a business, who are investing in this for the right reasons and who are. A nice way of saying if they need to fund losses after they buy the team, you wanted to have the financial wherewithal if necessary to fund losses.
00:22:13
Speaker
Absolutely. Yeah. And it's a high growth business. So the expectation is that it's going to grow. The value is going to grow. To get there is going to require real investment. And we're really clear with investors coming in the door that we're in the early stages. So we want to be a high growth company. And so we want people who have higher risk tolerance in that regard.
00:22:41
Speaker
We want people who understand how to and are willing to listen and learn to their partner from their partners around the board table, the other owners and, you know, empower the league to really execute on their strategic vision. You know, we want we want good people. We want people who.
00:23:04
Speaker
who are values aligned with the league, who get it in terms of what social issues we're trying to address through this business. We really do feel like the people who are attracted and being attracted to this league are those kinds of people. It really does
Leadership Philosophy and Advice for Women
00:23:26
Speaker
self-select those kinds of people.
00:23:29
Speaker
All right. Let me, let me shift gears and we're going to, we're in the home stretch here. I'm going to ask you a few questions about your philosophy and advice you would give to others in their careers. And let's just start. If you had to describe your leadership philosophy. Um, I would describe it as a collaborative and probably the best way to answer your question is
00:23:54
Speaker
with Ruth Bader Ginsburg's quote, fight for the things you care about, but do it in a way that will lead others to join you. That's really my leadership philosophy. I believe that you have to stand for something, but I try to lead with the honey, not vinegar approach and bring people along, even if it might take a little bit longer. I believe in trying to build consensus. I believe in transparency and
00:24:24
Speaker
communication and collaboration. I believe in listening to other people's perspectives and surrounding yourself with people who think differently. I do think it gets you to the right result. If you had to give advice to women in their careers who either are leaders or who aspire to leadership, what advice would you give to women? I think it would be to be authentic
00:24:54
Speaker
to yourself, be aware, be very self-aware. This would be advice to anyone, really. Really take an active role in your own self-reflection and determine what accountability or changes you can make that will allow for you to be effective in your role.
00:25:21
Speaker
I've definitely had my share of situations in my career where I felt like I was struggling to achieve my intended result or intended outcome. And you can vacillate between blaming others or figuring out what you could do differently.
00:25:42
Speaker
If you had to give advice to younger folks listening who aspire, and I have these conversations myself frequently with younger people who want to be in sports management or leadership, and boy, it's hard to find a way to get into the space, what advice would you give them? Yeah, I would cast your net wide. I think the sports industry has
00:26:11
Speaker
broadened so much from the time that I was coming out of college where the thought was like, if you want to work in sports, you have to work at a league or a team, or you have to be an agent. And there are so many other industries who support sports that are adjacent to sports that could allow for you to be part of the sports ecosystem, whether it's on the media side or the brand side.
00:26:37
Speaker
medical side, you know, there are so many adjacencies to this growing industry that I think it actually provides opportunities for more people to work in sports if you redefine how you categorize working in sports. And I noticed one of the interesting lessons I think from your career, you went and got a law degree, you became an expert in an area, which was law.
00:27:07
Speaker
And then you built on that. Is that a good guide maybe to others for how to think about a way to enter sports? I think the lesson learned there is that this is a very competitive industry. And anytime you're trying to work in a competitive industry, you have to recognize that the people making hiring decisions will want to hire the best. And so.
00:27:34
Speaker
For whatever area you're coming from, your job is to have the best candidacy, which means that you need to be good at what you do. And ultimately, it's not rocket science. So once you're in the door and can demonstrate that you have capacity and capabilities beyond what you're actually doing, so long as you're doing your day job, well, at least in my experience, there are opportunities to scale into other areas.
00:28:04
Speaker
And being a sports fan is not enough to make that dream a reality. Obviously in this
Inclusivity and Transgender Participation in Sports
00:28:12
Speaker
day and age we're dealing with, you talked about a range of issues in terms of diversity, equity, inclusion. One of the diversity, equity, inclusion subjects is in women's sports.
00:28:24
Speaker
at least increasingly on the media is a transgender issue where you have people who've changed genders and become female athletes. What's your approach or philosophy in women's soccer about how dealing and managing transgender participants? Yeah, that's a great question. And I think this will be a question that all leagues and sports are going to face.
00:28:53
Speaker
We actually have two players in our league who are non-binary and do not identify as female.
00:29:01
Speaker
And the approach we've taken in my nine months here is number one, to recognize and be appropriately conscious and sensitive to their identity, their gender identity. And the way that shows up for us is most importantly from a communications perspective.
00:29:28
Speaker
We launch an education program for our on-air talent to ensure that they understand the ramifications of referring to someone as a she when they are a they. Starting with their hearts and then going to their minds by giving them real lessons and tactics for being able to shift their language, particularly when they're calling a live broadcast.
00:29:58
Speaker
We, the league before this season and even this season a few times has had issues where the talent on air are referring to players who do not identify as female as she. We're, we're trying to approach it from a place of everybody's on a journey of learning and recognizing that we as a league have a responsibility to provide the tools and resources to set people up for success.
00:30:25
Speaker
In terms of our policy, we're consulting with subject matter experts all the time to make sure that we're at the forefront of how to be the most progressive league in this area. I would say there isn't a clear best answer and we'll continue to be nimble as we listen and learn to the people from the community about the best way to support being the most inclusive league.
00:30:53
Speaker
If someone
Balancing Career and Family Responsibilities
00:30:54
Speaker
listening wants to learn more about women's soccer, they want to figure out do they have a local team, how they can watch it, how they can get involved in it. What advice would you give those listening to how they can get more involved in women's soccer and learn more about your league? Well, definitely you can watch no matter where you live on CBS platform. We do have teams in 12 markets, soon to be 14.
00:31:23
Speaker
Um, there, I have personally fallen in love with the sport. Um, and I think there's no substitute for attending a game live. Super exciting. I personally love the running clock. Um, it's, it's great from a fan perspective. You, you can really like plan around a finite period of time. Like, you know, the game's going to be over in basically two hours.
00:31:48
Speaker
which is great. And obviously social media, all of those places. From a business perspective, yeah, I mean, all of our teams, I believe they all hire interns. We hire interns. I think there are lots of opportunities to get involved. Okay. And you mentioned the two hour game and the need to manage your time. I know you're a working mom,
00:32:17
Speaker
So you're your CEO and head of a league and you've got a big job being a mother. How do you balance those two and any lessons you've learned from this experience on how to balance those two things? Yeah, I I've learned a lot of lessons and the approach that I've taken which has worked well for me is to treat my children almost the way that I would treat
00:32:45
Speaker
any stakeholder group that I work with. So if you want people to support you in what you're doing, particularly where it requires compromise, they need to understand the why. They need to understand context. And that's, in my experience, been true with my kids as well.
00:33:06
Speaker
My kids know everything that's going on in my work life. They know when I have a board meeting, they know when I'm dealing with a franchise issue. They know when I'm dealing with hiring someone and it's taking up a lot of my time.
00:33:21
Speaker
so that they understand why it's important for them to sacrifice having me around during that particular day, week or month. And it's really worked well for me. My kids, you know, they definitely trust them in terms of confidentiality. They know everything going on. But they also like, it makes them want to support me. You know, I don't have
00:33:44
Speaker
Thankfully, friction or conflict at home where they're sort of complaining about how much I work, they get it. And I think that's because I give them the respect of understanding what I'm doing and why it matters.
Preview of Future Episodes
00:33:58
Speaker
Jessica Berman, congratulations on your success so far. We're gonna be rooting for you and women's soccer. And thank you so much for your leadership. Thank you.
00:34:16
Speaker
Next time on Move the Needle with Rob Kaplan.
00:34:30
Speaker
But they also had seen a broadcast early in the morning, the very first one out of Topeka in the morning. Mike Wallace was doing the morning news. They were impressed by the law degree and the license. And today everybody's a lawyer, it seems like, but then it was unusual. The making of America's Anchorman. Rob talks to Bill Curtis, who is a big voice, a remarkable journalist, and an entrepreneur.
00:34:57
Speaker
Move the Needle with Rob Kaplan is produced and edited by Sam Zeff and Scott Richardson and I'm executive producer Renele Golden. We want to thank Michelle Brown and Zorik's team from Hello Studios for help with production and logistics. Do not forget to subscribe to Move the Needle wherever you get your podcasts and to Rob's YouTube channel. Until next time, this was Move the Needle with Rob Kaplan.