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Free Interview Episode - Mateo Retegui Deep Dive With Dan Edwards (Ep. 308)
1.3k Plays3 years ago
Carlo welcomes onto the show Buenos Aires-based Argentine football journalist Daniel Edwards, who gives us a full profile on new Italy and Tigre striker Mateo Retegui.
Every interview episode as well as the weekly Monday review episode of The Italian Football Podcast are always free for all.
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Transcript
Introduction and Special Episode Overview
00:00:02
Speaker
Welcome to the Italian football podcast. Hello, everybody, and welcome to the Italian football podcast. I'm Carlo Garganese. And today we have a special podcast ahead of the Italy versus England Euro 2024 qualifier that takes place on Thursday in Naples.
Matteo Retegui's Call-up to Italy
00:00:21
Speaker
The biggest story ahead of that game has been Roberto Mancini's call up of Matteo Rotegi
00:00:28
Speaker
Ratecki is a 23-year-old Argentine-born striker who is on loan at Tigre in the Argentine Primera division from Boca Juniors. He has been naturalised to play for Italy on account of having an Italian grandmother. And I would say that until about a week or so ago, most Italian football fans probably hadn't even heard of this player.
00:00:52
Speaker
and still now know very, very little about him. So we've invited an Argentine, one of the top Argentine football journalists, Daniel Edwards, to come onto the pod and tell us about Retegmi. Dan writes for for goal for pedafield.com and many, many others. He's regularly appears on TV, radio and online.
00:01:16
Speaker
so he really really knows his Argentine football, especially the domestic leagues, so there's no better person to have on the pod to talk about Rotegi. So Dan thanks so much for coming on. First of all, how are you doing in these months after Argentina winning the World Cup?
Celebrations in Argentina Post World Cup Win
00:01:35
Speaker
Hello, Carlo. Thank you for that very, very kind introduction. I'll try my best to live up to it. It's been a brilliant start to 2023. Obviously, that World Cup win for Argentina was just so much fun. The spot for weeks and weeks really are celebrations. I think even mid-January, late January, we're hearing, still hearing random snippets of mucha chos ringing out from
00:02:02
Speaker
from rooftops and from parties around the city. Just something to treasure, really, and brilliant to have that first star for Argentina and great to just be a part of it from Buenos Aires. Yeah, I should have said that Dan is based in Buenos Aires, so he's really been in the middle of everything. And he also gets to follow everything that goes on in the Argentine domestic league. So he knows everything about Rotegi.
Argentina's Mixed Reactions to Retegui
00:02:30
Speaker
So to start with,
00:02:32
Speaker
before we look into the player and his qualities and everything, you know, what did you and the people in Argentina, the football media and everyone there, what did they make of Rotegri getting called up by Italy? You know, did it come as a surprise? Does it seem to come out of nowhere in Europe? And is there a kind of like, what was the reaction to it? And is there a kind of like an unhappiness that he's been poached by Italy?
00:02:59
Speaker
It's an interesting one, really, because I think he's really a kid that's come out of almost nowhere. As he mentioned, he's still online at Tigre from Boca. Has only played a handful of games for Boca. Just couldn't really find his way. Had other line spells before this most recent one and didn't really make his mark. Very modest.
00:03:26
Speaker
goalscore in return and then last year 2022 he just exploded really scored 19 goals in 27 games for Tigret to top score in the league. He started it right on the same track again this year with with six goals in eight games.
Retegui's Growth and Career Decisions
00:03:45
Speaker
That led a lot of people to think that Boca might have
00:03:48
Speaker
retained him for this year instead of sending him back online but it was actually a retigo who said no I want to stay in Tigray I want to keep having regular first team football and you know give myself this window to shine and it's paying off for him he's a guy you know he's really come to prominence definitely considered one of Argentina's top young domestic strikers and I wouldn't say there's been a huge
00:04:15
Speaker
outburst about this decision. Obviously, you want to keep your young players, but you can understand where it's coming from definitely for Rotege because the way the Argentina team is stacked at the moment, it's probably going to be more simple for him to break through in Italy than for Argentina right now.
00:04:37
Speaker
Yeah, and why do you think that, I mean, you mentioned, obviously, you know, Argentina have got Alvarez, they've got Lautaro, Messi stood around. I mean, is that the reason why you think Rotegri chose to play for Italy rather than Argentina? Or do you think that there's like maybe an economic angle that he sees this as a maybe a chance to get a move to an Italian club or a European club if he chooses Italy? Do you think that maybe he's played a part in this as well?
00:05:04
Speaker
I think definitely there's a bit of open decision because even before this Italy switch came up and the rumors broke that Mancini was thinking about including him in the squad. There were already reports saying that he could be heading to Italy as soon as this June or July. It definitely puts him in the spotlight if he has a strong international break now for Italy. From what I've been reading, it looks like he has a
00:05:35
Speaker
really good chance of getting some minutes if not even starting Italy's first game or both the games. That will definitely put them even more in the window. And on the other hand, you've got two. You've got a possible generational talent in Julian Alvarez and a fantastic striker like Lautaro Martinez in front of you. You're almost the same age or even older in the case of Alvarez.
00:06:04
Speaker
It's a dilemma, I think, that a lot of footballers in this kind of situation face. Do you wait three, four, maybe five years to see if you can push your way in, get that big European move and make it impossible to leave you out? Or do you say, look, I want to play international football and Italy looks like the best option for me.
00:06:29
Speaker
And, you know, the links with Italy and Argentina have always been strong. There's a lot of Italian culture here. It's not an alien culture by any means, I think. He knows he'll feel at home. A lot of players have done it before, you know, from the 20s to 30s onwards. So I think, yeah, probably five factors came into the decision and we'll see how he goes. I'm looking forward to seeing how he fares with Italy.
00:06:58
Speaker
Yeah, I think we all are, especially the Italians, because we don't have many many strikers at the moment.
Retegui's Playing Style and Challenges
00:07:05
Speaker
Talking about Radegri's position, we know he's a forward, but what kind of forward is he? And for what kind of system, for example, do you think he's
00:07:16
Speaker
he's best suited to because Mancini generally plays his favourite formations a 4-3-3 but he's also been using recently a back 3, a 3-5-2 or a 3-4-3. I think Mancini said that ahead of this international break against England and Malta he will use either a 4-3-3 or a 3-5-2. So what formation and system is Rateg we best suited to and what is his actual position would you say?
00:07:43
Speaker
Well, Rettig is a classic number nine, a classic center forward in every sense. Loves getting into the area, loves playing in and around the goal. Sorry, dangerous from short range. So that's what we'll bring to you, just a guy to lead the line with power, with pace. And generally with Tigre, at least over the last season, he's been playing
00:08:12
Speaker
almost always as part of a front two. What Tigger they generally do, they play this kind of classic 4-3-1-2 setup in a very
00:08:23
Speaker
very traditional in Argentine football with a playmaker just behind and kind of a smaller second striker to take a bit of the pressure off of Retegui. And he's frightened that system, possibly he would struggle to lead the line alone if you put him in a 4-5-1 or a 4-3-3 because I don't know if he
00:08:47
Speaker
has kind of the all-round game to act as that solitary striker, but if you have someone up with him, he's very good at playing off that second striker and just getting into positions where he can score goals is what he's done best. Okay, that's interesting. So you see him as more of a player that needs to be playing in a two-man attack rather than as a man in the middle of a three. Okay, that's interesting. What would you say are Rotegri's strengths and best qualities?
00:09:18
Speaker
As I say, he's a classic centre forward, he's brilliant in the box, he's got a great eye for goal. Unusually, for an Arsenal forward, he's so strong in the air, he's a big lad, I think 6-2, a metre 85, scores a lot of goals with his head and he's got an absolute grenade for a right foot. Most of his goals come
00:09:42
Speaker
in around the penalty area, but he has knocked a few in from long range. So as I say, penalties as well, he's very, very reliable from the box. Just general goal scoring and getting the ball in the area and making it count. He's got speed, he's got strength, lots of power to get past the last man.
00:10:09
Speaker
Yeah, all the attributes of a real classic centre forward. And what would you say are his weaknesses and areas that he would need to improve on in his game? Well, I think that would be contained in the same answer. He's not that much of a modern forward in the sense that you're not going to see him dropping back and playing his teammates in so much. It's very single-minded.
00:10:38
Speaker
I wouldn't want to say one-dimensional because I think he'd be doing him a disservice, but definitely he's a guy that away from the area and away from the final third, he's not going to contribute a whole lot. His best position is just posted there and waiting for the ball to come for him. Possibly, you know, he's still young and has time to evolve and kind of bring in a more cerebral,
00:11:09
Speaker
all-round approach to this game. But for now, it's definitely funny. He has that tendency towards being one-dimensional, which possibly held him back at the start of his career and might hold him back as he progresses kind of through the levels. Okay. And here is the big question then, based on everything you've said. If you had to compare him to a current or former attacker, who would you compare him to?
00:11:38
Speaker
It's a tough one. I know just before we were recording, Vieri was mentioned and that's obviously a big stretch, but there are possibly similarities in the game in terms of his approaching his kind of directness. Another guy who occurred to me, someone like Gonzalo Iwain, someone who's just got the knack of getting in those positions,
00:12:07
Speaker
and being on the end of chances. Anyone like that really just sees some powerful direct centre forwards, which we don't see a huge amount of now in modern football, I don't think. So for that reason, I think it's going to be very interesting to see how we get some.
00:12:26
Speaker
Yeah, Italy would definitely take a Vieri or Higuain. Definitely. Okay, away from his actual football skills, anything interesting about Rotegri's backgrounds and his personality, his family?
Retegui's Background and Potential in Europe
00:12:42
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, he just comes across as a very grounded, very down to earth kid.
00:12:48
Speaker
Unlike a lot of Argentine footballers or guys who come up from South America in general, he's not someone who's really had to fight his way up from the bottom. He comes from quite a comfortable background. His father, Carlos Pretegi, played hockey at a professional level for years. For Argentina, he played in the Pan-American games, won golds in the Pan-American games, and then went on actually to win Olympic gold.
00:13:17
Speaker
with the Argentina team. I can't remember the years, but I think he got at least one gold medal. So very sporting family. His sister, I believe as well, is in Las Leonas, the Argentine women's hockey team.
00:13:37
Speaker
A very sporty family, comfortable upbringing. Actually a river fan, which is funny, and started in the river academy, didn't quite make it there, and that led him to switch over to Boca, which isn't something a whole load of players do. But he just seems very down to earth, very determined. He had quite a rough start to his professional career.
00:14:07
Speaker
at the age of 20, 21, 22, it didn't seem like he was going to come through on this promise. He wasn't breaking through at Boca, but he stuck at it and had that fantastic season last year at Tigerez, which I think speaks very highly of them coming back from those early knocks and showing that he could thrive in Argentine football and score goals. As I say, I love to see him do well because I think really, really nice kid.
00:14:38
Speaker
And personality-wise, yeah, he's got everything in his favour, I think. Yeah, it will definitely be interesting to see because over the years, Italy has naturalised a lot of Argentine footballers. Going back to the 1930s when they won the World Cup in 1934, they naturalised a lot of Argentines. Luis Monti, probably the most famous of them all, he played in the 1930s.
00:15:09
Speaker
And then, you know, into the 50s and 60s, and we had like Omar Seabody, for example. And even recently, 2006 World Cup, we had Mauro Camarenese, of course, who was part of the 2006 World Cup winning team. And there's been some others who haven't been as good and successful.
00:15:29
Speaker
Cristian Ledesma comes to mind as one player. Do you remember him? Yes, you have taken on some interesting players, Gabriel Paleta, I remember. Oh my gosh.
00:15:45
Speaker
Daniel Sveldo was a talented player. He really was. He just didn't seem to have a head for it. He was, he absolutely meant, oh yeah. Yeah, he was. And Palletta, it's funny actually that Italy are playing England on Thursday because I remember Gabriel Palletta, and it might have even been his debut for Italy. It was in the 2014 World Cup when Italy played England in Brazil and Palletta played in that game. Italy won 2-1, but he was absolutely dreadful. He was terrible.
00:16:13
Speaker
Yeah, I just remember him with the with the haircut with the like it's one like cambiaso kind of one strand of hair that he was holding on to. He was only like 25 or something. Yeah, he was. He just looked really old for his age. Yeah. I wonder what happened to Gabriel.
00:16:33
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know where he, I don't know if he's retired now or I don't know, but we'll be interested to see whether Rategi can be another, you know, Camaronesi or Sivori or Monti, or if he'll be another Ledesma or Paleta. It'll be interesting. And that leads us on nicely to the final question. And how far do you think Rategi can ultimately go in the game? Can you see him eventually making it at a top European club?
00:17:02
Speaker
I think he has a chance. Generally, if you can score goals in Argentine football, you can score goals anywhere. Just looking at players who've gone the other way, Carlos Devis, who was almost top scorer for Juventus at the time, he went back to Boca and he was fantastic for Boca but never scored the kind of volume of goals that he managed there because it's just
00:17:27
Speaker
such a hard league. The defenders are always at your ankles. You get absolutely nothing given to you. You really have to fight for every goal. If you're scoring regularly in Argentina, that's generally a good indicator that you can go and do it at a higher level. I think it's a little bit different for midfielders, defenders where they might have it a little bit easier. I think the opposite is often true for
00:17:55
Speaker
for attackers, and definitely just kind of the raw talent he has, what I mentioned before, kind of the pace, the power and the skill in the air, it should come over well, I think. Whether he can get to the elite or not will depend on if he continues to develop his game, if he doesn't decide to rest on his physical attributes and kind of works on
00:18:24
Speaker
on the link-up play and the technical side, which probably is a minor weakness compared to what he does best. I think he'd have to start a little bit lower, mid-table Serie A or mid-table La Liga or the Portuguese League, as so many South Americans do as they're coming up, and then see how he finds the level.
00:18:55
Speaker
if he's got it what it takes. But plenty of South American players have done that. They've gone to kind of middle or lower tier clubs in Spain or Italy or they've gone elsewhere and made a success with it. So he's still young, only 23, got all of his career ahead of him. And if he can just keep scoring them goals, I think he's got a decent chance of going far, yeah.
00:19:24
Speaker
Yeah and Italy certainly need some of those goals and as you said at the start you know the links between Argentina and Italy over the years well you know he will make his debut it seems potentially like you said it looks like he will play he will certainly get on at some point during the England game and maybe even start based on what we've seen in training so far and the game is in Naples which is the most Argentine of places in Italy you know Maradona's temple so
00:19:51
Speaker
Yeah, that is certainly the place to start your Italy career if you're of Argentine descent, or actually Argentine out, right? That is definitely going to be a very, very interesting game on Thursday.
00:20:08
Speaker
Brilliant. Dan, thanks so much. Thanks so much for that brilliant profile and telling us all about Ritwegi. That was brilliant. Fantastic. Yeah, really, really appreciate you coming on. We'll certainly invite you on again in the future sometime to talk about some more.
Conclusion and Listener Engagement
00:20:29
Speaker
You can follow Dan on Twitter at Dan Edwards Goal. Dan, thanks so much. Before we let you go, is there anything you've got coming up, anything you want to plug or talk about? No, I just want to say thanks for having me on. It's a pleasure. Yeah, really, the pleasure is all ours. We really, really appreciate you, Arthur. One of the best in the business when it comes to Argentine football. One thing actually, because I'll get in trouble if I don't mention it,
00:20:58
Speaker
If I've tickled your fancy for Argentine football, I do co-host an Argentine football podcast called Hand of Pod. Give it a listen if you like. Yeah, and I wish I'd plugged that at the start, but there you go. Yeah, please do give that a listen because if there really isn't anyone better talking about Argentine football in the English language than Dan and me and him go back a long way,
00:21:25
Speaker
Over 10 years, really. He really is a fountain of knowledge and he knows so much about, not just now, but the history of the game. That's something that I'm very, very much into. He's always got some great anecdotes. When it comes to Argentine football, no one does the soap operas better than the Argentines, even more so than in Italy. And Dan knows everything about Wundericardi and Maori Cardi as well.
00:21:55
Speaker
Get some good stories and I will have to invite you back on to talk about them at some point when he returns to Italy Only if I got my lowest present Yeah Brilliant. Okay. Well, thanks so much again Dan and thanks everyone for listening We will be back on Thursday evening after the Italy England game where NIMA will do a post-match reaction on that opening Euro 2024 qualifier So we will hopefully see you again then until then have a great week. Ciao. Ciao