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Extended Clip - Paul Pogba Doping Ban: The End Of Juventus Star’s Career (Ep. 401)
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After receiving a four year ban due to doping, Nima Tavallaey and Carlo Garganese discuss and debate whether the second stint of Paul Pogba at Juventus isn't the worst return of any footballer to a club of all time, whilst analyzing if the career of the France FIFA World Cup Winner isn't over now.
This is an extended clip from this weeks free Monday episode of The Italian Football Podcast which is available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts and Google podcasts.
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Transcript
Introduction to Pogba's Doping Ban
00:00:02
Speaker
Welcome to the Italian football podcast. We have to talk about Paul Pogba. It was announced on Thursday that Pogba had been banned for four years for doping. It's his anti-doping tribunal. Handed Pogba a four-year ban. He, of course, failed a doping test in August after the opening Serie A game of the season against Gudeneza.
00:00:23
Speaker
which he'd been on the bench for, DHEA, which can raise the level of testosterone found in Pogba's body, and then he had a repeat test, a second sample that also tested positive in
Pogba's Disastrous Return to Juventus
00:00:36
Speaker
October. That led to him being suspended provisionally, and now he has been banned for
00:00:43
Speaker
for four years and so a few things to discuss in them and first of all starting from the Juventus point of view and I think as you said last week and I said also I wrote a feature about this a few months ago this now confirms that this is the most disastrous return in football history isn't it never I can't think of anyone that's any any worse return I really can't think of anyone who's returned back to a club and it be
00:01:11
Speaker
more disastrous than what we've seen here this time around, honestly. It's absolutely atrocious. Everything that has gone wrong has gone wrong. Everything. I really don't even know what else to say. It's just everything that could go wrong has gone wrong. His body has completely deteriorated. He was barely fit before the doping suspension and then that came.
00:01:41
Speaker
It's just been an absolute mess. And if you take into consideration how much they paid for him in wages and how much he's cost them, it's just been, it's a waste, a complete waste. Well, he's played just 214 minutes of football for Juventus since, since showing in. I mean, that's less than, that's two and a bit games, you know, in total. And he came last summer, not this summer. That was the summer of 2022.
Failed Treatment Choices and Financial Impact
00:02:06
Speaker
scores no goals, just the one assist. He only started one match in his entire second spell at Juventus, a game in which he limped off from injured against Cremonerza in the first half. The way that Juventus have handled this as well, his injury and Paul Pogba as well, they've messed the cock
00:02:25
Speaker
I've learned that more on Pogba, but the injury. He had the injury. He tried to get fit for the World Cup. He refused to have an operation, which Juventus wanted him to have an operation. He refused. He wanted to try conservative treatment. That failed. He then was forced to then have an operation, which basically ruled him out for almost the most of the season. He came back towards the end.
00:02:47
Speaker
with a few kind of substitute appearances and then got injured again. I blame that more on Pogba, but yeah, Juventus certainly are responsible. They shouldn't have signed him in the first place. I said it at the time, it was a crazy decision because they could see his injury record at Man United in his last two to three years there, which you could see this was a guy that was broken physically. Then they give him a contract of 10 million a year on a four-year contract. So he's been very expensive.
Contract Termination and Appeal Possibilities
00:03:13
Speaker
The only positive for the event is that now with this doping test, which is when they won't admit it publicly, which is actually probably a good thing for the event is because they've only been paying him 2,400 euros a month since the provisional doping ban. So they don't have to, even if they keep him on his books now for the rest of his contract until 2026, they won't have to pay peanuts until then. So they released that financial burden
00:03:43
Speaker
which would be important. He's almost certain he'll be released now. They just need to be legally secure. They'll make sure legally they're safe. I think they'll terminate the contract by mutual consent in the summer.
00:03:59
Speaker
I think he's going to appeal now the four-year contract, sorry, the four-year suspension, and we'll see where it goes, and if it goes down, and how far it goes, and so on and so forth. But I don't... I mean, it's obviously very sad, though, isn't it? I mean, we have to... I just don't see Paul Pogba putting on the event to shut over again.
00:04:16
Speaker
But it's not just Juventus shirt. I mean, this is his top level career over. I mean, even to be fair, it's a four year. Listen, it's a four year ban. And let me just say, I do think the punishment is very excessive for a first offender for DHEA. Four years is way too severe. But I mean, I'm sure it will get cut on appeal. But even if it's a two year ban, that's his career done. If it's a two year ban, he's back in 20. He'll be back in September 2025. You know, he'll be he'll be 32 and a half. You know,
00:04:44
Speaker
No, that's his career. But to be fair, if we're perfectly honest, his career has been over for a few years, in my opinion.
Pogba's Marred Legacy and Comparison to Past Cases
00:04:51
Speaker
I mean, I think after France, essentially after France won the World Cup, his career was over. You know, he's been the mess. He was united as well, wasn't he? He didn't have a good plan. He was united, that he was there, and everything that happened then. And it's a shame because he was a fantastic player when he was at U of I, the first Bell.
00:05:10
Speaker
It was what he provides so unique. And that Yuva side that he played under him in Diwala was just unbelievable. Yeah. I just think that, you know, in terms of when we look back at his career, obviously he'll be seen as partly an unfiltered talent, even if he still had a, you know,
00:05:29
Speaker
the first half of his career still did so many fantastic things that many players could only dream of doing. It's sad in the sense that his reputation has now been tarnished. I mean, yes, when we've spoken that Dope and his wife in football, many more superstars that have never been named publicly Dope, but Pogba has been caught. This is a stain on his career and he is
00:05:51
Speaker
I think he's got to be the most high, he's the most high profile convicted Doper in football for, you could even potentially say 30 years since Maradona. I mean, maybe, I mean, certainly 20 years since Guardiola and like the Dutch players, like Stan, de Boer, Davids, when they all got done. I mean, since Guardiola, he is the most, I can't think of anybody else that is a bigger name, an international name. So, you know, this is always going to be a stain on him.
Analysis of Pogba's Desperate Mistake
00:06:19
Speaker
It is, isn't it? And I think that's sad, I think. I think that's sad. It is sad, of course, especially since he... It was clearly not, you know, the way when you read more into it, it was a stupid mistake. It was more... Well, Juventus didn't know anything about it, which I think is what's killed him here because, you know...
00:06:38
Speaker
He's clearly gone off and he's done this. He's gone to a doctor who's not been in, like the whole, there was no... Well, this is his defense, yeah. Yeah, but it doesn't matter because you're always responsible for what you put your body in and that's just how it is and that's how the doping rules are built up. But if you look at it, it's not like he's gone in and tried to, you know, Ben Johnson his way.
00:07:02
Speaker
this was this was something stupid. This was a mistake. And again, he's responsible for it. But it just it just reminds me of, you know, when when players are desperate and they they're so they're so desperate to get back to what they were that they
00:07:19
Speaker
they kind of lose focus a little bit of and become a little bit frantic in how they want to get back. And it's sad, but there's no doubt that his career is over now, even if he gets a two year back, like, okay, so what is he going to do? Jog on the sidelines for two years and then come back to who? Who's going to take him at 32 33?
00:07:35
Speaker
No, I think you're right. I think you're spot on. I think it was a cry of desperation that he couldn't accept that his body was breaking down and he couldn't do it and he couldn't accept it. And, you know, it's like a probably like someone that's getting older and goes to plastic surgery and botches that you've up even more, you know, or like Alexei Sanchez that can't understand that he can't do, can't run as quickly as he used to do and still thinks refuses to accept that he's no longer 25, but continues to stand in the, you know,
00:08:04
Speaker
doesn't understand that time waits for no man and that you have to adapt. One of the greatest reasons that someone like Ronaldo or Zlatan were able to play or Maldini were able to play as long as they did is because they understood that they were getting older and they relied on other things and they adapted their game accordingly. But with Pogba, with someone like these guys, they just can't accept reality. And when you can't accept reality,
00:08:30
Speaker
you become desperate. And that's what I'm a little bit worried about, what's going to happen to Federico Chiesa, which is what I was referring to, that he needs to accept that he's no longer a
Lessons for Other Players: Chiesa's Adaptation
00:08:39
Speaker
winger. He can't do that anymore, in my opinion. And I don't want to see him piss away the rest of his career.