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Lev Buslovich - Apadana Energy
103 Plays9 months ago
From escaping the former Soviet Union to helping build an 80-person clean energy company, Les Bosnich brings a rare mix of grit, brilliance, and humanity to leadership. In this episode, Les shares how his immigrant story fuels his entrepreneurial spirit, why culture beats perks, and how "growing into bankruptcy" nearly crushed his last venture. We talk about hiring for potential (not perfection), the power of clean process handoffs, and how good leadership—like good soccer—requires the right players in the right positions.
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Transcript
Podcast Introduction with Brian Smith and Angie Jones
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to Gritty Leadership, the podcast where we celebrate the leaders who make and move America. We're diving into the untold stories of resilience, innovation, and perseverance of the leaders in the gritty industries that keep America running.
00:00:13
Speaker
I'm b Brian Smith, and together with my co-host Angie Jones, we're on a mission to honor the leadership that's often overlooked but makes all the difference. So let's get into it because real leadership gets its hands dirty.
00:00:25
Speaker
Welcome to the Gritty Leadership podcast.
Introducing Guest Lev: Entrepreneurial Ventures
00:00:29
Speaker
Sam, Angie, how the heck are you? Good, Brian. How about you? We have a great guest coming up, Lev. um I know Lev through a business networking group we're in together. Really interesting conversation.
00:00:42
Speaker
What's cool about Lev, you know, definitely in the gritty business world with us, but he's done a lot of different things over his career. ah a lot of different functions and a lot of different kinds of businesses.
00:00:54
Speaker
ah He's been an entrepreneur. He's worked in different kinds of organizations as well. And so just a really diverse set of experiences, I think, to to learn from.
Managing Success and Hiring Challenges in Business
00:01:05
Speaker
I really enjoyed our conversation talking through some of the ah challenges as an entrepreneur ah of managing success and growth.
00:01:15
Speaker
We had a really interesting conversation about um when he was running his commercial lighting business, how a really big contract almost put him out of business.
00:01:26
Speaker
And things like that, I think, are super fascinating. Sam, you brought up some of the stuff we talked about as far as just being super intentional about hiring, how you hire, how you go about hiring. I think that's also really critical. I mean, yeah at the end of the day, our products are important.
00:01:43
Speaker
um What we do is important, but the people we hire is really what makes up our businesses. And the size businesses that I think a lot of the folks that we talk to and are probably listening to this podcast are in, it doesn't take more than a few people to really hose up an organization.
00:02:03
Speaker
How you build a culture is is so critical. So I think Lev is such a smart guy and such a thoughtful and and kind person. I think you're really going to enjoy the conversation today.
Lev's Immigrant Journey and Diverse Career Path
00:02:14
Speaker
Welcome to the Gritty Leadership Podcast. I'm ah thrilled to welcome Les Buslovich to our episode today.
00:02:21
Speaker
Lev, thank you for joining us. Glad to be here. Awesome. ah So let's we'll jump right in here. Lev, tell us a little bit about you, your story, and kind of how you got here today.
00:02:32
Speaker
Well, you know, because this does affect... you know, who I am as a as a business person. So I was actually originally born in Vilnius, Lithuania, in the Soviet Union.
00:02:46
Speaker
And ah my mom's from there. My dad's from Leningrad. ah the The color to that story is we were Jewish. So all of my grandparents were in the Holocaust.
00:03:02
Speaker
My parents have no uncles and aunts. And so growing up in the Soviet Union in pretty repressive times when we were a minority, it was, I learned perseverance and, and, and, and just how to get by in those circumstances. So We came to this country with $8 and um yeah, and I think our good immigrant story.
00:03:33
Speaker
So that that obviously um
00:03:37
Speaker
gives me the the characteristics, I think, to have taken initiative, um sometimes foolishly been brave in things, you know,
00:03:53
Speaker
probably more outspoken than I need to be. um But so um went away to college, um upstate New York, never thought I'd be back in Minnesota. Next thing you know, I'm living five minutes from my parents, married to a girl from my high school.
00:04:10
Speaker
I was a ah corporate guy for many years. My MBA is in marketing. um i worked at ConAgra, GE, and um project product management.
00:04:22
Speaker
And then at GE, I got into Six Sigma World, which kind of opened my eyes to the world of operations. um And then through that, I ran some large operating groups and then helped start the Six Sigma programs at Target and Carlson at the same time because I was i got into Six Sigma kind of in advance of... um I would say the rest of the businesses, geez, was kind of ahead.
00:04:49
Speaker
i started lecturing at the the Carlson School in the MBA program and then of all things in the operations world. And then and and ended up being an adjunct professor for a number of years there for their core MBA class.
00:05:05
Speaker
um So I kind of wore that hat for a little while. And then really without um looking for it in 07, the best time to start a company, I started an energy efficiency company with a neighbor of mine who was um kind of ah the technical experts. And interestingly, and I thought I was going to be kind of his support. But next thing you know, I was responsible for probably 90% of our sales. And we did great. We doubled for about five years and then got big enough where we actually needed outside investors and
00:05:44
Speaker
went through that process, so learned a lot. I ended up selling my shares in 2019 and then ran a large construction company um for a few years until my non-compete ran out. And then I joined Apadana also in the energy efficiency space.
00:06:03
Speaker
um But this time I'm running their renewables, which is solar, EV charging, battery storage, you know, those kinds of technologies. So,
Family, Soccer, and Acquiring Soccer Teams
00:06:14
Speaker
that's where I am now. And in the meantime, by the way, as a, as a side, I have three kids and, uh, uh, you know, an active, uh, volunteer life, but I also have been, coaching competitive soccer for 40 some years.
00:06:31
Speaker
I, I, I coached, um, long before I had kids. So it was, it wasn't one of these, um father coaching things. Um, I coach kids that,
00:06:43
Speaker
go on to play college and professional. So that's been something that I've been very passionate and actively involved and actually have something else going on recently with a an acquisition of a ah a, guy that I've been with for a long time. He's a yeah Canadian hall of famer and we are in the process of purchasing a Portuguese team and a Minneapolis professional team. Oh, wow.
00:07:11
Speaker
Yeah, lots of things going on. I've got kids that are 26, almost 24, and 21, and they played for MTA and wings and pretty competitive clubs.
00:07:25
Speaker
Awesome. So my son actually does work with us, but kind of a circuitous route. um He went and got his...
00:07:37
Speaker
So he he went to college in Miami and then quit because immediately after he started, it went online and he hated that. So he said, well, listen, if you're going to be down there, you got to go to some school.
00:07:49
Speaker
And so he picked the only thing that was hands-on at the time, which was automotive repair. So he got his automotive repair certificate, then came back to Minnesota and then ah went to Dunwoody.
00:08:00
Speaker
And there he got his welding and fabrication and he was going to go work for, um, a manufacturing shop. But in the meantime, while he was kind of waiting, he started working on our fleet of cars here in this company.
00:08:16
Speaker
And these guys really loved them and he's really good at it. And next thing you know, he's doing many other things and managing the warehouse and it's got a couple of guys reporting to him now. So, so I try to stay out of that one, but, but it's fun to, it's kind of,
00:08:36
Speaker
the girls The girls are both in the healthcare care industry. So my oldest is actually graduating in May with her doctorate. So, and my youngest is still a junior in college.
00:08:49
Speaker
Awesome. So tell us a little bit about kind of the um the business now, what are sort of the ins and outs of it What are some of the challenges you guys are facing?
Business Challenges: Political Unpredictability and Cashflow
00:09:02
Speaker
Well, you know, there's there's enough challenges in a business to begin with, but this political system doesn't really, really help. So um I'll start with that, then I'll go backwards.
00:09:12
Speaker
um A, unpredictability, right? That's always crappy. B, um always these threats of tariffs, even though we are not really vulnerable to the countries that have been mentioned, we've never purchased anything from ah China as our core products um or the other related countries.
00:09:33
Speaker
So we're lucky or fortunate or smart that way. um so that's not really the issue. um But still just this uneasiness, which has affected our clients.
00:09:45
Speaker
And of course, the whole government ah threatening and stepping back from incentives, we deal with a lot of low income housing. um That's a big market for us.
00:09:57
Speaker
And we've had ah couple of million dollars canceled just in the last couple of months of projects simply because And not that's not even including on hold, but simply because literally the grants, as you remember, have been canceled. And so they've they've had to go to either a smaller project or cancel their project altogether or just wait to see if this is really real. So that's affected us in a not a fun way.
00:10:25
Speaker
But then you got the regular, you know, things of business, just the cashflow side. Just we got a lot of mouths to feed. We got probably... 80 people now in the company.
00:10:37
Speaker
So that's grown a lot. And, you know, 80 people, everybody's, you know, it's people management, right? So there's always issues there. And then cashflow is always, you know, a topic. So the normal thing we've been really fortunate. We, um when I started with Appanana almost exactly four years ago, I, um you know, we were,
00:11:02
Speaker
um I'll just tell you, we were, we've we've grown about nine fold in the last four years. So it was a much smaller company with just a handful of folks and um we've grown great. And that's ah partly just bringing in the right people, partly, you know, being fortunate and,
00:11:24
Speaker
getting the kind of projects, then of course you do a good job and those projects lead to more projects. So um most of it is on the the solar side, commercial solar, and we're starting to get into larger community gardens as well as utility scale stuff. So trying to do what we can. And I think we're pretty organized. You know who I am just, you know, remember I told you my MBA was in marketing and got into this operation. So I'm kind of a,
00:11:52
Speaker
unique animal, I call myself an integrator because I've been in sales roles. I've been in managing large team roles. I've been in running operations. I'm a master black belt in Six Sigma.
00:12:05
Speaker
So I know a lot of things about a lot of different things. So it's interesting because I can, you know, i know what sales should look like. I know what marketing should look like. I know what um the implementation of those things should look like. I know actually what strategy should look like we're you know everything that we do in our company has processes and is very, very good at handoffs. So we're pretty good. So in addition to just growing, we're also growing profitably. So all that's coming together.
00:12:40
Speaker
When you think about all those different um all those different functions, what do you think are the most for What do you think are the most challenging for organizations to tackle or manufacturers particularly to to tackle?
00:12:54
Speaker
So, A, I am not a manufacturer. So we're engineers and electricians. We are product agnostic. um I mean, I can speak to manufacturers, but we are a solution-based company. we ah We identify, let's say, a solar opportunity, and we then engineer the right solution using the appropriate materials, and then our electricians install them. We procure, of course, the products and we do it directly from the manufacturers and then we have our electricians in install them. So that's our world.
00:13:31
Speaker
um But your question about what do... So let's answer that question within your world. So within your world, what do you think, within all those functions, what do you think the most kind of challenging function is?
00:13:46
Speaker
I will always give the most credit to sales. Sales, I think, is always king. If you don't have sales, then the rest of it is just overhead. um you know So you have to have sales and you have to have the right sales. You can't just sell at super low margins and therefore you know have a lot of work where you're losing money.
00:14:11
Speaker
So sales always starts you know everything. But then you have to be able to have great ah technical ability.
00:14:22
Speaker
um So what differentiates us, for example, is our engineering is second to none as a matter of fact, um because we were founded by two engineers, one mechanical, one electrical.
00:14:33
Speaker
We still have that as our core and we have more electrician, sorry, we have more engineers, um mechanical, electrical, power systems,
00:14:44
Speaker
structural, on staff than all of the other solar companies in Minnesota combined. And that definitely differentiates us because we are, um that part we never mess up on, which is, as you can imagine, will have then lagging effects all the way through to the installation if they don't get the right design or if you're ordering the right, or didn't specify the right equipment, ordered their own the wrong thing. That happens a lot um when Xcel Energy, the utility that basically we do most of their projects within their territory, when they um survey our results, um we always get accolades of how well laid out and the systems are, how clean the panels look. And here's a little little fact.
00:15:40
Speaker
Apparently, this is what Xcel Energy told our guys just two weeks ago, apparently 75% of all solar installations ah fail the first time they try to commission them. That's when they turn on the system. 75%. We have failed we have failed maybe a couple of times each year only.
00:16:03
Speaker
So we're talking about failure rate is probably two to 3% and the industry standard is about 75%. So I think that's pretty awesome. So in answering your question to say, um we're good at um being technically savvy at each of these stages and making sure that the output of each prior stage, this is my kind of Six Sigma mindset going through, the output of each stage is the input of the next stage, right?
00:16:39
Speaker
So if your input is bad because the output is not perfect, then you're all you're doing is working with bad data. make sense? So I think we're very good at each of the stages and making sure that those handoffs are very clean.
00:16:55
Speaker
And like I said, I'm an integrator. That's what I do. I can put these pieces together and know how to how to make sure that the organization works. And then after that, it's just figuring out where your bottlenecks are. And those things keep switching.
00:17:08
Speaker
Sometimes, you know, you need more
Importance of In-Office Culture and Core Values
00:17:10
Speaker
sales coming in. Sometimes your bottleneck is the engineering side. Sometimes all sudden you got, you know, too much stuff going on. for procurement to to handle. And so they become the bottlenecks. So it's playing whack-a-mole and figuring out where you can help at any given point. And that's normal to an organization, you know? So it's, um that's how I've been at least being able to do it.
00:17:36
Speaker
So leading a team of 80 people, mixture of, uh, engineers and and other folks, how how do you build culture? How do you build a a team within that crew?
00:17:50
Speaker
You know, um I will give... Credit first to the the founders, Ahmad and Asan. they um you know It started as ah as a family business, family and friends.
00:18:04
Speaker
And so they have always, like one of the core things is they always make lunch for all the staff. To this day, the owners cook lunch every single day for all the staff.
00:18:16
Speaker
So when you guys come over here next, um You should stay here for lunch and they will make some sort of rice dish or some something interesting.
00:18:28
Speaker
And so that just creates, you know, a different level of interaction. First of all, we're not big enough that people don't know each other and, you know, and and have relationships, but but really there is just the way that the organization works.
00:18:47
Speaker
We're also always have been, um i haven't i wasn't here during COVID, but as I understand, even during COVID, they only took about six months off, but everybody comes into the office.
00:18:59
Speaker
So we're an in-office culture where people can go walk over to somebody's desk and, you know, and talk to them, you know, rather than being somewhere far away. um Very, very team-oriented, very collaborative.
00:19:14
Speaker
And I think it's, you know, that's that's the tone. I also think that we have, we don't have them pasted all over the office, but frankly, just a couple of weeks ago, I talked about core values. And interestingly enough,
00:19:29
Speaker
Again, we don't have them pasted and we don't have a mission statement, um you know, blaring in the the entryway. We have those, but on our, we just did our annual reviews with everybody.
00:19:43
Speaker
And what I did is I kind of read what are the characteristics on that review and what do they really mean and how do we really act? And, you know, a lot of them are about showing up with the right attitude and and being team oriented.
00:20:02
Speaker
and And so then i kind of, you know, frankly, narrowed it down to here's really the four or five things that are really, really core to what we do, you know, accountability, integrity, teamwork, just caring.
00:20:18
Speaker
and think we have a lot of people that's that exude that like, Hey, you need help. I'll go help you. Right. So I think we've done a really good job of just as we grow to still maintain that.
00:20:30
Speaker
I don't want to be cheesy about it, but that kind of family, you know, deal. I hate when people say, you know, we're a family, but, but we really do try to um make sure that we are truly caring for others.
00:20:46
Speaker
And, um and I think we, we act upon like that, including with our vendors and especially our customers. I use so many um examples from my soccer coaching that translate it into the business world.
00:21:03
Speaker
I am really, really good at soccer coaching, at taking a midfielder and making them an outside back. And then sometimes, you know, taking somebody and making them a forward, even though they never thought they would be.
00:21:16
Speaker
um and And some of them were literally with that move have gone on to be recruited at division one colleges and ended up even being professionals because, you know, maybe that characteristics they never saw in themselves.
00:21:32
Speaker
And then same thing with business. I'll just tell you, another little philosophical concept. So there I've, um, you know, there's, uh, there's a number of psychology books that I've written all the time, but, um, the Brown ones, I forget his first
Professional Development with StrengthsFinder
00:21:49
Speaker
name. He, um, he wrote, um, um, Oh my gosh. The,
00:21:56
Speaker
discovering your um strength, strength finder. That's the guy, yeah the strength finder guy. he's got several books on that topic. um But he, um he's, he's a psychologist that then got into this business concept. And, you know, strength finder is basically the concept that you're always who you are.
00:22:19
Speaker
You know, you, you always lean towards the things you gravitate towards. You could be, um You can be a great great employee, but you just don't like public speaking, right? But maybe part of your job requires you to do something like that or in a sales environment, or maybe you're a great salesperson but you're just really not analytical and you just can't sit down you know at your desk.
00:22:45
Speaker
But how many times do companies take their salespeople and make them fill out you know all the pricing sheets and that's part of their job? And the thing is that might just completely drain a person, right? And and they just hate doing those kinds of steps.
00:23:04
Speaker
Whereas they thrive in these other things. So um like with soccer at work, especially, I try to figure out like, what do they gravitate towards? And sometimes you hire a person and you're hiring them for this role, but there are aspects of them that just are not very good about that role. And the thing is, they'll never would be. I remember reviews but that I was at Target sometimes.
00:23:31
Speaker
And, you know, you guys probably get in corporate and they give you kind of, you know, here's the things you've accomplished. Great job. Here's your strength. Here's your development needs. So you've got an hour to 45 minute meeting.
00:23:42
Speaker
They spend 10 minutes on like great accomplishments, but 45 minutes they spend on things you should develop. You know, you should... um be more energetic. You should, whatever, whatever that thing is, you know, you should, you gotta be more attention to detail.
00:23:58
Speaker
And the the funny thing is that's opposite of what, um, You know, people, psychologists, no. People gravitate towards what they gravitate and they'll be that much happier and they'll give you that much more. So one of my big learnings over time is just to figure out what is the person both good at and what do they really love and how do I build a role that makes them do more of what they love because they'll come here earlier, they'll leave later, they'll spend more time, they love doing it.
00:24:35
Speaker
It's not draining, it's in fact energizing. That's what really where I focus on whether it's soccer players or whether it's employees. I love that. I talk about, I i use StrengthsFinder a lot in my own kind of development work with people. And i always say like, you know, I just try to manage my shortcomings enough that they're not derailers and then be done with it.
00:24:59
Speaker
Because like, I'm never going to be an organizational wonder. That is not my superpower and I'm never going to be good at it. And so I just make sure that I'm good enough that I'm not a complete hot mess and then like move on to other stuff I'm good at, you know, ah just a medium hot mess. Like, right you know, whereas my wife, we talked about my wife's an administrative assistant or executive assistant. She's great at that stuff. Like it's probably partly why we got together, and find people to fill your gaps and build a team of people. And, but yeah, like that whole review process is such,
00:25:40
Speaker
bullshit because it's, you know, you're you're not going to make someone who who they aren't. You're totally right. And and and and my gosh, 99% of all reviews are that. It's ridiculous. It is he truly worthless.
00:25:59
Speaker
you know And and if if if managers actually cared about their employees, that whole process would change. They were discussing the other day too, about how many, ah how many reviews are a justification for a shitty raise rather than an actual evaluation.
00:26:17
Speaker
ah Like it's, it's not actually a a real review. It's just a, we're giving you a shitty raise. And so we're giving you development stuff to tell you why it's not a better raise. Like,
00:26:29
Speaker
Anyway, that's great. Thank you. You brought up earlier this the managing cash flow. And in ah in a business that is, ah you know, requires capital expense, it requires this sort of thing, but is not very large.
Cash Flow Management Lessons and Business Growth
00:26:45
Speaker
How do you approach managing cash flow? How do you how do you get creative? Creative? um Or can you? yeah Try not to be creative. Yeah, not too creative, not as legally creative.
00:26:57
Speaker
Yeah. In this a company, luckily, I don't have to spend my time ah worrying and thinking about that. um the The owners focus on that portion of it, but I can tell you my experience in my own prior company.
00:27:14
Speaker
um I learned a term called growing yourself into bankruptcy. um No, seriously, I was always in corporate. I've never heard of that term before.
00:27:25
Speaker
And then all of a sudden, like, you know, when you deal with people that are um that have been around the block, like all everybody knows this term. So what that means is and and I just want to say we weren't close to bankruptcy um in my prior company. But what happened was.
00:27:43
Speaker
We doubled for about five years straight and started getting some really big accounts, some big national companies even.
00:27:56
Speaker
um Actually, I wouldn't mind putting a negative plug in for Thomson Reuters. Let's just do it.
00:28:04
Speaker
Because they, so typically most companies pay you on a net 30 term. That's typical, right? But big companies don't want to.
00:28:16
Speaker
and And they even sometimes can bull you into a 60 day contract. So we luckily negotiated with them to get it to a 45 day contract. And 45 days just means that they're going to pay us 45 days after we invoice them.
00:28:32
Speaker
And we have to obviously pay our staff every two weeks. So we're already in the hole and um we have to pay for our equipment usually after 30 days or so. So 30 days kind of breaks us even a little bit.
00:28:48
Speaker
45 takes us back. um And obviously that's why you have credit lines. And one thing it's important to know for people that may not have to manage credit lines,
00:28:59
Speaker
they're only good for 90 days. So most banks give you a credit line and after 90 days, they call those um unrecoverable, right? um Unreceivable.
00:29:11
Speaker
So they drop. So you might have $100,000 that you have on your credit line that after 90 days, if you don't get paid from that client,
00:29:21
Speaker
The bank thinks it's not going to be collected, and therefore they don't even consider that. That's typically $85,000 right there of lost credit line.
00:29:32
Speaker
means you just your credit line just got smaller. And if you're maxing your credit line every time, then you're kind of screwed in the process. So, of course, you get into Thomson Reuters. Did I say that loud enough? Did I say Thomson Reuters already?
00:29:45
Speaker
oh yeah. Yeah. So they negotiated 45 days and then 45 days came, 60 days came, 90 days came. They just just felt like paying later. you know Because for them, every day they hold off you know on all of their small little vendors is you know those pennies from interest, right? so um So they felt like paying us later. Now, we knew they were gonna pay us.
00:30:10
Speaker
The problem is, what are we gonna do, sue them? Like how many times can you send invoices, right? So all of a sudden we got all these big clients like that just deciding to play late.
00:30:22
Speaker
And then we started getting into also full construction work, which means construction work, you're now dealing through ah general contractor and then you're dealing with a title company usually. So it's not just the general that's paying you, they have to take your invoice submitted to their owner, their owner has to take it through the title company, blah, blah. blah So again, more than 90 days.
00:30:47
Speaker
So all a sudden we're growing, sales are coming in we're fulfilling them just great. But all of a sudden we're like, what the heck? A,
00:30:58
Speaker
We don't have the money to pay people and B, you know, um it's interest rate is eating up some of the profits as well, right? Growing yourself into bankruptcy. So we were brilliant enough to reach out and find an investor who paid lot part of the business, paid for a good portion We thought we put good super majority clauses on our contract. and um And the honeymoon was very, very short.
00:31:35
Speaker
And next thing you know, there were some weird things that he started doing. But here's the kicker of it all. About six months later, ah get a call from the bank and they said, you guys are going to have to leave.
00:31:52
Speaker
And like, what are you talking about? You know, we got a lot, a lot of money with you. We've paid it always on time. there's You've never told us anything differently.
00:32:03
Speaker
And then I had to kind of get it out of them. Well, it turns out your partner is being investigated. Oh, no. What? So it turns out this guy, who we, by the way, vetted and we thought everything was hunky-dory, and he was – it was a had other businesses. that So apparently had a business where he raised $33 million dollars and embezzled 18 million of it.
00:32:29
Speaker
And those people were suing him for that, which had nothing to do with us whatsoever. He's not even an active player in our business, right? He just bought part of it, gave us extended credit lines. That was his job.
00:32:43
Speaker
So we're doing great. But all of a sudden, he just is undermining our banking relationship. So I go to a different bank and they're like, nope, not going to take you and go to another bank, another bank. And all of a sudden I realize, oh crap, because he owns more than 20% and he's on the lease now, we can't get another bank with him around.
00:33:07
Speaker
We're never going to get a bank account. In the meantime, the bank's trying to foreclose on us. So all a sudden, we have to now find somebody to buy him out. We don't have the money to buy him out, right? He paid a pretty penny for it. I was happy about that.
00:33:22
Speaker
But we don't have the money to do it. So all sudden, we're scrambling to find somebody that we don't want, we need, right? Different ah notice, right? So all sudden now, we have to...
00:33:40
Speaker
get him out to be able to get a bank account. And believe me, that was very close to divorce for, I think both of us, um my partner and I am talking about. So yeah, it was a very stressful situation.
00:33:52
Speaker
So, so you could do great on everything. You could be the best salesperson, marketer, operations person, engineer, but something crazy like that happens. And then all of a sudden your business is in you personally.
00:34:08
Speaker
if you have personal guarantees, you personally could be somewhere else. Luckily, you know, we pulled it out, but it was, I'll tell you, it was one of the stress, the most stressful moments in my life next to couple of cancer scares. So.
00:34:25
Speaker
Yeah, that sounds really, really horrible, but i'm I'm glad you were able to figure it out. And it's, and it's always hard to be in a position where you're forced to have to figure that out rather than, you know,
00:34:38
Speaker
making the choice to figure it out for sure. Yeah. And with timelines, by the way, with right ah tick, tick, tick, if you don't figure it out. Oh my gosh. You talk about pressure. This, this, this is extra time in soccer and you're losing, right? Can you get a tying goal to make it go into overtime or, or a playoff game?
Leadership Insights: Empowering Teams
00:35:02
Speaker
What's the best piece of advice you've gotten as a leader? You know, one thing that comes to mind, I'm not sure this is the best piece of advice, but I always think about this. I got two things.
00:35:14
Speaker
One is long ago, a gentleman said, if you want something done, find somebody that is really, really busy rather than somebody that has a lot of time. There's a reason that person has a lot of time.
00:35:27
Speaker
um So I find that to be absolutely true. People that are idle are going to remain idle and people that are busy are magically going to squeeze you in because they're just doers. That's number one.
00:35:37
Speaker
Two, i would say that 10% of a um big pie is a lot more than 95% of nothing.
00:35:51
Speaker
see So i sure i prefer to deal with with partners and I'm willing to share if we can, um you know, drive it further.
00:36:03
Speaker
So, and then the the last thing, I'm not sure this is advice. I'm sure throughout different coaching sessions, I just thought about this, you know, so many managers um are, and what I'd call leaders, um really are about themselves and they, they direct down.
00:36:26
Speaker
And I think what they all have to realize is that They're there to lead people to do the best they can. So in fact, their job really is to help their staff to be the best that they can be, not to make them look good.
00:36:47
Speaker
They will look good because they will be helping others and then magically everything comes together. I think a lot of managers are not taught that. I think their ego gets ahead of them and they start, um,
00:37:02
Speaker
start directing, you know, rather than understanding that, um you know, it's the team that gets things done and you got make sure that all of your pieces are firing in all cylinders, no different than a soccer team. Everybody's got to be at their best to be the best team, right?
00:37:26
Speaker
Rather than You being an ego coach, but your team is a losing team.
Experiences in Big vs. Small Companies
00:37:31
Speaker
100%. Having gone from big companies to a smaller company, what what have you brought with you that you want to keep?
00:37:38
Speaker
And what did you leave behind that you never want to see again? Those are pretty easy. So, big companies have structures. they There's a set of behaviors.
00:37:50
Speaker
You know, there's emotional IQ, right? You guys know about that. Emotional intelligence. EQ is what companies call it. um Those are always higher at bigger companies.
00:38:02
Speaker
The bigger companies, typically, I'm stereotyping, of course, but I've worked with really, really smart people. doesn't mean the company is a good company, but um you know again, egos and other things.
00:38:16
Speaker
There are a lot of smart people that are hired because companies big companies can pay for that. um But what they always lack is...
00:38:27
Speaker
a culture that that is, again, the bigger the company is that it breaks down. I think Malcolm Gladwell says the op optimal number is about 150 people. So all businesses should divide themselves into divisions of 150 people because that's when you can really know your teammates.
00:38:49
Speaker
um Anything bigger than that becomes too loose. So I think that the smaller companies um have that going over the big companies. It's really difficult to compete because you don't have the resources. you You know, there's there's a lot of resources and reputation and brand and money that.
00:39:08
Speaker
big companies have that can win. But what smaller companies have, obviously, is when everybody is aligned, and you can you can be more nimble, and you can be more than the the set of the parts. So I think trying to bring the structures and and the and the best practices from big companies, but with, like I said, a more caring approach is, I think, how they work together.
00:39:38
Speaker
I think that businesses should hire the best person, not the person that whose resume has all of the words that the AI search has written.
Rethinking Hiring Practices
00:39:53
Speaker
I think that is a crock of... Big doo-doo. I think that the way that we hire is terrible. um I think that also the fact that we have screeners that don't know about the job and don't know about what that role is going back to our strengths, you know, and those.
00:40:13
Speaker
So when you have a generic screener screening for people, they're going to screen out some really good people and screen in some other people. And they're always what I would say, screening for lowest common denominator, right? They want um maybe ah a nice presentation, always a smile. I actually,
00:40:34
Speaker
both from recruiters in the past, as well as if you can believe it in one of my reviews at target, this was my review. You guys ready for this? I'm i totally serious. I have it in paper still.
00:40:47
Speaker
You should smile more. Because that is like, I'm talking about it like in you know meetings, you should smile more and you should talk at a higher octave because it's more friendly.
00:41:00
Speaker
So I should smile more and and be at a higher octave. And I should not put my hand like this too often when I'm listening and thinking because it seems like I'm hiding something.
00:41:12
Speaker
That was my review. That just made me throw up in my mouth a little bit. Yep. Yeah. I haven't written down. I can i can share it with you. but and I will say, I think you're the first man I've heard say that someone told them they should smile more. Usually that's something they say to women a lot.
00:41:28
Speaker
And my wife's response to that is, um ah my face is not here to make you feel better. Yeah. So um I get it. People, you know, like ah happier, more energetic, you know, more attractive people.
00:41:43
Speaker
But my point is that that doesn't mean that they're going to be a good employee and going to be a good worker and all that stuff. So going back to the original question, I think hiring the right people that that are a team, a good team member that that can contribute and then figuring out, you know, and tweaking where they should optimally fit.
00:42:11
Speaker
Um, it's opposite of what companies do. They have this narrow box. They want you to fit in this box and they try to find some unicorn candidate to fit in that box. It's, it's bad.
00:42:23
Speaker
i think that I, I think especially if you're thinking long-term for the company, you don't want somebody to fit the box. You want a great person that can grow and go grow out outside that box.
00:42:36
Speaker
And, um I don't have a solution for you, by the way. I'm just venting because that's what I've seen um companies do poorly. And and i think in that respect, I think I've done pretty well, both in my soccer world and in all of my companies, you know, even even not being able to pay maybe as much as some others as are, because it's always not the pay.
00:43:02
Speaker
You know, people want a nice environment where they are enjoying themselves, where, They do feel respected, tonight i and I wish that you know I could always pay them more, but that's um and secondary to you know giving them a ah respected job where they can grow.
00:43:19
Speaker
Well, Lev, I know you got a hard stop, so I want to thank you so much for your time and for being on the podcast today. um so It's been wonderful.