Transcript
Speaker: Hi, and welcome to the next episode of Unfiltered Podcast.
Speaker: In this episode, Courtney and I sat down for a chat with Sydney Newborn and family portrait photographer, Sophie Partica from Sophie Lee Photography.
Speaker: Sophie has been in the photography biz for more than 18 years, and she's been running her own portrait business for 10 years.
Speaker: She's also one of the speakers at the upcoming Unfiltered Retreat in the Blue Mountains from August 8th to 11th,
Speaker: And we are so excited to have her on the podcast today, sharing her thoughts and her expertise about building a brand and a business that you love.
Speaker: You'll hear us chat about how nostalgia and desperation to hang on to moments in time fuels the passion to create images for ourselves and others, how experience and maturity impacts our work and how we relate to clients.
Speaker: Sophie will explain how being patient and allowing your business to grow rather than rushing through that growth leads to long-term sustainability.
Speaker: How the best way to grow is to just get in and do the work.
Speaker: How cultivating genuine relationships is the real secret to building a successful business.
Speaker: What Sophie believes is one of the big misconceptions about building a successful brand and how outsourcing can be the catalyst for exponential growth.
Speaker: All right so we are so excited to have Sophie Lee from Sophie well Sophie Partica from Sophie Lee Photography here with us today for an episode on the Unfiltered Podcast.
Speaker: Hello Sophie how are you?
Speaker: So well thank you so much for having me.
Speaker: Thank you so much for being here.
Speaker: So just to start off, could you tell everybody a little bit about what you do?
Speaker: I mean, I know what you do.
Speaker: Kylie knows what you do.
Speaker: You're amazing.
Speaker: We love, we followed you for such a long time.
Speaker: It's been so amazing to see your growth over this period of time.
Speaker: And, but there's going to be people who come from areas that aren't familiar with you.
Speaker: So tell us a bit about you and your business, please.
Speaker: Of course.
Speaker: Well, I am a portrait photographer specializing in the family journey, I guess.
Speaker: So from pregnancy, newborn and families, it's all I have ever done.
Speaker: So I think a little unique in that, and then I know sometimes people fall into this after having children, whereas I was long before having kids or even thinking about having kids that I was capturing families.
Speaker: So I studied at school.
Speaker: I studied full-time at TAFE after school and failed the course but persisted anyway.
Speaker: Lied to get my first job saying that I was actually qualified and then I have worked in studios ever since then.
Speaker: So I worked in two, three major studios in Sydney for about eight years and then I...
Speaker: I fell pregnant with my son, which as we all know, well, if you've experienced that, how it flips your life upside down.
Speaker: And I decided that if it wasn't now, it was never.
Speaker: So it was the time to go out on my own.
Speaker: And I've had my own business.
Speaker: My business turned 10 last year.
Speaker: And since then, I've gone from working in homes and outdoors to now working outdoors and in my own studio.
Speaker: which has been a beautiful transition.
Speaker: But I just have never been able to completely pull my or at all pull myself away from capturing families.
Speaker: And it's only the obsession has only grown since having my own.
Speaker: I now have three and just that almost appreciation with this dash of desperation to capture families.
Speaker: things for myself yes but also for other families just seems to increase as my kids get older yeah so I guess usually over time people get oh how long can I do this for and yeah that's kind of I feel like the opposite yeah the level of it just deepens for me now that my son is just he'll be turning 10 this year
Speaker: Isn't that funny you ask me, what do you do, Sophie?
Speaker: And here I am talking about my kids again.
Speaker: Oh, well, I have these children.
Speaker: You know, it's just so natural.
Speaker: But he's about to turn, he'll turn 10 this year and he's up to my shoulder.
Speaker: And it's just like, I thought as they got older, I'd probably photograph them less.
Speaker: And it's the opposite again.
Speaker: I'm just like, oh, wait a minute.
Speaker: You've just grown that little bit more.
Speaker: Your studies look like a teenager.
Speaker: Like, let's get as many photos before that happens.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: So I think just across the board, like capturing my own family, capturing parents,
Speaker: these moments now when people come in with their first baby to me that's a decade ago yeah um and I'm like oh my god you guys don't even know how much you want to capture this and you're gonna want that and you're gonna want that yeah I always think about the things that I didn't get with my own girls when they were babies and I'm like you have to get this like I need to make sure you have all of this because you will regret it if you don't
Speaker: Yeah, if you do not have a 16 by 24 inch print of the tiniest crease of your baby's foot, you're going to never, like you won't live.
Speaker: It's just a funny thing because now I guess like for the three of us who have been in the game for a long time, like we've been doing this before socials and all of that.
Speaker: and have, you know, like slightly older kids, I guess, rather than babies now.
Speaker: But it is just a realisation that if you don't do it, you never get that back.
Speaker: You never get that shot again.
Speaker: And I think you sort of think that, but when you have older kids and they're just like, you don't want to kiss their feet anymore, you realise like, shit, that's it, isn't it?
Speaker: Like that's gone now.
Speaker: There's no, even sniffing their head, I'm like, ooh, have you washed it?
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: Like my daughter wanted me to pick her up the other day and I'm just like, you're too big, mate.
Speaker: Like I can't do it.
Speaker: And she's my youngest.
Speaker: I'm like, oh, my gosh.
Speaker: I know.
Speaker: I'm not going to like pick her up again.
Speaker: Oh, no.
Speaker: Yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker: Heartstrings, eh?
Speaker: Kind of like scoop them up and sit on the lounge and make them into a ball because they're just all these like long arms and legs.
Speaker: Yeah, they're all limbs at this point.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: It's amazing though because like it gives you that different perspective and I think sometimes that's what parents that come to us can really appreciate because I think a lot of times they see that in our work
Speaker: as well as the passion grows, as your kids get older, as you said, like you, I think that all the time too, when I'm making a film for a family, like just wait, just wait, not till you see this, but like five years from now when you watch this again.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Even six months, 12 months, like even I've noticed just like to really zoom out on my behavior with inner shoot has changed.
Speaker: I know when I was young,
Speaker: maybe it was an energy thing too who knows but I was very like I was very the clown like trying to kind of bring things out and make kids laugh all the time and and now I just feel like I'm very like what's gonna happen here like what's your dynamic like and and I it's okay to not have them even having fun all the time because that's not reality either and
Speaker: And I just, I'm so much quieter than I was.
Speaker: And I think that's experience too, of just kind of going, I just want to, I don't want to be the main character at this shoot.
Speaker: I just kind of want to, well, I definitely direct and I'm probably direct way more than a lot of people do.
Speaker: But I, yeah, my approach has even changed just with experience and I guess maturity and
Speaker: And then understanding that not every, like every time I look back at a shoot, I've got different favorites.
Speaker: So I'll know that I'll go in and I'll edit my favorites.
Speaker: And then I revisit a shoot and I find all this stuff and it's never the typicals.
Speaker: I go, oh my gosh, he doesn't do that face anymore.
Speaker: She doesn't pull that silly face anymore.
Speaker: That's why even when kids, like when I play a game about making funny faces, I still want to capture a couple of those because it's like, they're just, it's a type of face they'll never do again.
Speaker: And
Speaker: So I think, yeah, I think the imagery film of your children is going to be appreciated in a different way as they grow.
Speaker: And then as I grow as a photographer, the way that I approach it is also different.
Speaker: So there's growth in all elements.
Speaker: But, yeah, so aside from photography, I also teach, which is another huge passion of mine.
Speaker: Yeah, tell us about that.
Speaker: Yeah, well, I mean,
Speaker: I've always wanted to end up in that position.
Speaker: I hoped to that I focused on my business for such a long time, but it was always in the pipeline because when I was in studios, I always ended up in a managerial leader training position in every role I did.
Speaker: Even way back when I was folding underwear at best and less, I would always end up as
Speaker: like the service supervisor you know with all the rattling keys like yeah service supervisor to register one and down should come like 16 years of age like so important and so I was always like always kind of reached for the next step and what else can I do I'm here now like how how much can I can I kind of climb up a little so obviously when that um
Speaker: played out in the studios.
Speaker: I was teaching people to shoot.
Speaker: I was teaching people to sell.
Speaker: I was teaching all elements of that.
Speaker: So I really loved it and I didn't have the best teachers when I was starting.
Speaker: My teachers were to the point but ruthless, a lot of fear-based teaching.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I knew there was a better way to do that because then when I had them one-on-one, I wasn't teaching like that but getting really great results and I thought you don't have to teach people like that.
Speaker: You can actually like really love and foster them and give like honest feedback and support them.
Speaker: So I hoped one day I'd be able to do that on a bigger scale.
Speaker: So it's been about two years now that I've been doing, starting off with like one-on-one Zooms to like group Zooms and then in-person experiences, retreats and workshops.
Speaker: And that has been a really fulfilling part of my experience.
Speaker: I guess, as I said, I have no idea
Speaker: I have no vision of giving up the camera.
Speaker: However, the two go so well hand in hand in terms of diversifying my year and my output.
Speaker: So it's been, that's been a real joy.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: That's awesome.
Speaker: I feel very strongly in the same way about just like the style of teaching and sort of what was available when I first started and it kind of, I'm so just like, do what works for you.
Speaker: Like try lots of things.
Speaker: experiment lots of ways um but sometimes I think especially in the early days is very black and white it was very like you have to do it this way and you have to do this and it's like no um there's so many different ways to do things so that's amazing and it's such it gives such a great insight to who you are as a person and as a teacher um I know that's something that I really appreciate
Speaker: when I'm looking for someone to learn from is just that sort of approach to things being a little bit more relaxed and less rigid and strict.
Speaker: But one of the things that we are the most excited about for you coming on as a teacher to Unfiltered is the way that you've grown your business and built your brand as well.
Speaker: And I think this is something that
Speaker: so hard for creatives like to like you can shoot and you can edit but there are so many amazing photographers that fail at the business side of things because like there's I mean there's a plethora of reasons but a lot of times you know it's not getting the right support not knowing what you need to do from a business point of view like what do I need to have in place
Speaker: How can I, how can I grow my business?
Speaker: You get, there's so many, it's very noisy out there in the world of business.
Speaker: Like what advice should you follow?
Speaker: Things like that.
Speaker: So it's been really for me, like inspiring to watch you grow from the business that you had.
Speaker: I would say like,
Speaker: you've really taken off in probably like the last five years or so.
Speaker: Would you like agree?
Speaker: Like just, it feels like you've really skyrocketed.
Speaker: And I think a lot of that is you.
Speaker: It's like you showing up.
Speaker: It's you, you know, putting your face forward.
Speaker: But I know that you have a very business mind.
Speaker: Like that comes in, I feel like that comes naturally to you, but you can tell me if I'm wrong or not.
Speaker: That's what it seems like.
Speaker: Do you have like a background in business?
Speaker: Have you had support from someone else?
Speaker: Like, where do you feel like, like, where has that come from for you?
Speaker: Does it come naturally?
Speaker: Does it come naturally?
Speaker: I think it does because you get to a point where some people try to ask you to explain things and you can't.
Speaker: And I think that's when you know it's inherent.
Speaker: Now,
Speaker: However, you can then observe results and then create formulas off the back of that, which is kind of what I've done with my education is going, okay, as we were saying before, there's so many ways to like, you know, do one thing.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: But especially for beginners, just having some like
Speaker: structure helps um so I feel like that's where I can I provide a lot of value I know there's a lot of people doing um just like you know fly on the wall shoot things where there's few people in my industry that sit down and go right this is how we can actually you can walk away today and probably have a better business after it so I've been able to kind of zoom out and go okay what is it I do that has the most impact but I think there's been other things for sure I think for me working in studios old school yeah as like brutal as it was yeah
Speaker: There is a side to me that has done me a lot of favours, which is my work ethic.
Speaker: So it's not necessarily, oh, she's born for business.
Speaker: It's like I have a really good work ethic and I do not give up easily.
Speaker: So I stayed in environments way longer when I was in a position of like the highest staff turnover.
Speaker: I just stayed and I dug my heels in and I'm like, there was no university for us.
Speaker: There was nowhere else to learn if I was going to leave.
Speaker: well, I can leave because I'm not being treated well, but what will I then learn?
Speaker: I learned all the things not to do.
Speaker: So it was kind of learning in reverse.
Speaker: So I was like, okay, I'm seeing people crying here.
Speaker: They're leaving.
Speaker: They're getting fired.
Speaker: They're like,
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: So what would I do?
Speaker: Like, how could I retain staff or how would I speak to my staff if I had them?
Speaker: It's like the opposite of that.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: You know, they, this happened and that happened and I can see all we get, we get so many complaints, we get so many upset clients, we get husbands coming in, like screaming at us.
Speaker: So like that never felt right.
Speaker: And it never sat right in my value system.
Speaker: So I queried, okay, well, what could we have done to still like, you know, make money and be successful, but have people come back because getting new clients was just always the chase.
Speaker: And I knew I didn't have that in me.
Speaker: I didn't want to be cold calling people.
Speaker: And I just wanted to be magnetic rather than chasing all the time.
Speaker: So I guess over the years, like no kids, just I was young.
Speaker: I started in there when I was like 18, 19 into my early 20s.
Speaker: And I just watched.
Speaker: I watched.
Speaker: I got paid next to nothing.
Speaker: I wasn't chasing the money.
Speaker: I thought this is invaluable experience.
Speaker: I actually can't buy this anywhere.
Speaker: So I'm sticking it out.
Speaker: So I think my work ethic like played like definitely served me very well in those environments.
Speaker: So I kind of learnt that way a lot of the time.
Speaker: Probably a little bit by osmosis with my dad.
Speaker: He's always had his own business and businesses.
Speaker: He's been in partnerships and on his own.
Speaker: And whilst I've never really sat down and been like, teach me about business.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: there was definitely things that I noticed with him growing up and like his likability.
Speaker: And I was like, why doesn't my dad ever sit in an office?
Speaker: Why is he always out to coffee?
Speaker: And I learned it's about the people, right?
Speaker: So you, your relationships, my dad knew people for like 40 years.
Speaker: Like he was having coffee with the same guy every Friday at the same place at the same time, like 25 years.
Speaker: And he had a contract with that guy for all that time.
Speaker: And yeah,
Speaker: So every time things came up for tender, he always got it, even if he charged more because he had these relationships.
Speaker: And I just noticed the way of what work looked like for him versus other people's dads and thought, yeah, wow, that's cool.
Speaker: That's cool that you get to do what you're really good at.
Speaker: And I saw his superpower.
Speaker: But my dad had to put it into perspective.
Speaker: My dad had a contract cleaning company.
Speaker: But he just like felt like, well, I'm sure he would just die if he heard me say it.
Speaker: It's not all that, Sophie.
Speaker: But I felt like, wow, you don't actually clean anything.
Speaker: You just have coffee.
Speaker: It's like that's kind of how it seems to me.
Speaker: So hopefully he does not listen to that.
Speaker: But I guess what I'm saying is it taught me it is way and I hate the phrase it's who you know, but it's not who you know, it's who you who you foster.
Speaker: Um, and, and I just was, when I got into business, I, gosh, I just took that so seriously.
Speaker: And I had someone who picked up my work in, he was down, um, in a completely different part of Sydney.
Speaker: He found my work, he was closing down his portrait side.
Speaker: And all of a sudden I started to get all these recommendations from this person.
Speaker: I didn't know.
Speaker: And they'd be like, so-and-so anyway, so I made, um, sure that I reached out and I was like,
Speaker: you know, I wanted to let you know that I've got so much work from you and I need your address.
Speaker: And like I sent him and his wife a Christmas gift and some like movie tickets for his kids.
Speaker: And I was like, this is like a relationship because you have, you know, and I feel like that sort of stuff is, is what I've learned.
Speaker: It's what I've watched.
Speaker: And I've gone, those are the things like as silly as it seems, or as small as it might seem, they are the things that really help you along the way, because if you're grateful, you're
Speaker: And you make sure that you show up for other people and you're available for people and you help other people.
Speaker: It always seems to come back to you.
Speaker: So I guess they were like, when it comes to like, oh, you know, the lessons, I think that's really what it was.
Speaker: And I think that's always served me well and making sure that I then show up.
Speaker: And obviously my dad did not have Instagram.
Speaker: He wasn't talking to a screen, but I have no doubt that
Speaker: If he did and he was 30 kicking off his business, he would.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: My dad would be going live on the daily.
Speaker: He's just charismatic and people like to listen to him and be around him and he has a way of bringing people together and speaking where people understand and he's got a really good sense of humour.
Speaker: So I think... Sophie, you like have just described yourself.
Speaker: Oh, God.
Speaker: Again, my dad would be like, she doesn't tell any jokes.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So it's, yeah, I think it's those things to be honest.
Speaker: I'm forgetting the question.
Speaker: No, that really makes so much sense because I think, and I see this in the way that you have grown your business and the way that you have specifically kind of grown online and social media, it's relationships.
Speaker: It's so clear, like it's relationship building essentially.
Speaker: And I think that sometimes people can get a bit caught up in like,
Speaker: chasing the numbers or like the statistics and the views and the likes and all of that.
Speaker: And I feel like maybe, and maybe you do a little bit of like noticing those things.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I don't know that back end of your business, but from the outside, what it seems like to me is that it's just very genuine and you genuinely believe in the things that you say and the, and that everything that you are doing is really coming from a place of
Speaker: genuinely wanting to help people and building relationships with it, with your community online.
Speaker: It doesn't feel like any of it is with the intent of growth.
Speaker: And I think that it just, it comes across so effortlessly.
Speaker: And, and I think that really like when people try and ask maybe what the secret formula is, is it's not so much about all of that.
Speaker: It's just about that authenticity, that genuine, like,
Speaker: desire for wanting to build relationships yeah absolutely and I think it's tapping in and figuring out like what is your superpower everyone has something different to offer and I know there's some people you know in in or out of the industry they're relevant but people that I follow on Instagram and I'm like it is perfectly suited to them to be more elusive and like not talk
Speaker: And there's some people that I'm like, oh my gosh, I actually don't even know what they look like, but it's like perfectly their brand.
Speaker: Like I just go, oh my gosh, like if they jumped on it would be weird, but it's almost like that's the intrigue.
Speaker: So it's not about going, you have to do this framework.
Speaker: It's like, but don't do it if it's not you because
Speaker: Not everyone can do that.
Speaker: And for some people that's going to create like massive anxiety or like whatever it is.
Speaker: And that's not to say that it wasn't, it was easy for me to just jump on.
Speaker: Like when I started talking to my phone, like what a weird thing to do.
Speaker: I saw an opportunity when stories came out and I didn't have anyone to look at and go, oh, they're doing it.
Speaker: It's worked.
Speaker: It's this thing that is definitely going to work for me.
Speaker: It wasn't like that.
Speaker: So I think, I guess touching on like
Speaker: coming from a place of just being authentic I just saw it as another way or a really really unique opportunity to talk to people um that we hadn't had before yeah um so it was either lives or you know posts at that point so I was like oh this is cool because what I liked about it is that they expired anything permanent yes always felt a bit for me like a live that was fully saved it's like what did Sophie say in May 2021 and like
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I was just a bit like, oh, not really ready for that.
Speaker: So the stories were great because I'm like, if it didn't sound great, if it didn't work, quote unquote, like not that I wanted anything to be anything with a particular outcome because at that point it was really experimenting.
Speaker: Right, yes.
Speaker: But I assumed if I could talk directly to my clients in a way that they could get to know me rather than just by, you know, writing.
Speaker: And if I'm going to go into education, if people...
Speaker: figure out they like me as a person, then they're probably more inclined to book education with me because there's nothing worse than turning up to education and going, I can't even stand this woman's voice.
Speaker: I don't like her values or,
Speaker: what the fuck is she doing with that baby?
Speaker: Like, I don't know what, you know, like I have been in that position and gone, actually, when I stepped back, I knew nothing about that person and the way that they worked.
Speaker: I saw their photos, but the way they got there, did it align with me?
Speaker: I've got no idea.
Speaker: Whereas I feel like opening myself up, not to my clients and because this is twofold.
Speaker: I don't have two pages.
Speaker: So I'm kind of talking to audiences all the time.
Speaker: Yeah, I was just about to ask about that.
Speaker: Yeah, and I toyed with the idea, but I just, I love how my clients are so invested in my other side as well.
Speaker: Like they actually are my biggest cheerleaders.
Speaker: So I just kind of ended up leaving it as one page.
Speaker: But yeah, so they're,
Speaker: and and and because then my education team like followers or you know mentees also get to see the way I kind of relate to my clients but I've had I I guess the the result of showing up in that way has been has surpassed what I ever thought it would be uh the wildest moments are
Speaker: When someone says to me, I just never, ever wanted photos done, but I just kind of booked it so I could hang out with you.
Speaker: I'm like, what?
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: I never, ever would have thought, yeah, I'm going to jump on stories and people are just going to hang out with me and give me their money because like I'll make it more about me than the photos.
Speaker: Like that was never, I would never, ever in my wildest dreams think I could convince someone
Speaker: to have photos just because they think I'm like a nice person.
Speaker: And it's kind of come to that point where they're like, oh, I just started following you and my friend told me that you talk a bit about parenting a little bit, so I kind of followed along.
Speaker: And then I realised, oh, my God, if I don't have photos of my child's foot, I'm going to die.
Speaker: So that's kind of, I guess, taking the most important thing for a sustainable business for me has been taking something that is,
Speaker: not necessary and making it a necessity.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So that's kind of been, I guess, my driver of my brand because true or not, I was told so much when I was younger that you'll never make a living out of this, you know,
Speaker: And especially when digital photography came out, it was like, oh, well, now what are you going to do?
Speaker: It's like when it's actually been the opposite.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's now completely opposite.
Speaker: Like imagery is like more valuable than ever currently is in my belief.
Speaker: So, yeah.
Speaker: So interesting tool, the social media and trial and error as well as, you know, just a clear vision of wanting to
Speaker: A, make sure people are capturing their babies frequently because I'm a photographer and B, making sure that people starting businesses and particularly females in this industry don't feel alone.
Speaker: So that was kind of like my, that's just like the format of starting out.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's just kind of grown from there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's really clear in everything that I've seen on your feed.
Speaker: I'm curious about how you felt when they introduced Reels.
Speaker: Yeah, I am not offended.
Speaker: Like people are really offended.
Speaker: I'm 38.
Speaker: I'm 39 this year.
Speaker: The only thing that's certain is change and we know that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's like nothing is ever going to stay the same.
Speaker: Got to adapt.
Speaker: And...
Speaker: The other thing I was sort of surprised at was that the people that were most pissed about reels were the creatives, whereas I was like, we have the biggest advantage because we're creatives.
Speaker: So it's time to just get creative.
Speaker: Like imagine if you were like someone who didn't even know how to take a decent video or photo on your, like they're lost.
Speaker: We have the biggest leg up on socials.
Speaker: anyway yeah and if they change the game a bit we're still I've found each change I feel like well photographers or videographers creatives in general still ahead because they can think outside the box but then I found like wow they're actually really offended um because why is that I feel uh I think because creatives love to
Speaker: be seen as really unique and like edgy and maybe reels felt at the beginning felt cringe and tacky where it was like that just because people are selling stuff and they're doing lip syncing or whatever yeah um
Speaker: It's okay.
Speaker: And it's also okay to play around with that too between creative reels and like showing your face or whatever it is.
Speaker: But, yeah, it was interesting, I felt.
Speaker: I was like, no, definitely not offended by it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And definitely believe and have proof that stagnant images, like good ones, are still great on socials.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Absolutely will still perform as long as they're good imagery.
Speaker: Like I love...
Speaker: to encourage people to get a bit more creative with their captions.
Speaker: But I've had a post like in the only in the last couple of weeks that outperformed so many of mine.
Speaker: And it was like pretty much a happy Friday, like a really like lame caption and one single photo.
Speaker: And I almost never post just one single photo.
Speaker: And that's like outperformed my
Speaker: so many of my posts in the last six months.
Speaker: So to say that it's, to get cranky at something, and I think that, you know, the algorithm at Instagram is its own business.
Speaker: So there's ebbs and flows and there's learning happening all the time there too.
Speaker: It's always changing too.
Speaker: Always changing.
Speaker: So I think, yeah, you just got to lean in.
Speaker: And I think people can get really scared and annoyed by it.
Speaker: But, I mean, I was doing letterbox drops.
Speaker: and reels are better than that so take my word if you want to go back to doing letterbox drops just because you know that whole hand in paper is like the old you know back in my day it's like nah you got to adapt you know I love that um taking you back to like sort of the beginning how long do you feel like it took for you to
Speaker: feel like things are picking up.
Speaker: You were getting momentum, like going from that sort of beginner, what am I doing?
Speaker: Am I doing the right things to like, things are good.
Speaker: Like getting to that kind of point where your brand was felt solid to you and felt like it was in a really good place.
Speaker: How long do you think that took you?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like this is a really interesting question because I,
Speaker: By comparison, I sort of think of it like raising kids.
Speaker: Like at each stage, my brand was exactly where it needed to be for that time in my life.
Speaker: So when my brand was younger and felt probably...
Speaker: It probably felt more local and less professional.
Speaker: It was when I had two babies at home.
Speaker: And of course, I like didn't have good systems, but I was, you know, obviously shooting and people were loving their work and it felt different.
Speaker: And so my brand was looser and more casual.
Speaker: And I was really sort of, it was word of mouth.
Speaker: So people were quite local to me.
Speaker: And I guess, yeah, that brand was different to what it is now, but it was exactly the brand that I was servicing the people at the time and where I was at in my life.
Speaker: So as my brand grew over time and I had more capacity and more energy and was ready for that growth and my brand grew and to a point now, like by comparison, is probably considered within our industry, like I am known globally to a degree,
Speaker: in a lot of different countries know me, which is weird.
Speaker: And that's the brand that I need now to service what I have.
Speaker: So staff and studio and education.
Speaker: But I think it's all where you're at at the time and you can't skip the steps.
Speaker: And each part is what you have to deal with.
Speaker: Like if I just was like new photographer, fresh out of the gates, here's my business.
Speaker: It's just too much.
Speaker: There's like, you know, it's skills you're learning along the way.
Speaker: So, yeah, to say where did I think, like when did I feel like it was right, it was just kind of right all along.
Speaker: But I think when I began to outsource was when I felt that I could grow with confidence.
Speaker: So my head was above water because I had help.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: but it's kind of like, you know, when you're raising kids and each time you're like, I just really can't wait for them to walk.
Speaker: I just want them to be able to eat on their own.
Speaker: I want them to stop wiping their bums or like whatever.
Speaker: Each stage is just long enough that you'll miss it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because if it was any longer, you'd be like, just kill me.
Speaker: But it's always long enough.
Speaker: It's always the right stage.
Speaker: It's always just enough.
Speaker: It's always
Speaker: ready for the next bit.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I feel like that's with your business and your brand as well.
Speaker: So there's no rushing.
Speaker: And I think if you rush, you miss the lessons.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But probably for me, when I felt like I could go, okay, I think I'm good in terms of I'm pretty sure I'll be booked and I don't have to worry was probably, yeah, about four or five years ago.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: When I felt like I had the air energy to then kind of prepare my audience for education launch.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because I put a lot into that like years.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Before I like bit the bullet.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And was like, now I'm going to drop it on them.
Speaker: I love that answer.
Speaker: Because I wanted that relationship.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I love that answer because, you know, what I find that I see a lot of times is photographers,
Speaker: Will they want to get all of the branding and like their the business stuff kind of looking really professional before they're shooting before they really put themselves out there they're like holding back from doing that work to sort of wait for everything to be perfect and I'm always encouraging them.
Speaker: to just be shooting and because so many things are going to change the more clients that you work with the better your systems are going to get and the more people that you work with the better your shoots are going to be the more prepared you're going to be the the better your questionnaires are going to be the and then that's when you sort of sort of like find your voice and your style and your branding then that's all really connected so
Speaker: The fact that your answer was really like everything was perfect for the time that it was and what it meant to be is so in line with that.
Speaker: It's just don't rush it and, and really just be kind of.
Speaker: continue to shoot, continue to do that work, continue to show up and do all of that without like, get out there and start building those relationships with clients because my little $5 Etsy logo was just fine how she was, you know, and it was not about
Speaker: Definitely not about that.
Speaker: But I hear that all the time too.
Speaker: And I have that, oh, yeah, no, I'm about to launch.
Speaker: I'm like, launch what?
Speaker: No one even knows what you're talking about.
Speaker: Like you're not launching anything.
Speaker: Just put it out there.
Speaker: Get out there and start doing the work.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like I think there's like that ego sometimes attached to, oh, then I'm going to come out and then they go, oh, shit, no one's doing it.
Speaker: Like no one's reacting to me.
Speaker: Everyone wants everyone to.
Speaker: react to you and tell you your grade and every gallery has to be like, you're amazing.
Speaker: And if it's not, it's like, oh my God, you know, it's just like, we all start somewhere.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And the, the, the, I, I just believe that people that want all the ducks in a row are just
Speaker: it's they're hiding behind what they feel is perfectionism and it's really just like a form of procrastination um keeping them from rejection yeah yeah yeah fear of you know not getting it right straight away yeah and and that's the thing is like in my education I'm always saying you know how many times ashen like ash works is my full-time employee how many times we sit together and change like the whole thing you know
Speaker: And I come in, I go, well, and I've got an idea.
Speaker: And Asha's like, oh, Jesus.
Speaker: And she goes again.
Speaker: You're describing us.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's like, no, this isn't working.
Speaker: Or just simple things like questionnaires.
Speaker: Like people say, well, do you have a questionnaire?
Speaker: I go, yeah.
Speaker: Well, what are all your questions?
Speaker: It's like, but my clients are different to your clients.
Speaker: Don't ask questions.
Speaker: Like your client, your questionnaire would be so different to mine because you don't need to ask questions just for the sake of asking questions because then you're just wasting people's time.
Speaker: So you have to think about what do I actually need to know to prepare myself to shoot these people?
Speaker: And for some people, it'll be a lot.
Speaker: For me, it's very little because I can talk to anyone.
Speaker: And I find if I have too much information, I have a really...
Speaker: poor memory yeah so then I feel like I've asked you all this stuff and I should know it so I'm actually setting myself up for failure doing that so I'm better fresh so maybe when someone sees my questionnaire they're like oh is that it because I had this other photographer she had three pages I'm like because we're different right so um but you don't know that until you start and so then you go to a shoot and you go oh they really like wore a lot of blue and I hate editing blue so now I need to tell my clients
Speaker: I don't like shooting blue.
Speaker: So that's, that's important.
Speaker: But like, now I need to tell them this, or now I need to ask them this.
Speaker: Oh shoot.
Speaker: I went to the beach and then, you know, like the, the, you know, the kids are allergic to salt water.
Speaker: Oh, I need to ask them.
Speaker: Are there any, you know, so these things come up over time and they're different for everyone.
Speaker: Cause some people, someone that lives in the middle of Australia, that's like, you know, five hours from the local beach doesn't have to worry about that.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: So yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, I think it's just like dive in, dive in and work it out.
Speaker: And just shoot as much as you can.
Speaker: Yeah, the learning is in that.
Speaker: And the type of clients you attract are different as well.
Speaker: So my client base is going to be so different to someone else's.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And do your clients need or like a lot of hand-holding?
Speaker: It's very different.
Speaker: I've booked photographers before, so many photographers because I get my family captured all the time.
Speaker: And everybody has a different way of doing it.
Speaker: And you sort of think, yeah, that's really different to me, but it doesn't mean anything's right or wrong in what we do.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: What do you feel like, just kind of, I guess, on the topic of,
Speaker: what people should sort of know and what people think they know or want think they want I guess is a better way of putting it as a newish I would say like first second year in photography what do you feel like maybe a misconception is about building your brand that they might have uh yeah that it needs to be separate to you that it's
Speaker: I mean, this is going to be, everyone has a different opinion on this, but I just don't think in the industry that we're in that your brand is separate to who you are.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So you don't need to be different.
Speaker: Your brand is a reflection of you.
Speaker: People need to know.
Speaker: I think the biggest thing I've learned is that people are so comforted by the fact that they feel into whatever degree that is.
Speaker: They feel they know me before they turn up.
Speaker: So there's so many walls that are broken down for people.
Speaker: The feedback from that could be anything like ranging from, I know that your little one's a bit of a challenge, so I thought you might be able to deal with my little nightmare, to I feel like you could talk to my husband well because you've got a bit of a,
Speaker: Like, you know, you're a bit cash or easy to speak to us.
Speaker: I just know that my husband hates photos, but I feel like you could get him to do it.
Speaker: So things like that.
Speaker: I think branding isn't a logo and a website and a professional voice and I'm going to jump on Instagram and say rephrase all the things that someone else has said because it's worked for them.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Branding now is front facing whether you like it or not.
Speaker: Most people don't even know what my logo looks like unless they email us.
Speaker: It's not that anymore.
Speaker: It's got to be, you've got to get in front of it.
Speaker: And I think that's the biggest difference between a creative that's a creative and a beautiful photographer and someone who is
Speaker: going to have a successful business yeah getting out of your own way stepping forward and and understanding that um but as we said before in your own way stepping forward for your own brand doesn't have to be getting on instagram and talking to people or um
Speaker: It's just got to be true and reflective of you.
Speaker: So I think that's probably the biggest misconception.
Speaker: It's like, okay, this week I'm going to work on branding and it's like straight to the pen and paper, the Canva.
Speaker: And I'm so sloppy with that sort of stuff too.
Speaker: So that's why I know it doesn't matter.
Speaker: Like I have lots of people that I follow and I go, fuck, your slides are like so together.
Speaker: But I just can't do that because, first of all, I hate using Canva from my phone.
Speaker: And second of all, I don't sit at a computer for very long at all because that's not my, I can't, not built for it.
Speaker: So if I'm just going to get content out constantly and be there doing those things that I want to do, educating my clients and supporting photographers, I just have to get over that.
Speaker: And just, I go straight into create and I type and I, sometimes it's always a different on and whatever, like it doesn't, you know, but then I guess that people would also kind of go, oh, like she's,
Speaker: her brand is so polished or so like it is in a way, but then I just don't let, I don't let that also don't let that get in my way.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'd rather put it out there than it'd be perfect.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I love that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's, I think what is so interesting and fascinating because exactly what you said, like branding is not just your logo or your website.
Speaker: Like it's,
Speaker: It's showing up and all of that is so consistent in your, on your socials, at least.
Speaker: And so I don't think that the graphic design side of it matters at all.
Speaker: And so I think that's a really great thing for a lot of people who are out there thinking about
Speaker: I'm not good at graphic design.
Speaker: So how can I like, I can't, I can't move forward without hiring a graphic designer.
Speaker: Oh, I need to hire someone to do like, you can hire people to do those things.
Speaker: But if you're just starting out and you don't have the money for it, you can create a website very simply.
Speaker: It does not have to be perfect.
Speaker: And it does not have to be done by a graphic designer or a website designer or anything like that.
Speaker: So no.
Speaker: And I think it's just like a one page landing page to legitimize yourself.
Speaker: When people want that like second step, you know, they go on socials, but then they'll go on your website.
Speaker: Like if they're looking to book, they just want that next step.
Speaker: So definitely just like a landing page, a bit about you, an image of yourself so they know who they're meeting.
Speaker: All your images are on socials.
Speaker: So I feel like websites more like the deep dive info, like what am I up for?
Speaker: Like where are you located?
Speaker: Like things like that.
Speaker: But yeah, it definitely doesn't need to be.
Speaker: And the thing is, it's like everything is,
Speaker: everything can be changed so you're not tied to it that's right you can change it tomorrow or you can update it tonight when the kids are down yeah but you're actually better off putting it up in the morning and just having something there so um understanding that everything's especially now because you can buy these templates that you drop in i mean yes lord do you remember doing your first website oh my god yeah yeah hours and hours
Speaker: I mean, it's so hard.
Speaker: And even for me now, I got my website kind of put together, but then I can go in and edit it.
Speaker: And if I can go in and edit it, then anyone can.
Speaker: And it just sees templates.
Speaker: They just drop in and you buy them and you download them and you drop them in somehow.
Speaker: And like, wow, that is such an amazing resource.
Speaker: Canva's amazing.
Speaker: Oh, my God.
Speaker: I feel like Canva is a complete game changer.
Speaker: Complete game changer.
Speaker: Everything I used to do in Photoshop before.
Speaker: Oh, I know.
Speaker: So painful.
Speaker: So painful.
Speaker: And then you'd export it and be fuzzy, like, oh, so fuzzy.
Speaker: Oh, the wrong bloody, you had to be a genius.
Speaker: Like a Photoshop, not just Photoshop, Photoshop genius to be able to put out a flyer.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I think now there's like the resources available for, I mean, there's some things that I feel for starting out photographers, challenges that we didn't have, but I think overall, you know,
Speaker: they are resource rich and you can start a photography business with a camera and a laptop.
Speaker: And that's a pretty cheap business to start.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: So, okay, last question for you before we wrap things up.
Speaker: What is one thing that you wish you knew when you first started that you feel like might've helped you at that time?
Speaker: if there was anything, like one thing that you wish you knew when you began?
Speaker: Oh, there's a lot of things.
Speaker: But I think understanding that the most valuable investment you can make is outsourcing the stuff that you don't want to do.
Speaker: Having someone else in your business that takes on the tasks that don't suit you
Speaker: I believe is the key to longevity and avoiding burnout.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So being honest with yourself because, I mean, I've had multiple times of burnout and multiple times of wanting to throw it in the towel and burn it all to the ground.
Speaker: Like I've had so many of those, but it was never the shooting that did that to me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, never.
Speaker: It was the editing.
Speaker: It was the backend.
Speaker: It was the questioning myself.
Speaker: It was the socials.
Speaker: It was the, all the things.
Speaker: I could shoot all day and I still do.
Speaker: I mean, people, I just get multiple messages all the time going, how many, how do you still do so?
Speaker: How do you do so many shoots?
Speaker: How?
Speaker: I know everyone's capacity is different.
Speaker: My capacity for shoots is large.
Speaker: I just am so happy doing it.
Speaker: But what pulls you back from that capacity is when you have to do everything else.
Speaker: Absolutely.
Speaker: So now obviously I don't have to do everything else.
Speaker: So I'm like, well, what else am I going to do?
Speaker: I may as well do another shoot.
Speaker: So I really wish that I had perhaps the resources that you and I offer.
Speaker: of going and sitting and listening to someone say, yeah, definitely do that.
Speaker: Because everyone at the time that I was doing it was just still doing everything for themselves.
Speaker: I didn't have that person to go, oh, well, she did it and it was the best thing ever.
Speaker: I didn't really have that.
Speaker: So, yeah, the rest of everything aside from shooting and big picture stuff, like I'm really good at the vision and I'm strong on socials and I'm really good in my shoots.
Speaker: everything else challenges me in a negative way.
Speaker: So like I said, sitting at the computer, I get anxious.
Speaker: I feel very square peg round hole in front of a computer for a long period of time.
Speaker: If I had have invested in it sooner, could I have avoided burnout?
Speaker: Highly possible.
Speaker: And I would have been able to grow in a smarter way.
Speaker: And I would have been training people from a place of growth instead of a place of panic.
Speaker: Because by the time I did put people on,
Speaker: it's like this better if I can work.
Speaker: Like, you've got to get it right there.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it made it hard because anyone who's ever tried to outsource editing, I feel like everyone does the same thing.
Speaker: Everyone tries one person is too hard and then they go, I tried and it didn't work.
Speaker: And I totally get that because I went through multiple people and I sort of left it alone for a big period of time in between.
Speaker: But then I just got to the point where it's literally,
Speaker: I just don't think I can do this for a long term if I'm still doing the editing.
Speaker: Like it's, that's going to be what kills me.
Speaker: So that gave me the motivation to go again, but that's a relationship building experience over time.
Speaker: Um, and no one wants to hear it, but you will be paying for editing that you will be redoing for many, many, many months.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And that's a normal part of the process.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Um, but as soon as people feel like, oh, I'm redoing it and I've paid that person, this isn't worth it.
Speaker: Whereas it's actually, it is worth it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: it is 100% worth it because if you're wanting to do this long term, it's just a necessary evil.
Speaker: So I think when I was doing that, it was stressful because I was like, I really need this to work now rather than coming from a place of going, okay, where do I want my business to be in five years?
Speaker: Whether or not I had the work, it was like, where do I want it to be in five years and what do I need to do to get there?
Speaker: Could I put someone on
Speaker: or get someone to just do a contract basis editing for me once a week and just kind of get them good so that by the time, like as I get busier, they are on my path.
Speaker: That would have been, I know that's so easy to say in hindsight, but it's that, yeah, that would have changed the game for me early on.
Speaker: That's such great insight.
Speaker: Thank you for that.
Speaker: Cause I think there's probably a lot of people listening who are in that sort of
Speaker: third, maybe fourth year of their business who is really feeling that right now.
Speaker: I know myself, like I find it really hard to do more shoots or as many as what I know that I could book because of the video editing.
Speaker: Like it is a killer, but it is very hard to let that go.
Speaker: I think it's much harder to let that go than it is to let go of the photo editing.
Speaker: Just because so much of the video editing is like,
Speaker: your creative soul pouring into that film as well yeah totally and I think that it's you've got two choices when you're in that position it's like okay this is my creative soul what's that worth or um does understanding that other people have souls I love you
Speaker: you know?
Speaker: So people will say to me, but like the way I talk to my clients and I'm like, do you honestly think you're the best communicator?
Speaker: Because if you think you're the best at everything, then like, where did you come from?
Speaker: And I think learning that there are other people out there who are actually like, if they're really good at that, like I work for another photographer, I do all of the backend and whatnot.
Speaker: And I mean, we're totally different people, but I know when it comes to communicating with clients in an email way or whatever, like,
Speaker: I'm really good at doing that and doing that in a way that works with her.
Speaker: Yeah, totally.
Speaker: I mean, that's why I'm doing it for her.
Speaker: Because she's so much better at the other things.
Speaker: Why should she be spending her time?
Speaker: Because now she can spend more time shooting than trying to reply to a bunch of emails every day.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: And admin's a huge one for me because...
Speaker: The thing is when you're a buy appointment business as well, so you've got scheduling, you are going to have changes to the schedule, right?
Speaker: So you're going to have shuffling happening.
Speaker: Now, in my experience, things like that can show up in your shoot negatively.
Speaker: If you are dealing with someone who is constantly moving things or changing things or not communicating with you well, what I've found is
Speaker: it's been a huge thing in my business is that I just turn up now.
Speaker: I've got no idea what happened.
Speaker: I don't know how many times they've rescheduled, how many times they've asked questions, how many times I pushed Ash to like, or, you know, done something maybe a little inappropriate, like sent a text message at 10 o'clock at night or I don't know anything.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I just turn up every shoot's like clean slate.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And so I don't take any negative energy into my session.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And,
Speaker: Then I will do the shoot and then after she'll be like, how did it go?
Speaker: And I'm like, yeah, it was fine.
Speaker: Why?
Speaker: She's like, oh, and she'll tell me then maybe.
Speaker: But I go, oh, wow, because if I hadn't known that, I'd be like, oh, you're a bit annoying, you know.
Speaker: So I find it really hard to capture people from a real like blank slate openness if they have caused grief or difficulty prior.
Speaker: So having someone doing your admin and like that boundary gap
Speaker: trust that ash doesn't burden me with certain things because that's why like i she that's why i have her um is a really really really good relationship for us um and she understands that those sorts of things so i just see my schedule and i'm like i see sometimes i jump on and there might be things changing um or whatever but i don't know the reasons why and i don't ask why or sometimes i do i go oh i thought i had an actual shoot like next wednesday she's like yeah yeah it's moved
Speaker: You know, do you want me to fill it or do you want to like take the night off or whatever?
Speaker: But there's no details.
Speaker: There's no, oh, my God, well, she told me that blah, blah, blah.
Speaker: Like, so I feel like that's a really, for me and my personality, that's a really good segregation.
Speaker: So I think that might be something that people haven't considered.
Speaker: as well.
Speaker: So, but that definitely was something that I didn't expect, but I'm very grateful for.
Speaker: So there's, there's other people that are great, if not better at all the things that you do.
Speaker: It doesn't matter what it is.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: And I understand that there are some photographers that say, oh, I could never outsource my editing because I just love it so much.
Speaker: And I'm like, well, then don't.
Speaker: If that's part of your passion, like never do that.
Speaker: But there's always something else.
Speaker: There's always something else.
Speaker: And there's always a way.
Speaker: There's always a way.
Speaker: Even if, you know, obviously VA is a really popular now and much more accessible.
Speaker: But don't underestimate the ability to get someone to come physically to you and just pack your orders because, you know,
Speaker: gosh, that would have been like an amazing job for me as a teenager.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Just to come and like look at prints and pack them up and take them to the post office.
Speaker: Like just to be involved, I would have been like, that's great.
Speaker: Like hit up, you know, high schools and tapes and, you know, it's there.
Speaker: Like whatever task you want done, there's someone to do it.
Speaker: But I think really understanding and getting out of your own way and saying, okay, maybe I'm not the best person.
Speaker: And now I get people and no one ever meets us face to face unless we're doing like,
Speaker: you know, minis and stuff like that.
Speaker: She's there, but typically they don't meet her face to face.
Speaker: And now I like, well, not now, like from, from very early on, um, people like, Oh, you were so amazing.
Speaker: Oh, can you just tell Ash?
Speaker: Like, she's just, you know, and I was like, I never thought that she could become her own.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Like personality within the business.
Speaker: And now we get like, thank you, like gifts or letters from mentees that have come on retreats.
Speaker: And then she gets the fucking parcel too.
Speaker: And I'm like,
Speaker: who's that from?
Speaker: And she's like, Oh, it's just from the girl from the retreat.
Speaker: She's just, you know, I was like, Oh, like, you know what I mean?
Speaker: So you can just think that they fulfill a role, but if you allow it, you can't add the right person into your business and not them, not bring their own soul, their own heartbeat, their own like lifeblood into your business and have it like flourish more.
Speaker: It's kind of just, yeah, impossible thing.
Speaker: I think there is, had there have been multiple times over the last five years that we've been working together, Kylie, where I would have just completely fallen apart without having her there, without having her.
Speaker: I mean, there's been times where I feel like I've even just like completely bounced from the business entirely because I've been so burnt out, but it's continued going because of her.
Speaker: And it's given me that space and that time to like regather myself and come back feeling fresh and anew and being able to jump back into it without feeling like I'm, you know, feeling completely guilty or like I've wrecked everything or that it's all fallen apart while I've been away.
Speaker: So it has been the very best thing that I've ever done in terms of that growth.
Speaker: Yeah, 100%.
Speaker: And like, obviously I still have like a pretty thick schedule, but yeah,
Speaker: There are weeks where it's like I'm just doing my shoots.
Speaker: I'm going home.
Speaker: I'm shooting.
Speaker: I'm dropping my cards in.
Speaker: I'm going home.
Speaker: Like I just can't.
Speaker: There's nothing left for me.
Speaker: There's no strategizing.
Speaker: There's no like bouncing in, going, cool, let's like, yeah.
Speaker: And then there is that where I'm like so annoying.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: But it is a huge relief to know that everyone's going to get their emails returned.
Speaker: Everyone's going to get their messages returned.
Speaker: Everyone's going to be like still nurtured.
Speaker: but I don't have to yeah I don't have to kind of do that every day but yeah because it's a lot like you give a lot in a session there's a lot of energy that is and and not just on the moment you arrive but the pre like the lead up to a shoot preparation for a shoot the headspace you've got to get into for a shoot I spend a bit of time like managing where I'm at right before a shoot so
Speaker: It's really good to have the support.
Speaker: And, yes, like, you know, Ash does everything behind the scenes, but totally, like, she's also been my friend for over a decade.
Speaker: So I do come in and go and fall apart.
Speaker: You know, we cry, we all of the things.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: She's a huge, huge support.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Really, really good advice for everyone.
Speaker: And I hope that if you are here listening to this talk, you have been able to take away a lot from this conversation.
Speaker: I know that I have.
Speaker: So thank you, Sophie.
Speaker: Like this just means so much to have you on here.
Speaker: And it makes me even more excited for you to teach at Unfiltered coming up in August next, this year.
Speaker: Oh my God.
Speaker: It's going to be here before we know it.
Speaker: So Sophie's going to be there.
Speaker: We can't wait to hear more from you.
Speaker: I know that you just are a wealth of knowledge and experience.
Speaker: So thank you for being here.
Speaker: It's an absolute pleasure.
Speaker: I'm very honoured to be invited to speak and also to be on the podcast today.
Speaker: You girls are amazing.
Speaker: Huge respect back to you girls as leaders in this industry.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: And I'm grateful to be working with you this year.
Speaker: Yeah, awesome.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: We really hope you enjoyed that episode of Unfiltered Podcast.
Speaker: If you want to learn more about Sophie and follow her, look her up on social media, just head to the website.
Speaker: It's unfiltered.au slash podcast and you'll find the show notes there with all the links to the things and you'll also...
Speaker: find information for the Unfiltered Retreat.
Speaker: We would love it if you joined us.
Speaker: It's going to be an incredible three days of education with just so many amazing inspirational speakers.
Speaker: So unfiltered.au for all of the details about everything retreat podcast, specifically for the podcast, unfiltered.au slash podcast.
Speaker: And if you enjoyed this episode, make sure you subscribe and jump over to our Instagram account, unfiltered.au and let us know what you thought of the episode.
