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C2 Ep 41 Eberron Reviewed 8
254 Plays4 years ago
Come hang out as we take a look at the last arc and answer your questions!
This episode is brought to you by the generous donations of our amazing Show Sponsors: Laura Pickrahn, Darrin Katzska, Irene Viorritto, Ryan Royce, Darrell DeLaney, Jessica Smith, Charles Compton, Danielle Bramhall-Smith, Nastasia Raulerson, The Kamm Family, David Scrams, Elizabeth Clark, Andy Dossett, Rebekah Gowman, deviouspoptart, Eðvarð Arnór Sigurðsson, Michael Clark, Eric Witman, and Shelby Johnson.
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Transcript
Introduction and Patron Acknowledgement
00:00:00
Speaker
The following episode is brought to you by the generous donations of Laura Pickron, Darryl Delaney, Darren Katska, Devious Poptart, Irene Villarito, Ryan Royce, Andy Dossett, Danielle Bramhall-Smith, Elizabeth Clark, Eric Whitman, Jessica Smith, Charles Compton, Natasha Rallerson, Richard Cree, The Cam Family,
00:00:20
Speaker
David Scrams, Dustin Troop, Edvard Arnoff, Michael Clark, Rebecca Gowman, and Shelby Johnson, as well as all of our generous patrons.
Host Introduction and Eberron Review
00:01:17
Speaker
to Eberron renewed an actual play tabletop RPG podcast where we use the Genesis rule set in the Eberron campaign setting. My name is Jeff. I'm Philip. I'm Trevor.
00:01:30
Speaker
And I'm Eric. And unfortunately, Randy will not be with us today as we do another Eberron Review.
Review Process Changes
00:01:38
Speaker
This is the middle of an arc, which is different than the way we did it last campaign. But frankly, we got tired of doing nine episode look backs. So we decided we're going to stick with every third episode. The arc is not over.
00:01:51
Speaker
It will continue. Rayard will continue to shirk his obligation for several more episodes. But we wanted to take some questions. I will say there aren't as many questions as we typically have, and I think that is a result of not really having a resolution that tends to engender discussion. So this might be a shorter episode than normal, but also, I think we have a lot to talk about. Okay, do you guys want to help me recap just a little bit?
Reynard's Family Dynamics and Privilege
00:02:21
Speaker
This was a Reynard obligation arc, if in name only. We discovered that A-hole runs in the family. Ain't that just the way with the privilege though?
Shifter Disappearances Investigation
00:02:40
Speaker
So yeah, we were sent by Satan himself. I really like saying that.
00:02:48
Speaker
Every time Eric tells us these orders come from Satan himself. We were sent by Satan himself into the cogs to do some digging around on some, well, originally it was war force, not war force, pardon me, shifter disappearances, but then there was finally a murder. And so we went down to kind of see what's going on. We were told to talk with Detective Spade, who turned out to be Trevor.
00:03:18
Speaker
Basil. Who you may recall is Raynard's cousin and one of the many people in his life he was trying to run away from and managed to do it again. I mean he did he did get away.
00:03:41
Speaker
Long story short, we delivered some mail. We found some evidence, ultimately, that led us to a mill hatch industries. That's not right. Mill hatch labs. Industries. It is interesting. Mill hatch industries, which, of course, took us to Olive. And the button at the end of these three episodes was old Posey shows up.
00:04:04
Speaker
because it turns out she is the one person that might be able to connect the dots for us on some of this stuff to get us moving in the right direction. Will she? It's an Eric character, so not likely, but maybe he does want the show to continue, so I think she's going to give us
Group's Critique of Eric's Characters
00:04:19
Speaker
just enough. He looks mad. Maybe we'll learn her name. But in a pedantic and condescending manner.
00:04:29
Speaker
By the way, I just want to get out there. We're the only ones allowed to talk about Eric's characters that way. Everybody else can keep it to themselves. Don't worry. Nobody else. Nobody else gets condescended to by them, so everybody else can just shut up. And I promise, Philip and I at least will continue to do it enough for everyone to enjoy. That's very true.
Group Tensions and Dynamics
00:04:50
Speaker
Also, Eris punched Reynard. I feel like we left that out. Yeah, that was deeply satisfying. Eris punched Reynard. Hob lifted Reynard off the floor by his collar. Didn't change things. Reynard's still Reynard at all over the place. But he is going to contact HR. Yeah. Where is HR department? The same HR that has sent us on now to suicide.
00:05:18
Speaker
But no, I mean, go
Character and Family Dynamics
00:05:20
Speaker
ahead. I was just gonna say you all also had a companion traveling with you on this little quest. We did, and I really, not Flula, that's the German guy on the Pittsburgh movie. I really want Flula Borg along on the next mission. Eric, that's your job. Can we get him? Can we book him?
00:05:43
Speaker
Seems it a lot. He he does a lot for room. Thank you for rude luck who it did turn out I guess it didn't turn out it always been that way is cats half-brother Mm-hmm some shades of adventures past with half-brother brooding half-brothers returning after a long time separated I don't know if Peru was brooding. He seemed very
00:06:05
Speaker
Very like fine with the situation He did not he did not seem fine. He kept going. I don't understand why anybody would ever live here. I don't understand Okay Before we jump into questions
00:06:27
Speaker
Do any of the four of us have anything we want to talk about or ask each other? I want to share an experience that I hope is relatable and it's not just me. You know that thing where somebody says something and you're really frustrated by what they said and then in the car ride home you think of what you ought to have said? That was me with the confrontation with Raynard.
00:06:53
Speaker
is after we recorded. I came up with 18 better lines. And I really desperately wish this was the kind of show where we could take it again.
00:07:03
Speaker
Just all of us. Get back in Riverside and do it again. There's a term for that. I know you like it. Yeah, there's a German word, but I don't remember what it is. It's a French phrase. It's l'esprit de scallier, which is staircase wit. You think of it as you're walking down the staircase when you leave. Yeah, I definitely had that experience with the confrontation outside with Reynard in this episode.
Character Obligations and Stakes
00:07:30
Speaker
OK, I have a question.
00:07:32
Speaker
And it is for Trevor. And I do want to, again, get out of the way. None of us have been or maybe will be actually upset with Trevor for the way that he's playing. Maybe will be.
00:07:42
Speaker
our characters are obviously angry with him and right and my well i mean just not at trevor no whatever entity is controlling you behind the scenes i am very frustrated with that and as you may you may have have noticed my love language with my friends is giving them no end of bad bad times so hey you don't have to keep coming back fellas they all gave me a look
00:08:08
Speaker
You called me. But like Trevor, is Raynard going to grow up one day? Probably not. Oh, okay. Well, I mean, literally, no, none of us are going to get better because we're going to hit 100 off the game. Yeah, for those of you that didn't catch that, good. In my mind,
00:08:34
Speaker
He's already made a major life change, and it wasn't that long ago. So, at least for a while, he's probably gonna stay pretty set the way he is. Just lonelier, it would appear. A little bit how he wants it. I mean, he just was disassociated with family, and now he's not really wanting that connection to be disassociated again, so he's not trying to get too super close to anybody.
00:09:03
Speaker
Okay. Man, we really need someone who's more emotionally mature in this group so they can deal with this. Because I'm just ticking through the other characters. Eric, can we get a therapist? What's the shard version of therapist? To guest for a while.
00:09:22
Speaker
Hobb only comes halfway. Hobb can only change so much from the way I originally envisioned him. Sure. No, no. I wasn't suggesting that he is a different person. Aris cuts and runs. And I just feel like it's wrong to put this on Milo. Milo has so much. It's just wrong for this to be on Milo.
00:09:48
Speaker
And I don't trust Eric to do it through an NPC. Not when he knows everything else that's happening. No, not because of Eric, but because he knows everything that's going might and will happen. And for those of you who did not pick up on it in the latest episode,
00:10:04
Speaker
We are currently at obligation, are we at 80? Did we double check that? Yes, you are at 80. We are at 80, which means that we have a 20% chance, an 80% chance of it getting worse in the next arc. When we hit 100, if we don't resolve things,
00:10:25
Speaker
We will not be, what's up? Go ahead, finish, finish. I have a statement, finish. Okay, when we hit 100, we will not be able to use our experience points until we have started resolving things, which means we cannot advance our characters. No new skills, no new talents, no cool new gadgets from Eris. It's all- Oh, I can build things. That doesn't cost experience. That's a different- I guess I'd say no new
00:10:56
Speaker
You're right, I have used a lot of talents and things like that to represent gadgets. Yes, thank you. What is the one where you get to drastically change the look of the ship, of the boat? Oh, fancy paint job. Yeah, we'll never get to fancy paint job at this rate. And frankly, that's devastating. I would say 80% chance of having to deal with it. It doesn't have to get worse.
00:11:24
Speaker
No, because he'll roll and we have everything from 20 to 100 now will be another obligation. Right, but that just means we have to deal with it. It doesn't necessarily mean the problem, the situation gets worse. Yeah. To at least a certain degree that's on us. I just meant that the number gets worse. And also apologies because Eris is at 10, Milo is at 20, and Hob and Raynard are both at 30, so it's actually 90 right now.
00:11:53
Speaker
Okay, we are might be nice to somebody at some point. Only one of you. Well it's not that, you have to deal with your family. Call your mother. Defend the fact that I'm also at 30 by saying that one, I've been rolled three times.
00:12:10
Speaker
and two of those three times. Now one time I genuinely, I know things I could have done to have made it better and didn't do them for various reasons. But two of them, I did not know until the very end of the arc who I was dealing with and what I needed to do about it. So like, what could I have done? Yeah.
00:12:28
Speaker
I'm working on it now, me and, oh geez, now I just want to call him Calvin. I hate this place. I wrote it all down. Yeah, but it's like K-A-L apostrophe V-Y-N. Absolutely. It's Calvin. But it needs to be Calvin's. It's Calvin's and Hobb. Yeah, that's right.
00:12:51
Speaker
Uh, but yeah, I mean, like, like Philip saying, it's, it's an opportunity to, to deal with it because that's the other thing is your obligation can't get lower unless it's rolled. Like, and unless you go on, you obviously could go out of your way and Philip could say, I would like Eris to go talk to, uh, talk to Olive
Shifters vs. Lycanthropes Discussion
00:13:11
Speaker
about potentially doing something to lower obligation. Like I would be open to that as well.
00:13:16
Speaker
I mean, that's how I feel about my obligation to Boom Rush. The clock is now ticking. I've had the first meeting. I've got 10 days. So it's going to have to happen. Frankly, Eris would like to go have a conversation about increasing her obligation to Olive and lowering it to everyone else at this point, whose transfer obligation.
00:13:38
Speaker
So yeah, and every time I roll obligation while I'm planning out those sessions, and I've kind of talked about this before, there are multiple states that I basically plot out of like, if this happens, they will lose X amount of obligation. If this happens, they'll lose Y amount. If this happens, they'll increase it by this much, and so on and so forth. So they're built into my plans. It's just how things play out is
00:14:07
Speaker
what ends up happening. Sure. Yeah. Having said that, hopefully somebody will do something. I'll do my best to make old Boomerush happy with me. Yes. So that's what happens with the obligation thing. And it's going to boy, what a wrinkle. I have I have also just for for people out there listening who are familiar with Edge of the Empire.
00:14:36
Speaker
I have also removed some of the rules with obligation. Like there's also a rule where you all are like negatively impacted mechanically. If your obligation is rolled, like your strain threshold is lowered and I think there's setback dice involved and I removed that stuff just because I didn't want it to be.
00:14:54
Speaker
The way I was wanting to play it was going to be less, I didn't want it to be that punitive towards you all. I want it to be narratively punitive, not mechanically. That feels unnecessarily difficult. Yeah, I mean, it's supposed to represent the stress of it. I guess. Kind of thing. Yeah. So anyway. Which clearly we don't let our obligations stress us out much at all, so. Oh, I do want to add the dragon above dragon below, the street game.
00:15:24
Speaker
Yeah. Is this, is this a canon thing? Is this something you? I made it up. With banged up out of your dome? I came up with the name and then built the game around the name essentially. The assumption being it's just a sleight of hand or a magnet or a press to digitization that they just make it where you say it is. Make it not where you say it is. The hole in the middle is just small enough to the where the ball always catches and so when they open it they
00:15:48
Speaker
look at one way or the other and their turn of phrase internally is because we all come from Eberron which is in between the dragon above and the dragon below so that's that's how that works so those of you wondering Eric comes up with secret catchphrases for his games that
00:16:05
Speaker
may not have even like in case it comes up like that's true now I bet you knew as soon as I said Hobbs gonna go talk to them he was like I didn't have to write that okay well let's go ahead and get to the questions some of them are pretty
00:16:23
Speaker
multiple questions so it's been taking a little while. So if you have or have a question you'd like to ask it, you can get into our Discord. Everyone who listens can join the Discord and is free to ask a question in one of the general channels. However,
00:16:38
Speaker
We do tier priority. If you are a patron, there's a channel called Eberron Reviewed Questions that you can ask in. If you are in the $5 a month tier or higher, there is the QA channel where you have take top priority. As it stands, we have yet to have to tell someone we didn't have time for their questions. And I hope to never have to, like obviously, logistically, eventually we will. But that's a lot of adverbs. But right now,
00:17:07
Speaker
We can get them all. So come and ask. So first question is from Richard. I'm going to summarize a bit of it, but not the ones that are actually interrogative. He's talking about the first meeting that we had with Detective Spade. Basil thought he had all the cards just by now knowing where Raynard was. But other than that, there wasn't a lot. Raynard didn't seem concerned by it. So Raynard didn't engage.
00:17:37
Speaker
And then he says, the way that Hobb came in, it was like, look, you told our boss you'd help us. And we don't have a problem telling him you didn't. And given Hobb's abilities with the role, that worked. But did you anticipate that Raynard would acquiesce to Basil? Did you anticipate that if he didn't, one of us would still try to make something happen? How did you game out how those things might have played?
00:18:07
Speaker
Yeah. Well, and one thing Richard mentioned was equating it to the cold or situation where Eris just went to them and said, hey, he's a spy. Yes. And I glossed over that. I apologize. No, you're fine. The possibility that that happens again. And I mean, for one, those two situations are just I mean, Basil has paperwork proving that he is a
00:18:31
Speaker
a well-known detective from Fairhaven, Detective Spade, who, I mean, random people off the street come in and go, hey, he's actually a member of House Fearland. They're going to be like, no, he's not. So it's a very different situation. So that possibility was there in my head because Eris had done it before, but that's, yeah.
00:18:58
Speaker
I don't know, I played it out a bunch of different ways and Raynard's outright passivity in the scene was something that did catch me for a bit of a loop. I wasn't expecting it to be that drastic. I was fully anticipating you all not going along with Basil's request, but Raynard
00:19:24
Speaker
I mean, and Trevor can speak to this on his side, but for my side of things, as Basil, it seemed like Reynard just disengaged from the conversation and was not interested in even talking to Basil or engaging with the request, which was something that I wasn't fully anticipating.
00:19:47
Speaker
I fully anticipated you not going along with it because I've met you all and I've met your characters.
00:19:57
Speaker
Yeah, I do play these scenes out multiple ways in my head when I'm playing them. And that was one that I hadn't really accounted for. Sure. I do want to say, I don't think any of us went the we'll rat you out route. No. Because I think we all knew, you'd made it pretty clear, everybody thinks he's Sam Spain, or Texas Spain. He's Texas Spain. In my notes, his first name is also Sam. Yeah, I assume he was.
00:20:28
Speaker
And then Richard goes on to ask if the plus 20 obligation was a little bit GM frustration or punishment. And then says, I can't, I can't, I do understand if you can't elaborate too much, given there's still plot threads dangling, but it felt off in a little railroading. I'll just say it. I personally disagree with Richard. I don't have to grudge him that feeling, but I didn't feel railroaded. I mean, the obligation system in and of itself is
00:20:58
Speaker
to a certain extent punitive. I mean, you all like, you have people that expect things of you and if you don't do that, then the score goes up. And I think, like I said, the absolute passivity of Rainard in that scene is what would have raised Basil's ire that much to be representative of a 20.
00:21:23
Speaker
and seeing Raynard in this state and then Raynard's
Basil's Expectations and Family Views
00:21:27
Speaker
unwillingness to engage with him. And I mean, in Basil's mind, we didn't get too deep into this, so I'm not going to get too deep into it from behind the curtain. But there are people within the House that still thinks Raynard can make good, I guess, for lack of a better way to put it. And Raynard, like,
00:21:54
Speaker
didn't do himself any favors in regards to Basil in that scene. And so the plus 20 obligation wasn't me being frustrated. It was me acknowledging basically trying to communicate, you have to deal with this. Just ignoring these problems aren't going to make them go away at any point. And people are just going to continue to get mad and want to harangue you further.
00:22:22
Speaker
So yeah, I was not frustrated. I don't get frustrated by your all's choices in the game because it's your all's game. I have fun with it too, but your choices are always valid to me and so I'm not going to
00:22:39
Speaker
punish you for playing your characters the way you think you should play them. So, yeah. You said I'm having fun, too, as though you're under the impression that we're enjoying ourselves. Is that what you think? Fair enough. That is a bold assumption on my part. So, Trevor, did I cut you off? You keep coming back, fellas, like I did. I keep thinking if we ever get to meet in person again, I'll get free dinner out of the deal, so I'm willing to ride the wave until that again.
00:23:08
Speaker
Richard asks a later question, no longer related to that stuff. Can you further elaborate on the differences between shifters and lycanthropes? Is it just that one is a curse and the other is something you are born with? Or could you be born with lycanthropy? And what keeps the Church of the Silver Flame from hunting shifters? Can I take a stab at it? Because I think I actually know this one. And then you can tell me how wrong I am.
00:23:28
Speaker
Yes with the exception of the original people that came from another plane lycanthropy must be
00:23:41
Speaker
given to somebody by a lycanthrope. Whereas the shifters are a genetically passed down set of traits that was born from interspecies, or I don't know if it was the original lycanthropes with humans, or later they're not lycanthropes with humans, but they are a race that is from that line.
00:24:04
Speaker
So maybe the yeah might be from that's a theory it's a chicken or the egg situation of which one came first the shifters are the lycanthropes but The the lycanthropes like the original lycanthropes coming from another plane. That's that's Eric's ever on that's not
00:24:21
Speaker
cannon with a C or a K. Okay. Well, you got to stop messing with me then because I'm talking not that I ever would go to like a discord or Facebook group of people who take this very seriously because I know, because honestly, they can be mean. I'm just going to say it. But nerds can be mean. That's true, man. I'd feel dumber than I typically do. So yeah, shifters are a race of people with like, like Jeff said, genetic traits that are passed down.
00:24:51
Speaker
They also have full control. I think that's probably a big difference. Even a very well behaved lycanthrope like we met in the first campaign
00:25:06
Speaker
Um, they sometimes turn, just turn, right? It's not, yeah, that's not within entirely the control. That's the whole idea. That's the thing that makes it occurs. He, he would go out into the forest when he knew he was going to turn. So he would just be a bear in the forest instead of in the city. Um, so yeah, that, that is a big thing. Um, as to the final question, I mean, an alternate theory on shifters, lycanthropes is, um,
00:25:36
Speaker
that lycanthropy is a horrifying curse unleashed on the world by one of the overlords. Yeah. Or one of the Delkir. Or one of the Delkir, yeah. The one question, can you be born with lycanthropy? That's a hard note, right? No, yeah. Correct. At least in... It rules as written. It's a canonical eberron.
00:25:57
Speaker
Here in this where we be at yes, that's um now to Richard's final question of what keeps the church of the silver frame for hunting shifters a desire like I There's no yeah, there's no reason to hunt the shifters Do they I mean they don't even still hunt lycanthropes right like there's not like squads. I mean no No, no problem to what if they see
00:26:20
Speaker
But yeah, I mean if a werewolf is loose like you know, aren't it right? But there's not like like it was like there's not a there's not a crusade Yeah, there's not a concerted crusade out hunting lycanthropes and and the them killing shifters towards the end of the silver purge Was
00:26:43
Speaker
zealotry or misunderstanding or yeah Salem it was any number of things so because because it's it's entirely possible that somebody thought that a shifter was a lycanthrope and that's why they were killed
00:27:00
Speaker
Um, so, so yeah. Um, so yeah, they just, they wouldn't do that. The church of the silver phone is not an evil organization that would hunt people for just being people, I guess. So, uh, at least intentionally. Right. At least, at least publicly.
00:27:18
Speaker
I mean, let's shoot straight. There's a very good chance that we could find that out. That would not be out. If you created a campaign where you found that out, Noah would be like, oh, they would never. I mean, right.
Trust and Character Growth
00:27:31
Speaker
Moving on, Darren wants to know, what would it take for each member of the crew to trust Raynard and then parenthetically again? Mind control. I think insinuating that maybe some of us never did in the first place.
00:27:44
Speaker
Do you want to start this one, Iris, or do you want me to? Mind control. All right. Brainwashing a wish spell would probably do it. Maybe groveling. I mean, the thing about Hob is without getting too much into it, Hob is not the man he once was.
00:28:11
Speaker
And so he knows that there is capacity for change. I think what Hobb would have to see is the work to change. If Raynard came up to Hobb after this, like, let's say we all go home and get a night's rest, and the next day, Raynard comes up to Hobb and he's like, well, I just want to let you know that I'm a different person. Now I've turned over New Leaf, and everything is going to be fine from now on, and I'm going to be good, and I'd be like, no, you're not.
00:28:40
Speaker
but a consistent record of doing things, even small things that aren't self-serving or petty. I mean, Hobb has no problem trusting her. Hobb would turn around on Viggo, Viggo turned around. That's who Hobb is. But it's going to have to be proven and not spoken. I think might be the best way to say it.
00:29:09
Speaker
to answer less glibly. I mean, I don't know how to quantify it. An absurd amount of work on Reynard's part because Eris' tendency, as I said, Eris' tendency is cut and run. That's defense, that's safety is this person burned me so now I will wall myself off from them.
00:29:39
Speaker
And so, yeah, a whole lot. But I don't know how exactly to quantify, I don't know what it would look like. I'll say this, there's a big difference with Hob between what it would take for him to trust Raynard again and what it would take for him to count on Raynard again. Or, yeah, no, he could count on Raynard. That might be the best way to say it. Because Hob's world was not shaken
00:30:02
Speaker
deeply by finding out that Raynard was secretly a member of a dragon marked house. It made him less trustful, but it didn't rock his whole world. What Hob is more concerned about is I can't rely on him to be there, to do, especially, what Hob knows for sure, and I think, I mean, and Trevor's doing this on purpose. This is not an indictment of Trevor. Again, I want to keep saying this.
00:30:29
Speaker
Hobb knows that Raynard will not take one for the team. Or at least certainly feels like he can trust that Raynard would not take one for the team. And until he believes that he can, he's not gonna count on Raynard again. Yeah, I think that's exactly, that's exactly Eris's issue. Like Eris's whole idea of team is deep. Like it's a deep idea with her and the fact that Raynard
00:30:57
Speaker
Reynard would would bail on the team to save his own skin is Huge but she already knew that I think what's really ticked her off here is that Reynard Reynard did not own that anything that anything about this situation was off Like it was oh, well, we've all got our own sorted past that comment has put Reynard on the list
00:31:27
Speaker
The rest of the list isn't good. It's not good company. No, it's not. Eris has sorted past. It's Vigo and whoever did terrible things to Eris before we met her. Yeah, that's Eris' sorted past. Yeah. Raynard has joined the list that is made up of people who are responsible for Eris' sorted past. In her mind, I should say, because probably there are a lot of people on Eris' list who are not actually that responsible.
00:31:54
Speaker
And if I could remember any of the names from that dumb book series, I'd say one right now. So one of them was like Liam Payne or something. Well, I mean, uh, okay. Just because this is not, this is not, there's never, this is never going to be a payoff. So example, uh,
00:32:11
Speaker
Orgev is on Eris's list. It's entirely irrational, but Prince Orgev is on Eris's list. And absolutely why wouldn't he be? He was the number one person in charge of the initial thing that led to Eris's life falling apart.
00:32:26
Speaker
Right, I think based on what I know of that is the reason yes in the goblin lanes or whatever I don't know it well. Yeah, I'm gonna trivialize something you got it. I Really should read a book you landed it. Okay continue and unfortunately Randy's not here to answer that but I think
00:32:44
Speaker
If I were to take a stab at it, it would take less for Milo than for Hob or Eris, just by the way that Randy plays Milo. I think that's true. I think it has to do with Milo's age. I think he's just like, Milo is just, he's older, he's just more, he's just more steady. I don't know. It just seems like he rolls with the punches a lot better.
00:33:01
Speaker
In the hierarchy of surprising secrets, he's learned a bigger one lately. Yeah, I think they all said that I think Milo less because he's just learned that, yeah, maybe a lot of people do have secrets and you can still love those people. Yeah, okay. Irene's got a couple. They're both for Trevor. Irene wants to know, and remember, we like Irene, so we give real answers.
00:33:31
Speaker
Is Reynard actively avoiding his obligation, or just hoping it will all go away on its own? I think both is a perfectly acceptable answer too if you're waffling a little.
00:33:45
Speaker
I want to say actively avoiding, but that does kind of sound correct. He certainly actively extricated himself from something. Exactly. I mean, the whole thing about Raynard's background is that he has created a new person to avoid
00:34:04
Speaker
his past life. So in a way, yes, he is 100% trying to avoid the obligation of somehow making amends with family or even seeing family again. But
00:34:22
Speaker
I don't think it's just as, you know, as petty as like, oh, I just don't want to do that. You know what I mean? Do you think that he believes there's a chance it could all blow over either meaning he could return to his family on good terms without working towards it or they'll just give up and stop looking for him? Do you think like this rain or really think deep down either one of those is possible.
00:34:43
Speaker
I don't think he is, I think he's too shallow of a person currently to think that far ahead, if that makes sense. No, he's just not processing it. So he's kind of like, you know, my life's really good right now. I got what I need, got what I want. He thinks so, huh? He thinks his life's really good right now. Let's go look at how much gold Raynar has. That's what's really interesting to me.
00:35:12
Speaker
in these very, very broken characters that we have created is that it feels like Randy's not here to disagree with me.
Reynard's Avoidance of Obligations
00:35:21
Speaker
So I, uh, but I, my, my read on agreement, so obviously I'm right. My read on Milo is that he also is dealing with all of these cascading revelations with a sort of
00:35:39
Speaker
Um, you know, this is, this is all all right in comparison to the thing with, to the thing with Kaylee in the book or with Kylie and Kylie in the book, this is all fine. Uh, and, and Raynard seems to be doing the same thing of, Oh no, this is still fine. It's still fine. It's still fun. And just like why he was so quiet and, uh,
00:36:03
Speaker
You know, just almost disregarding Basil. As you know, he was confronted with a situation he definitely didn't expect to be confronted with. Sure. It was just almost hoping, this will go away if I don't acknowledge it. So...
00:36:19
Speaker
The problem is, on the empathy scale, all of your party is negative. I can assure you from my interactions with Sally Mae that that's not how that works. That's very good. Unfortunately, none of our characters have empathy and thought, this must be difficult for Raynard, too.
00:36:41
Speaker
like as a player as Trevor I was like jeez Louise guys you're not even gonna ask me what's up it's obvious what's up and and and in her own way Erez asked you what was up and he was like I don't want to talk about it you've got secrets too
00:37:02
Speaker
None of us are particularly open or good friends. And then the next question from Irene also is directed at Trevor, but I think in a way I could say it's for Eric as a present to Eric to hear this answer. Raynard, what will it take to get Raynard in the mindset that it's time to deal with some of this?
00:37:26
Speaker
Trevor has, eric has uncapped his pen. Oh man. And sitting at his desk we get to write on his hand. I guarantee you there are no books there but. Or you know, word document. Sorry, go ahead Trevor. Oh. You know. I guess probably the promise of like the slate being wiped clean.
00:37:50
Speaker
Like because, yes, Renard definitely messed up and definitely deserved to be kind of excommunicated. But at the same time, you know, when family hurts you, it cuts deep. So.
00:38:10
Speaker
I think in Raynard's mind, the slate would, to even the playing field, it would just be like a clean slate of like, we're going back to before anything ever happened. Like, so. So you're talking about a complete reconciliation, not we'll leave you alone now. Like not your ledger is clean, you can walk away, but like an actual going back to the way things used to be. A prodigal situation.
00:38:38
Speaker
I mean, I think in the back of Raynard's mind, that would be ideal. Yeah. He likes where he is. He's content. He's like happy with the way he's making money, living his life on his own. But, you know, he left all that glory or was kind of pushed out of all that glitz and glamour and
00:39:04
Speaker
Who wouldn't want to go back to that? I'll tell you one thing, it's not going to be nice to Basil ever. Which is funny because, and this might come up in the game, but after that interaction, absolutely not. Basil, like I had written Basil to be the most sympathetic towards like the way you were treated. Like, like he was the one that was like, man, we did Raynard really dirty.
00:39:29
Speaker
And so, but as Phillip said, A-hole runs in the fan, like, being legit is their love language, so. You guys heard it here first. Eric thought that was the way to portray the most sympathetic person to a character. Yeah, I don't think Raynard picked up on that. To Raynard specifically. I know, I know. Like, even Alistair in the little cold open, like, was every, all of them were ribbing each other. And so, yeah. Sure.
00:39:55
Speaker
That didn't feel like ribbing. That was, I know where you live now. That's not ribbing. That was at the end. That was after Hobb had intimidated Basil into giving up the notes. So that's once the 20 obligation had turned and happened.
Obligation System Explained
00:40:11
Speaker
Hey tell me when when hob when hob was successful on intimidation Basil Basil Pete a little right he'd be just a little sure Okay, you know what I mean he does that pretty often, but that's just a condition Okay Richard circles back to his questions about obligation mentioned some edge of Empire rules About I mean it says it says
00:40:38
Speaker
Edge of Empire Rules is written states that obligation penalties are generally not assessed until the obligation is avoided multiple times. I think it, I mean obviously we can we can fudge the rules that we want to fudge and uh but it is a fair question since it's in there that way um um obligation was avoided three times and they finally took a five point increase as a result is what happened in the book
00:41:06
Speaker
Here's the question. What was your thought process in making it an immediate 20-point penalty as opposed to a warning and a gradual increase over the course of multiple obligation? Avoidances. He is currently GMing an Edge of the Empire game, so he's asking both as a listener and for some, I don't know, other options of ways to run his game, I guess.
00:41:27
Speaker
So the reason is because, unlike the rules that's written, I also build into every arc where obligation is ruled a way to decrease the obligation, which is not the way that it's written in Edge of the Empire, that there are consistent and actionable ways to drive it down, especially in 10 or 20 point increments. And I wanted
00:41:54
Speaker
I don't know, I wanted the obligations to feel like they had a good amount of teeth to them, for lack of a better way to put it. Especially one like, obviously the obligations that you all took are varying degrees of, I don't wanna say severity, but just the nature of them. Eris' obligation is to her mentor.
00:42:24
Speaker
And so that is inherently less antagonistic than Hob and Reynard's being a bounty and a family that you have burned bridges with. And then Milo's is paranoia. It's this obsession over the death of Kylie, which also is treated very differently because that you're getting into Milo's mental well-being, which he has done a great job since that increase of talking about
00:42:52
Speaker
as opposed to being at the bar, now he's in his booth reading the journal and becoming more obsessive about that situation. So, you know, I think that, I don't know, having that scene in the office play out with Basil where Raynard does not engage at all and allows
00:43:17
Speaker
From Basil's perspective, this is not Eric speaking just from Basil's point of view, Raynard has his goon step up and threatened to physically harm him if he doesn't hand over these notes. I don't think Basil would give Raynard a warning like he's going to have a visceral emotional response to that that is manifested through the increase of obligation.
00:43:44
Speaker
Um, and like I said, if that scene plays out differently, uh, Raynard's obligation goes down. Um, and I mean, so that's honestly, Raynard's obligate, Raynard and Hobbes obligations are the two easiest to plot out of a path to zero, I guess, for, for like a very, would have put it heiresses. Wouldn't be too difficult. And Milo's is the hardest to think, how do you, how do you get rid of this obligation altogether? Um, but you know,
00:44:13
Speaker
The other flip side of obligation is a lot of times it involves capitulation. It involves not making a check to try and quote unquote win the scene, but rather as a character.
00:44:31
Speaker
humbling yourself and saying, OK, yes, I will I will do this thing for you because I know that that is what you're asking of me. And that's the only way that we're going to be able to make right. That's why Hobb is deeply in over his head right now. And so and obviously I'm speaking primarily towards Reynard and Hobbs because that's the nature of their obligations. Eris does not need to capitulate to Olive and be like, we will do things your way. But also Eris has the lowest obligation of the party. Olive.
00:44:58
Speaker
All of his speaking sense. He's the only person in Erez's life who makes sense right now. So so yeah, that's why I have been. I guess the intensity has been turned up in the way that I'm playing obligation is a I want obligation to feel meaningful and impactful in the characters lives because of the way that I'm structuring the campaign, which is actually
Narrative Focus and Character Development
00:45:22
Speaker
leopards question. So I'll get that more when we get there. But
00:45:28
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to play these characters and their expectations of the player, the player characters, realistic. And there's, there's a version of that scene where it's a five point jump. There's a version of that scene where it's a five point decrease and potentially next session, Raynard has zero obligation, um, to his family and he's made right. But that's not, that's not these characters, obviously. There's, it's going to be a path for them.
00:45:57
Speaker
I was actually I was actually really worried that Reynard was going to go with it. Yeah, because. Eris is actually deeply hurt that Hobb keeps saying it's him and not us on Hobbs thing, but that is exactly Eris's opinion of Reynard's problem. That is Reynard's problem. It is not Eris's problem.
00:46:27
Speaker
Yeah, and I mean, I think obviously the scene after that scene of Raynard explaining the situation and all that, like getting everybody on board would obviously play out very differently. Did he explain the situation? No, I'm saying in the room where Raynard goes along with Basil. In the what-if world. Yeah, in the multiverse. So yeah, I mean, that's...
00:46:51
Speaker
That's why I ramp up the difficulty for lack of a better way to put it on the obligation. And also because I don't, like I mentioned earlier, do the mechanical deficiency of obligation. Like the players aren't being constantly mechanically put at a deficit because they're rolling obligation. It's a narrative thing because for me obligation is a narrative tool and I don't really want to have the mechanics get in the way of that. So anyway, that was a very long answer but
00:47:18
Speaker
I hope you now have a better insight into why I did it.
00:47:24
Speaker
I'm sorry, I zoned out. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine. I zoned out when I talked to you, it's fine.
00:47:50
Speaker
Whereas this one has been a slower, I love this, slower but more savory burn into the main plot. So speak on that, Eric. Yeah, I mean, I just wanted to tell a different kind of story. Obviously campaign one was very much an external force is threatening at least initially somebody that you care about and then further expanding that into threatening the world.
00:48:18
Speaker
which is great for like a high fantasy let's let's go be big dang darn heroes and for this one obviously when i made the pitch to the cast of doing an urban setting campaign in the city of sharn and having it be a lot more intimate and personal by its very nature you if you're trying to tell a personal story for characters you can't have a big epic story out of the gate because
00:48:47
Speaker
at least in my opinion, it's much more difficult to have a personal story. And so having a slow buildup to where the characters, the player characters can develop relationships and the players can develop genuine feelings towards the NPCs in play makes a big difference in terms of telling that more intimate personal story. And so that's why it's been much more of a slow burn. And honestly,
00:49:17
Speaker
this campaign doesn't really have a plot yet in terms of the main plot. Or rather, it hasn't been revealed. I'm just making it up as I go, guys. I don't know about you. I mean, yes, that's the nature of the game. I know. We're making it up as we go. We really need you to have some place. But you know, like,
Campaign Story Unfolding
00:49:44
Speaker
Salmond Calloway, and Norsen Millhatch, and Olive, and Saden, and Viggo, and Ulfin. All of these characters are being set up to be figures in the characters' lives that are either allies
00:50:03
Speaker
neutral parties or rivals slash villains and so I want to get all the all the chess pieces on the board because that's how chess works right before before things pop up so so yeah that's that's I I don't think
00:50:20
Speaker
I don't know. My storytelling has just innately improved because I've done it more since starting Campaign 1. I mean, the more you do a thing, the better you get at it. But I won't say that Campaign 1 was a worse story. It was just a very different story. So yeah. Campaign 1 was much more what I, as a first time player, expected out of a D&D game. Yeah.
00:50:48
Speaker
this is much different than what I would have expected. And honestly, I don't think I would have done, I'm not insinuating I'm doing well this time, but if our first campaign had been this small stakes, low magic stuff, I don't know that I would have been good. Stay tuned for campaign three. Talked with good, yes. Campaign three, we all just work in an office together. No, that's Kyber Scharz.
00:51:16
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, OK. I do. I do. I do know what came in here is going to be, though. So stay tuned for a while. Eric made it. Eric made a decision and then it's going to be like two years down the road and he thinks it's going to still be the decision. Yeah, zero percent chance. No, because I know what my next character is going to be, too. Yeah. Well, and Eric thinks that, but we haven't had our legendary falling out yet where I get this invited from the podcast. That's pretty cool. That is coming.
00:51:46
Speaker
I think that'll be me and my a-hole characters that I keep making. All right. And our last question from Leopard is, has your old lady voice from season one improved since you voiced Graham? Philip, would you like to take this one? How has Eric's voice improved since he voiced Graham? I haven't heard Eric pretend to be an old lady in a while. I think Eric did as well as I would. We did. The lady in the apartment.
00:52:12
Speaker
Oh, yeah, who thinks that Gordon had boy based on these questions Jeff is really the only person that Gordon the mailman mattered at all at any point during this whole thing No, I don't think Gordon mailman mattered as I'm saying. We're the mailman's job was to get us to the monster It was a it was a funny voice
00:52:37
Speaker
Uh, you know, it's a different voice. It's a very different voice. Trying to be a very, very old, uh, kind old woman. Um, honestly, nosy, busy body lady. I was trying to be Terry Jones from Monty Python, like his, his female voice where it's just really high pitched and, uh, silly. So yeah. Um, so in that way, yes, it has improved because I'm leaning into the silliness of my old lady voice. So.
00:53:03
Speaker
And then one last question that actually came from the Q&A tier. I just wanted to save it till the end since it's not related directly to the campaign. This is from Becca. She asks, a general question for any show or person, because we also take Kyber Schard's questions in that tier for people who are, a general question for any show or person who wants to tackle
Hosts' Dream Living Spaces
00:53:22
Speaker
it. What is everyone's dream living space? What are the main features? Money's not an issue unless you want it to be one.
00:53:30
Speaker
I always want money to be an issue. I would like for my interview, what should I do with all this money? And then just start giving it away. I think about this a lot just because I'm constantly redoing my own home. I'm almost done with the kitchen remodel and I'm already getting the plaster in my living room tested for asbestos to see if I can rip it down and replace it with drywall. I'm constantly shifting my thing. My dream living space is extremely open and modular.
00:53:59
Speaker
With the exceptions of bedrooms and bathrooms, I wouldn't care if it was just basically a gymnasium with some counters and a sink for a kitchen. I love openness, both indoors and outdoors. The only goal I have is to one day live on, even just like five acres, just to have some space.
00:54:20
Speaker
That's all. And honestly, that much space in Oklahoma money is not a huge issue. We still have it and it ain't that expensive. The one thing I would love to have is a... Bear with me. A well sound approved room.
00:54:39
Speaker
One day when my friends and I can get together again, and I think everyone in this chat right now can attest to this, one of the things that we always devolve into is just making music together. And I would love to be able to do that as loud as we want without disturbing people who didn't want to be a part of it. So big room soundproof, full of instruments and a big table to play games around.
00:54:57
Speaker
and I don't know, I'd probably let Ferris pick something fun. He has opinions about his room. I may as well give him a couple rooms to just absolutely ruin with Nerf guns and YouTube. I don't know what he would do.
00:55:13
Speaker
I mean, I would probably say mine's like, mine's really never going to happen. I want to be floating. Because here's how it's going to go. A industrial loft style apartment type house place space. I don't know. That also has a backyard.
00:55:43
Speaker
Um, also is above coffee shops. It always smelled like coffee. And then you tell Trevor about making coffee at home where his house might smell like coffee. Also candles. Don't tell him about candles. Um, but I don't want to try. I just wanted to smell like coffee all the time. Glade plugins. Ask Eric how fun it is to smell like coffee all the time.
00:56:09
Speaker
But on like one side, it's like a cityscape and the other side is like a lake. So you want to live facing the North West. Yeah. Oregon. You want to move to Oregon, Trevor? Or Chicago. It could be Chicago. I think you want to face the boat pond in Central Park because you've definitely got a lake on one side and a city on the other. That wouldn't be a backyard though. That's true. No backyard courtyard. You could turn a balcony into a backyard.
00:56:35
Speaker
a tiny backyard, a backyard big enough for one dog, not even one of your dogs. Yeah, not my dog, but a dog. Philip? I mean, if I could just refit, if I could just get an old castle with modern amenities, that'd be solid, but I guess,
00:57:03
Speaker
because that's the problem with buying a castle is they want you to preserve it they don't want you to update it we're like oh I don't I don't actually want to update the appearance of it I just want it to be climate controlled and have plumbing that's really that's really all I want I was gonna say you want a thermostat and toilets that's what you want yes and mate I guess lighting
00:57:22
Speaker
or a team of people to come in and light all of the actual candle-powered chandeliers. This started with, I don't know, and now you have servants. More, I guess, more plausibly, although not very much more plausibly, the living space that I would want, and a very large, very nice outdoor living area.
00:57:52
Speaker
Um, which is the thing that I perpetually work on at my house is I'm always messing. I'm currently messing with the backyard. I'm always messing the backyard. Um, and a, a great hall, uh, with a, with a big table and a like down the center of the room fireplace dope.
00:58:18
Speaker
Enchanted ceiling. Oh, yeah, like like the whole like big big Vaulted roof with the buttresses. They're flying. No, no like beams not stonework like wood beams with
00:58:34
Speaker
enormous carved chairs. You know, the Great Hall from Winterfell or something like that would be about my ideal like main room of my house space. I saw an oversized beach chair today if you want to. It was made out of wood.
00:58:54
Speaker
I know I really get a I really get a kick out of gigantic ornate chairs like I find that immensely amusing That would be that would be where I would play D&D I saw a giant cement throne covered in mosaic tile with a toilet built into it today also So that would be interesting. I found out there's a reddit subreddit called weird toilets and fellas it does not disappoint
00:59:18
Speaker
in that it contains weird toilets. It's exactly right. But you get what it came for. And located in the cloud forest at the top of the mountains in Costa Rica. Nice. I wanted to go last because I have the most boring answer in that I would like a finished basement to do all my content creation business in. But other than that, like. You live in the wrong state for that brother. Yeah, I know. Other than that, like.
00:59:48
Speaker
Four bed, two bath, I'm good. It's not a big enough backyard for my dogs, and that's about it. So yeah, I'm boring. But I'm content. Did I mention the flaming moat around mine? It's just full of sturno. It's weird. It's gross. It smells terrible. It keeps food warm.
01:00:16
Speaker
One thing I would like in a house is ethernet run throughout it. Ethernet ports built into the wall to where things could plug in hard line into that. That's that's my nerdy thing that I would want. Oh, also the opposite of curb appeal. I watch all of these like home renovation shows and they go through and they're like, oh, you can't even see that house from the curb. We need to clear up. I'm like, no, it's perfect.
01:00:39
Speaker
No one wants to come to the door. That's exactly what I want. Only people I invite can find the door. No one is aware there's a door.
01:00:52
Speaker
There's a driving back empty land in the middle of town. There's a there's a there's a piece of land for sale not far from where I live and I'm driving down the road and there's a there's a turn off with the roads called like Gray Branch or something like that. But there's a sign not far because the land is for sale and it says two homes and a barn and that sign is there because you can't see any evidence that there is anything built on that land.
01:01:18
Speaker
And that's, that's honestly, except there needs to be an enormous gate over that road so that people can't act. Don't accidentally come down my drive. I sell you on a hatch built into the ground that your home is just completely underground. That way nobody will ever know. You know, I read somewhere a while back that.
01:01:38
Speaker
If you are willing to live in it and maintain it, Switzerland will give you one of the many, many old fallout bunkers that they built during the Cold War because they built enough of them to support 125% of their population. Wow. Because they were anticipating having to be underground for a long time.
01:01:58
Speaker
There are more than a few decommissioned underground missile silos in America that people are currently turning in to homes. Yeah. But no, I would not at all want to live underground. I do not hear me say large outdoor living space.
01:02:13
Speaker
Without a footprint of a home, there's that much more outdoor living space. That was a great question. I'm sorry that none of us were prepared enough to answer it. If I had seen it yesterday when you posted it, I would have actually taken some time to think about it. The real answer is...
01:02:30
Speaker
My dream living space changes with every bit of new information that enters my brain. And every new thing that I see. Like, I've just started buying houseplants because I decided, you know what, my dream is to have more houseplants in my home. And I was right, it's fantastic. Never owned one. Gonna kill these, but I'll learn and get better next time. I want to know what you're doing because I keep thinking, you know, houseplants.
01:02:54
Speaker
So I want to know what your experience has been with that. I'll keep you posted. Here's what I did do. I bought one that you can't kill, and I bought one that's like really already six feet tall and expensive and is very difficult to take care of. So that was stupid, but I liked it. What's the one you can't kill? Pothos. Pothos. It's a hanging, trailing plant that is impossible to kill. Dig it.
01:03:18
Speaker
I mean, I'm sure that's not true, but. Does it need a lot of sun? Because that's the problem in my house, is I don't have like a whole bunch of. Okay, we'll do this after the room. We only have so much time. I'm just really enjoying watching Eric react every time we proceed with this extremely suburban conversation that we're having. It is time to wrap it up. Thank you everyone. For the two of you left. Hey, but what grout do you guys use? Oh my god.
01:03:46
Speaker
Well, we're having to redo our kitchen right now. Sanded on the ceramic tile, non-sanded on the glass, and you should be okay. Here we go.
01:03:58
Speaker
Thank you so much. I mean, obviously, if you're still listening, use the glutton for punishment. Honestly, Eric, cut everything else out, and they'll wonder what we talked about. That'd be good, too. Except what kind of grout do you use? We, thank you guys for listening so much. And asking questions. This is great. We love this interactivity, both through these questions and just in general on the Discord and the Facebook. Speaking of those, we have a Discord, a Facebook, a Twitter presence, an Instagram presence.
01:04:24
Speaker
uh they are all at the geek panthe well pardon me all but the discord the socials are at the geek pantheon if you'd like to join the discord you can do so there's a link on the facebook page or on our website www.thegeekpantheon.com our youtube channel has a lot of DMing advice from eric as well as our other show GM DMed by Philip it is a 5e
01:04:47
Speaker
game Eric is one of the players as well as some of other Phillips other people he's played with before or friends and Eric streams on Twitch three times a week minimum three times a week the twitch channel is also the geek Pantheon I believe that's everything oh we have a tick tock now
01:05:10
Speaker
Do we really? We do. You just say that to watch my face. It just says this to watch my face. Only build awareness of the brand. Yeah. Hey, I will say this. I don't have a TikTok, but I am like just constantly on Twitter and I love TikTok. I just am not a member of myself. From a distance. Yeah. All right. So having said all that again, thank you all for listening and we will catch you next week with another episode in the meantime. Well, and then too, I'm Jeff. I'm Philip.
01:05:41
Speaker
I'm Trevor. And I'm Eric. Thanks again. Sorry it got weirder at the end. Goodnight. I'm not.