Transcript
Karen Seinor: Hello everyone, thanks for joining us. I've got Clint here from Alma Organics. So we're going to be talking organic food and whatever Clint has slipped up his sleeve today.
Karen Seinor: um We've called him at the shop down in South Albury. He's under the pump, I think that sometimes happens. So he's he's back in the office. So welcome Clint, thank you for chatting with me today.
Clinton: ah Thank you for inviting me and having me, Karen. I yeah am grateful for the opportunity to to share some words and share some stories and, yeah, I'm extremely grateful to be able to chat about all things life and and where we're headed and and, yeah, I'm interested to see where the conversation goes and then let's have some fun along the way.
Karen Seinor: me yeah Me too. ill I'll kick it off, shall I? um So you've got the store. So you're actually, um ah maybe I'll just wiggle it around a bit. So because of course, this podcast is really designed to talk about spirituality from a practical perspective.
Karen Seinor: And um it makes sense to me, and obviously to you too, that how we take care of our physical bodies and what we put into it is almost an act of spiritual self-care, I guess.
Clinton: Absolutely.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, so I'm curious, what got you into this whole thing about um selling organic food? Was it the growing that happened first?
Clinton: Yep.
Karen Seinor: Takes where you want to go.
Clinton: Perfect. Well, I will also do my best to encircle around spirit and spirituality as the underpin of the conversation and we'll also share
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: my unique history and journey which has shaped and evolved my lens and my perspective on life and the bigger picture and the bigger meaning and what is life all about and what does life mean to me and and how i perceive my journey and what I have to look forward to. So again, that really excites me because for me personally, as a middle-aged man, you know, this is what I spend my time pondering is is is is the depths of the universe and what is my role in all of this.
Karen Seinor: Mm-hmm.
Clinton: So again, so grateful for the opportunity to talk Karen. And then again, like I said, I'll intertwine it all through my daily practices, which fundamentally revolve around food, nature, serving my community and, you know, also being able to treat myself and serve myself as a temple and an expression of my practices which serve me. So that's kind of, even before I knew what I wanted to do, let's say 10 years ago, we Katie and I started Almar Organics nine years ago. i think we've been in business for nine years.
Clinton: And you know for your audience and for yourself, I'll try and wrap it up in lovely little bundles without going too deep.
Karen Seinor: Yep.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And so I was i have a history of, I was in construction. Okay. I was working in construction because as a young man, i didn't know what I wanted to do as do most young men and all women.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: But I enjoyed travel. i enjoyed making money and that's what motivated me. And that was okay because, you know, I was a young man without any guidance. I didn't have a father figure.
Clinton: I was raised by my mother and I was raised by my mother under the roof of the church, which is a blessing and potentially a curse as well. But um yeah, absolutely.
Karen Seinor: I'm hearing you there. Yeah.
Clinton: Amen. And, you know, it is just completely shaped my perspective on on life, on values, on ethics, on spirit. And, you know, if we go down this path as well, this is the conversation because my my children are now going to a Christian school and and my my my message to them is understanding the difference between religion and church.
Karen Seinor: you
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: religious practices and spiritual practices and church and the entity that is the church and how it is used to, you know, support community or, you know, again, we can use whatever words we want to use.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So that's where we want. So that was kind of my background. And again, so then I pushed away from the church and everything that was sacred to my mother, being raised by a single mom that was heart and no male figures.
Clinton: Anyway, it worked, traveled the world, spent my money know, mid to late 20s, I got sick of it. um I got sick of it. I was empty. I didn't know how to fill that hole and I tried to fill it with many, many things.
Clinton: And I found a beautiful woman that was enough for me to at least change certain behaviours and the way that I was showing up in the world. And that was...
Karen Seinor: We should check that with Katie when she's available, I reckon.
Clinton: Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, I'm sure she'll probably take more credit than she deserves,
Karen Seinor: you Yeah.
Clinton: but that that critical moment in time for me kind of coalesced with meeting a beautiful woman, which was enough for me to, you know, just change a little bit.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: um And with that came, well, I am not satisfied with my career. I work with people that I don't resonate with because I was already, i was quite lucky because I worked away.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: so i spent a lot of time by myself. And again, I've always been quite lucky that I'm, i' am was happy alone, i like my own company, ah I have thoughts that are deep, but generally the language and the words that I use and the way that I feel about myself is quite positive.
Clinton: So whether that is nature or nurture, I'm not too sure. I've done a lot of work in that space. but um So I was isolated throughout you know my 20s when working away and what that really made me do was get a better understanding of myself.
Clinton: So then
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: who and what kind of people I didn't want to hang around with and didn't want to be a part of certain groups or circles or, you know, people that did certain things. So when I came back to Albury and to my wife, I was like, I don't want to work in construction anymore because ultimately, and I'm not, I don't want to stereotype anyone, but the gentleman that I were working with, I wasn't resonating with.
Clinton: They weren't lifting me up. I wasn't lifting them up. i was like, okay, I need to get out of this environment, which was potentially toxic and wasn't uplifting. And I needed to find something that aligned more with my values and,
Karen Seinor: Yes.
Clinton: My values were health, fitness, food, I love cooking, and there was an opportunity to buy into an existing small organic space, which was Alma Organics.
Clinton: And at that time, it was a lady called Alison and she was doing veggie boxes, organic veggie boxes, and looked into it and
Karen Seinor: yes
Clinton: both my wife and I thought, cool, what a fantastic opportunity. It gives me something to pull my energy into something to, you know, give me some purpose and something that really aligned with how I was feeling at that time in my life. So, you know, that was like nine years ago, yeah, nine or 10 years ago, we started that process and then we've gone and we've built this beautiful business now, which is certainly values focused. and And again, to the detriment of our business sometimes, but that's how we have built the business. And now we're trying to be better at business, but ultimately,
Clinton: The business was about connecting people to the source of their food and being able to teach and show people through the way that we were living and what we were learning, how they can improve their lives and improve their health.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And then this is ah this is a funny one. Well, I believe it's funny because it's like the chicken and the egg. And I hear a lot of like people in the regenerative space, in the growing space, in the organic space, that, and this kind of co-op, again,
Clinton: aligns with the spirit that we're talking about, Karen, is that we need to do these practices to serve the mother or to serve nature, you know, to heal and repair nature.
Karen Seinor: Exactly.
Clinton: and And I'm like, no, I am doing this for me because this is what's best for me. And when it is truly aligned, what is best for me on the micro is my actions that serve the macro.
Karen Seinor: exactly like
Clinton: And so I've come from the other way because I'm like, no, like my body is a temple and I only need to eat, you know, ABC, real food, grow by real people in real soil with real nutrients, real bugs.
Clinton: And so then it's like, okay, well, let's get a farm and let's grow organic food for me. And then it's like, oh, but when I do this, I have an abundance of food for my community. And when I can regenerate the soil, then the animals come back to nature.
Karen Seinor: Mm-mm.
Clinton: And, you know, so these, low impact processes and practices which grow food the way that nature or God has designed do not only serve me, it serves my community and then it can serve my ecosystem that I'm such a crucial part of because I'm a custodian of that land or I am caretaker of that ecosystem and my impact can be minimal or it can be maximal, but that maximal impact that I want to have is one that serves the entirety not just takes, you know, that consumption model, which is now we're in I'm not going to say competition, but in correspondence with is, you know, for whatever it is, 40, 50 years, I don't really know, but certainly for my lifetime is we've been wired for more is less or less is more, you know,
Karen Seinor: yeah
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yes.
Clinton: um We want more food for less dollars. So then that corporate model flows into our food systems. And what do we end up with? We end up with a generation of sick and disconnected kids, sick and disconnected adults, obesity, chronic illness, metabolic syndrome, like, you know, people living along with disconnected, unhealthy lives plugged into the matrix, plugged into pharmaceuticals and meds.
Clinton: And for what purpose? Just so the cycle of money can continue to spin and it, doesn't serve seemingly no one, like not the individual, not the society, the planet as a whole, and not the cosmos.
Karen Seinor: Well, it's certainly serving someone because um if you follow the money, we know who's being served.
Clinton: Yeah, you know, that's, and yeah the three is tri redistribution of wealth is clearly evident everywhere you go.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And, you know, 100%. And I kind of just don't like to, you know, like the term they them, the elites, the global, whatever, the corporatists.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: I just kind of think it kind of, you know, in terms of our community here in Aubrey Woodall, it kind of just disappears, you know, but yeah, you feel the impact of that.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah.
Clinton: So there is a long slash short story, Karen, around how I got to where I am now um in terms of the shop and then the evolution of the farm and growing food.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: at a level that my body and my community deserves and so does mother nature. um And then now I've expanded that because again, understanding that human health is not just what you eat, it's what you do, it's what you believe, it's what you say, it's how you serve, it's your purpose, it's aligning with community and lifting others up. So that evolution has continued now into my space where I share my insights, not just around food, but around spirit and mindset and parenting and all these other wonderful things which make my life holistic and purposeful and intentional and spiritual and healthy.
Clinton: And that's now what I'm i'm putting my energy into is being able to yeah help others live a life of purpose and integrity and of intention.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: yep
Karen Seinor: It's a massive vision, isn't it? And to actually be able to to hold all of that and to balance all of that. That's a really big undertaking to put all of that into one package.
Karen Seinor: And yet the more simple things become, the easier it is to hit all of those little bells.
Clinton: Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. ah think um simplicit life in simplicity, you know, by a certain set of values can bring you peace and and also at the same time make you feel so much more whole or so much more complete because it's only our own programming generally that makes us feel like we're not enough so we need to do more or be whatever, when you know.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah.
Clinton: like
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: make more, work more, have more impact, you know, it depends on whether it's truly serving our true selves or whether it's serving our ego or, you know, that competition that we spoke about a little bit earlier. um But I agree trying to manage and navigate that space.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: Again, you're living in 2025, it's hard not to, you know, we're here connecting over, this is like a live chat stream through technology, which is fantastic because again, too, you're like, we could have this conversation in person, but again, we want to be able share it with others.
Clinton: But yes, again, i think ins in its simplest form, of trying to um break our lives down into bite sized pizzas, which are based on those values and that are clear and simple, particularly when I get back to nature, you know, like what is
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Paul Kingman, : said says, you know, all healing happens in nature, and you know there's just so many lessons again very lucky that I get to have that space I get to spend time outside with my feeding in the dirt and my son my skin under the sun and breathing fresh air and you know it's in the animals, but yeah truly.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: Paul Kingman, PhD.: : is a simpler life that I seek Karen even though that story may not sound as such.
Karen Seinor: I think we're all really whether we are conscious about it or not and certainly anyone listening to this will be conscious about that desire to connect to a life that has more meaning and I find that a lot of the time people are thinking it has to be really big things and But in truth, the way we, even the way we consume our food or create a meal, you know, they're the sorts of things, you know, the choice of food and where it comes from, that whole, um I mean, i've I've been out to your place.
Karen Seinor: ah did a permaculture course at the TAFE and um so Canon took us through and showed us all the the bits and bobs, who looked at the bees and all that. I'm a bit of a bee person.
Karen Seinor: um And the energy out there is lovely. You've got a beautiful space there. There's a really soft energy out there, I think.
Clinton: Yeah, yeah, um absolutely. with With the location of the farm, without going too far off point, it is, I use the word sacred ah and going in a little bit deeper because I run workshops and retreats out there as well.
Clinton: But it has like this aspect of east-west orientation through the valley that
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: lights up in the morning and then surrenders at night. And it has this, I use like this sacred energy, but it's it's um it's it's either the, I feel like the sacred feminine, like it feels like this lovely cuddle um when we work out there, it's like she's embracing us. And then that kind of flows into the farming, like the try hard, I've had to push things a little bit this year because of the weather.
Clinton: um And by that, I just mean i I'm always like behind, but maybe I'm always just on time. I don't know. But I always tell people that I'm always like, how's the farm going? Oh, I'm about three weeks behind where I want to be.
Clinton: um But again, too, like I said, that divine timing, perhaps I'm just exactly where I need to be at that moment in time when it comes to my scheduling. But, yeah, this year has been a little bit tougher. We've, you know, plants have died purely because it hasn't rained.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: Animals have struggled because there hasn't been any feed or any water. But I'm certainly aware of that and I'm doing my best. But like I said, yeah, I probably am not as, haven't served as well as I as well as i can.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And so I can sense that.
Karen Seinor: I mean, that's that's part of the thing. I mean anybody who's coming into into the shop there and purchasing food that's grown locally on the farm, and I imagine that you get some produce from around about as well. You can't do it all.
Karen Seinor: um They're seeing what's in season. So there's ah an understanding about which I think that people who go to these large ah supermarkets can actually forget.
Karen Seinor: you know, back in the day, we would only eat cherries at Christmastime because...
Clinton: Christmas.
Karen Seinor: That's when they were in season. It was part of the celebration of summer, wasn't it? But now they ship them in from all over the joint.
Clinton: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: And that's one of the things I think that you're talking about is, you know, the cuddle and the land and and being directed by it. um You know, the fact that you're having to
Karen Seinor: lose plants because it's not raining and all that sort of stuff. So people who come into the store have a an opportunity to have a better understanding about where their food comes from and what's actually involved in the process of bringing food to their tables.
Clinton: Yeah.
Clinton: Yeah, absolutely. And that's been even when so before we had the farm and you mentioned it in the the last question that you're the last statement that you made as well, Karen, was um that awareness that comes with consumption.
Clinton: And you mentioned, you know, the people that are listening to this are conscious. And and so I use the term like a few years ago, conscious consumption, you know, because we are consumers.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And we can't deny that, but you you know there's this there's a difference between unconscious and conscious consumption. but And then again, particularly when it comes to food, I think again, and we mentioned the health crises earlier as well is that one of, I believe one of the major causes of this health crisis, health epidemic, that we're, or mental health epidemic, whatever you wanna label it, um is a real disconnect from real food.
Karen Seinor: e
Clinton: I certainly believe that if people were to just pull back and look at the way they eat, and unfortunately, again, we just mentioned conscious and unconscious, a lot of it is unconscious. although yeah People don't even know what they eat.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Like if you were to say to someone, what do you eat in a day? And most people will say, you're pretty healthy, you know, and, you know, i have breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Exactly right. Okay, well, what does that consist of You know, and it would be some form of processed food with maybe a little bit of real food.
Clinton: you know But then simple snacks throughout the day and then you know maybe flavored drinks. you know And this is just standard. i'm not you know I don't want to generalize the stereotype too much, but this is just standard.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: And so if everyone wants to just just peel that back and then develop a deeper Here we a deeper connection to their food. If food then becomes sacred, because again, we have an abundance of food. The problem is that, and that's abundance of fake food. It's an abundance of unnatural food. It's an abundance of man-made, industrialized, hyper-palliative foods, which doesn't serve the individual. Again, it sort serves those corporates we spoke about earlier, keeps people sick, keeps people in a cubicle, keeps people plugged into the necessary farmers that they need to operate so they don't die, but they're still here.
Clinton: I guess it's a little bit intense just then, and I'm sorry.
Karen Seinor: a
Karen Seinor: yeah No, no, this is ah this food and food security is a really major topic.
Clinton: But...
Karen Seinor: I think we should all be intense about it, quite frankly.
Clinton: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Because, and and then and um you mentioned, and i will mention it, is that eating seasonally. Because again, too, like, we are conditioned, we're programmed to walk in a supermarket and there is abundance.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: don't if you remember, it only five years ago, you walk into a supermarket and there's like no toilet paper and everyone's freaking out, you know, the end of the world, was like, people are still shitting the same amount as what they were two weeks ago, why do we need a backup of toilet paper, you know, that's not food, but that's an example of like, shelves are empty.
Karen Seinor: I remember.
Karen Seinor: Thanks.
Clinton: And, and you know, one thing that our society is really going to struggle with, and this is the thing, because we have too much, we have and an abundance, i said not abundance of good food, abundance of food like products. People don't
Karen Seinor: got a lot of We've got a lot of shit in cardboard boxes, don't we?
Clinton: absolute plastic packaging even worse we won't go there just yet um so we don't know what it's like to be hungry or we don't know what it's like and again we i don't talk about me but we as a society we don't know what it's like to grow our own food we don't know what it's like to kill our own animals and so that disconnect has arrived and so there's no sacredness around food anymore you know like there's no communion there's no like you know and don't get me wrong but
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: There are people that do say grace, but there's no grace around the dinner table. You know, like we used to thank God for this meal and for the chef and for the farmer. And now it's just like, oh, fuck, we'll just go through Maccas.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah.
Clinton: Yeah, we'll just drive through Maccas. It's easy. It's going to cost 10 bucks. We'll feed the family and we'll go home and watch Netflix, you know. So that disconnect from the grower, from the source, from the season and from God has created this void which has been filled by temptation, gluttony, taste, blah, bla blah, blah, blah.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: And where are we now? We're in a fragmented society where, you know, conversations like this need to be had to make people conscious of the impacts and the greater impacts, not only on the micro but on the macro because where do these foods come from?
Clinton: They're made in factories, monocrop culture, which kills the soil, which kills the microbiome, which kills the air, which kills the waterways, blah, bla blah, blah.
Karen Seinor: you know Yeah.
Clinton: This is the impact of this whole more for less model that we are now living through, Karen. Hopefully I nailed those points. One more was the seasonal aspect again too.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: Our bodies have designed, have evolved, have grown up in symbiosis with the environment that we are a part of. So certain cultures, certain races, certain genetic makeups are literally designed to eat.
Clinton: This is how our bodies have evolved for thousands of years, to eat certain foods at certain times of the year to thrive. Like this is an incredible machine which has been designed in the most amazing way by whatever universal intelligence, again, you want to label it, not to be eating sugar at 10.30 out of a packet.
Clinton: It's been designed to go through feast and famine through certain seasons and, you know, load up on berries and fruits during the colder months and then fatten up in the summer so we can go through the long winter.
Clinton: And again, we um we are denying our body's natural expression, which is one of beauty and and strength and robustness and resilience to seek comfort, which is again, killing the species at a gradual a gradual but alarming rate, you know, at the same time.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: i And it's, you know, people... uh, struggling to conceive naturally these days, you know, like, I think there's just so many layers of disconnect, which can be solved by throwing half the shit out of the supermarket and just filling it up with fruit and meat and just, and, and,
Karen Seinor: Yeah, absolutely.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Just getting the inflammation down in the body. um i mean, that's a major thing. The way we have been taught to eat, like, I'm just a tiny bit over 60 now. So my whole life has been one of, you know, abundance in terms of food.
Clinton: Yep. yep
Karen Seinor: As a kid, you know, in the summer we would go up to Mountain Creek Road with buckets and stand in the freezing cold water and stand there in the sunshine and eat the blackberries because they weren't poisoned and fill up our buckets and we'd go home and we'd have blackberry pie and we'd make jam and it'd be frozen for the winter and, you know, it's so there's always been this abundance. Same with mushrooms. I mean, you wouldn't...
Karen Seinor: I'd be too scared to go and pick a mushroom out of a paddock these days. It'd be full of some revolting, disgusting stuff that is pulled out of the dirt.
Clinton: Yeah, exactly.
Karen Seinor: Don't kill me. but um yeah we've But, yeah, we've so become disconnected. I mean, even just the whole thing about foraging, i don't think kids even know about that stuff. Most kids wouldn't know where the closest walnut tree is or apple tree. You know, we used to know those things, didn't we?
Clinton: Absolutely. Absolutely. And that's, you know, and you're talking too about nature's abundance.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: You know, i grew up much the same way. i was was very lucky that, you know, before my father did leave, he, because he was raised in a way where, you know, you grew your own food and you had to hunt and catch your own food and everything else was a, what would the word I would say, ah blessing, I would say, but, you know everything else was over and above.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: And so, you know, like we used to mushroom and forage and fish and hunt rabbits and, you know, all the stuff, pester food, grow food, veggies, fruit trees, all the stuff.
Karen Seinor: Oh, thank
Clinton: But yes, again, I think one of the common things, because I've ran quite a few ah kids farm days, which are always so beautiful.
Karen Seinor: i
Clinton: Yeah, lots of junior schools, Scott's and John's and Border Christian College, where my girls go to school. And they're always an amazing day, but always challenge the kids. You know, the first two questions I ask is like,
Clinton: Where does your food come from? you know and And it's great because you'll have you'll have those cheeky little buggers that will say supermarket or Maccas because they can't help themselves. But they're genuinely real responses.
Karen Seinor: Yes.
Clinton: you know um They know they're on a farm and they know they're going to see food and food growing and you know that's going to be the whole spiel. And then the other one is you know what makes a farmer? and And my answer is a farm.
Clinton: you know You can't have a farmer without a farm. but yeah these kids are now grown up in spaces where mums and dads are too busy so no and again not not all mums and dads so many many men and again there's a revolution because you know people are realizing that the cost of food and the cost of life is one it's it's artificial it's it's man-made but that's another again another story for another day um
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: We need to be able to be food resilient, as you said. We need to look after local food systems. And that starts at home, you know, because again, too, if you start growing food at home, then your kids recognise real food.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: They might eat a tomato from the shop because it'll taste like crap. It won't taste like mum's tomato or grandma's tomato. And then, you know, all of a sudden they're going to the farmer's markets where they're coming to Elmar and then they're stopping at roadside stalls and,
Clinton: they're building and rebuilding that connection with food and their environment and the ecosystem that they're such a pivotal part of.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: I think it's the most powerful thing that anyone can do is is I think even Mark Hyman says this, he goes, the best thing that you can do for your health is learn how to cook.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So one step removed from that is, you know, if you're learning how to cook, then you're knowing what is going into your food.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Most people don't. Again, if you're getting an external business company organization to cook your food, it could be bloody anything going into that food. And for the most part, again, it's the cheapest possible ingredients to be able to get that more for less mentality satisfied by the consumer.
Clinton: But if you're cooking food, you know what's going into it. And then, like I said, upstream from that is even your... And that's what got me going right at the start, like I said, was if you're actually growing your food, then you know unequivocally...
Clinton: where that food has come from, what has gone on to that plant, what has gone into that plant, the soil that's grown it, the love that it's had. And then on a deeper level again is once you actually start growing food, then you understand that it's energy, you know?
Karen Seinor: Yes, exactly.
Clinton: So it's not just the compounds that your body is designed to on a physical level. It's the energy. It's the spiritual level that goes into it. So again, like I would hate to price my cauliflowers. You know, and I think I did a post on it maybe last year. because I should be charging $85 cauliflower. but
Karen Seinor: if
Clinton: ah should be charging $1,085 because it's like the sequence of love. It's the sequence of energy. it's It's man's energy. It's my productivity, but it's my love. It's because it's love for, it's not like,
Clinton: oh, fuck, I've got to plant cauliflowers again today. You know, it's like, yes, I get to plant cauliflowers today. And, you know, you toil the soil with love and you feed your compost and you you you raise your seedlings from seed and you water them every day in, you know, your handmade seed raising mix.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And there's this whole process of love and energy that goes in. And then what's the end product is you get this beautiful cauliflower that you get to then, let's slow bake that bloody thing in the wood roasted oven with some organic spices and it takes another three hours and then you get all excited to share that cauliflower with your family and then they go oh it tastes like crap dad but then you'll have other guests like oh my god it's the most amazing cauliflower i've ever eaten and i'm like you get it you get it you go out there and you take over the world my friend um and you take my energy and you use it for good um yeah
Karen Seinor: yeah
Karen Seinor: that's That's right. That's exactly right. I love that you've talked about that because, i mean, food is really solidified sunshine, isn't it?
Clinton: Yes.
Karen Seinor: I mean, it's pure life force energy. And then, you know, you're tilling the soil, you're making that soil alive. and So the the nutrition, the minerals are coming up and then the people like yourself who are working with it, the people that you have in the store selling it, all of that stuff has an impact and the majority of people are completely unaware of this energetic transfer and interplay that occurs.
Karen Seinor: And you're right, you cannot put a price on that because that is the difference between um eating something crunchy and eating something that's full of love that's going to nourish your soul as well as your body.
Clinton: Absolutely.
Karen Seinor: It's is you know really great that you've talked about that.
Clinton: Yeah.
Clinton: Yeah. And we sound like crazy hippies when we say it's nourishing our soul. Exactly right. But it, well, I believe that it is.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: I believe that it is.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Um,
Karen Seinor: And even and like I mean, organics is ah is a tricky one. I mean, there's a lot of... i i imagine that for you, you're in a in a very difficult dance because... And I'm speaking from a business perspective now because you've got you've got a beautiful, thriving local business that...
Karen Seinor: people who understand food come in and they want to buy the produce, you're working on ah on a certain set of values, but at the same time as your business grows, the production needs to go up and that must create a difficult balance to maintain, I would imagine.
Clinton: Um, it's everything about business is difficult, Karen.
Karen Seinor: true. true
Clinton: Um, we, yeah, we, we certainly, with with the farm, I've gotten better, um, because it's not entirely about, originally it was, um,
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah.
Clinton: how to grow at scale, how to grow at scale fast. Let's get really good at this as quickly as I can, learn from my mistakes. So it cost lots of money um and it was quite a journey and was really interesting.
Clinton: So this year I've reduced our varieties, still operating under the same mantra.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: Like I'm no till, we rotate crop, there's no external imports, all the imports are from the farm, which is beautiful.
Karen Seinor: Wow. Amazing.
Clinton: Make all our own compost, we'll have for the last three years now, which has been super cool. um And so, but I've changed my varieties because, again, I had to get good at, one, what grows in my soil, in my location, in my own microclimate, but also, two, then, what sells.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Like, there's no point in growing. And I'm lucky because I had a closed... economy like I have chickens and I have cows and I have compost so like it doesn't ever go to waste it it just comes back around in a different form again that energy that we spoke about you know there's we don't create any more energy it just you know is that Nikola Tesla like it just moves or transfers or whatever it does it just you know it does some magic um so then this year it's like okay well these are the variety of beets I grow this is the pumpkin that I grow you know like and we do get we we do we can I did get carried away in like your heirloom varieties.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yep.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: And, you know, I was growing like forward, like biodiversity. I was big on biodiversity and I'm like, no i don't know 40 different species of crop at any given time i'm just making things going back to what you said right at the start simple ah and it's making things way too complicated for myself for my systems and for my farm so that's what i did was i simplified i'd plant long running crops that would stay in the ground for a long time and then i'd rotate and rest the beds and that's how i would get my diversity and i'd like um
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: carve a crop cover crop with a pea or you know, I'm a neural mix. So I've changed to simplify my life because I'm pretty sure i was going to get divorced last year.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: I can't remember if that's what my wife said.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: I was kind of like really busy. I couldn't, I know she said something, she's like, I'm leaving. Something's got to give. I can't remember. I wasn't really listening.
Karen Seinor: look
Clinton: And I picked up on what was going on. So so Yeah, I had to change because I couldn't just like serve the dirt, serve the farm and then not serve my family as well.
Clinton: And don't get me wrong, like summer and spring in particular are like so really stressful.
Karen Seinor: in
Clinton: And I know that God has given us longer days so we can be more productive and work that's, you know, carry chop the wood and carry the water. But, um you know, it's it's really hard. So I simplified things this year.
Clinton: I changed our labour and it seemed to have worked a lot better.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah.
Clinton: Yes, back to your original question, is this dance, this balance? um Yes, because I can't just... I was speaking to this with my brother-in-law like i mean yesterday. It's like you can work in something that you're passionate about, but if you're just working and you're not selling, now this is the business hat. you're not providing value to your community, then it's just a hobby.
Clinton: And if you're a market gardener that doesn't sell his food, it's a fucking expensive hobby, you know?
Karen Seinor: yeah
Karen Seinor: Yeah, and the kids are going to be lovely.
Clinton: So yes, yes.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: You know, they'll get old and they'll be like, oh, if dad ever did. so um Yeah, always evolving, always improving, always learning. And the biggest feedback loop, again, I wouldn't have been there and when canna but when I've done farm tools in the past.
Clinton: So the biggest feedback loop is nature, is the plants, is the soil. If you've pushed it too far, it will let you know. if the plants are finished, they'll let you know. If time to plant, they'll let you know. um And so it's the same with you life, my partnership, my relationship, business.
Clinton: It's all feedback, but you need to be open and realise that you don't understand what
Karen Seinor: Yeah. And that takes time.
Clinton: everything and you are purely student of life. It does take time. It does take time.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: But that's one big thing.
Karen Seinor: So you've got to be able to stop, breathe, have your feet actually on the ground so that you can receive that feedback loop, isn't it
Clinton: Absolutely, absolutely. And it's one thing that... um I won't go off on tangent this time, but it is one thing that, yes, working in the land, on the land, is you can get quite caught up, as I said earlier.
Clinton: I'm always two or three weeks behind. So you can get really caught up with your head down and your bum up, toil, toil, toil, and miss the roses, you know, or miss the bird song.
Clinton: So I'm certainly getting better at that as well, Karen, is like this is a gift and I get to spend time in nature, in this incredible space working.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Um, so yeah, I need to enjoy it and be present for every moment.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: yeah i
Clinton: Not just watch the clock, not just watch the clock.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, no, it's not about watching the clock at all, is it? And yet that's, I guess that's what I was referring to before by saying, you know, you're in a unique and challenging space, because there's that understanding of nature and the production of food, but also having to make sure you can pay the rent and all the bills and things like that. And that
Clinton: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: You know, yeah, it's ah it's a tricky one. And I think um I wonder whether the community in general understands the pressures involved in actually delivering a quality product like real food. I i sometimes wonder about that.
Clinton: Yeah. ah And it's your your short answer is absolutely. And, you know, for for most people, Like we can't see the forest through the trees or we can't see past our own nose because like at the end of the day, we're working in our own hustle with our own grind and it's hard enough to be aware and conscious and present of our own actions and our impact and, you know, why are we doing the things that we do?
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So then go another deeper level and zoom right out and go, oh, well, you know, Karen's over here and Clint's over here and wonder...
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: where they're at and how they're coping and how they're doing things. But yeah, it's, I just, again, full circle, I certainly believe that educating ah community on where and how food is grown, where it's come from and what real food can do for you and your health is, you know, the most impactful message that we can get across and get out to our community or one of the most
Karen Seinor: Yeah, yeah. There's a couple of things I want to ask you about. I'll come back to that. I want to ask you about the men's groups I know you've been running. I'm really interested in hearing about that.
Clinton: Yep.
Karen Seinor: um The other thing I want to ask you about is from a chemical perspective, like organic farming, means, you know, not using those big nasty chemicals and things.
Karen Seinor: Would you like to speak to that a little bit and your view on that?
Clinton: Yep. Yep. Absolutely.
Karen Seinor: No,
Clinton: Absolutely. um So what, and and this is the way I explain, because I love it because I have people, and I've been doing this for a little while now and I always have people come in and they say, how do I know?
Clinton: And this is the question that I get asked. So this business, any business transaction, any value proposition, any exchange of money or goods or services for another is all about trust.
Karen Seinor: what?
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Okay. It's all about trust. So when you run, say, paddock to plate experience like mine or you happen to have a farm down the road, it's a lot easier for me to be transparent because I can just say, come out to my farm, you know, I'll show you.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: You can check my shed, my garage, you'll find some fly spray. That's about it.
Clinton: So always start there. You know, I always start there. And so this is where it's come in. So this there's organically grown and then there's certified organic.
Clinton: And the thing is, and and this is why so I like to explain this, is like there are certified organic growers and that's who we have here in the shop.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So these guys are bigger style farms that will still run multi-species farms because that's how they operate and that's what they believe in. But they're doing it at a much larger scale. And so what they have to do is they are governed or regulated by a certifying body. They have to pay for that.
Karen Seinor: and
Clinton: which sounds corrupt, but they still, it's these are NGO companies, organizations that need to be paid because their services are going in there to approve certain practices. And this is across the board. It's not just farming or food or anything like that.
Clinton: But so a certified organic, say pumpkin and ah pumpkins may be a bad example, but pumpkins grow quite easily. Anything with a thick skin is quite robust. You know, you're more worried about getting eaten by rabbits or hares or kangaroos than like bugs.
Karen Seinor: Yep. Yep.
Clinton: But it's how they grow because again, if you're putting just say a particular herbicide that goes into the soil that is hydrophilic, then it can be uptaken through the moisture within the soil it can end up in the cell wall of the plant and then you ultimately ingest that. It can make you sick chronically.
Clinton: So anyway, the... Organisations, basically police, they're regulating bodies for these farmers to farm under a certain set of rules.
Karen Seinor: ye
Clinton: So that, and so that's what they're paying for because they have to come and check on regular basis that they're doing the things, their soils get tested. They're only allowed to use certain imports that are approved by these bodies.
Clinton: So where that comes into play or practice is from my understanding, way that I see it is for the cities. Okay. For, you know, you're traveling and you can't make it to the farmer's market or, you know, you're not at your local growers area or your local grocery store.
Clinton: And so you're traveling and you're, oh, okay, well, that's an organic pumpkin. It only says it's an organic pumpkin, but again, there's that level of trust that someone has to take to transfer that value or or that money.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So that's what that is, that is the organic cert of the organic certification. And from the way that I see it and the way that I believe it is that that is like a stamp of approval that the customer can trust if they trust it. If they don't, then that's entirely up to them. I suggest they do more research until they're ready to trust or they get someone like me to explain to them how it works.
Clinton: So what an organic grower can do and what they do do, Karen, is they use certain inputs and by inputs I mean like fertilizers, herbicides, pesticides that are approved by the certifying regulator.
Clinton: Now, some of those products I would not use, but again, I'm small scale and all of my inputs are natural 100%. And all of these inputs are generally natural.
Clinton: There may be some man-made ones, particularly when it comes to fertilisers, but they're not, they have been, again, they're certified, they're approved.
Karen Seinor: yeah Aren't they finding that in the placenta of brand new babies?
Clinton: Whether they are will be approved in the future or have it been approved in the past or are good for human cat consumption. Again, you know like back in the day, they used to say that you could drink Roundup. or like I would not recommend that to ah
Clinton: Well, ah I believe so, Karen, yes. So, you know, it's it's in the body, it's in the water, it's in the soil for a bloody long time.
Karen Seinor: I do too.
Clinton: So anyway, there are, and some growers are more values driven and more values based than other growers.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: This is on a certified level. um So again, I try and get the best ones.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Yeah.
Clinton: I try and get Victorian growers. trying ones that are growing more than just one product. um And again, I've done my best to go to some of these farms. I've gone to the markets and try and connect with these so that I can be that conduit of trust between the consumer and the producer.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: And like I said, when it comes to my farm or other local growers, then they practice transparency. And some of them will just tell you straight up, I'm not organic because again, generally it's too hard or there's too many steps for me to go from, yeah.
Karen Seinor: It's a lot of money involved in in getting that registration and keeping it, isn't it?
Clinton: Okay. Of changing.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Oh, absolutely. And it's it's certainly so for me, it's not worth me getting my farm certified because I'm only selling direct to community here in my shop. If I was to sell to Melbourne, um which again, if I was to do that, I'd have to reduce my 10 crops a season to two crops a season to have enough to be able to sell. And it just wouldn't be worth it, Karen.
Clinton: um
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: But that's that's the difference. And so an organic grower and an organic grower like me or a permaculture grower um or a biodynamic grower We'll use practices, as I mentioned, it like no-till or low-till, minimal disturbance to the soil to maintain the fungi and the microbial and the mycorrhizae integrity of the soil.
Clinton: Because, again, if we turn soil, generally it kills the life in the soil. It exposes it to sun, to heat, to moisture that it doesn't need.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: You want to keep the minerals in the soil. So no-till or low-till for us is definitely no-till. And... and like said, all my imports is trying to balance the nitrogen and the carbon pretty much is very, very simple.
Clinton: I just use mulch when I need to use mulch, use compost when I need to use compost. I use animal manure off the farm, compost that I've made. And generally I'll use a sea salt or a sea oil solution when I plant my seedlings.
Clinton: that's pretty much it. And usually I use the plants as an indicator whether they need something or don't need something.
Karen Seinor: in
Karen Seinor: It almost sounds as though given the way you are operating, it's almost a bit more organic than the certified organic people, really.
Clinton: Oh, absolutely. um and I'm going to say that. um Absolutely. But again, too, like their livelihood is different to my livelihood. And they're growing mass to get to market to serve, you know, hundreds of thousands of people in the city, as opposed to me, you know, a couple of hundred people here.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: and
Karen Seinor: It's a totally different model, isn't it That's the problem.
Clinton: Absolutely. And that's and going back to like, as long as and not as long, but you know, if they're true to their values, which most of them are, honestly, like I've got a collection of the, you know, their family owned farms, they transitioned to full organic 20 years ago, when the sun took over the farm, usually it's a transition phase.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: They're growing this, this, this, you know, they're running regenerative pastures where they've got, you know multi-species crop or multi-species mammals and birds and, you know, I believe again, we mentioned that word earlier biodiversity.
Clinton: So in agriculture, it might be labeled multi species. So again, like i said, if you've got different plants, grasses and seeds, rotating your crops in this case, vegetables, flowers and fruits, um you know, many different animals with different microbes with different inputs from their, you know, their manure, which chew up different grasses at different times of the year, have different positive impacts on the soil and the ecosystem as a whole.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: um So am I more organic? Like maybe not, but am I less, input intensive, I would say yes as well.
Karen Seinor: yes
Clinton: Yeah, yes as well. So we use like, again, old school, I ah cover everything up, we weed by hand, you know. Yeah,
Karen Seinor: I know, I think I've pulled the weed out there.
Clinton: yeah absolutely. We love the spring hands in the dirt.
Clinton: But you know, Fingers crossed we you know we get on top of that weed bank in the soil. But yeah, that's that's probably one of the biggest things that I think most people need to understand.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: that is that you know The organic label or organic farmers, it's not a crock, it is literally a way of farming which you know generally encompasses low-tox minimal imports and supporting natural growth of crops throughout their natural growing cycle and season.
Karen Seinor: and
Clinton: And what do I believe happens then, as we mentioned way, way back at the start, is that you're providing and growing a food which is then bioavailable in its nutrient form but also energetically serves you.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: not you know It's not It's not... it's not dysfunctional, it's living energetics that can be transferred and you feel it.
Karen Seinor: And every part of us can suck it up and use it and it's good.
Clinton: Absolutely. Absolutely.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Absolutely.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Thank you for talking about that. I appreciate it. um So can we jump over to the groups that you do?
Clinton: yeah Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Did you?
Karen Seinor: Or is there anything else you wanted to talk about before we do that?
Clinton: We've No, it's okay, Karen. We've spoken about many things in such a short period of time from food to food systems to, you know, source and energy and the corporatocracy. And, yeah, we've covered a lot of things.
Karen Seinor: Actually, our thoughts just popped into my head. This is, you know, obviously none of this is planned, right? um Food security, I mentioned that before. Personally, i have some concerns when I look out into the world and I see what's going on out there.
Karen Seinor: I have a few little concerns about um our food for us as a nation. um but but Do you have any thoughts around that?
Clinton: Yeah, absolutely. um That was like one of my, and you may remember, I said right at the start, i was like, I had to lean into growing food at scale really fast.
Karen Seinor: Yes.
Clinton: um You know, i talked about shells with no toilet paper. So it was like here in this space, I'm like, okay, I can't get potatoes. And, you know, like people are wearing the potatoes.
Clinton: um So right at that moment, you know, 2020, I saw the fractures in the food system and our reliance on single suppliers, supply chains, overseas, you know, so it was like, okay, this is a call to arms. This is call to action for me, Karen.
Clinton: ah Yeah, I'll be completely honest. it was It was, again, protect me, protect my family. I'm in a position that most aren't.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: I can...
Karen Seinor: Well, at the at the end of the day, we have to take care of ourselves first and our family before we can do anything, you know, for the community. It's a basic thing, isn't it?
Clinton: ye Yeah, yeah, yeah, 100%. And that that was it, you know, fill the cup, pour from a full cup. But, you know, my motivation was, okay, we need to you need to lock in. We need to secure food for our family. And then, and oh, don't get me wrong, my vision was always abundance. My vision was always and the community.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, yeah, I understand that.
Clinton: because during that period community was very strong, you know, like the, the yeah, it was it was great to be honest.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: It was fracturing for some and it was very adhesive for others. And for me, it was very adhesive, which I'm very grateful for.
Karen Seinor: Mm hmm.
Clinton: But my goal was sovereignty. I was like, I've got to be food sovereign, energy sovereign, money sovereign. I'm like, I'm unplugging, I'm going to build my principality out here and, you know, put up the walls.
Karen Seinor: I'm hearing you.
Clinton: Yeah, me me and mine will be okay.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And if anyone else wants to come, you bring your guns and your gold, we'll be okay.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: But it's you know that's very reactive.
Karen Seinor: ah ah
Clinton: I did mention that I can be reactive sometimes.
Karen Seinor: yeah you know
Clinton: So, yes, the writing was on the wall then. And then again now, like it just depends on, like how far-fetched you want to get in conspiracy. But the more centralised food becomes, the more reliant the masses become on that centralised food system, the harder it is for those people to be able to do what we have done or what we spoke about in being sovereign.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: You will not have a choice because if there's no potatoes and there's no carrots and there's only hyper-palatable bloody crunchy chris crickets in the shop, like what option do you have?
Clinton: And you like you said, you look around, um not so much in the, I'm looking in my store, even the supermarket, it's all very glitzy.
Karen Seinor: Oh,
Clinton: But when you actually drive it out into the bush or out into the farmland or you do the trip to Melbourne the trip to Sydney, you know, like the the land is stretched. Farmers are struggling. Primary producers are struggling. I, know,
Clinton: i you know migration population growth globally, not just here in the country. Like there's pressure on our food systems and they need to be preserved. But I use the term centralized versus decentralized.
Clinton: And ah I believe again, for thriving, healthy communities on every scale, in every aspect, decentralization is what is going to preserve and help these communities thrive.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. Mm.
Clinton: So, you know, a thriving food community is about many local growers supporting a local base of conscious consumers, conscious food, those that are energetically aligned and values aligned.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: That is the future and one that's going to be sustainable, one that's going to be, I'm going use the word profitable, impactful, one that's going to last, one that people will see value in because
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: that's just how it's meant to be sorry we've inevitability the more decentral and sorry the more centralized that the food systems has become the more likely they are to collapse because um it's just that's not a sustainable model you can't have just one wheat grower in australia growing all the wheat for all the processed bread because what happens if there's a flood or a fire or a drought or a
Karen Seinor: yeah
Karen Seinor: and Exactly.
Clinton: You know, like all of a sudden they can't drive trucks anymore and we've got to wait 10 years for electric trucks. Like, who knows, you know?
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So it starts in your own backyard. It starts with food swabs. It starts with going to your local organic grocery store. It starts with going to your fast market.
Karen Seinor: yet
Clinton: It starts with looking online on where these local food outlets and local food systems are operating and how can you be a part of that to secure your food future, your food integrity, your health future and your sovereignty into the future.
Clinton: There you go.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: There's a red but yeah, it's not being impressed.
Karen Seinor: That was beautiful. Thank you. And what certainly not what I expected, and that's absolutely fine. It's so interesting to hear you talk about that. And really what we're but my take on that is, you know, food, when we have when we've got um some power, <unk>s it's a power issue really, isn't it? Food is required for life.
Karen Seinor: And if we get too far removed from that, we've lost our power.
Clinton: Yep. Yeah, absolutely.
Karen Seinor: basically.
Clinton: Absolutely.
Karen Seinor: yeah All right, let's segue because I'm just aware of the time and I know you're a busy person. um You're spinning a lot of plates. um so you run, and i've I've heard about this from somebody I know, um who's been to one of your men's groups, and it sounded I mean, nothing was really disclosed, but I could see from the look on his face and the way he held his body that it was a really wonderful experience for him. And I don't think that there's that many men in the community who are working in the way that you do.
Karen Seinor: I'd love to hear you speak about this.
Clinton: Yep. Awesome. Awesome. I love the opportunity to speak about it, Karen. I have through through that journey, through that, you know, the 2020s and prior to self-development, spirituality, my own healing journey,
Clinton: that period like 2021, 2022, I found myself as a sounding board for many, on many levels.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: there's a lot of fear, a lot of loneliness and my mum took her own life through suicide. Um, so that was, um, something that I, that was my crisis.
Karen Seinor: one
Clinton: That was the grief that I had to work through. um
Karen Seinor: Oh, wow.
Clinton: and still that's, it's okay.
Karen Seinor: I'm so sorry to hear that.
Clinton: Um, and I'm still working through that, but that, I worked very hard to maintain my my sanity, my connection to God, my presence, to heal.
Clinton: And I learned so much that I can't just keep that to myself.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: I can't just keep that to myself because I see many men, many women too, um but you know I haven't been put on this earth to help everybody.
Karen Seinor: That's right. And can I say that it isn't... You know, being a woman, a middle-aged, a certain age woman, I mean, that's part of our role as women.
Karen Seinor: We learn how to do that nurturing thing. But for men, from my perspective, there's been a massive um shift in the expectation on men and how they're supported.
Clinton: you
Karen Seinor: So, sorry, you go on.
Clinton: Oh, well, you just, in you nailed it in terms of like a generational
Karen Seinor: go
Clinton: space that we're in, you know, like, like I grew up in the eighties and nineties as a kid, but you know single parent, um, but you know, like my dad didn't have the capacity to be a parent.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: ye
Clinton: Um, so, you know, I've had to work through that and I don't want my children to go through that, but i'm not I'm not individual, you know, I'm not unique in that story.
Clinton: mean Men, my my vintage, you know, I read a book called the new manhood, Steve Biddle. And I read many, many books, I'm always reading, but just statistics, it was like, I think maybe 5%, he just, and again, I'm i'm just gonna doctor these numbers, but it's like 5%, but he starts at the back and it's like, he's got a group of 100 men that are there for one of his workshops, okay?
Karen Seinor: Yeah, that's okay. Mm-hmm.
Clinton: and And basically, long story short, he's a writer, he's a psychologist, and he runs workshops for parents. But anyway, this is specific about men and and healing men and father-son relationships.
Clinton: Anyway, there's 100 men in the room, And 50% of them don't have anything to do with their father. They haven't talked for years, um put me in that category. I mean, I have spoken to him, but you do not mean in reality, nothing to do with him.
Clinton: I think was like, what was it? 40% have a duty to their father, but don't have a connection or relationship with their father.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: 5% have a relationship with their father, but it's...
Clinton: It's not deep or, you know, they've worked through it or something. I can't remember.
Karen Seinor: Our
Clinton: And then the final 5% actually have a father that is their male role model and is the one that they go to that they, you know, is what you would imagine the ideal masculine role model bit.
Karen Seinor: hopes and dreams.
Clinton: Yes. You know, like what all young boys want is the dad that says, you're doing a good job. This is how I will do with it the next time. I love you. I'm proud of you. Keep going, son. Next time you need help, come to me, you know. And so just that figure alone, 95% of men grew up without a male role model that empowered them to be healthy, masculine, empowered them to be able to, you know, through relationships as well, teach them how to nurture a woman and, ah you know,
Karen Seinor: in
Clinton: honour their own feminine and the femininity within the home and how do they support that, you know, and I think that is the most important thing within any relationship is, you know, understanding the polarity and where you are and where your partner is at any given time and and that comes with self-awareness, it comes with work, you know, but that's because we haven't been taught, you know, and by we, again, I'm throwing men in a bucket
Karen Seinor: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Clinton: Most men haven't been taught, and even the 5% that had those healthy role models may not have been specifically taught or used the language that I'm using, but they were led in a way that they have evolved to be healthy, masculine men that are going to do the same for their kids and their community and but however they show up in the world.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, yeah.
Clinton: um So this is huge. And for me, I am a masculine guy. um i like to...
Clinton: lead I like to create, I like to build, I like to think programmatically and linearly. And I have a beautiful woman that balances that out and then also causes stress and friction in my life.
Clinton: But that's, it's it's its said sensational.
Karen Seinor: um sounds like a normal life, Clint.
Clinton: Yeah, absolutely. It's so beautiful, but I'm very aware of her and she's very aware of me. And it's a constant, you know, evolution of ourselves and how we can be better partners because understanding that it impacts my kids and other people's kids. so I've just done lots of work in how I can be ah good dad, a good father, a good husband, a good role model in the community.
Clinton: And without going too far, i I have this beautiful space where men can unplug and be embraced by the feminine. As I mentioned earlier, spending time in nature in the bush with your shoes off is like a warm hug from a woman, but it's it's the mother, it's not the wife, it's not their mother, so there won't be any resentment towards her or those words that come up when someone says, oh, your mum, how's your relationship with your mum?
Karen Seinor: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Karen Seinor: you
Clinton: So, yes, I have this space and we have built a series of workshops where my goal is to help men in a nutshell, find out more about themselves pretty simply to encourage them to get out of their comfort zone because just so many men are, going back to what you said earlier about those those role models, is that I think, you know, my father was not just physically but emotionally unavailable. So you have to figure this stuff out in your teens and 20s, which is not good for me, not good for those people that I heard along the way.
Clinton: um So what a lot of men do, again, their only role model was provide or work. And so a lot of men that I'm working with now, they're providers. They work their ass off. They bring home the money. They pay the mortgage. And that's how they show love because that's how they were shown love. But one of my things that I try and get them to understand is that, you know, you are more than your work.
Clinton: You are more than you're providing, you know, and you need to lean into that to realise that, you know, your healthy expression of your love and your language and your emotions and your feelings is what your family needs.
Clinton: So I help men compartmentalize some of that. I help them recognize some of that within side them, not through conversation, through workshops, because men work, we do the work.
Karen Seinor: Yes.
Clinton: we We do have circle and i don't I'm not a woman, So I've never been to a woman's circle, but would assume it would be very different because you guys would feel very safe and being vulnerable and being able to express.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: that's what That's what a man's role is for his woman is to create a space where she feels safe to be her emotional self. We don't need to understand what's going on in there because we never can because we are from Mars and you guys are from Venus.
Karen Seinor: That's right. You don't want to. You don't want to.
Clinton: i No, no, we just need to build a harbour for you to like rock around and create some waves and some splashes and
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And so again, just getting men to do workshops so they can peel some of those layers back, recognize their patterns in themselves, and then try and empower them with some practices that they can take home around anger, around love, around vulnerability, around communication and expression, and then also some somatic stuff as well. So I get them to move that energy through their body. Because a man...
Clinton: feels emotion in his body, but he can't necessarily express that emotion. So the somatic work is really powerful as well because
Karen Seinor: And that makes sense because it's a different brain.
Clinton: it is the left and the right, you know, absolutely. Absolutely. So, you know, we feel like ah like That's the best way I can describe it. Let's just say anger is like my forehead hurts and I'm seeing red, you know, whereas if I were to say, oh, Karen, are you angry?
Clinton: Then you would be able to articulate what that sensation is and what you're angry at.
Karen Seinor: Hmm. Yeah.
Clinton: um Whereas a man, yeah yes, whereas a man is taught to to suppress generally by example and then not process it, push that down bottle that down and you hold that in because you don't express yourself in a way that shows emotion because if you show emotion you show weakness and you're not weak you're a man you're meant to be strong um so yes and ah don't like giving away too much in terms of our workshops but that's what we do we we work really hard we build trust then we peel them back and break them down
Karen Seinor: And all the little details involved.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: No, no, that's fine.
Clinton: chew them up and spit them back out and send them back out into the world. um Hopefully a little bit lighter emotionally and spiritually and then also a little bit more connected because so the workshops that we do are quite intense and the goal is to build a brotherhood, build a community of men that are doing the work and showing up for themselves, for their for their community and then also building a community.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Mm-hmm.
Clinton: So we you know we all stay in touch and we catch up regularly It's been incredible Karen, something i'm very proud of. And that's something that brings me a lot of joy, lot of pain, a lot of love and a lot of reward. And yeah, it's really cool to be able to work with men and and see them grow and do things that they probably would never have thought they would or could do.
Karen Seinor: I'm so happy to hear that. it's i I'm actually a trained therapist and I've worked in that space for a long time. And the emptiness of the space for men receiving support has been a ah personal pain point for me because,
Karen Seinor: um yeah, it's men... I mean, I've worked with a lot of men actually over the years, but it's a different way of operating.
Karen Seinor: So what you're talking about is definitely the building of brotherhood and it's a completely different way of doing things and it's perfect. It's exactly what we need. And like you said, you know, four women, women I'm so basic.
Karen Seinor: I am so basically and an inappropriate, Clint, because I think about chickens and I so often will use this very inappropriate story with my clients if I'm doing um particularly working with a woman who's got a problem with her man and I'll say, it's all about chooks.
Karen Seinor: You know, when you look at chickens, they think that the rooster's doing basically nothing except wandering around looking gorgeous But when he's not there, she has to start watching out for that big bird that's come going to come and get her and she can't do her chicken work and so the egg production drops.
Clinton: yeah
Karen Seinor: And that's real thing. We all know that's true. So um we need our men to we need our men to actually be themselves so that the women in our community can actually...
Karen Seinor: ah
Karen Seinor: but For people who are listening to this, somebody's trying to get into Clint's office and he's holding his hand up. It's quite good.
Clinton: ah and And I agree just totally totally with you, Karen. It's exactly right because the the risks, again, in modern relationships is a cause of that because when a woman feels the need to step into her masculinity, then what happens?
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: Her femininity is drawn out of her and it's replaced.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: So, you know, like you said, like the chicken is a great example because she's not feeling safe to be hen, so she can't be a hen.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And so in the home or in the modern life, it's like the woman feels like, and again, this is part of the fracturing of society and the modern family the or the the traditional family unit
Karen Seinor: That's right.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Mm-hmm.
Clinton: Again, by design, I don't know, but you know, it's dividing, whatever, but yes, the woman and the man, so the man is now stepping into his feminine to support this space, which i' am guilty of, you know, like I have to be the gentle parent and the confidant and the bloody emotional counselor.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: And again, at the end like I said, like you just said, my wife doesn't need me. She needs me to be the rooster.
Karen Seinor: Exactly.
Clinton: Not, you know, just strutting around, but
Karen Seinor: but But because of the way society has groomed us, um as women, we sometimes don't know that.
Clinton: yes.
Karen Seinor: I'll often say to women, you don't need a guy who to, um you know, tell you you look beautiful.
Clinton: Yes.
Karen Seinor: That's what your girlfriends are for.
Clinton: Yeah.
Karen Seinor: Do you know what I mean? oh not That's not the right example, but that's what girlfriends are for.
Clinton: Yeah, 100%. And so again, just agree with you. And same with a brotherhood, a bunch of good, positive, influential mates. My wife, and and I love this one too, if I just am the rooster, like my flock of hands, my wife doesn't want me to come home and go, babe, poor business, I'm struggling.
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: i't you know She wants me to come home and go, on top of put it sorted, babe.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: You just dance your flow and surrender to the moon and you know you just make some hard work and you just enjoy being you and everything will be okay. And then when you get to the mates, it's like, okay, boys, I have a problem.
Clinton: what solution do you suggest we look at this so we can fix it because I don't want to be bringing this home to my wife. Again, that's in its most simplest form and it goes, you said vice versa again, like my wife, when she's emotional, what does she need from me?
Karen Seinor: Yeah.
Clinton: She just needs to feel held and safe. When she wants advice for the way that she feels, she'll go to her mum, her sisters or a group of girlfriends because she doesn't want me and my pragmatic and masculine approach to give her direct answer and say, maybe if you just do this, then this will fix this and everything will be all right.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: that is that the
Karen Seinor: until Until she does need that and when she does need that, she will come to you.
Clinton: Yeah, and she'll probably ask me directly instead of, you know, me trying to read between the lines.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, that's right.
Clinton: That all takes practice. But um
Karen Seinor: You and I could talk forever but i know I'm watching the time and I'm thinking i need to let you get back to business.
Clinton: it's all good.
Karen Seinor: Yeah. It has been absolutely super interesting and we've covered a lot more than I had even hoped for. I'm really grateful for your time and your conversation.
Clinton: Pleasure.
Karen Seinor: um Is there anything that you want to sort of share? Like obviously tell us where the the shop is so that people listening can come and find you.
Clinton: Okay. Yep. Cool. we We are, yes, Bricks and Mortis. We are a real life shop in a real life location. Corner of Kiowa Street and Uragong Street in South Albury. 539 Uragong Street, South Albury.
Clinton: Our email, no, sorry, our website, www.almarorganics.com.au if you to have a the website.
Karen Seinor: yeah
Clinton: um Open Monday to Saturday. You can find Alma Organics on Instagram. You can,
Karen Seinor: I'll actually put the links in the little blurb so that people can click on that and come to you too.
Clinton: um Yeah, perfect.
Karen Seinor: Okay.
Clinton: Yeah, Alma Organics. Also my Alma Life, which is my personal brand as well. So that pushes more to men's health and psychology and support and mindset and wellness and my seven pillars to the modern man's healthy life.
Karen Seinor: Perfect.
Clinton: So it's a little bit different and a little bit more.
Karen Seinor: Okay. Have I got those links, Clint?
Clinton: I'm not too sure, Karen, but if not, I'll definitely send them to you or vice versa.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, okay.
Clinton: If you send me an email, I'll get it through you ASAP.
Karen Seinor: Yeah, okay.
Clinton: But yeah, I appreciate the time. As I mentioned to you, I think, you know, when we chatted the other day, if anyone wants to sit down and listen to me talk about myself for an hour, more than happy to, because most of the time I'm just pottering around in the fields, pondering my own thoughts.
Clinton: So, yeah, I'm very grateful.
Karen Seinor: yeah Yeah, I really appreciate it. Look, we'll wrap it there and thank you so much. And um thank you for doing the work that you're doing, not just with the men, not just with the food, but also holding this intention. i think your why is very powerful.
Karen Seinor: And um let there be more of it, I say.
Clinton: Thank you, Karen. Appreciate it. Thank you very much.
Karen Seinor: All right.
Clinton: um i best be off. There's a few people lining up, so I'm not too sure what I'm in trouble for, but I'm about to find out.
Karen Seinor: Okay. All right, hang on a second.
