Transcript
Speaker: Bonjour and welcome to Cibette, the podcast about psychology, philosophy, and minor grievances which shall not stand.
Speaker: I'm your host, Sophia, and this is Greg.
Speaker: Hello, Sophia.
Speaker: How are you on this fine day?
Speaker: I'm doing well.
Speaker: How are you?
Speaker: Fantastical.
Speaker: Good to hear.
Speaker: Today on the show, I'm going to throw it back to basically what the core of the podcast was and kind of the reason...
Speaker: behind it even though we did cover it in like two episodes I feel like now we can delve into like the other sides of it because it's kind of a backstory every week when I'm trying to decide what to talk about or what we should talk about on this podcast I go through my notes which I have developed since last year and a lot of them are from like
Speaker: you know, months ago.
Speaker: So when I look at them, I'm kind of just like, what was I, what was I talking about?
Speaker: Like, what was I trying to get at here?
Speaker: So I look at these like one liners and try to deconstruct my own mind.
Speaker: And then I was like, I saw one, which I think I mentioned before.
Speaker: And it was called life is so silly.
Speaker: And I was like, there's no way to that.
Speaker: I mean, I was looking at it.
Speaker: I was like, well, what did I mean?
Speaker: That's so vague.
Speaker: I could mean so many things by that.
Speaker: But then,
Speaker: I feel like that was kind of just what I was getting at with this entire podcast was just like all these thoughts.
Speaker: They have weight.
Speaker: They have meaning.
Speaker: But at the end of the day, in like the nicest way possible, they don't have to mean that much.
Speaker: Like they don't have to be like something that weighs on like your soul or anything.
Speaker: It's just...
Speaker: thoughts that you have you give them space you allow yourself to think about them but also at the end of the day you're like okay that's what I think about it I can move on with my life so when I decided on this week's episode I was kind of like okay it's the end of the year I feel like we could do something a little light-hearted just reflect on the past year and like
Speaker: everything that's gone on in our lives in general, and then go into the next year with like a positive outlook or at least an outlook, take what you will from it with how to go into like what you want next year.
Speaker: And also it's kind of celebrating the fact that Greg was able to post on multiple platforms, this podcast.
Speaker: So I, in celebration of that was thinking we could probably talk about, like I said, the core, the podcast,
Speaker: And yeah, so this is a hopefully lighthearted discussion about the quote, life is so silly.
Speaker: But yeah.
Speaker: Find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google Podcasts, or wherever you find your podcasts.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I don't know where other people listen to podcasts.
Speaker: I personally use Spotify, but wherever it's there.
Speaker: Thank you, Gray.
Speaker: And, oh, another thought process that I have every week when I try to decide what to talk about is I kind of take what's going on in my, like, regular life and try to think about, like, what... I mean, I actually think about these things, to be honest.
Speaker: Like, things happen to me in real life, and I just, like, have this random thought about them, and I'm like, I could talk about this for 40 minutes, which I don't really know if that's, like, a healthy thing, but it happens.
Speaker: And recently, I mean, a lot of...
Speaker: The things that I think about recently have been about my personal move to New York because we started this podcast after I moved and that's a very significant move in my life.
Speaker: So a lot of the reflections I have are like based on that and the people that I've met here.
Speaker: That's something I've realized about New Yorkers, which I don't think is very specific to New Yorkers in general.
Speaker: It's specific to like anyone, but I've noticed it especially here is that they really like to party.
Speaker: Like it doesn't matter what it is.
Speaker: It could be like a watch party for a documentary or like a new TV show finale that's coming out or just literally anything.
Speaker: They'll just find a reason to like host a party or go to a party.
Speaker: And I think partially that's also because the city is so vast and big, like you have to kind of build your own community.
Speaker: So it's just like that active act of trying to bring people together for any reason, really.
Speaker: So I was thinking about that and the things that I've experienced or like gone to here and also just like in the spirit of Christmas in general, when I was like buying a gift, for example, for like my work holiday party, I was like,
Speaker: are they gonna, they're gonna like anything.
Speaker: Like, of course it's just like a free gift, but I was like in my mind, like going to these Christmas markets, very stressed, like, oh, it has to be a really good gift because I really stress out when I give out gifts.
Speaker: And the overarching theme of all of these things is just like, it doesn't matter.
Speaker: Like at the end of the day, it's a very wholesome activity to have and everyone's gonna have a good time at the end of the day.
Speaker: Why put pressure on yourself?
Speaker: Why really try, but,
Speaker: I feel like in the same vein, because it doesn't really matter, there's no reason not to try.
Speaker: So like I could get someone like a soap, but, and there's nothing wrong with soap.
Speaker: I mean, I think soap is really useful.
Speaker: And like personally, as a receiver, I would love soap or like anything in general, but like when I'm giving a gift, for some reason, I put so much more pressure on myself and I'm like, this has to be the very best gift that they've ever received in their lives.
Speaker: And
Speaker: That kind of ties into the whole meaning of this podcast episode, which is, in my opinion, positive nihilism.
Speaker: Which, okay, so nihilism essentially is kind of like a philosophical belief that, like, life is meaningless.
Speaker: Also, disclaimer, I'm not a philosopher, so if I'm getting anything wrong, don't attack me.
Speaker: It's just that this is what I've drawn from, like, what I've read over the past years.
Speaker: couple years of my life about this but basically it's like life is meaningless and I think a lot of philosophers who originally had this belief um people kind of viewed them as like killjoys like you know they're like very sad they don't really participate in life because they think it's meaningless like they're about to I don't know you like you just picture a very like a dejected person because they have this like
Speaker: existential dread about them.
Speaker: And I think that's like, I mean, there are people like that and there is, life is, I mean, very sad.
Speaker: So like, if anyone feels that way, it's completely understandable to be honest.
Speaker: But I think it can also be taken in like a positive way.
Speaker: Like life inherently, I feel like it's just a tiny little bit, like our personal lives are just a tiny little bit meaningless just because I feel like we are very small
Speaker: in a vast universe and even like a vast like world of different people with diverse experiences who have their own problems.
Speaker: And I think we all view our personal problems as like the center of the universe.
Speaker: But I realized even like here, especially I think in New York, I mean, I'm not like, I'm not like,
Speaker: how do I phrase this?
Speaker: Like, I also think I'm the center of the universe.
Speaker: Like, I feel like my problems are very big to myself, but like coming here has been a very humbling experience because I feel like everyone has that kind of like, they view themselves as like the main character almost.
Speaker: It's like, they have their own problems.
Speaker: They have their own struggles and things that they're achieving.
Speaker: And just realizing like the grand scope of like everyone's
Speaker: identities and how different people live their lives, I've realized that like, oh, I'm actually very small.
Speaker: Like all the things that I've experienced and want to experience in life are just my own little corner of the world when there's so many different corners of the world to have.
Speaker: So I think that could be a very, how to say, like it can be very, like you can view it in a sad way.
Speaker: Like you could be like, oh,
Speaker: does anything really matter if I'm really this small?
Speaker: Like I can't really make an impact.
Speaker: I can't leave like a lasting legacy.
Speaker: There's so many other people doing the same things that I want to, for example, like it can be very existentially dreadful.
Speaker: But I also think in a positive way, which can be hard to get to.
Speaker: And I also think you have to get through that kind of existential dread phase before you get to this more positive phase.
Speaker: Um, but I think that it can be taken as like, oh, I am small and nothing that I do really matters, but because nothing really matters, that means you can do anything.
Speaker: Like there's no reason for you not to do anything or not to try at the things that you want to try at because like, at the end of the day, there's no real consequences.
Speaker: I mean, of course, um,
Speaker: You could be doing something really bad.
Speaker: Like you could use this to justify really bad behavior.
Speaker: But I think if it's just like you thinking about what you want to do, like if it's really small, like pursuing something different, start doing something that scares you, like at the end of the day, it's like, is anyone going to really remember it?
Speaker: No, but you're going to probably remember how you feel once you do it.
Speaker: And I feel like that could be very empowering.
Speaker: So...
Speaker: Like I said before, you can feel hopeless about nothing mattering, but also it can be a nice, like, and you can kind of feel like anonymous in that also, and that like, okay, nothing matters, but that's okay.
Speaker: I don't know if that makes sense, but it's also kind of like taking a step back, especially like with imposter syndrome, I think.
Speaker: I mean, throwing it back to, I think...
Speaker: everything's going to come back to New York.
Speaker: And I don't want to be like that person that's like talks about like, Oh, I moved to New York, you know, but I feel like a lot of these things I realized, especially coming to New York.
Speaker: Um, cause I was talking with my roommates recently because they go to Columbia university and a lot of people at Columbia have done a lot of things with their lives and they're very young.
Speaker: And you can be like in a cohort with people who are like literally like
Speaker: government officials or people who have won worldwide pageants, for example.
Speaker: And once you're in that environment, it's easy to feel very discouraged to be like, what have I done?
Speaker: What do I deserve?
Speaker: Do I deserve to be here really?
Speaker: But something that struck me as like pretty intriguing was when my roommate was like, it's kind of also nice to not be the smartest person in the room.
Speaker: It's like, there are these other people who are very significant and who are very, who have done like amazing things in their lives.
Speaker: But
Speaker: It's also nice to just like talk to them as like people and to like understand where they're at, how they even got there, what caused them to like want to pursue that path and just like learn from them.
Speaker: And you can get a lot from just like being like taking that more like humble learning approach.
Speaker: And I was like, that made me feel a lot better about myself also because I have a lot of imposter syndrome about being here as well.
Speaker: And I was like, oh,
Speaker: I think as long as you, like I said, you just like take a more humble approach, like a more listener approach.
Speaker: It's hard to say how to phrase this, but I feel like in general I take, I like, I'm the one who doesn't talk as much.
Speaker: I kind of let the other person do the talking, but in a way that has helped me a lot because I
Speaker: It even helps me with like this podcast is just like figure like when other people tell me things, I'm like, actually, that's a really good thought.
Speaker: Let me think about this and dissect it.
Speaker: So just like the ability to realize again that it sounds so bad, but like you are insignificant and just like owning that.
Speaker: I mean, you're not insignificant, but also in some ways, like you will not be the most significant person in the room and just understanding and being willing to learn.
Speaker: And also putting people less on a pedestal of like, oh my God, you, you did this, you're this type of person, you've achieved so much and just being like, oh, how did you get there?
Speaker: Like, why, what is your story?
Speaker: Because I've realized that a lot of people have very similar stories.
Speaker: Also, it's like,
Speaker: Everyone has a family that they came from.
Speaker: Everyone has experiences that they've had with like their childhood, everyone's experience, you know, growing up.
Speaker: Like, it's just interesting to see how like those very common experiences are like almost remixed in different ways with different people, but like they all are at the core very similar.
Speaker: And there's always something that you can like find a commonality in with someone else.
Speaker: And I think that's,
Speaker: It's really nice.
Speaker: Like, even though this person may be very different from me, we are similar in some ways.
Speaker: And that makes the world a little less big also.
Speaker: That kind of strayed from my rant.
Speaker: I don't know if it did.
Speaker: Sometimes I just talk, but I don't know where I'm going.
Speaker: Yeah, true.
Speaker: So I guess when you're talking to someone, you know, in your new circle of friends who you would consider to be really accomplished.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Does that...
Speaker: Do you extrapolate kind of that philosophy that you have for yourself in that everything that you have done feels meaningless and then extrapolate that to somebody who has, you know, like you said, won a pageant or done something that you feel is significant?
Speaker: Do you think they feel the same way?
Speaker: Like it's a drop in the bucket?
Speaker: What do you mean like feel the same way?
Speaker: Like when they're talking to someone else who they feel like has done something really significant?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: or just of themselves, right?
Speaker: So the meaning that you have in your accomplishments, whether it's learning how to play the violin or whatever it might be, learning how to play the drums, that's a significant thing in your life that has meaning to your life, but it doesn't really have meaning to anybody else.
Speaker: So for the person that you're talking with, do you think they feel the same way?
Speaker: I mean, I've realized that people are very humble.
Speaker: Like, they'll be like, yeah, I did this, but it didn't really feel... Like, it doesn't feel...
Speaker: It's hard to say.
Speaker: I guess in my mind, when I picture people who do these kinds of things, I'm like, oh, they're very self-aware of what they're doing.
Speaker: They know what they want and they go after it.
Speaker: And I feel like that kind of warrants a sense of confidence about it.
Speaker: But in reality, I mean, they don't really talk about it.
Speaker: It's not like they're showing off or anything about everything that they do.
Speaker: And obviously, I mean, they wouldn't do that.
Speaker: I feel like most people who are like...
Speaker: quote unquote good people wouldn't like just randomly show off everything that they do or like be a walking resume.
Speaker: But I think in my mind, because like I have so many preconceived notions also about like what people from New York are like or like what people who go to an Ivy League school are like.
Speaker: But something I've realized here is that, you know, everyone's literally just a person.
Speaker: Everyone's just doing their best.
Speaker: And some people like in their lives have just gone.
Speaker: gotten to be in the right place at the right time or they've experienced like something that like led to them wanting to pursue a different career path or they just I mean at the end of the day they work really hard and they're very dedicated at what they wanted to do and that of course got them to the place that they are today and like granted there also are people who are very like
Speaker: I don't want to say privileged, but they, I don't know.
Speaker: Like money definitely gets you a lot of places.
Speaker: And I think when the cost of tuition is so high at these universities, there definitely kind of breeds like a certain type of person who goes there.
Speaker: But for the most part, I realized that the people I've met here, like I said, very humble, very down to earth.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Like going back to your point, they, when they're talking about their own experiences, like when I think of my own experiences, not really meaning that much to someone else other than me, I think they don't really view it as, I mean, I don't know.
Speaker: Obviously I can't read it to their brains, but when they're talking about it, they don't see it or they don't seem like they're like very self, like full of themselves, you know?
Speaker: Self-aggrandizing.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Like they're not,
Speaker: They're not assholes about it.
Speaker: Like, it's just like, you know, this is something that they did.
Speaker: Obviously, they're proud of it, but it's not like they're going to make someone else feel bad for it, I think is what I'm trying to say.
Speaker: Oh, yeah, totally.
Speaker: I think, you know, I think there's the notion that...
Speaker: when we're talking about privilege, and I think that's maybe kind of what you're dancing around a little bit with, with some of the folks that you're running into, ultimately privilege is access or access is privilege.
Speaker: So like whether you're talking about money or being in the right place at the right time, I think, you know, everybody that you're talking to is working hard or however you want to put it, but it's ultimately being in a place where you can act on that.
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
Speaker: And I feel like
Speaker: Like I feel like being here, like when I think about like students who maybe like grew up or went to the school system here and then like went to like the theater school of like a New York school, for example, it's like, wow, they've just had these opportunities.
Speaker: Like they could just like, the UN is in their backyard.
Speaker: Like they could have just volunteered at Mount Sinai Hospital, for example.
Speaker: Like they have so many, or like Billboard Music, for example.
Speaker: Like they had so many major companies or organizations or like opportunities to discover what they wanted to do.
Speaker: And that's like insane to me.
Speaker: Like, it's just like, you know how you can't like determine where you're born and some people just like have a natural leg up in the competition just because they were born somewhere else.
Speaker: That's kind of how I thought like New Yorkers would be.
Speaker: But like, granted, also, a lot of the people that I've met, apart from like the people I work with are transplants, like they don't, they're not growing up here.
Speaker: So I think it's different in that lens.
Speaker: But
Speaker: there is this like overarching like theme or like not theme, but just like something that I realized with a lot of the people that I've met who are transplants is that there's this kind of like common, just sense of like hardworkingness.
Speaker: Like they, everyone I think come here, comes here to like make the most of those opportunities.
Speaker: And sure.
Speaker: There's a re there's a reason everybody went there, right?
Speaker: There's a reason everybody has come to this place and typically, maybe not typically,
Speaker: in the way that I contextualize it in my mind, you're there because of what is available.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I think so.
Speaker: But I think also to like get here, they had to work very hard because I mean, it's not a very accessible city.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't really know where I was going with that though.
Speaker: Well, maybe to bring it back around to nihilism and kind of the idea that, you know, if we're coming from everything is meaningless ultimately.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Then functionally though, that means that whatever meaning we find is a, is subject to context and it's subject to scope.
Speaker: Right?
Speaker: So what's meaningful to your roommates is not meaningful to anybody outside of your apartment, but.
Speaker: your life will be greatly impacted by what happens to the people that are that close to you.
Speaker: And so it has really great meaning if you're making it sick, for example.
Speaker: But, you know, if they're sick for a day, doesn't matter to anybody outside of the apartment.
Speaker: It means for you, your life will be changed in some way.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, definitely.
Speaker: I mean,
Speaker: This is kind of like a less psychological, but more, like you said, getting sick.
Speaker: Actually, I'm not going to talk about when we got a COVID scan in our house.
Speaker: I don't think maybe being sick was a bad example.
Speaker: That was just what I thought about the top of my head.
Speaker: No, but it's true.
Speaker: Because my kids have the sniffles right now.
Speaker: And so it changes the dynamic of the household, right?
Speaker: I guess maybe to speak about this podcast a little bit,
Speaker: I think whether we're talking about, so I guess before you moved, you know, as kind of context for our listeners, there was like a month before you moved that personally I got kind of on a kick and I kind of can, I think we're kind of creative cohorts in a way.
Speaker: And when we're talking about the things that we are doing personally for me doing this podcast,
Speaker: ultimately we could say is meaningless, right?
Speaker: But if we're talking about what it means to us personally, I think on some level of meaning, we're getting something out of this and we would be poorer for not having done it.
Speaker: And what I was going to say is kind of the month before you moved, I got on a kick where I was trying to write basically a song a night.
Speaker: And that meant nothing to anybody outside of my basement other than I kept sending you songs every night.
Speaker: That sense of accountability was basically like a sense of purpose.
Speaker: And it got me to the point, I guess, to back up.
Speaker: So I think a lot about Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
Speaker: And I guess I probably bring it up too much.
Speaker: But the basic idea of that is at the very bottom rung of existence, you have like the physiological stuff where it's like food, water, shelter.
Speaker: If you don't have that, you can't get to anything else.
Speaker: And then the next step up is like safety.
Speaker: So like having security, having resources, having structure.
Speaker: And then the next step up is social.
Speaker: So it's like,
Speaker: having friends or having a sense of belonging or having intimacy.
Speaker: And then the level above that is like recognition and purpose.
Speaker: And that's kind of where we get to nihilism.
Speaker: And then the top of the pyramid is self-actualization, which is like the ability to explore or the ability to create or the ability to find beauty.
Speaker: And when we think about philosophical frameworks, I feel like those are there as like a step from step two to step three.
Speaker: of finding structure and then finding belonging in order to get to purpose, in order to get to creating something beautiful.
Speaker: And if we're talking about nihilism or if we're talking about purpose in the people around us or in scope around us, I think you can look at it either that we're trying to get to the top to get to what we need
Speaker: But on the other, you know, if you flip it around, we're getting those other things out of the way to get to what, to get to the top of the pyramid.
Speaker: Like, I feel like it's easy.
Speaker: I mean, especially for me.
Speaker: I mean, I can't speak for anyone else, but like, it's easy to get caught up in the weeds of just like, what does any, what does it all mean?
Speaker: What is the meaning of this?
Speaker: And like, I've gotten to the point in my life where I'm able to just be like, you know, it doesn't really matter what it means as long as like, like you said, kind of just like,
Speaker: you're able to meet like the basic needs.
Speaker: Like at the end of the day, like if you're fed, you have shelter, you are able to like provide for yourself.
Speaker: Like that's amazing.
Speaker: Like that's all really that you need.
Speaker: And like, once you start getting stuff, it's kind of like, you know, it's like that treadmill, what's it called?
Speaker: The hedonic treadmill where it's like, once you like achieve something, it's like, you're looking for something else.
Speaker: And then it's like, you choose that, but then you're like, want something else.
Speaker: But you're not like, I mean, I say you, but like,
Speaker: this hypothetical you might not apply to everyone.
Speaker: The royal you, right?
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker: In this theory, it's like you achieve something, but you're always looking for something else.
Speaker: And then as a result, you're never really truly satisfied.
Speaker: So I think it's a good reminder that as people, we have basic needs that if we're meeting them, we should definitely be grateful for that and just be appreciative of what we do have instead of looking for meaning or being so aware of
Speaker: of our consciousness that we're looking for meaning constantly because there's, I mean, there's meaning in everything.
Speaker: And just the fact that you're like doing life is meaningful.
Speaker: It doesn't have to be like a ginormous purpose or anything, but.
Speaker: Sure.
Speaker: I think it's that again, going back to scope, you know, it has great meaning to me to be able to eat in the morning.
Speaker: But with anything, the more you say, and then like, okay, you achieve this.
Speaker: And then what the farther you go with that, the more absurd you have to get.
Speaker: And that's where you, I mean, I think that's where you get to those philosophical quandaries where you're questioning what, what it all means.
Speaker: They almost have to go backwards on that.
Speaker: And then to like, come back.
Speaker: So one of the reasons that I am,
Speaker: not a particularly productive member of society right now is the game Starfield came out.
Speaker: Which if you don't know what it is, it's like a big open world space role playing video game.
Speaker: And if you follow it online, there's this really big, there's, there was this really big backlash to the game because it took
Speaker: whatever it was, 15 years to make, and people were finishing it in like, you know, 40 hours or whatever.
Speaker: But one of the themes of the game, and like without giving too much away if you actually are going to play it, if you actually like finish the story, there's like a time loop aspect that sends you back to kind of the beginning of the narrative, and then you have to kind of go through it again.
Speaker: And the players who are most vocal about how trash the game is or how short it is or that sort of thing are the same people that are on that hedonic treadmill and constantly looking to like min max and like get to the next thing and get to the next thing.
Speaker: And kind of the philosophy of the narrative of the game is like,
Speaker: it's a big universe, slow down and like take the time to notice things and like take the time to do these little small things on the side.
Speaker: And I know you talk a lot about how your interests are kind of like side quests for you.
Speaker: And I feel like that is maybe like a pushback on, you know, like hustle culture or always looking for that next thing or always looking for meaning and things when,
Speaker: Ultimately, if you take a step back and enjoy what's around you, that ends up being the meaning that you're looking for, to be sappy.
Speaker: I'm a sappy person, so yes, I agree.
Speaker: I mean, to be honest, I'm also victim.
Speaker: I'm not perfect.
Speaker: I'm also victim to hustle culture.
Speaker: I also want to achieve for absolutely no reason.
Speaker: I think it's also kind of like the fact before where it's like, you know, if you don't have to try, but you might as well try.
Speaker: Yeah, like you were saying, like I view everything as like kind of like a side quest in the video game of my life.
Speaker: It's like, I mean, for example, like playing the drums last year, which you encouraged me to do.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: That was like a lifelong goal or not.
Speaker: I would say a lifelong goal, but I wanted to do it for a really long time.
Speaker: But like, I don't know, I had these kind of like preconceived notions where I was like, oh, you know, that's kind of like that's like what the guys do.
Speaker: I don't know why I thought this for some reason, but I just didn't feel like
Speaker: represented in the field.
Speaker: And so I just, the field, I said the field of music.
Speaker: So I just feel, I felt like I couldn't do it, but then you left drumsticks on my desk one day and I was like, I need to make use of these.
Speaker: So I found an instructor who was a girl.
Speaker: She is a girl, a woman.
Speaker: And I think it was very empowering for me to learn how to like, you know, do something which I viewed as like a very male dominated activity.
Speaker: learn it for myself and my own spin on it and learn it from someone who is a woman, like someone who probably went through like those same plots and, um, is now, or like was a touring member of a band and now teaches and stuff.
Speaker: Like I thought that was a very eyeopening experience and like going back, like that doesn't really mean anything to anyone.
Speaker: But like for me personally, I feel like it helped me a lot with being like, Oh, like this is something I could do.
Speaker: Like I had so much, um,
Speaker: resistance in my head towards doing it because I thought it wasn't for me but once I actually did it I feel like that in itself was empowering so like like you said I feel like the meaning like stepping back the meaning of life is just like doing the things that bring you joy almost it's like the things that you feel like you want to try because at the end of the day I guess you don't really have regrets which isn't to say you should do everything that you want to do but like
Speaker: But like if you're going to do it, you should try to be good, right?
Speaker: You should try to make it the best thing that you can.
Speaker: Well, yeah.
Speaker: Well, that's kind of what I'm getting at.
Speaker: I feel like that in a way could also be kind of pressuring, at least for me, because I'm kind of an overachiever.
Speaker: So like when I want to do something, it's like it has to be perfect.
Speaker: And then that kind of stops me from doing a lot of things.
Speaker: But like in general, I think like.
Speaker: Everyone has, like, intrusive thoughts of, like, things that they want to do, but they don't do it because, I don't know, they're, like, waiting for, like, the perfect time or they just feel like it's not... I don't know.
Speaker: I really don't know what I'm trying to say here, but I think it's just, like, important to try the things that you want to do because...
Speaker: even if it doesn't work out in the end or if it's not perfect, like kind of what I was talking about with myself, where I feel pressure to make everything perfect, at least you like did it.
Speaker: And it's like, you don't have to like it at the end of the day.
Speaker: Like maybe you try out drumming and you're like, Oh, actually this isn't for me, but you wouldn't have known that if you hadn't tried it.
Speaker: So at least, you know, you tried it.
Speaker: So in the whole grand scheme of like, you know, nihilism, it's like,
Speaker: It doesn't mean anything.
Speaker: And it's like, if you try it and you hate it, and it's like, you could be like, oh, this is stupid.
Speaker: Like, why did I even try this if I didn't, if I wasn't gonna pursue this?
Speaker: If I wasn't like, you know, I'm gonna like do something with it.
Speaker: I think in the whole taking it back and like understanding like the meaning behind it, like enjoying kind of like the process of doing it and what it did for you.
Speaker: psychologically almost or like how it helped you try something new I think is valuable too.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So I guess insight into my life, dear listener, I grew up in a wrestling family.
Speaker: So like not like professional wrestling, but like the kind that's in the Olympics.
Speaker: um and now that i'm a grown up and i have kids uh my kids are starting to get into it um and so i coach their team and we practice in the same room as the local high school um and i have to get there like before the high school is done practicing to make sure that the room is ready to go and invite the kids in and all this stuff
Speaker: Well, uh, I came in toward the end of practice and if, if you've never participated in wrestling as a sport before, it's really difficult.
Speaker: Like it, there's a lot of endurance involved.
Speaker: There's a lot of like pressure because it's an individual sport that kind of like, if you're on, if you're in competition or if you're on the mat, like everything is focused on you.
Speaker: Like there's nowhere to hide.
Speaker: It's not like a team sport where you can kind of be part of a team.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: So there's a certain type of individual that ends up gravitating toward that type of sport.
Speaker: So I showed up to start my practice and the high school is just ending.
Speaker: And they were doing like conditioning drills where they were running and like lifting each other up and like having to do things that they're already tired.
Speaker: They've had this like two hours worth of practice.
Speaker: And then they're like trying to wring every last bit of energy out of themselves before the time is over.
Speaker: And as they're doing this, the coach is walking around the room and he said, like, you know, loud so that the whole room could hear, enjoy this process.
Speaker: Enjoy that you're here.
Speaker: Enjoy being here.
Speaker: Enjoy doing all of this stuff.
Speaker: And I've heard that before.
Speaker: Like, you know, if you're in that sport, you hear that a lot because if we're talking about the –
Speaker: recognition or the purpose behind participating in a sport like wrestling where there's no multi-million dollar deal.
Speaker: It's a pretty short shelf life as to how long you can do it because it's pretty hard on your body.
Speaker: If you aren't there because you like the suck of it,
Speaker: you're going to have like the meaning of showing up every day after school when you're, when you're a high school kid and like turning yourself inside out for two hours a day for five days a week for four months a year.
Speaker: Like you should, you shouldn't be there.
Speaker: Like your, your life will have no meaning at all, but finding the meaning and like the process and like trusting that, um, I think it's kind of going back to even like when you're drumming, like,
Speaker: Maybe you do have aspirations to like, whatever, take over for Lars Ulrich in a Metallica tribute band or something like that.
Speaker: But probably you're doing it because you want to, you want to be in that suck.
Speaker: You want to be in that learning process.
Speaker: And like the improvement is kind of the point.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Just when you're talking about that, it made me think about standing in that room and seeing all these people who are kind of working towards something that inherently has no meaning other than they're all there right then.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, I feel like it's just, I don't even know what it's called.
Speaker: Not like a superiority complex.
Speaker: You know, the idea where you have to be like the best at it.
Speaker: I guess that is a superiority complex.
Speaker: Well, superiority complex means that you are already the best, right?
Speaker: Nobody's better than you.
Speaker: I thought it was just like the thought that you're better than everyone.
Speaker: Like you go into something because you want to be like the best at everything.
Speaker: I think that's ambition.
Speaker: Oh, that's true.
Speaker: I mean, like not necessarily a bad thing, but yeah.
Speaker: Where was I going with that?
Speaker: I have such a goldfish brain where it's like sometimes...
Speaker: Sometimes you like say things and I'm like, okay.
Speaker: And then for some reason I forget how to like respond to it.
Speaker: But I think it was a good point because yeah, there's these things, there's things that we do where it doesn't really have to, I mean, I'm sure you could achieve and you could be very ambitious with the sport, but like you, at the end of the day, if you're doing anything, you're,
Speaker: it should be something that you at least slightly enjoy, especially if you spend a lot of time with it.
Speaker: I know a lot of people say this with like jobs and stuff too.
Speaker: It's like, you should at least kind of enjoy what you're doing.
Speaker: Otherwise you're going to have like a miserable eight hours of your day and it can be seen in your hobbies too.
Speaker: Cause like, I think there's a lot of hustle culture around hobbies as well, where it's like, people want that to be their identity or it has to be like their entire personality is like, I'm a drummer.
Speaker: Like I'm,
Speaker: I'm good at drumming or like, this is an example.
Speaker: Like I don't, I don't like go up and tell people I'm a drummer actually, unless very interrogated about what instruments I play.
Speaker: But like if someone were to do that, it's like, I feel like that can be very toxic because then you're like your entire goal for why you do it is like based on someone else's validation instead of like you actually enjoy it.
Speaker: Like you enjoy the process.
Speaker: Like for me, it's not necessarily I enjoy that it sucked.
Speaker: Actually, it's kind of the opposite of,
Speaker: Well, sure.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I'm not saying that it sucked, but it's the suck, right?
Speaker: Like the work of it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: But I only enjoy the work of things when I like genuinely enjoy what I'm doing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: There's a quote and I don't remember who it is.
Speaker: Bertrand Russell, maybe the quote is something like a moment enjoyed is never a moment wasted.
Speaker: And I think that kind of flies in the face of what you're talking about.
Speaker: Like, well, I may be so I think there's aside from hustle culture, there's also productivity culture.
Speaker: And like, if you're not working toward drumming to be in a band, then why are you even doing it?
Speaker: Like, I feel like that's kind of the thing.
Speaker: Or if you're going to sit in a room and talk about your innermost thoughts, why aren't you putting it on a podcast?
Speaker: Like, you know, you could be doing this and making money off of it or trying to at least.
Speaker: Yeah, I know.
Speaker: I remember like when I wanted to do graphic design, I was doing stuff on the side.
Speaker: And then I was talking to someone about this and I was like, yeah, I do like kind of like design stuff, but I don't like monetize it or anything.
Speaker: It's just like something I do for fun.
Speaker: And then they were like, oh, you should monetize it.
Speaker: And I was like, why?
Speaker: Like, I don't know.
Speaker: It would just take so much of the joy out of it because I think then I would feel a lot of pressure in like making something that
Speaker: someone else would enjoy as opposed to what I like.
Speaker: And going back to the podcast too, it's like, it's kind of nice.
Speaker: It's like nice doing this and just like putting it out there.
Speaker: And it's like not really, I mean, we can have goals.
Speaker: It's nice to have goals and just to take it seriously, obviously, like have like a whole plan behind it, but at the same time, not do it because like, at least for me, not trying to like be like NPR, like trying to like make it immediately famous and stuff.
Speaker: It's more like, you know, it's like fun.
Speaker: And then
Speaker: see where it goes, where it takes us.
Speaker: And like, at the end of the day, it's just like, it's something I enjoy doing.
Speaker: But had I had me or at least had I gone into it with the mindset of like, Oh, it has to be the greatest podcast ever.
Speaker: It has to be something that everyone listens to in the morning.
Speaker: I think I would not like it as much.
Speaker: So yeah, well, and I think it's where you put it on your rung of needs, right?
Speaker: Like, true.
Speaker: I think for us,
Speaker: we got the other things covered.
Speaker: Our livelihoods are not dependent on whether or not we get this thing out on time.
Speaker: There's a YouTuber, HBomber guy, who just put out a video about rampant plagiarism on YouTube and in the media.
Speaker: And he highlighted a couple of creators and basically, you know, where it came from was they were taking content for their channel from smaller creators who basically did it, you know, maybe because they were trying to make a living, but mostly because they were passionate about a subject.
Speaker: And they were basically lifting those things whole cloth to put into their machine that was churning out three shows a week.
Speaker: and showing how getting on that kind of pernicious train of doing this because you're trying to put content out versus trying to actually do something that matters to you gets really ugly really fast.
Speaker: And I know, maybe someday we'll turn to this as our sole means of sustenance, but I hope it never comes to that.
Speaker: Yeah, it's kind of like how, I mean, I feel like a lot of people in media or the arts say this, or even go to art school, they'll be like, they liked art before they went to art school, before it became your sole source of income, or you pressure yourself to do it in order to eventually get a job so you can get money from your art, for example, or if you're a musician, and that's your entire job.
Speaker: At some point, the passion, I mean, the passion hopefully is always there, but at some point, I feel like
Speaker: You're doing it to like sustain yourself.
Speaker: Like for example, Taylor Swift, one of my favorite musicians, but she's like, she's a business woman at the end of the day.
Speaker: Like she's a performer, she's a professional.
Speaker: Like I'm sure she started off doing it because she really liked making music, writing songs, and she probably still really enjoys it.
Speaker: But there's also like,
Speaker: the part of it where now she has to like make money off of it.
Speaker: So there's gonna be like some songs that she like caters towards what she thinks people would like to hear or like she has to make the movie or like she has to do the live stream, for example.
Speaker: And like, if you're not, I don't know, if you're not like really invested in what you're doing, I feel like it can be hard or like, I feel like that business aspect or like the aspect where you have to like make a living or if it's like, like you said, lower on your needs,
Speaker: or higher, I guess, on your needs, then I think that can kind of take away the joy of what you're doing.
Speaker: So I feel like there's a perfect storm aspect there, right?
Speaker: Like ideally, I mean, granted, maybe not ideally, because this is, again, going back to monetizing your, your passions.
Speaker: I feel like if you can't, if you can do that more power to you, like,
Speaker: I mean, Taylor Swift has been an industry mainstay since she was, whatever, 13 years old and has been writing for a major label since she was 12.
Speaker: So to some extent, I mean, A, if she went away tomorrow, she'd be fine, right?
Speaker: She's not grasping for money.
Speaker: I feel like, and again, this is totally speaking from a place of ignorance.
Speaker: I feel like at this point,
Speaker: She like, that's the fun of it for her is doing the tour and like having this big thing and being able to give hundreds of millions of dollars away to charities and the places she goes.
Speaker: Like, I feel like her, not to, not to go back to her old label, but her big machine that she has going is like that for her, that is the point.
Speaker: And like, I, I know that I think it was around like when red came out, like when she kind of made her big pivot, um,
Speaker: I remember listening to an interview with her saying that she felt like she had to have something new out every two years to stay relevant.
Speaker: But I also feel like that was when she was chasing what she has now.
Speaker: I think maybe where I would turn to, if we're going to use an example of an artist who maybe went over the edge, it would be like,
Speaker: I don't know, one of these artists from the 90s who is like out touring their 25th anniversary of their whatever album was big for them.
Speaker: And like maybe they're doing it because they like touring and they want to like be around their fans that like that aspect of their lives from 25 years ago.
Speaker: But there's got to be some where it's totally because they spent all their money and they just need something, right?
Speaker: And I feel like that's where it starts to get sad.
Speaker: And I think you can see the difference where it's the artist that like comes out of the dressing room and plays their 45 minutes and like, this sucks.
Speaker: And like, I don't know, maybe you haven't been to shows like that, but I've been to shows like that where it's like, oh, this is a shell of themselves versus the ones that do it because they love it.
Speaker: Yeah, I remember people used to say that about Fall Out Boy.
Speaker: Actually, I think they still say that about Fall Out Boy.
Speaker: They call him Sell Out Boy.
Speaker: I really like Fall Out Boy and I like their new music and I think they're really talented even in the new stuff that they released.
Speaker: But I don't know, something about the way that they promote their things, people I think are not into it.
Speaker: Yeah, well, so I mean, I like Fall Out Boy too.
Speaker: I think you have to look at them.
Speaker: There's basically, there are two eras, quote unquote, like their first
Speaker: we'll say four albums and then everything after they're basically like two different bands.
Speaker: And I remember when, I think it was when they went on their first, when they went on their hiatus and they were talking about where the band was after fully adieu, they were saying it was like being a band with, you know, those four people together.
Speaker: It was like getting into a car and everybody being like, okay, so where should we go to eat?
Speaker: And nobody can agree.
Speaker: So they ended up just going to like a shitty all you can eat buffet.
Speaker: And that was like where they felt their music was at that point.
Speaker: And I think for the people that really loved that era of music,
Speaker: they don't like where the band went.
Speaker: And you can see it with, I can't remember if it was this last album or the album before their guitarist was super bummed out because he was basically not in the songwriting process because they were doing super electronic stuff and not really being a guitar-based band at all.
Speaker: But he's sticking around because he likes to tour and they still play those old songs.
Speaker: So I don't know, maybe for him, that's where that is.
Speaker: But then at the same time, making all that money lets them go do whatever they want.
Speaker: Yeah, and I feel like their new music isn't even like, like, I feel like it's still a bomb.
Speaker: It has like the lyrics.
Speaker: It has like, for me, their whole thing was just like very poetic.
Speaker: I mean, it's just a lot of words.
Speaker: I remember when I was in like my Fall Out Boy phase in middle school, my dad was like, why are they speaking so much?
Speaker: Like, why are they trying to fit every possible syllable in these songs?
Speaker: Because they always have like a ton of words in it.
Speaker: And I feel like to me, that's always been what Fall Out Boy was, was just like a band band.
Speaker: Like, lyricism was, like, the whole thing behind their band.
Speaker: And obviously, production level, too.
Speaker: And I feel like now, like you said, they're kind of very electronic, very commercial, a little commercialized.
Speaker: But they still have the core of what I think they are.
Speaker: So maybe that was a bad example of, like, what a sellout, not like a sellout, but, like, you know, someone who doesn't have the passion in it anymore is.
Speaker: But...
Speaker: Well, maybe it's going to going back to the scope of meaning, right?
Speaker: Because when, well, A, so, you know, when they first started, they were in like hardcore bands, right?
Speaker: And kind of the story behind Fall Out Boy is they wanted to play for a room not of 95% dudes, right?
Speaker: So they kind of had this come together moment where they're like, we want to write something that girls will come to.
Speaker: And so then they reverse engineered it.
Speaker: They're like, okay, we want...
Speaker: to write songs that are basically the lyrical content of some of these hardcore bands that we love and have been a part of, but make it sound like New Found Glory.
Speaker: And so like the first, when they recorded their first album they brought in, it was like two New Found Glory albums and a Blink-182 album.
Speaker: We were like, this is what we want this to sound like.
Speaker: So help us figure that out.
Speaker: And then like that was their trajectory for their rise was, I don't know.
Speaker: Hardcore mentality, DIY mentality, but then make it pop punk.
Speaker: And so it's almost like a sellout from the start.
Speaker: So in a way, they've stayed true to themselves.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Well, and then, you know, those songs were made for...
Speaker: you know, 500 seat venues and music that you make for a 500 seat venue that is, you know, kind of that emo core thing is going to hit different to when you're 40 years old and writing songs that play well in arenas.
Speaker: And so if you're that person that likes that kind of DIY aesthetic, you're probably not going to like the song that sounds good in an arena.
Speaker: But if you go to a follow up show right now, the songs are going to be awesome.
Speaker: That's a good point.
Speaker: I always thought it would be really hard to be a musician because,
Speaker: First of all, it's the pressure of always trying to improve, at least I think so.
Speaker: And then also, when you're trying to improve, would your audience even want you to change, you know?
Speaker: I feel like that's always very hard.
Speaker: Yeah, I remember an interview with, what's the name of the My Chemical Romance guy, Gerard Way.
Speaker: Yeah, Gerard.
Speaker: So I remember an interview that he had, and he was talking about basically existing.
Speaker: It was that same thing, like existing in Arrested Development, because he wrote songs that were true when he was 17.
Speaker: And now he's a 30-year-old man and still singing about stuff that was true when he was 17.
Speaker: But if he tries to write about things that are about being 30...
Speaker: like the people who listen to that music and like it would not follow.
Speaker: And then ultimately that's why the band stopped playing.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I remember when they came back and started touring again, people were like, why is this dad on stage like singing about, you know, I mean the stuff that they wrote about back when they were like very famous was very risque, I would say.
Speaker: So like, it kind of makes sense.
Speaker: Like it's a very different picture, but at the same time, I feel like, yeah, it's kind of hard to evolve and like keep the same fan base.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It also reminded me of when leader of the K-pop group BTS, RM, he was doing an interview and he was talking about how he really liked art, like going to art museums, sculptures, interior design.
Speaker: Like that's what he was like really actually into because he would do music a lot.
Speaker: Like he used to like produce, or he still does.
Speaker: He produces, writes music, writes his own raps and stuff, but that kind of became like his job.
Speaker: And that's what he like really enjoyed.
Speaker: like had to find, like he like produced it for like an audience.
Speaker: Like he made this stuff for someone else.
Speaker: So in a way, like art was a way for him to like enjoy kind of like the same creativity, but like in a lens that wasn't for someone else or like for an audience, it was just like something he enjoyed for like what it was.
Speaker: And I thought that was kind of, that was like really interesting.
Speaker: And it kind of like goes back to like the whole overarching argument here is that just like when you,
Speaker: Or like it can be hard to do something that you enjoy, I think, for other people.
Speaker: But once you like actually enjoy it for what it is, like you're able to take enjoyment outside of like that realm of validation.
Speaker: Obviously, I think it becomes more fulfilling.
Speaker: So all that said, what are your what are your New Year's resolutions?
Speaker: We actually had like a dinner recently where we just entirely came up with New Year's resolutions and there were so many.
Speaker: But some of them, I mean, some of them are just like goals that I've been trying to like pursue for a really long time.
Speaker: Like, for example, like the podcast, I think was like something that we were able to achieve this year, which was something that I wanted to do.
Speaker: So thank you for that.
Speaker: And like, kind of like in that same vein of things, it's just like trying things out just for like the sake of trying them.
Speaker: And like, I might not stick with them, but maybe I will, maybe I won't just discovering what I like to do really.
Speaker: So like, for example,
Speaker: graphic design like actually going back to like when I wanted to be a graphic designer just like doing that but like doing it in more of like a Instagram shop thing maybe I don't know we'll see and performing music that's also another goal of mine again not because I want to become famous but more of just like seeing how it feels for me you know stuff like that so
Speaker: It's really the same kind of things that I've been doing for a long time, but just like with different things.
Speaker: What about you?
Speaker: I guess kind of the same vein as what you're in.
Speaker: I think, again, I think we're both trying to step out of the hamster wheel of things to some extent and find goals that...
Speaker: Again, kind of get us to that creation and exploration side of things and finding what makes us happy.
Speaker: So as far as the daily grind of things, like I said, I got two kids.
Speaker: A lot of my goals are wrapped up in making sure they're happy, right?
Speaker: But then the time that I get to take for myself, yeah, I think creation, doing more music stuff, continuing this podcast, like finding things to put out into the world.
Speaker: There's another podcast that I listen to.
Speaker: They always end the podcast with, think about what you put out into the world, make it a better place.
Speaker: And A, because I listen to that podcast a lot, I hear that a lot, but I also think about that a lot.
Speaker: So yeah, I just want to find small ways to make the world around me a better place.
Speaker: Okay, so for the next section, it's kind of our little small rant section where we get to talk about something less significant than the big rant, but still in the vein of ranting or talking about something.
Speaker: Just not to like the same deep extent, I would say.
Speaker: My rant of the week is I really hate professional shoes.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I've been looking for shoes that, especially for women, I think I've been looking for shoes that are like comfortable to walk around in and stand in and not feel like your feet are dying or like pinch the back of your feet or have like absolutely no soul where you feel like you're just stepping on the ground.
Speaker: I feel like that's so hard to find.
Speaker: And it's just, it makes me think like in the grand scheme of things, why are we considering these shoes to be professional anyway?
Speaker: What is considered professional?
Speaker: It's like something on your feet.
Speaker: Is anyone really looking at your feet?
Speaker: Like, why is this so important?
Speaker: But like, for some reason, when you're trying to dress business casual or like fancy or professional, you're like expected to wear these uncomfortable shoes.
Speaker: And I feel like we should abolish the concept that professionalism is
Speaker: It's in your shoes or in your clothes to begin with, because also, wow, this is really becoming more of a rant than I thought it would, but like not everyone can like have access to those clothes either.
Speaker: Like I feel like finding like a blazer and like really nice fitting trousers and stuff.
Speaker: Like, those are so hard to find, and the good ones are often very expensive.
Speaker: And it's just so wild to me that your clothes... Like, someone really decided, like, that's how you dress in order to seem like a professional.
Speaker: But I'm sure there's, like, some sort of meaning behind it where, like, I think professionalism obviously is a good thing, and, like, being, you know...
Speaker: being put together is like good, but like to the extent of like being like so like buttoned up and stuffy, I feel like that's kind of unnecessary depending on the person you are, but that's just me.
Speaker: That's just me.
Speaker: I go back and forth on this.
Speaker: A, I wholeheartedly agree with you.
Speaker: Full stop.
Speaker: That said, I really, I like, I like looking good.
Speaker: You know, the concept of fashion and putting yourself together and like putting out into the world this image of yourself that is, I don't know, curated in a certain way.
Speaker: Like.
Speaker: I can get behind that.
Speaker: At the same time, I don't know why we do it.
Speaker: Again, it's one of those things where if you keep saying the and then, it seems absurd.
Speaker: And I think we're post-professionalism in our attire.
Speaker: We live in a society and we need to look appropriate, I guess.
Speaker: But then when you really drill down to it, like with shoes, who decides what's professional?
Speaker: And it's like, how far do you have to go with it?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: So what makes a professional shoe for a woman?
Speaker: Like, let's, let's go through this.
Speaker: It has to be.
Speaker: I feel like I usually think of like flats, like ballet flats and like heels.
Speaker: But when I like go out to find flats, half of them are like not very comfortable.
Speaker: They're very poorly made and it kind of feels like you're not wearing shoes.
Speaker: But I feel like there is some sort of expectation.
Speaker: At least it like depends on like, obviously the places that you're going to.
Speaker: In general, I really like fashion and I really like dressing up, but I feel like my version of fashion is not necessarily like professional or like what should be considered professional.
Speaker: So like I'm talking about like in settings that are professional, like the things that you're expected to wear, I feel like can be kind of
Speaker: It's like, where are you supposed to find these things?
Speaker: Why are they, why, why is there an emphasis on being uncomfortable?
Speaker: But that's just me, obviously.
Speaker: Like, I think there's also a point in looking like that because that's the setting that you're in.
Speaker: But it's just, it's interesting to me.
Speaker: But again, it's arbitrary.
Speaker: Like, I think dudes have it way less worse than,
Speaker: then somebody is gonna present as female, right?
Speaker: But if we go down, if we break it down, if a dress shoe like an Oxford is your standard, but then loafers are also a standard, but only some kind of loafers.
Speaker: It has to be like a leather look.
Speaker: There's a specific kind of loafer that's like this arbitrary floor for what it can be.
Speaker: Like technically a van slip-on is a loafer, but that would not be appropriate.
Speaker: But you could probably find a canvas loafer that thinks it's a dress shoe and you could pull that off.
Speaker: But you have to dance that line.
Speaker: At the office I work in, they relax the dress code.
Speaker: And one of the shoes that is appropriate is a Chuck Taylor.
Speaker: Um, but what they have in mind is not a Chuck Taylor that you would mow the lawn in.
Speaker: Like it has to be a clean Chuck Taylor.
Speaker: Um, and I think they are specifically thinking of, uh, like a, like a low top Chuck Taylor, but the letter of the law is Chuck Taylor.
Speaker: So if I show up in my leather high tops, um,
Speaker: or my rubber high tops, or my slip-on Chuck Taylors that don't have laces, I feel like I'm pushing that boundary, but they technically can't say anything.
Speaker: But then if I'm pushing that boundary, if somebody shows up in a different shoe that is functionally the same thing as my laceless slip-on Chucks that are all worn out on the bottom, are they gonna get in trouble?
Speaker: Are they gonna get the side eye?
Speaker: And I just feel like it's a slippery slope that we shouldn't even be on.
Speaker: You should just be able to wear what you want.
Speaker: We're post office culture.
Speaker: You can work from home.
Speaker: You should be able to show up in pajamas.
Speaker: So that's a segue into my little rant.
Speaker: And that is, I'm going to go both ways on this.
Speaker: I'm going to go multiple ways on this.
Speaker: I'm going to see if I can make a cohesive argument here.
Speaker: So, like I said, I'm coaching wrestling for my kids this year in Parks and Rec League, and all of the Parks and Rec coaches had to meet to figure out the schedule for the year.
Speaker: And it was a step in the right direction, and they're like, cool, let's do this remotely so we don't all have to find a time to go to the same place.
Speaker: That's cool.
Speaker: There's two problems with that.
Speaker: One, they use Zoom.
Speaker: As a platform, Zoom sucks.
Speaker: But it could have been way better if the people running the call knew how to use the platform.
Speaker: It ended up being an hour long call and half an hour was spent just trying to get people to connect.
Speaker: Right?
Speaker: And so I feel like there's two things.
Speaker: One, there's a problem with having non-utilitarian, non-utility means of communication as our primary means of communication.
Speaker: I think having a nationalized telephone network was a really good thing.
Speaker: And we've ever since landlines became like, not a thing we've been moving farther and farther away from having like a really simple platform that everybody can use and you know how to like connect to each other.
Speaker: It's reliable.
Speaker: That's one side of things.
Speaker: The other side of things is there has to be some sort of standardization in learning how we use these things.
Speaker: Because when it works, it's great.
Speaker: It's an awesome alternative to having to show up in the middle of winter to a place you don't know and sit around people that you don't really want to sit around with for an hour.
Speaker: But it's so painful when the things that you're trying to accomplish take twice as long because nobody knows how to use the platform.
Speaker: So two things.
Speaker: One, if you're going to be a citizen of the world in 2024, learn how to use Zoom, learn how to use Teams.
Speaker: And if you are a telecommunications company, please find it in your heart to lobby for a national standardization of what these platforms are so that we don't have to learn a new platform every time we try to connect with a different group.
Speaker: I just hate it.
Speaker: I hate it.
Speaker: I hate it.
Speaker: This is so true.
Speaker: I hate it.
Speaker: It's just all part of, yeah, like the evolving, you know, society is now just you have to learn how to use these things.
Speaker: But there's, yeah, I've had to use like, you know, WebEx, Zoom, Teams, Google Meets, all of them.
Speaker: And they're all different.
Speaker: And they're all awkward.
Speaker: And they're all.
Speaker: They're all great in their own way and they're all awful in their own way.
Speaker: And those things do not overlap.
Speaker: And it's choosing the lesser of all evils.
Speaker: Even this thing that we're using to record this podcast.
Speaker: Like, it is flaky.
Speaker: It's...
Speaker: Sometimes it throws you an error and you don't know what it means.
Speaker: Sometimes you just can't connect.
Speaker: And like, sometimes it takes four hours to upload because for some reason it just decides to hang up at 80%, which is what happened with last week.
Speaker: But at the same time, if you like look up reviews of podcast platforms, this is like the best one.
Speaker: They all have flaws.
Speaker: I think it's just how you work through the flaws.
Speaker: Maybe it's a metaphor for people.
Speaker: You just got to assume the best and figure it out.
Speaker: That's also true.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think most of life is what you make of it anyway.
Speaker: Okay.
Speaker: Rant rescinded.
Speaker: Zoom's fine.
Speaker: Well, not that.
Speaker: People are bad.
Speaker: People who use Zoom are bad.
Speaker: No, that's not it either.
Speaker: Every single person.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Zoom is a, it says a lot about your character.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, because teams is the, it's Microsoft specific, isn't it?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And that has everything that comes with Microsoft.
Speaker: Plus I think teams only is a thing if you're in an, if you're in an organization company.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Zoom is like, actually is Skype still a thing?
Speaker: I don't even know.
Speaker: I used to use Skype so much, but I don't use it anymore.
Speaker: I'm an Apple child, so I have FaceTime and stuff like that.
Speaker: And then I work for a company that has Teams.
Speaker: But I remember, especially in early podcast stuff, Skype was how you did it.
Speaker: Oh, on podcasting?
Speaker: I remember Skype was how you called people before FaceTime.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: It's probably called something different now.
Speaker: It probably turned it into... Skype really had an opportunity to be Zoom.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: They could have been Zoom.
Speaker: Maybe that's what happened.
Speaker: Because I feel like Skype was Teams, but if you're not in a company.
Speaker: And then Microsoft figured out all the money is not in that.
Speaker: So they went real hard on Teams.
Speaker: But I don't know.
Speaker: I mean, people use WhatsApp.
Speaker: That's kind of like Skype.
Speaker: I kind of forgot about that.
Speaker: Fair.
Speaker: But it's not the same.
Speaker: I think professionally, no one really uses WhatsApp.
Speaker: Well, it...
Speaker: Again, maybe that's like a US-centric way of thinking about it.
Speaker: Because isn't like the entire world run on WhatsApp?
Speaker: If you're in Asia.
Speaker: Oh.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Hi.
Speaker: Hello.
Speaker: Oh my gosh, she has a bob.
Speaker: Oh yeah.
Speaker: She, um... So, dear listener, I don't know if we'll keep this in or not.
Speaker: My daughter just walked in.
Speaker: She just got home from school.
Speaker: And she has a bob because we, um...
Speaker: It's been a challenge to wash and comb hair because it gets snarly when it gets long.
Speaker: And so then it's like a snowball effect where the longer we go without brushing it, the harder it is to like get her to brush it.
Speaker: But then there's that memory of how terrible it was so that she doesn't want to do it in the first place.
Speaker: So then it just keeps getting tangled over and over again.
Speaker: So we cut it all off.
Speaker: And now it's a chin-length bob and everybody's way happier.
Speaker: I mean, that's why I cut my hair.
Speaker: So she's valid for that.
Speaker: You guys are valid for that.
Speaker: And both of you look fantastic.
Speaker: Thank you.
Speaker: Au revoir!
Speaker: Au revoir, Phoebe!
Speaker: Au revoir, Simone!
Speaker: And finally, to get you through to the next time we are together to rant, we are going to leave you with our parting gifts.
Speaker: My parting gift for this week, so last week, or last podcast, Sophia talked about her excursion to see an early screening of the latest Miyazaki movie.
Speaker: And based on her
Speaker: Reminder, I also saw that film and it was fantastic.
Speaker: So both for you and for Sophia, my parting gift is, well, it's a show, not a film.
Speaker: But I brought this up with Sophia before, so now I'm putting it into the world that I have suggested this to her.
Speaker: And hopefully everybody else will like it as well.
Speaker: It's a little bit...
Speaker: I would have seasoned, but I think I can make this work so it doesn't feel like I'm just super behind the times.
Speaker: So my parting gift for this week is the show, the bear it's a Hulu show.
Speaker: Um, it's about, uh, a kitchen in like a restaurant kitchen in Chicago.
Speaker: Um, and kind of all of the K well, it's all of the characters that are kind of in and out of that kitchen.
Speaker: The, uh,
Speaker: first season of the show is really kind of showing the psychology of what a kitchen looks like and how everybody kind of interacts and bumps into each other and all the personalities that kind of come together.
Speaker: And it's a metaphor for baggage and mental illness and working through kind of your demons to make things work and how everybody is kind of working through their own thing and how all of those things kind of tend to run into each other to make
Speaker: compelling drama basically.
Speaker: The second season kind of breaks all of those characters apart and it goes into the backstory of each character and shows why they are the way they are and shows how they kind of overcome their own kind of personal narrative to then come back and try again at the end of the season.
Speaker: I think this is specific to this time of year because the sixth season
Speaker: episode of the second season is an episode called fishes.
Speaker: Um, and it's about a Christmas dinner with the kind of main family of the show.
Speaker: And if you've seen the show, you know that that's probably the most controversial episode of the series, both in terms of the subject matter and also, um,
Speaker: the production goes way out of bounds to bring in all these huge big name actors.
Speaker: And it almost feels like a totally different show that got turned into a movie.
Speaker: That's only tangentially related to the rest of the show.
Speaker: Um, but,
Speaker: might be one of the most accurate depictions of some of the family Christmas dinners that I've been to, maybe not culminating in quite as much drama as that episode does.
Speaker: But then if we're going to be very specific about what makes me love the show so much is the episode that follows that is an episode called Forks.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: and forks for as big and bombastic as the episode before it is, um, is this really beautiful little bottle episode showing how a character can find meaning in their life and overcome kind of their feelings of existential dread, um, to ultimately be a happier person and kind of redeem themselves as a person and a character on the show.
Speaker: So if you have time over the holidays, take a couple hours, more than a couple hours, take eight to 10 hours and binge the show.
Speaker: I think you'll be very happy that you did.
Speaker: I've actually seen it on, well, I haven't seen the show, but I've seen it recommended on Hulu.
Speaker: And I was reminded, I was like, I need to watch it.
Speaker: And then we watched New Girl instead.
Speaker: Well, New Girl's fun.
Speaker: But I will say, I know that Chicago is one of your favorite cities.
Speaker: It's a love letter to Chicago.
Speaker: The needle drops in the show are fantastic.
Speaker: It's such a cool soundtrack.
Speaker: It's funny.
Speaker: The characters are more or less relatable.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And for all the things that we have talked about today and kind of the things that we just generally tend to talk about when we're together, I feel like it is so your shit.
Speaker: I really want to watch it.
Speaker: I think it could be my next show.
Speaker: After I finish Emily in Paris, it will be my next show.
Speaker: So thank you for the recommendation.
Speaker: I have not watched Emily in Paris.
Speaker: I've heard it is a guilty pleasure show.
Speaker: It is so bad, but I really like it.
Speaker: I really like bad things.
Speaker: Okay, well, this is not bad.
Speaker: I think it is fairly objectively good.
Speaker: And one of the things that made me think of it other than I just, I rewatched it from time to time.
Speaker: And recently I went through it again.
Speaker: They, with the writer strike ending, there was just news that they're starting a third season and I'm pumped for it.
Speaker: So before that, actually it won't come out till the end of next year, but in the meantime, you should watch the first two seasons.
Speaker: I got a whole year to catch up.
Speaker: That could be my New Year's resolution.
Speaker: There you go.
Speaker: Watch the bear.
Speaker: Finish the bear.
Speaker: That is obtainable.
Speaker: Writing it down.
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: Well, I'll definitely have to because I feel like I'm always behind on TV and movies.
Speaker: So I will try to watch it.
Speaker: As for my recommendation, it doesn't really have that much weight, but I really like Japanese mayo.
Speaker: I don't know why it kind of tastes different than American mayo.
Speaker: It has like a little star coming out of the cap.
Speaker: So when you like put the mail on something, it looks cute.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I just really like Japanese mayo and I would recommend it to anyone who hasn't tried it.
Speaker: So I just looked it up.
Speaker: That's my rant.
Speaker: And it's different because it's, it's egg yolks, no egg whites.
Speaker: So it's like more custardy and it's like richer.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: I love Kewpie mayo.
Speaker: Yeah, Kewpie is so good.
Speaker: The little baby on the cover.
Speaker: Just something about it.
Speaker: You squeeze that little baby and it just makes anything better.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: So anyone who hasn't tried it would recommend.
Speaker: It goes great on anything.
Speaker: Rice, baked potatoes, anything.
Speaker: Just keep going.
Speaker: Shrimp scampi, shrimp kebabs.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: Shrimp and grits.
Speaker: Why only shrimp?
Speaker: So have you ever seen the movie Forrest Gump?
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Well, a really long time ago.
Speaker: No, there's a montage where they're talking about shrimp and he's listing all the shrimp dishes.
Speaker: Oh, the Bubba Gump shrimp, right?
Speaker: See?
Speaker: Yeah, so you do know.
Speaker: Well, I just know the restaurant.
Speaker: Have you ever eaten at the restaurant?
Speaker: Actually, no.
Speaker: I should.
Speaker: I mean, it's shrimp.
Speaker: I like shrimp.
Speaker: Do you like Applebee's?
Speaker: I like Applebee's.
Speaker: Well, is Applebee's the same as... There's another one that's exactly the same, but it's not Applebee's.
Speaker: It's the same concept, though.
Speaker: I can't remember what it's called, but I've eaten there, but not at Applebee's.
Speaker: Anyway, continue.
Speaker: No, that's, it's one of those things where it is not fine dining, but it's a solid six out of 10 if you ever need a six out of 10.
Speaker: Exactly.
Speaker: It's like Olive Garden, but not with the unlimited breadsticks.
Speaker: Which makes it objectively worse, but.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Olive Garden is like a seven out of 10.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Have you seen, I don't, I saw recently they did another lifetime soup and salad offer.
Speaker: Lifetime?
Speaker: Yeah, so like periodically, it's like secret.
Speaker: They'll do like a drop where for – it's like not an insignificant amount of money.
Speaker: It's like for $500.
Speaker: To buy it?
Speaker: The first 20 people that put $500.
Speaker: It's like Ticketmaster, like, you know, where like the thing is counting down and like you might get in, you might not.
Speaker: And like if you get in, then it's like, okay, you just spent $500, but you can walk into –
Speaker: Olive Garden any day of the week and it's like free soup salad and breadsticks.
Speaker: So like no matter what else is happening in your life, you got that covered.
Speaker: I feel like $500 is kind of a large ask.
Speaker: Like couldn't they have just done like $10?
Speaker: Well, I guess then everyone would.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They got to make sure you're committed.
Speaker: But I feel like you just get very sick of their salads and soups and breadsticks.
Speaker: Well, if you were the person that would only spend $10 on it, maybe that's true.
Speaker: But if you're so committed to Olive Garden that you will spend $500, then it's like you'll bring your friends, you'll bring your family.
Speaker: That's true.
Speaker: It's not just for one person.
Speaker: No, no, no.
Speaker: You're going to get it for free, but then it's like the loss leader, right?
Speaker: Then you're going to be there like four days a week, maybe a couple days a week.
Speaker: You bring somebody in, they'll buy drinks.
Speaker: Oh, you get a guest pass?
Speaker: Wow.
Speaker: No, they have to pay for themselves.
Speaker: Oh.
Speaker: You're set.
Speaker: I see.
Speaker: But at least, yeah, at least you're experiencing it with others.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Interesting.
Speaker: No, I haven't been to an Olive Garden in a very long time, but.
Speaker: That said, bubblegum shrimp does not have that.
Speaker: Oh.
Speaker: Therefore, they are not as good as that.
Speaker: But like, again, if you need like the six out of 10 and just say that you did and buy.
Speaker: And really, I think probably they make all their money in merch.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: They always have a gift shop.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And they're always in like touristic places.
Speaker: So.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: I feel like I've never h ad a bubble cone.
Speaker: But if I ever wanted popcorn shrimp, maybe I'll go.
Speaker: I wonder at what point maybe we're already there.
Speaker: The people who go and eat there know it only for that and have no idea what that is referencing.
Speaker: Yeah, I actually think about this.
Speaker: This is so random with like halal carts in once again, New York.
Speaker: I'm just like, how many people think halal is just like the term of like the type of food?
Speaker: How many people like know what it is?
Speaker: Anyway, but yes, it's like also with that bubblegum.
Speaker: It's like, do people know that it's a reference?
Speaker: Right, because that's 30 years old at this point, right?
Speaker: Yes.
Speaker: I think so.
Speaker: But I knew what it was.
Speaker: Yeah, it was 94.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think it kind of seems like a new movie.
Speaker: Well, but that's, that's just like, it's so culturally relevant.
Speaker: Is it though?
Speaker: It was, I think a couple of years ago.
Speaker: Why was it a couple of years ago?
Speaker: I mean like 10 years ago.
Speaker: Why was it relevant 10 years ago?
Speaker: Well, I don't know.
Speaker: People would like reference it occasionally, like the chocolate thing, the stocks thing, him running across the field thing.
Speaker: But I feel like I hear less of it now.
Speaker: Maybe that was the 20th anniversary.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: Maybe they'll make a remake.
Speaker: I don't know how you could.
Speaker: That's such a boomer movie.
Speaker: I feel like they make remakes out of everything.
Speaker: It's like how they make a Willy Wonka movie.
Speaker: Maybe they'll do it on like...
Speaker: Well, I guess he didn't have children.
Speaker: Anyway, not me trying to figure out how to continue the Forrest Gump franchise.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker: Maybe you do it not about Vietnam.
Speaker: Maybe you do it about the Gulf War.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I feel like if you're going to do it over again.
Speaker: Right, because it's like, you know, it's like the greatest hits of 1950 through 1975.
Speaker: True.
Speaker: That's true.
Speaker: They could do it for like now.
Speaker: I was thinking of like a...
Speaker: What is it?
Speaker: It's like the same characters, but like they're older or something.
Speaker: I feel like that's common.
Speaker: Or it's like a prequel.
Speaker: But it's not like a fantasy story, so I don't know why there would be a prequel.
Speaker: I mean, it's kind of a fantasy story.
Speaker: Yeah, that's true.
Speaker: It's like just being able to remember that over and over again.
Speaker: That's true.
Speaker: They could really play into the nostalgia factor.
Speaker: I'm trying to think, is there... Maybe there is...
Speaker: room for that what's the nostalgia factor of the 90s and 2000s has there been a movie about that about the 90s i don't know that's where we are if we're talking about that movie came out in 1994 and it's about 1950 through 1985 if there was a movie that came out now it would be from 1980 ish i don't know if there i mean i think there is
Speaker: I feel like a lot of people romanticize the nineties.
Speaker: Like it wasn't, it was like 10 years, 20 years ago, but like the styles coming back in particular, the music, the music genre is kind of a little coming back.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: We'll see.
Speaker: Well, Hey listeners, if you can think of a movie that, uh, that checks all those boxes, what's, what's the, uh, what's the latest Forrest Gump?
Speaker: What could Forrest Gump be?
Speaker: If there's a,
Speaker: anything you want to talk about, you should write us at sabetpodcasts at gmail.com.
Speaker: And follow us on our Instagram at sabetpod.
Speaker: I'm finally posting, so I would appreciate a good follow.
Speaker: And once again, we're on all the social media platforms.
Speaker: Well, no, we're not on all the social media platforms.
Speaker: We're on all the podcasting platforms, though.
Speaker: Wherever you listen to podcasts, you can find us, sabet.
Speaker: I was actually kind of surprised that that name hasn't been taken yet.
Speaker: I don't know if that means that it's a really good name or a really bad name.
Speaker: At least it's unique.
Speaker: At the very least.
Speaker: It is not what we're all striving for.
Speaker: Goodbye!
