Transcript
Speaker: Hey everybody, and welcome to the Shepherding Time podcast. And this is a place where we talk with pastors and ministry leaders about how they're intentional about taking their time and really investing it with the heart of a shepherd. And today I'm so excited but to have ah Dr. Ben Glad, who is the executive director of the Carson Center for Theological re Renewal. He's here with us today. wanna Ben,
Speaker: um where Because in your work in your work, you spend a lot of time in the chair and you're investing in biblical theological work. I mean, certainly the connecting scripture, New Testament, just remarkable help for the church.
Speaker: And there's a lot of time that's spent there. how do you How within a normal week of the work that you do, Where do you find um kind of the natural opportunities for discipleship and ministry that's outside of kind of official, the official work in the chair? And how do you connect the two? Do you see them as two separate realms or is there a continuum? And how do you think about managing that?
Speaker: Yeah. Um, they're of course organically related. mean, it's, if I only had one without the other, then I would not be in a good, not being, not be healthy, you know, mentally, psychologically. So I, I of course like to do both. Um,
Speaker: I'm intentional in at least two places. i suppose there may be more, but one is, and this is something that I've started to really think about and do, and that is I will text friends, old friends, new friends, and just encourage them. Like, I mean, that's so cool about technology is that I...
Speaker: i you know I can take 10 seconds and punch out a text, whether it's to you, Joe, or to just old friends and just say, you know what? I'm so thankful. I'm praying for you. And when when you do that to me, when other friends do that to me, it really makes a big deal. And it's something so small.
Speaker: um yeah i Yeah. So just texting, maybe throwing up some good emojis, something like that. you know Of course, praying for my friends, that kind of thing. And then the other thing that I do...
Speaker: ah is I reach out to my local friends, pastors, and professors, and i i go to lunch with them. And there are a lot of good places around where I live for lunch. And so I try to meet with as many as I can. And some of these friends 15 years, 12 years old. Some of them are a lot newer.
Speaker: And it really invigorates me. So I work remotely remotely. And I have a huge community around me, but TGC is not, you know, we all, of everybody at TGC, we work remotely.
Speaker: And so it's important for me to spend time with, you know, brothers that are you know kind of like me. And just get to know them and just, um you know, hey, how can I how can i pray for you? what are you working on? How are you doing? How's church going? How's your job? Those sorts of things. And it's amazing how few men are asked that question.
Speaker: I think women, you know, in their in their Bible studies, and their i think theyre they talk about those things quite a bit. But men, especially middle-aged, we don't really get to talk about those things. Well, what I was going to say is that, and I hope our listeners really picked up on this, is that the way in which that you think about relationships is not is not only not separate from the work that you do in ministry, but rather that there's a continuum. I mean, you just said, listen, if I'm not connected, if I'm not connected with people in ordinary days, that's being intentional about asking good questions, understanding the heart, thinking about what it means to follow Jesus, that, that your heart would be,
Speaker: um not enriched and maybe even unhealthy when you're actually moving back to the, the formal programming and the work that you're a part of. And I just, I think that those are the things that, uh, that, that pastors, that pastors really, um, should continue to embrace that when I'm spending, when I'm having lunch with a friend, that that is not a, that is not against or that is not outside of or a distraction from my ministry time but then it's actually a continuum of what it means for my heart to serve the lord in whatever context i'm in am i hearing that right
Speaker: Yeah, I think so. And you know, you know there's there's one little piece in here. and And pastors that are on staff, they tend to go out to eat or hang out with the same people all the time. Of course, that's amazing. Of course, that that needs to keep happening.
Speaker: But yeah, i and I have to do this. I have to force myself to say, you know what, I'm going to grab lunch with somebody that, quite frankly, it's going to be an awkward conversation. i don't know this person all that well. They don't go to my church.
Speaker: But this needs to happen. And I really think that they're struggling. And I think and i think I can encourage them. and i And I do it and I walk away going like, oh my gosh, that was amazing. In other words, we tend, so there's just like, there's a spectrum where it's like, oh, i'm I'm doing great. I'm hanging out with people that, yeah, but they're all like you. Of course, you're of course that was enjoyable. Like you you laugh at the same dad jokes. They laugh at your jokes. And that's that, but you know, that's great. I'm not throwing shade on that, but it's, there is this there is this whole category of people
Speaker: that we just don't get along with just like our our personalities or whatever they just aren't quite fitting together you still need you still need to talk to them and and work with them and that's hard like i i have thought more about that and i have tried to reach out to people that you know it's going to be an awkward it's just going to be awkward and that's fine and uh just just that's hard quite frankly that's that's hard for me i think it's hard for most guys Yeah. But, but it's the, it's the intentionality of it that I think is what the through line is. It's like, how am I, how am I going to be intentional about people that I'm around the interactions that I have, whether be in a formal setting, whether be in an informal setting or whether it be in a developing, like, yeah, I'm trying to find this or something that I need to move into that's uninvited. that the The through line of um really shepherding and thinking through your time in an intentional way, that's what resonates with our with our hearts is is just that level of commitment. And you're right. You're right. It does take a minute for pastors and ministry leaders to go, okay, how am I thinking through not just...
Speaker: the time block that I have when I'm doing work, but how do I think intentionally about all the relationships that I have? ah Because in the end, that's, what's good, not just for them, but for us.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. That's really good. Let me give you, let me give you one little, one little glad special sauce thing. I don't typically talk about this cause I don't just have the opportunity. So one of the things, so I've been doing this, i mean, I graduated in 2008. So that was all, you know, what, 18 years ago or so.
Speaker: But my my editorial life that I really started about 10 years ago, and what that means is like just how I communicate to publishers and authors and contributors. Like I i am constantly talking to all of like hundreds of people, hundreds of them simultaneously.
Speaker: And one thing that I learned, and I don't know, i don't know if this is this happened to me and I was like, I don't want to do it or it's something. But I noticed that when people talk, you know, from one colleague to the other, they tend to be very, it's very dry.
Speaker: Okay, do this. I'll be you there on Thursday. Okay, I'll get this to you on Friday. Okay. And so it's totally fine. But I really have noticed over the years that people respond to me really well.
Speaker: Is if I say, hey, is your day going okay? It's really hot here in Mississippi. I typically say that with most of my emails. ah But i'll like I'll ask them about how they're doing. And then I'll say, you know what? I'm so thankful that you work, that you are spending your time and energy for me. You don't have to do that. like That's so kind of you. like i really ever Whether it's on Slack,
Speaker: email or would ever a line of communication I have with somebody, I always, try to thank them and I try to make it personal. It takes an extra 10 seconds to do that. But I'm telling you, like, because I do that and because I've made it a pattern of my communication, people, when they see me in person at conferences wherever, like they, feel like we're best friends because I talk to them. i talk to them as a friend. I talk to them as somebody who's
Speaker: who Who cares for them? I don't talk to them sterilely. Is that the right word here? just ah like Just from one worker to the next. And that's life-sucking. So think of it like this. That's life-sucking. Try to try communicate with people that's life-giving.
Speaker: And what you will find is that they will be just blown away because nobody in the workplace talks like that. That's a little like piece that I've just learned.
Speaker: It's easy, but it really has gone a long way and in my in my career. Yeah, because people people um begin to start realizing that there are two kinds of relationships. There are transactional relationships. Yeah, that's the word, transactional. you know I get from you, you get from me. It's very transactional. And then there's transformational relationships.
Speaker: where it's meaningful and i'm i'm not just caring about what you do but who you are and it is um it's very uh beautiful when someone who only lives in a transactional world to say wait a minute i can actually be transformational with you and care about you as we are actually doing good work together And and the the beauty of that really is life-giving, especially when when you're in a transactional world to be able to experience that. And um and yeah so and once you taste of it once you taste of it, what's great about that then is that it also becomes something that then you long for.
Speaker: And so introduce connecting, once taste of it, then then you want to be able to have that in whatever context you're in. Yeah. And like, I'll get, I'll get, so if it's, if it's, if I start working with a new editor at a particular publisher, like I try to kind of explain, Hey, this is who I am. And I, but then I ask them questions. And then when we start to work, you know, in the months to come, I'll come back, Hey, how your kids doing? They play volleyball or whatever. And I try to take interest in, I'll tell you what, like it has really, it really makes a huge difference in how I work just by being friendly
Speaker: And caring to others. And I think pastors and just church leaders, when they when they talk to amongst themselves, whether it's through texting or emailing or Slack or whatever, just take just just take five extra seconds. I mean, i'm really, it's five seconds or 10 seconds. like It makes a huge difference in how people relate to you.
Speaker: Ben, thank you so much. i'm I'm really blessed by this conversation as a pastor myself. I'm just sitting listening to someone who has so many channels for ministry. And we all know that ministry can become so structured and maybe programmed that we lose the rich person centered aspect to it. So that's a great example that you're really providing for us today. And i appreciate that. Uh, what's maybe one thing as we come to a close that you're really getting a lot of traction around personally, you're excited about ministry project. Uh, what's really on your mind and captivating you now?
Speaker: o I do so many things, so many fun. That's, that's like cool thing about working at TGC and putting together all these books and projects. I'm going to work on like really fun, like cutting edge, cutting edge stuff. Um,
Speaker: I mean, it's it's like it's it's almost 80% of what I do is is falls into that category. 20% of what what I do is like life sucking. Like, I'm just not interested in this. This is just not fun. So I can tell you some of the things that I'm working on that are that are particularly exciting. I'm finishing up a big Mark commentary. that I've been working on for a while now. And it's my, so I have, the way that I work is I have, so I work on several books simultaneously. So I'm writing several things simultaneously, but then I'm also editing several things simultaneously. And in each of those things, so some of these are like really big volumes, like really big volumes. Some of them are really small, like maybe it's a TGC article where I, so I'm, so I'm constant. So I'm working with many, many documents simultaneously. So the trick is,
Speaker: to be able to process and manage all of these things simultaneously. So I have like front burners, back burners, and like mid burners. So constantly shuffling between them. ah Some of the things that are that are particularly exciting, I'm doing an Old Testament version of connecting scripture where we're hunting down illusions within the Old Testament itself, old and the old. That's Michael Morales and I are are working on that. We've got a whole team of scholars working on that. I think that's going to be just amazing. I think the church really needs that. One of the things that Don Carson said,
Speaker: And this was, i think, with him and Kevin DeYoung on Kevin's podcast. He talks about like publishing. and he goes He goes, there are things that that writers need to do because the church needs them. like there There are resources that the church is asking for, and those resources need to be produced.
Speaker: okay And then he says, there are times when the church doesn't know that she needs those resources. that you kind of have to predict what is what's a hole that the church doesn't realize that there's a hole.
Speaker: See that? Like there's this element of prophetic ministry. They're not like foretelling, but, or foretelling, but foretelling. So, yeah, so I have to think. So when I take on projects and when I work with these things, I'm thinking in terms of,
Speaker: do I want to spend my life working on these things? Does the church need it? Or does the church not know that she needs it? If not, I'm not going to do it. Like I get, you know, I have, there are lots of things that come across my desk where i'm like, I don't think the church needs it.
Speaker: I think the church already has that. It's, it sounds amazing. I'm thankful for this opportunity, but I'm just going to pass on this because it doesn't feel, doesn't fall into one of those two categories. So yeah, does that make sense? does Oh yeah, for sure. For sure. And you know what?
Speaker: it's been so It's been so easy to be with you. And thanks so much for your generosity and thoughtfulness that out of all the different things that you have on your burner that you would spend just a couple of moments with Rush and I. And we just want to thank all of our Not only ah Dr. Glad for being on the show, but also for all of you for listening to this episode. If you would like to know more, more thinking and, um and helps on how to shepherd your time, we'd draw you to that resource coming out of new growth, press shepherding time, a pastor's guide to time management.
Speaker: and Thanks so much for listening. And we'll see you next time.
