Transcript
Speaker: Hello and welcome to I Kinda Liked It.
Speaker: I'm your host, Harris Smith, and on each episode I'll be speaking to different guests about a movie or other piece of media that they love but is generally regarded as being bad or was poorly reviewed or just generally unsuccessful when it first came out.
Speaker: If you like the show and are interested in reading more about hated, beloved movies, you can check out my blog at ikindalikedit.blogspot.com.
Speaker: My guests this time are my old friend Jack Hayden and his best friend Devin Simpson.
Speaker: Jack is the founder of Snakebomb Comics.
Speaker: He's based in Portland, Oregon, where he's heavily involved in the local VHS swap community and spends much of his time watching and writing about strange movies.
Speaker: Among his favorite films are Cemetery Man, The Human Tornado, and Ernest Goes to Jail.
Speaker: Devin Simpson resides in Baltimore, Maryland, the Charm City, and his favorite films include Father's Day, The Texas Chainsaw Massacre, and Gozu.
Speaker: Jack and Devin have been friends since middle school.
Speaker: For today's show, they've chosen the extended cut of the 1993 Super Mario Brothers film directed by Annabelle Jenkel and Rocky Morton.
Speaker: Let's find out what it is, why it's considered a bad movie, and why Jack and Devin love it anyway.
Speaker: Hey, guys.
Speaker: Hey, how's it going?
Speaker: Hey, Harris.
Speaker: Good.
Speaker: Thanks for having us.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Thanks for being here.
Speaker: I'm super excited.
Speaker: It's the first show.
Speaker: So yeah, I was really glad that you kind of gave me the choice to pick what movie we were going to talk about as a guest, because I feel like it was going to be this or an earnest movie.
Speaker: But I didn't want to be too stereotypical.
Speaker: So of course, I had to go for the wild card of Super Mario Bros.,
Speaker: I think it's also a good one because I feel like it gets a little bit more piled on than it needs to.
Speaker: And I like genuinely like this movie.
Speaker: Well, yeah, absolutely.
Speaker: You're the reason that I own this movie on DVD.
Speaker: So, of course, you were the first person I thought of to, you know, ask to join as well.
Speaker: cool so well let's uh let's start off by telling everyone what it is what is super mario brothers the movie and specifically i guess the um the jenco morton cut well this movie came out in 1993 uh i was seven years old at the time and saw it in the movie theater and um
Speaker: couldn't believe what I was seeing.
Speaker: Finally, a Super Mario Brothers movie, and it was really fucking strange, I think, in the best way possible.
Speaker: I don't know if either of you saw it when it was released theatrically.
Speaker: I did not.
Speaker: No, I was so I was my parents were in the Navy and I was stationed that he was my dad was stationed in Japan.
Speaker: So back in the day, we used to get movies like six, seven months later in the theater on base.
Speaker: So I didn't see this until we rented it, maybe like the year after it came out without any like preparation that it was being made or anything.
Speaker: It was completely just like, oh, that's on the shelf and it's a Mario, so it's going to be good.
Speaker: And we rented it on that whim.
Speaker: I like the idea that you needed preparation, like a window of time to prepare yourself.
Speaker: There was no like, oh, they're making a Mario movie and Bob Hoskins and John Leguizamo are going to be in it.
Speaker: There was nothing like, you know, it just showed up.
Speaker: It was just one of those things like, oh, that's in front of me at my level as a kid on a shelf.
Speaker: So we're going to get it.
Speaker: Yeah, it's funny because, yeah.
Speaker: It really is like the first, as far as I'm aware of, the first major studio, like live action video game movie.
Speaker: And that probably...
Speaker: is the biggest milestone for this film existing.
Speaker: After watching this movie, what, three times in the last two and a half weeks, which has to be a record?
Speaker: Because I watched the theatrical cut and then the two-hour Morton and Jenkel cut.
Speaker: I don't think there's any way to make a Super Mario Bros.
Speaker: film that makes sense.
Speaker: And this is, to me, the best possible iteration
Speaker: of what it could be.
Speaker: There's so many different ways it could have gone.
Speaker: And I'm so happy that they decided to go with this bizarre kind of like family-based cyberpunk film that's like weirdly a little dark, but still kind of a PG movie with this sort of confused tone and actors who
Speaker: after the fact really claimed that they like hated working on the, on the project, but it doesn't come across at all.
Speaker: When you watch it, it seems like a, it was like a lot of fun to, to be a part of.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I know Bob Hoskins in particular thought it was like the worst thing that he ever did.
Speaker: I feel like, uh, I feel like the bitterness around this film and like a lot of the reason why it catches a lot of flack is because
Speaker: the people that were involved in the production had such a negative experience that they went on to like talk all this shit.
Speaker: Like there's so much shit talking from so many different levels on this production.
Speaker: And like, I think, I think for the people that, you know, either had a different vision of where it needed to go at like a production level or you know, the actual experience of being on set, it just sounded like it was a train wreck.
Speaker: And so I think that's one of the reasons why this movie gets a lot of flack.
Speaker: And I think it's unfair because,
Speaker: it doesn't come across when you actually sit down and watch the film.
Speaker: No, it doesn't.
Speaker: It doesn't.
Speaker: But yeah, I guess it's, it's worth talking about the background a little bit that, um, uh, Rocky Morton and, um, what's her?
Speaker: Annabelle Jenkel.
Speaker: Annabelle Jenkel, um, had come, uh, from like music videos.
Speaker: Um, and then they created Max Headroom.
Speaker: One of the best, one of my favorites.
Speaker: Yeah, which was genuinely a visionary thing.
Speaker: And also directed a pretty decent remake of the old film noir DOA.
Speaker: Oh, I didn't know that.
Speaker: I haven't seen that.
Speaker: Yeah, with Dennis Quaid and Meg Ryan, I think.
Speaker: Yeah, it's pretty good.
Speaker: So I think they came to Super Mario Brothers with maybe...
Speaker: a vision that was significantly different than what ultimately wound up, you know, when Disney got involved.
Speaker: Well, I know, Devin, that I sent you a bunch of the clips of, like, the music video stuff they were working on.
Speaker: They did a really cool Rush music video.
Speaker: And I think they did a talking heads.
Speaker: Elvis Costello.
Speaker: Elvis Costello.
Speaker: And also a bunch of commercials for this UK soda brand called Quattro.
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
Speaker: That's right.
Speaker: I'm guessing that it's disgusting.
Speaker: It probably tastes horrible.
Speaker: It probably tastes like canned beans or something.
Speaker: Sorry, British folks, but I bet it's disgusting.
Speaker: But the commercials for Quattro, more than anything else, looking at those old music videos, it blew my mind to go back and watch them.
Speaker: Both of them are on YouTube.
Speaker: All of the aesthetics of the Super Mario Brothers film are in that Quattro commercial.
Speaker: It's the blue and red...
Speaker: uh, stage lights and then just shit loads of dry ice and smoke machines.
Speaker: And then like a semi futuristic looking technology that also seems like it's ancient at the same time.
Speaker: Like the soda dispensing machine almost reminds me of like the, the Devo machine from the, the Mario Bros movie.
Speaker: Um, yeah.
Speaker: And all of the really interesting kind of old school CGI stuff that they inserted into the Mario Bros movie is in those commercials.
Speaker: And even in some of the Rush video.
Speaker: So they had that really locked down way before they came on board, which I thought was really interesting.
Speaker: Yeah, I think it makes me really wonder what either the pitch meeting or the brainstorming, the creative brainstorming looked like for this movie.
Speaker: Because it feels like there's a sense of
Speaker: like auteur that they're coming at it with, you know?
Speaker: And so it's something like, how do you see Mario?
Speaker: You know, like that's the conversation like, well, I see him.
Speaker: He's like jumping around in these space boots.
Speaker: That's the movie.
Speaker: There it is.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And and it feels like it just it is interesting that they they wanted to open up the world because really the plot is essentially it's essentially the same as the video game.
Speaker: It's just a completely different aesthetic and tone like
Speaker: go save Daisy.
Speaker: Like that's it.
Speaker: That's the, that's the whole thing.
Speaker: And they, they do that.
Speaker: And, and you even, uh, Jack, I remember you brought up, you feel like it's, uh, it's copping on a Mario cart a little bit.
Speaker: That had just been called a bad driving.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Every, every time someone is behind the wheel of a vehicle, they're either crashing into shit or like, even like, uh,
Speaker: Like, anytime you see someone in Dino Hatton on a bike, they're, like, crashing into a guardrail and flipping over.
Speaker: Like, I feel like they just shoehorned in Mario Kart, which I think came out the year before.
Speaker: Yeah, they really just didn't know what to do with Mario because it's just a bizarre template with no story attached to it.
Speaker: It's just...
Speaker: If you made a truly accurate Mario film, he would be jumping for like 98% of it.
Speaker: Right, yeah.
Speaker: Just jumping on shit, you know.
Speaker: And they do manage to incorporate that in.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: It makes me think, like, the only other way they could have done this movie...
Speaker: Because one complaint I've seen, like I briefly kind of went down a rabbit hole and just took a glance at why do people hate on it and how are they hating on this movie?
Speaker: I think people are like, that's not in the video game.
Speaker: And it's like, what do you expect?
Speaker: It's an Italian-American plumber in a fantasy world stepping on turtles to get to a princess that's captured by a bigger turtle dinosaur king guy or whatever.
Speaker: That's all in there.
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, it's basically in there.
Speaker: Yeah, it's funny because...
Speaker: I feel like 1993 was like the year of the dinosaur with like Jurassic park coming out the same year.
Speaker: And obviously like, there's no way that the people making that movie, at least the studio didn't weren't aware that that was going to be like the biggest film of the year.
Speaker: And so I feel like there's all of the, the dinosaur stuff.
Speaker: That's like kind of a marginal part of like Mario lore or whatever.
Speaker: It's like just kind of thrown in there in the video games.
Speaker: I feel like that's one of the reasons why they,
Speaker: went down that path and, um,
Speaker: It definitely takes it in a much different direction than what you would be expecting if you had just played the games.
Speaker: But I think it's for the best.
Speaker: I love it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Really, I think the only other way they could have done it is if people want it to be like the video game and true to exactly how that is.
Speaker: Like maybe if Jim Henson puppets were in it and he was jumping on like giant Jim Henson turtles or something, maybe it would have been more of what they wanted.
Speaker: But I think that would have gotten old really fast.
Speaker: Yeah, I mean, no one wants to see Labyrinth with like fat middle-aged men instead of Jennifer Connelly.
Speaker: I don't know if that's like a winning combo.
Speaker: It is for someone out there, but I can guarantee you that film would have been even more hated if that's the route that they went.
Speaker: It's interesting to think about this at the time that it was made in the sense of like now so many movies that come out are adaptations of something.
Speaker: But really up until like Batman, Dick Tracy and like the Addams Family movie, like that wasn't like there had been like the Superman movies and stuff, but it wasn't like as much of a thing.
Speaker: Yeah, this was like kind of part of the first wave of movies where it was like, oh,
Speaker: like Batman and Dick Tracy and Adam's family all did really well.
Speaker: So let's start, let's start, you know, mining properties.
Speaker: But mining ones that are less culturally entrenched.
Speaker: Like, I think at that point when the films were being made of everything you just brought up, Harris, it's like,
Speaker: everyone like kids and people's parents and probably even people's grandparents were aware of all those things because those were on tv for generations and like batman is just this eternal archetype that exists in everyone's brain whether you want him to or not but the i think going for something that maybe is so much more abstract that probably only younger folks are aware of if your parents bought you a nintendo system or you're some like
Speaker: fanatic that's just been into computer shit from like, you know, day one and really was plugged into what was happening at the time.
Speaker: Like, I don't think that there was as much like fondness for this franchise or this characters.
Speaker: And there's certainly not enough like of a story to adapt where
Speaker: People are just going to be on board.
Speaker: Like you really have to win, win people over.
Speaker: And I don't, I don't think that worked as well.
Speaker: All those adaptations you mentioned, Harris at the time, even then they were throwbacks.
Speaker: Like Adam's family is an old cartoon.
Speaker: You know, Superman started out as like a circus looking character or something.
Speaker: And it was all very corny and all that stuff.
Speaker: And it was all kind of much safer and more,
Speaker: I don't know, just kind of typical conservative delivery of content.
Speaker: And all of those adaptations went gritty with it.
Speaker: Like even Adam's family with the macabre was still like a silly kind of look at the American family.
Speaker: But that movie made it it pushed it a little more to the edge.
Speaker: And Mario just was like, well, all eight year olds love this right now, but we still want their parents to come into the theater and, you know, buy all the toys and stuff.
Speaker: So we're going to put Bob Hoskins saying, you can't arrest a guy for being a plumber.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And, you know, a nightclub scene with a ton of like hot dancers and assless chaps and, you know, that, that one's for dad.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I mean, I wonder, though, if that also wasn't part of sort of the backlash against the movie when it came out, just that it wasn't it was the first live action movie, or at least the first American live action movie based on a video game.
Speaker: So like, yeah, like there wasn't even like legacy media that existed unless they had done like Pac-Man or something, you know, like.
Speaker: like there was not going to be a video game movie that people were familiar with.
Speaker: And then also, I think so many people at the time or critics at least were like, that it seems so crass to turn a game, you know, a video game into a, into a film.
Speaker: I think a big part of it too, is that a lot of critics at the time were like, Oh, well everyone that's, or, you know, most everyone that's involved in this film has done all of these other,
Speaker: projects that are so much more like critically acclaimed and like, how could they end up in this like steaming pile of shit?
Speaker: Like everyone, it was just like totally ragged on.
Speaker: I feel like there was the, the misunderstanding of, of what the film was because it is a confusing film.
Speaker: It's like one of the reasons why I like it.
Speaker: It's unwieldy and like, it's kind of exhausting and how like breakneck pace it is and how much is packed into,
Speaker: I mean, 140 minutes is a long time for a film like that.
Speaker: And it definitely feels long.
Speaker: But yeah, I think that like on top of that, people really, like I said earlier, caught wind of like the troubled production and just wanted to dismiss it outright.
Speaker: And it's funny because like for me, this movie is not like a lost gem.
Speaker: because I never stopped watching it.
Speaker: Like I've watched this movie.
Speaker: I've watched this movie too many times.
Speaker: It's just something that like clearly had more of a legacy that grew with like a, like an internet fan base and people that really like loved the film and wanted some kind of restoration.
Speaker: And I guess that's where like the, the, the two hour Morton and Jenkel cut comes in.
Speaker: Harris, I know that you watched that.
Speaker: Devin, did you get a chance to watch like the two hour cut?
Speaker: I didn't end up doing it.
Speaker: Every time I went to start it, I started, you know, when I would search for it, I would like start going down the rabbit hole of looking at whatever else was saying.
Speaker: So I went off with it, but yeah.
Speaker: It's, it's funny because, uh, it really is not, it's not a better movie.
Speaker: Um, there's at all Harris.
Speaker: Did you get to watch the theatrical cut too?
Speaker: I didn't, but I remembered it well enough.
Speaker: And you can kind of tell from how the extended cut is put together, like what's extra.
Speaker: And so much of it is just like extra reaction shots in like the middle of the scene.
Speaker: And then there are like a few scenes.
Speaker: I don't know.
Speaker: I felt like maybe at the beginning, like it does do at least a little bit more character development.
Speaker: Because I think that's kind of one of the big criticisms of the movie itself.
Speaker: uh in general i was looking at some of like the contemporary criticism from when it came out and it's like a lot of people actually did like acknowledge that um you know it looked really good and that it had a really great cast the the criticisms were like with the script with the like lack of coherence and with the idea of just making a video game into a movie in the first place yeah the the
Speaker: The Morton and Jenkel cut adds about 15 minutes.
Speaker: And like you said, Harris, it's weirdly, it's like reaction shots and bits of dialogue that don't really substantially change the course of the film or like the tone of it, really.
Speaker: It's almost just like, and then there's like three scenes that are substantial that were cut from the theatrical version of
Speaker: that again are like not essential to the film at all.
Speaker: It's funny because one of them is just in the beginning of the film, you get like Mario and Luigi's confrontation with like Scapelli brothers.
Speaker: Like you get the, you get the scene inside the restaurant where they're supposed to be, you know, fixing the dishwasher and,
Speaker: Scapelli has already got there.
Speaker: And it's like, all it does is it just builds up Scapelli as like more of a villain than it needs to.
Speaker: And like, I feel like the thing that stuck out to me that was hilarious was that the owner of the restaurant's like, Scapelli, you know this guy?
Speaker: And Mario's like, yeah, I grew up with him.
Speaker: It was like, holy shit.
Speaker: We need like a scene of like, like baby Mario and baby Scapelli, like beating each other up with like wrenches on the playground or something.
Speaker: Like just like building in this lifelong rivalry.
Speaker: It was hilarious.
Speaker: Grandparents had a rivalry in Ellis Island.
Speaker: And when they came to the United States from Italy, it just kept going with their competing plumbing businesses.
Speaker: It goes all the way back to the old country.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Three hour cut right there.
Speaker: And then, you know, like, and they, like it establishes like Mario is like, nobody touches my tools, which is like, you know, they, they really, uh, they, they harp on that quite a bit throughout the entire film, but like, it's really, it's not, it's not that important.
Speaker: Although I did enjoy watching it.
Speaker: And then, um, the scene with, uh, where Dennis Hopper kills one of his minions.
Speaker: Yeah, there's the, it's, I think it's the one that's the most noticeable is like when you watch the theatrical cut, it's obvious there's something missing.
Speaker: It's like the, it's the Devo machine.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And there's a scene in the theatrical cut where you suddenly see Koopa, Dennis Hopper is Koopa like slip on this giant pile of what looks like baby shit on the floor.
Speaker: And it's really jarring because it's very obvious, like maybe not as much when you're seven years old and watching this movie in the theater, but like now,
Speaker: You can tell that there's something very awkward about it.
Speaker: And it's just, it's like a missing effects shot where one of Koopa's minions like sneezes accidentally.
Speaker: And Koopa, who's like a germaphobe, decides to put him in the Devo machine as like punishment.
Speaker: And he sends him all the way back to Cretaceous.
Speaker: And the dude just turns into like a pile of Gerber's baby food and like splatters all over the floor.
Speaker: And then there's the wrap.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Oh, there's the rap.
Speaker: With Richie Edson and Fisher Stevens.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: With, dude, Richie Edson, the original drummer from Sonic Youth.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: From 81 to 82, wrote the lyrics and music.
Speaker: Oh, for the rap?
Speaker: For the rap.
Speaker: That was him.
Speaker: Oh, wow.
Speaker: I didn't know that.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's...
Speaker: Apparently that whole scene came about and then was cut because there was so much chaos on set with the film being written and then rewritten that they were just like, um, him and Fisher Stevens were both like, Hey, what about this?
Speaker: Like, we just came up with this.
Speaker: Can we put this in the movie while they're filming the club scene?
Speaker: And they were like, yeah, sure.
Speaker: Why not?
Speaker: Everything else is falling apart.
Speaker: So let's put it in there.
Speaker: And they do like a, a really bad, like, um,
Speaker: like Beastie Boys style.
Speaker: Like they do probably like, like four bars where they trade off, like, you know, within the same line, finishing each other's like sentences.
Speaker: It's so funny, but it's funny because it's like that part of that part of the movie is a bunch of like the quote unquote political commentary that was like cut from the film.
Speaker: Like Iggy and Spike do like an anti-Koopa rap because Mario says, Hey, it's your world.
Speaker: Do something about it.
Speaker: When they're like complaining about, um, complaining about how shitty everything is and Dino Hatton.
Speaker: And that like sparks something in Iggy and Koopa's brain to do this, like anti-Koopa rap where they're like, Koopa, the party poopa, the poopa scoop.
Speaker: It's, it's, um, I'm, I'm, uh, actually thankful that that's not in the theatrical cut of the film.
Speaker: Yeah, it's funny, the political element.
Speaker: I feel like this is one of a number of movies.
Speaker: I had a conversation with someone about this recently from the 90s that sort of implicitly or explicitly were warning us about Donald Trump.
Speaker: Yeah, for real.
Speaker: So the Koopa character, I don't know how much of it is intentional and how much of it is just...
Speaker: because we've been so exposed to the other one for such a long time but like it seems it seems almost like a like a you know like an impersonation donald trump is a germaphobe holds his hands weird it has has bizarre hair uh he's a fascist yeah he's a real estate mogul koopa gets pretty pretty handsy in one scene we're just like oh shit let's let's not do this guys let's keep it
Speaker: Yeah, that's true.
Speaker: And is one as well.
Speaker: The political commentary of it is, um, it's there in the, in, in one of those deleted scenes, um, that I took note of when, when I watched the two hour cut, there's a scene when, um,
Speaker: Mario, Luigi, Iggy, and Spike are hijacking one of those sludge gulpers, you know, the garbage trucks that they just paint sludge gulper on the side.
Speaker: And they're riding it back to the Boom Boom Bar after being in the desert.
Speaker: And they're all talking to each other.
Speaker: And Luigi says, hey, guys, what's with all this Koopa the blank stuff?
Speaker: Everywhere we look, you got Koopa the sportsman, Koopa the environmentalist.
Speaker: That was the other Trump thing that like, yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Koopa the Studmiser.
Speaker: Does anyone else run against this guy?
Speaker: Iggy says, Koopa the Sensitive ran four years ago, but he only got 2%.
Speaker: Luigi says, no, no.
Speaker: I'm talking about someone other than Koopa.
Speaker: Spike says, no, Koopa doesn't like that.
Speaker: Mario, what do you mean?
Speaker: You can vote for anybody as long as it's Koopa?
Speaker: Luigi, what kind of system is that?
Speaker: Spike, democracy.
Speaker: Hard-hitting political commentary that unfortunately did not make it to the theatrical cut.
Speaker: Let's talk about what you guys love about this movie.
Speaker: What is it about Super Mario Brothers that speaks to you?
Speaker: I liked it when I was a little kid.
Speaker: We rented it, and I think that's just kind of that...
Speaker: that phase where your filter is not that sophisticated.
Speaker: So yeah, it either speaks for yourself and and it was it was good.
Speaker: Like it was just it was fun in and of itself.
Speaker: It was fun.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: And I wasn't overthinking like this isn't the same as level two and, you know, Super Mario Land or whatever.
Speaker: Like I I wasn't thinking about that.
Speaker: I was just along for the ride.
Speaker: And I think what makes it work is
Speaker: it's like those cuts sound like they make sense to me because they're not trying to make it too real.
Speaker: It's just this weird cyber punky take on the Mario franchise.
Speaker: And it does set up its, its world, right?
Speaker: It's got its own rules and it pretty much follows them consistently for, for better or worse.
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: Like it doesn't have to make a lot of sense to me as an eight year old to appreciate that, um,
Speaker: it was fun.
Speaker: And like the bad guy turns into slime at the end and all that stuff.
Speaker: Like it, it just works.
Speaker: It really embellished the personalities of very two dimensional characters in a way that was satisfying to my little kid brain.
Speaker: And even if it's a heavy dose of nostalgia, it's still, it still holds up to me.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I agree with all of that.
Speaker: And I'll say that like, I think visually the film has really held up.
Speaker: Um, it's, it's pretty incredible.
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: how much they really physically built the sets, like using that abandoned cement factory and just kind of using that as the template for all of the Dino Hatton stuff.
Speaker: I think the early CGI stuff that they use holds up.
Speaker: I think that was at a time when CGI was still a little bit more sculptural and akin to painting from what I've seen from the behind the scenes work.
Speaker: And it just, you know, it obviously looks
Speaker: outdated if you compare it to what is used now but i appreciate that about it i think it just looks cool and it it's interesting that they use the cgi more as an accent to a bunch of the crazy practical effects that they built i think this had like kind of like a visual influence on a lot of like the science fiction and action type movies that came out at least like the dystopian ones in the in the 90s
Speaker: Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker: And, you know, I think it's a shame that the movie didn't do that well because they obviously put a lot of work into it.
Speaker: And the thing that I think is cool is that they really do show off a lot of the stuff that they built.
Speaker: You know, with some films, you get cool shots of effects that maybe you only see for
Speaker: a couple seconds at a time, or it's all either front-loaded or back-loaded in the film.
Speaker: And even before they do the Dino Hatton alternate universe stuff, you get that baby hatching out of a slimy egg.
Speaker: And all the costumes are really awesome too.
Speaker: Like, I just appreciate that they really put a lot of work into it and like fully show it off.
Speaker: It almost gives the movie kind of a strange look because so much of what's happening in Dino Hatton is really brightly lit because they clearly want to show off all the work they put into it.
Speaker: And I just, it took me a really long time to rewatch it when I rewatched the DVD, just the theatrical cut, because I was,
Speaker: taking screenshots and pausing probably every 30 seconds, looking at all the signs and the background characters and really just picking up on stuff that I've never seen before, even though I've seen this movie probably over 15 times at this point.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: It's an amazingly like busy movie.
Speaker: Like it's it's everything is super kinetic.
Speaker: There's a million things going on in the background.
Speaker: Like the set is part of the action that the background characters are part of the action.
Speaker: Everybody's constantly shouting like, yeah, it's so like that's part of what I really like enjoyed about it.
Speaker: And also, I think maybe another reason why a lot of people
Speaker: don't like it is that it's so it's so like energetic like there's no there's no breathing room like you're just I mean and it is like kind of a really good cinematic version of a video game in that respect
Speaker: Yeah, totally.
Speaker: And I feel like Harris energetic is like the kind way to put it.
Speaker: I think most of their folks would say exhausting.
Speaker: Psychotic.
Speaker: But yeah, I just, I, I think it has, it has a lot of momentum to it.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: One of the things that's funny about this movie that I think about now is,
Speaker: there's so much um there's so much interference and like public scrutiny of films as they're being made now that i don't think that this film would have turned out the same if there had been something like twitter that existed while it was being made because i was i was thinking specifically about like the the first sonic the hedgehog movie they made like what like three or four years ago where
Speaker: Twitter caught wind of how creepy the CGI was for Sonic's face.
Speaker: Like he basically had like a rat nose and like human teeth and just looked horrifying.
Speaker: And yeah, I mean, I, I, I think it would have been a better film if they had kept that creepy CGI.
Speaker: I just appreciate that something like this movie came out at a time where like production was just hermetically sealed and you just get what you get at the end of it, you know, for better or for worse.
Speaker: And I think it's, you know, for the best with this film, like,
Speaker: If this word had gotten out that there was all of these production problems in the middle of the film, and this looks weird, or this wasn't working out, or people aren't enjoying it, being a part of it, I think that the extra pressure from the public, where people would just be ripping it apart, probably would have made it collapse.
Speaker: I don't think that people are going to like it anymore.
Speaker: now if they weren't predisposed to like it when it first came out.
Speaker: I think there was a lot of praise when it came out just heaped on the special effects, which is fair.
Speaker: It doesn't look bad at all.
Speaker: But if you're not going to get on board immediately for what it is, I don't think that now you're going to like it.
Speaker: And from everything I've seen, and this drives me fucking crazy, is it ends up on YouTube channels with just dudes talking at a camera being like,
Speaker: this movie's so bad.
Speaker: I can't believe this movie was made.
Speaker: This sucks.
Speaker: What a shitty movie.
Speaker: It's so bad.
Speaker: It's good.
Speaker: And it doesn't feel like,
Speaker: there's a genuine engagement with what's happening.
Speaker: Like, I don't want to overplay the sophistication of the movie or anything, but like, it feels like it was presumed dead on arrival.
Speaker: Like, Oh yeah, they're going to, you know, I don't know, just like the decision making and stuff like it's, yeah, it's corny, but also it, it literally was aimed at children who were playing the video game.
Speaker: back in the early 90s.
Speaker: Like, it's not trying to be bigger than it is, and it's not trying to be more serious than it needs to be.
Speaker: So it just kind of comes off as like sort of an attention grab to be like, here's how I'm specifically going to shit on this movie, and it's going to be the coldest takes that a person can take about each scene beat by beat.
Speaker: And it's like, you know, it's not like an Oscar-winning movie or whatever.
Speaker: Should have been.
Speaker: you know what i mean like it's it's a fun movie it was nominated for special effects i think actually it was though yeah that's right that actually was nominated on that front it's funny actually though but that that kind of criticism on some technological level right wasn't there like a machine or a program they used it it was the c it was the cgi yeah yeah yeah
Speaker: But that kind of criticism that you're talking about is the other inspiration for wanting to do this show is to talk about movies like this with.
Speaker: Like, you know, not with scorn, but like, I don't know, like we enjoy this stuff, so let's let's you know, let's let's revel in the pleasure of what they gave us.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, I think that.
Speaker: It's certainly now more than ever you get
Speaker: other podcasts or just YouTube channels or just people's entire personalities that are based on shit talking movies.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's like, Oh, this movie.
Speaker: So I was talking to Harris about this earlier.
Speaker: It's like this movie so bad.
Speaker: I only watch trash movies.
Speaker: I like shit.
Speaker: I like garbage.
Speaker: It's like, I feel bad for you, bro.
Speaker: You should probably watch a movie that you like.
Speaker: It's life is too short to just be like cynical about everything.
Speaker: And like,
Speaker: you know, it's, um, it's really lame to also shit talk a movie when you haven't made your own.
Speaker: Like, I'd like to see you make a super Mario brothers movie that the rest of the world can scrutinize.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: We'll give you, we'll give you, um, $34 million and you have to make a super Mario brothers movie that, uh, doesn't suck.
Speaker: Good luck.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: Because it's a Rorschach test.
Speaker: It's going to reveal something about your own psyche that you don't want the world to see because Mario is such an abstract force of nature.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I feel like that's really the lens that this movie...
Speaker: is looked at, you know, currently it's just, it ends up on like WTF.
Speaker: Oh my God.
Speaker: I can't believe this exists, which is the stupidest fucking, like if that's your personality, fuck you.
Speaker: That is so annoying.
Speaker: I cannot believe that's something that people base their entire lives on.
Speaker: I think it's something else is like people want to chase that feeling of the like the viral, you know, sensation of room or Birdemic or troll to where it's super easy to shit on the pace and the wooden performances and the really bad writing and the the everything about those movies.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And it's just applying that veneer to this in a way that's unfair because it's just like, you just really want to hear yourself talk about a shitty movie and be part of that mindset or, you know, that mindset.
Speaker: that culture i guess i don't know i really um i really like the the mario and luigi dynamic in this movie that they totally invented just for the sake of this film that is like not based on the the video games whatsoever where like luigi's an orphan and mario's raised him like as his father his his his mother his brother okay my father then
Speaker: And they do this thing that I really like where Luigi is the very enthusiastic and impulsive and kind of intuition-based character at the beginning who doesn't have the know-how and skills of traditionally trained Mario.
Speaker: And Mario's the one who's like, don't touch my tools.
Speaker: I'm all about the tools.
Speaker: It's all about family.
Speaker: My grandfather gave me these tools.
Speaker: Luigi's a conspiracy theorist, and he's reading the National Enquirer and stuff.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And then by the end of the film, they both, they don't swap character traits.
Speaker: They like completely fill out each other's characters by like adopting pieces of each other.
Speaker: And so like Luigi is like much more like confident in being a plumber and like has more experience.
Speaker: And then
Speaker: Mario is like, he's still, you know, his top dog, but he, he's like, I believe.
Speaker: Oh, I believe.
Speaker: Like he becomes like, his like mind is expanded by the end of the film.
Speaker: He's like ready for anything.
Speaker: What do you guys think happens at the end when Daisy comes back?
Speaker: It's like, you guys are never going to believe this.
Speaker: Did you guys think like, do you have something that you pictured with, with Daisy coming back and like setting it up for a sequel?
Speaker: I did not.
Speaker: So I like that it was ambiguous.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: When I was eight, I was just like, oh, I'm going to, you know, the same thing.
Speaker: I was just going to accept what was given to me.
Speaker: And I was like, well, this is definitely going to happen because sequels do happen all the time.
Speaker: They made another Batman.
Speaker: They made more Back to the Futures.
Speaker: They made more Ninja Turtles and all that stuff.
Speaker: They made five Mario games already.
Speaker: You know, and yeah, exactly.
Speaker: Like it was like, this will definitely happen.
Speaker: And now watching it, I was thinking about like, what would I want the rest of it to look like?
Speaker: And I was thinking it would be really fun if it went even further off the rails in like a phantasm kind of way.
Speaker: Like they just really get weird with exploring the world and they're out in the desert.
Speaker: And then there's like, there's this portal to like the deeper universe or, or another planet or something.
Speaker: I think that would be pretty sick if they just,
Speaker: really went and just defied all of your hopes and expectations for what the franchise should be.
Speaker: It just gets even darker.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly.
Speaker: I would watch that.
Speaker: I would watch that.
Speaker: This is what I thought.
Speaker: I was thinking, so Lance Henriksen is turned into this city or planet-wide spanning fungus body.
Speaker: Mm-hmm.
Speaker: in the course of the Super Mario Bros.
Speaker: film.
Speaker: And apparently, like, his consciousness is, like, is reaching into every single, like, tendril of this, like, fungus growth.
Speaker: It's, like, watching everything that's happening and, like, aiding the Mario Bros.
Speaker: in their quest to defeat Koopa.
Speaker: And I was thinking, like, so he has this, like, almost, like, minor eldritch god consciousness expansion becoming this giant fungal body and then is, like,
Speaker: forced to become like a man again and rule the kingdom and i really want to see like uh like lance henrickson doing like john carpenter's the thing type role where he's like he's like the fungus king but he's like struggling because he has this like multi-dimensional consciousness and he's like still part fungus and starts to like just totally fucking destroy dino hatton and they have to like
Speaker: torch him with flamethrowers.
Speaker: I think that would be amazing if it's like Daisy has to fight her own dad who's like a human fungus hybrid at the end of it.
Speaker: That sets it up for a perfect sequel.
Speaker: I think we could combine both of those ideas and it would be just maybe not just the best possible Mario Brothers movie, but maybe just the best possible movie.
Speaker: I just want to make a case for this film being great.
Speaker: Like, I truly enjoy it.
Speaker: I've watched it so many times because every time I watch it, it has a sense of fun about it that does not feel cynical.
Speaker: And I know it was a cash grab, but I think that, like, that's more from the... From the corporate side.
Speaker: From the corporate side and the movie being greenlit in the first place, but there's so much creativity and weirdness that went into it.
Speaker: Even just, again, pausing it and looking at all of the signs that they built and all of the actual sets they built.
Speaker: It was clear that it was this massive effort to make a film that looked pretty unique at the time and I think still really holds up.
Speaker: like as I was taking screenshots of this film and kind of looking back at them after watching it a couple times I was like these look like fucking like vinegar syndrome releases like it looks like something that like would be put out like the cult Mario movie that everyone forgot about with like the little practical like baby dinosaurs that are just eating slime with like a neon light and like a fog machine behind them it's awesome recognizing that
Speaker: the, the lore of Mario at that time was super limited.
Speaker: And then the fact that so much was built out of a very basic premise is kind of awesome.
Speaker: Like it's, it is very artistic and they didn't skimp on anything.
Speaker: And I think it gets criticized because people are like, did they even play Mario?
Speaker: Don't they understand who he is?
Speaker: And it's not that it's not that deep.
Speaker: It's like, yeah, he, you know, smashed the stuff.
Speaker: And so yeah,
Speaker: It's on its own really an awesome creative exploration of a really, really paper thin premise.
Speaker: And yeah, it's really fun.
Speaker: Well, thanks guys.
Speaker: This has been really awesome.
Speaker: It's been really fun.
Speaker: Thank you for having us on.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: I think we, I think we've gotten to the heart of what makes, what makes super Mario brothers a good movie.
Speaker: Yeah.
Speaker: And I'm happy to be on the first episode as well.
Speaker: Thanks for trusting us enough to, you know,
Speaker: pick something that you'd want to talk about.
Speaker: So totally cool.
Speaker: You've been listening to, I kind of liked it.
Speaker: Thanks for joining us for the first episode.
Speaker: If you kind of liked it, subscribe for future episodes and check out our patron page at patron.com slash.
Speaker: I kind of liked it to become a supporter of the show and get access to bonus material.
Speaker: See you next time.
